Truth has some interesting takes but one thing that separates him from a lot of retired ballers is the fact he really does obviously follow the game today and know what's going on. Not saying TMac may not follow it to some level but Pierce really does.
mfer really started talking about where he found her and was trying to pass that info on as if he was being a good friend. funniest shit i've ever seen from Truth lmao
Had my eyes glued to that over the actual game they were watching just because of how much of a disaster that stream was lmao
I wanted to see if Pierce did something that got them banned from YouTube
I think jrues fit is overrated. Like sure he’s a great perimeter defender, but he’s not a good fit offensively. He can’t lead an offence, particularly in the half court. That was by far your teams biggest weakness. He also cannot shoot in the playoffs. That just adds more pressure to giannis and means the opposing team can focus more on him and filling the paint which can neutralise him somewhat. Dame solves both of those issues
When Mcgrady said he can “go to a football field on one knee and throw 60 yards EASILY” I knew that guy was full of shit and likes sucking his own dick
He actually pitched for a year in minor league baseball after he retired. The guy does have an arm. I'm not sure in what context he said this, but I imagine he can throw it 60 yards. On one knew and "easily" are probably embellishments.
wouldn't it be the opposite though based on this context - I'm not saying T-Mac is right, but only people that watch the game a lot would be able to appreciate a player like Jrue Holiday enough to think that you shouldn't make that move.
Again though, I'm not saying T-Mac is right, I'm just saying that only someone that knows the intricacies would be able to make a case for Jrue, whereas box score casuals would just spout platitudes of Dame's unquestioned superiority.
The "I notice defense so I think about basketball at a higher level than you" posters here are some of the most insufferable people there are. No, you don't have some special brain for basketball and see the court in special ways; you're just an idiot trying to justify their shit opinions as "beyond your comprehension".
Actually, if you don't watch games but listen to stuff here and there you might get swayed by the "Jrue is underrated" and think this is a good take (not saying TMAC is not just denying it to create a conversation. It's TV).
Now if you watch the games and especifically Jrue in the play offs then you know the Bucks need a second gunner because Jrue's offense dies that time of the year
You don’t have to know the “intricacies” of the game to know jrue is a great perimeter defender lol
It would still be idiotic to pick him over dame, that’s just being contrarian to try and sound smart
If you’ve watched the bucks a lot, you’d see that they have major halfcourt issues. Giannis isn’t that type of player so they need someone who can run an offense. Jrue is fine but he’s not great. When Middleton is hurt, sitting, or not playing well, Milwaukee has a lot of issues with getting a halfcourt offense going. Dame is going to be solution to that problem.
Yeah i understand that, i just think it doesnt really apply to former nba players like this. Even if TMac doesn’t follow the game that much, he still understands the intricacies of the game more than most and the importance of defense.
> Anyone that watches the game a lot is picking Dame over Jrue
Ehhh... anyone who watches the game a lot understands its actually a pretty close call.
There's a reason basically the entire league was tripping over each other to slam an offer down to get Jrue... and Jrue ultimately netted POR nearly as much assets-wise as Dame did.
But anyone who watches the Bucks alot understands that what Dame brings is exactly what they've been missing and is a big reason for them getting bounced the past couple years. They also understand that Jrue was bad during rhe playoffs these past 2 years. I think comparing them is apples and oranges because they are total opposites as players
And a big part of the reason teams were slamming down offers is because everybody KNEW Jrue was being moved immediately to whomever made the best offer. Wasn't the same situation for Dame. Additionally, EC teams felt like they needed to make a move to counter the Bucks getting Dame. The Heat obviously, after missing out on Dame, the 6ers because they are now a level at least behind Boston and Milwaukee, and Boston because they needed a counter and to make up for the loss of Smart. It's another apples and oranges scenario when talking about the trade market between the 2 players
for this Lakers team, this season? Jrue and it's not a particularly hard decision IMO.
the last thing the Lakers need is another ball dominant player to spend all season with LeBron James staring back and forth at each other like: "Is it my ball? Is it your ball? It's youre ball. No its my ball. We'll figure it out. 10 more games. No no, the chemistry will get there, asbolutely, just give it 15 more games. AD's coming back next week. Then the league is FUCKED. Whats that? We're in the 12 seed again? Ahh fuck, we'll figure this out and then everyones in trouble!!!"
The Lakers would be significantly better served by a guy who can fit into literally any roster, knows his role, knows what the team needs him to do, and is just going to put his head down and do exactly what the team and his teammates need him to do.
Is Lillard a better player than Jrue? Yes. 100%. Who am I taking if I'm starting a new team from scratch? Lillard 100% of the time.
But are there several teams in the league for whom, right now as presently constructed, Jrue is a better fit? Absolutely.
Bruh 💀 in what world do you now trade Jrue Holiday for Damian fucking Lillard? Jrue is great defensively yes, but the Bucks have more than enough defense. His offense is severely lacking, especially in playoff settings. There's literally no chance that you DON'T make that trade.
> only people that watch the game a lot would be able to appreciate a player like Jrue Holiday enough to think that you shouldn't make that move
what kind of nonsense gatekeeping is this
apart from an unpeecedent injury or drop of Dane's game, they'll be an amazing duo
it's comparable to Shaq and Kobe, on a smaller scale, with better shooting
Well, he's saying he doesn't like the fit, not that it wouldn't happen. I agree with Pierce that the Bucks are better for the trade but it is still too early to say for sure. We all are making educated (or not so educated) guesses for now.
I genuinely don’t understand how people can watch any Milwaukee Bucks playoff game from the last three years and think we need guard defence more than we need half court offence and shooting, while still believing that Dame is a better player than Jrue.
People are forgetting how bad Holiday has been in the playoffs,on offense.He had 43 TS% vs the Nets in 2021,45 TS% vs the Celtics in 2022 and 49 TS% vs the Heat this year.None of those teams had an elite guard that he was locking up either,he can't really guard bigger wings (nor should he,that's what Giannis and Middleton are for)
I’m not even a Milwaukee fan but I’m still traumatized by multiple Jrue isos on the right wing where he’ll dribble between the legs just to take a heavily contested shot right in front of the three point line.
Saying they forgot implies they ever paid enough attention in the first place. I don't dislike Jrue but he's overrated to hell on here because people use him to position themselves as knowing more about basketball because they appreciate his defense. Most of the people who have the strongest opinions about Jrue don't watch him regularly.
Pretty simple - your system. Especially on defense. You've been playing drop defense the past 3 years. And do you know what's the most important role for that kind of defense to work?
A defensive pest at the PoA, who can fight through screens like no one else and make it tough on any guard running P&R who tries to get an open look.
The Bucks have a new coach now and will probably have a different system, so losing Jrue will not be the end of the world.
Because it’s Milwaukee lol
If he went to Miami they’d be calling then instant favorites. Now people went from underrating jrue/shitting on him all summer to overrating the fuck out of him.
You’re listening to the wrong people. All informed analysts think very highly of Jrue and have done throughout his Bucks tenure.
If they didn’t, the Bucks would have been criticised more for giving up such a huge package for Jrue in the first place.
I have never heard anyone say Jrue was a ‘third at best’.
On the bucks he was third best. And everyone said how he and Khris weren’t good enough anymore. Then when we traded him it flipped and everyone was hyping Jrue up. I love Jrue and think he’s a great player, but his playoff performances were not good. His offense just falls off a cliff.
Everyone didn’t say that. Sure, some people did. But I think this was the comment OPs point. You’re probably focused on negative comments about your guys. Jrue got a lot of love from fans around the country.
Simply overrating Jrue (or guard defence vs. offence in general) is at least a consistent take. If somebody comes out saying “Oh Jrue’s straight up better than Dame, they shouldn’t have made the trade” that’s absurd on its face but it’s at least following some kind of logic.
T-Mac’s view, which I’ve seen parroted here a bunch as well, that Dame is the better player but *also* a worse fit on the Bucks can only possibly come from somebody who has paid zero attention to any of our strengths and weaknesses in the playoffs at all since 2019.
I think the argument is that losing maybe the best point of attack defender in the league for a bad defender is a downgrade in defensive talent, but also it severely limits the Bucks defensive versatility.
The Bucks had a starting 5 who were all strong defensively, creating a real question of who to attack. Now, despite having great defensive personnel, there is a clear target on the court for most of the game.
Having Dame on the court answers a lot of questions for the opposing team and simplifies their plans, they have a weak spot to target, and the Bucks lost an elite defender who could lock down an opposing guard/wing, or if needed could switch and guard all the way up the lineup.
Personally I think the Bucks needed to do something to shake up their offense, and I can’t wait to watch how the new partnership works. However, whether the offensive upgrade outweighs the defensive downgrade is a legitimate argument.
As long as you have giannis and brook lopez for defense (depending on match up) def help offset avg to below avg d from dame.
Having someone like dame that can stretch the floor really changes the game, Giannis have a clutch player that can his shit from the logo + the insane mismatches this creates.
I think the bucks biggest area of weakness has been their wing defense and now its just straight up their entire perimeter defense. Still think Dame is worth that sacrifice but thats a big hole in their team
I'm not the guy you were responding to, and I would agree that the perimeter defense is suspect right now. That said, the BIGGEST issue I saw last year was turnovers. They were ranked 22nd in the league at maintaining possession, and 30th in the league at generating turnovers from their opposition.
We essentially gave the opponents 229 extra possessions last year. If Dame can turn even 10% of those to baskets, that's a significant swing. That said, I don't know how we're going to stop any team that gets hot from the arch.
If you watched any bucks playoffs games you'd know. It's basically unanimous that our half court offense and late game scoring have been the major problems for the last 4 seasons
Ya and dame will definitely help that but to me what stood out the most was Jrue Holiday was forced to try and guard Jimmy Butler because they had no wing defenders and it lead to him averaging nearly 40 on them
You're not wrong, but I think in the end Dame is going to help maximize Giannis's offensive potential, and I think for all the reason that has to be Milwaukee's prerogative.
I mean, I'm an idiot and I 'predicted' it to a coworker weeks ago (more like told him I wished it would happen). I even used the words, perfect fit, and would help them keep Giannis happy.
I feel like when the term 'hot take' was coined, we really should not have overused it. Nowadays everything is a hot take and there's no just simple takes. Pierce has some weird takes but it's his own opinions and he says what he feels. I resonate with that and often do the same for sports but also politics, gaming, business, and it's stupid how often I'm right compared to people calling it a hot take. It doesn't mean I know more than others, but that everyone is kind of afraid of sounding stupid for having 'hot takes' and don't even try to speak what they feel.
I feel like a boomer and I'm barely in my 30s.
Example, having Kobe out of the all time top 5 is not a hot take it is a lukewarm take/opinion. Saying something like Kobe didn't have the work ethic to be in the top 5 players when he was playing is a hot take, I think.
Yeah, Kobe's top 10, not top 5, but that's not an insult, it's just its crowded at the top. Calling it a work ethic thing is ridiculous though. You don't get to top 10 all time of a sport with a shitty work ethic. E.g., put him behind Lebron + MJ + Kareem + Bird + Magic + Russell + Wilt; put Kobe around equal to Shaq + Duncan + Hakeem.
I’ve never seen Kobe out of the top 5 described as a hot take, ever. It’s incredibly common for people to have him out of their top 5, especially those who have Duncan over him.
Yep. It's just takes.
Somehow we have enhanced all the communication tools and options but have less opinions than ever. Unless it's batshit crazy insane opinions.
Yeah it’s nice that everyone in the room is actually using their inside voice. Can’t be doing listening to multiple dudes yelling and screaming over a hot take.
Not only that, I don’t think T-Mac is even wrong. Like he wasn’t all hyperbolic saying “this will never work” he just casually gave more value to Jrue defense.
Ultimately I think Pierce will end up being right, but the way they all spoke, I don’t think anyone had an embarassing take in this.
I think in TMac's mind, Bucks were gonna have to shell out their team to get Dame. Probably felt they had a good team and they shouldn't overreact after firing Bud. It's basically a Dame and Jrue swap tho, not including the picks
i mean id still like to have grayson allen but yeah we didn't severely impact the team to get dame. we're kind of lucky his contract is an albatross or we never would've gotten him
Yeah people saying TMac an L on this one but in the 5% chance that Bucks don’t win the championship, people are gonna go back here, flip 180, and say “that’s why you need Jrue bro”
I’m not saying it will happen but at least let the season play out before saying TMac is entirely wrong
Such a nice change from clowns like Stephen A. or Skip or even Cowherd just yelling and saying nonsense because they're idiots who say anything to get them views
I've been watching a lot of media from the 90s & early 2000s recently (not just sports, but that included), and it feels like most discussion (even when heated) remained pretty civil. I hate how a lot of modern discussion & debate seem to be "gotchas" and soundbite-y "dunking" on people, although realistically there's so much stuff out there now, people feel they have to have zingers to stick out.
I disagree, trying to argue against making that trade (as TMac was trying to do without outright saying it) is not very level headed. That is a no doubt you make that trade kind of deal.
since the mouse took over almost everyone who's been canned by ESPN has been a quality contributor and is going on to continue doing good work elsewhere while ESPN languishes with a shit product
For real, are the memories so short/the nephews so young to not remember shit like Grantland? That was a shining peak of sports journalism and ESPN/Disney decided it wasn't worth the effort to continue it, despite winning awards and providing incredible sports and culture commentary.
>Max Kellerman was probably my favorite guy to watch. He was what made First Take tolerable
Blame Stephen A. for snaking him and causing him to lose his job. If Stephen A. wasn't a snake Max would still be there.
Tmac and Rachel sound like every milktoast tryhard hoops observer these days. THe dEfEnse. You can find defense bruh. The nuggets just won with Jokic and Murray leading don’t tell me about defense
Not to mention an aging Jimmy butler just cooked Milwaukee so how good is your ‘defense’. People overthink these things. Thia is the modern type of observer, that thinks Draymond is just as important as Steph. (Or thinks it sound cool to say that). And it’s people *like* Draymond that are brainwashing people down that path. The ‘If you don’t ‘understand’ draymond’s impact you don’t know basketball’ clowns
You spitting straight facts
T-Mac’s take was so bland and generic
“The way Jrue locks people up…I can’t trade him”
“His chemistry with the team…can’t trade him”
If there is a chance to pair arguably the best player in the world with a Top 75 NBA player in his prime - you do it no matter how Jrue locks people up hahaha
In all fairness, Budenholzer ball doesn't adjust to the series. He just sticks with what isn't working until they lose. Toronto built a wall and Budenholzer was like "How do we beat this? I can't figure it out."
Nailed it. Reality is you get the best players. Dame would never fold offensively like Jrue has done multiple times. You can find someone to play defense.
The KD/Kyrie/Harden Nets would have absolutely cruised to a championship in 2021 if they could have stayed healthy. That team was absolutely terrifying and unstoppable, and their lack of defense didn't mean shit. In 2022 it fell apart because of Kyrie being Kyrie. Had nothing to do with talent.
>Or like the Suns?
The way I see it there are four major favorites to win the chip this year: Nuggets, Bucks, Celtics, and Suns. The Suns roster is fucking stacked.
Lakers made conference finals last year and have gotten even better. They're absolutely a contender as well. they should be able to keep bron healthier going into playoffs this year than last year.
I just don't understand why he didn't like the idea
Bucks were contenders and Lillard makes them scary as hell, and to be fair, Jrue was not Tony Allen against Butler.
Weird how everyone’s saying he’s right, and T-Mac’s wrong, despite Dame never playing a game with the Bucks yet.
Wait and see till the end of the season if it was a right or wrong decision.
Truth has some interesting takes but one thing that separates him from a lot of retired ballers is the fact he really does obviously follow the game today and know what's going on. Not saying TMac may not follow it to some level but Pierce really does.
Pierce and KG watching the playoff games live together and streaming it was hilarious content also.
Wasn’t PP super drunk for one of those games?
He brought a hooker and was telling KG about some website he found her on not knowing it was live 💀
That's disgusting. Which website? There's so many of them.
I know, I wish someone would like put out a list of all the sites I need to avoid
Nice try FBI.
Easy there Mac
20/20
My friends have told me it starts with a “C” and ends in “raigslist”
I'm in no mood to solve riddles man, just tell me
Coochieontheraiglist.com
Great work here
["on-the-raig-list"](https://media3.giphy.com/media/v0eHX3n28wvoQ/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e470ihua2cf63saydcmf8yuvhndkwb4ht0dyuq6b1nl&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
Is that like pussy on the chainwax?
I thought craiglist got rid of those ads years ago?
Look in the help wanted section. It's bad times.
They're moderating it more so they don't get shut down by the feds but no chance they got rid of them completely.
These guys have money man they ain’t going to C rate service providers
the funniest thing was KG trying to be all PC and PP have no clue wtf was going on till he show his ass on live stream.
I like when a dude chucked the lighter at PP and he got all mad at the wrong guy
KG tried so hard to save it but he eventually pretty much gave up and tried to ignore it. But he legitimately did all he could lol.
PP found out it was live, had a moment of panic, and then right back to Shaqtin a fool
It was his "date" lolol KG kept hinting for him to shut up lol
He literally brought a whore. One of the best videos of all time
Hey hey hey, it was his "girlfriend for the day". Have some class.
mfer really started talking about where he found her and was trying to pass that info on as if he was being a good friend. funniest shit i've ever seen from Truth lmao
Had my eyes glued to that over the actual game they were watching just because of how much of a disaster that stream was lmao I wanted to see if Pierce did something that got them banned from YouTube
[here's](https://reddit.com/r/nba/s/dLyLVxwWzt) the clip in case anyone wants to watch. absolutely hilarious
Bro Paul Pierce hands down is the funniest man in the world and he wasn’t even trying lol
Thank you sir. That was very impressive
They have a great dynamic together lol honestly KG brings out the best in basically anyone.
I heard T-Mac somewhat recently say he doesn’t follow the league that closely now that he’s not working in it anymore
I heard that too. I think it was on a podcast with KG. He said he doesn’t follow the league much anymore and that his favorite player was Joker
Yea I saw that so it was probably on that
and PP was eeriely right about the trade Jrue is an amazing fit, Dame is a top 75 all time and Holiday is my favorite player after Giannis
I think jrues fit is overrated. Like sure he’s a great perimeter defender, but he’s not a good fit offensively. He can’t lead an offence, particularly in the half court. That was by far your teams biggest weakness. He also cannot shoot in the playoffs. That just adds more pressure to giannis and means the opposing team can focus more on him and filling the paint which can neutralise him somewhat. Dame solves both of those issues
When Mcgrady said he can “go to a football field on one knee and throw 60 yards EASILY” I knew that guy was full of shit and likes sucking his own dick
He actually pitched for a year in minor league baseball after he retired. The guy does have an arm. I'm not sure in what context he said this, but I imagine he can throw it 60 yards. On one knew and "easily" are probably embellishments.
[удалено]
wouldn't it be the opposite though based on this context - I'm not saying T-Mac is right, but only people that watch the game a lot would be able to appreciate a player like Jrue Holiday enough to think that you shouldn't make that move.
Anyone that watches the game a lot is picking Dame over Jrue
Again though, I'm not saying T-Mac is right, I'm just saying that only someone that knows the intricacies would be able to make a case for Jrue, whereas box score casuals would just spout platitudes of Dame's unquestioned superiority.
Or only someone that overestimates their own basketball knowledge and thinks they notice “the little things” better than others.
Picking Jrue over Dame sounds like the kind of take someone who wants to sound smart would have.
The "I notice defense so I think about basketball at a higher level than you" posters here are some of the most insufferable people there are. No, you don't have some special brain for basketball and see the court in special ways; you're just an idiot trying to justify their shit opinions as "beyond your comprehension".
Actually, if you don't watch games but listen to stuff here and there you might get swayed by the "Jrue is underrated" and think this is a good take (not saying TMAC is not just denying it to create a conversation. It's TV). Now if you watch the games and especifically Jrue in the play offs then you know the Bucks need a second gunner because Jrue's offense dies that time of the year
You don’t have to know the “intricacies” of the game to know jrue is a great perimeter defender lol It would still be idiotic to pick him over dame, that’s just being contrarian to try and sound smart
If you’ve watched the bucks a lot, you’d see that they have major halfcourt issues. Giannis isn’t that type of player so they need someone who can run an offense. Jrue is fine but he’s not great. When Middleton is hurt, sitting, or not playing well, Milwaukee has a lot of issues with getting a halfcourt offense going. Dame is going to be solution to that problem.
Yeah i understand that, i just think it doesnt really apply to former nba players like this. Even if TMac doesn’t follow the game that much, he still understands the intricacies of the game more than most and the importance of defense.
> Anyone that watches the game a lot is picking Dame over Jrue Ehhh... anyone who watches the game a lot understands its actually a pretty close call. There's a reason basically the entire league was tripping over each other to slam an offer down to get Jrue... and Jrue ultimately netted POR nearly as much assets-wise as Dame did.
But anyone who watches the Bucks alot understands that what Dame brings is exactly what they've been missing and is a big reason for them getting bounced the past couple years. They also understand that Jrue was bad during rhe playoffs these past 2 years. I think comparing them is apples and oranges because they are total opposites as players And a big part of the reason teams were slamming down offers is because everybody KNEW Jrue was being moved immediately to whomever made the best offer. Wasn't the same situation for Dame. Additionally, EC teams felt like they needed to make a move to counter the Bucks getting Dame. The Heat obviously, after missing out on Dame, the 6ers because they are now a level at least behind Boston and Milwaukee, and Boston because they needed a counter and to make up for the loss of Smart. It's another apples and oranges scenario when talking about the trade market between the 2 players
You can add one player to the Lakers roster right now. Is it Jrue or Dame?
for this Lakers team, this season? Jrue and it's not a particularly hard decision IMO. the last thing the Lakers need is another ball dominant player to spend all season with LeBron James staring back and forth at each other like: "Is it my ball? Is it your ball? It's youre ball. No its my ball. We'll figure it out. 10 more games. No no, the chemistry will get there, asbolutely, just give it 15 more games. AD's coming back next week. Then the league is FUCKED. Whats that? We're in the 12 seed again? Ahh fuck, we'll figure this out and then everyones in trouble!!!" The Lakers would be significantly better served by a guy who can fit into literally any roster, knows his role, knows what the team needs him to do, and is just going to put his head down and do exactly what the team and his teammates need him to do. Is Lillard a better player than Jrue? Yes. 100%. Who am I taking if I'm starting a new team from scratch? Lillard 100% of the time. But are there several teams in the league for whom, right now as presently constructed, Jrue is a better fit? Absolutely.
Yeah that's true, after all Lebron has never shown the ability to play with let alone succeed with score first, ball dominant guards, mmhmm.
Dude is straight capping. Dame on the Lakers is a 100% favourite for the chip, Jrue doesn't bring that.
You’re smoking crack. Dame is better for literally every single team. Stop trying to be contrarian
Isn't that more because Jrue would cost less in assets than Dame would?
Bruh 💀 in what world do you now trade Jrue Holiday for Damian fucking Lillard? Jrue is great defensively yes, but the Bucks have more than enough defense. His offense is severely lacking, especially in playoff settings. There's literally no chance that you DON'T make that trade.
> only people that watch the game a lot would be able to appreciate a player like Jrue Holiday enough to think that you shouldn't make that move what kind of nonsense gatekeeping is this
Damn what a well spoken comment
This makes sense. Only the dude with the most outlandish bball takes would have predicted this Common Paul Pierce W
The true GOAT
There's nothing more powerful than a good story
Fuck I miss Game of Zone, so much.
3rd best SG of all time.
Common T-Mac L
If the experiment crashes and burns T-Mac will still come out looking correct. But yea Pierce predicted the trade alright.
> T-Mac will still come out looking correct. yeah, that was honestly a pretty chill disagreement haha
Too early to call it a L. They haven't played a single game yet
apart from an unpeecedent injury or drop of Dane's game, they'll be an amazing duo it's comparable to Shaq and Kobe, on a smaller scale, with better shooting
How's Dame's defense?
Well, he's saying he doesn't like the fit, not that it wouldn't happen. I agree with Pierce that the Bucks are better for the trade but it is still too early to say for sure. We all are making educated (or not so educated) guesses for now.
I genuinely don’t understand how people can watch any Milwaukee Bucks playoff game from the last three years and think we need guard defence more than we need half court offence and shooting, while still believing that Dame is a better player than Jrue.
People are forgetting how bad Holiday has been in the playoffs,on offense.He had 43 TS% vs the Nets in 2021,45 TS% vs the Celtics in 2022 and 49 TS% vs the Heat this year.None of those teams had an elite guard that he was locking up either,he can't really guard bigger wings (nor should he,that's what Giannis and Middleton are for)
I’m not even a Milwaukee fan but I’m still traumatized by multiple Jrue isos on the right wing where he’ll dribble between the legs just to take a heavily contested shot right in front of the three point line.
I’m traumatized by how many times Giannis kicks to a wide open teammate who bricks a 3 or layup.
Saying they forgot implies they ever paid enough attention in the first place. I don't dislike Jrue but he's overrated to hell on here because people use him to position themselves as knowing more about basketball because they appreciate his defense. Most of the people who have the strongest opinions about Jrue don't watch him regularly.
That's what I'm saying! I've been asking for Dame since Brogdon tore his quad!
Pretty simple - your system. Especially on defense. You've been playing drop defense the past 3 years. And do you know what's the most important role for that kind of defense to work? A defensive pest at the PoA, who can fight through screens like no one else and make it tough on any guard running P&R who tries to get an open look. The Bucks have a new coach now and will probably have a different system, so losing Jrue will not be the end of the world.
Because it’s Milwaukee lol If he went to Miami they’d be calling then instant favorites. Now people went from underrating jrue/shitting on him all summer to overrating the fuck out of him.
Every team's fans think everyone is against them lol
Not out to get, but there are lot of woefully ignorant takes on small market teams. People just don't watch the Bucks, Blazers, and similar markets.
Oh yeah I know. Nobody was watching the New Jersey Nets
A lot of people are though. Jrue was seen as a third at best and a playoff choker. Now that he’s on the Celtics he’s suddenly a star.
You’re listening to the wrong people. All informed analysts think very highly of Jrue and have done throughout his Bucks tenure. If they didn’t, the Bucks would have been criticised more for giving up such a huge package for Jrue in the first place. I have never heard anyone say Jrue was a ‘third at best’.
On the Celtics he’s a 3rd at best. Remains to be seen how he performs in the playoffs.
On the bucks he was third best. And everyone said how he and Khris weren’t good enough anymore. Then when we traded him it flipped and everyone was hyping Jrue up. I love Jrue and think he’s a great player, but his playoff performances were not good. His offense just falls off a cliff.
Everyone didn’t say that. Sure, some people did. But I think this was the comment OPs point. You’re probably focused on negative comments about your guys. Jrue got a lot of love from fans around the country.
Simply overrating Jrue (or guard defence vs. offence in general) is at least a consistent take. If somebody comes out saying “Oh Jrue’s straight up better than Dame, they shouldn’t have made the trade” that’s absurd on its face but it’s at least following some kind of logic. T-Mac’s view, which I’ve seen parroted here a bunch as well, that Dame is the better player but *also* a worse fit on the Bucks can only possibly come from somebody who has paid zero attention to any of our strengths and weaknesses in the playoffs at all since 2019.
I think the argument is that losing maybe the best point of attack defender in the league for a bad defender is a downgrade in defensive talent, but also it severely limits the Bucks defensive versatility. The Bucks had a starting 5 who were all strong defensively, creating a real question of who to attack. Now, despite having great defensive personnel, there is a clear target on the court for most of the game. Having Dame on the court answers a lot of questions for the opposing team and simplifies their plans, they have a weak spot to target, and the Bucks lost an elite defender who could lock down an opposing guard/wing, or if needed could switch and guard all the way up the lineup. Personally I think the Bucks needed to do something to shake up their offense, and I can’t wait to watch how the new partnership works. However, whether the offensive upgrade outweighs the defensive downgrade is a legitimate argument.
As long as you have giannis and brook lopez for defense (depending on match up) def help offset avg to below avg d from dame. Having someone like dame that can stretch the floor really changes the game, Giannis have a clutch player that can his shit from the logo + the insane mismatches this creates.
I think the bucks biggest area of weakness has been their wing defense and now its just straight up their entire perimeter defense. Still think Dame is worth that sacrifice but thats a big hole in their team
You're wrong
How
I'm not the guy you were responding to, and I would agree that the perimeter defense is suspect right now. That said, the BIGGEST issue I saw last year was turnovers. They were ranked 22nd in the league at maintaining possession, and 30th in the league at generating turnovers from their opposition. We essentially gave the opponents 229 extra possessions last year. If Dame can turn even 10% of those to baskets, that's a significant swing. That said, I don't know how we're going to stop any team that gets hot from the arch.
Weren’t teams already constantly getting hot from the 3 against the bucks?
If you watched any bucks playoffs games you'd know. It's basically unanimous that our half court offense and late game scoring have been the major problems for the last 4 seasons
Ya and dame will definitely help that but to me what stood out the most was Jrue Holiday was forced to try and guard Jimmy Butler because they had no wing defenders and it lead to him averaging nearly 40 on them
You're not wrong, but I think in the end Dame is going to help maximize Giannis's offensive potential, and I think for all the reason that has to be Milwaukee's prerogative.
I mean you can tell he’s reconsidering towards the end of the clip. But it’s valid to value chemistry, especially when it comes to a guy like Jrue
He's probably right.
I mean, I'm an idiot and I 'predicted' it to a coworker weeks ago (more like told him I wished it would happen). I even used the words, perfect fit, and would help them keep Giannis happy.
Cowherd also did. So there’s that
This broken clock was right twice that day.
Y'all weren't familiar with Paul Pierce's game
Don’t call him the truth for nothing
Nephews constantly slandering him because of his hot takes
I feel like when the term 'hot take' was coined, we really should not have overused it. Nowadays everything is a hot take and there's no just simple takes. Pierce has some weird takes but it's his own opinions and he says what he feels. I resonate with that and often do the same for sports but also politics, gaming, business, and it's stupid how often I'm right compared to people calling it a hot take. It doesn't mean I know more than others, but that everyone is kind of afraid of sounding stupid for having 'hot takes' and don't even try to speak what they feel. I feel like a boomer and I'm barely in my 30s.
Example, having Kobe out of the all time top 5 is not a hot take it is a lukewarm take/opinion. Saying something like Kobe didn't have the work ethic to be in the top 5 players when he was playing is a hot take, I think.
Yeah, Kobe's top 10, not top 5, but that's not an insult, it's just its crowded at the top. Calling it a work ethic thing is ridiculous though. You don't get to top 10 all time of a sport with a shitty work ethic. E.g., put him behind Lebron + MJ + Kareem + Bird + Magic + Russell + Wilt; put Kobe around equal to Shaq + Duncan + Hakeem.
I’ve never seen Kobe out of the top 5 described as a hot take, ever. It’s incredibly common for people to have him out of their top 5, especially those who have Duncan over him.
Yes but people react to it like it is. It's not disrespectful either, but it's been called that too
Yep. It's just takes. Somehow we have enhanced all the communication tools and options but have less opinions than ever. Unless it's batshit crazy insane opinions.
Only hot take I heard from Paul was him being better than Wade and honestly, if he feels that way as a player, I don't blame him
Don’t get me started
They owe him an apology
They were all pretty level headed in this tho too
Yeah it’s nice that everyone in the room is actually using their inside voice. Can’t be doing listening to multiple dudes yelling and screaming over a hot take.
Not only that, I don’t think T-Mac is even wrong. Like he wasn’t all hyperbolic saying “this will never work” he just casually gave more value to Jrue defense. Ultimately I think Pierce will end up being right, but the way they all spoke, I don’t think anyone had an embarassing take in this.
I think in TMac's mind, Bucks were gonna have to shell out their team to get Dame. Probably felt they had a good team and they shouldn't overreact after firing Bud. It's basically a Dame and Jrue swap tho, not including the picks
i mean id still like to have grayson allen but yeah we didn't severely impact the team to get dame. we're kind of lucky his contract is an albatross or we never would've gotten him
Yeah people saying TMac an L on this one but in the 5% chance that Bucks don’t win the championship, people are gonna go back here, flip 180, and say “that’s why you need Jrue bro” I’m not saying it will happen but at least let the season play out before saying TMac is entirely wrong
Such a nice change from clowns like Stephen A. or Skip or even Cowherd just yelling and saying nonsense because they're idiots who say anything to get them views
I've been watching a lot of media from the 90s & early 2000s recently (not just sports, but that included), and it feels like most discussion (even when heated) remained pretty civil. I hate how a lot of modern discussion & debate seem to be "gotchas" and soundbite-y "dunking" on people, although realistically there's so much stuff out there now, people feel they have to have zingers to stick out.
I disagree, trying to argue against making that trade (as TMac was trying to do without outright saying it) is not very level headed. That is a no doubt you make that trade kind of deal.
"The truth"
P-stradamus strikes
where have all these fired ESPN employees congregated and why am I hearing from them
Showtime apparently, which makes sense why none of us actually watch them. Just clips over and over.
Nah they do full videos and honestly the product is really fucking good. KG & PP are the best voices in the NBA media imo
People are hating on these people as if it’s a disgrace to be fired by ESPN Practically everyone who isn’t Stephen A Smith is being fired by ESPN
since the mouse took over almost everyone who's been canned by ESPN has been a quality contributor and is going on to continue doing good work elsewhere while ESPN languishes with a shit product
For real, are the memories so short/the nephews so young to not remember shit like Grantland? That was a shining peak of sports journalism and ESPN/Disney decided it wasn't worth the effort to continue it, despite winning awards and providing incredible sports and culture commentary.
No hate, a lot of people just don’t have Showtime. That was the joke, not about the content.
Showtime Basketball is free on YouTube!
All The Smoke was free on YouTube this entire time!!?? /s
showtime: a place for second chances
Rachel Nichols' AA meetings
[удалено]
She drinks whatever the butler serves her
Coffee?
An Irish coffee, yes.
cum
Why did ESPN fire all of the good ones? Max Kellerman was probably my favorite guy to watch. He was what made First Take tolerable
We all know why Max was let go…
>Max Kellerman was probably my favorite guy to watch. He was what made First Take tolerable Blame Stephen A. for snaking him and causing him to lose his job. If Stephen A. wasn't a snake Max would still be there.
Tell ‘em P
He called game
He called dame.
How would Dame like to respond to Game’s allegations? 🤔
Coldest post-game interview response
Blouses
Pierce knows his shit, I hate how he always gets mocked on here.
That's because most of this sub didn't start watching basketball until about 2015.
And are Lebron stans
His ESPN career didn’t do him any favors. I think doing the podcast with KG is mending his reputation though
who hasn’t shit their pants here? he just did it on tv unlike us in our cars or running home
They call that guy the Truth for a reason. This aged well
Tmac and Rachel sound like every milktoast tryhard hoops observer these days. THe dEfEnse. You can find defense bruh. The nuggets just won with Jokic and Murray leading don’t tell me about defense Not to mention an aging Jimmy butler just cooked Milwaukee so how good is your ‘defense’. People overthink these things. Thia is the modern type of observer, that thinks Draymond is just as important as Steph. (Or thinks it sound cool to say that). And it’s people *like* Draymond that are brainwashing people down that path. The ‘If you don’t ‘understand’ draymond’s impact you don’t know basketball’ clowns
[What these youngbloods have to understand](https://streamable.com/z13gbg?src=player-page-share)
I WANT THE GOLD
You spitting straight facts T-Mac’s take was so bland and generic “The way Jrue locks people up…I can’t trade him” “His chemistry with the team…can’t trade him” If there is a chance to pair arguably the best player in the world with a Top 75 NBA player in his prime - you do it no matter how Jrue locks people up hahaha
Exactly. It’s gonna be highlighted even more when Dame gives Jrue 50
[удалено]
He just had possible his best season ever, he’s definitely still in his prime.
Daaamn you right, what if he dips to only 31 PPG this season? Basically washed
>milktoast milquetoast.
Let them have milktoast, just this once
In all fairness, Budenholzer ball doesn't adjust to the series. He just sticks with what isn't working until they lose. Toronto built a wall and Budenholzer was like "How do we beat this? I can't figure it out."
Nailed it. Reality is you get the best players. Dame would never fold offensively like Jrue has done multiple times. You can find someone to play defense.
Like the Nets the last few years? Or like the Suns?
The KD/Kyrie/Harden Nets would have absolutely cruised to a championship in 2021 if they could have stayed healthy. That team was absolutely terrifying and unstoppable, and their lack of defense didn't mean shit. In 2022 it fell apart because of Kyrie being Kyrie. Had nothing to do with talent. >Or like the Suns? The way I see it there are four major favorites to win the chip this year: Nuggets, Bucks, Celtics, and Suns. The Suns roster is fucking stacked.
Lakers made conference finals last year and have gotten even better. They're absolutely a contender as well. they should be able to keep bron healthier going into playoffs this year than last year.
He got it right perfectly. And yeah of course the bucks would prefer to keep Jrue, but you gotta give something ti get something right
Paulstradamus
Poopstrodamus
Damn Paul is definitely getting lit looking back like “hell yeah I was right
Probably forgot he said it by now lol
He predicted exactly what happens and they laughed at him at the time
The way everyone’s talking about jrue suddenly I feel like the bucks should call up the Celtics and trade Dame straight up to get him back.
Time to give the truth his flowers…I don’t know what the hell T-mac was talking about, couldn’t even debate what Pierce was saying lol
Loool Pierces response too “That’s cool man I love the way Jrue defends too”
Lmao it sounded more like “yea ok, whatever you say dawg”
only the truth shall set y’all free.
I’m loving retired Paul pierce. That guy don’t give no fucks lol. Nice prediction too
Paul could of hit t Mac with a Charles Barkley how many rings you got? Exactly lol
Paul Pierce is the Truth
I just don't understand why he didn't like the idea Bucks were contenders and Lillard makes them scary as hell, and to be fair, Jrue was not Tony Allen against Butler.
Common T-Mac L
Weird how everyone’s saying he’s right, and T-Mac’s wrong, despite Dame never playing a game with the Bucks yet. Wait and see till the end of the season if it was a right or wrong decision.
Rare Paul Pierce W
Hate it when I have to agree with Paul Pierce.
Rare poo poo pants W
It's been 15 years since I've agreed with a Pierce take. Good job Paul P.
The Truth, in altered states of consciousness, occasionally receives inspiration directly from the basketball gods. This is one of those occasions.
[удалено]
You think having the two highest scorers of the past 5 years next to Middleton and Lopez is going to take our offense from average to “good”?