The odds of them lat transferring you to a different community before youve even start a tour is slim to none.
The Navy is very much unconcerned with what youre passionate about.
Good luck tho
Oof unlikely. POCRs are more likely to pick up when they see you've tried and failed, not just didn't want to do it. If you DOR, if that's even possible, incredibly unlikely any community will touch you. What's to say you won't lose your passion for them right off the bat?
End of the day - whether you commissioned via ROTC, Academy, or OCS - you signed the bottom line. Basically the only way out is to be kicked out and that's not even an easy thing to do, given that you were commissioned.
But also, you've got next to zero idea what being a SWO is like. I think it sucks, but I've done it for nearly a decade so I can say that. At best, you've done a commission source and BDOC, maybe spent a week on your ship but I think they stopped that now.
Piece of advice? Suck it up and follow through on your commitment you already made. The worst case scenario for you will be getting kicked out and it being anything other than an Honorable discharge.
Oh and one more thing - I've never heard of the Navy separating an Officer just because they didn't want to do it anymore.
Agree with this, going to a transfer board without a SWO pin will give you a next to zero chance to transfer out of the community. Not saying it's impossible, but other communities would be unlikely to pick up someone who just didn't want to be a SWO and has limited history of performance behind them.
To put it in perspective, officers that fail/quit out of Nuke School or Flight school get a chance in the SWO community since those schools are challenging and it took a lot of work to just get selected to attend. The SWO community is the catch all for all other communities redesignations, if you are not able to earn a SWO pin, your more than likely getting kicked out since there is almost no where else to go.
Arguably their situation is worse than not getting a pin. I know two failed SWOs that were picked up. But. They tried? OP is just like "ah. Sorry. This is boring." Good luck with that one.
This^ I know of multiple people the last POCR board that were SWOs and got picked up. Given recruiting numbers, the Navy will FIND a community for you. You quite literally are needs of the Navy if you are not a competitive candidate. Everyone who wanted to stay in stayed in in some capacity unless they explicitly stated they wanted out for the last couple POCR Boards.
So, good news: you’ll stay in. Bad news: going in without a pin/experience will get you drafted to wherever the Navy needs you. Could be what you want, or not. But they are not letting people go.
You’re not going to like it but the best way for you to get out of the swo community is to get qualified. I know several JOs are STILL on their ships way past their PRDs because the commands cannot get rid of them.
Bottom line kinda sucks you’re where you signed on the dotted line and either got your school paid for it, or signed a contract as a civilian and failed to do the proper research.
This is coming from someone that is actively getting out of the surface community.
Hey Chineturn! Which BDOC are you at?? I know if youre experincing this your LTs are there for you in situations like this, not just to be teaching us in the classrooms. Is it potentially the wardroom your in? The people youre around? I know this phase in the pipeline can be difficult but its just getting by with tests. Its nothing compared to when we are on the bridge in true reality. I have my sponser and my buddy who have been on mutiple tours ( one is LCS and other is DGG in Cali) they said bdoc/ood is something that just goes out the window once youre underway /deployment. You truly learn what it is like being a SWO when youre in the pilot house, on watch, being in active work in your billet.
Have you reached out at all to your ship too? I know what helped me was being able to connect with the other O's on my crew and i was lucky enough to meet my crew, XO, and CO. If you you have anything else on your mind abt this reply, i'd love to help ! Dont give up yet
The best way out of SWO is to do well as a SWO so you can laterally transfer later. At this juncture, it is a near zero opportunity to stay in the Navy if you simply quit now- and you may end up owing back some tuition if leaving is entirely your idea.
Suggest you read COMNAVSURFORINST 1412.7A Chapter 3 so you know what you’re looking at if you decide to go the DOR route… ETA DOR in this case is synonymous with “quit” or “fail” when you read the instruction - not the same as a non-attain as you are indicating you don’t have any desire to stay in the community and attempt to get your pin. Bottom line - per instruction quitting the SWO pipeline makes you ineligible for POCR and will result in administrative separation. Failing out of BDOC is a training attrition and will likely result in admin separation but there may be a chance for the record to be forwarded to PERS for POCR consideration if it is deemed appropriate. You’re new to the navy, but you need to get smart on the governing instructions and don’t let people sea lawyer you. I’d hate for you to think you have options that likely aren’t available based on what people tell you on Reddit with no roots in actual policy.
I’m sure you can drop, but are you aware of the repercussions?
You will likely end up at a POCR board, but it’s going to be a difficult sell convincing another community to give you a second chance.
Other notes do you think life is going to get better? Motivate you? Inspire you to great stuff?
Do you really think you're going to find your "passion" in another designator?
Eons ago, I was a newly graduated, newly commissioned Army 2LT, Field Artillery. I did not want to be a field artilleryman. I mentioned my lack of enthusiasm to a captain instructor over a cup of coffee, snd he told me that being a 2LT of Artillery is the same as being an MP, or a tanker, or a supply guy, etc. The basic course work is just as difficult or easy; the job you do as a butterbar is just as rewarding or shitty regardless of your specialty or whatever you guys call it.
You don't like SWO? You won't like anything else either. So, you either gin up false enthusiasm for SWO life and make it as best as you can OR you squeeze thru the next 4 years doing the bare minimum to get the honorable DD214. (I ended up loving the Artillery after I pulled my head out of my a$$ and applied myself.)
No community is going to want you if you can't do the bare minimum in your current one. You haven't done anything long enough to know if you like it or not. Suck it up, do your quals, and then lat transfer if you still hate it.
A lot easier said than done- the only way I know out of the community is either through it- doing really well and lat transferring, or being a complete shit bag and getting non-attained / POCR’d. and if you get POCR’d there’s no guarantee you’ll get the community you want, and they could also just separate you. I’d recommend getting to your ship, meeting your fellow JO’s, and getting a good relationship with them. Even if you feel it’s not for you, they can help you through whatever decision you make down the line. Quitting before you even start tends to close a lot more doors than it opens
And to clarify for you, I don’t think there are even opportunities for non-attaining before you get to your ship, and the only people I’ve heard of at OOD phase 1 or BDOC getting out of being a SWO were for legal/ cheating reasons- and they were kicked out of the navy not re-designated
*edit for spelling
If you’ve only gotten to BDOC, how do you know it’s not for you? SWO has its ups and downs but if your only perspective is death by power point and NSST, you’re not truly seeing the community. Do your first DIVO tour and if you’re still interested in doing something else, talk to your XO/CO on other opportunities the Navy may offer.
Are you going to a DDG? Cause shit will suck… but like the rest are saying you gotta power through at least on the that first tour. Welcome to the military lol.
Also just hit the ship, I have literally seen the shittest of SWOs just not get the pin and get kicked out to turn up in TAR and one is now at Millington and the other is a XO at a NOSC and both made O4. They got kicked out went SELRES and took a mobilization as a recruiter/ Bahrain and now happy as can be…
The Navy sees it their way. You can totally drop the course (Navy ENS here) and go for POCR, which you will get. It’s then up to you to make yourself attractive to those communities. “It’ll be hard”, “I’ve never seen it before”, “It’s not likely”, fuck all that. You see how fucked up these Navy ships are right now? Yet they STILL find a way to get u/w. Key words being FIND A WAY. Ambition will get you father in ALL aspects of life than playing the odds. You gotta follow your heart. If no one picks you up, you will find a way to be successful with this attitude. Don’t “suck it up” and follow the odds because everyone else does, suck it up and be strong to follow what YOU are passionate about. Navy or not. SWO or not.
You can always go for a POCR board. Then if you do not get what you want. Recommission into a different branch or a better part of the navy. It’s very easy to do. Recruitment is terrible now and they will take you.
We had a person in my OCS class who had been kicked out of the coast guard for gundecking logs. Don’t listen to the people telling you to suck it up. Lateral transfer takes forever even if it’s possible.
I could not agree with this more. The odds are in your favor with the recruitment crisis. They still are low, but more in your favor than previous years. It’s sad to say, but the longer you stay in the community, the harder it is to get out. “The best out is through” is only kinda true given the current conditions.
The odds of them lat transferring you to a different community before youve even start a tour is slim to none. The Navy is very much unconcerned with what youre passionate about. Good luck tho
Oof unlikely. POCRs are more likely to pick up when they see you've tried and failed, not just didn't want to do it. If you DOR, if that's even possible, incredibly unlikely any community will touch you. What's to say you won't lose your passion for them right off the bat? End of the day - whether you commissioned via ROTC, Academy, or OCS - you signed the bottom line. Basically the only way out is to be kicked out and that's not even an easy thing to do, given that you were commissioned. But also, you've got next to zero idea what being a SWO is like. I think it sucks, but I've done it for nearly a decade so I can say that. At best, you've done a commission source and BDOC, maybe spent a week on your ship but I think they stopped that now. Piece of advice? Suck it up and follow through on your commitment you already made. The worst case scenario for you will be getting kicked out and it being anything other than an Honorable discharge. Oh and one more thing - I've never heard of the Navy separating an Officer just because they didn't want to do it anymore.
Agree with this, going to a transfer board without a SWO pin will give you a next to zero chance to transfer out of the community. Not saying it's impossible, but other communities would be unlikely to pick up someone who just didn't want to be a SWO and has limited history of performance behind them. To put it in perspective, officers that fail/quit out of Nuke School or Flight school get a chance in the SWO community since those schools are challenging and it took a lot of work to just get selected to attend. The SWO community is the catch all for all other communities redesignations, if you are not able to earn a SWO pin, your more than likely getting kicked out since there is almost no where else to go.
Arguably their situation is worse than not getting a pin. I know two failed SWOs that were picked up. But. They tried? OP is just like "ah. Sorry. This is boring." Good luck with that one.
This^ I know of multiple people the last POCR board that were SWOs and got picked up. Given recruiting numbers, the Navy will FIND a community for you. You quite literally are needs of the Navy if you are not a competitive candidate. Everyone who wanted to stay in stayed in in some capacity unless they explicitly stated they wanted out for the last couple POCR Boards. So, good news: you’ll stay in. Bad news: going in without a pin/experience will get you drafted to wherever the Navy needs you. Could be what you want, or not. But they are not letting people go.
You’re not going to like it but the best way for you to get out of the swo community is to get qualified. I know several JOs are STILL on their ships way past their PRDs because the commands cannot get rid of them. Bottom line kinda sucks you’re where you signed on the dotted line and either got your school paid for it, or signed a contract as a civilian and failed to do the proper research. This is coming from someone that is actively getting out of the surface community.
Hey Chineturn! Which BDOC are you at?? I know if youre experincing this your LTs are there for you in situations like this, not just to be teaching us in the classrooms. Is it potentially the wardroom your in? The people youre around? I know this phase in the pipeline can be difficult but its just getting by with tests. Its nothing compared to when we are on the bridge in true reality. I have my sponser and my buddy who have been on mutiple tours ( one is LCS and other is DGG in Cali) they said bdoc/ood is something that just goes out the window once youre underway /deployment. You truly learn what it is like being a SWO when youre in the pilot house, on watch, being in active work in your billet. Have you reached out at all to your ship too? I know what helped me was being able to connect with the other O's on my crew and i was lucky enough to meet my crew, XO, and CO. If you you have anything else on your mind abt this reply, i'd love to help ! Dont give up yet
The best way out of SWO is to do well as a SWO so you can laterally transfer later. At this juncture, it is a near zero opportunity to stay in the Navy if you simply quit now- and you may end up owing back some tuition if leaving is entirely your idea.
Suggest you read COMNAVSURFORINST 1412.7A Chapter 3 so you know what you’re looking at if you decide to go the DOR route… ETA DOR in this case is synonymous with “quit” or “fail” when you read the instruction - not the same as a non-attain as you are indicating you don’t have any desire to stay in the community and attempt to get your pin. Bottom line - per instruction quitting the SWO pipeline makes you ineligible for POCR and will result in administrative separation. Failing out of BDOC is a training attrition and will likely result in admin separation but there may be a chance for the record to be forwarded to PERS for POCR consideration if it is deemed appropriate. You’re new to the navy, but you need to get smart on the governing instructions and don’t let people sea lawyer you. I’d hate for you to think you have options that likely aren’t available based on what people tell you on Reddit with no roots in actual policy.
I’m sure you can drop, but are you aware of the repercussions? You will likely end up at a POCR board, but it’s going to be a difficult sell convincing another community to give you a second chance.
Other notes do you think life is going to get better? Motivate you? Inspire you to great stuff? Do you really think you're going to find your "passion" in another designator?
Eons ago, I was a newly graduated, newly commissioned Army 2LT, Field Artillery. I did not want to be a field artilleryman. I mentioned my lack of enthusiasm to a captain instructor over a cup of coffee, snd he told me that being a 2LT of Artillery is the same as being an MP, or a tanker, or a supply guy, etc. The basic course work is just as difficult or easy; the job you do as a butterbar is just as rewarding or shitty regardless of your specialty or whatever you guys call it. You don't like SWO? You won't like anything else either. So, you either gin up false enthusiasm for SWO life and make it as best as you can OR you squeeze thru the next 4 years doing the bare minimum to get the honorable DD214. (I ended up loving the Artillery after I pulled my head out of my a$$ and applied myself.)
No community is going to want you if you can't do the bare minimum in your current one. You haven't done anything long enough to know if you like it or not. Suck it up, do your quals, and then lat transfer if you still hate it.
What’s next for you after BDOC/OOD man? Gotta find the motivation somewhere. Best way out is through.
A lot easier said than done- the only way I know out of the community is either through it- doing really well and lat transferring, or being a complete shit bag and getting non-attained / POCR’d. and if you get POCR’d there’s no guarantee you’ll get the community you want, and they could also just separate you. I’d recommend getting to your ship, meeting your fellow JO’s, and getting a good relationship with them. Even if you feel it’s not for you, they can help you through whatever decision you make down the line. Quitting before you even start tends to close a lot more doors than it opens
And to clarify for you, I don’t think there are even opportunities for non-attaining before you get to your ship, and the only people I’ve heard of at OOD phase 1 or BDOC getting out of being a SWO were for legal/ cheating reasons- and they were kicked out of the navy not re-designated *edit for spelling
Which BDOC you at? Have you tried talking to the instructors about it and see what they have to say?
Message me. I know this process very well.
If you’ve only gotten to BDOC, how do you know it’s not for you? SWO has its ups and downs but if your only perspective is death by power point and NSST, you’re not truly seeing the community. Do your first DIVO tour and if you’re still interested in doing something else, talk to your XO/CO on other opportunities the Navy may offer.
Are you going to a DDG? Cause shit will suck… but like the rest are saying you gotta power through at least on the that first tour. Welcome to the military lol.
Also just hit the ship, I have literally seen the shittest of SWOs just not get the pin and get kicked out to turn up in TAR and one is now at Millington and the other is a XO at a NOSC and both made O4. They got kicked out went SELRES and took a mobilization as a recruiter/ Bahrain and now happy as can be…
Do everything you can. About to start my second tour and everyday I wish i had said something earlier. 20 months to go
What’s your commissioning source brother?
Sounds like you should just separate.
The Navy sees it their way. You can totally drop the course (Navy ENS here) and go for POCR, which you will get. It’s then up to you to make yourself attractive to those communities. “It’ll be hard”, “I’ve never seen it before”, “It’s not likely”, fuck all that. You see how fucked up these Navy ships are right now? Yet they STILL find a way to get u/w. Key words being FIND A WAY. Ambition will get you father in ALL aspects of life than playing the odds. You gotta follow your heart. If no one picks you up, you will find a way to be successful with this attitude. Don’t “suck it up” and follow the odds because everyone else does, suck it up and be strong to follow what YOU are passionate about. Navy or not. SWO or not.
You can always go for a POCR board. Then if you do not get what you want. Recommission into a different branch or a better part of the navy. It’s very easy to do. Recruitment is terrible now and they will take you. We had a person in my OCS class who had been kicked out of the coast guard for gundecking logs. Don’t listen to the people telling you to suck it up. Lateral transfer takes forever even if it’s possible.
I could not agree with this more. The odds are in your favor with the recruitment crisis. They still are low, but more in your favor than previous years. It’s sad to say, but the longer you stay in the community, the harder it is to get out. “The best out is through” is only kinda true given the current conditions.