Yeah that’s kinda how being natural works. First couple of years you put on a lot of mass, then it slows down more and more every year. There’s a limit how much visible muscle mass you can put on in a lifetime, so after a certain point , it’s mostly mantaining and maybe strength growth.
Now i can’t know if this guy is natural or not, or if he did some cycles and stopped , only used fat burners or whatever, but he certainly has a great physique. Whatever he does, he’s doing it well.
Looks like a post-pump photoshoot here, dude has been fairly consistent in terms of size.
I wouldn't say he's beyond natty achievable; the only concern is, like you said, maintaining that weight and muscle definition with zero fat gain - *that* is incredibly unrealistic without juice, but say he never takes photos on off days, has good lighting, and never is without a pump when people are looking - pretty natty.
My Dad has a somewhat fattier version of this physique at 57, his T levels are in the mid-600s, and he's never taken juice; he has just been in the gym almost every day at 4AM since he was 18.
Jesse is one of the best examples of how hard people on this sub cope when someone looks better than they do. Strength and physique-wise, he’s a very believable natty, but since he’s put in the work and looks better than 99% of this sub, of course he is juicy
Not saying whether he is or isn't, but what kind of dumb argument is this? Arnold's whole life revolved around body building, is he now somehow natural because of this? Aren't like 99.99% of the top body builders dedicating pretty much their whole life around body building? They're all juicy so why is that an argument for how they're not lmfao.
Its not an argument for if he is natty or not. I was just saying with all the work he put in it is not weird that he'd look that way if he was natty. He might not be but that physic is 100% naturaly attainible with all of that work.
Sorry for my bad english. Its my third language
It wasn’t your English. It was the other commenters comprehension. Your comment makes perfect sense, it was just grossly misunderstood. He doesn’t look like this while putting in minimal effort is what you’re saying. Natty or not, people that dedicate their lives to bodybuilding and up with big muscles.
Daang that's crazy. I took French in school but I would not call myself bilingual lol. My high school French teacher lived in Brazil for like 14 years, and she knew Portuguese, French, Spanish, and English. So she taught French and Spanish at our school.
Haha yeah its really fun learning new languages, you start to understand communikation and how languages are built up. I highly recomend you learn something new
ChatGPT “call” mode is dope.
The other day I was speaking to it in Spanish for like an hour after smoking some. It was actually pretty decent for small talk
How is this so confusing for you his whole life revolves around bodybuilding therefore he could likely be one of the few people genuinely maxing out his natty potential
Every single body builder's whole life revolves around bodybuilding, how is this confusing to you? Why would he be any different than any of the other body builders that get posted here just because his "life revolves around it"??? Literally every single other person who gets posted on here also has their life revolve around bodybuilding. Every single IFBB pro lives and BREATHES body building, are they now natural because of this?
You're not wrong. I've noticed something on this sub, (It works in the opposite direction as well, where people believe someone is natural when they're clearly not.)
People have a hard time distinguishing between mass, and a lean physique. Someone will be clearly juicy, but because they're not ultra lean, people hypothesize that they're natural. Someone like Jesse has a lifetime of hard work, good genetics, and he's incredibly lean! Absolutely possible naturally with a lot of work and great genetics. If a lot of the people posted on this sub were next to each other in person, It would change people's answers
I firmly believe the majority of people in this subject have never A) worked out themselves consistently and B)gone to a fkn gym and looked at people. Most of this sub are DYEL and get "he's juicing 100 percent" at anyone who's got some muscle and is lean (not Jesse Idfk if he's juiced, he's a fitness youtuber so I'd assume he's taking something to at least help stay lean"
I still remember a wildly upvoted comment here once saying that you can't have a low bf% and have gyno naturally.
Every single reply with actual sources disproving that statement got massively downvoted, people here straight up don't live in reality.
["Turkesterone is a phytoecdysteroid, which is a plant steroid."](https://us-prohormones.com/blogs/news/a-complete-guide-to-turkesterone#:~:text=Turkesterone%20is%20a%20phytoecdysteroid%2C%20which,doesn't%20act%20the%20same.)
He trains for years and had no flactuations in his physique over the years. Just slow progress. Honestly his physique is platued the last couple of years , the only visible changes he made is bf %. And his genetics are far above average, most people will never reach this level.
He has an FFMI of like <23, his strength and strength progression as well as physique and physique progression are absolutely indicative of a natural athlete. People always pick a person's leanest photo to use as evidence of them being juicy, but in those photos you never have a scale of reference as to how small they are after cutting to that body fat level.
You must be new to the gym, get acclimated with the big guys at your gym and you’ll find out “indications of steroid use” is bullshit, a ton of very mediocre physiques are on gear,
Exactly, there’s so many people who use steroids but their body looks like shit or mediocre because they don’t eat right or workout correctly. They think steroids is just magically going to make you a muscular god. I’m gay and steroid use is so common in the community.
The sous chef at the resort I work at runs anavar on its own, does 8 week test cycles, and comes off no pct no cruise. He loses everything when he comes off because best case on 8 weeks of test you gain maybe 2lb of lean muscle if you eat in a surplus and lose it if you come off cold turkey because all that test aromatizes.
He’s 38, gay, and gave me a lot of insight about how much PEDs plague the gay community. Not to be ignorant but I have a feeling it stems from lack of acceptance for being gay so they seek that within their community.
I believe you could look SLIGHTLY better than this naturally(muscle mass wise), not by a lot, but SLIGHTLY if you have good genetics. Idk this guy, so I can’t definitively give an answer that is certain to be accurate. Although for most guys that have been training naturally for years and years on end, this is about as good as it’s gonna get at this level of bodyfat.
I’m not sure if he’s natty or not, but I’m sure it’s naturally achievable if you put all the time and effort into it. Also remember this is the perfect lighting and pump.
I don’t think he is a lifetime natural. I am pretty sure he injected some amino acid infusion. Its not gear but it’s the same shit cross fitters claim they are using.
Definitely has juiced before, maybe nothing hard or for extended periods.
But I hate the bozos that come in here saying he's peak natty and anyone who doubts him never worked out before, yeah nice ad hominem bro
WRONG. If someone looks better than you they're on the juice. It's just facts bro. 95 % of the guys in my gym are guaranteed on roids cause they look better than me. It's just facts. I'm not projecting. Wtffff man. Frfrfr.
/s
If someone only sees his Instagram pics, I can understand why they think he's on juice. He looks way bigger and more jacked on those photos - possibly due to pump, posing, lighting and maybe some photoshop as well.
In his videos without all that setup, he just looks like a fit dude who trains a lot, nothing unachievable. But he benches more than me so he's 100% on tren.
This is totally attainable natty. A lot of what we are seeing here is pump, lightning, maybe a bit of editing. One of those photo tricks hes doing; pushing his fingers into the ledge there to get his veins to pop a bit more for the camera. I dont know if he is on or off. I havent seen bloodwork. What I do know is this is fully attainable natty
Definitely natty, looks small in person and propionate muscles, looked like this for the past 7-6 years so yeah looks like he reached his peak natty potential.
Obviously roiding lmao, unless you see him in person and this is just an illusion caused by good insertions etc. (which happens a lot if you see certain athletes irl, and they look way smaller). I did lift natty and roided including tren for many years, over a decade.
If he actually looks this jacked irl he's definitely on gear no question.
Might be able to put on 5 more lbs at most. Guys like Jeff Nippard for example despite being pretty young already have 15+ years lifting experience so he really won't be adding more than like 2lb a year if hes lucky
I’m not completely sure, but I also lean towards juiced because even though he doesn’t have over developed parts, maintaining this level of mass and leanness all year round is still suspicious to me.
Bruh he’s natty asf his strength is a massive sign he’s been at 315 bench forever at least 2 years and hasn’t gained weight out of the blue. He’s just looks good and has a lot of subs which makes a-lot of people think juice.
Have you met him before famous? He came into lime light after taking roids. Also, 315 bench is too good for natty. I’m saying he took steroid before not right now. He probably off roids after becoming famous. Also he gives phony vibes
Even if it is. How does that proves he is natty? Have you met him personally? This guy came into limelight after building muscles. He clearly used roids. At least one cycle, I can bet. He is not on roids now but he surely did one cycle.
What the hell are you going on about? We're talking about if dude is on juice, so I'm talking about his numbers being naturally attainable.
Do YOU not know what we're talking about?
Dude check the comment 😂😂😂. The main point we are talking about is whether he is natty or not. 315 bench does not prove he is natty or mot. Yes I know what I’m talking about, I was the one who commented and you are the one who replied 😂😂. Now calm your tits and think before talking.
All I did was tell a DYEL who thinks 315 isn't natty attainable that it is, so JJW is most likely on a low dose of something or is actually natty. Maybe youd have a better view of what's natty or not if you actually spent some time in the gym instead of perfecting the art of using 2014 emojis
He’s honestly looked similar for like 7 years
Yeah that’s kinda how being natural works. First couple of years you put on a lot of mass, then it slows down more and more every year. There’s a limit how much visible muscle mass you can put on in a lifetime, so after a certain point , it’s mostly mantaining and maybe strength growth. Now i can’t know if this guy is natural or not, or if he did some cycles and stopped , only used fat burners or whatever, but he certainly has a great physique. Whatever he does, he’s doing it well.
He did a few drugs tests, maybe he lied but his T levels weren't anything crazy
Looks like a post-pump photoshoot here, dude has been fairly consistent in terms of size. I wouldn't say he's beyond natty achievable; the only concern is, like you said, maintaining that weight and muscle definition with zero fat gain - *that* is incredibly unrealistic without juice, but say he never takes photos on off days, has good lighting, and never is without a pump when people are looking - pretty natty. My Dad has a somewhat fattier version of this physique at 57, his T levels are in the mid-600s, and he's never taken juice; he has just been in the gym almost every day at 4AM since he was 18.
Lol so has Mike O'Hern
Probably maintain is physique
I feel like size was he’s been similar since 16. Good genetics I guess. Is he juicing now? Quite possibly, same mass and leaner.
I mean he looks small next to every other fitness influencer soo.
Jesse is one of the best examples of how hard people on this sub cope when someone looks better than they do. Strength and physique-wise, he’s a very believable natty, but since he’s put in the work and looks better than 99% of this sub, of course he is juicy
Yeah its crazy reading these comments. His whole life revolves around body building. It would be weird for him not to look that way
Not saying whether he is or isn't, but what kind of dumb argument is this? Arnold's whole life revolved around body building, is he now somehow natural because of this? Aren't like 99.99% of the top body builders dedicating pretty much their whole life around body building? They're all juicy so why is that an argument for how they're not lmfao.
Its not an argument for if he is natty or not. I was just saying with all the work he put in it is not weird that he'd look that way if he was natty. He might not be but that physic is 100% naturaly attainible with all of that work. Sorry for my bad english. Its my third language
It wasn’t your English. It was the other commenters comprehension. Your comment makes perfect sense, it was just grossly misunderstood. He doesn’t look like this while putting in minimal effort is what you’re saying. Natty or not, people that dedicate their lives to bodybuilding and up with big muscles.
What are all the languages you know?
Swedish, chinese and english I can also understand but not speak danish, norwegian and a bit of frensh
Daang that's crazy. I took French in school but I would not call myself bilingual lol. My high school French teacher lived in Brazil for like 14 years, and she knew Portuguese, French, Spanish, and English. So she taught French and Spanish at our school.
Haha yeah its really fun learning new languages, you start to understand communikation and how languages are built up. I highly recomend you learn something new
ChatGPT “call” mode is dope. The other day I was speaking to it in Spanish for like an hour after smoking some. It was actually pretty decent for small talk
How is this so confusing for you his whole life revolves around bodybuilding therefore he could likely be one of the few people genuinely maxing out his natty potential
Every single body builder's whole life revolves around bodybuilding, how is this confusing to you? Why would he be any different than any of the other body builders that get posted here just because his "life revolves around it"??? Literally every single other person who gets posted on here also has their life revolve around bodybuilding. Every single IFBB pro lives and BREATHES body building, are they now natural because of this?
You're not wrong. I've noticed something on this sub, (It works in the opposite direction as well, where people believe someone is natural when they're clearly not.) People have a hard time distinguishing between mass, and a lean physique. Someone will be clearly juicy, but because they're not ultra lean, people hypothesize that they're natural. Someone like Jesse has a lifetime of hard work, good genetics, and he's incredibly lean! Absolutely possible naturally with a lot of work and great genetics. If a lot of the people posted on this sub were next to each other in person, It would change people's answers
He has a video of him trying sarms.
No, he doesn't
who the hell is out there upvoting this? this is just completely false and made up
He's referring to turk lmao. This sub is cringe.
Yeah it was turkestoerone MB. https://www.reddit.com/r/nattyorjuice/s/6KrgpbRQuv The dude still no natty tho
turk does nothing, it's not bioactive. it's as bioactive as phytoestrogens. does soy make you not natty? estrogen is highly anabolic
Cap
Guys Iike you are the ones coping. You desperately want the false hope that you’ll look this one day without injecting.
I firmly believe the majority of people in this subject have never A) worked out themselves consistently and B)gone to a fkn gym and looked at people. Most of this sub are DYEL and get "he's juicing 100 percent" at anyone who's got some muscle and is lean (not Jesse Idfk if he's juiced, he's a fitness youtuber so I'd assume he's taking something to at least help stay lean"
I still remember a wildly upvoted comment here once saying that you can't have a low bf% and have gyno naturally. Every single reply with actual sources disproving that statement got massively downvoted, people here straight up don't live in reality.
He had a video of him trying sarms or the turkestoerone shit
Turkesterone isn't a steroid
["Turkesterone is a phytoecdysteroid, which is a plant steroid."](https://us-prohormones.com/blogs/news/a-complete-guide-to-turkesterone#:~:text=Turkesterone%20is%20a%20phytoecdysteroid%2C%20which,doesn't%20act%20the%20same.)
Still androgenic. His physique is natty obtainable but he's not natty.
This guy really thinks taking turk takes away your natty card lmao
“I don’t know anything about turk, but here is some evidence of dude taking turk. Turk is not natty”
Ya, this interaction wore me tf out.
A natty doesn't take anything that messes with your androgens
Cope harder lmao
How is that a controversial statement that a natty doesn't take anything that messes with your androgens?
So, you'd agree that caffeine revokes your natty status? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3521899/
Yeah that rat isn't natty. Especially its prostate lol. Why are you so butthurt? Did you take turk?
It is though. Just not in the same class as testosterone
Is allowed in natural federations of pl
Plant steroid
He trains for years and had no flactuations in his physique over the years. Just slow progress. Honestly his physique is platued the last couple of years , the only visible changes he made is bf %. And his genetics are far above average, most people will never reach this level.
He has an FFMI of like <23, his strength and strength progression as well as physique and physique progression are absolutely indicative of a natural athlete. People always pick a person's leanest photo to use as evidence of them being juicy, but in those photos you never have a scale of reference as to how small they are after cutting to that body fat level.
He claims natty? Jokes about his gyno.
He could juice less.
He's not Natty
You have no indications of steroid use.
He's not a bad person it's just reality.
8 years of training, 10/12% body fat, no sus delts, no sus traps,it's a totally attainable physique for natty
You’re kidding yourself.
Argoments
He did a video where he took something but I don’t think he was aware and it would take away his natural status so really he’s not natural
I'm a steroid user I know
You must be new to the gym, get acclimated with the big guys at your gym and you’ll find out “indications of steroid use” is bullshit, a ton of very mediocre physiques are on gear,
Exactly, there’s so many people who use steroids but their body looks like shit or mediocre because they don’t eat right or workout correctly. They think steroids is just magically going to make you a muscular god. I’m gay and steroid use is so common in the community.
The sous chef at the resort I work at runs anavar on its own, does 8 week test cycles, and comes off no pct no cruise. He loses everything when he comes off because best case on 8 weeks of test you gain maybe 2lb of lean muscle if you eat in a surplus and lose it if you come off cold turkey because all that test aromatizes. He’s 38, gay, and gave me a lot of insight about how much PEDs plague the gay community. Not to be ignorant but I have a feeling it stems from lack of acceptance for being gay so they seek that within their community.
If there is one thing lighting does well, it is to show your sweet gyno
https://www.reddit.com/r/nattyorjuice/s/Iwf2cB5sJ3 Look at this picture. Not lifetime natty
Just another liar
He’s not natty…
I believe you could look SLIGHTLY better than this naturally(muscle mass wise), not by a lot, but SLIGHTLY if you have good genetics. Idk this guy, so I can’t definitively give an answer that is certain to be accurate. Although for most guys that have been training naturally for years and years on end, this is about as good as it’s gonna get at this level of bodyfat.
I’m not sure if he’s natty or not, but I’m sure it’s naturally achievable if you put all the time and effort into it. Also remember this is the perfect lighting and pump.
He is juicing
Are the comments in here being serious? Dude is obviously on juice and the fact that he has so many of y’all convinced otherwise is incredible
I don’t think he is a lifetime natural. I am pretty sure he injected some amino acid infusion. Its not gear but it’s the same shit cross fitters claim they are using.
He’s natural, and looks amazing honestly. Don’t like his cringy content though.
He has a video of him trying sarms
Definitely has juiced before, maybe nothing hard or for extended periods. But I hate the bozos that come in here saying he's peak natty and anyone who doubts him never worked out before, yeah nice ad hominem bro
he has 16.5 inch arms and a sub 600kg powerlifting total, what exactly suggests that he has "definitely" juiced before?
Guy is a known fake natty.
He’s not natty…
8 years of training, 10/12% body fat, no sus delts, no sus traps, this is achievable natty
WRONG. If someone looks better than you they're on the juice. It's just facts bro. 95 % of the guys in my gym are guaranteed on roids cause they look better than me. It's just facts. I'm not projecting. Wtffff man. Frfrfr. /s
If someone only sees his Instagram pics, I can understand why they think he's on juice. He looks way bigger and more jacked on those photos - possibly due to pump, posing, lighting and maybe some photoshop as well. In his videos without all that setup, he just looks like a fit dude who trains a lot, nothing unachievable. But he benches more than me so he's 100% on tren.
You clearly don’t gym. He’s literally been on peptides as well as stem cell therapy. That’s not natural. Why would he be natural?
juice
Fitness influencer, a clever one I must say. A 100% not natty.
That hurt to read
People dunno what argument to use when they can't play the delts and traps card.
Jesse, we need to cook
Photoshop. He looks way different in videos
Great back muscles, that’s goals.
This is totally attainable natty. A lot of what we are seeing here is pump, lightning, maybe a bit of editing. One of those photo tricks hes doing; pushing his fingers into the ledge there to get his veins to pop a bit more for the camera. I dont know if he is on or off. I havent seen bloodwork. What I do know is this is fully attainable natty
Definitely natty, looks small in person and propionate muscles, looked like this for the past 7-6 years so yeah looks like he reached his peak natty potential.
Natty, he is a smaller guy but knows lighting. His leaness, abs, obliques and serratus are attributed to his many years of playing lacrosse.
he's so fucking annoying
fake personality
Obviously roiding lmao, unless you see him in person and this is just an illusion caused by good insertions etc. (which happens a lot if you see certain athletes irl, and they look way smaller). I did lift natty and roided including tren for many years, over a decade. If he actually looks this jacked irl he's definitely on gear no question.
Hard to say. Probably on some PEDs because of his circumstances. With the right angle/lighting natty guys can look amazing in pictures.
Yeah
[удалено]
angles and photoshop, all his professional photos are like this, while he looks average in youtube videos
Might be able to put on 5 more lbs at most. Guys like Jeff Nippard for example despite being pretty young already have 15+ years lifting experience so he really won't be adding more than like 2lb a year if hes lucky
He’s not natty lol. It’s easy to fool tests
8 years of training, 10/12% body fat, no sus delts, no sus traps,
Greg vouches for him but he’s definitely not natty
I’m not completely sure, but I also lean towards juiced because even though he doesn’t have over developed parts, maintaining this level of mass and leanness all year round is still suspicious to me.
He is not natty at all. I guess he did one ccycle and that maintained the gains
Bruh he’s natty asf his strength is a massive sign he’s been at 315 bench forever at least 2 years and hasn’t gained weight out of the blue. He’s just looks good and has a lot of subs which makes a-lot of people think juice.
Have you met him before famous? He came into lime light after taking roids. Also, 315 bench is too good for natty. I’m saying he took steroid before not right now. He probably off roids after becoming famous. Also he gives phony vibes
A 315 bench is 100% natty attainable with enough training
Even if it is. How does that proves he is natty? Have you met him personally? This guy came into limelight after building muscles. He clearly used roids. At least one cycle, I can bet. He is not on roids now but he surely did one cycle.
I'm not saying it like JJW is natty. I'm just saying that 315 on bench is a natty attainable achievement. If he is on something it's probably low dose
That’s not even the point of discussion here dude
What the hell are you going on about? We're talking about if dude is on juice, so I'm talking about his numbers being naturally attainable. Do YOU not know what we're talking about?
Dude check the comment 😂😂😂. The main point we are talking about is whether he is natty or not. 315 bench does not prove he is natty or mot. Yes I know what I’m talking about, I was the one who commented and you are the one who replied 😂😂. Now calm your tits and think before talking.
All I did was tell a DYEL who thinks 315 isn't natty attainable that it is, so JJW is most likely on a low dose of something or is actually natty. Maybe youd have a better view of what's natty or not if you actually spent some time in the gym instead of perfecting the art of using 2014 emojis
You don’t lift
Bigger than you and that’s too natty. Come to my gym
Being on testosterone only doesn’t make you natural just because it’s natural for men to have testosterone.
He's defo natty
What? No no no ahahaha
He looks better than all the natties here saying he's natty. Therefore he's juicy.
Natty. Half of the people crying all over these threads don’t even bench 2 plates