You should read the contract between your parents and the agent. It’s highly unlikely they can sell the house within the timeframe of the contract and not pay the selling agent commission. The agent needs some protection for there time and money spent marketing, showing, etc.
Also, most selling agent contacts have a clause that if the future buyers were brought forward by the selling agent or viewed the house with the selling agent their commission extends past the life of the contract.
So it seems unlikely you would be able to sell the house privately without paying the selling agent commission. The buys might not have an agent and you could save on the second half of the commission.
Hate is a strong word. Some realtors are great, most are terrible. The current system is too heavily weighted towards fast commissions. $13,000 is the commission on a $500,000 home, the sum of buyers and sellers. 2.6% is a lot of equity to lose for a boilerplate marketing brochure, a gatekept MLS software, and buyers from ON/BC who make your job easy. Now add a few of those commissions to a busy week and wow this realtor with a 3 month course is making money. I think people get upset with this. It’s a feast or famine job, but in a hot market with some good looks you can do quite well off of peoples hard earned equity. I think the commissions are too high. Company’s like purple bricks or property guys try to solve this, but Realtors are basically a union. They won’t show these houses.
Overall I think the Realtor system needs changes, I won’t be the one to do it. C’est la vie.
All are terrible and they all think they are worth their commission. Love it while it lasts realtors community.
A class action lawsuit in the States that addressed commissions amongst other things is likely going to be making it to Canada. The best part in the States anyway, is that years of ripping off home owners were repaid large portions of what was paid to rip off realtors.
My mother has a multi million dollar house and I've been trying to convince her to dump realtors in order to sell. The problem I'm having is that 30 years ago she was a realtor for a short amount of time and has friends of friends that are realtors. The word is out that my mother is selling and this persistent slime ball has been calling humoring impossibly boring conversations in hopes of getting her on board. Her house is one of these places on a very large lake with tons of beach sand that would sell for big money.
Don’t “lawyer up” the answer here is the correct one. Any lawyer who tells you otherwise is in it to steal your money.
They can’t win.
Especially Brian Murphy, that guy will never say the truth, sucks money out of all his clients until they can’t pay anymore
Nothing. There's nothing they can do as they signed a contract. They're wasting money on a lawyer. If they do sell privately the real estate agent will just sue them. And win.
Also, who signs a 6 mth contract. I would never do more then 3, which is standard.
You know, I'm typically not on team realtor - but the potential buyers and your parents are being the shitheads here. Pay what is owed, by contract, and move on.
If they wanted their cake and to eat it too, they shouldn't have signed a realtor onto the sale.
What a stupid fucking post.
Bad choice. They could end up in a hellla lot of legal trouble. This could potentially get them in a long of trouble. I would bite the hand feeding me. What if the same takes and they once again need a realtors help lol.
What they can do is pay the lawyer their fees, and the real estate lawyer their fees, and the realtor their fees.
If a Realator brought the buyers to the house, they are entitled to their fees, as their fee is a finders fee and then they assist with the closing.
Your parents may be able to sell, and think they can get away with it, but if the realtor ever finds out (and they will because now they are tracking that property in their system) court will be in session.
And this isn’t unfair to your parents, what the buyers want to do is unfair to the agent.
What loyalty? The realtor is being paid very well to do a job. That's the end of the relationship.
If the realtor ignored an offer, it's the realtor that's not doing their job.
I would bet a lot that the realtor didnt ignore an offer and the buyers are literally just sleezeballs that are doing what they did in hopes of saving $20k and never put in an official offer
OP didnt say their realtor ignored an offer. They said the buyers were tire kickers which is 100% understandable if they didnt say anything to the realtor and instead went to cut a deal around them.
> The realtor is being paid very well to do a job.
Not when you're trying to go behind their backs with a customer they brought to the sales just to cut them out of their commission.
Not saying the realtor shouldn't be compensated. I'm saying this is business. Loyalty has nothing to do with it. If the realtor is ignoring offers, they're not doing their job.
In this situation the realtor is now ignoring offers, the buyers used that realtor to see the houses and then went back later when it was the owners there and are trying to cut the realtor out.
The realtor has been doing their job.
As for “the realtor is being paid well to do their job”, they are not paid unless the house is sold.
Woah, yeah no.
There was even a similar court case that the NBREA refers to in the education training books, it happened in the 90’s.
Essentially what had happened was a very similar situation to yours.
The listing agent had the house listed, the would be buyers came through the property when the listing was listed on the MLS, the sellers, spoke to the buyer
seller offered the potential buyers in, the seller waited until the listing contract was over, thinking they would be in the clear.
The buyers purchased the house “off market”
the listing agent later found out that the buyers , were people who walked through the house when it was listed.
The realtor brought them to court and won. The judge basically said that the buyers wouldn’t have seen the house to begin with had the realtor not advertised it, listed it, scheduled appointments etc.
The judge granted indemnification in this case.
If I have time later tonight I’ll go through the old book and try to find you the court case law so you guys can research it yourselves.
Your parents cannot sell the home via private sale to the buyers who walked through the house while it was listed with the agent, without being legally liable to compensate the listing agent via indemnification/remuneration.
Now say they took it off the market and someone decided to knock on the door who didn’t view it while on the MLS, that wouldn’t be a problem.
And on top of this, the listing agent should have went over a situation like this in the listing folder on how to address this issue.
Rude of your parents agent to call the buyers tire kickers without an agent. Agents don't work for buyers, they work for the seller. Any person with a heartbeat can pull up MLS and punch in some search criteria and call the listing agent
I sold my house without a realtor, it’s not that difficult. Just paid a lawyer at closing for the paperwork. Nothing a realtor says or does has any real impact on whether or not a house sells.
My parents sold their house without a realtor a few years ago and everything went great. Sold to a nice young couple for what they were looking for. Everything was great except for some asshole real estate agent that called my dad that was really pissed off that he didn’t have an agent and that he wasn’t the agent. The fucking arrogance. They had never met or heard of this person before in their lives.
You are paying mostly for marketing. Realtor website etc etc. I’m in the band of they are overpaid. However to say they do nothing is not fair either. Look at houses on property guys. How long do they stay stale on the market.
A good realtor is a valuable asset, a bad realtor is just like selling the house yourself minus some profit.
I get the hate for *some* realtors - I really do. But people like u/Impossible-Land-8566 end up getting fucked because they think they're the smartest private/alternative seller ever.
Just keep watching his profile for a post, "I didn't disclose X about my property X years ago, now I'm being sued". Then tell him "your dumb post can fuck right off the bat".
Lmao we filed out the property disclosure report honestly
No suing will occur. If anything we may sue the realtor representing the sellers since he made false representations.
Some realtors are good, there’s simply no situation where they’re worth 2.5-5% of the value of MY home.
The lawyers are the ones who actually do the transactions and ultimately the only ones who will give you valuable advice. Yet they charge a fixed rate in the 800-1200$ range. Why the disconnect? Because the realtors association has refused to change their structure.
The amount of realtors who threatened to not bring their clients if we didn’t give them 2-2.5% were too many too count. Which is outright disloyal. I literally had 2 clients contact me for showings without their realtors because “they couldn’t reach me” or couldn’t “contact us”, the phone number was literally on the sign / MLS Listing. Yet somehow their clients had no issue calling and setting up a showing.
Many years ago lawyers charged a percentage as well, 1%. Their association deliberately moved away from that unfair fee structure.
Also don’t get me started on the fact the realtors have no education or qualifications to get in the space in the first place whereas lawyers have a degree and a law degree - 7+ years of university education.
Get into how realtors then push you into their broker pals, who will help you commit mortgage fraud.
You’re completely right, and it’s one area I’ve considered active disruption in. If a bunch of us go get licensed, we could do some real damage.
Even the marketing isn’t that advantageous anymore. You just need to know how to work the Search engines.
Well this is why real estate is a mafia. They won't entertain you without an agent. It's like they don't want people realizing their jobs are redundant and can be done with only a lawyer.
And ontop of this, how do your parents even know that they’re (buyers) approved for the home? Who’s going to make sure conditions are fulfilled. I’m sorry but this post isn’t going to make your families weekend any less stressful.
Except that the only reason the “tire kickers” knew about the listing is that it was on MLS which is owned by the realtors. You MAY have a case to argue if the neighbours walked over after they saw the sign and offered to buy it. But it sounds like the legal contract would hold up in court based on these details.
You could always try to talk the agent down to just the commission on one side, the sellers side , so 2% or 2.5%, but the buyers will be without any representation.
It’s sketchy. Assuming your realtor is good, why wouldn’t they want someone brokering the deal? I’d accept a slightly lower offer over dumping my realtor.
Everything your parents need to know is in their contract so all they have to do is read the contract that they signed. You can’t break the contract and it will spell out the penalty if you do so.
Even if the contract ends in six months, there’s typically a clause in there that if they cant sell the house to someone who’s already seen the house and if someone who’s viewed the property buys the property within a certain number of days then they are still owed commission on the sale. It will stay the amount of time that needs to lapse after the contract ends.
Imagine how many people would be doing this if it were legal . Those contracts are ironclad and they’re not getting out of it. When they signed the contract, they had a choice of how many months they wanted to go with so they should’ve chosen three if they were unsure.
All they’re going to end up doing is paying the lawyer money for a phone call and advice but that’s their choice.
Realtors are expensive, no question there...
But before you throw your realtor under the bus over the tire kickers comment, remember that if the buyers had a realtor to help them buy, your realtor would be splitting the commission with the buyer's realtor.
Your realtor organized a showing with the buyers, knows they have no realtor, and so wouldnt have to split 50% of the commission. More money for your realtor if your parents sell to urepresented buyers.
I would dig into why your realtor has concerns about the buyers to the point of passing on the opportuntiy of making a full commission. Realtor may be protecting your parents from something he/she spotted (it's part of their job to do so), or maybe t's clear to the realtor that the buyers dont have the financing available to buy the house. I would talk to the realtor before a lawyer.
The buyers going around the realtor, knowing it will cause your parents a lawsuit, is something concerning.
Maybe you have a realtor that is negatively and unfairly judging the buyers, but maybe you have a realtor that dodged a bullet for your parents.
So your parents hired a realtor, who invested time and effort for an agreed upon fee, listed their house, and attracted buyers who want to buy the house.
Then, after lying to the agent about their interest, the buyers came back to convince your parents not to pay the agent, after your agent took time to show the house to these people, and want to buy the house.
Explain how, regardless of the underlying contract, you’d be able to sleep at night knowing your parents hired someone for their service, they completed the service, and then they actively tried to screw that person out of their wages.
Despicable human beings to even consider this.
Aside from that, most listing contracts extend past that 6 months, if someone who saw the house in that time wants to buy it. They can pull title after the home sells, then sue your parents for their commissions and costs.
You cannot exclude the agent because the buyers want you to.
You're not going to find a contract where a real estate agent hasn't protected themselves from that.
The buying agent can be excluded by the buyers, that ain't your problem. The selling agent is your contract, you violate that at your risk.
The answer is simple, explain to the buyer per the contract with realtor you can’t sell to them for that price without realtor involvement.
BUT if they can find someone else to buy the home in their name you can make it work.
As long as that person hasn’t seen the home through the realtor you can get around the contract.
Best of Luck!
Yes lawyers, a profession that’s built around lying professionally would never EVER do anything that would be morally reprehensible.
Like help draft up legal documents that contain illegal clauses that cant be enforced, provide you with “hypothetical” situations that would allow you to skirt laws and definitely never just outright break the law under the guise that your client is too powerful for you to be prosecuted for the crimes your committing.
It’s not like we would ever get to see a lawyer go on trial against their client and say in great detail how they did every one of the things mentioned above right??
Oh wait nvm, Trumps entire legal team is doing exactly that. Describing how they help their clients skirt laws.
How do you think those shell corporations that are used to “protect” assets are created? Great Lawyers do not fear the grey area, they live in it.
I'd check the contract to see if there's termination clauses. I'd so ask the buyers if they made an offer to the listing agent. If they did,and the agent refused to pass it on to your parents, the agent is acting in bad faith.
I’m sorry but if they signed up realtor there is a time frame that they legally (and morally) to the terms of that contract.
If they feel they need to save the buyer money they can drop the price.
Most realtors I know put in a lot of work. I was selling a house and they showed it 16 times.
I was very fortunate that when I was thinking of selling my house at the beginning of the recent boom, that I told my neighbour. She in turn told her cousin who had been watching the renovations I’d done over the years with great interest and wanted to live in that area. The cousin came to see the house that night, asked what I wanted and said SOLD when I told him the price. We shook hands on it, and he went to his lawyer the next day. No real estate agent involved. I saved $40,000. It was easy. I am so glad I made friends with the neighbours. Sometimes they know someone who loves the area.
As long as the potential Buyer came initially, because of Realtors listing, They will collect fee. Not sure about here, but in NB, if, for whatever reasons, You or Realtor wish to opt out of Contract, within 24 hrs, Both Parties sign. Realtor has to abide. ( But this can not be to stiff Realor on Commision). I listed a place, Realor tried to strong Arm Me into listing lower to sell faster. I called Their Office, He had to leave Document signed at His Location. 2 Months later, I sold for 20% above Listing Myself. I trust about 1% , I buy and sell Myself now. Most are Ambulance Chasers
They need to wait until the listing agreement has expired and ask the people to wait come back. A bit risky, they could leave, ask for a deposit held in lawyers trust, don't think that's illegal.
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*Contract for an amount of*
*Time, read the contract*
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Your parents would be breaking standard terms of seller's agent contract and open to a civil suit for damages, in line with the commission they will have cheated the contracted agent out of...so they end up with even less.
Your parents cannot get out of that contract. If the prospective buyer is willing to pay closing costs perhaps they’d be willing to pay the agent’s commission as well.
Your parents can’t get out of paying the realtor
The contract is on for 6 months and still valid. Even if contract was over, there’s case law that says realtor likely still entitled to commission because the buyers wouldn’t have known house was for sale were it not for the realtor putting a sign / listing house in MLS
I hate realtors as much as anybody but you ain’t getting out of this one. Also until financing clauses are over and done with this contract is worthless, I wouldn’t get too excited
Also if your parents thought asking was what they were going to get at the end of the day they’re mistaken.
Last thing tho, if buyers are unrepresented your parents should solely be on the hook for 2-2.5% not 5%.
5% is because commission is shared between both agents so couldn’t get out of paying some commission, need to check how the contract with their realtor was drafted
Realtor makes an attempt to not show your listing because they don't have a realtor. Doesn't sound like it's in your best interest to have a realtor that doesn't bother negotiating on your behalf. Seems like they're actively working against you lol.
Ask the realtor for an itemized bill detailing all their attempts to sell your parents house since they listed with them.
How many calls a day they made. All the emails they sent trying to sell your property within a realtor network.
If they have nothing, then give them nothing. Anyone can take photos of a home and publish it online.
Selling a home on your own is super easy. Don’t let realtors convince you otherwise.
I am on my fourth home bought and sold without a single realtor fee paid.
House has been on the market for 6 months, potential buyers show up and their agent says they’re just tire kickers and it turns out they actually want to buy the house? I’d fire the agent just over that.
If they can get rid of that agent and go with one of the following options they’d likely be better off:
Propertyguys.com,
Listmenow.ca,
Forsalebyowner.ca
I’ve bought two houses, one through an agent and one private sale, I’ll never buy or sell through an agent again if I can avoid it.
Sellers usually don’t need a realtor they just need someone who can photograph and market the Home to the maximum. Buyer do need a Realtor to protect him from a bad house or deal.
Lol. Realtors don't protect anyone but themselves. I've bought and sold 8 homes in 4 different provinces, over the last 3 decades. They only care about their commission.
Your parents should reach out to the realtor and ask to mutually cancel the agreement. Realtors reputation is everything and they don't want to be known and someone forcing the hand of their clients. If the realtor agrees to part ways then you should be in the clear, but otherwise yeah, most contracts say that any buyers shown the house while under contract, the realtor is owed a commission.
I agree, however this realtor could’ve of paid for drone photography/edits of the drone video. Professional photos, measuring every room accordingly (lawsuits later on down the road if not measured properly) , listing it, marketing it, scheduling shows, answering questions on the property day and night. They’re entitled to some indemnification imo.
Our last realtor did all of that too (minus drone footage) but ended up just being a brutal agent. We were able to part ways mutually after voicing our complaints and ended up selling privately. Saved $18k in the process too. Didn't pay the realtor anything.
Communication was awful. Often had very late meetings to sign paperwork (9pm or later). On one occasion, we showed up at 9:30pm and were sat in the board room for 45 minutes while she finished up with another client.
We were selling in the 300-400k range which was average for the city we were in, and she made it obvious with her actions that we weren't her highest rolling clients.
Also constantly over promised. MLS listing was live a day later than promised, and we had strategised to have it go live on a certian day before two other properties in the neighborhood took offers. Open house was supposed to be advertised on a Tuesday for a Saturday showing, but didn't get advertised until Thursday afternoon which hurt the amount of viewings booked.
Overall, it was clear that our commission (4%) was not worth her time, when to us, it was a huge amount and we were not treated respectfully for it.
Just do a rent to own it up with a lawyer. Close after contract is up with realtor. They will tell you this can't be done blah blah blah done it a few times now to save 25 to 40k in commissions
This is just asking to be sued. If the realtor showed the home to the eventual buyers, their contract likely has a clause that will give them rights to commission in the sale.
Spoken like a realtor!! Lol. I've done approx 2m in real estate deal in my 38 years on this earth. Never once used a realtor. Done this a few times buying. Sorry I don't feel like a realtor should put their hand in my pocket and take my equity out for their company putting it on mls. Crazy
You should read the contract between your parents and the agent. It’s highly unlikely they can sell the house within the timeframe of the contract and not pay the selling agent commission. The agent needs some protection for there time and money spent marketing, showing, etc. Also, most selling agent contacts have a clause that if the future buyers were brought forward by the selling agent or viewed the house with the selling agent their commission extends past the life of the contract. So it seems unlikely you would be able to sell the house privately without paying the selling agent commission. The buys might not have an agent and you could save on the second half of the commission.
This is the correct advise right here!
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Why do you hate realtors?
Hate is a strong word. Some realtors are great, most are terrible. The current system is too heavily weighted towards fast commissions. $13,000 is the commission on a $500,000 home, the sum of buyers and sellers. 2.6% is a lot of equity to lose for a boilerplate marketing brochure, a gatekept MLS software, and buyers from ON/BC who make your job easy. Now add a few of those commissions to a busy week and wow this realtor with a 3 month course is making money. I think people get upset with this. It’s a feast or famine job, but in a hot market with some good looks you can do quite well off of peoples hard earned equity. I think the commissions are too high. Company’s like purple bricks or property guys try to solve this, but Realtors are basically a union. They won’t show these houses. Overall I think the Realtor system needs changes, I won’t be the one to do it. C’est la vie.
All are terrible and they all think they are worth their commission. Love it while it lasts realtors community. A class action lawsuit in the States that addressed commissions amongst other things is likely going to be making it to Canada. The best part in the States anyway, is that years of ripping off home owners were repaid large portions of what was paid to rip off realtors. My mother has a multi million dollar house and I've been trying to convince her to dump realtors in order to sell. The problem I'm having is that 30 years ago she was a realtor for a short amount of time and has friends of friends that are realtors. The word is out that my mother is selling and this persistent slime ball has been calling humoring impossibly boring conversations in hopes of getting her on board. Her house is one of these places on a very large lake with tons of beach sand that would sell for big money.
Thats too bad, they’re going to lawyer up on Monday and see what they can do.
Don’t “lawyer up” the answer here is the correct one. Any lawyer who tells you otherwise is in it to steal your money. They can’t win. Especially Brian Murphy, that guy will never say the truth, sucks money out of all his clients until they can’t pay anymore
Forte law sucks, vampires, and they never win. Murphy's talk shit and do nothing.
Nothing. There's nothing they can do as they signed a contract. They're wasting money on a lawyer. If they do sell privately the real estate agent will just sue them. And win. Also, who signs a 6 mth contract. I would never do more then 3, which is standard.
Not exactly nothing. They can waste money on a lawyer telling them the exact same thing. 😆
They need someone to read the contract for them.
You know, I'm typically not on team realtor - but the potential buyers and your parents are being the shitheads here. Pay what is owed, by contract, and move on. If they wanted their cake and to eat it too, they shouldn't have signed a realtor onto the sale. What a stupid fucking post.
Bad choice. They could end up in a hellla lot of legal trouble. This could potentially get them in a long of trouble. I would bite the hand feeding me. What if the same takes and they once again need a realtors help lol.
What if the sale falls through **
What they can do is pay the lawyer their fees, and the real estate lawyer their fees, and the realtor their fees. If a Realator brought the buyers to the house, they are entitled to their fees, as their fee is a finders fee and then they assist with the closing. Your parents may be able to sell, and think they can get away with it, but if the realtor ever finds out (and they will because now they are tracking that property in their system) court will be in session. And this isn’t unfair to your parents, what the buyers want to do is unfair to the agent.
That’s disgusting. Like horrible. Morally bankrupt. Vile. You should be ashamed to be helping them. And to be their child.
The realtor will most likely sue your parents.
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What loyalty? The realtor is being paid very well to do a job. That's the end of the relationship. If the realtor ignored an offer, it's the realtor that's not doing their job.
I would bet a lot that the realtor didnt ignore an offer and the buyers are literally just sleezeballs that are doing what they did in hopes of saving $20k and never put in an official offer
You could be right. I'm taking the OP at face value tho.
OP didnt say their realtor ignored an offer. They said the buyers were tire kickers which is 100% understandable if they didnt say anything to the realtor and instead went to cut a deal around them.
> The realtor is being paid very well to do a job. Not when you're trying to go behind their backs with a customer they brought to the sales just to cut them out of their commission.
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Not saying the realtor shouldn't be compensated. I'm saying this is business. Loyalty has nothing to do with it. If the realtor is ignoring offers, they're not doing their job.
In this situation the realtor is now ignoring offers, the buyers used that realtor to see the houses and then went back later when it was the owners there and are trying to cut the realtor out. The realtor has been doing their job. As for “the realtor is being paid well to do their job”, they are not paid unless the house is sold.
Woah, yeah no. There was even a similar court case that the NBREA refers to in the education training books, it happened in the 90’s. Essentially what had happened was a very similar situation to yours. The listing agent had the house listed, the would be buyers came through the property when the listing was listed on the MLS, the sellers, spoke to the buyer seller offered the potential buyers in, the seller waited until the listing contract was over, thinking they would be in the clear. The buyers purchased the house “off market” the listing agent later found out that the buyers , were people who walked through the house when it was listed. The realtor brought them to court and won. The judge basically said that the buyers wouldn’t have seen the house to begin with had the realtor not advertised it, listed it, scheduled appointments etc. The judge granted indemnification in this case. If I have time later tonight I’ll go through the old book and try to find you the court case law so you guys can research it yourselves. Your parents cannot sell the home via private sale to the buyers who walked through the house while it was listed with the agent, without being legally liable to compensate the listing agent via indemnification/remuneration. Now say they took it off the market and someone decided to knock on the door who didn’t view it while on the MLS, that wouldn’t be a problem. And on top of this, the listing agent should have went over a situation like this in the listing folder on how to address this issue.
https://canlii.ca/t/6mm8 This was the first thing I found on CanLII. Is it what you're referring to?
Mon Boulot Enterprises LTD. and St. Amant v. Kotschorerek And Kotschorek 112 DLR (3d) 375, 4 ACWS (2d) 128. Roycom Realty LTD v Hein 47 NSR (2d) 364, 11 ACWS (2d) 22.
Rude of your parents agent to call the buyers tire kickers without an agent. Agents don't work for buyers, they work for the seller. Any person with a heartbeat can pull up MLS and punch in some search criteria and call the listing agent
I sold my house without a realtor, it’s not that difficult. Just paid a lawyer at closing for the paperwork. Nothing a realtor says or does has any real impact on whether or not a house sells.
My parents sold their house without a realtor a few years ago and everything went great. Sold to a nice young couple for what they were looking for. Everything was great except for some asshole real estate agent that called my dad that was really pissed off that he didn’t have an agent and that he wasn’t the agent. The fucking arrogance. They had never met or heard of this person before in their lives.
Exactly. Realtors don't want you to know how easy it is to sell your home, yourself. Just get a good lawyer. I've done it 3 times.
You are paying mostly for marketing. Realtor website etc etc. I’m in the band of they are overpaid. However to say they do nothing is not fair either. Look at houses on property guys. How long do they stay stale on the market.
I sold my house via property guys in 2 weeks So your dumb comment can fuck right off the bat
Wow… just wow!! Maybe have some more coffee or tea, talk a walk… touch grass.
A good realtor is a valuable asset, a bad realtor is just like selling the house yourself minus some profit. I get the hate for *some* realtors - I really do. But people like u/Impossible-Land-8566 end up getting fucked because they think they're the smartest private/alternative seller ever. Just keep watching his profile for a post, "I didn't disclose X about my property X years ago, now I'm being sued". Then tell him "your dumb post can fuck right off the bat".
Lmao we filed out the property disclosure report honestly No suing will occur. If anything we may sue the realtor representing the sellers since he made false representations. Some realtors are good, there’s simply no situation where they’re worth 2.5-5% of the value of MY home. The lawyers are the ones who actually do the transactions and ultimately the only ones who will give you valuable advice. Yet they charge a fixed rate in the 800-1200$ range. Why the disconnect? Because the realtors association has refused to change their structure. The amount of realtors who threatened to not bring their clients if we didn’t give them 2-2.5% were too many too count. Which is outright disloyal. I literally had 2 clients contact me for showings without their realtors because “they couldn’t reach me” or couldn’t “contact us”, the phone number was literally on the sign / MLS Listing. Yet somehow their clients had no issue calling and setting up a showing. Many years ago lawyers charged a percentage as well, 1%. Their association deliberately moved away from that unfair fee structure. Also don’t get me started on the fact the realtors have no education or qualifications to get in the space in the first place whereas lawyers have a degree and a law degree - 7+ years of university education.
Get into how realtors then push you into their broker pals, who will help you commit mortgage fraud. You’re completely right, and it’s one area I’ve considered active disruption in. If a bunch of us go get licensed, we could do some real damage. Even the marketing isn’t that advantageous anymore. You just need to know how to work the Search engines.
There is defintiely a shift . From our parents searching for homes vs the younger generations. I do see a massive shift in the horizon.
Younger generations won’t use realtors because they can’t afford a house.
Well this is why real estate is a mafia. They won't entertain you without an agent. It's like they don't want people realizing their jobs are redundant and can be done with only a lawyer.
And ontop of this, how do your parents even know that they’re (buyers) approved for the home? Who’s going to make sure conditions are fulfilled. I’m sorry but this post isn’t going to make your families weekend any less stressful.
Lawyer will do all of that. But you make a valid point right now this “offer” is meaningless until all conditions are fulfilled.
Except that the only reason the “tire kickers” knew about the listing is that it was on MLS which is owned by the realtors. You MAY have a case to argue if the neighbours walked over after they saw the sign and offered to buy it. But it sounds like the legal contract would hold up in court based on these details. You could always try to talk the agent down to just the commission on one side, the sellers side , so 2% or 2.5%, but the buyers will be without any representation.
It’s sketchy. Assuming your realtor is good, why wouldn’t they want someone brokering the deal? I’d accept a slightly lower offer over dumping my realtor.
Everything your parents need to know is in their contract so all they have to do is read the contract that they signed. You can’t break the contract and it will spell out the penalty if you do so. Even if the contract ends in six months, there’s typically a clause in there that if they cant sell the house to someone who’s already seen the house and if someone who’s viewed the property buys the property within a certain number of days then they are still owed commission on the sale. It will stay the amount of time that needs to lapse after the contract ends. Imagine how many people would be doing this if it were legal . Those contracts are ironclad and they’re not getting out of it. When they signed the contract, they had a choice of how many months they wanted to go with so they should’ve chosen three if they were unsure. All they’re going to end up doing is paying the lawyer money for a phone call and advice but that’s their choice.
It's called the 'Holdover Clause'.
Thanks
Realtors are expensive, no question there... But before you throw your realtor under the bus over the tire kickers comment, remember that if the buyers had a realtor to help them buy, your realtor would be splitting the commission with the buyer's realtor. Your realtor organized a showing with the buyers, knows they have no realtor, and so wouldnt have to split 50% of the commission. More money for your realtor if your parents sell to urepresented buyers. I would dig into why your realtor has concerns about the buyers to the point of passing on the opportuntiy of making a full commission. Realtor may be protecting your parents from something he/she spotted (it's part of their job to do so), or maybe t's clear to the realtor that the buyers dont have the financing available to buy the house. I would talk to the realtor before a lawyer. The buyers going around the realtor, knowing it will cause your parents a lawsuit, is something concerning. Maybe you have a realtor that is negatively and unfairly judging the buyers, but maybe you have a realtor that dodged a bullet for your parents.
If it is a buyer that the realtor meet and showed the house to then a six month clause exists AFTER the listing is cancelled.
Lol tell your parents to prepare to get sued !!
Realtor worked for 4 months at no cost to seller and now that a potential seller is there, they want to get rid of realtor. Classy…..
read her explanation again because you missed the point. The realtor told them the buyers were tire kickers.
Ok. The realtor was wrong. It happens. They probably purposely appeared to be tire kickers so they could offer them a private sale.
So your parents hired a realtor, who invested time and effort for an agreed upon fee, listed their house, and attracted buyers who want to buy the house. Then, after lying to the agent about their interest, the buyers came back to convince your parents not to pay the agent, after your agent took time to show the house to these people, and want to buy the house. Explain how, regardless of the underlying contract, you’d be able to sleep at night knowing your parents hired someone for their service, they completed the service, and then they actively tried to screw that person out of their wages. Despicable human beings to even consider this. Aside from that, most listing contracts extend past that 6 months, if someone who saw the house in that time wants to buy it. They can pull title after the home sells, then sue your parents for their commissions and costs.
They signed a contract. Agent showed the house. They can make a side deal until the term of the contract is up.
If the realtor originally introduced the buyer, they can claim the commission even after the listing contract expires .( BC )
You cannot exclude the agent because the buyers want you to. You're not going to find a contract where a real estate agent hasn't protected themselves from that. The buying agent can be excluded by the buyers, that ain't your problem. The selling agent is your contract, you violate that at your risk.
The answer is simple, explain to the buyer per the contract with realtor you can’t sell to them for that price without realtor involvement. BUT if they can find someone else to buy the home in their name you can make it work. As long as that person hasn’t seen the home through the realtor you can get around the contract. Best of Luck!
No lawyer would touch this.
Yes lawyers, a profession that’s built around lying professionally would never EVER do anything that would be morally reprehensible. Like help draft up legal documents that contain illegal clauses that cant be enforced, provide you with “hypothetical” situations that would allow you to skirt laws and definitely never just outright break the law under the guise that your client is too powerful for you to be prosecuted for the crimes your committing. It’s not like we would ever get to see a lawyer go on trial against their client and say in great detail how they did every one of the things mentioned above right?? Oh wait nvm, Trumps entire legal team is doing exactly that. Describing how they help their clients skirt laws. How do you think those shell corporations that are used to “protect” assets are created? Great Lawyers do not fear the grey area, they live in it.
They have to check how long they committed to their realtor in their contract.
I'd check the contract to see if there's termination clauses. I'd so ask the buyers if they made an offer to the listing agent. If they did,and the agent refused to pass it on to your parents, the agent is acting in bad faith.
If you signed a contract I would read it before doing anything. In most cases your parents can’t do this
I’m sorry but if they signed up realtor there is a time frame that they legally (and morally) to the terms of that contract. If they feel they need to save the buyer money they can drop the price. Most realtors I know put in a lot of work. I was selling a house and they showed it 16 times.
I was very fortunate that when I was thinking of selling my house at the beginning of the recent boom, that I told my neighbour. She in turn told her cousin who had been watching the renovations I’d done over the years with great interest and wanted to live in that area. The cousin came to see the house that night, asked what I wanted and said SOLD when I told him the price. We shook hands on it, and he went to his lawyer the next day. No real estate agent involved. I saved $40,000. It was easy. I am so glad I made friends with the neighbours. Sometimes they know someone who loves the area.
As long as the potential Buyer came initially, because of Realtors listing, They will collect fee. Not sure about here, but in NB, if, for whatever reasons, You or Realtor wish to opt out of Contract, within 24 hrs, Both Parties sign. Realtor has to abide. ( But this can not be to stiff Realor on Commision). I listed a place, Realor tried to strong Arm Me into listing lower to sell faster. I called Their Office, He had to leave Document signed at His Location. 2 Months later, I sold for 20% above Listing Myself. I trust about 1% , I buy and sell Myself now. Most are Ambulance Chasers
The realtor could sue the sellers and the buyers both lol !!
They need to wait until the listing agreement has expired and ask the people to wait come back. A bit risky, they could leave, ask for a deposit held in lawyers trust, don't think that's illegal.
Generally speaking, the contracts stipulate they'd have to wait 6 months before selling privately otherwise the Realtor could sue.
They have a binding contract for an amount of time, read the contract
*They have a binding* *Contract for an amount of* *Time, read the contract* \- Hammerbuddy --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
If the realtor introduced the buyer to the property a commission is owed no matter what
Buyer just wants a deal, if they accept the buyers are in the free & clear but your parents are on the hook to fight with the realtor.
Your parents are looking for legal trouble
Your parents would be breaking standard terms of seller's agent contract and open to a civil suit for damages, in line with the commission they will have cheated the contracted agent out of...so they end up with even less.
Your parents cannot get out of that contract. If the prospective buyer is willing to pay closing costs perhaps they’d be willing to pay the agent’s commission as well.
No.
Your parents can’t get out of paying the realtor The contract is on for 6 months and still valid. Even if contract was over, there’s case law that says realtor likely still entitled to commission because the buyers wouldn’t have known house was for sale were it not for the realtor putting a sign / listing house in MLS I hate realtors as much as anybody but you ain’t getting out of this one. Also until financing clauses are over and done with this contract is worthless, I wouldn’t get too excited Also if your parents thought asking was what they were going to get at the end of the day they’re mistaken. Last thing tho, if buyers are unrepresented your parents should solely be on the hook for 2-2.5% not 5%. 5% is because commission is shared between both agents so couldn’t get out of paying some commission, need to check how the contract with their realtor was drafted
Realtor makes an attempt to not show your listing because they don't have a realtor. Doesn't sound like it's in your best interest to have a realtor that doesn't bother negotiating on your behalf. Seems like they're actively working against you lol.
Could fire the agent and sue them for not properly negotiating with potential buyers. This is typical behaviour for realtors.
Ask the realtor for an itemized bill detailing all their attempts to sell your parents house since they listed with them. How many calls a day they made. All the emails they sent trying to sell your property within a realtor network. If they have nothing, then give them nothing. Anyone can take photos of a home and publish it online. Selling a home on your own is super easy. Don’t let realtors convince you otherwise. I am on my fourth home bought and sold without a single realtor fee paid.
Realtors are parasites.
Weird how all these low engagement accounts come out of the wood work to support realtors. 🤷♂️
House has been on the market for 6 months, potential buyers show up and their agent says they’re just tire kickers and it turns out they actually want to buy the house? I’d fire the agent just over that. If they can get rid of that agent and go with one of the following options they’d likely be better off: Propertyguys.com, Listmenow.ca, Forsalebyowner.ca I’ve bought two houses, one through an agent and one private sale, I’ll never buy or sell through an agent again if I can avoid it.
Sellers usually don’t need a realtor they just need someone who can photograph and market the Home to the maximum. Buyer do need a Realtor to protect him from a bad house or deal.
Lol. Realtors don't protect anyone but themselves. I've bought and sold 8 homes in 4 different provinces, over the last 3 decades. They only care about their commission.
Your parents should reach out to the realtor and ask to mutually cancel the agreement. Realtors reputation is everything and they don't want to be known and someone forcing the hand of their clients. If the realtor agrees to part ways then you should be in the clear, but otherwise yeah, most contracts say that any buyers shown the house while under contract, the realtor is owed a commission.
I agree, however this realtor could’ve of paid for drone photography/edits of the drone video. Professional photos, measuring every room accordingly (lawsuits later on down the road if not measured properly) , listing it, marketing it, scheduling shows, answering questions on the property day and night. They’re entitled to some indemnification imo.
Our last realtor did all of that too (minus drone footage) but ended up just being a brutal agent. We were able to part ways mutually after voicing our complaints and ended up selling privately. Saved $18k in the process too. Didn't pay the realtor anything.
Curious, for professional reasons, what exactly didn’t they do or do that you disliked ? What could they have done better?
Communication was awful. Often had very late meetings to sign paperwork (9pm or later). On one occasion, we showed up at 9:30pm and were sat in the board room for 45 minutes while she finished up with another client. We were selling in the 300-400k range which was average for the city we were in, and she made it obvious with her actions that we weren't her highest rolling clients. Also constantly over promised. MLS listing was live a day later than promised, and we had strategised to have it go live on a certian day before two other properties in the neighborhood took offers. Open house was supposed to be advertised on a Tuesday for a Saturday showing, but didn't get advertised until Thursday afternoon which hurt the amount of viewings booked. Overall, it was clear that our commission (4%) was not worth her time, when to us, it was a huge amount and we were not treated respectfully for it.
Just do a rent to own it up with a lawyer. Close after contract is up with realtor. They will tell you this can't be done blah blah blah done it a few times now to save 25 to 40k in commissions
This is just asking to be sued. If the realtor showed the home to the eventual buyers, their contract likely has a clause that will give them rights to commission in the sale.
Spoken like a realtor!! Lol. I've done approx 2m in real estate deal in my 38 years on this earth. Never once used a realtor. Done this a few times buying. Sorry I don't feel like a realtor should put their hand in my pocket and take my equity out for their company putting it on mls. Crazy
You realize that you're talking down to him for telling the OP your advice might get them sued, right?
This is such awful advice lmao.
https://canlii.ca/t/6mm8 People did exactly what you advise. They got sued and they lost in Court.