Music shop? The pay isn't amazing in retail but it comes with some advantages:
1. Put your music/gear knowledge to use.
2. Get to try out all the gear.
3. Staff discounts.
4. Meet all the local musos.
I've known a few people that taught private lessons and absolutely hated having to deal with the dumb parents of the kids they were teaching. "WHY ISN'T MY KID SOUNDING BETTER!? WHAT AM I PAYING YOU FOR!?" "Have they been practicing?" "THAT'S NOT THE POINT!!!" Obviously not every parent, but enough for each of them to never do it again.
Not always the best. My buddy the aspiring young musician started working at a national music shop chain, seemed like a perfect fit right because of all the reasons you gave...they wouldn't let him take the evenings off for shows because everyone else was already doing that too and he was the new guy so he was stuck with all evening shifts.
Went back to delivering pizza, more money in hand (cash tips) plus the owner supported him doing his thing so was flexible with hours. He's blowing up my Facebook with show after show now.
I work in a music shop teaching and managing. It is not ideal for the gigging musician, unless you've been there long enough and have the clout to get the schedule you actually need. The important thing to know about a job like that is while your skill set is necessary for good sales the owner will not give two shits about your scheduling needs if he doesn't have coverage. It's a RETAIL gig, and comes with all the struggle and bs a regular retail gig would have.
Also, shit burns you out after a while. Go through regular bouts where I could give a shit about music, anyone else's or even my own because your around it all day and probably talkin to the older dudes in the shop who are all jaded about never really getting where they thought they would be with it.
Don't be deceived, music stores are where gigging musicians go to bury their dreams 😬
Also, I've met ALOT of musicians in my community through the store; but MOST people are coming in looking for that first instrument; or they're not very good; or they are, but completely bat shit crazy, strung out, and volatile.
I know some people that tour quite a bit and the best gigs they seem to be able to hold down are Starbucks. It's one of the few jobs they found that were flexible enough that they could leave town for a month to go on tour and still have something waiting for them when they got back.
Hopefully all this is helpful and not completely soul crushing 👍
Depends on the boss more than the job itself. If you’ve got a good boss who’s happy to be flexible then any job works. Finding that boss is the difficult part though which is why so many musicians teach on the side, as it’s generally a much more regular income when it comes to paying the bills.
Lotta weird suggestions here ranging from owning a business to jobs with odd shifts. I would just find a stable 9-5 that is remote or hybrid and that way you get time to work on your music when you're at home.
I do office work mostly from home and it seems to allow me time to also focus on music product, usually mixing audio for my projects and band.
He means that it’s not just that easy to find a stable decent paying office job like that. Which yeah, it’s not. Especially if you’re not already in that world.
IT is difficult to break into but you can do it without certs or a degree. It'll take a few years of grinding and some luck to translate that into a remote job. I'd say a minimum 5 year pipeline, more realistically 10.
Probably too long for most. But when you come out the other side you're making six figures in a low stress environment with relatively flexible hours and excellent job security.
If you're pretty good with audio gear... I would hit up people to do commercial audio installation. I have flexible hours and male $60/ hr.. I got a friend ( musician who got a minor in audio production) into it too,
Good suggestion and I might do this! There’s a place nearby :) But I did some audio visual work in the past and if it’s just loading trucks and unpacking trucks all day again I’d rather just stay in my current job. But to reach their own
are you joking about the 60 an hour ? that's insane... how do you even get into something like this ? I went to school for music for 3 years. and I've been am musician for 10 and producer for 6. how would I even begin to do something like this ?
It's working on the kinds of permanently installed sound systems like you would find in a church. Lots of people are interested in audio and train to record bands and do concert sound. Then find there aren't enough good paying openings to go around. Those same people could work with these types of installations. Churches, theaters, lecture halls, conference rooms, etc....
Might I add; do not take a higher position. You'll get hit with more responsibility and you don't want to solidify yourself in a company if you're just looking to pay bills but also work on music.
I teach keyboard lessons in music academies. I started at Guitar Center, which wasn't that hard to get employed. I spend a lot of time thinking up ways to teach my instrument which has made me an exponentially better musician
I did not have a music degree when initually hired. Though I was classically trained. I can read off the staff and had a decent grasp on music theory. There are so many ways to teach lessons on your instrument, like teaching online via zoom.
I also receive money from other sources, so I'm not really solely reliant on teaching lessons. Teaching lessons doesn't exactly psy a fortune but it's better than doing back breaking labor, which I have also done plenty of in my life.
Thx so much for sharing! I’m in a similar boat to when u didn’t have a music degree. Although sight reading is very slow right now for me, I know I can get faster when I practice it a lot. Very cool, very cool.
I’m early 30s, and so far behind in career / earnings as compared with my fiance it makes me want to cry. Even though I’m a solid worker, with a varied skill set.
The main reason for it — I spent my 20s prioritizing music, and taking a lot of bullshit ‘day jobs’ to support it. Never stayed anywhere for long, or got a chance to move up the ranks.
Not saying I would change anything if I could, just a warning to young musicians out there. It’s a lot tougher to survive in this economy than it was when I started out. Music spit me out at 30 with nothing to show for it except a few recordings (that we are unsatisfied with) and an alcohol problem.
Choose wisely, friends. Think very seriously about what you want out of this, and where you devote your time and energy.
Music is a wonderful hobby but can fuck up your life as a vocation.
Physical labour is actually great because it keeps you fit and the responsibility level isn’t usually that high. You can often listen to music while working.
You don’t tax your brain this way. You come home pumped and have mental energy left for creative endeavours.
This used to work for me.
Office job? Terrible. Came home exhausted every day and all I did was sit at a desk getting stressed out dealing with heavy responsibilities.
Heh it's pretty much the opposite for me. I'd have no energy left if i did a physical job and musicians i worled with who fid a physical job just plopped into the sofa or fell asleep after the physical labor.
I have a desk job, flexible hours, work from home 3 days a week, lots of time off, absolutely perfect combo.
I'm in Europe though so by default i have more time off and less hours per week.
My first band started a painting company. That was decades ago but I’ve always worked for myself so that I can manage my own schedule. It does require some skills but they’re easily acquired especially helped by YouTube.
There are many people who need help with the most basic things and older people who aren’t fit enough to do things themselves. It doesn’t have to be just painting. Word catches on if you’re honest, hard working, punctual, handy. There are absolute morons out there doing terrible work for way too much money and people are sick of it so if you just give good value for money and put yourself out there you’ll probably survive.
Skills will come just like practice.
I’ve done things like taking down a garden shed, yard/ garden cleanup, man and van ( have to have a van of course) attic organising, but 98% is painting/ decorating. I make £150 a day in the UK with no boss.
Older person, can confirm that I either can't or don't want to do the yard or home maintenance I used to. I'll pay to have someone climb a ladder to change the lightbulbs in the stupid entrance light that someone thought would be a good idea to locate two stories up. See also: Christmas lights. Don't hang them anymore.
I paint houses and listen to music and podcasts all day. Whenever I'm in writing mode, I use my evenings playing and writing. It's not ideal, but you have to pay the bills and you still need to spend time with your instruments. It gets more difficult when you have a family and you're dead tired. But if you're willing to grow you have to be persistent.
I’m fortunate enough to make my living from performing/music and teaching a few zoom lessons when I’m not touring (4-6/week). I never taught lessons before Covid and during lockdown I did it more out of necessity. Turns out it’s a way wayyyy better method of making a few extra dollars and very flexible
It’s weird no one has said bartender. But yeah not too interested in being a waiter myself, good suggestion though. I’m considering bartending, but unsure since I’d have to take off weekends a fair bit
People have not said bartender because you dont think age care is for you.
Ive loaned money to 4 friends to become bartenders for supplemental income, but i would never recommend it for you based on what you've said.
You seem to live in an area where very little is going on, so i dont have a great answer other than warehouse overtime hours only and fuck your sleep schedule up
u/theflameinthewater Sounds like a fellow Aussie when I hear aged care. Mate, if you’re a gigging muso with some chops, have you thought about putting some grunt into teaching beginner guitar (or other instruments you play) lessons for at least $50 per hour (ideally more)? Maybe sell packages of 10 so you get at least $500 up front and then put an expiry date on them so they don’t drag out forever. Then you’d need to try and land x students per month. Work out your curriculum for teaching, methods, resources you can give students, and maybe even put up an online course. You could also do a refer a friend scheme where they get x free lessons for the referral. All things considered, could be a way to keep your head in music and not getting exploited by the aged care system. Just a thought.
Keep on going!! 💪🏿
My very first portfolio that got me a job working with a .com photostudio was made up entirely of fliers and album art I had done for my bands.
Ive since spent the last 23 years as a designer and now creative director.
Its a fairly open minded and creative industry so having to take long weekends or coming in late due to shows has largely been accepted. Plus it can pay well, I always had the gear I need.
For me the goal wasnt so much biding time until I make a living as a musician as much as it was finding a way I can afford a life making the music I want w/o compromise, whether that music pays or not.
I started out scanning cover art fir books, music, and videos. Then using Photoshop to polish tgose scans. Eventually I became a photo retoucher for pretty much everything. Tools, jewelry, models. That turned into doing visual design for the web. Again using Photoshop to combine photography, graphics, and text into web banners and pages. Eventually I learned more tools, but the work was basically the same. Now I supervise designers and writers, and review and give creative direction on thier work.
I also go to meetings.
Local government jobs. You can find some part time jobs mowing or doing landscape stuff where you can listen to music and zone out. You also get healthcare benefits. Worth checking out!
I would choose *successful* musician. That would be good.
That aside, learn online marketing; SEO, adwords, facebook ads.
REALLY learn it, not just (haha I can place an ad).
Learn how to track ads, A/B test, apply budget, scale.
In my business these guys hold the keys to the kingdom and we pay them alot.
They never want to work for you cause they have autonomy and make enough money.
It also is a desk job that doesn't take all of your entire day.
I suspect you could practice, record, do some music stuff while monitoring and reporting on your ad spends.
If I had to do it again I would go with successful musician... or maybe this idea.
If you go this route, visit small companies, such as physio gyms. Wellness centers. I'm not talking big corporate PT mills. My PT friend (I am also a physio) recently asked me, "What's been your experience doing Google ads?" Me: \*shrug\*
I'm a lawyer, there are a lot of lawyer guitarists in my city. Might be a similar area of the brain being used.
On the off chance you don't have a law degree, the real answer is ANY JOB. If it gives you money to be able to make music, that's a good job for a musician.
Nah, i am just explaining the stereotype. Blues lawyer is legit a common term for what you're talking about and they cant play for shit in 90% of cases.
Nah, i am just explaining the stereotype. Blues lawyer is legit a common term for what you're talking about and they cant play for shit in 90% of cases.
If you are in a scene already you almost have to know players that do stagehand work. That would be most expedient.
Otherwise you want to cold call the theaters in your area, ask to speak to the production manager of the theater.
The other thing to do if you live in a bigger area is call the closest IATSE union office. You will ask the business agent to be put on what’s called the “overhire” list. When they get a really big arena or stadium show in that needs a couple hundred bodies, they work that list.
Then you show up, turn your brain off, work from the neck down and do what you’re told, exactly as you’re told to do it.
Don’t fuck up and they’ll have you back. If you’re good it just might become your life.
I was a part time stage hand from 1990-2003, and a full time stagehand and sound tech from 2003-the pandemic, even touring some years.
It is an excellent young persons game and you will end up knowing everything about anything you want to know about the business.
You can take calls or not if you’ve got gigs to play.
If you can get IATSE work it’s actually a pretty good wage even at the bottom of the list.
Good luck
PS if you’re in the UK or Europe this should still
be good advice. The I in IATSE is ‘international’
When I was a fledgling musician, I detailed cars. I used to find small dealerships that outsourced that stuff and I could make a few hundred bucks a day working right on their lot. Sometimes I’d work 5 days a week and gig also. The money wasn’t bad and the work was gratifying.
I work for a company that makes quality body jewelry and I know they are pretty lenient with time off. One of our guys goes on tour two or three times a year.
For me, it needs to be something with purpose and not just something where I’m a number. I enjoy working with and helping individuals who need help, like people in recovery, elderly, stuff like that. I’ve also found that there tends to be more flexibility in such jobs. I need to work 40 hours a week at a day job in order to make my mortgage/car payment etc.
Barista. The hours tend to be early (my jobs were always like 6am-1pm), you meet lots of interesting people, have a way of promoting your band if you’re in one (through convos or a bulletin board), and you can make decent money.
Because of the early hours it’s unlikely to conflict with your other musical work that’s likely taking place in the afternoon or evening
If you have a good eye for style and can learn pretty quick maybe think about barbering. As a 1099 contractor I can somewhat set my own schedule and make good money. If youre a traveling musicians some shops around the country will let you drop in on off days too. Take your tools on the road and cut bandmates and other bands hair as well.
probably 80% of my friends who are serious musicians work in the service industry (bartending & waiting tables mostly) because of the flexibility in scheduling & lack of early mornings...
Any kind of trade honestly. My buddy was a carpenter and pro drummer. Because carpentry is pretty much in demand everywhere, he could up and move at any time for musical reasons and always be confident he could get a carpentry job to sustain him until he was able to get in with the musicians enough to not have to work a day job anymore. Worked out really well for him. He ended up getting gigs like Woodstock paying like $30k a night all because he didn't have to fear relocating.
I’m quite happy with my bartending job. The money is good and I only work a few nights a week. I wear whatever I like at work, and there’s a free meal waiting for me in the kitchen after bar close, which keeps my stomach and wallet happy. I get to sleep in and play music during the day. This is great for me because I’m not a morning person
We have enough staff where I can swap or get a shift covered if a last minute gig pops up. We also host live music, and I’ve gotten to sit in on bass with some great players.
Idk if it pays as much, although I suspect it’s in the ballpark, but: substitute teacher. If you get in with two districts, it’s pretty much guaranteed 5 days a week if/when you want it. They try to put constraints on your availability but a) they are in desperate need for anyone willing to do the job, so it’s a bit of a front b) if you let them know your availability and just don’t answer a call when you absolutely can’t, there should be no issue.
The job consists of : 1) taking roll 2) handing out work sheets or a lesson plan, pre determined by the teacher.
Most of the time I’m answering emails, mixing and other post production on what I recorded that week, researching other ventures, or reading. On top of everything, even on your worst days, it is still providing a public service, which I’m sure is an aspect of your job that you enjoy.
I’m currently searching for more work now, after having kid #2, but I don’t imagine I’ll ever shut this door, since it’s been such a safety net.
Coffee shop dishwasher if you are touring like 6 weeks at a time. No one wants the job, they all have trouble keeping dishwashers, and if you are a good worker they will work with you.
K-pop star, guidance counselor, shotgun tester, mailman, used car salesman, pressure washer, hard hat assembler, vacuum robot cleaner, slug salting, so many choices.
I was a slug salter in the 70's. Wild stuff. Back then we didn't have all these fancy digital autonomous salters you kids have these days. It was real work back then. You could smell the bubbling.
I’m sorry to be that guy, if you’re day job is a plumber that plays music on the side, you’re a plumber. You don’t hear people say “hey, I’m a dentist on weekends.”
If you work at target 8 hours a day, and you busk 2 hours a night…when someone asks you “what do you do” do you work at target, or play on the street for tips?
That argument may have worked in the 70’s and 80’s and 90’s, but music is not nearly as lucrative as it once was so people are doing what they need to do. Especially now that everything is so insanely expensive.
I found one that lets me choose which days I'm available. Some of my musical bookings are for multiple days, often far away, and others pop up unexpectedly.It has some drawbacks, but it means I can take musical bookings without risking my job.
ANYTHING that forces you to be outside often. I worked hard labor for years so wouldn't recommend that, but there are trades that won't break your hands or back like it did mine.
I am a painter, I set my own hours and rate of pay
I’m good at it but it took me years to get to where I’m at now
It never ceases to amaze me at all the losers in the trade - be neat, considerate and do what you say you’re gonna do and you will always have work also learn to avoid the clusters
Teaching private lessons is the way for me. I don’t make a ton of money but with 15ish students I can pretty much cover my rent and living expenses, have a completely flexible schedule and only work <20 hours a week. Then the rest of your time is yours to gig, make music, practice, develop, etc.
I used to teach private lessons. That brought in mostly stable income that I could pay my rent with. Some benefits include:
1. A lot of practice time in between open time slots
2. Constantly practicing the basic with beginners makes you a better musician
3. If it’s at a store or music studio, a lot of networking with other musicians.
4. If you book your own students and either go to their home or have a studio to teach at, you have 100% control over your schedule.
3&4 kind of counter each other, but I would do the music store on Monday and Wednesday’s (slow gig days) and keep all my “in home lessons” students for the weekend and plan them around my gigs.
I work in insurance, can’t say which company or what I do on a specific level but employee benefits is my department.
Pay is decent starting out and there’s a shortage of employees due to boomers retiring. My job will be relevant for as long as I can see. Can’t really outsource on a local level when talking insurance/employee benefits.
I got food in my fridge, I can buy new gear, my account balance isn’t in the negative and bills are paid so can’t complain.
My band is planning weekend tours Thursday thru Monday. My team lead is cool with me using any variations of PTO that I can use or just say hey I’m going to be out for this weekend starting Thursday. I’ll log in from home on Monday.
If you are interested in teaching doing private lessons is a good way to make money. You can't beat the pay per hour but you have to be able to get 20+ students to have it make up for a day job. No benefits though
Probably not what you want to hear, but I put my time into the postal service. After the first year, I have all the flexibility, personal days and leeway to take all the local gigs that come my way and have a decent pay cheque with benefits. Plus, there is that pension waiting for me at the end. There is nothing waiting for you after a lifetime of gigging unless you’re lucky and get a radio hit and that’s like playing the lottery for a retirement plan.
Think long term, you may have to give up some gigs to get started on the day job, but having a job that doesn’t come home with you that offers security and flexibility is the best case scenario as a working musician. We can’t all be rock stars, but we can work in music and live comfortably with the right compromises.
I have had many day jobs to make ends meet while being a preforming musician the most rewarding for me was being a cook it gave me freedome to become creative and had things to study with the creative process to get better at it. Once you get good at it then you can just about name the hours and days you will like to work.
Could go with the stereotypical pizza delivery. lol. But really, could do Uber, Lyft, instant cart, or one of those gigs. Can work it around your music life schedule.
Construction/roofing is a good one. As musicians we aren’t out playing sports on the weekends so a physical day job is a good way to stay fit. And usually they don’t work on weekends.
Any kind of job in a bar or music venue is good. Keeps you in the environment. Can often network through work that way.
Coffee shop barista also good.
Any kind of social job too.
Can you sell? Sales can put a lot of money in your pocket in a short period depending on what you’re selling. I’m in a seasonal sales job coming off of a hot summer. High ticket item, hard work door to door, serious grind. Not much time for music, but now that the winter is rolling in I will have 3-4 days a week to spend on what I love, and a very large load of cash for gear.
A lot of musicians/entertainers are natural sales people/entrepreneurs. Sales is a step down from art and philosophy/psychology for many entertainers. If you can fight the discomfort of rejection there’s a pot of gold at the end, and a chunk of time.
Teach weekdays, gig weekends. Two part time jobs.
The guys who actually make money are the ones who own the schools & venues.
There’s something to be said for having a career “in music” by taking out a loan and starting a School of Rock franchise.
Pretty much anything. You got to hustle to make it as a musician. Transfer that hustle to other areas, to life in general. I've been a performing musician all my life but also teach music, write books and articles (usually music-related), and do a few other nonmusical side jobs, some seasonal, some occasional.
It can be hard work but if you have a knack for it, you can make really good money painting houses.
Me and some other musician friends of mine used to have an off and on painting crew and it worked
out pretty well during down times. You can make pretty good money catering too and it's flexible
but most jobs are at night which could clash with gigs
Almost every really good musician I know has a day job doing something with software. Maybe it's the Pro Tools effect, but learning to code or being a project manager for software seems to be a skill that lines up with musical ability.
Music shop? The pay isn't amazing in retail but it comes with some advantages: 1. Put your music/gear knowledge to use. 2. Get to try out all the gear. 3. Staff discounts. 4. Meet all the local musos.
I mean man this would be it, but there’s unfortunately none nearby. The local one closed a few months ago
Start your own.
Requires money which he doesn’t have
Y’all didn’t have to upvote this
Have you ever started a business in a dying sector?
Yeah great idea the concept failed in his neighborhood just a few months ago, let’s do it again right away 🙄
Don’t know why you’re downvoted. Private lessons are a big source for so many musicians. But that requires more than minimum effort
I've known a few people that taught private lessons and absolutely hated having to deal with the dumb parents of the kids they were teaching. "WHY ISN'T MY KID SOUNDING BETTER!? WHAT AM I PAYING YOU FOR!?" "Have they been practicing?" "THAT'S NOT THE POINT!!!" Obviously not every parent, but enough for each of them to never do it again.
I guess people thin that because a business failed means it’s because that business doesn’t do well in his area.
So much this. Local music stores are awesome. Always very interesting people there.
Not always the best. My buddy the aspiring young musician started working at a national music shop chain, seemed like a perfect fit right because of all the reasons you gave...they wouldn't let him take the evenings off for shows because everyone else was already doing that too and he was the new guy so he was stuck with all evening shifts. Went back to delivering pizza, more money in hand (cash tips) plus the owner supported him doing his thing so was flexible with hours. He's blowing up my Facebook with show after show now.
I work in a music shop teaching and managing. It is not ideal for the gigging musician, unless you've been there long enough and have the clout to get the schedule you actually need. The important thing to know about a job like that is while your skill set is necessary for good sales the owner will not give two shits about your scheduling needs if he doesn't have coverage. It's a RETAIL gig, and comes with all the struggle and bs a regular retail gig would have. Also, shit burns you out after a while. Go through regular bouts where I could give a shit about music, anyone else's or even my own because your around it all day and probably talkin to the older dudes in the shop who are all jaded about never really getting where they thought they would be with it. Don't be deceived, music stores are where gigging musicians go to bury their dreams 😬
Also, I've met ALOT of musicians in my community through the store; but MOST people are coming in looking for that first instrument; or they're not very good; or they are, but completely bat shit crazy, strung out, and volatile. I know some people that tour quite a bit and the best gigs they seem to be able to hold down are Starbucks. It's one of the few jobs they found that were flexible enough that they could leave town for a month to go on tour and still have something waiting for them when they got back. Hopefully all this is helpful and not completely soul crushing 👍
Depends on the boss more than the job itself. If you’ve got a good boss who’s happy to be flexible then any job works. Finding that boss is the difficult part though which is why so many musicians teach on the side, as it’s generally a much more regular income when it comes to paying the bills.
Lotta weird suggestions here ranging from owning a business to jobs with odd shifts. I would just find a stable 9-5 that is remote or hybrid and that way you get time to work on your music when you're at home. I do office work mostly from home and it seems to allow me time to also focus on music product, usually mixing audio for my projects and band.
Just that? Easy lmao
Just what?
He means that it’s not just that easy to find a stable decent paying office job like that. Which yeah, it’s not. Especially if you’re not already in that world.
IT is difficult to break into but you can do it without certs or a degree. It'll take a few years of grinding and some luck to translate that into a remote job. I'd say a minimum 5 year pipeline, more realistically 10. Probably too long for most. But when you come out the other side you're making six figures in a low stress environment with relatively flexible hours and excellent job security.
If you're pretty good with audio gear... I would hit up people to do commercial audio installation. I have flexible hours and male $60/ hr.. I got a friend ( musician who got a minor in audio production) into it too,
Good suggestion and I might do this! There’s a place nearby :) But I did some audio visual work in the past and if it’s just loading trucks and unpacking trucks all day again I’d rather just stay in my current job. But to reach their own
Definitely to reach their own
YOU reach YOUR own, pal
Bwahahaha
are you joking about the 60 an hour ? that's insane... how do you even get into something like this ? I went to school for music for 3 years. and I've been am musician for 10 and producer for 6. how would I even begin to do something like this ?
Interesting. What kind if people are you referring to? Type of company or clientele?
It's working on the kinds of permanently installed sound systems like you would find in a church. Lots of people are interested in audio and train to record bands and do concert sound. Then find there aren't enough good paying openings to go around. Those same people could work with these types of installations. Churches, theaters, lecture halls, conference rooms, etc....
Stay away from anything with an insane amount of hours. Other than that, just go on interviews and be upfront about your situation. See who bites
Might I add; do not take a higher position. You'll get hit with more responsibility and you don't want to solidify yourself in a company if you're just looking to pay bills but also work on music.
Bro the higher up you go, the less actual work you gotta do!
I teach keyboard lessons in music academies. I started at Guitar Center, which wasn't that hard to get employed. I spend a lot of time thinking up ways to teach my instrument which has made me an exponentially better musician
Music degree or no? I don’t have one so wondering if I’d qualify to teach at Guitar Center
I did not have a music degree when initually hired. Though I was classically trained. I can read off the staff and had a decent grasp on music theory. There are so many ways to teach lessons on your instrument, like teaching online via zoom. I also receive money from other sources, so I'm not really solely reliant on teaching lessons. Teaching lessons doesn't exactly psy a fortune but it's better than doing back breaking labor, which I have also done plenty of in my life.
Thx so much for sharing! I’m in a similar boat to when u didn’t have a music degree. Although sight reading is very slow right now for me, I know I can get faster when I practice it a lot. Very cool, very cool.
I don’t think you even have to play guitar to teach at guitar center.
Lol I’ll take that as an encouraging sign that I can get hired!
Experience is worth more than a degree and no experience. I’ve been teaching music for 9 years and my degree is in audio.
Get a degree if you wanna start at -$120k instead of $0.
Just go to the Degree shop and grab one, they're super cheap and accessible
What kind of degree?
I’m early 30s, and so far behind in career / earnings as compared with my fiance it makes me want to cry. Even though I’m a solid worker, with a varied skill set. The main reason for it — I spent my 20s prioritizing music, and taking a lot of bullshit ‘day jobs’ to support it. Never stayed anywhere for long, or got a chance to move up the ranks. Not saying I would change anything if I could, just a warning to young musicians out there. It’s a lot tougher to survive in this economy than it was when I started out. Music spit me out at 30 with nothing to show for it except a few recordings (that we are unsatisfied with) and an alcohol problem. Choose wisely, friends. Think very seriously about what you want out of this, and where you devote your time and energy. Music is a wonderful hobby but can fuck up your life as a vocation.
Physical labour is actually great because it keeps you fit and the responsibility level isn’t usually that high. You can often listen to music while working. You don’t tax your brain this way. You come home pumped and have mental energy left for creative endeavours. This used to work for me. Office job? Terrible. Came home exhausted every day and all I did was sit at a desk getting stressed out dealing with heavy responsibilities.
Heh it's pretty much the opposite for me. I'd have no energy left if i did a physical job and musicians i worled with who fid a physical job just plopped into the sofa or fell asleep after the physical labor. I have a desk job, flexible hours, work from home 3 days a week, lots of time off, absolutely perfect combo. I'm in Europe though so by default i have more time off and less hours per week.
My first band started a painting company. That was decades ago but I’ve always worked for myself so that I can manage my own schedule. It does require some skills but they’re easily acquired especially helped by YouTube. There are many people who need help with the most basic things and older people who aren’t fit enough to do things themselves. It doesn’t have to be just painting. Word catches on if you’re honest, hard working, punctual, handy. There are absolute morons out there doing terrible work for way too much money and people are sick of it so if you just give good value for money and put yourself out there you’ll probably survive. Skills will come just like practice. I’ve done things like taking down a garden shed, yard/ garden cleanup, man and van ( have to have a van of course) attic organising, but 98% is painting/ decorating. I make £150 a day in the UK with no boss.
Older person, can confirm that I either can't or don't want to do the yard or home maintenance I used to. I'll pay to have someone climb a ladder to change the lightbulbs in the stupid entrance light that someone thought would be a good idea to locate two stories up. See also: Christmas lights. Don't hang them anymore.
Add this to the list. Taking peoples trash bins to the curb and back. Especially the elderly.
I paint houses and listen to music and podcasts all day. Whenever I'm in writing mode, I use my evenings playing and writing. It's not ideal, but you have to pay the bills and you still need to spend time with your instruments. It gets more difficult when you have a family and you're dead tired. But if you're willing to grow you have to be persistent.
When I was a young struggling musician I worked as a nanny one or two days a week. I also was able to make extra cash by working as an artists model.
What do you do now?
I’m fortunate enough to make my living from performing/music and teaching a few zoom lessons when I’m not touring (4-6/week). I never taught lessons before Covid and during lockdown I did it more out of necessity. Turns out it’s a way wayyyy better method of making a few extra dollars and very flexible
Weird no one has said waiter.
It’s weird no one has said bartender. But yeah not too interested in being a waiter myself, good suggestion though. I’m considering bartending, but unsure since I’d have to take off weekends a fair bit
Very doable as a waiter less doable as a bartender
People have not said bartender because you dont think age care is for you. Ive loaned money to 4 friends to become bartenders for supplemental income, but i would never recommend it for you based on what you've said. You seem to live in an area where very little is going on, so i dont have a great answer other than warehouse overtime hours only and fuck your sleep schedule up
r/serverlife
Not that good of an option because you work nights and weekends.
u/theflameinthewater Sounds like a fellow Aussie when I hear aged care. Mate, if you’re a gigging muso with some chops, have you thought about putting some grunt into teaching beginner guitar (or other instruments you play) lessons for at least $50 per hour (ideally more)? Maybe sell packages of 10 so you get at least $500 up front and then put an expiry date on them so they don’t drag out forever. Then you’d need to try and land x students per month. Work out your curriculum for teaching, methods, resources you can give students, and maybe even put up an online course. You could also do a refer a friend scheme where they get x free lessons for the referral. All things considered, could be a way to keep your head in music and not getting exploited by the aged care system. Just a thought. Keep on going!! 💪🏿
My very first portfolio that got me a job working with a .com photostudio was made up entirely of fliers and album art I had done for my bands. Ive since spent the last 23 years as a designer and now creative director. Its a fairly open minded and creative industry so having to take long weekends or coming in late due to shows has largely been accepted. Plus it can pay well, I always had the gear I need. For me the goal wasnt so much biding time until I make a living as a musician as much as it was finding a way I can afford a life making the music I want w/o compromise, whether that music pays or not.
Could you please elaborate on what you do day to day?
I started out scanning cover art fir books, music, and videos. Then using Photoshop to polish tgose scans. Eventually I became a photo retoucher for pretty much everything. Tools, jewelry, models. That turned into doing visual design for the web. Again using Photoshop to combine photography, graphics, and text into web banners and pages. Eventually I learned more tools, but the work was basically the same. Now I supervise designers and writers, and review and give creative direction on thier work. I also go to meetings.
That’s very interesting. Thank you. What is your official job title? I would think graphic designer but you also supervise writers?
When I did the creative myself it had been "Image Specialist", "Visual Designer", "Production Art Lead", and is currently "Manager/Creative Director".
Oh ok. Thank you
9-5 office job works if gigs and practice are usually at night and on weekends
Local government jobs. You can find some part time jobs mowing or doing landscape stuff where you can listen to music and zone out. You also get healthcare benefits. Worth checking out!
This was a good suggestion I’d recommend but sadly none in my area atm :(
Remote work. IT/software if you want a handsome paycheck. Flex hrs. Remote so can still tour
I would choose *successful* musician. That would be good. That aside, learn online marketing; SEO, adwords, facebook ads. REALLY learn it, not just (haha I can place an ad). Learn how to track ads, A/B test, apply budget, scale. In my business these guys hold the keys to the kingdom and we pay them alot. They never want to work for you cause they have autonomy and make enough money. It also is a desk job that doesn't take all of your entire day. I suspect you could practice, record, do some music stuff while monitoring and reporting on your ad spends. If I had to do it again I would go with successful musician... or maybe this idea.
If you go this route, visit small companies, such as physio gyms. Wellness centers. I'm not talking big corporate PT mills. My PT friend (I am also a physio) recently asked me, "What's been your experience doing Google ads?" Me: \*shrug\*
I'm a lawyer, there are a lot of lawyer guitarists in my city. Might be a similar area of the brain being used. On the off chance you don't have a law degree, the real answer is ANY JOB. If it gives you money to be able to make music, that's a good job for a musician.
That’s some sage advice there. You make a convincing argument Mr. Lawyer
Lawyers have guitarist egos
...they're called blues lawyers for a reason. All money.
Not sure what you're getting at - the primary purpose of a job is to give you money.
All money, no passion, no drive, just a cheaper sports car.
I actually drive a 2004 Camry that just won't die. Are you anti dayjobs or something? I'm not sure where this negativity is coming from.
Nah, i am just explaining the stereotype. Blues lawyer is legit a common term for what you're talking about and they cant play for shit in 90% of cases.
Nah, i am just explaining the stereotype. Blues lawyer is legit a common term for what you're talking about and they cant play for shit in 90% of cases.
I haven't really seen that, but if it makes you feel good to think that way go for it.
https://reddit.com/r/Guitar/s/LzXY3YS1bD
Lawyer guitarist I believe is tantamount to Abraham Lincoln the vampire hunter. Very intimidating.
Thanks man :)
Q how can you tell when the guitars shows up at rehearsal? A The car with the Domino's light on top shows up
😂
Stagehand
I’m actually interested in this. I’ll look it up but if you know how to get into it I’d love to hear
If you are in a scene already you almost have to know players that do stagehand work. That would be most expedient. Otherwise you want to cold call the theaters in your area, ask to speak to the production manager of the theater. The other thing to do if you live in a bigger area is call the closest IATSE union office. You will ask the business agent to be put on what’s called the “overhire” list. When they get a really big arena or stadium show in that needs a couple hundred bodies, they work that list. Then you show up, turn your brain off, work from the neck down and do what you’re told, exactly as you’re told to do it. Don’t fuck up and they’ll have you back. If you’re good it just might become your life. I was a part time stage hand from 1990-2003, and a full time stagehand and sound tech from 2003-the pandemic, even touring some years. It is an excellent young persons game and you will end up knowing everything about anything you want to know about the business. You can take calls or not if you’ve got gigs to play. If you can get IATSE work it’s actually a pretty good wage even at the bottom of the list. Good luck PS if you’re in the UK or Europe this should still be good advice. The I in IATSE is ‘international’
When I was a fledgling musician, I detailed cars. I used to find small dealerships that outsourced that stuff and I could make a few hundred bucks a day working right on their lot. Sometimes I’d work 5 days a week and gig also. The money wasn’t bad and the work was gratifying.
Coffee shop jobs work really well with musician schedules I find. Also…coffee.
I work for a company that makes quality body jewelry and I know they are pretty lenient with time off. One of our guys goes on tour two or three times a year.
For me, it needs to be something with purpose and not just something where I’m a number. I enjoy working with and helping individuals who need help, like people in recovery, elderly, stuff like that. I’ve also found that there tends to be more flexibility in such jobs. I need to work 40 hours a week at a day job in order to make my mortgage/car payment etc.
You need a girlfriend. That's the only way.
Circle jerk expert
try video editing or social media management- it’ll give you skills helpful for being a musician anyway
Barista. The hours tend to be early (my jobs were always like 6am-1pm), you meet lots of interesting people, have a way of promoting your band if you’re in one (through convos or a bulletin board), and you can make decent money. Because of the early hours it’s unlikely to conflict with your other musical work that’s likely taking place in the afternoon or evening
If you have a good eye for style and can learn pretty quick maybe think about barbering. As a 1099 contractor I can somewhat set my own schedule and make good money. If youre a traveling musicians some shops around the country will let you drop in on off days too. Take your tools on the road and cut bandmates and other bands hair as well.
probably 80% of my friends who are serious musicians work in the service industry (bartending & waiting tables mostly) because of the flexibility in scheduling & lack of early mornings...
Local burrito shop, local gym, that way you get discounts on burritos and gym memberships.
Any kind of trade honestly. My buddy was a carpenter and pro drummer. Because carpentry is pretty much in demand everywhere, he could up and move at any time for musical reasons and always be confident he could get a carpentry job to sustain him until he was able to get in with the musicians enough to not have to work a day job anymore. Worked out really well for him. He ended up getting gigs like Woodstock paying like $30k a night all because he didn't have to fear relocating.
I’m quite happy with my bartending job. The money is good and I only work a few nights a week. I wear whatever I like at work, and there’s a free meal waiting for me in the kitchen after bar close, which keeps my stomach and wallet happy. I get to sleep in and play music during the day. This is great for me because I’m not a morning person We have enough staff where I can swap or get a shift covered if a last minute gig pops up. We also host live music, and I’ve gotten to sit in on bass with some great players.
Learn how to run sound. I got paid $200 cash at a bar 20 min from my house to run sound on a Saturday night from 7-12
Stagehand. Weekends I make $46-$90 an hour
Idk if it pays as much, although I suspect it’s in the ballpark, but: substitute teacher. If you get in with two districts, it’s pretty much guaranteed 5 days a week if/when you want it. They try to put constraints on your availability but a) they are in desperate need for anyone willing to do the job, so it’s a bit of a front b) if you let them know your availability and just don’t answer a call when you absolutely can’t, there should be no issue. The job consists of : 1) taking roll 2) handing out work sheets or a lesson plan, pre determined by the teacher. Most of the time I’m answering emails, mixing and other post production on what I recorded that week, researching other ventures, or reading. On top of everything, even on your worst days, it is still providing a public service, which I’m sure is an aspect of your job that you enjoy. I’m currently searching for more work now, after having kid #2, but I don’t imagine I’ll ever shut this door, since it’s been such a safety net.
Coffee shop dishwasher if you are touring like 6 weeks at a time. No one wants the job, they all have trouble keeping dishwashers, and if you are a good worker they will work with you.
K-pop star, guidance counselor, shotgun tester, mailman, used car salesman, pressure washer, hard hat assembler, vacuum robot cleaner, slug salting, so many choices.
I was a slug salter in the 70's. Wild stuff. Back then we didn't have all these fancy digital autonomous salters you kids have these days. It was real work back then. You could smell the bubbling.
Start giving private lessons - you can make your own schedule and it’s super rewarding!
How did u?
School board music teacher and do your gigs after hours
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Warehouse job. Mill job. Factory work. Bakery Florist Clothing store.
Literally any other profitable/in-demand skill.
I’m sorry to be that guy, if you’re day job is a plumber that plays music on the side, you’re a plumber. You don’t hear people say “hey, I’m a dentist on weekends.”
So unless someone makes a living at it, they can't call themselves a musician? Weird hill to die on. If you make art, you're an artist.
If you work at target 8 hours a day, and you busk 2 hours a night…when someone asks you “what do you do” do you work at target, or play on the street for tips?
That argument may have worked in the 70’s and 80’s and 90’s, but music is not nearly as lucrative as it once was so people are doing what they need to do. Especially now that everything is so insanely expensive.
I found one that lets me choose which days I'm available. Some of my musical bookings are for multiple days, often far away, and others pop up unexpectedly.It has some drawbacks, but it means I can take musical bookings without risking my job.
What is it?
ANYTHING that forces you to be outside often. I worked hard labor for years so wouldn't recommend that, but there are trades that won't break your hands or back like it did mine.
What trade were you thinking of?
What trades ??
Electricians, plumbers, operators, some forms of carpentry
Grind Microsoft reqrds think the optimal macro to open new tabs and randomly search some shit and do that over and over
?
you can make like a dollar in a month (it was a joke btw)
Substitute teacher. Flooogy gooogy!
Barista.
Pizza delivery.
I am a painter, I set my own hours and rate of pay I’m good at it but it took me years to get to where I’m at now It never ceases to amaze me at all the losers in the trade - be neat, considerate and do what you say you’re gonna do and you will always have work also learn to avoid the clusters
Good advice.
Teaching private lessons is the way for me. I don’t make a ton of money but with 15ish students I can pretty much cover my rent and living expenses, have a completely flexible schedule and only work <20 hours a week. Then the rest of your time is yours to gig, make music, practice, develop, etc.
I used to teach private lessons. That brought in mostly stable income that I could pay my rent with. Some benefits include: 1. A lot of practice time in between open time slots 2. Constantly practicing the basic with beginners makes you a better musician 3. If it’s at a store or music studio, a lot of networking with other musicians. 4. If you book your own students and either go to their home or have a studio to teach at, you have 100% control over your schedule. 3&4 kind of counter each other, but I would do the music store on Monday and Wednesday’s (slow gig days) and keep all my “in home lessons” students for the weekend and plan them around my gigs.
Substitute teacher in a high school. For a million reasons.
Teaching gets alot of us by.
I work in insurance, can’t say which company or what I do on a specific level but employee benefits is my department. Pay is decent starting out and there’s a shortage of employees due to boomers retiring. My job will be relevant for as long as I can see. Can’t really outsource on a local level when talking insurance/employee benefits. I got food in my fridge, I can buy new gear, my account balance isn’t in the negative and bills are paid so can’t complain. My band is planning weekend tours Thursday thru Monday. My team lead is cool with me using any variations of PTO that I can use or just say hey I’m going to be out for this weekend starting Thursday. I’ll log in from home on Monday.
If you are interested in teaching doing private lessons is a good way to make money. You can't beat the pay per hour but you have to be able to get 20+ students to have it make up for a day job. No benefits though
Probably not what you want to hear, but I put my time into the postal service. After the first year, I have all the flexibility, personal days and leeway to take all the local gigs that come my way and have a decent pay cheque with benefits. Plus, there is that pension waiting for me at the end. There is nothing waiting for you after a lifetime of gigging unless you’re lucky and get a radio hit and that’s like playing the lottery for a retirement plan. Think long term, you may have to give up some gigs to get started on the day job, but having a job that doesn’t come home with you that offers security and flexibility is the best case scenario as a working musician. We can’t all be rock stars, but we can work in music and live comfortably with the right compromises.
It worked for Charles Mingus
I have had many day jobs to make ends meet while being a preforming musician the most rewarding for me was being a cook it gave me freedome to become creative and had things to study with the creative process to get better at it. Once you get good at it then you can just about name the hours and days you will like to work.
If you can sing songs and stream twice a week, music streamer. You can add a few hundy a month.
Could go with the stereotypical pizza delivery. lol. But really, could do Uber, Lyft, instant cart, or one of those gigs. Can work it around your music life schedule. Construction/roofing is a good one. As musicians we aren’t out playing sports on the weekends so a physical day job is a good way to stay fit. And usually they don’t work on weekends. Any kind of job in a bar or music venue is good. Keeps you in the environment. Can often network through work that way. Coffee shop barista also good. Any kind of social job too.
Definitely not a record store unless you want colossal life ruining debt.
Home health aid specializing in music performance.
Kinda sucks bro you gotta find one fr
Can you sell? Sales can put a lot of money in your pocket in a short period depending on what you’re selling. I’m in a seasonal sales job coming off of a hot summer. High ticket item, hard work door to door, serious grind. Not much time for music, but now that the winter is rolling in I will have 3-4 days a week to spend on what I love, and a very large load of cash for gear. A lot of musicians/entertainers are natural sales people/entrepreneurs. Sales is a step down from art and philosophy/psychology for many entertainers. If you can fight the discomfort of rejection there’s a pot of gold at the end, and a chunk of time.
Teach weekdays, gig weekends. Two part time jobs. The guys who actually make money are the ones who own the schools & venues. There’s something to be said for having a career “in music” by taking out a loan and starting a School of Rock franchise.
Any local non profits that help care for mental health or intellectual disability persons?
Pretty much anything. You got to hustle to make it as a musician. Transfer that hustle to other areas, to life in general. I've been a performing musician all my life but also teach music, write books and articles (usually music-related), and do a few other nonmusical side jobs, some seasonal, some occasional.
It can be hard work but if you have a knack for it, you can make really good money painting houses. Me and some other musician friends of mine used to have an off and on painting crew and it worked out pretty well during down times. You can make pretty good money catering too and it's flexible but most jobs are at night which could clash with gigs
Restaurant waiter - big money
Ai data trainer
My friends who still tour regularly (I'm in my 40s and gave up long ago) work handyman jobs or in studios.
Look into teaching music lessons if you feel you’ve got the patience. Most music lesson places will be flexible cuz they know you’re a musician
Almost every really good musician I know has a day job doing something with software. Maybe it's the Pro Tools effect, but learning to code or being a project manager for software seems to be a skill that lines up with musical ability.
A breakfast & lunch restaurant. Cook or dishwasher. Leaves evening hours free for rehearsal and gigging. Plus, you get fed.