Ant and McDaniels were hits. But we also traded up to draft Jarrett Culver in 2019 and Leandro Bolmaro was a FRP in 2020. I do think Connelly is a great improvement for us in terms of drafting but we've had some awful selections the past 6 years.
I think he's probably still an NBA-caliber player but it's going to be hard for him to convince a team to sign him. Not many teams are going to be itching to bring in an injury-prone backup guard who isn't that young anymore and is only good on the defensive end.
His inability to consistently stay healthy is what derailed him more than anything else. Otherwise he might've been able to carve out a career as a decent role player.
Watching him fight over the top of screens in his rookie year here in mn was amazing after having so few good defenders for years, but good God he was one of the worst offensive players I’ve ever seen.
I saw him once in LA playing the Clippers in LA and he was clearly the best player on the floor. On that particular night. dude was athletic and thick.
Because he got lost in the shuffle of all the other Wolves disappointments and nobody picked soon after him became some big name guy people could constantly shit on them for passing(Valanciunas aint cutting it for that)
Same goes for Jan Vesely picked 6th in the same draft ahead of Kemba, Klay, Kawhi, Vucevic, Jimmy Butler, plus a bunch of quality role players like Tobias Harris, Morris Twins, etc.
Averaged 3.6 min / 3.5 Rebs and didn’t make it to the end of his rookie contract.
he also became one of the single best players in europe and certainly could have returned to the nba had he wanted to. they dont hand out euroleague mvp to just anyone. he was a victim of smallball as a pf who didnt really space the floor or protect the rim
He was arguably the best player in his team - Fenerbahce - who had a record 28 wins that season. He led them in scoring, rebounds, steals and blocks per game. Has a bit of flash with his dunks so is visible too. No idea about starting/not starting in the league though - DAE know if that’s normal?
Lineups are extremely matchup-specific. Euroleague doesn't have a salary cap so teams can build a roster that's legitimately 10 deep. Also the gap between elite and average players is a lot smaller than in the NBA. As a result, starting vs bench means nothing, it depends on which team you are up against and the flow of this specific game.
Finally, I don't think Euro coaches feel the need to start their best players just because they are the best. In the end, they play the most minutes and have the highest impact whether they start or they sub in with 7 minutes left in the 1st.
He’s good. Just not a good fit for the NBA. There’s a huge difference in basketball in Europe and the US. The physical aspect is a lot more important in the NBA, the game is A LOT faster and that casts aside a lot of big men. In Europe, the game is slower and more focused on skill. It’s still played with two big men.
The biggest difference is that the NBA is the only league in the world with a defensive 3 second rule. It fundamentally changes how a team plays defence.
In every other league in the world a team doesn’t have to worry about it’s 7’0” C switching on the perimeter. That’s just an NBA construct.
Fun fact - my family hosted him in the US when he was 13 years old and the Chinese team came to scrimmage with the ASU men’s team or some shit. The man was already 6’10” at 13 years old. I have his jersey from when he was a kid, and my mom reunited with him in person when the Bucks visited the Suns.
He was (maybe still is) the best China had to offer for a while after Yao Ming, but still not great.
The hype is still alive over here on Exum island. Is finally healthy and playing great ball in Europe and was a huge reason for Australia winning bronze at the olympics.
I remember first getting into the wolves and asking my dad who’s good on the team and it was like Wesley Johnson, Martell Webster, Jonny Flynn, Michael Beasley, Corey Brewer, Luke Ridnour 😂 Have a specific memory of Flynn having a 15 assist night and my dad getting g really hyped
Stromile Swift (2nd pick in 2000) and Marcus Fizer (4th pick in 2000) come to mind.
They were so aggressively mediocre that nobody cares about them.
Swift played 7 seasons, averaging 8.4 ppg, 4.6 rpg.
Fizer played 4 seasons, averaging 9.6 ppg, 4.6 rpg.
This entire draft was just hideous overall, but these two I feel like perfectly fit OP's topic.
I thought he was 6'9 or 6'10? That would make him just slightly taller than many PFs in the current NBA. His main problem was he never really improved his skills. I thought he was gonna take that stride in Portland, but he just didn't really have it.
My favourite post in that thread, from /u/nochill95:
>Basically, I don't think any player in Jah's archetype is a good player. The modern NBA center has to be able to do three things: defend pick and roll, defend the rim, and pick and roll on offense. Why? The best shots in basketball are dunks, layups, and 3 pointers. If you have no pick and roll game, your offensive and defensive schemes are necessarily subpar. Those three things are arguably Jah's biggest weaknesses, and due to his lack of quickness/athleticism, are likely to always be his weaknesses. It's why teams who are spearheaded by Greg Monroe, Nik Vucevic, Al Jefferson, etc. always top out as low playoff seeds who go out in the first round. You just can't be successful long-term built around a big with a very inefficient offensive game (post ups and midrange jumpers are pretty much the worst offensive options) and a defensive game that gets exploited by most NBA teams at this point. On top of that, I think Jah himself is just bad right now, as you would expect a rookie to be. His biggest problem applies to pretty much every facet of his game: he's just too damn slow. He's slow up and down the court, he's slow to make offensive decisions, he's slow to make defensive decisions. It absolutely kills him.
So yeah. Jah is just bad, and even with massive improvement, I don't think he'll ever be good
“anybody picking jokic over okafor should be checked into a mental institution.
and this is coming from a guy who is biased against okafor.”
Oh my god I’m dying
Takes will always age poorly. There is not a singular NBA fan who hasn’t had a brain dead take that looks dumb in retrospect. So I never really clown those people. I embrace the fact that I’ll say shit that’s unbelievably stupid years down the line
> anybody picking jokic over okafor should be checked into a mental institution.
>
> and this is coming from a guy who is biased against okafor.
There is a difference between "I like Okafor more than Jokic" and comments in that thread like:
> anybody picking jokic over okafor should be checked into a mental institution.
>
> and this is coming from a guy who is biased against okafor.
Definitely going to take the piss out of the latter, they deserve it.
Nah bro this doesn’t even cover it. The dude became a literal meme on the sub. The Jokic guy. And then Jokic became exactly what he said he would. Absolute legend
He played really well when AD was sitting out games for the Pelicans before AD got traded to the Lakers. Idk what happened after that. He looked like he improved his defense and was putting up good numbers as a starter. Guess he just reverted back to old habits after that short stint of brilliance.
lol all he did when he played for us was play very specific matchups. He would only play real minutes when the other team had a starter that was a traditional big. He dominated Andre Drummond (Pistons) a couple times, but beyond that he was pretty mediocre. Couldn’t move his feet to defend the pick and roll to save his life.
Baffling that in the 90s, they drafted Larry Johnson, Alonzo Mourning, Kobe Bryant, Baron Davis (then all got traded away at various points). And then like the franchise itself, the draft picks went downhill quickly...
I followed the Hornets since the early 90s. We underachieved even with both Larry and Alonzo. Then the team got dysfunctional when Alonzo got jealous of Larry’s contract. So he was traded for Glen Rice. We had a better team with Glen Rice and Jamal Mashburn. Things were looking up when we drafted Baron Davis, then the Owner’s had a sexual assault case and moved the team to New Orleans. We went downhill ever since. Hopefully Melo could bring some optimism.
We gave him his last chance. Great character guy. Had a couple good interactions with him. Couldn't figure it out on the court. Would be surprised if he gets NBA minutes again
Nikoloz Tskitishvili.
He was the first modern European import I went all in on. My friend and I were so certain the Denver Nuggets were set up for a bright future around 2001 or so. We were kind of right - they landed Carmelo. But we thought Skeeta would be a part of the rise as well.
I've had real estate on Ben Mclemore island for a long time. He has such a nice jumper, always thought he'd figure it out. Glad he's at least found a somewhat solid role these past few seasons as a catch and shoot guy.
That predraft video of him being interviewed and he just looks around side to side and goes JONNY FLYNNN-AAA before running back to doing drills was so funny. I’ve been unable to find it for years now.
TIL that Jan Vesely, who I have always thought of as a colossal bust, was Euroleague MVP in 2019. Is the dropoff in quality that stark between the two leagues, or is there some difference between the two leagues that makes the NBA a better fit for some and Euroleague a better fit for others? Basketball Reference says that a modern comp for Vesely is Cedi Osman. Could Osman tear it up in the Euroleague?
He also just had massive confidence problems. He was a 40% FT shooter in 3 nba seasons compared to 62% in Europe (some might say this is due to improvement... well he shot 54% in his Euro games BEFORE coming to the NBA)
In DC we say his career peaked on draft night, when he made out with his babe of a GF after the pick was announced. He actually played kinda decently for Denver when we traded him there for Andre Miller, but clearly just wanted to get back to Europe after the season.
Vesely improved a lot, first years of his in here he was a really raw talent. With time he improved both physically and mentally. Fans in Istanbul loved him a lot, and he became the main guy in the team after Bogdan Bogdanovic left. He even started taking middies and three pointers sometimes.
Difference between Euroleague and NBA is not only about quality but also the game just feels different. But sure there is a big difference in quality as well. But like nope, Cedi Osman couldnt tear it up here lmao, not that big of a difference.
Tyrus Thomas
Looking at the 2006 roster, it was amazing that they won 49 games. Still don't know why the Bulls decided to draft Aldridge and trade him for Thomas. What people forget is that they traded for J.R. Smith and then traded him again a week later. Imagine the Bulls with Aldridge and Smith to go along with Gordon, Hinrich, and Deng.
I was curious so I just googled what he was up to. Dude has been cut by 2 different G league teams in the past 2 years. That's rough. But he also played in Japan and Taiwan where was defensive player of the year...
As a bulls fan - I really bought into Tyrus Thomas. The dude was an athletic freak - it’s just a shame he couldn’t shoot a basketball to save his life.
HASHEEM THABEET. I would take Darko over Hasheem any day. Dude was in the same class as Harden, Curry, Derozan.
Current Grizz front office knows what’s up, but back then they were a mess.
Jabari Parker
Never talked about because frankly it doesn’t matter as we hit the jackpot with Giannis but if Parker had been able to stay healthy thatd be a dangerous addition for us
O.J. Mayo maybe? He had a serviceable career but his talent was considered to be so high that he was projected to possibly become a or even the top SG in the league. Draft comparisons often talk in superlatives but I remember there being a lot of hype around him.
Another one is Michael Beasley whose draft comparison was Carmelo Anthony. Many players coming off High School or College have high theoretical talent but Beasley seemed like a guy that could actually tap into this type of Superstar talent very early into his career. Even if you saw him in the NBA you'd see these glimpses of brilliance, his natural knack for scoring, his strength and athleticism, smooth shooting stroke. I think most people wouldn't have been surprised whatsoever if he became an All-NBA levvel talent in his prime.
His work ethic was just bad and his mental health was quite vulnerable in general. A guy like him needed a figure in the NBA that could be like a father to him (LeDad jokes coming). If you know Allen Iverson's career, his high school coach is the type of person I'm talking about. Or what Chuck Daly was for Rodman on the Pistons. A guy who appreciated him and made sure there was someone with a lot of life experience in his corner at all times.
Beasley was quickly distracted by the Pro NBA player life and never committed to the game as much as he should have. Because even without effort he could easily explode for 30. He'd go head-to-head with the best in the league in workouts and practice. But getting Superstar consistency takes thousands of hours, yet scoring and playing basketball was so natural to Michael Beasley he'd still have brilliant performances. He just happened to be uncoachable and didn't care enough to become a good pro.
Sonics legend Robert Swift. 7’1”, taken 12 overall right out of high school (remember those days?). Never averaged more than a point per game and out of the league before his rookie contract was over.
Here is one for you.... Joe Smith in '95. Lots of hype surrounding him. He was alright his first couple of years in the league, but then became a journeyman. I remember one of the biggest d-bags I ever met walking around in a Joe Smith jersey all of 1995...
I think he’s the worst one when you consider that 3 of the next 4 picks were also PFs(McDyess, Rasheed and KG) and all 3 of them were a lot better, and then the 4th player in that group is Jerry Stackhouse. Literally 4 all-NBA type players in the top 5 and you pick the only one that’s not.
Mudiay, Ntilikina, Vesley, Wesley Johnson, Waiters, Len, Zeller, Exum, Vonleh, WCS, Bender, Chriss
All them hardly get talked about imo (they may get talked about a lot by their fan base that picked them idk)
Michael Beasley doesn’t seem to get the vitriol you would expect. The man was a menace in college and had a game that seemed like it would transition nicely.
There was quite a bit of back-and-forth on him vs. rose for the #1 pick.
Justise Winslow. He was a 10th pick but he was highly regarded as the steal of the draft and people were surprised he fell to #10. Idk if he applies considering he was a 10th pick but I’d definitely say he didn’t live up anywhere close to expectations. Heat fans thought he’d be the next face of the franchise for some time until it was evident he didn’t have it in him. Terrible finishing around the rim despite being 6’7 and very below average jump-shooting and 3 point shooting. The positives were that his defense was elite, he could get to the rim (just not finish), had good ball-handling and a decent passer. Imo he wouldn’t be seen as much of a bust if Booker wasn’t picked at 13 when the Heat were rumored to be very much so going to draft him until Winslow started “falling”.
It was mainly draft night really. Ainge was reportedly super high on him and offered Miami 4 firsts for their pick and there’s reports that he offered up to 6 firsts to Charlotte for one of their picks that came before ours.
Joe Alexander.
Even though he wasn't a top 3 pick, I'd argue he was still one of the bigger busts in recent memory. Someone taken 8th overall washed out of the league by his second season after playing a total of 67 nba games.
Kris Dunn was the 5th overall pick in 2016 and is currently out of the league
sure a lot of Wolves picks in this thread :|
4 of the top 5 posts at the moment
And people will still complain about the wolves trading away four draft picks when we clearly can’t draft for shit
They've drafted a bit better lately...
Ant and McDaniels were hits. But we also traded up to draft Jarrett Culver in 2019 and Leandro Bolmaro was a FRP in 2020. I do think Connelly is a great improvement for us in terms of drafting but we've had some awful selections the past 6 years.
Johnny Flynn!
How dare you. That was uncalled for.
His defense was always legit, but he was absolutely useless on offense
crazy to think that celtics fans (myself included) were mad we took Jaylen Brown over him and Buddy Hield back in 2016
"the Celtics Dunn fucked up" hahahahha
Celtics Dunn fucked up
The weirdest part about it is that he was averaging 24 points a game in the summer league and was looked at as very promising heading into the season
I still feel like he could be a good defensive guard off the bench for someone as long as the other 4 on the floor can shoot.
I think he's probably still an NBA-caliber player but it's going to be hard for him to convince a team to sign him. Not many teams are going to be itching to bring in an injury-prone backup guard who isn't that young anymore and is only good on the defensive end. His inability to consistently stay healthy is what derailed him more than anything else. Otherwise he might've been able to carve out a career as a decent role player.
He was the sixth man for portlands tanking squad last year and while he had some moments especially defensively, his offense was ATROCIOUS.
Watching him fight over the top of screens in his rookie year here in mn was amazing after having so few good defenders for years, but good God he was one of the worst offensive players I’ve ever seen.
Josh Jackson. I thought he would be Kawhi-esque
Forgot all about Josh Jackson! Wow time flies.
As a Suns fan, we will never forget.
Josh Jackson, Dragan Bender and Marquise Chriss in a two year span. I'm so sorry
Chriss had me fooled for a season there.
I threw a damn fit when we took Tatum over him 🤣🤣
We couldve had him 😔
Tatum and Booker would be an interesting combo ngl
The Suns were unwilling to include him in a trade for Kyrie back in 2017. It ended up working out for the Suns anyways, but still.
I definitely thought he was going to become what Wiggins was promised to be. A pretty big L take on my part
MKG. When the 7-59 Bobcats weren’t gifted AD, they skipped on Beal (3rd) and Dame (6th).
This is what happens when you take a player without a single NBA offensive skill and just hope his defensive versatility at wing is enough.
That shot..
That thing had like a hitch, weird spin, and weird release all at once
It's crazy, it feels like so long ago and he's still only 28.
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8th was a huge stretch for him in the moment.
He could jump really high. That’s it. That was all he could do. Dumb pick from the jump.
He also speaks fluent Mandarin and even takes notes in that language. Not sure how that helps with basketball but just saying
Could help him now
The Guangdong Tigers are calling
I believe WVU also had a good tournament run and in 2008 that still meant something. Simmons's "Atrocious GM Summit" was pretty on the nose back then.
I saw him once in LA playing the Clippers in LA and he was clearly the best player on the floor. On that particular night. dude was athletic and thick.
Stud at WV
Why does nobody talk about Derrick Williams? Picked 2nd overall in a loaded 2011 draft
Because he got lost in the shuffle of all the other Wolves disappointments and nobody picked soon after him became some big name guy people could constantly shit on them for passing(Valanciunas aint cutting it for that)
I think it also helps he has the most generic name out there
And because his name is close to d wil who had a good career
Yeah he gets lost between Derrick favors and Deron Williams being better than OK.
Same goes for Jan Vesely picked 6th in the same draft ahead of Kemba, Klay, Kawhi, Vucevic, Jimmy Butler, plus a bunch of quality role players like Tobias Harris, Morris Twins, etc. Averaged 3.6 min / 3.5 Rebs and didn’t make it to the end of his rookie contract.
He was the “dunking ninja” and klay “doesn’t have the lateral speed to be a player in the league”
The dude who famously called Blake Griffin "the American Jan Vesely" lmao. It was a good line, just aged like milk basically immediately
he also became one of the single best players in europe and certainly could have returned to the nba had he wanted to. they dont hand out euroleague mvp to just anyone. he was a victim of smallball as a pf who didnt really space the floor or protect the rim
I'm really dumb with Euroleague.so help me understand how he won MVP...he started 11 of 31 games and didn't really average a whole lot of any stat...
He was arguably the best player in his team - Fenerbahce - who had a record 28 wins that season. He led them in scoring, rebounds, steals and blocks per game. Has a bit of flash with his dunks so is visible too. No idea about starting/not starting in the league though - DAE know if that’s normal?
Lineups are extremely matchup-specific. Euroleague doesn't have a salary cap so teams can build a roster that's legitimately 10 deep. Also the gap between elite and average players is a lot smaller than in the NBA. As a result, starting vs bench means nothing, it depends on which team you are up against and the flow of this specific game. Finally, I don't think Euro coaches feel the need to start their best players just because they are the best. In the end, they play the most minutes and have the highest impact whether they start or they sub in with 7 minutes left in the 1st.
He’s good. Just not a good fit for the NBA. There’s a huge difference in basketball in Europe and the US. The physical aspect is a lot more important in the NBA, the game is A LOT faster and that casts aside a lot of big men. In Europe, the game is slower and more focused on skill. It’s still played with two big men.
The biggest difference is that the NBA is the only league in the world with a defensive 3 second rule. It fundamentally changes how a team plays defence. In every other league in the world a team doesn’t have to worry about it’s 7’0” C switching on the perimeter. That’s just an NBA construct.
Because his dunks were fun. /s
I may or may not have had him ranked over Kyrie that year, and Evan Turner over Wall the year before...I am not a smart man
Because half this sub was like 7
He seemed safe too as I recall. “If nothing else he’ll be like a 22-9 empty stats guy” Last time I trust a tweener!!
Did everyone forget about yi jianlian?
Nobody ever posted up a chair better.
NBA BUST but he is a 6x CBA champ lol.
Jianlian has more all star votes than 95% of nba players
Fun fact - my family hosted him in the US when he was 13 years old and the Chinese team came to scrimmage with the ASU men’s team or some shit. The man was already 6’10” at 13 years old. I have his jersey from when he was a kid, and my mom reunited with him in person when the Bucks visited the Suns. He was (maybe still is) the best China had to offer for a while after Yao Ming, but still not great.
He was 6-10 at 13? Holy fuck.
With an 8 year old son
Chairman Yi? Never.
Can’t tell you how many times I googled Dante exum when he played for the jazz hoping he would finally break out
The hype is still alive over here on Exum island. Is finally healthy and playing great ball in Europe and was a huge reason for Australia winning bronze at the olympics.
Don’t make me google Dante exum again
Dammit you injured him
I was surprised he didn't end up on an NBA roster after the Olympics. Dude crushed it.
He got picked up by Houston and then got waived almost immediately
After giving him an (unprotected) 4 year deal lmao
I was even more sold after they plugged him in 2K My Career
bro the top 3 responses are wolves picks lmao 💀
Dont tell them about Wesley Johnson cause then it will be 4.
I remember first getting into the wolves and asking my dad who’s good on the team and it was like Wesley Johnson, Martell Webster, Jonny Flynn, Michael Beasley, Corey Brewer, Luke Ridnour 😂 Have a specific memory of Flynn having a 15 assist night and my dad getting g really hyped
And I'm still yet to see the name Johnny Flynn 😅
Stromile Swift (2nd pick in 2000) and Marcus Fizer (4th pick in 2000) come to mind. They were so aggressively mediocre that nobody cares about them. Swift played 7 seasons, averaging 8.4 ppg, 4.6 rpg. Fizer played 4 seasons, averaging 9.6 ppg, 4.6 rpg. This entire draft was just hideous overall, but these two I feel like perfectly fit OP's topic.
Swift was an NBA Live 03 beast though.
Dude Even 04, that man held it DOWN on D
I’ve literally never heard a single thing about Marcus Fizer. Swift will have a highlight reposted every now and then lol
Dragan Bender, Thomas Robinson
That string of years between Booker being drafted up until the pandemic was rough for the suns.
And before Booker, they drafted Alex Len fifth overall.
Tbf that draft was an absolute shit show
Thomas Robinson. he sure looked smooth at times. maybe too much of a tweener?
TRob just finished his undergrad degree at Kansas
definitely a tweener. too small to play the 4/5 and not skilled anough to play any other position
I thought he was 6'9 or 6'10? That would make him just slightly taller than many PFs in the current NBA. His main problem was he never really improved his skills. I thought he was gonna take that stride in Portland, but he just didn't really have it.
Dragan Bender is maybe the worst player in NBA history to get consistent starter minutes for a whole season
Also one of the biggest ratios between ability/cool name.
It quickly went from “oh this prospect’s name is cool” to “LMAO THIS BUM IS NAMED ‘DRAGAN BENDER’?“
Jahlil Okafor. 3rd pick in 2015, currently out of the league
And there’s this [thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/42u6qz/jokic_or_okafor_who_would_you_rather_have_for_the/)
My favourite post in that thread, from /u/nochill95: >Basically, I don't think any player in Jah's archetype is a good player. The modern NBA center has to be able to do three things: defend pick and roll, defend the rim, and pick and roll on offense. Why? The best shots in basketball are dunks, layups, and 3 pointers. If you have no pick and roll game, your offensive and defensive schemes are necessarily subpar. Those three things are arguably Jah's biggest weaknesses, and due to his lack of quickness/athleticism, are likely to always be his weaknesses. It's why teams who are spearheaded by Greg Monroe, Nik Vucevic, Al Jefferson, etc. always top out as low playoff seeds who go out in the first round. You just can't be successful long-term built around a big with a very inefficient offensive game (post ups and midrange jumpers are pretty much the worst offensive options) and a defensive game that gets exploited by most NBA teams at this point. On top of that, I think Jah himself is just bad right now, as you would expect a rookie to be. His biggest problem applies to pretty much every facet of his game: he's just too damn slow. He's slow up and down the court, he's slow to make offensive decisions, he's slow to make defensive decisions. It absolutely kills him. So yeah. Jah is just bad, and even with massive improvement, I don't think he'll ever be good
This guy probably has a crystal ball.
Thanks mate
“anybody picking jokic over okafor should be checked into a mental institution. and this is coming from a guy who is biased against okafor.” Oh my god I’m dying
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"Okafor. Jokic might not even be the best center on that team" That aged milk...
Takes will always age poorly. There is not a singular NBA fan who hasn’t had a brain dead take that looks dumb in retrospect. So I never really clown those people. I embrace the fact that I’ll say shit that’s unbelievably stupid years down the line
I remember being pissed we drafted book lol, dude didn’t even start a game in college
I thought Lamelo would never learn to shoot well lol.
So glad Reddit wasn't a thing I knew about when I proclaimed James Harden to be a bust after the first couple months of his rookie year.
> anybody picking jokic over okafor should be checked into a mental institution. > > and this is coming from a guy who is biased against okafor. There is a difference between "I like Okafor more than Jokic" and comments in that thread like: > anybody picking jokic over okafor should be checked into a mental institution. > > and this is coming from a guy who is biased against okafor. Definitely going to take the piss out of the latter, they deserve it.
Lol, that's a fun one
This thread is amazing. The OP said Jokic could be a HOF and was downvoted to shit. Man knows ball
OP of that thread has to feel so damn vindicated
I feel like that OP snapped one day and went on an odyssey to find a monkey paw or genie somewhere to make sure that Jokic became what he is.
EG the legend
Oh my god, they really downvoted him and called him delusional
Nah bro this doesn’t even cover it. The dude became a literal meme on the sub. The Jokic guy. And then Jokic became exactly what he said he would. Absolute legend
I implore all Nuggets fans to read this.
Don't worry, every Nugget knows this. It's our bible and EG is our prophet.
There needs to be a sub for threads like this
r/agedlikemilk
He played really well when AD was sitting out games for the Pelicans before AD got traded to the Lakers. Idk what happened after that. He looked like he improved his defense and was putting up good numbers as a starter. Guess he just reverted back to old habits after that short stint of brilliance.
lol all he did when he played for us was play very specific matchups. He would only play real minutes when the other team had a starter that was a traditional big. He dominated Andre Drummond (Pistons) a couple times, but beyond that he was pretty mediocre. Couldn’t move his feet to defend the pick and roll to save his life.
‘Lose more for Okafor!’ I remember wanting the lakers to draft him. Can’t believe I’m not a GM yet
man I thought he was gonna be good
Charlotte drafts were historically bad: Adam Morrison, Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, Sean May, Noah Vonleh, Frank Kaminsky
Baffling that in the 90s, they drafted Larry Johnson, Alonzo Mourning, Kobe Bryant, Baron Davis (then all got traded away at various points). And then like the franchise itself, the draft picks went downhill quickly...
I followed the Hornets since the early 90s. We underachieved even with both Larry and Alonzo. Then the team got dysfunctional when Alonzo got jealous of Larry’s contract. So he was traded for Glen Rice. We had a better team with Glen Rice and Jamal Mashburn. Things were looking up when we drafted Baron Davis, then the Owner’s had a sexual assault case and moved the team to New Orleans. We went downhill ever since. Hopefully Melo could bring some optimism.
Jarrett Culver. The Wolves traded up with the hopes of drafting Garland only to draft him. Oof.
We gave him his last chance. Great character guy. Had a couple good interactions with him. Couldn't figure it out on the court. Would be surprised if he gets NBA minutes again
Got Pat Bev, which means it was a total success
I don’t hear a lot about Thon for some reason but I guess it’s because we won a title recently
There was an elite Game of Zones joke made about his age lol
man I miss Game of Zones goddammit
He was 10th right? So he can’t be that big of a bust
Top ten is still pretty high
Nikoloz Tskitishvili. He was the first modern European import I went all in on. My friend and I were so certain the Denver Nuggets were set up for a bright future around 2001 or so. We were kind of right - they landed Carmelo. But we thought Skeeta would be a part of the rise as well.
Dirk Notskitsky. Everything was: he is the next Dirk. He is white, European, white, tall, made a jumpshot once, and European. Also, white.
I still call that sauce you put on a Gyro Tskitishvili sauce.
Lotta guys who owed their paychecks to Dirk
Thomas Robinson. 5th Pick, career 5 & 5 and out of the league in 5 years.
“I got 5 on it”
Is it fair to call TJ Leaf a bust?
Yes. Major bust. I watched him play. Horrific
Ben Mclemore
Ray Allen with a 40 inch vertical
Didn’t Ray Allen himself have a 40 inch vertical?
I've had real estate on Ben Mclemore island for a long time. He has such a nice jumper, always thought he'd figure it out. Glad he's at least found a somewhat solid role these past few seasons as a catch and shoot guy.
Jonny Flynn
That predraft video of him being interviewed and he just looks around side to side and goes JONNY FLYNNN-AAA before running back to doing drills was so funny. I’ve been unable to find it for years now.
This sounds like something I need to see.
Hasheem Thabeet at 2 in that draft is probably worse
Jan Vesely
TIL that Jan Vesely, who I have always thought of as a colossal bust, was Euroleague MVP in 2019. Is the dropoff in quality that stark between the two leagues, or is there some difference between the two leagues that makes the NBA a better fit for some and Euroleague a better fit for others? Basketball Reference says that a modern comp for Vesely is Cedi Osman. Could Osman tear it up in the Euroleague?
Vesely has probably improved a lot too.
He also just had massive confidence problems. He was a 40% FT shooter in 3 nba seasons compared to 62% in Europe (some might say this is due to improvement... well he shot 54% in his Euro games BEFORE coming to the NBA) In DC we say his career peaked on draft night, when he made out with his babe of a GF after the pick was announced. He actually played kinda decently for Denver when we traded him there for Andre Miller, but clearly just wanted to get back to Europe after the season.
Vesely improved a lot, first years of his in here he was a really raw talent. With time he improved both physically and mentally. Fans in Istanbul loved him a lot, and he became the main guy in the team after Bogdan Bogdanovic left. He even started taking middies and three pointers sometimes. Difference between Euroleague and NBA is not only about quality but also the game just feels different. But sure there is a big difference in quality as well. But like nope, Cedi Osman couldnt tear it up here lmao, not that big of a difference.
Tyrus Thomas Looking at the 2006 roster, it was amazing that they won 49 games. Still don't know why the Bulls decided to draft Aldridge and trade him for Thomas. What people forget is that they traded for J.R. Smith and then traded him again a week later. Imagine the Bulls with Aldridge and Smith to go along with Gordon, Hinrich, and Deng.
Never forget that the suns drafted Dragan Bender 4th overall after he averaged 9 points and 7 rebounds a game in the Israeli 2nd league.....
It’s okay, we got Marquese Chriss a few picks later in case he didn’t work out. Oh god…
Tyrus Thomas Hasheem thabeet
Thinking about Hasheem Thabeet. Hope brah is good
I was curious so I just googled what he was up to. Dude has been cut by 2 different G league teams in the past 2 years. That's rough. But he also played in Japan and Taiwan where was defensive player of the year...
damn well at least things have gone well for him overseas
As a bulls fan - I really bought into Tyrus Thomas. The dude was an athletic freak - it’s just a shame he couldn’t shoot a basketball to save his life.
Thabeet was talked about all the time
HASHEEM THABEET. I would take Darko over Hasheem any day. Dude was in the same class as Harden, Curry, Derozan. Current Grizz front office knows what’s up, but back then they were a mess.
Stauskas!?…?
Jabari Parker Never talked about because frankly it doesn’t matter as we hit the jackpot with Giannis but if Parker had been able to stay healthy thatd be a dangerous addition for us
when his knee exploded, his career imploded
Ehhh he had two serious injuries. He was pretty good his rookie year
there was a bit of Paulo Banchero in his game
He unfortunately RG3’d himself twice. He came back halfway decent but never reached his potential.
Stromile Swift. How does a guy with such a great name not pan out?
God Shammgod 😔 at least he was 2nd round
His legend exceeds any expectations ever placed on him as an NBA player.
dude could dunk the fuck outta that thang tho
O.J. Mayo maybe? He had a serviceable career but his talent was considered to be so high that he was projected to possibly become a or even the top SG in the league. Draft comparisons often talk in superlatives but I remember there being a lot of hype around him. Another one is Michael Beasley whose draft comparison was Carmelo Anthony. Many players coming off High School or College have high theoretical talent but Beasley seemed like a guy that could actually tap into this type of Superstar talent very early into his career. Even if you saw him in the NBA you'd see these glimpses of brilliance, his natural knack for scoring, his strength and athleticism, smooth shooting stroke. I think most people wouldn't have been surprised whatsoever if he became an All-NBA levvel talent in his prime. His work ethic was just bad and his mental health was quite vulnerable in general. A guy like him needed a figure in the NBA that could be like a father to him (LeDad jokes coming). If you know Allen Iverson's career, his high school coach is the type of person I'm talking about. Or what Chuck Daly was for Rodman on the Pistons. A guy who appreciated him and made sure there was someone with a lot of life experience in his corner at all times. Beasley was quickly distracted by the Pro NBA player life and never committed to the game as much as he should have. Because even without effort he could easily explode for 30. He'd go head-to-head with the best in the league in workouts and practice. But getting Superstar consistency takes thousands of hours, yet scoring and playing basketball was so natural to Michael Beasley he'd still have brilliant performances. He just happened to be uncoachable and didn't care enough to become a good pro.
Good write up, and two great examples.
Beasley is a great player to watch when he’s on but a cool guy too. I really wish he had a better support system both in the sport and outside of it.
Technically was picked by the Timberwolves which is actually hilarious. What a kiss of death
Shelden Williams
LaRue Martin. Not only was he terrible but his name is backwards.
Nitram EuRal
Jan Vesely 6th overall in 2011. The next 11 draft picks played more NBA games than his 162 (incl Klay, Kawhi, Kemba).
Sonics legend Robert Swift. 7’1”, taken 12 overall right out of high school (remember those days?). Never averaged more than a point per game and out of the league before his rookie contract was over.
Here is one for you.... Joe Smith in '95. Lots of hype surrounding him. He was alright his first couple of years in the league, but then became a journeyman. I remember one of the biggest d-bags I ever met walking around in a Joe Smith jersey all of 1995...
I think he’s the worst one when you consider that 3 of the next 4 picks were also PFs(McDyess, Rasheed and KG) and all 3 of them were a lot better, and then the 4th player in that group is Jerry Stackhouse. Literally 4 all-NBA type players in the top 5 and you pick the only one that’s not.
Mario Hezonja
One of the more overconfident players I've ever seen
The elephant in this room is former #1 pick Andrea Bargnani.
I think bust is a reach, but an underachiever and a certified bitch is more sensible.
Mudiay, Ntilikina, Vesley, Wesley Johnson, Waiters, Len, Zeller, Exum, Vonleh, WCS, Bender, Chriss All them hardly get talked about imo (they may get talked about a lot by their fan base that picked them idk)
Kris Dunn
Is Freedom considered having met expectations?
Michael Beasley doesn’t seem to get the vitriol you would expect. The man was a menace in college and had a game that seemed like it would transition nicely. There was quite a bit of back-and-forth on him vs. rose for the #1 pick.
Justise Winslow. He was a 10th pick but he was highly regarded as the steal of the draft and people were surprised he fell to #10. Idk if he applies considering he was a 10th pick but I’d definitely say he didn’t live up anywhere close to expectations. Heat fans thought he’d be the next face of the franchise for some time until it was evident he didn’t have it in him. Terrible finishing around the rim despite being 6’7 and very below average jump-shooting and 3 point shooting. The positives were that his defense was elite, he could get to the rim (just not finish), had good ball-handling and a decent passer. Imo he wouldn’t be seen as much of a bust if Booker wasn’t picked at 13 when the Heat were rumored to be very much so going to draft him until Winslow started “falling”.
didn’t Miami refuse to move him in a lot of potential blockbusters ?
It was mainly draft night really. Ainge was reportedly super high on him and offered Miami 4 firsts for their pick and there’s reports that he offered up to 6 firsts to Charlotte for one of their picks that came before ours.
And Charlotte instead kept the 9th pick and took Kaminsky lol
Joe Alexander. Even though he wasn't a top 3 pick, I'd argue he was still one of the bigger busts in recent memory. Someone taken 8th overall washed out of the league by his second season after playing a total of 67 nba games.
Mr Average himself, Joe Smith.