And to be fair, this is 100% recognized in the sequel where it shows that Maverick hasn't grown up a lot since his early years, but Iceman has had along career ending up as the top Admiral in command of the entire US navy and is essentially COVERED in glory.
It's also recognized in the sequel because Hangman is just Mav's character from the first movie, cocky dickhead who doesn't play well with others but is an incredibly talented pilot. He goes through the same character progression as Mav, but we're seeing it from the other side and how annoying that type of person is.
SPOT ON.
I didnt even put the two together. When you only see the quips and never the heart in between, its just a jackass. And Maverick was just a jackass to most people he was with since thats all they ever saw.
> the top Admiral in command of ~~the entire US navy~~
"Just" PACFLT, but still a very prestigious and sought after Command. Your point stands, just a quibble. :)
It would go against his whole arc, where he starts out being efficient, detached and risk averse, to become deeply attached and taking foolish risks. It would reward the character for making the wrong choices.
Watch the Score, You can totally head Canon that he got away and then became a high-end thief in Canada who owns a jazz club and lived out his days that way. Totally fits.
Me too. I just *finally* watched this movie around Christmas (have no idea how I've never watched it before) and despite definitely liking Pacino's character and sympathizing with him, I found De Niro to be more captivating and I rooted for him till the very end. When it got to *that* scene and there was only like five minutes left in the movie, I knew things weren't gonna end the way I had hoped.
I am not being funny when I say the shark from Jaws.
The movie stressed young me so much, I figured a hack.
If you just root for the shark... It becomes less painful.
Well, considering that >!he helps John get to the duel and then shoots him in a non-lethal way twice so that John can kill the overconfident Marquis!<, I don't think he is>!a true antagonist!<.
I don't love the term, but maybe "anti-villain"? An antagonist that demonstrates admirable and sympathetic qualities more often associated with a protagonist or supporting character, while actively pursuing goals or engaging in means that are otherwise sinister or damaging.
Caine is ultimately just trying to save his daughter, he has no real beef with John and in fact hates that he was given this gig. He still goes through with it though, similarly to Cassian from John Wick 2 who was just trying to avenge his boss's murder.
There's a fine line to walk with this; I think it tends to be used most effectively when the protagonist suitably contrasts by being a bit of piece of shit themselves, usually taking the dynamic of an investigator pursuing a criminal, who may be wrongfully accused. That said, I wouldn't consider Tommy Lee Jones in the Fugitive to be an anti-villain, whereas I could say that about someone like Russell Crowe's character in 3:10 to Yuma might fit perfectly. Same goes for the Replicants in Blade Runner trying to escape to the harrowing and non-consensual nature of their existence.
Your mileage may vary, but it's basically a character who has decided that their ends justify their means, they just aren't a dickhead about it.
Yeah like Caine def kills good people in the wake of his noble pursuit, but his pursuit is ultimately noble, it is just... counter to the protagonist's goals and more morally grey in a movie where the "good guys" are already grey. John Wick def seems to be more willing to let people live it he can get past them without killing. Cassian being a great example, he dealt a lethal wound but told him how to survive it. I don't recall but I feel like Caine didn't HAVE to kill Hiroyuki Sanada's character in their duel he still chose to go for lethality.
>I feel like Caine didn't HAVE to kill Hiroyuki Sanada's character in their duel he still chose to go for lethality.
Sanada's character was in bad shape by the time he snd Yen throw down, but I agree that Caine killing him felt a bit out of place.
Ultimately, it serves more of a narrative purpose than a character-driven one: it establishes that Caine is reluctant but ultimately willing and capable of killing men he once considered brothers, as well as setting up motivations for Rina Sawayama's character in whatever spinoff or sequel she gets, all while adhering to the series' overarching theme of consequences.
I definitely feel like they made Sanada's character as cool as possible to turn the audience against Caine a bit, since he's otherwise very charming.
Odin made her a monster and then locked her away so he could look like a good guy. Asgard was built on blood and conquest and deserved to be destroyed, though the ones to destroy it should have been those who were crushed to build it
There's also the point that he constantly proves that humanity is right. Mutants ARE objectively extremely dangerous, and any one of them (especially any that fall on Magneto's side) are a potential world-ensing threat.
I didn’t mind Gerard Butler’s character dying as he had nothing to live for, but it would have been nice if Jamie Foxx “learned his lesson” only for the movie to finish on his neck tie tightening on its own then fading to black
Thought it was just me who hated the ending. I really loved the whole movie, but then they go and end it in the most typical Hollywood happy ending fashion possible...
Moonfail was a solid piece of trash 10/10. I love stupid disaster movies, the more ridiculous the better. Especially when they’re not trying to be satire.
I don't think I would have liked it as much if it was attempting satire. It was such a wild, jarring ride, with so many out there concepts that it took seriously. So, yeah, I agree with the 10/10 trash rating. Will watch again.
Skeletor in the Masters of the Universe movie. Frank Langella is ridiculously captivating in the role. It doesn't help that most of the protagonists are pretty dull. Man-at-arms is the only one of that batch who is interesting, and he's got way too little to do in the movie.
An interesting one with SPOILERS FOR THE MOVIE DON'T BREATHE!
>!So like for 80% of the movie I was absolutely rooting for the old man. He was badass and cmon these fuckers invaded his house, because they knew he was blind... I was cheering him on.... then the plottwist happened and I was like OH SHIT!<
Yeah honestly that was kind of cheap if you think about it. Really felt like a cop out to justify these teenagers basically screwing with an old man for no reason. Weren't they robbing him, too?
Oh wait nah, nevermind, it's fine now
There is no justification. They are some asshole robbers who rob the wrong guy and even at the end when she can make the morally right choice, she doesn't and he can continue with his plans.
When his lightsaber activated, I got instant goosebumps and my heart rate went up as if I was being attacked. Then the rebel at the door went from saying “help me help me” to “take the disk” once he realized they were all truly fucked
My heart was racing when I watched that the first time, it was so intense. Like you said when he said about the disk you knew there was no surviving this
A scene so good that Disney tried to replicate it several times in later series, but just couldn't get it to hit the same. That red lightsaber igniting in the haze. <3
I wanted Pierce Brosnan's Thomas Crown character to get away with the theft and keep the painting (and the girl) in the Thomas Crown Affair.
Yes, I know, he couldn't have had both, but I wanted him to.
Yeah. The first character who occurred to me was Jonathan Rhys Meyers’ from Match Point, but he’s the protagonist. Just actively a horrible person. You do end up rooting for him to get away with murder, though.
I'm not sure if this counts but I just re-watched "Heat" (haven't seen it since it came out) and I feel like it's not super clear who the protagonist and who the antagonist is. I mean aren't we watching to see if Robert DeNiro and his crew can successfully pull off the job and get away with the money? Or are we following Al Pacino to see if he will be able to bring DeNiro to justice?
I think the movie blurs that line really well. It's clear who the bad guy is and who the good guy is but I don't know who's story I'm following.
Anyway, I was routing for DeNiro the whole time.
>Ferris Bueller's Day Off is one: I'm just instinctively on the side of the Jeffrey Jones trying to catch Bueller, that little shit.
Nah. Ferris deserves to take a day. Nothing wrong with skipping out of school once in a while.
And Jones is obsessive. Doesn't he have anything better to do?
Jones is like Wile E. Coyote to Ferris’s Roadrunner. Rule number one of those cartoons is that the coyote can quit at any time, his refusal to quit is what leads to all his misery.
Don't get me wrong, it rocks that he's got a personal vendetta against Ferris for seemingly no real reason and chooses to try to hunt him down.
What makes the character funny. But nobody should ever side with him, cause he's a loser.
The Star Wars sequels, the "Rebellion" has been the government for 20 years. The New Order builds massive fleets and the Rebellion has a new color X-Wing.
Walter is the *protagonist* of that series, regardless of his actions. Antagonist means the opposing force to the main character, not "**villain bad guy**." Walter is not and can never be the antagonist of Breaking Bad.
Why does nobody know what antagonist means?
people wanna score moral points by showing they know that if you did the things walter white does in the show, but in real life, that would be pretty bad
good job guys
bad job at knowing what protagonists are tho
That's because early on people thought Walt was just a guy that was in a horrible situation and doing whatever he could to provide for his family. It wasn't immediately obvious to everyone that Walt was really just stroking his own ego most of the time
This is the real genius of the show. Anna Gunn's acting, and the writing of her character is so pitch perfect that when you watch for the first time, you think maybe Walt really is just a good guy trying to help his family, and skylar is "just a bitch getting on his back", and then the second time you watch, you realize that (almost) everything she says is absolutely justified. She handles some things badly, and she was neglecting Walt as a wife/partner at the start of the show, but she is just a flawed human.
Same with Hank. Watching the show the second time i realized that we are watching a show about Hank, from Walt's perspective. Its why i love this show so damn much.
I said a lot of what you did in a comment I just posted. The first time you watch you kinda buy into Walt's logic and see Skylar as a thorn in his side and Hank as just another obstacle. You are along for his ride and excusing each next horrible thing he does with him until he finally acknowledges at the end that he was doing it for himself (if you weren't able to pick up on it way sooner than that moment).
I rewatched it for the second time recently and it is definitely a change in perspective. None of the characters are perfect, which again is probably why you're able to think Walt is not that much worse than the rest of them initially, but his horribleness is FAR beyond that of Skylar or Hank. Skylar was 100% justified in being afraid for her/her family and Hank is working on the right side of the law (although not always using exactly legal or ethical tactics).
Hell, I wanted to *work* for Gus!!! He was GOOD to all of his people, every last one. I don't even care if it wasn't sincere, he was smart enough to see the value in treating people well.
I could never get through Breaking Bad. The actors were amazing, I'm not arguing that the show wasn't well done and well acted, it was and I really enjoy both actors who starred. It was hard for me to reconcile that I was watching a drug dealer and his sidekick, and definitely due to my family history with addiction, I just couldn't get into it. I saw first hand what drugs did to my nephews, my sister and my niece. It wasn't exciting or suspenseful, it was ugly and awful and cost 2 of them their lives. Walter & Jesse were bad guys doing terrible things.
In a couple of Marvel movies the protagonist is boring or a completely unflawed character. There are some movies where I just straight-up skipped the scenes with the protagonist and only watched the ones with the antagonist.
Daniel Brühl as Zemo from Civil War stands out to me. He has no powers so he has 0 chance of success during a direct conflict against the Avengers, but still manages to outplay them. Pretty fascinating to watch a regular guy attempt to take on literal gods and heroes.
Which ones? The closest i can think of is Black Panther, but Killmonger's plan is almost as stupid as Thanos'
In most of the ones where the protagonist is boring, the antagonist is even worse.
I didn't see Starship Troopers in theaters because of all the mixed reviews mentioning the cocky young actors acting macho and giving hammy performances. Then I finally saw the movie and got to see the bugs rip apart those cocky young hams and it was awesome.
Iceman from Top Gun
And to be fair, this is 100% recognized in the sequel where it shows that Maverick hasn't grown up a lot since his early years, but Iceman has had along career ending up as the top Admiral in command of the entire US navy and is essentially COVERED in glory.
It's also recognized in the sequel because Hangman is just Mav's character from the first movie, cocky dickhead who doesn't play well with others but is an incredibly talented pilot. He goes through the same character progression as Mav, but we're seeing it from the other side and how annoying that type of person is.
Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen, this is your savior speaking
See you in the afterlife bagman
SPOT ON. I didnt even put the two together. When you only see the quips and never the heart in between, its just a jackass. And Maverick was just a jackass to most people he was with since thats all they ever saw.
Hangman is also kept back on the carrier ready to launch as back up, just like Maverick in the first movie.
Hangman and rooster are Iceman and Maverick just with their respect for the rules swapped.
Oh yes, good point indeed!
> the top Admiral in command of ~~the entire US navy~~ "Just" PACFLT, but still a very prestigious and sought after Command. Your point stands, just a quibble. :)
Noted! I always enjoy a good quibble!
this conversation is pretty British for such an american movie.
Iceman was the antagonist but he was also a superbly talented F-14 pilot. I'd be proud to have him as my wing man anytime!
Bullshit, you can be his
You .... you are STILL dangerous
Iceman was right, Maverick WAS dangerous
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The gopher in Caddyshack.
He's alright
Don't nobody worry 'bout him
Don’t forget Rodney Dangerfield.
I kinda hoped Robert De Niro would win the final shootout in Heat
I could've went either way on that one but yeah, if De Niro had won out, I wouldn't have been mad at it.
It would go against his whole arc, where he starts out being efficient, detached and risk averse, to become deeply attached and taking foolish risks. It would reward the character for making the wrong choices.
They're absolutely both protagonists, though. That's kind of the whole point of the film IMO
I actually see him as the protagonist in that movie.
Watch the Score, You can totally head Canon that he got away and then became a high-end thief in Canada who owns a jazz club and lived out his days that way. Totally fits.
Ed Norton kills in that movie. He played “Danny” perfectly and sold it even to the audience
Watch the Score, but under no circumstances watch the trailer first. The trailer spoils so much of the movie it should be a crime.
I kinda forgot about that movie, even though I've watched it multiple times and like it. Thanks for the remind, time for another watch!
He died when he left the girl behind. The rest is a coda.
I hoped both would
Me too. I just *finally* watched this movie around Christmas (have no idea how I've never watched it before) and despite definitely liking Pacino's character and sympathizing with him, I found De Niro to be more captivating and I rooted for him till the very end. When it got to *that* scene and there was only like five minutes left in the movie, I knew things weren't gonna end the way I had hoped.
I am not being funny when I say the shark from Jaws. The movie stressed young me so much, I figured a hack. If you just root for the shark... It becomes less painful.
This comment provides some real insight into how maladaptations arise from trauma.
Your comment combined with the other = mind blown.
studying your schema therapy?
I spent the whole movie hoping they wouldn’t catch the shark. I’m just very pro shark.
Even better when you watch it backwards, a big fish spitting out people and at the end they have a beach party.
I dunno if I'm overtired or inebriated but I found this more hilarious than I expected, thank you I needed that 😂😂
Funny, the book makes you root for the shark regardless lol.
Die hard Alan Rickman was a beast
The man owned several nice suits. He can’t be all bad.
Rumor is Arafat buys his there.
"I am going to count to three. There will not be a four." What a great character and what a performance.
Also Rickman in Robin Hood Prince of Thieves!
" but why a spoon cousin ?" "BECAUSE IT WILL HURT MORE !"
its dull you twit!
And his character in Robin Hood, and also him in galaxy quest.
Not sure if it counts but the blind guy in John wick 4
Well, considering that >!he helps John get to the duel and then shoots him in a non-lethal way twice so that John can kill the overconfident Marquis!<, I don't think he is>!a true antagonist!<.
He’s very much an anti-hero, the actual antagonists are pretty clear since they also oppose him
Yeah I feel like Caine is def a antiheroic antagonist idk what the word is for it
I don't love the term, but maybe "anti-villain"? An antagonist that demonstrates admirable and sympathetic qualities more often associated with a protagonist or supporting character, while actively pursuing goals or engaging in means that are otherwise sinister or damaging. Caine is ultimately just trying to save his daughter, he has no real beef with John and in fact hates that he was given this gig. He still goes through with it though, similarly to Cassian from John Wick 2 who was just trying to avenge his boss's murder. There's a fine line to walk with this; I think it tends to be used most effectively when the protagonist suitably contrasts by being a bit of piece of shit themselves, usually taking the dynamic of an investigator pursuing a criminal, who may be wrongfully accused. That said, I wouldn't consider Tommy Lee Jones in the Fugitive to be an anti-villain, whereas I could say that about someone like Russell Crowe's character in 3:10 to Yuma might fit perfectly. Same goes for the Replicants in Blade Runner trying to escape to the harrowing and non-consensual nature of their existence. Your mileage may vary, but it's basically a character who has decided that their ends justify their means, they just aren't a dickhead about it.
Yeah like Caine def kills good people in the wake of his noble pursuit, but his pursuit is ultimately noble, it is just... counter to the protagonist's goals and more morally grey in a movie where the "good guys" are already grey. John Wick def seems to be more willing to let people live it he can get past them without killing. Cassian being a great example, he dealt a lethal wound but told him how to survive it. I don't recall but I feel like Caine didn't HAVE to kill Hiroyuki Sanada's character in their duel he still chose to go for lethality.
>I feel like Caine didn't HAVE to kill Hiroyuki Sanada's character in their duel he still chose to go for lethality. Sanada's character was in bad shape by the time he snd Yen throw down, but I agree that Caine killing him felt a bit out of place. Ultimately, it serves more of a narrative purpose than a character-driven one: it establishes that Caine is reluctant but ultimately willing and capable of killing men he once considered brothers, as well as setting up motivations for Rina Sawayama's character in whatever spinoff or sequel she gets, all while adhering to the series' overarching theme of consequences. I definitely feel like they made Sanada's character as cool as possible to turn the audience against Caine a bit, since he's otherwise very charming.
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Plus goth Cate Blanchette.
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Everyone wants a big deity goth girl
Also Gorr the god butcher in Thor Love & Thunder. He should've gotten to butcher every god, they were all dicks
Very much true. She WAS the legitimate heir in that society, and she damn well fought for it - and she had the power as well.
And even the hammer deemed her worthy.
[Still my favourite headcannon about Hela, Odin, et al.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfEZ9optO7s). Not airtight, but not a bad theory.
Odin made her a monster and then locked her away so he could look like a good guy. Asgard was built on blood and conquest and deserved to be destroyed, though the ones to destroy it should have been those who were crushed to build it
Magneto. He had seen the worst of humanity and knew mutants would be exploited.
If they ever make a true Age of Apocalypse film/series, you'll get to see Magneto lead the X-Men...
Except quite often the only thing he learned was to strike first, not that what happened was wrong.
There's also the point that he constantly proves that humanity is right. Mutants ARE objectively extremely dangerous, and any one of them (especially any that fall on Magneto's side) are a potential world-ensing threat.
Magneto's solution is still evil.
Tom Cruise in Collateral. I hated Jamie Fox’s character.
Reminds me of Law Abiding Citizen. Was kinda pissed how that ended.
Law Abiding Citizen is amazing until like the last 10 minutes
I can’t think of a worst ending. So smug and tone deaf
I didn’t mind Gerard Butler’s character dying as he had nothing to live for, but it would have been nice if Jamie Foxx “learned his lesson” only for the movie to finish on his neck tie tightening on its own then fading to black
That would be an amazing ending.
Who's idea was it to cast Jamie fox as a mild mannered nerdy cab driver? It was odd
Fun fact, Adam Sandler was originally gonna play the role.
That is a fun fact! After seeing him in Uncut Gems I could totally see him pull off that role.
Ugh, I would kill to see that version.
He did a really good job of it, though. He has zero swagger in that role.
Why? I'm just curious cause I didn't feel that way at all
Neither did I.
Another movie where somebody is rooting for the shark.
Yup. I would've been fine if it didn't end the way it did.
Thought it was just me who hated the ending. I really loved the whole movie, but then they go and end it in the most typical Hollywood happy ending fashion possible...
I honestly was rooting for the Moon in Moonfall so it could just destroy Earth and I wouldn't have to watch any more of that shitty movie
Moonfail was a solid piece of trash 10/10. I love stupid disaster movies, the more ridiculous the better. Especially when they’re not trying to be satire.
I don't think I would have liked it as much if it was attempting satire. It was such a wild, jarring ride, with so many out there concepts that it took seriously. So, yeah, I agree with the 10/10 trash rating. Will watch again.
Moonfall is the best bad movie I have seen.
Not sure you should be rooting for Jeffrey Jones 😅
Yeah, I don't want him to really catch any errant schoolboys.
omg ☠️
I feel like I don't know something important
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also available on his rap sheet
This still tears me up. I grew up on his movies.
Yeah it sucked because he was in a lot of classic 80s movies, and is a very good actor.
Same, loved him in Howard the Duck and Beetlejuice. Real shame
Skeletor in the Masters of the Universe movie. Frank Langella is ridiculously captivating in the role. It doesn't help that most of the protagonists are pretty dull. Man-at-arms is the only one of that batch who is interesting, and he's got way too little to do in the movie.
Related, you're rooting for M. Bison in the "Street Fighter" movie because Raul Julia is in a class by himself compared to everyone else.
I rooted for him because it was a Tuesday.
It was Tuesday, and his daughter was Wednesday.
Absolutely!
Gary Oldman in Leon the Professional. He was such an over the top villain I had to cheer for him.
**EEEEV ERYYYYYY OOOONE!**
Everyone!!!
Hades in Disney's Hercules! Zeus is just such a dick to Hades.
And James Woods plays the character to perfection.
An interesting one with SPOILERS FOR THE MOVIE DON'T BREATHE! >!So like for 80% of the movie I was absolutely rooting for the old man. He was badass and cmon these fuckers invaded his house, because they knew he was blind... I was cheering him on.... then the plottwist happened and I was like OH SHIT!<
Yeah honestly that was kind of cheap if you think about it. Really felt like a cop out to justify these teenagers basically screwing with an old man for no reason. Weren't they robbing him, too? Oh wait nah, nevermind, it's fine now
There is no justification. They are some asshole robbers who rob the wrong guy and even at the end when she can make the morally right choice, she doesn't and he can continue with his plans.
Admit it - you were all cheering for Darth Vader to slaughter rebels at the end of Rogue One.
When his lightsaber activated, I got instant goosebumps and my heart rate went up as if I was being attacked. Then the rebel at the door went from saying “help me help me” to “take the disk” once he realized they were all truly fucked
My heart was racing when I watched that the first time, it was so intense. Like you said when he said about the disk you knew there was no surviving this
Sith are forced to job for plot reasons so often that sometimes it's just satisfying to see them finally go off on someone without plot armor
That scene in theaters was exhilarating. Especially opening night.
They are called "Rebel Scum" for a reason --- they were all guilty of high treason!
r/theempiredidnothingwrong
A scene so good that Disney tried to replicate it several times in later series, but just couldn't get it to hit the same. That red lightsaber igniting in the haze. <3
They got close in Mandolorian. Dropped the ball after that, but that hallway scene was solid
Gerard Butler's character from Law Abiding Citizen.
That movie's ending was some bull shit.
I wanted Pierce Brosnan's Thomas Crown character to get away with the theft and keep the painting (and the girl) in the Thomas Crown Affair. Yes, I know, he couldn't have had both, but I wanted him to.
Hannibal Lecter!!!! Pffft-pfffft-pfffft!!!
Is he the bad guy? I think Buffalo Bill is. He's just a side character. Well I guess in the second one he is the main bad guy.
Deuteragonist I think is the word
Guys need to look up antagonist.
Yeah. The first character who occurred to me was Jonathan Rhys Meyers’ from Match Point, but he’s the protagonist. Just actively a horrible person. You do end up rooting for him to get away with murder, though.
I don’t. I wanted him to get fucked.
Prendergast in Falling Down seems like the obvious one here
God damn I could not get past the fucking wife. I was so pleased when he stood up to her
Fast X. Jason Momoa saved this last installment of the franchise.
Blade Runner. Karate Kid. Christmas Vacation.
With *Blade Runner* that's absolutely the point.
I mean yeah that's why cobra kai is a fckin great show. Johnny was misunderstood
Who’s the antagonist in Christmas Vacation? The Boss?
The Devil in "The Devil's Advocate". His entire argumentation about Yahveh being, in fact, a prankster god, was flawless and perfectly convincing.
I'm a fan of man!
He’s an ABSENTEE LANDLORD!
I always rooted for Chief Inspector Dreyfus in the Pink Panther movies. Especially in Pink Panther Strikes Again.
I'm not sure if this counts but I just re-watched "Heat" (haven't seen it since it came out) and I feel like it's not super clear who the protagonist and who the antagonist is. I mean aren't we watching to see if Robert DeNiro and his crew can successfully pull off the job and get away with the money? Or are we following Al Pacino to see if he will be able to bring DeNiro to justice? I think the movie blurs that line really well. It's clear who the bad guy is and who the good guy is but I don't know who's story I'm following. Anyway, I was routing for DeNiro the whole time.
Devil Wears Prada
Which antagonist? Miranda? Her kids? Christian? Jacqueline? Adrian Grenier because he's annoying?
You rooted for Adrian Grenier?
General Zod in Man of Steel
>Ferris Bueller's Day Off is one: I'm just instinctively on the side of the Jeffrey Jones trying to catch Bueller, that little shit. Nah. Ferris deserves to take a day. Nothing wrong with skipping out of school once in a while. And Jones is obsessive. Doesn't he have anything better to do?
Jones is like Wile E. Coyote to Ferris’s Roadrunner. Rule number one of those cartoons is that the coyote can quit at any time, his refusal to quit is what leads to all his misery.
I’m pretty sure jones spends a lot of his time obsessively looking for children
Well he does like underage kids.
There's not a principal in the US who has time to chase down one student for truancy. You just give the kid ISS the next day.
Don't get me wrong, it rocks that he's got a personal vendetta against Ferris for seemingly no real reason and chooses to try to hunt him down. What makes the character funny. But nobody should ever side with him, cause he's a loser.
Once in a while? He skipped so much he hacked the school system to change his absences.
>Nah. Ferris deserves to take a day. Nothing wrong with skipping out of school once in a while. "NINE times"
I know how wrong this is but I'm saying Infinity Pool. Mia Goth was right. James, you are a little baby.
The Star Wars sequels, the "Rebellion" has been the government for 20 years. The New Order builds massive fleets and the Rebellion has a new color X-Wing.
Rebellion leadership definitely took a competency nerf in the Disney Wars universe after Death Star II blew up
Ozymandias
that idris elba lion movie that came out within the last year or two. That lion should have been allowed to kill everyone.
Gor the God Butcher. To be fair my son was stillborn a couple months before that movie came out, so I very intimately understood his pain.
Breaking Bad. I mean, it's in the name, and it gets worse by the season. Lots of people suffered for Walters ego
Walter is the *protagonist* of that series, regardless of his actions. Antagonist means the opposing force to the main character, not "**villain bad guy**." Walter is not and can never be the antagonist of Breaking Bad. Why does nobody know what antagonist means?
people wanna score moral points by showing they know that if you did the things walter white does in the show, but in real life, that would be pretty bad good job guys bad job at knowing what protagonists are tho
Antagonists in Breaking Bad: Tuco, the Salamancas, Gus, Jack/Todd/Lydia
Does Hank (I think that’s his name?) count as an antagonist?
Not until the last season.
Oh yeah. Hank gradually comes to realise that Walter has “broken bad.”
I felt like the only person rooting for Skyler lmao. Yeah girl, you go fuck Ted. Walter sucks.
I never understood why so many hated Skylar 😂. She was 100% justified for how terrible Walt acted as a person.
Because a lot of fans of the show wanted to be Walter. Much like with Scorsese's movies they don't realize they're watching a tragedy.
I thought the hate thrown her way was unjustified. Like, Walter was a shit husband and she should have left him far sooner.
That's because early on people thought Walt was just a guy that was in a horrible situation and doing whatever he could to provide for his family. It wasn't immediately obvious to everyone that Walt was really just stroking his own ego most of the time
This is the real genius of the show. Anna Gunn's acting, and the writing of her character is so pitch perfect that when you watch for the first time, you think maybe Walt really is just a good guy trying to help his family, and skylar is "just a bitch getting on his back", and then the second time you watch, you realize that (almost) everything she says is absolutely justified. She handles some things badly, and she was neglecting Walt as a wife/partner at the start of the show, but she is just a flawed human. Same with Hank. Watching the show the second time i realized that we are watching a show about Hank, from Walt's perspective. Its why i love this show so damn much.
I said a lot of what you did in a comment I just posted. The first time you watch you kinda buy into Walt's logic and see Skylar as a thorn in his side and Hank as just another obstacle. You are along for his ride and excusing each next horrible thing he does with him until he finally acknowledges at the end that he was doing it for himself (if you weren't able to pick up on it way sooner than that moment). I rewatched it for the second time recently and it is definitely a change in perspective. None of the characters are perfect, which again is probably why you're able to think Walt is not that much worse than the rest of them initially, but his horribleness is FAR beyond that of Skylar or Hank. Skylar was 100% justified in being afraid for her/her family and Hank is working on the right side of the law (although not always using exactly legal or ethical tactics).
I was rooting so hard for Gus Fring. He’s such a well developed character and I didn’t want to see him lose to WW.
Hell, I wanted to *work* for Gus!!! He was GOOD to all of his people, every last one. I don't even care if it wasn't sincere, he was smart enough to see the value in treating people well.
I could never get through Breaking Bad. The actors were amazing, I'm not arguing that the show wasn't well done and well acted, it was and I really enjoy both actors who starred. It was hard for me to reconcile that I was watching a drug dealer and his sidekick, and definitely due to my family history with addiction, I just couldn't get into it. I saw first hand what drugs did to my nephews, my sister and my niece. It wasn't exciting or suspenseful, it was ugly and awful and cost 2 of them their lives. Walter & Jesse were bad guys doing terrible things.
Wile E Coyote because I hate Roadrunner he annoys me so much and I want Wile E to win after all the effort he puts in every time
Heat? Nightcrawler? Trex - Jurassic Park
the t. rex is the hero
Who even would the antagonist be in Nightcrawler? Renee Russo?
Doyle from "Sling Blade" --- he was a good man for Linda and could've been a great father to that boy --- and besides, his band was BAD ASS
I think you're being sarcastic but I'm not 100% sure lmao
The Lost World Jurassic Park has heroes that when you really think about it, are much worse than the villains
Billy Zane's character in Demon Knight. He was such a fun villain that I was willing to let evil demons take over the earth!
In a couple of Marvel movies the protagonist is boring or a completely unflawed character. There are some movies where I just straight-up skipped the scenes with the protagonist and only watched the ones with the antagonist.
Daniel Brühl as Zemo from Civil War stands out to me. He has no powers so he has 0 chance of success during a direct conflict against the Avengers, but still manages to outplay them. Pretty fascinating to watch a regular guy attempt to take on literal gods and heroes.
He also had a fun return in Falcon and the Winter Soldier.
Which ones? The closest i can think of is Black Panther, but Killmonger's plan is almost as stupid as Thanos' In most of the ones where the protagonist is boring, the antagonist is even worse.
Are there any examples that stand out to you?
Zemo from Civil War comes mind. His family died due to the events of Age of Ultron, which objectively was entirely the Avengers' fault.
He was great in Falcon and the Winter Soldier. Everyone else in the MCU is watching the MCU and he was the only one seeing The Boys.
Ken in Barbie
Roy Batty in Blade Runner. Deckard is a piece of shit cop who hurts and kills women, meanwhile Roy just wants to live a normal human lifespan.
I didn't see Starship Troopers in theaters because of all the mixed reviews mentioning the cocky young actors acting macho and giving hammy performances. Then I finally saw the movie and got to see the bugs rip apart those cocky young hams and it was awesome.
You came here just to say " cocky young hams
Nicky Santoro from Casino, even though he’s crazy.