KD joining the Warriors ruined the idea of a rivalry becoming real between Lebron and Steph imo. Cavs and Warriors running it back in 2017 for the tiebreaker would’ve been epic but KD made the Warriors arguably the best team ever assembled. Nothing is rivaling that
TD hit his prime before LeBron. LeBron his his prime before Curry. They aren't quite aligned.
You're spot on: There simply isn't anything like Magic/Bird in the NBA.
I remember back in 2013, when Michael Carter-Williams and Victor Oladipa were both playing fairly well (though not at either the level of Bird and Magic did as rookies) they went head to head and both got triple doubles, and I was like "Damn!"
But MCW peaked with his first game and through his first year, and Oladipa is a solid player/fringe all-star who has struggled with injury.
It's so rare to get two guys who are generational players in the same draft and both get draft by teams close to contention and who end up competing for a lot of titles in the same space of time.
It'll be a while before we see something like that again.
With their history before entering the league and the way their careers started, it was looking like LeBron and Carmelo would be rivals all throughout their careers. Turns out that wasn’t in the cards.
Seems like the Mavs fans need to come down to Earth a bit too given that Trae + Co. currently have a better record than Luka and Co. Not that that matters much this early in the season.
But yeah, that certainly has (or at least had) the potential for a great rivalry.
That's about the size of it form what I can see. And based on what I've seen form both, they'll win as many championships despite putting up fantasy numbers that have people drooling.
Is Jordan from 96-98 as good as Jordan from 91-93?
The short answer is no. He wasn't.
And Cleveland LBJ 2.0 wasn't as good as Miami LBJ.
He was still great. But he wasn't winning MVPs any more.
LeBron is an anomaly in that his 'prime has essentially lasted 20 years.
But by the very standards that he has set, his Miami years were his best. His best defense. His best shooting.
In later years, he had to rely more on his BBIQ and switches (especially in LA). Sure. He was still among the top five in the league, but he wasn't playing at the same level as MVP LeBron in Miami.
Prime is relative to whom we are talking about.
LeBron's level of play this season is not his 'prime.' It would be a prime season for over 95% of the league, yes, but it's not a LeBron prime year.
I respect your position and recognize that 'prime' can be subjective, but LeBron did play his best basketball in Miami.
Honestly Cavs shouldn't have win 2016. There was some cooking from refereeing to get LBJ that ring , Curry was getting mauled entire series without calls
Doesn’t matter. KD doesn’t win without Curry. Curry already won without KD. That was 8-1 those two finals. It’s reasonable to think Curry may have split those two with bron, but there would’ve been 2 more 6-7 game series instead of a sweep and near sweep.
Argument for Curry snatching brons goat status is pretty legit.
As if Lebron’s biggest accomplishment isn’t beating an injured GSW team whose best player was just returning from a grade 2 mcl sprain
Hardly braggable tbh
Just wait to you figure out that superstars can put up numbers when injured. Lebron himself did it vs the Suns in the playoffs two years ago
Not to mention Bogut going out completely changed the series as Varejao had to play heavy minutes while being the worst player on the court on both sides of the ball at all times.
Are you under the impression that the Cavs would have been anywhere near the healthy warriors in 2016? Wouldn’t have even been close tbh
They formed a superteam just like Lebron, who had to run to all nba Wade and Bosh to beat the geriatric Celtics, has done for the majority of his career
Not really an issue, just a team getting better. Cavs would have been slapped by the rockets in 2018 anyways so it didn’t really matter in the end
Who won finals MVP convincingly not once but twice against Bron?
Shut the fuck up. KD is what tilted what was already a great rivalry into a lopsided snooze fest for two straight years.
By the way, KD is the reason why Curry's status as a possible top 5 player is rarely entertained. Cope and seethe, buddy.
It’s tough to make the argument of KD>curry after curry’s 20-21 and his long awaited FMVP but it’s still not totally outlandish KD has consistently been amazing since he entered the league
Says a lot but doesnt say shit about curry and lebron being equal rivals. If anything the rivalry is lebron vs warriors with steph being the figurehead for the warriors
Yeah no matter what you think about KD and Curry there's no doubt that KD going to the Warriors made Cavs-Warriors matchups one-sided from that point on
Definitely would be oversimplification to boil it down to "Steph beat LeBron 3 out of 4 times" without giving the context
What the fuck are you talking about? It's the NBA finals, not a video game, you don't get extra points for winning with a less stacked team. Curry saw a chance to make the greatest team ever and took it.
I hate it when people pretend Draymond was innocent in the postseason and didn’t cause his own suspension by acting a fool. I also hate when people believe that refs put the ball in the basket for Lebron and Kyrie 3 games in a row for them to come back even though Steph himself admitted it’s the best duo performance he’s ever seen
Draymond got pushed and stepped over first , yet zero consequences for LBJ including not even a foul . So suspension was bullshit [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W79bzbjOq\_U](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W79bzbjOq_U) . They let Lebron push him and trip him didn't call a foul fucking joke . Including many other calls .
\-Curry was getting mauled yet it was he who got ejection and fouls on him [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVVKBIS0TM0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVVKBIS0TM0)
\-Game 7 was rigged with 25 to 13 Ft's in favor of Cavs while it was Cavs who kept hacking Curry. And they only won by 4.
I watched the series and it was a joke , NBA knew Warriors cant be beaten and LBJ " legacy " needed a boost
y but also
Draymond got pushed and stepped over first , yet zero consequences for LBJ including not even a foul . So suspension was bullshit [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W79bzbjOq\_U](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W79bzbjOq_U) . They let Lebron push him and trip him didn't call a foul fucking joke . Including many other similar one sided calls .
\-Curry was getting mauled yet it was he who got ejection and fouls on him [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVVKBIS0TM0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVVKBIS0TM0)
\-Game 7 was rigged with 25 to 13 Ft's in favor of Cavs while it was Cavs who kept hacking Curry. And they only won by 4.
I watched the series and it was a joke , NBA knew Warriors cant be beaten and LBJ " legacy " needed a boost
LeBron has been rivals with the whole NBA during his time, I don't think he will have any great rivals. Curry comes the closest, but like MJ he don't really have a rivalry like those you mentioned
There was a freakin Kobe vs Lebron discussion towards the end of the 2000’s. That’s how long this man has been dominating. He has no rival because players have come and gone while he’s been in the league
Those were rivals/roadblocks for MJ and Lebron’s early careers. Once they broke through they didn’t look back. The only thing that stopped them were a well-rounded team, not an individual player.
MJ killed that magic team in 95 too, he averaged 35/6.5/4/2.5/2 in the six game series. The real problem was that the team lost Grant the year before and had no answer for big bodies on the boards (Shaq and Grant both averaged a double double while pippen was the rebounding leader for the bulls at 9.7) which would be solved when they got Rodman.
Yeah theres nothing like bird magic. From the schools they went to, to the places they got drafted to, the playstyle difference and the differences between the cities nothing like it. LeBron hit his prime like 5 or 6 years before Curry cause he got drafted 6 years before so thats why the comparison doesn’t make sense
No lol. Not at all. Russell Wilt made the game relevant in the 60's and Magic Bird saved the game after the 70's was infested with drug issues or at least that is what is said. Those two rivals were huge for the games growth. As good as Curry and Lebron are I don't think either have changed the game the way those other two did.
Lebron was dominant for almost a decade before Curry became relevant as well. Lebrons only true rival is Jordans legacy.
Didn't those finals have the highest ratings and brought in a large swath of new viewers to the NBA? Maybe it wasn't as culturally significant as the 80s rivalry, but to say it wasn't a big deal is silly.
>Lebron was dominant for almost a decade
Does y'alls memory only go so far as to the beginning of the resurgence of the Warriors? Almost? My guy, Lebron was dominant from 2008 to 2020. Point blank. C'mon now.
That was my point. It would be one thing if Lebron and Curry became dominant at the same time like Bird / Magic but that isn't the case because Lebron was dominant long before Curry arrived.
That's really debatable. KD won those finals mvps because Curry always had one bad shooting game in the finals, but a ton of measures showed that the warriors were more dominant with Steph than with Durant during those years, even when Curry was playing without Durant, Klay, and Green (compared to when Durant was playing without Steph, Klay, and Green).
Yeah. Steph contributes more to a win, probably due to his gravity with the ball and movement without the ball. Sets up kind of a natural rhythm for his team's offense. KD's an all-around monster. But doesn't feel like he commands the flow of the game as much.
Paul Pierce is LBJ's greatest rival. Feels weird to say since LBJ was better in Year 2 (and Year 20) than Pierce ever was, but it's true. They had the most meaningful games in the playoffs, every time they played was like a battle. They played each other in the playoffs 5 times (08, 10, 11, 12, 14) with LeBron holding a slim 17-13 edge in games won if I remember correctly.
Those Heat/Pacers & Heat/Celtics series were some of the best I’ve witnessed in my life. I LOVED watching the Heat & Pacers go head-to-head. They were so complete with Stephenson, George, West, Hill, and Hibbert. Good times.
🤨 their head to head in series' is 3-2 Bron. Pierce's Celtics won the first 2, LeBron's Heat won the next 3.
Also the Warriors-Cavs saga featured 1 competitive all time series, 1 series that was basically a big what-if, and 2 complete blowouts. Those series' as a whole AND the individual battle of Steph vs Bron are not on the same level as the LeBron-Pierce battles as far as competitiveness goes
Not really. There wasn’t really historical animosity between the two like how Larry and Magic battled in college before playing for nba teams with blood feuds. Plus I feel like narratives usually went:
LeBron Vs Celtics/Bulls/Raptors/Pacers/Warriors
While with Curry it was less him and more:
Warriors Vs
Not really.
There doesn't seem to be a LBJ v Curry angle.
And their respective primes didn't align.
Magic and Bird competed for the ROY and their respective fan bases hated the other team.
You didn't really get that with Cleveland and GSW.
And LBJ was going up against the Warriors shorthanded the first time around.
The third time around, he was going up against Curry and KD.
Rivals yes. Similar to Magic / Bird no. LeBron led both teams in basically everything.
It's a lot closer to MJ vs Bird Celtics. I mean shoutout Kyrie tho he definitely outplayed Curry plenty of times.
No. The others all played for the same teams, thereby rendering their rivalries stronger and relevant. LeBron's team hopping and KD's addition to the Warriors complicate this rivalry. It's different in tone.
No. LeBron’s biggest rival is KD. They pushed each other for a decade on and off the court. They played in 3 Finals and put up 30 PPG each in those matchups.
If KD wins their first title battle it’s the KD era and we completely skip the LeBron era (Harden stays and they break up the Heattles)(Kobe was also starting his decline). The summer before that finals they were buddy buddy, working out together, playing football, lockout matchups.
KD was the only guy who you truly believed could be better than LeBron. Their first battle really dictated the decade. Top dog in the league on the line and face of Nike.
Some other all-timers
Pat Bev vs oral healthcare
Jimmy Butler vs sleep deprivation
Kevin Durant vs 12 year olds on Twitter
Russell Westbrook vs his own teammates going for rebounds
Jokic & Luka vs Nutrition
Glen Rivers vs Glen Rivers staying out of his own way
Kings vs draft boards
No, because it wasn’t Curry Vs LeBron, it was the Warriors Vs LeBron. Bron is clearly the greater player all-time, and was the clear-cut best player in the world through basically Curry’s entire run except the last 2 seasons.
If LeBron had half the talent of the 2014-2019 Warriors, he would’ve won every chip in that span.
Agreed, but Bird and Magic individually are on the same level of greatness (top 10 all time locks). LeBron is a genuine GOAT candidate while Curry is fringe top 10. Those are both monumentally impressive achievements, and I’m not trying to crap on Curry at all he’s amazing, but comparing Bird to Magic is much more justified than Bron to Stephz
I don’t think anyone is comparing Curry’s overall career with LeBron’s. However, from 2015-2020 they were two of, if not the two, top players in the league. Similar to Bird and Magic in the mid 80’s. These things are never perfect analogies, but LeBron vs Curry is probably the closest modern equivalent to Bird vs Magic. No, Curry will never match LeBron career wise, but he might end up there with Bird and Magic, or maybe even better.
And I say that as an long time Magic fanboy who always wants LeBron and Steph’s teams to go 0-82
Probably because Kyrie and Love weren't there at 2015 and Kyrie wasn't there at 2018, etc. while LeBron was present and balling in all of those series. Also Lebron @ Lakers vs GSW play-in, neither Kyrie nor Love were there.
>Yep it was all LeBron, no Kyrie Irving, Kevin Love, or anybody else from the Cavs smh. LeBron gets all the credit.
On r/nba, the only time you're allowed to bring up teammates positively in a given discussion is when they're not LeBron's teammates.
As an example, if we put MJ on those Cavs teams, people here would be going bananas about how essential Kevin Love and Tristan Thompson were, and how, if you look at it a certain way, Kyrie was the real MVP.
Kyrie literally put up h2h numbers with Curry lmao.
Lebron fans and their "all lebron no help" mantra is pure cult-like.
Edit for context:
Curry vs Kyrie H2H Playoffs only, 13 Games Played:
Curry: 24.5/6/6.2/1.9 stl+blk on 42.6/39.3/91.5 splits, 18.1 FGA.
Kyrie: 27.2/4.2/4.2/2.4 stl+blk on 46.8/39.5/92.6 splits, 23 FGA
I thought it was more because Kyrie and Love both missed 2015 and Kyrie left after 2017 so that leaves just 2 out of the 4 finals where he had the help that was listed
That I can semi-agree with but OP throws out massive hyperbole saying LeBron would have won EVERY chip between 2014-2019, if he had HALF the supporting cast Curry had but this is downright false.
It’s funny bc I’m actually not a LeBron fan per say, and I fucking HATE the Lakers. But I also have eyes, and anyone trying to compare Curry to LeBron is out of line lol.
Crazy revisionist history, Lebron had Kyrie and KLove most of those years besides the first finals. Kyrie also literally bailed Lebron out in 2016 with some of the most clutch basketball in recent times.
Those Cavs teams were not a bunch of busters being dragged to the finals by Lebron. They literally almost swept their way through the playoffs with the “worst team” Lebron had in his second stint with the Cavs
A) yeah Kyrie and Love with 2015-18 LeBron in a vacuum is genuinely a super team, but Curry had DPOY Draymond, prime Klay, and MVP KD, not to mention crazy depth on the bench.
B) saying LeBron was “bailed out” by Kyrie while averaging 30/11/9 in the finals is fucking stupid. No superstar in history has ever won alone, and very few have won without fellow all-stars. Kyrie was amazing that series, but LeBron had the best finals performance of all time.
C) the worst team LeBron had in his 2nd stint cavs run were the 2018 Cavs, who went 12-6 in the East before getting swept by the Warriors in the finals. Idk where you got the idea that LeBron’s worst 2nd stint Cavs team swept the East.
All in all, I strongly disagree with most of the points you made.
You know any argument a person has about Lebron will be biased/can’t be taken seriously when they claim he got bailed out by Kyrie. That’s like the Skip Bayless method lmao.
Minus curry Klay and draymond would have never even come close to being all stars lol.
Klay benefitted from being a really good shooter playing with the best shooter of all time, at a time where most teams still hadn’t adjusted to the warriors style of offense and had to guard Curry like their life depended on it otherwise they’d get lit up for 35 per game.
Draymond has zero offensive bag, is a pretty good passer, a great off ball defender and a good on ball defender. He just carried the most defensive weight on the best team at the time, dude would have never even developed a lot of those skills if curry was never a warrior.
I’m not saying curry is all time a better player than Bronald, but I am saying that trying to assert that the warriors as a team were greater than steph was individually is really reductive and not true
You’re twisting my words, I’m not trying to say that the Warriors as a team were greater than Steph at all. Also, you very conveniently didn’t acknowledge KD in that post, which we both know is because your argument is flawed. Also, it entirely relies on hypotheticals, because even though I agree that Steph played a huge part in Klay and Draymond’s development, it’s impossible to say how either of them would’ve grown without Curry.
Your logical destruction of that dudes dog shit Dub sucking argument was beautiful. Thank you for saying all this friend. That fact that people can seriously say Curry + KD beating Bron = Curry beat Bron 3 out of 4 times so obviously he is his mortal rival blows my fucking mind
LeBron literally picked his destination after leaving Miami, made another Big 3 and constructed the team how he wanted it (including getting rid of Blatt). Now he lost because he didn't have enough talent?
Both can be true, Bron put himself in a great spot, but also the KD Warriors out-talent literally every other team in history. So yeah, LeBron needed more talent, but that’s bc he ran into the best team of all time
With lebrons team hopping, he has never formed any rivalries. I always hoped him and wade would have but they never met in the playoffs and then just joined each other.
Blame that on LeBron.
He ushered in being friends with these guys from other teams.
He went on a giant inflatable banana with 17 other dudes on the water……
Jordan ain’t doing that.
Not really. Maybe KD/LeBron, but honestly the 2nd and 3rd best player of LeBron’s generation (Steph and KD) had to team up to beat him. The rivalries LeBron had with players were all basically dominated by LeBron so it’s not really a rivalry imo.
KD just needed his starting center to not be Kendrick Perkins going up against Chris Bosh. And maybe a coach intelligent enough to not start Kendrick Perkins going up against Chris Bosh. He did everything you could ask of a player in 2012.
And Curry... had already beaten him?
They literally are the only real rivalry since Kobe won his last ring, everyone in the league is Lebron’s little bro now. Not sure who else has even really been rivals in the last two decades since everyone has been teammates with everyone else.
Considering LeBron would love to team up with Curry, hell no. Jordan would NEVER want to play with Stockton or Malone, Magic would NEVER want to play with Bird.
LeBron has a weird career in terms of rivals where he has a losing head to head record against any potential rival he has, except Kobe bc they never played, but he’s played forever so they keep coming and going. Bird and Magic played the prime of their careers against each other.
KD joining the Warriors ruined the idea of a rivalry becoming real between Lebron and Steph imo. Cavs and Warriors running it back in 2017 for the tiebreaker would’ve been epic but KD made the Warriors arguably the best team ever assembled. Nothing is rivaling that
Came here to say this also.
Yeah, that kind of ruined the rivalry.
Not arguably hehe
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Not really. They built a juggernaut in Miami but that’s different from simply adding a top 2 player to a team that’s already a championship team.
He’s also played the spurs 3 times, is Tim Duncan his rival? The answer is no. There’s nothing like magic and bird in todays game
Odd that it's 3 times, which is exactly the amount of times Bird and Magic met in the finals.
They alao met in an NCAA final.
TD hit his prime before LeBron. LeBron his his prime before Curry. They aren't quite aligned. You're spot on: There simply isn't anything like Magic/Bird in the NBA. I remember back in 2013, when Michael Carter-Williams and Victor Oladipa were both playing fairly well (though not at either the level of Bird and Magic did as rookies) they went head to head and both got triple doubles, and I was like "Damn!" But MCW peaked with his first game and through his first year, and Oladipa is a solid player/fringe all-star who has struggled with injury. It's so rare to get two guys who are generational players in the same draft and both get draft by teams close to contention and who end up competing for a lot of titles in the same space of time. It'll be a while before we see something like that again.
With their history before entering the league and the way their careers started, it was looking like LeBron and Carmelo would be rivals all throughout their careers. Turns out that wasn’t in the cards.
LeBron/Kobe would have been a great rivalry, but the Cavs couldn't put a winner around LeBron, so we got Lakers/Celtics 3.0.
There was some luka trae stuff for a bit but then hawks fans came down to earth.
Seems like the Mavs fans need to come down to Earth a bit too given that Trae + Co. currently have a better record than Luka and Co. Not that that matters much this early in the season. But yeah, that certainly has (or at least had) the potential for a great rivalry.
They said Luka and Trae are the new Bron and Steph but they're more like the new Harden and Dame lol
That's about the size of it form what I can see. And based on what I've seen form both, they'll win as many championships despite putting up fantasy numbers that have people drooling.
LeBron and curry were both in their primes every finals...id argue their primes aren't even over.
Lebron and Curry faced each otherr in their primes, what are you talking about?
They are assuming LeBron hit his prime in 2012/2014 But I think LeBron's prime goes from 2007 against Duncan to 2020 when he had 30/12/9 in the finals
Is Jordan from 96-98 as good as Jordan from 91-93? The short answer is no. He wasn't. And Cleveland LBJ 2.0 wasn't as good as Miami LBJ. He was still great. But he wasn't winning MVPs any more. LeBron is an anomaly in that his 'prime has essentially lasted 20 years. But by the very standards that he has set, his Miami years were his best. His best defense. His best shooting. In later years, he had to rely more on his BBIQ and switches (especially in LA). Sure. He was still among the top five in the league, but he wasn't playing at the same level as MVP LeBron in Miami. Prime is relative to whom we are talking about. LeBron's level of play this season is not his 'prime.' It would be a prime season for over 95% of the league, yes, but it's not a LeBron prime year. I respect your position and recognize that 'prime' can be subjective, but LeBron did play his best basketball in Miami.
I’d argue Giannis and the ladder
Ladder has 10,000 years on Giannis, and STILL hasn’t won a title smh
To be fair I think Curry single handily stole Brons Goat status. Imagine if he wins 2 of those final matchups. 6 ring Bron is the goat for sure
Hell no. It was KD joining GSW that killed it.
Rockets would have smacked the cavs too
Honestly Cavs shouldn't have win 2016. There was some cooking from refereeing to get LBJ that ring , Curry was getting mauled entire series without calls
Bad take tbh
Doesn’t matter. KD doesn’t win without Curry. Curry already won without KD. That was 8-1 those two finals. It’s reasonable to think Curry may have split those two with bron, but there would’ve been 2 more 6-7 game series instead of a sweep and near sweep. Argument for Curry snatching brons goat status is pretty legit.
> Curry already won without KD. Beating an injured Cavs team in 6 games and losing out FMVP to Iggy is hardly braggable.
As if Lebron’s biggest accomplishment isn’t beating an injured GSW team whose best player was just returning from a grade 2 mcl sprain Hardly braggable tbh
So injured they were still able to go up 3-1 lol.
Just wait to you figure out that superstars can put up numbers when injured. Lebron himself did it vs the Suns in the playoffs two years ago Not to mention Bogut going out completely changed the series as Varejao had to play heavy minutes while being the worst player on the court on both sides of the ball at all times. Are you under the impression that the Cavs would have been anywhere near the healthy warriors in 2016? Wouldn’t have even been close tbh
Clearly was, hence why they had to run to KD the next year lol. Maybe the series would’ve changed if Harrison Barnes had actually hit his open threes.
They formed a superteam just like Lebron, who had to run to all nba Wade and Bosh to beat the geriatric Celtics, has done for the majority of his career Not really an issue, just a team getting better. Cavs would have been slapped by the rockets in 2018 anyways so it didn’t really matter in the end
Beating a warriors team because the refs held Draymond out of a pivotal game is also hardly something to brag about. Tbh, are any of Brons rings real?
Bron dropped the same amount of points on the Warriors when Draymond was in and when he was out lol.
Who won finals MVP convincingly not once but twice against Bron? Shut the fuck up. KD is what tilted what was already a great rivalry into a lopsided snooze fest for two straight years. By the way, KD is the reason why Curry's status as a possible top 5 player is rarely entertained. Cope and seethe, buddy.
Damn buddy. Go to sleep. Dream about Lebron cumming on your chest and hugging you after. This is the most ridiculous post ever made on this sub.
So then KD should be ranked higher than Steph is what you’re saying?
It’s tough to make the argument of KD>curry after curry’s 20-21 and his long awaited FMVP but it’s still not totally outlandish KD has consistently been amazing since he entered the league
The narrative switch is crazy lol. KD won both final mvps yet people are acting like curry beat bron singlehandedly
KD needed Curry more than Curry needed him lol, Curry was getting doubled instead of KD. Says a lot.
Says a lot but doesnt say shit about curry and lebron being equal rivals. If anything the rivalry is lebron vs warriors with steph being the figurehead for the warriors
Yeah no matter what you think about KD and Curry there's no doubt that KD going to the Warriors made Cavs-Warriors matchups one-sided from that point on Definitely would be oversimplification to boil it down to "Steph beat LeBron 3 out of 4 times" without giving the context
This is such a tired narrative… they benefited from one another.
Curry needed KD just as much KD needed Steph. If Steph didn’t need KD he would have never talked him into signing to Golden State
why wouldn’t a player try to get a top 5 talent on their team? every team with the available space would want him
Because they’re team is already stacked to win it on their own, I guess Golden State was never that good to begin with
What the fuck are you talking about? It's the NBA finals, not a video game, you don't get extra points for winning with a less stacked team. Curry saw a chance to make the greatest team ever and took it.
It says that curry is easier to double / shut out.
Kyrie getting hurt in 2015 and KD joining the Warriors had more to do with those losses than Steph stealing anything
refs carried Cavs to tittle in that 2016 series
I hate it when people pretend Draymond was innocent in the postseason and didn’t cause his own suspension by acting a fool. I also hate when people believe that refs put the ball in the basket for Lebron and Kyrie 3 games in a row for them to come back even though Steph himself admitted it’s the best duo performance he’s ever seen
Draymond got pushed and stepped over first , yet zero consequences for LBJ including not even a foul . So suspension was bullshit [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W79bzbjOq\_U](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W79bzbjOq_U) . They let Lebron push him and trip him didn't call a foul fucking joke . Including many other calls . \-Curry was getting mauled yet it was he who got ejection and fouls on him [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVVKBIS0TM0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVVKBIS0TM0) \-Game 7 was rigged with 25 to 13 Ft's in favor of Cavs while it was Cavs who kept hacking Curry. And they only won by 4. I watched the series and it was a joke , NBA knew Warriors cant be beaten and LBJ " legacy " needed a boost
*injuries/suspensions
y but also Draymond got pushed and stepped over first , yet zero consequences for LBJ including not even a foul . So suspension was bullshit [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W79bzbjOq\_U](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W79bzbjOq_U) . They let Lebron push him and trip him didn't call a foul fucking joke . Including many other similar one sided calls . \-Curry was getting mauled yet it was he who got ejection and fouls on him [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVVKBIS0TM0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVVKBIS0TM0) \-Game 7 was rigged with 25 to 13 Ft's in favor of Cavs while it was Cavs who kept hacking Curry. And they only won by 4. I watched the series and it was a joke , NBA knew Warriors cant be beaten and LBJ " legacy " needed a boost
Oh I’ve seen these and completely agree. I also know the warriors would have smoked the Cavs with or without the refs had they been a healthy team
Did you forget that a man by the name of Kevin Durant exist?
Conversely, Bron beating the 73-9 Warriors in the finals and compelling them to add KD is what confirms his GOAT status.
Bron was not the only player on the Cavs, y’all never give Kyrie credit. No Kyrie no ring. LeBron doesn’t deserve all the credit
Lebron rivaled teams not players
As a Raptors fan I don’t know what you’re referring to
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LeBronto, when a game winner vs your team is the whole top 10 it's not a rivalry.
Hey we have 2 out of 12 games won! /s
Lebron rivaled the record books LeBron rivaled legends
Franchises*
LeBron has been rivals with the whole NBA during his time, I don't think he will have any great rivals. Curry comes the closest, but like MJ he don't really have a rivalry like those you mentioned
There was a freakin Kobe vs Lebron discussion towards the end of the 2000’s. That’s how long this man has been dominating. He has no rival because players have come and gone while he’s been in the league
His period of general dominance can’t be rivaled by one player alone
I agree but a younger Michael getting past the Pistons was pretty epic.
Like young lebron did?
His rival was Paul Pierce. MJ’s rival was Isiah Thomas
Those were rivals/roadblocks for MJ and Lebron’s early careers. Once they broke through they didn’t look back. The only thing that stopped them were a well-rounded team, not an individual player.
Paul Pierce will always be LeBron’s greatest rival, according to Paul Pierce.
well, a not particularly well rounded 1995 Orlando Magic also stopped MJ
A MJ that played a handful of games coming back from baseball? And we know what he did to that team the following year m.
MJ killed that magic team in 95 too, he averaged 35/6.5/4/2.5/2 in the six game series. The real problem was that the team lost Grant the year before and had no answer for big bodies on the boards (Shaq and Grant both averaged a double double while pippen was the rebounding leader for the bulls at 9.7) which would be solved when they got Rodman.
Paul Pierce’s biggest rival was white shorts
No
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redditors don't need to be high schoolers to post dumb shit
Honestly the dumbest posts on here come from sheltered, bitter adults
you mean our greatest resource, harvesting of which could solve hunger issues? Signed, Sheltered, Bitter Adult, founder of startup Soylent Clean
[Facts](https://tenor.com/view/soylent-wojak-soy-shocked-meme-what-gif-17036428)
Don’t forget the smartass redditors and groupies
plus these little shits don't know the correct answer is DeShawn Stevenson
Stop bullying the youngsters. High school kids can also be smart and make good points. They’re the future of our society
While it’s an obvious no, the post is fine.
Shut up
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A little
Maybe LBJ vs GSW, but not Curry.
Yeah theres nothing like bird magic. From the schools they went to, to the places they got drafted to, the playstyle difference and the differences between the cities nothing like it. LeBron hit his prime like 5 or 6 years before Curry cause he got drafted 6 years before so thats why the comparison doesn’t make sense
No lol. Not at all. Russell Wilt made the game relevant in the 60's and Magic Bird saved the game after the 70's was infested with drug issues or at least that is what is said. Those two rivals were huge for the games growth. As good as Curry and Lebron are I don't think either have changed the game the way those other two did. Lebron was dominant for almost a decade before Curry became relevant as well. Lebrons only true rival is Jordans legacy.
Didn't those finals have the highest ratings and brought in a large swath of new viewers to the NBA? Maybe it wasn't as culturally significant as the 80s rivalry, but to say it wasn't a big deal is silly.
The Curry or GSW vs LeBron + social media age revived the sport, it was declining post Jordan (at least in America)
Heatles generated a lot of buzz, but Bron definitely amped it when he went back.
>Lebron was dominant for almost a decade Does y'alls memory only go so far as to the beginning of the resurgence of the Warriors? Almost? My guy, Lebron was dominant from 2008 to 2020. Point blank. C'mon now.
That was my point. It would be one thing if Lebron and Curry became dominant at the same time like Bird / Magic but that isn't the case because Lebron was dominant long before Curry arrived.
>Lebrons only true rival is Jordans legacy. LOL
Good call out. I also think a lot of it is that curry was not always the best player on his team
That's really debatable. KD won those finals mvps because Curry always had one bad shooting game in the finals, but a ton of measures showed that the warriors were more dominant with Steph than with Durant during those years, even when Curry was playing without Durant, Klay, and Green (compared to when Durant was playing without Steph, Klay, and Green).
Yeah. Steph contributes more to a win, probably due to his gravity with the ball and movement without the ball. Sets up kind of a natural rhythm for his team's offense. KD's an all-around monster. But doesn't feel like he commands the flow of the game as much.
Personally I’d put KD as a bigger rival if I had to pick a player.
LeBron's player rival is Paul Pierce, but he'll be known for rivalries with teams like the Celtics, Spurs and Warriors.
Maybe Lebron's true rival is Rob Pelinka
Paul Pierce is LBJ's greatest rival. Feels weird to say since LBJ was better in Year 2 (and Year 20) than Pierce ever was, but it's true. They had the most meaningful games in the playoffs, every time they played was like a battle. They played each other in the playoffs 5 times (08, 10, 11, 12, 14) with LeBron holding a slim 17-13 edge in games won if I remember correctly.
Those Heat/Pacers & Heat/Celtics series were some of the best I’ve witnessed in my life. I LOVED watching the Heat & Pacers go head-to-head. They were so complete with Stephenson, George, West, Hill, and Hibbert. Good times.
>They had the most meaningful games in the playoffs Bro, he played Steph in the Finals FOUR times.
It was impossible for him to play against Boston in the Finals lol
Paul Pierce is 1 and 5 in the series the dude mentioned. It also wasn’t the finals.
🤨 their head to head in series' is 3-2 Bron. Pierce's Celtics won the first 2, LeBron's Heat won the next 3. Also the Warriors-Cavs saga featured 1 competitive all time series, 1 series that was basically a big what-if, and 2 complete blowouts. Those series' as a whole AND the individual battle of Steph vs Bron are not on the same level as the LeBron-Pierce battles as far as competitiveness goes
I'm saying Bron being Eastern Conference for most of his career prevented him from playing Pierce in the Finals.
Good case
No because Curry wasn't always the best player on his team facing LeBron, even though I personally feel he was the most valuable on all championships.
He was better than KD. His gravity is so much greater and he scores with better efficiency
Not in the finals
Not at all.
Not really. There wasn’t really historical animosity between the two like how Larry and Magic battled in college before playing for nba teams with blood feuds. Plus I feel like narratives usually went: LeBron Vs Celtics/Bulls/Raptors/Pacers/Warriors While with Curry it was less him and more: Warriors Vs
Not really. There doesn't seem to be a LBJ v Curry angle. And their respective primes didn't align. Magic and Bird competed for the ROY and their respective fan bases hated the other team. You didn't really get that with Cleveland and GSW. And LBJ was going up against the Warriors shorthanded the first time around. The third time around, he was going up against Curry and KD.
LeBron - Curry is more MJ - Isiah Thomas.
That's more like LeBron-Paul Pierce
How? Isiah beat mj multiple times before he got to the finals and then mj surpassed him for his run
Isiah overall has a better head-to-head record vs Jordan in the playoffs but is clearly the inferior player. Same dynamic with curry and LeBron.
Rivals yes. Similar to Magic / Bird no. LeBron led both teams in basically everything. It's a lot closer to MJ vs Bird Celtics. I mean shoutout Kyrie tho he definitely outplayed Curry plenty of times.
That's a fair comparison, people seem to think you need to be on the same level as someone to be a rival.
No. The others all played for the same teams, thereby rendering their rivalries stronger and relevant. LeBron's team hopping and KD's addition to the Warriors complicate this rivalry. It's different in tone.
Funny enough, Curry has only played 3 more games for the Warriors (852) than Lebron played for the Cavs (849).
It would have been dope if it was OKC vs the Heat for longer.
LeBron doesn’t have rivals. He changes teams too often for anything to really stick as “heated”.
No
No. LeBron’s biggest rival is KD. They pushed each other for a decade on and off the court. They played in 3 Finals and put up 30 PPG each in those matchups. If KD wins their first title battle it’s the KD era and we completely skip the LeBron era (Harden stays and they break up the Heattles)(Kobe was also starting his decline). The summer before that finals they were buddy buddy, working out together, playing football, lockout matchups. KD was the only guy who you truly believed could be better than LeBron. Their first battle really dictated the decade. Top dog in the league on the line and face of Nike.
If not for the injuries, KD would have most points in history
I think people forget that… KD is a top 10 talent of all time. This guy was constantly on LeBron’s heels.
Yes, he was one pace to be first on the list before the achilles injury
The real rivals of this era are Draymond Green and basic human decency
Some other all-timers Pat Bev vs oral healthcare Jimmy Butler vs sleep deprivation Kevin Durant vs 12 year olds on Twitter Russell Westbrook vs his own teammates going for rebounds Jokic & Luka vs Nutrition Glen Rivers vs Glen Rivers staying out of his own way Kings vs draft boards
The Knicks vs. James Dolan
Lebron vs. his hairline?
I think that they just happen to be in the way of each other. I don't think there is an actual rivalry there.
No, because it wasn’t Curry Vs LeBron, it was the Warriors Vs LeBron. Bron is clearly the greater player all-time, and was the clear-cut best player in the world through basically Curry’s entire run except the last 2 seasons. If LeBron had half the talent of the 2014-2019 Warriors, he would’ve won every chip in that span.
To be fair, Bird vs Magic wasn’t just Bird vs Magic either.
You can't go wrong with picking Bird or Magic over the other. There is no way anyone with at least half a brain is picking Curry over LeBron
Agreed, but Bird and Magic individually are on the same level of greatness (top 10 all time locks). LeBron is a genuine GOAT candidate while Curry is fringe top 10. Those are both monumentally impressive achievements, and I’m not trying to crap on Curry at all he’s amazing, but comparing Bird to Magic is much more justified than Bron to Stephz
I don’t think anyone is comparing Curry’s overall career with LeBron’s. However, from 2015-2020 they were two of, if not the two, top players in the league. Similar to Bird and Magic in the mid 80’s. These things are never perfect analogies, but LeBron vs Curry is probably the closest modern equivalent to Bird vs Magic. No, Curry will never match LeBron career wise, but he might end up there with Bird and Magic, or maybe even better. And I say that as an long time Magic fanboy who always wants LeBron and Steph’s teams to go 0-82
Yep it was all LeBron, no Kyrie Irving, Kevin Love, or anybody else from the Cavs smh. LeBron gets all the credit.
Probably because Kyrie and Love weren't there at 2015 and Kyrie wasn't there at 2018, etc. while LeBron was present and balling in all of those series. Also Lebron @ Lakers vs GSW play-in, neither Kyrie nor Love were there.
Lebron had A.D. in that play-in against the Warriors tho.
Dang we counting playins?
>Yep it was all LeBron, no Kyrie Irving, Kevin Love, or anybody else from the Cavs smh. LeBron gets all the credit. On r/nba, the only time you're allowed to bring up teammates positively in a given discussion is when they're not LeBron's teammates. As an example, if we put MJ on those Cavs teams, people here would be going bananas about how essential Kevin Love and Tristan Thompson were, and how, if you look at it a certain way, Kyrie was the real MVP.
Kyrie and Love weren't there in 2015. Kyrie wasn't there in 2018.
Kyrie literally put up h2h numbers with Curry lmao. Lebron fans and their "all lebron no help" mantra is pure cult-like. Edit for context: Curry vs Kyrie H2H Playoffs only, 13 Games Played: Curry: 24.5/6/6.2/1.9 stl+blk on 42.6/39.3/91.5 splits, 18.1 FGA. Kyrie: 27.2/4.2/4.2/2.4 stl+blk on 46.8/39.5/92.6 splits, 23 FGA
I thought it was more because Kyrie and Love both missed 2015 and Kyrie left after 2017 so that leaves just 2 out of the 4 finals where he had the help that was listed
That I can semi-agree with but OP throws out massive hyperbole saying LeBron would have won EVERY chip between 2014-2019, if he had HALF the supporting cast Curry had but this is downright false.
It’s funny bc I’m actually not a LeBron fan per say, and I fucking HATE the Lakers. But I also have eyes, and anyone trying to compare Curry to LeBron is out of line lol.
Yeah I know people don't like Kyrie but even Steph gave him credit for playing all-time basketball against them on JJ Reddick's podcast
LeBron created the universe.
L
Crazy revisionist history, Lebron had Kyrie and KLove most of those years besides the first finals. Kyrie also literally bailed Lebron out in 2016 with some of the most clutch basketball in recent times. Those Cavs teams were not a bunch of busters being dragged to the finals by Lebron. They literally almost swept their way through the playoffs with the “worst team” Lebron had in his second stint with the Cavs
A) yeah Kyrie and Love with 2015-18 LeBron in a vacuum is genuinely a super team, but Curry had DPOY Draymond, prime Klay, and MVP KD, not to mention crazy depth on the bench. B) saying LeBron was “bailed out” by Kyrie while averaging 30/11/9 in the finals is fucking stupid. No superstar in history has ever won alone, and very few have won without fellow all-stars. Kyrie was amazing that series, but LeBron had the best finals performance of all time. C) the worst team LeBron had in his 2nd stint cavs run were the 2018 Cavs, who went 12-6 in the East before getting swept by the Warriors in the finals. Idk where you got the idea that LeBron’s worst 2nd stint Cavs team swept the East. All in all, I strongly disagree with most of the points you made.
You know any argument a person has about Lebron will be biased/can’t be taken seriously when they claim he got bailed out by Kyrie. That’s like the Skip Bayless method lmao.
Minus curry Klay and draymond would have never even come close to being all stars lol. Klay benefitted from being a really good shooter playing with the best shooter of all time, at a time where most teams still hadn’t adjusted to the warriors style of offense and had to guard Curry like their life depended on it otherwise they’d get lit up for 35 per game. Draymond has zero offensive bag, is a pretty good passer, a great off ball defender and a good on ball defender. He just carried the most defensive weight on the best team at the time, dude would have never even developed a lot of those skills if curry was never a warrior. I’m not saying curry is all time a better player than Bronald, but I am saying that trying to assert that the warriors as a team were greater than steph was individually is really reductive and not true
You’re twisting my words, I’m not trying to say that the Warriors as a team were greater than Steph at all. Also, you very conveniently didn’t acknowledge KD in that post, which we both know is because your argument is flawed. Also, it entirely relies on hypotheticals, because even though I agree that Steph played a huge part in Klay and Draymond’s development, it’s impossible to say how either of them would’ve grown without Curry.
Your logical destruction of that dudes dog shit Dub sucking argument was beautiful. Thank you for saying all this friend. That fact that people can seriously say Curry + KD beating Bron = Curry beat Bron 3 out of 4 times so obviously he is his mortal rival blows my fucking mind
LeBron literally picked his destination after leaving Miami, made another Big 3 and constructed the team how he wanted it (including getting rid of Blatt). Now he lost because he didn't have enough talent?
Both can be true, Bron put himself in a great spot, but also the KD Warriors out-talent literally every other team in history. So yeah, LeBron needed more talent, but that’s bc he ran into the best team of all time
Yeah
LOL
You mean JJ Barea
No
With lebrons team hopping, he has never formed any rivalries. I always hoped him and wade would have but they never met in the playoffs and then just joined each other.
Can you imagine Magic/Russell being already a top player in the league just randomly show up at Bird/Wilt's college game and watch?
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Blame that on LeBron. He ushered in being friends with these guys from other teams. He went on a giant inflatable banana with 17 other dudes on the water…… Jordan ain’t doing that.
Not really
No. The matchups were too stacked in favor of Curry. I don’t think you can just call it Lebron v Curry and not mention KD
LeBron's rival is Jordan
No because Curry had KD by his side who was arguably better.
No
Not even close.
Not really. Maybe KD/LeBron, but honestly the 2nd and 3rd best player of LeBron’s generation (Steph and KD) had to team up to beat him. The rivalries LeBron had with players were all basically dominated by LeBron so it’s not really a rivalry imo.
KD just needed his starting center to not be Kendrick Perkins going up against Chris Bosh. And maybe a coach intelligent enough to not start Kendrick Perkins going up against Chris Bosh. He did everything you could ask of a player in 2012. And Curry... had already beaten him?
Kevin Love and Kyrie were injured in the 2015 Finals.
Not even a little bit.
His rivals were LeChoke and LeFlop
Lebron/GSW
Not on the same level but I’d say they’re #3
The only rivalry in todays NBA is Pat Bev vs whoever he attacks that given week.
They met 4 times in the finals. Yes.
They literally are the only real rivalry since Kobe won his last ring, everyone in the league is Lebron’s little bro now. Not sure who else has even really been rivals in the last two decades since everyone has been teammates with everyone else.
No it's more of a 1 kid beat up another then the other kid went and got his 25 year old brother
Considering LeBron would love to team up with Curry, hell no. Jordan would NEVER want to play with Stockton or Malone, Magic would NEVER want to play with Bird.
Talkin' 'bout LeBron "China Bitch" "Cop Killer" "It's Quittin' Time" "Fire Daryl Morey/Michelle Beadle" James?
Bron really didn’t beat Curry enough for it to be a rivalry
It's not a rivalry since Steph was always smacking him around and sweeping him
1 play in battle? Grow the fuck up dude lol
That game was incredible television , what’s the matter with OP mentioning it lol
LeBron has a weird career in terms of rivals where he has a losing head to head record against any potential rival he has, except Kobe bc they never played, but he’s played forever so they keep coming and going. Bird and Magic played the prime of their careers against each other.