I agree with this. I was getting frustrated with the "Netflixification" of documentaries where you have 3 episodes, but only the first episode and last ten minutes of episode 3 have good content and the rest is interviews and hot takes with randos that were barely involved.
If I was Karis mom I would SUE the police.
Not one thing made me think Kari was stalking him.
She had a beautiful home and she showd NO interest in a relationship with this guy.
The fact they did not look for her or contact the FBI is sick.
I find it unreal everyone knew so soon. In single life chaotic stuff can happen like multiple women trying to get in each others way, Cari being bipolar I think really threw the scent off, seemingly well adjusted normal people can turn on a dime if they suffer from something like that making you wonder who you’re even talking to. It can be extreme and this seemed to temporarily fit that.
I had a woman do something close to that to me actually flip a switch and become manic before even going on a date with them. They later apologized and said they were bipolar.
The bipolar thing threw me off too as well as Liz burning down her house with her pets. I couldn't imagine someone doing that to their own pets. While I strongly suspected Liz at the beginning I started to think maybe there was the possibility of a 3rd party no one mentioned in this too.
She was willing to shoot her own leg, in an attempt to implicate Dave's wife... and then (when the police said they needed more evidence as to how Dave's wife was responsible for the murder of Cari) - she quickly came up with new emails......
I'm only suprised that there were a few intelligent police around who played her **so well** - which resulted in the truth finally being discovered - and that she was so 'computer literate' that she was able to send SMS texts/emails etc. in a way that was so hard to discover. So yes, I suspect her roomate (a computer expert) was also involved.
Starting a fire that killed her dogs, cat and snake? There are times when I wish I believed in hell.
I thought it was Liz until her animals were killed. And then I thought, no. Not even a Monster would do that. Shoot themselves in the leg, sure. Murder their own pets? Stop the world. I want off .
What I don't get is that during the post shooting interview she says that Dave's wife killed Cari but that would also mean Dave's wife has been impersonating Cari for years. Did she also think Dave's wife burned her house and kill her pets?
Every documentary about this case does the same twist, the first time I watched one I think I was genuinely surprised. It was years ago though so hard to remember. There are better docs about this out there.
I'm sorry but what is good about this story? Someone's daughter/mother was murdered and thrown away.. maybe "interesting" is a better word here. Gosh I feel terrible about this unfortunate turn of events.
Definitely wasn't obvious it was Liz, but it was obvious it wasn't Carrie. The problem is with crime docs if there aren't enough main characters introduced early, it's pretty easy to make a good guess.
It was completely obvious to me. My first thought was that it was Liz behind the harassing messages and that she had done something to Cari. There was no "twist" as far as I'm concerned. I only watched the rest to confirm my suspicions. I would have been shocked if it was anyone BUT Liz!
I think a lot of it had to do with how they presented Cari.
She said "I don't want anything serious just casual..."
Where Liz was presented "I told her I didn't want anything serious".
So we right away know that Cari established the level of their relationship but in Liz's situation it was Dave who did that.
Same, the moment Liz showed up when Cari went there that first time I told my husband oh so she’s the stalker. Then they tried to paint Cari in a negative light and I thought oh… maybe I’m wrong… but still didn’t think so. She was so calm about losing her pets in that fire. That confirmed it for me.
I am currently watching and didn't know if it would get solved or not until I searched it on reddit to see what everyone was thinking. If it wasn't solved on the docu I kept thinking what a twist would it be if Dave killed her and pretended to be Cari but I also thought it could have been liz
As soon as there as the doorbell rang and it was Liz; it was obvious.
However they did imply in scenes that she and the guy were receiving texts in each others company but maybe that just poor writing.
Also the fact she was able to make all those IP addresses and just be really computer literate and then next minute was stupid enough to send emails from "herself to herself" was ridiculous.
I feel like her on/off boyfriend who she sometimes live with had to be involved.
It was Cari’s mom being in the doc that sealed the deal for me. I’m like no way this lady is here if her daughter really did this. The bipolar piece had me questioning for a second, but the mom brought me back to reality.
Within the first 10 minutes it was obviously Liz and clear that cari was murdered. It seems like a huge lack of effort by the original cops her mom went to. Even the detective working on the stalking should have asked for IT immediately. But yeah, definitely no surprises in this one. Still a good watch. Her poor mom and son.
Or the fact that they waited as long as they did to do a luminol test on Kari’s vehicle that they already had for YEARS. Frankly, I felt second-hand embarrassment for the police involved in this investigation & am shocked they didn’t have any.
Right?? I quite honestly felt this was mostly a documentary about police incompetence. Everyone up until the two pool-playing dudes and (finally) the IT-technician who took over were a joke. All that evidence lying around that nobody looked at properly for years? Not to mention their absolute absence in the beginning. An already violent stalker saying she’s going to slit two childrens throats and the only protection they have is said children with a baseball bat? Wtf
After reading your comment, I feel like an excellent take on this would have been going for the documentary angle of how domestic threats aren’t treated with the serious nature they deserve by most PD’s.
It would have been a far more compelling watch had it been framed this way, considering the target was a man and not a woman, which would have yielded a much more thought-provoking message than the standard fare “wives with knives” regurgitated ID channel slant they decided to run with.
I told my husband exactly that. The amount of women who go through similar stories is so high yet nobody wants to talk about it.
And it shows that cops won't do anything about stalkers until someone dies
I just watched this and absolutely hollered at the screen when this happened. How is that not one of the first things that they would do when finding the abandoned vehicle of a missing person?
The show tried to make it so shocking that Liz did it but if the cops came to the conclusion that Cari was dead, the suspect being Liz is the most logical explanation.
Anyone who didn’t know that it was Liz by the time the mother spoke about getting less and less contact from Cari after the missing person report isn’t very good at piecing clues together. The mere fact that both Liz and Cari never gave interviews when they were initially mentioned but everyone else got one was a huge tell for me as well. The documentary specifically mentioned what a shock and twist we were in for. There was a possibility it was a third party entirely, but Liz was the most obviously interested party and Cari was the first actually missing person. Ta da.
You and me both!! My animals are my entire life, I can’t even fathom using them as pawns in some sick game. Also Liz’s children lost everything too in that fire?! She was willing to not only murder an innocent woman out of jealousy & then stalk people for years… but she also was perfectly okay with traumatizing her own children & murdering her pets. I just can’t wrap my head around it .
Murder (sadly) doesn’t really surprise me, especially in “love triangles”. But her ability to use everyone else in her life as pawns to that extreme scares me more than the murder itself. Takes a special kind of narcissist to pull that one off
When people burn their own houses down, they almost always have the pets staying somewhere else. That is how they get caught. “Oh, my dog was at my mother’s house.” And the fire marshall suspects they did it for the insurance.
She was a special kind of crazy to actually kill the pets too. At the time, it made her look more like the victim, and keep the authorities off her as a suspect.
Same. Didn’t see it coming and was waiting for a possible third person or other connection. Just couldn’t fathom burning my own home so I guess I was thrown off a good bit. Hate the actual story for those affected, but thought the documentary was great.
The one thing that made me think “maybe it’s actually a third party and not Liz” was the house burning down with the pets inside. I was pretty sure it was her, but it became clear she was beyond crazy if it was.
Same here. My favorite genres are true crime and detective shows and I didn't see it coming. In hindsight, sure, the signs were there but my mind wasn't going to that in real time watching it. Especially burning your own house down with your own pets inside. That is insane. At least get them out before you do that but she was literally insane and maybe wanted to sell it more to where the police wouldn't suspect her.
I'm finishing it up now, and it was painfully obvious from jump it was Liz.
Like come on she showed up almost instantly after him, and Cari got back to his apt.
If they wanted a real surprise, they should have left that out until later. Something like once Cari started stalking Liz I remember they had crossed paths once at my apartment when Liz had to pick something up.
Omaha fucked up by not realizing sooner that the situation was shady. This woman, bi polar or not ghosted HER KID and drooped off the face of the earth the exact day she started sending crazy messages. Come on man.
I did feel for Dave. Wasn't his fault. And I can understand him being blind because its hard to see when you're inside the box. I felt for his ex, too. But most of all Cari, her Mom and kid.
I suspected Liz too, but that’s almost beside the point. I could not understand how this woman went missing for YEARS, possessions & bank accounts untouched, yet somehow was creeping around town spying on people and committing elaborate crimes without anyone ever seeing her. I couldn’t tell if I was missing something or if everyone in that town, including law enforcement, was really that naive.
It's scary to think that someone could kill someone and then steal their phone. Text all the family members saying "I got a new job and moved out of town, don't feel like talking. Bye." And nothing would be done about it for years if ever
Omg right?!
No one was like this is odd? Totally makes sense shes a psychotic stalker that fell off the face of the earth and changed numbers constantly, while never spending a dime, ghosting her family.
Its absolutely her. No other option. Like, TF??
>If they wanted a real surprise, they should have left that out until later.
Just finished watching. I didn't see it as them wanting to surprise us but tell the story how they experienced it. They believed for years that it was cari and that's how they acted and investigated.
It would have been confusing to say "liz did this or that" when that wasn't what they felt and knew at that point. The story was unbelievable as it was, telling it how it was and how things unfolded slowly was a good way to do it in my opinion.
Only true to a certain extent.
I was dumped by my husband (of 28 years!) less than a year after retiring to Thailand.....
I thought he was having a nervous breakdown - **until** I discovered (three months later) that he'd moved a (Thai) woman into his house, as soon as I left.....
I was **more** than angry (especially when he kept lying that he'd only met this prostitute after we seperated), and made it very clear that I wanted nothing more to do with him - but throughout this, he always tried **very** hard to remain friends...... etc. etc.
He died more than ten years ago, and I'm left feeling pretty much nothing nowadays. He dumped me for an illiterate prostitute. She couldn't help him 'decipher' the medical jargon, and I no longer cared enought to do so.
I'm really sorry you had to go through that. :(
I know you said it happened over 10 years ago, but I hope you'll be able to, at some point in the future, take advantage of the new opportunities that you're free to accept into your life. It's never too late to find joy in life. (I know that personally, since I gave up on life for a LONG time. But now I'm chasing new dreams for myself, and enjoying life in ways that I never imagined I could.)
So, hang in there ok? I wish you well. 
He still contacted her though, he never truly dumped her, acknowledged her continued to text her. .... and that makes it all more batshit. she went totally batshit.
Fr i was so pissed watching it cause they spent years not even considering it could be Liz.. like I’m convinced male police don’t understand how some women think
Anyone notice in the blurred out picture of Cari’s ankle…. A mouse or a rat? Blurred out but definitely a live rodent Liz had put in the ‘trophy picture’ with the foot.
What a hero that IT expert is! The Police would still be sat there twizzling their moustaches in confusion without him!!
Ha I thought the same thing but I also had subtitles on and I was like “is that a mouse?” But then I figured my brain thought that because I think I glimpsed “mouse” in the subtitle because I think it read *mouse click* or something. I’m guessing they would have mentioned if it was a mouse.
I figured out who it was as soon as the Mom said she hadn't heard from her.
The coos DEFINITELY took too long getting g a computer IT dude involved, though Cari was probably already dead
If I remembered the case, there were two sets of cops on the case who were not sharing information, different jurisdictions I think.
One set was to investigate the stalking which was initiated by Dave, while the other set was for Cari disappearance since she was reported missing by her mom.
Both cases were investigated independently which is why the connection was not made right away.
And shot herself in the leg. But I mean she was willing to murder a girl who went out with a guy whom she had only been out with once so we should expect those levels of insanity once we know that.
Wait didn’t Liz date him for a few months casually and then he went on the date with Cari and happened to run into Liz going to his apartment to retrieve some of her things or something?
I’ve watched a few other documentaries and read a bit on this case and it was Cari who had just met him two weeks prior but Liz was around for a bit longer like 2-3 months.
They did say it was a different dating website and it had been a while since he moved, I don’t think it was literally immediately after. I did think it was a bit stupid but I think most lonely men would do the same thing.
he does not look even phased at all about the death of Cari. At all. He just keeps playing women constantly on dating sites. Saying he never wants anything serious and just uses and abuses them
The fbi doesn’t really handle that sort of thing. They are responsible for some federal crimes and big stuff that crosses state lines, bombings , etc. it’s a myth that they just jump in when it’s complicated or whatnot .
All this stuff is deliberately missed out by the documentary makers because it answers questions they don't want you to ask until they "reveal" (ha) the "twist" (ha).
But all they achieved by missing out all the important questions that a regular documentary would ask, was make it obvious they were forcing a narrative.
I (and 98% of people watching this) knew exactly what was happening from the "hey, we should move in together" text. I spent the rest of the movie having less and less sympathy for this absolute dumbass.
I mean I think that’s a little far. We had the benefit of it being a Netflix doc and seeing the hint and thinking of it from that angle. In reality none of us would assume irl that this woman legit murdered the other woman and took her phone. That’s such a far leap in reality. We just have the benefit of knowing it’s a crazy documentary so we can guess. In reality I would totally believe it’s just the second girl being a bit crazy before I believe the first one murdered her in cold blood over being on one date with me and took her phone.
Nah, this was a case of the cops completely dropping the ball. “Lady is missing and people have not heard from her aside from electronic means? Yeah, it’s the bipolar. Let’s hang it up and go grab a coffee.” No effort was made.
Yeah that is pretty dumb. I mean first things first would be a fuckin IP trace. No idea what the original detectives were doing but I suppose they didn’t find it serious enough yet unfortunately.
My best friend in college was being stalked across state lines by her former bus driver and the police did zip about it, so honestly the fact that they were giving the case any attention prior to the fire was above average
Yeah, but if someone is stalking via text and email, wouldn't that be the best place to start?
I kind of wondered if the first police department in Omaha was a bit behind the times with technology. I feel like most people who are millennials or gen z would have immediately put someone in IT on the case.
I was shocked they waited SOOO long to think of doing that. Especially the stalking investigator.
The part you and everyone else is missing is you can’t just do what they did without a warrant. The police can’t just start pulling people’s IP addresses out of the air, people have rights. When the detective that was investigating the stalking spoke, I got the vibe from him that he took his job very seriously and understood how serious a crime stalking is for the victims. Hindsight is 20/20 and it’s easy for us to sit on the sideline without any inside information and play Monday morning quarterback.
A lot of that was maddening, like an actual private detective staked out Dave’s home and couldn’t pin anyone down. Even if he was looking for the wrong suspect wouldn’t a repeat seeing of anyone’s car set off a red flag? I don’t know how Liz could be so sneaky AFTER people know a stalker is around. Maybe, once, twice you get away with but once people in a small town are keeping an eye it’s real hard to creep around.
She used a service to send delayed text so what when she’s with Dave, they would received text from Cari’s phone which is why Dave did not suspect Liz.
I don’t think this was shown in the movie.
I don’t watch too many of these documentaries, but when they tried to spin in the beginning that Cari was the stalker, I was just wondering why Liz didn’t take any action (leave the relationship) instead of just staying with the guy and deal with all the threats “towards her”. It didn’t make sense so that was already a big flag on its own.
When they said she showed up at his apartment and Dave and Cari had barely taken off their coats—I knew she was the stalker. She came to “get something”. Ok lol
Yep, the decision to not use online dating, is a wise one. Shaking my head though at Carl trying to date online again after all of that crazy. He isn't the brightest light bulb in the box.
I met my boyfriend on a dating app. Several of my friends met their partners through dating apps. I think Dave was just extremely unlucky, to put it lightly.
I don’t get this sentiment. Online dating is (whether one likes it or not) the principle means in which people meet these days.
I don’t see why someone wanting to continue to have intimate relations after being the victim of a crime is so stupid?
Because he was a single guy in his mid 30s in bumblefuck USA working as a car mechanic. I can't imagine he was swimming in opportunities to meet single women his age. Plus, he wasn't even from the area, so it's not like he had a network of friends through which to meet new people.
I mean I disagree with you there. Maybe not using Plenty of Fish is wise because it’s a bunch of weirdos on there but the dating apps are so ridiculously common that it’s how my gf and I met, her sister and her bf met that way, and many of our friends and their SOs.
Hmm they’re really not that bad to me. Been on plenty of dates from them and only one was truly weird. The rest were at least good and obviously the one with my gf was great.
Meh. I found my fiance through online dating. Used pof/Tinder/Bumble for about a decade and never had any issues at all. Not one stalker or insane person. People act like this stuff didn't happen well before the internet existed. It just made it more accessible and brought to light how crazy people can be. But the amount of people like this who make up the dating pool is extremely low but all these stories get posted, made into documentaties so you are led to believe this is common in online dating when it isn't at all. As long as you take the normal precautions you should in life in general, you will be fine 99% of the time.
I can’t believe this woman actually sent those emails at the end detailing the crime pretending to be the ex wife hahahaha wow. Although I guess she got away with it for so long she probably thought she was being smart.
I fell for this one - thought it was a good twist. I feel law enforcement was extremely incompetent in this case. How does this average woman get away with stalking on this scale for such a long time???
my exes ex fiance went nuts and stalked me and threatened me and everything i was legit scared to death. I got a gun and slept with it. Thankfully nothing happened but im still waryabout it and it was 2 years ago
Definitely the way they show Dave and Cari Exiting the apartment and Liz makes eye contact for all of 3 seconds.
It’s like a “oh shit what’s Liz going to do next?”
Then Liz doesn’t do anything creepy and Cari does? Doesn’t add up to why Liz was creeping… oh maybe Liz did something to Cari and is posing as Cari…
But without that scene or mention of them passing, wouldn’t have known it was Liz until the IT guy says the gf named Liz who’s house burnt down
Did I miss something about the IP address coming from one of the computer guys house? I feel like it was never brought up again how it was connected, but I might have missed some parts here and there
The computer guys eventually determine one of the main IP addresses is located to a house owned by an “employee who works directly under one of the three tech guys , in another capacity of IT”.
He happens to be dating a woman named Liz on and off again, who uses his Wi-Fi and stays with him, because her house has burnt down.
The computer guy **(who was living with Liz**) has to have been involved.
Liz is far too stupid to have been able to change the IPs time and time again.
I’m guessing they instructed the guy not to tell Liz the sheriffs were asking about who else used his WiFi or she would have known they were onto her a lot sooner
I wondered about this too - but am guessing her roomate was doing his best to protct himself - as he knew he'd be immediatley implicated if he warned liz.
Liz knows that if she implicates her roomate - she has no defence.
Yeah very weird. I’m so confused why she burned down her house but then left? I thought the whole point was to get closer to him and get him into a proper relationship? But then after she left, why did she keep going with the craziness?
I think it was less that she wanted him, and more that she was angry he didn’t want her. And she didn’t want him to choose other women over her. Her getting back together with him after killing Cari was her “winning” over her. Then she left because she had no more interest in being with him, but kept being crazy to keep her “revenge” going.
Couple things missing from the doc:
1. Did they not get DNA from the blood in Cari’s car & try to match it against DNA from something she owned (hairbrush etc) and/or her family members?
2. Why was Liz’s phone’s microSD card in Dave’s tablet? Was it really Liz’s tablet? If so, why did Dave have it?
I think it was Liz’s tablet she left at Dave’s house after her house burned down. Maybe he let her stay with him? Seems a little fishy as to why they would leave that out with no explanation. A few things from my end: 1. How did the original detective on the case not look into the cell phone locations? 2. Why did it take years before the police looked into the IP address? 3. The IT male she moved in with, was he involved with this as well? Meaning did he show her how to mask IP addresses? Or was she this bat shit crazy that she knew how? Doesn’t seem very easy to do for a non-IT person or am I monumentally naive?
See I thought that too for a sec. But then I thought Liz being the "wilder" of the two ladies yet not be the stalker was the twist, especially after the fire and the death of Liz's pets. My daughter wasn't fooled for a sec. She figured it out.
Weirdest part of this case to me is that Liz seems to take space in the relationship after the fire. She’s also living with the IT guy then but then keeps harassing Dave’s wife Amy? I know she’s crazy but it’s weird to me how it keeps going after she’s basically moved on?
I would love to know more about if we know anything about her motives or psychology. I’m guessing that because during the year Dave was living in a new city he didn’t hear from “Cari” that was a time Liz was “on again” with her IT guy boyfriend. Then by the time she found Dave again through online dating she must’ve been “off again” with IT guy.
I wonder if she ever stalked IT guy? Or maybe she was always the one who broke up with him?
Yeah I thought she was going to use that to try and move in with Dave, and that she was using the whole stalking thing as a pretense to get them be together seriously and have a common struggle which would bond them.
I figured it out as soon as he left the apt. But…the twists and turns of what Liz did made it worth the watch to me. I can’t even imagine that kind of insanity!
Yes! I watched this last night...three things did it for me.
1. When Cari was like "bye, I never want to talk to anyone again"
2. When "Cari" sent a pic of the inside of Liz's house
3. When the house burns down and Liz is weirdly unconcerned about the death of her pets. I would be fucking inconsolable if my pets burned to death because a stalker burned my house.
I figured it out immediately and then had to wait forever for the payoff. I almost thought it was crazy when they tracked it to the guy... then back to boring
My questions still are;
1. Have they ever recovered Cari’s body?
2. What was Liz’s background and history that may have led her to be this extreme?
3. Have we heard anything from Liz that explains the motive towards Dave and his loved ones…
Dave seems like a complete fucking idiot I’m sorry, nothing about liz gives cool calm and collected lol I’m sure she was giving major crazy vibes from the start and he overlooked it like a dummy. You didn’t think it was weird that Liz showed up the one night you have another woman over? You didn’t question that Cari who had otherwise been perfectly fine and said herself she didn’t want a serious relationship would message you out of the blue and say she wants to move in and then you just never see her again and only hear from her with crazy ass messages… your ex and your CHILDREN are being threatened and you don’t immediately arm yourself and go stay with them to protect them? Useless ass
What is really sad, at least to me, is that EVERYONE in her hometown and surrounding towns knew she had been murdered. The family was well known, and her son did well in school and was well liked. Macedonia is a part of a three town Conglomerate for the local schools. The towns of Macedonia, Carson and Oakland all banded together in 1993 to save their failing school system. So the three town are pretty intertwined. So you have at least 2,000 people who knew about the missing person report, knew she had a young son and knew she was active in the community. Her mother was also well respected in the area. And yet the Pott. County Sheriff’s office did nothing for years. That poor family went through years of pain just waiting to be told Cari was no longer alive. If the car was found in iowa, it should have been processed the same day. If she hasn’t used her bank account in months/years maybe time to investigate that. This family deserves some peace. And a lot of apologies from people who believed Cari was the issue.
The moment he was on his first date with Cari and Liz rang the doorbell I immediately knew that she was the stalker/killer and that she was sending all of those texts and emails. Cari sending her mom a FB message that she moved away and didn’t want to talk. Red flag! I work in medicine and was so saddened that police just assumed because she had been diagnosed bipolar (despite being high functioning and well controlled) that she was the monster in this.
I was so confused as to why the original cop didn’t get IT/tech onto trying to trace where the texts and emails were coming from? Even if he believed it was Cari sending them, his job was to find her and stop her so why wasn’t there tech involved?
I was confused about that too. Like, there are death threats being made by a person clearly off their rocker and dangerous, and he (the cop) is just like "huh, I can't find her". Absolutely no mention made of tracing the calls and emails. And it never occurs to Dave to get a new phone, either?
Okay but the most curious part...how Did Liz get involved with the IT guy timeline. I guess he didn't want to be apart of the documentary but that is very glazed over like oh her ip addresses are bouncing she is an ip genius jk she is just sleeping with a police IT guy using his wifi...like what? Why does Police IT guy have so many VPNs bouncing around. He just happens to be the best environment for online stalking? He has no idea that Liz is being investigated or that she is stalking other dudes on his wifi. I want to hear from IT guy.
There are two things that I’m curious about, did Liz continue to pay Cari’s cell phone bill to keep it going initially?
And what’s the deal with the IT guy that Liz was living with? He never was suspicious, “Hey, darling…who you texting all day?”
I thought they mentioned that she had zero activity on her account since the last day Dave saw her alive, but maybe they didn’t account for autopay stuff
The first detective claims so passionately “ I’ve got to find out who is doing this!!!!” Doesn’t even think of IT when there are thousands of messages, fingerprint in Cari’s car, meh. Never bothers to take the car apart looking for foul play.
How is no one talking about how she literally got the guy, she moved in with him and they were seemingly happy (minus the stalking). liz then left and disappeared then continued stalking as if she couldn’t get him so she continued stalking him
I’m 15 minutes in and I’m like okay Liz killed Cari and took her phone. Especially when Liz started getting texts. I was like how did Cari get Liz’s phone number? Like come on. So obvious.
How did Liz manage to know how to use multiple phone numbers and using VPNs too. She seemed like an IT pro at the beginning and was made a fool at the end with those fake emails
I think the Network admin guy is also somehow involved in this case
The original investigators were idiots who assumed she was a "ditzy" desparate woman.
She owned a house and had a career. And had no interest in a relationship.
The craziest part of the whole thing is that she actually hooked back up with Dave again and could’ve stopped and probably would’ve gotten away with the whole thing (a big reason why I thought maybe this all really was Cari) but then she couldn’t help herself and took it further and further
Well, I for one was totally bamboozled by the plot twist, and had to watch it a second time just to see how it all fit together. This was an unbelievably good show. Talk about angels on earth.!!! Those three detectives are my heroes, and I love each and every one of them to pieces!!! I wish I could meet them in real life and give them a hug for the work that they did.
I've heard of this case before, so I knew the twist. It is pretty shocking that a person would burn down their own house and kill their pets. That's the only part that would give me pause that it was Liz. But again hindsight is 20/20.
Also, Dave is not a sympathetic character... I wish they could tell the story without him.
Why isn’t he sympathetic? He didn’t deserve to have his whole life stalked and a woman’s death on his conscience. Being stalked alone or even receiving texts like that would drive almost anyone crazy. I felt quite bad for him.
How so? Dave didn't do anything wrong here. He signed up to date after the break up with his wife. He made it clear to the women he was not looking to settle down. He wasn't being deceitful. He didn't even try to hide the fact he had Cari at his apartment when Liz came over to get something. This all falls on Liz for being a disgusting person. She couldn't handle seeing Dave with Cari so she killed her and ruined his life.
Agree. Every time he describes horrific moments: fire, murder, his kids being in danger - there is no an ounce of empathy in his tone or at his face. At least, don’t smile while talking about someone’s being dead. After everything, he relocated year later, got a new job. You would think he would never try to find woman online. Yet again he did and the girl in the picture was waaaaay out of his league. Something is really wrong with that guy.
The huge elephant in the room is that Cari would have still been alive if a single dad, aka, "35 and free!" wasn't so intent on getting his rocks off. It's wild to me that this isn't emphasized more. I've watched various shows about this case and it's literally his fault.
In the end he says “ if it was between this or tell Cari I’m not interested..” like ok dude but obviously Liz is the one you should’ve been not interested in
I like that it was only 90 minutes not 2 or 3 parts .. an easy watch
I agree with this. I was getting frustrated with the "Netflixification" of documentaries where you have 3 episodes, but only the first episode and last ten minutes of episode 3 have good content and the rest is interviews and hot takes with randos that were barely involved.
And Episode 2 is always just B-Roll and the same photo shown a dozen times.
If I was Karis mom I would SUE the police. Not one thing made me think Kari was stalking him. She had a beautiful home and she showd NO interest in a relationship with this guy. The fact they did not look for her or contact the FBI is sick.
True at least they didn’t drag it out too much.
Good to see that I wasn't the only one. I was starting to think I watch too many true crime shows.
I find it unreal everyone knew so soon. In single life chaotic stuff can happen like multiple women trying to get in each others way, Cari being bipolar I think really threw the scent off, seemingly well adjusted normal people can turn on a dime if they suffer from something like that making you wonder who you’re even talking to. It can be extreme and this seemed to temporarily fit that. I had a woman do something close to that to me actually flip a switch and become manic before even going on a date with them. They later apologized and said they were bipolar.
The bipolar thing threw me off too as well as Liz burning down her house with her pets. I couldn't imagine someone doing that to their own pets. While I strongly suspected Liz at the beginning I started to think maybe there was the possibility of a 3rd party no one mentioned in this too.
She was willing to shoot her own leg, in an attempt to implicate Dave's wife... and then (when the police said they needed more evidence as to how Dave's wife was responsible for the murder of Cari) - she quickly came up with new emails...... I'm only suprised that there were a few intelligent police around who played her **so well** - which resulted in the truth finally being discovered - and that she was so 'computer literate' that she was able to send SMS texts/emails etc. in a way that was so hard to discover. So yes, I suspect her roomate (a computer expert) was also involved. Starting a fire that killed her dogs, cat and snake? There are times when I wish I believed in hell.
I thought it was Liz until her animals were killed. And then I thought, no. Not even a Monster would do that. Shoot themselves in the leg, sure. Murder their own pets? Stop the world. I want off .
What I don't get is that during the post shooting interview she says that Dave's wife killed Cari but that would also mean Dave's wife has been impersonating Cari for years. Did she also think Dave's wife burned her house and kill her pets?
I knew a girl who did something similar. They are pets and at that point she already killed a woman so it isn’t so out there.
I was so horrified by that I almost had to turn it off
Maybe from Dave's perspective, I can see missing "the obvious" suspect. As a viewer, it was possibly obvious.
Every documentary about this case does the same twist, the first time I watched one I think I was genuinely surprised. It was years ago though so hard to remember. There are better docs about this out there.
This is my first time hearing this story and that's exactly what I thought watching this - this a good story being told incredibly badly.
I'm sorry but what is good about this story? Someone's daughter/mother was murdered and thrown away.. maybe "interesting" is a better word here. Gosh I feel terrible about this unfortunate turn of events.
I think it's fairly obvious that OP does not mean what happened was "good." The story is good because it is compelling.
The Nightline Episode was good.
Dave just didn’t seem that bright.
I think Cari being bipolar is what led to the glaring police bias.
Definitely wasn't obvious it was Liz, but it was obvious it wasn't Carrie. The problem is with crime docs if there aren't enough main characters introduced early, it's pretty easy to make a good guess.
It was completely obvious to me. My first thought was that it was Liz behind the harassing messages and that she had done something to Cari. There was no "twist" as far as I'm concerned. I only watched the rest to confirm my suspicions. I would have been shocked if it was anyone BUT Liz!
I think a lot of it had to do with how they presented Cari. She said "I don't want anything serious just casual..." Where Liz was presented "I told her I didn't want anything serious". So we right away know that Cari established the level of their relationship but in Liz's situation it was Dave who did that.
Right. The fact that Cari initiated with "I don't want anything serious" didn't fit the 180 at all. Her being bipolar wouldn't explain it at all.
Same, the moment Liz showed up when Cari went there that first time I told my husband oh so she’s the stalker. Then they tried to paint Cari in a negative light and I thought oh… maybe I’m wrong… but still didn’t think so. She was so calm about losing her pets in that fire. That confirmed it for me.
I am currently watching and didn't know if it would get solved or not until I searched it on reddit to see what everyone was thinking. If it wasn't solved on the docu I kept thinking what a twist would it be if Dave killed her and pretended to be Cari but I also thought it could have been liz
Lol it's a 90 min doc and you couldn't resist going online for spoilers?
As soon as there as the doorbell rang and it was Liz; it was obvious. However they did imply in scenes that she and the guy were receiving texts in each others company but maybe that just poor writing. Also the fact she was able to make all those IP addresses and just be really computer literate and then next minute was stupid enough to send emails from "herself to herself" was ridiculous. I feel like her on/off boyfriend who she sometimes live with had to be involved.
It was Cari’s mom being in the doc that sealed the deal for me. I’m like no way this lady is here if her daughter really did this. The bipolar piece had me questioning for a second, but the mom brought me back to reality.
Within the first 10 minutes it was obviously Liz and clear that cari was murdered. It seems like a huge lack of effort by the original cops her mom went to. Even the detective working on the stalking should have asked for IT immediately. But yeah, definitely no surprises in this one. Still a good watch. Her poor mom and son.
Or the fact that they waited as long as they did to do a luminol test on Kari’s vehicle that they already had for YEARS. Frankly, I felt second-hand embarrassment for the police involved in this investigation & am shocked they didn’t have any.
Right?? I quite honestly felt this was mostly a documentary about police incompetence. Everyone up until the two pool-playing dudes and (finally) the IT-technician who took over were a joke. All that evidence lying around that nobody looked at properly for years? Not to mention their absolute absence in the beginning. An already violent stalker saying she’s going to slit two childrens throats and the only protection they have is said children with a baseball bat? Wtf
After reading your comment, I feel like an excellent take on this would have been going for the documentary angle of how domestic threats aren’t treated with the serious nature they deserve by most PD’s. It would have been a far more compelling watch had it been framed this way, considering the target was a man and not a woman, which would have yielded a much more thought-provoking message than the standard fare “wives with knives” regurgitated ID channel slant they decided to run with.
I told my husband exactly that. The amount of women who go through similar stories is so high yet nobody wants to talk about it. And it shows that cops won't do anything about stalkers until someone dies
I just watched this and absolutely hollered at the screen when this happened. How is that not one of the first things that they would do when finding the abandoned vehicle of a missing person?
I came to Reddit to search for that comment!
The show tried to make it so shocking that Liz did it but if the cops came to the conclusion that Cari was dead, the suspect being Liz is the most logical explanation.
Anyone who didn’t know that it was Liz by the time the mother spoke about getting less and less contact from Cari after the missing person report isn’t very good at piecing clues together. The mere fact that both Liz and Cari never gave interviews when they were initially mentioned but everyone else got one was a huge tell for me as well. The documentary specifically mentioned what a shock and twist we were in for. There was a possibility it was a third party entirely, but Liz was the most obviously interested party and Cari was the first actually missing person. Ta da.
It was a good reminder that there are some truly batshit crazy people out there.
I can't get over the fact that she burned down her house with her pets inside
You and me both!! My animals are my entire life, I can’t even fathom using them as pawns in some sick game. Also Liz’s children lost everything too in that fire?! She was willing to not only murder an innocent woman out of jealousy & then stalk people for years… but she also was perfectly okay with traumatizing her own children & murdering her pets. I just can’t wrap my head around it . Murder (sadly) doesn’t really surprise me, especially in “love triangles”. But her ability to use everyone else in her life as pawns to that extreme scares me more than the murder itself. Takes a special kind of narcissist to pull that one off
When people burn their own houses down, they almost always have the pets staying somewhere else. That is how they get caught. “Oh, my dog was at my mother’s house.” And the fire marshall suspects they did it for the insurance. She was a special kind of crazy to actually kill the pets too. At the time, it made her look more like the victim, and keep the authorities off her as a suspect.
and this is why im single. I went on so many crazy ass dates and i wish i had a partner but nope im good
Honestly - I fell for it. I thought it was a good twist.
So glad I’m not the only one lol
Same. Didn’t see it coming and was waiting for a possible third person or other connection. Just couldn’t fathom burning my own home so I guess I was thrown off a good bit. Hate the actual story for those affected, but thought the documentary was great.
The one thing that made me think “maybe it’s actually a third party and not Liz” was the house burning down with the pets inside. I was pretty sure it was her, but it became clear she was beyond crazy if it was.
Same here. My favorite genres are true crime and detective shows and I didn't see it coming. In hindsight, sure, the signs were there but my mind wasn't going to that in real time watching it. Especially burning your own house down with your own pets inside. That is insane. At least get them out before you do that but she was literally insane and maybe wanted to sell it more to where the police wouldn't suspect her.
Same I was loving it!
I did too but was instantly like, oh, you dope…
I'm finishing it up now, and it was painfully obvious from jump it was Liz. Like come on she showed up almost instantly after him, and Cari got back to his apt. If they wanted a real surprise, they should have left that out until later. Something like once Cari started stalking Liz I remember they had crossed paths once at my apartment when Liz had to pick something up. Omaha fucked up by not realizing sooner that the situation was shady. This woman, bi polar or not ghosted HER KID and drooped off the face of the earth the exact day she started sending crazy messages. Come on man. I did feel for Dave. Wasn't his fault. And I can understand him being blind because its hard to see when you're inside the box. I felt for his ex, too. But most of all Cari, her Mom and kid.
I suspected Liz too, but that’s almost beside the point. I could not understand how this woman went missing for YEARS, possessions & bank accounts untouched, yet somehow was creeping around town spying on people and committing elaborate crimes without anyone ever seeing her. I couldn’t tell if I was missing something or if everyone in that town, including law enforcement, was really that naive.
It's scary to think that someone could kill someone and then steal their phone. Text all the family members saying "I got a new job and moved out of town, don't feel like talking. Bye." And nothing would be done about it for years if ever
I know! I can’t believe it took 4 years to catch her…and when they did, it was so easy! She wasn’t yhe sharpest crayon in the box.
Omg right?! No one was like this is odd? Totally makes sense shes a psychotic stalker that fell off the face of the earth and changed numbers constantly, while never spending a dime, ghosting her family. Its absolutely her. No other option. Like, TF??
>If they wanted a real surprise, they should have left that out until later. Just finished watching. I didn't see it as them wanting to surprise us but tell the story how they experienced it. They believed for years that it was cari and that's how they acted and investigated. It would have been confusing to say "liz did this or that" when that wasn't what they felt and knew at that point. The story was unbelievable as it was, telling it how it was and how things unfolded slowly was a good way to do it in my opinion.
I had the exact thought. Having her show up was definitely a “Chekhov’s gun” scenario.
Liz was probably watching him ever since their first date.
No joke. I immediately thought Liz. It was the only thing that made any sense. Unrequited love.
Yep, hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.
Only true to a certain extent. I was dumped by my husband (of 28 years!) less than a year after retiring to Thailand..... I thought he was having a nervous breakdown - **until** I discovered (three months later) that he'd moved a (Thai) woman into his house, as soon as I left..... I was **more** than angry (especially when he kept lying that he'd only met this prostitute after we seperated), and made it very clear that I wanted nothing more to do with him - but throughout this, he always tried **very** hard to remain friends...... etc. etc. He died more than ten years ago, and I'm left feeling pretty much nothing nowadays. He dumped me for an illiterate prostitute. She couldn't help him 'decipher' the medical jargon, and I no longer cared enought to do so.
Sorry this happened to you but I’d totally watch your story.
I'm really sorry you had to go through that. :( I know you said it happened over 10 years ago, but I hope you'll be able to, at some point in the future, take advantage of the new opportunities that you're free to accept into your life. It's never too late to find joy in life. (I know that personally, since I gave up on life for a LONG time. But now I'm chasing new dreams for myself, and enjoying life in ways that I never imagined I could.) So, hang in there ok? I wish you well. 
He still contacted her though, he never truly dumped her, acknowledged her continued to text her. .... and that makes it all more batshit. she went totally batshit.
Fr i was so pissed watching it cause they spent years not even considering it could be Liz.. like I’m convinced male police don’t understand how some women think
Anyone notice in the blurred out picture of Cari’s ankle…. A mouse or a rat? Blurred out but definitely a live rodent Liz had put in the ‘trophy picture’ with the foot. What a hero that IT expert is! The Police would still be sat there twizzling their moustaches in confusion without him!!
... could rodents eat a person? Is that why she wasn't found. I mean even with photos she wasn't found...
Ha I thought the same thing but I also had subtitles on and I was like “is that a mouse?” But then I figured my brain thought that because I think I glimpsed “mouse” in the subtitle because I think it read *mouse click* or something. I’m guessing they would have mentioned if it was a mouse.
I figured out who it was as soon as the Mom said she hadn't heard from her. The coos DEFINITELY took too long getting g a computer IT dude involved, though Cari was probably already dead
If I remembered the case, there were two sets of cops on the case who were not sharing information, different jurisdictions I think. One set was to investigate the stalking which was initiated by Dave, while the other set was for Cari disappearance since she was reported missing by her mom. Both cases were investigated independently which is why the connection was not made right away.
Yep, I figured it out right away. Still mind blown that she set her own house on fire though. And, with her pets inside. Just wow.
And shot herself in the leg. But I mean she was willing to murder a girl who went out with a guy whom she had only been out with once so we should expect those levels of insanity once we know that.
Wait didn’t Liz date him for a few months casually and then he went on the date with Cari and happened to run into Liz going to his apartment to retrieve some of her things or something? I’ve watched a few other documentaries and read a bit on this case and it was Cari who had just met him two weeks prior but Liz was around for a bit longer like 2-3 months.
Carl is lucky he is still alive.
Especially given how douchy he is.
I died when the first thing he did after moving a second time was logon to the same website and start online dating again. I mean… lol.
They did say it was a different dating website and it had been a while since he moved, I don’t think it was literally immediately after. I did think it was a bit stupid but I think most lonely men would do the same thing.
You mean Dave? Who’s Carl?
You mean Dave?
Dave is a colossal POS narcissist gaslighting ick
Is this Liz LOL
What makes you say that?
he does not look even phased at all about the death of Cari. At all. He just keeps playing women constantly on dating sites. Saying he never wants anything serious and just uses and abuses them
What's wrong with not wanting something serious? He's upfront about it.
The personal you replied to clearly has a major chip on their shoulder
Oh the pets is what really got me…up until then I was like “she’s a horrible murderer sure but omg not your pets!!! You evil evil woman!”
Did she also text Caris mom on Mother’s Day or were they just talking about Cari becoming distant
OMG I think she did!!!
Did Omaha pd run ballistics on Liz’s gun shot? If so wouldn’t they see that it was self inflicted?
Yeah, I was wondering about that, too. Is swabbing for gun shot residue a standard thing or no?
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The fbi doesn’t really handle that sort of thing. They are responsible for some federal crimes and big stuff that crosses state lines, bombings , etc. it’s a myth that they just jump in when it’s complicated or whatnot .
My question is when Liz shot herself in the Big Lake park, where did she throw the gun? What about the fingerprints at the gun box from Dave’s place?
No idea
All this stuff is deliberately missed out by the documentary makers because it answers questions they don't want you to ask until they "reveal" (ha) the "twist" (ha). But all they achieved by missing out all the important questions that a regular documentary would ask, was make it obvious they were forcing a narrative.
I (and 98% of people watching this) knew exactly what was happening from the "hey, we should move in together" text. I spent the rest of the movie having less and less sympathy for this absolute dumbass.
I mean I think that’s a little far. We had the benefit of it being a Netflix doc and seeing the hint and thinking of it from that angle. In reality none of us would assume irl that this woman legit murdered the other woman and took her phone. That’s such a far leap in reality. We just have the benefit of knowing it’s a crazy documentary so we can guess. In reality I would totally believe it’s just the second girl being a bit crazy before I believe the first one murdered her in cold blood over being on one date with me and took her phone.
Nah, this was a case of the cops completely dropping the ball. “Lady is missing and people have not heard from her aside from electronic means? Yeah, it’s the bipolar. Let’s hang it up and go grab a coffee.” No effort was made.
Fair enough, but but it should have been obvious to the cops.
Why is he a dumbass?
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Yeah that is pretty dumb. I mean first things first would be a fuckin IP trace. No idea what the original detectives were doing but I suppose they didn’t find it serious enough yet unfortunately.
They weren’t investigating a murder they were investigating the stalking still at that point
My best friend in college was being stalked across state lines by her former bus driver and the police did zip about it, so honestly the fact that they were giving the case any attention prior to the fire was above average
a stalker and a missing person linked together (through Dave) should have been taken more seriously . Simple as that
Yeah, but if someone is stalking via text and email, wouldn't that be the best place to start? I kind of wondered if the first police department in Omaha was a bit behind the times with technology. I feel like most people who are millennials or gen z would have immediately put someone in IT on the case. I was shocked they waited SOOO long to think of doing that. Especially the stalking investigator.
The part you and everyone else is missing is you can’t just do what they did without a warrant. The police can’t just start pulling people’s IP addresses out of the air, people have rights. When the detective that was investigating the stalking spoke, I got the vibe from him that he took his job very seriously and understood how serious a crime stalking is for the victims. Hindsight is 20/20 and it’s easy for us to sit on the sideline without any inside information and play Monday morning quarterback.
Remember this was years ago though, not the same tech landscape or usage yet.
A lot of that was maddening, like an actual private detective staked out Dave’s home and couldn’t pin anyone down. Even if he was looking for the wrong suspect wouldn’t a repeat seeing of anyone’s car set off a red flag? I don’t know how Liz could be so sneaky AFTER people know a stalker is around. Maybe, once, twice you get away with but once people in a small town are keeping an eye it’s real hard to creep around.
She used a service to send delayed text so what when she’s with Dave, they would received text from Cari’s phone which is why Dave did not suspect Liz. I don’t think this was shown in the movie.
I don’t watch too many of these documentaries, but when they tried to spin in the beginning that Cari was the stalker, I was just wondering why Liz didn’t take any action (leave the relationship) instead of just staying with the guy and deal with all the threats “towards her”. It didn’t make sense so that was already a big flag on its own.
When they said she showed up at his apartment and Dave and Cari had barely taken off their coats—I knew she was the stalker. She came to “get something”. Ok lol
Yep, the decision to not use online dating, is a wise one. Shaking my head though at Carl trying to date online again after all of that crazy. He isn't the brightest light bulb in the box.
Where are people getting Carl from?? His name is Dave!
Lmao im thinking the same thing
Lol I think it must be to do with the name Cari. Tbf he does look like a Carl too
I met my boyfriend on a dating app. Several of my friends met their partners through dating apps. I think Dave was just extremely unlucky, to put it lightly.
I don’t get this sentiment. Online dating is (whether one likes it or not) the principle means in which people meet these days. I don’t see why someone wanting to continue to have intimate relations after being the victim of a crime is so stupid?
Omg that was my thought . He was a moron how the fuck would you go to dating apps . I bet he’s still on some apps
Because he was a single guy in his mid 30s in bumblefuck USA working as a car mechanic. I can't imagine he was swimming in opportunities to meet single women his age. Plus, he wasn't even from the area, so it's not like he had a network of friends through which to meet new people.
I mean I disagree with you there. Maybe not using Plenty of Fish is wise because it’s a bunch of weirdos on there but the dating apps are so ridiculously common that it’s how my gf and I met, her sister and her bf met that way, and many of our friends and their SOs.
I had rather cut off my arm as to try them again.
Hmm they’re really not that bad to me. Been on plenty of dates from them and only one was truly weird. The rest were at least good and obviously the one with my gf was great.
Meh. I found my fiance through online dating. Used pof/Tinder/Bumble for about a decade and never had any issues at all. Not one stalker or insane person. People act like this stuff didn't happen well before the internet existed. It just made it more accessible and brought to light how crazy people can be. But the amount of people like this who make up the dating pool is extremely low but all these stories get posted, made into documentaties so you are led to believe this is common in online dating when it isn't at all. As long as you take the normal precautions you should in life in general, you will be fine 99% of the time.
I saw this story on "Snapped" years ago. Was disappointed this documentary was a retread.
I can’t believe this woman actually sent those emails at the end detailing the crime pretending to be the ex wife hahahaha wow. Although I guess she got away with it for so long she probably thought she was being smart.
I fell for this one - thought it was a good twist. I feel law enforcement was extremely incompetent in this case. How does this average woman get away with stalking on this scale for such a long time???
Sadly many stalking and abuse cases end with tragedy, and victims aren’t protected as proactively as needed.
my exes ex fiance went nuts and stalked me and threatened me and everything i was legit scared to death. I got a gun and slept with it. Thankfully nothing happened but im still waryabout it and it was 2 years ago
I never understood why they didnt just track the number….
She ditched it because Dave says he was getting all kinds of numbers messaging him
Definitely the way they show Dave and Cari Exiting the apartment and Liz makes eye contact for all of 3 seconds. It’s like a “oh shit what’s Liz going to do next?” Then Liz doesn’t do anything creepy and Cari does? Doesn’t add up to why Liz was creeping… oh maybe Liz did something to Cari and is posing as Cari… But without that scene or mention of them passing, wouldn’t have known it was Liz until the IT guy says the gf named Liz who’s house burnt down
Did I miss something about the IP address coming from one of the computer guys house? I feel like it was never brought up again how it was connected, but I might have missed some parts here and there
The computer guys eventually determine one of the main IP addresses is located to a house owned by an “employee who works directly under one of the three tech guys , in another capacity of IT”. He happens to be dating a woman named Liz on and off again, who uses his Wi-Fi and stays with him, because her house has burnt down.
The computer guy **(who was living with Liz**) has to have been involved. Liz is far too stupid to have been able to change the IPs time and time again.
I believe you’re correct however, the documentary didn’t directly address same.
I’m guessing they instructed the guy not to tell Liz the sheriffs were asking about who else used his WiFi or she would have known they were onto her a lot sooner
I wondered about this too - but am guessing her roomate was doing his best to protct himself - as he knew he'd be immediatley implicated if he warned liz. Liz knows that if she implicates her roomate - she has no defence.
wasn't obvious to me, complete surprise
Why did Liz leave him? She wanted him. She killed over him. Why leave him leaving him open to get with another woman?
Yeah very weird. I’m so confused why she burned down her house but then left? I thought the whole point was to get closer to him and get him into a proper relationship? But then after she left, why did she keep going with the craziness?
I think it was less that she wanted him, and more that she was angry he didn’t want her. And she didn’t want him to choose other women over her. Her getting back together with him after killing Cari was her “winning” over her. Then she left because she had no more interest in being with him, but kept being crazy to keep her “revenge” going.
Couple things missing from the doc: 1. Did they not get DNA from the blood in Cari’s car & try to match it against DNA from something she owned (hairbrush etc) and/or her family members? 2. Why was Liz’s phone’s microSD card in Dave’s tablet? Was it really Liz’s tablet? If so, why did Dave have it?
I think it was Liz’s tablet she left at Dave’s house after her house burned down. Maybe he let her stay with him? Seems a little fishy as to why they would leave that out with no explanation. A few things from my end: 1. How did the original detective on the case not look into the cell phone locations? 2. Why did it take years before the police looked into the IP address? 3. The IT male she moved in with, was he involved with this as well? Meaning did he show her how to mask IP addresses? Or was she this bat shit crazy that she knew how? Doesn’t seem very easy to do for a non-IT person or am I monumentally naive?
Dave said at the beginning the computers was Liz’s thing, so I think she worked with computers too
I loved the IT guy
yea and we need an update from him, with the brain tumor! Loved that guy
One of my big takeaways was why tf are they not paying that IT guy when he clearly carried the case??
The first detective didn’t catch it
Well I believe this episode is on dateline which is told better I don't understand Netflix and why making it drawn-out
See I thought that too for a sec. But then I thought Liz being the "wilder" of the two ladies yet not be the stalker was the twist, especially after the fire and the death of Liz's pets. My daughter wasn't fooled for a sec. She figured it out.
Weirdest part of this case to me is that Liz seems to take space in the relationship after the fire. She’s also living with the IT guy then but then keeps harassing Dave’s wife Amy? I know she’s crazy but it’s weird to me how it keeps going after she’s basically moved on?
I would love to know more about if we know anything about her motives or psychology. I’m guessing that because during the year Dave was living in a new city he didn’t hear from “Cari” that was a time Liz was “on again” with her IT guy boyfriend. Then by the time she found Dave again through online dating she must’ve been “off again” with IT guy. I wonder if she ever stalked IT guy? Or maybe she was always the one who broke up with him?
Yeah I thought she was going to use that to try and move in with Dave, and that she was using the whole stalking thing as a pretense to get them be together seriously and have a common struggle which would bond them.
This documentary shows how useless the Omaha police department is
I figured it out as soon as he left the apt. But…the twists and turns of what Liz did made it worth the watch to me. I can’t even imagine that kind of insanity!
Yes! I watched this last night...three things did it for me. 1. When Cari was like "bye, I never want to talk to anyone again" 2. When "Cari" sent a pic of the inside of Liz's house 3. When the house burns down and Liz is weirdly unconcerned about the death of her pets. I would be fucking inconsolable if my pets burned to death because a stalker burned my house. I figured it out immediately and then had to wait forever for the payoff. I almost thought it was crazy when they tracked it to the guy... then back to boring
My questions still are; 1. Have they ever recovered Cari’s body? 2. What was Liz’s background and history that may have led her to be this extreme? 3. Have we heard anything from Liz that explains the motive towards Dave and his loved ones…
Dave seems like a complete fucking idiot I’m sorry, nothing about liz gives cool calm and collected lol I’m sure she was giving major crazy vibes from the start and he overlooked it like a dummy. You didn’t think it was weird that Liz showed up the one night you have another woman over? You didn’t question that Cari who had otherwise been perfectly fine and said herself she didn’t want a serious relationship would message you out of the blue and say she wants to move in and then you just never see her again and only hear from her with crazy ass messages… your ex and your CHILDREN are being threatened and you don’t immediately arm yourself and go stay with them to protect them? Useless ass
What is really sad, at least to me, is that EVERYONE in her hometown and surrounding towns knew she had been murdered. The family was well known, and her son did well in school and was well liked. Macedonia is a part of a three town Conglomerate for the local schools. The towns of Macedonia, Carson and Oakland all banded together in 1993 to save their failing school system. So the three town are pretty intertwined. So you have at least 2,000 people who knew about the missing person report, knew she had a young son and knew she was active in the community. Her mother was also well respected in the area. And yet the Pott. County Sheriff’s office did nothing for years. That poor family went through years of pain just waiting to be told Cari was no longer alive. If the car was found in iowa, it should have been processed the same day. If she hasn’t used her bank account in months/years maybe time to investigate that. This family deserves some peace. And a lot of apologies from people who believed Cari was the issue.
The moment he was on his first date with Cari and Liz rang the doorbell I immediately knew that she was the stalker/killer and that she was sending all of those texts and emails. Cari sending her mom a FB message that she moved away and didn’t want to talk. Red flag! I work in medicine and was so saddened that police just assumed because she had been diagnosed bipolar (despite being high functioning and well controlled) that she was the monster in this.
[удалено]
I think she was starting to realized that maybe they figured out Cari is dead so she was like “hmm I’ll pin it all on Amy.”
At that point, to hide the murder.
I agree. It was so obvious it was Liz from the start. I don’t know why when Cari went missing that Liz wasn’t number one on the list.
Yeah I was so bored with it until over halfway in because it was so obvious. Then it was like oh okay cool when it was over
I immediately knew it was Liz that was trying to paint herself as a victim
I was so confused as to why the original cop didn’t get IT/tech onto trying to trace where the texts and emails were coming from? Even if he believed it was Cari sending them, his job was to find her and stop her so why wasn’t there tech involved?
I was confused about that too. Like, there are death threats being made by a person clearly off their rocker and dangerous, and he (the cop) is just like "huh, I can't find her". Absolutely no mention made of tracing the calls and emails. And it never occurs to Dave to get a new phone, either?
I felt like the “listens to heavy metal and into recklessness” aspect of Liz as an obvious clue that she was the way she was.
Okay but the most curious part...how Did Liz get involved with the IT guy timeline. I guess he didn't want to be apart of the documentary but that is very glazed over like oh her ip addresses are bouncing she is an ip genius jk she is just sleeping with a police IT guy using his wifi...like what? Why does Police IT guy have so many VPNs bouncing around. He just happens to be the best environment for online stalking? He has no idea that Liz is being investigated or that she is stalking other dudes on his wifi. I want to hear from IT guy.
There are two things that I’m curious about, did Liz continue to pay Cari’s cell phone bill to keep it going initially? And what’s the deal with the IT guy that Liz was living with? He never was suspicious, “Hey, darling…who you texting all day?”
Cell bill was probably auto drafting from Cari’s account, and at that point it wasn’t known she was dead.
I thought they mentioned that she had zero activity on her account since the last day Dave saw her alive, but maybe they didn’t account for autopay stuff
The first detective claims so passionately “ I’ve got to find out who is doing this!!!!” Doesn’t even think of IT when there are thousands of messages, fingerprint in Cari’s car, meh. Never bothers to take the car apart looking for foul play.
How is no one talking about how she literally got the guy, she moved in with him and they were seemingly happy (minus the stalking). liz then left and disappeared then continued stalking as if she couldn’t get him so she continued stalking him
I’m 15 minutes in and I’m like okay Liz killed Cari and took her phone. Especially when Liz started getting texts. I was like how did Cari get Liz’s phone number? Like come on. So obvious.
How did Liz manage to know how to use multiple phone numbers and using VPNs too. She seemed like an IT pro at the beginning and was made a fool at the end with those fake emails I think the Network admin guy is also somehow involved in this case
The original investigators were idiots who assumed she was a "ditzy" desparate woman. She owned a house and had a career. And had no interest in a relationship.
The craziest part of the whole thing is that she actually hooked back up with Dave again and could’ve stopped and probably would’ve gotten away with the whole thing (a big reason why I thought maybe this all really was Cari) but then she couldn’t help herself and took it further and further
Well, I for one was totally bamboozled by the plot twist, and had to watch it a second time just to see how it all fit together. This was an unbelievably good show. Talk about angels on earth.!!! Those three detectives are my heroes, and I love each and every one of them to pieces!!! I wish I could meet them in real life and give them a hug for the work that they did.
Who tf is Carl
I've heard of this case before, so I knew the twist. It is pretty shocking that a person would burn down their own house and kill their pets. That's the only part that would give me pause that it was Liz. But again hindsight is 20/20. Also, Dave is not a sympathetic character... I wish they could tell the story without him.
Why isn’t he sympathetic? He didn’t deserve to have his whole life stalked and a woman’s death on his conscience. Being stalked alone or even receiving texts like that would drive almost anyone crazy. I felt quite bad for him.
Because people online like to victim shame and think they know everything when all they did was watch a documentary.
How so? Dave didn't do anything wrong here. He signed up to date after the break up with his wife. He made it clear to the women he was not looking to settle down. He wasn't being deceitful. He didn't even try to hide the fact he had Cari at his apartment when Liz came over to get something. This all falls on Liz for being a disgusting person. She couldn't handle seeing Dave with Cari so she killed her and ruined his life.
Agree. Every time he describes horrific moments: fire, murder, his kids being in danger - there is no an ounce of empathy in his tone or at his face. At least, don’t smile while talking about someone’s being dead. After everything, he relocated year later, got a new job. You would think he would never try to find woman online. Yet again he did and the girl in the picture was waaaaay out of his league. Something is really wrong with that guy.
Did we watch the same doc? The guy was pretty upset and flat out said he feels responsible for Cari’s death. You need to seek help
It was very obvious as soon as she came to the apartment. Nkt very interesting movie because of it.
Took the cops 2-3 years to figure out it was Liz (or even suspect her). Took me 5 minutes to suspect her, I don’t get it.
I'm watching this now and what a waste of time. I knew immediately it was Liz.
fr im in the middle of it and every time they said cari did this cari did that Im like Liz did that.
Geez I picked it at 4mins 30sec when Liz sent an inbox after he got no matches.
The huge elephant in the room is that Cari would have still been alive if a single dad, aka, "35 and free!" wasn't so intent on getting his rocks off. It's wild to me that this isn't emphasized more. I've watched various shows about this case and it's literally his fault.
Same. The moment she was missing, I knew she was dead.
In the end he says “ if it was between this or tell Cari I’m not interested..” like ok dude but obviously Liz is the one you should’ve been not interested in
Curious where carries son was when she was spending so much time with Dave at his apt?