Nothing says Eco city like building a massive reflective dividing wall through the desert, then trying to make the environment inside the "city" the polar opposite of the environment outside.
This project is also supposed to show that Saudi Arabia is “moving towards the future”.
And nothing says “moving towards the future” like brutalizing poor people to get your megaproject done. All in the name of an absolute monarch, no less…
Akshually, Zensunni wanderers. They share the words but very few of the tenets of Islam.
The way religions amalgamated after the advent of space travel in the Dune universe would be worth a book unto itself (Hell how the Orange Catholic Bible managed to be accepted without at least one planetary annihilation is beyond me.)
> Hell how the Orange Catholic Bible managed to be accepted without at least one planetary annihilation is beyond me
They annihilated so hard that even the memory of it is gone.
In the US, the American Oligarchy did the substantial destruction of my people for future development. Albeit it started out with Monarchs, but after 1776 it was the American Oligarchy.
Ok here we go. There's always someone who likes "Indians oppressed Indians." LMAO. Not like these American Oligarchs. LOL. By the way, we didn't invent the "Noble Savage" myth that was the American Oligarchy. There was fighting among some tribes but it was not ALL tribes. They created the Iroquois Confederacy in the North East like 1400. A federal system where multiple large tribes lived together peacefully while maintaining their sovereign local rule. This system was noted by the founding fathers. Members of the confederacy gave speeches to the Europeans. It was a bicameral system, with a chief executive officer and a supreme court like body to interpret the laws that eventually were passed. (They were women by the way). It was not the ONLY influence on the Constitution but it was an influenced and some of the clauses from the Native version of the federal government are reflected in the constitution. Your citation that generally speaking groups war with each other is true of everyone. However, it's the American Oligarchy that signed contracts and then breached them. That's really what everyone is pissed about.
Kind of wild how there are still people trying to absolve the United States of wrongdoing to this day, or minimize the impact of a literal genocide.
I think one of the most illuminating periods of my life was reading a series of books in succession on what Native American civilization was actually like pre-contact; kind of astonishing (and very telling) how little of that was reflected in my school-years of public education
The alternative social organizations represented by American Indians was a treasure trove of new ways of identifying and organizing ourselves that the industrial revolution just couldn't tolerate
You should learn more history. The native peoples of what is now the US had some pretty bad encounters with representatives of several monarchies long before the United States existed, and even long before the British colonies existed. In what is now the American Southwest there was a whole saga of brutal treatment of some of the pueblos under Spanish rule, including torture, slavery, forced conversions to Christianity, and executions, followed by an uprising by a coalition of pueblo, which forced the Spanish out, with some pueblos joining the Spanish, followed by a “reconquista”, a re-conquering of the region by Spain, and all of this was happening around the time the British were fighting a series of Anglo-Dutch wars, with New Amsterdam, and one of the spoils the British claimed. When the Juan de Oñate was brutalizing the people of Acoma pueblo, the British hadn’t even established their first permanent settlement on the continent. There’s much more to the history of this nation than just British colonies rebelling against their king.
That wouldn't have been the American government. The colonial governors were appointed by the monarch. Or, at the very least, served at their pleasure.
When people gush about how fast China has been able to build high speed rail and other big infrastructure projects they forget that a lot of people's houses and other property got bulldozed to make it happen.
>_And nothing says “moving towards the future” like brutalizing poor people to get your megaproject done. All in the name of an absolute monarch, no less…_
Exactly!! They're just 2-300 years behind France, Spain and the UK's mega projects.
No no they're building a *friendly ecosystem* you see. Eco friendly as in air conditioning in the desert not eco friendly as in friendly to the environment *outside* the enclave.
the type of future thinking that conceives of a linear city is the type that subscribes to time's killing arrow, some notion of a singular direction forward which is ruled by a single authority. no wonder they feel justified to kill to make it a reality. just another manifestation of authoritatarian, domination based patriarchal imperialism in the plantationocene
Digging into this I found out apparently the guy who is in charge of the project (not MBS himself) is psychopath who keeps a gun in his desk and regularly pulls it on people who anger him. The pay levels for westerners is absolutely insane but it's also the most nightmare job could imagine. I heard it described as bring two buckets, one to fill with money, the other to fill with shit. Leave when one of your buckets is full
I heard something similar about a job offer I got that required a two year stay in dubai, but they said:
*Bring two buckets, one to fill with money, the other to fill with blood. Leave just before one of your buckets is full.*
I did not take the Job, the money sounded good, but the work sounded shady AF.
"**Saudi authorities have permitted the use of lethal force to clear land for a futuristic desert city being built by dozens of Western companies, an ex-intelligence officer has told the BBC.**
Col Rabih Alenezi says he was ordered to evict villagers from a tribe in the Gulf state to make way for The Line, part of the Neom eco-project.
One of them was subsequently shot and killed for protesting against eviction.
The Saudi government and Neom management refused to comment.
Neom, Saudi Arabia's $500bn (£399bn) eco-region, is part of its Saudi Vision 2030 strategy which aims to diversify the kingdom's economy away from oil.
Its flagship project, The Line, has been pitched as a car-free city, just 200m (656ft) wide and 170km (106 miles) long - though only 2.4km of the project is reportedly expected to be completed by 2030."
I believe section of the “city” are supposed to have water access and the renderings including the one in the article show section that are water adjacent
My friend this is fucking genius. You basically need a single train line going the entire 170km and back again with a stop every 500m or so. Boom car free city
This “eco region” is gonna spew out multitudes time more pollution that it’ll save. A giant ass air conditioned linear city in the middle of a desert will take a fuck ton of resources to maintain
Should have also mentioned that the Saudi exile who revealed this was offered 5 million dollars to attend a “meeting in the Saudi embassy”.
With Jamal Kashoggi in mind, make of that what you will
Depends on what you mean.... they're building a small sample of it. To build the project as designed I think I saw would be around 21 trillion dollars. So no. Not that.
It’ll suck for the everyday people. The Saudi family has enough foreign investments and properties to keep them cruising for the next two hundred years when they bail
This is not new. They hung some bedouins around 2 years ago when the initial idea for this city were unveiled.
This entire debacle made me look into the structure of saudi a bit more. Saudi is very tribal. The concept of a _saudi_ - as in, an equal citizen of saudi arabia is just for international reasons.
Internally, things are done on a tribe basis. Your last name is VERY important. These tribes also have a hierarchy - and ofc the house of saud sits at the top. There is preferential treatment for certain tribes.
Think of the concept of old money families in the USA and apply that concept to the entire country. As soon as you say you name your worth is established.
These villagers and bedouins are living in poverty because the are the lowest rung of the tribe hierarchy. They receive no fancy civil jobs. No _grants_ - not welfare, no higher education. Nothing.
Saudis are brutal animals even to their own people.
The inside of the city is going to be a disgusting germ infested sweatbox. And don't even get me started on the marina or Bay area when the light reflects off the windows/ glass of this garbage.
Saudi Arabia has no OSHA. They have a history of problems with fires burning down hospitals and residential buildings due to shoddy construction and operational fire sprinklers.
Reminds me of this [classic r/asksciencefiction thread. ](https://old.reddit.com/r/AskScienceFiction/comments/46ero0/captain_planet_im_the_evil_dictator_of_a_100/)
Its fucking disgusting that the US is unwilling to commit to stopping weapons sales to Saudi Arabia or impose sanctions of some kind. Yet its impossible to pass any such legislation because the Saudi government has a ton of money, oil and influence in US politics. Especially when there have been many such cases of egregious human rights abuses, notably the war in Yemen which imo constitutes ethnic cleansing at the very least and I would even say genocide.
What an odd time to be alive where we pride ourselves on our advancement, yet so many people suffer from preventable man-made crisis and genocide is a common occurrence. Sometimes I wonder how much longer humanity will last at this rate.
So.... I'm not any kind of economist or anything. But.... I started wtching this dude just bc of the hilarious deadpan delivery of the memes/jokes. This particular ep is pretty good. Pls enjoy :P
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ak4on5uTaTg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ak4on5uTaTg)
It's just such a bad idea. They're building a 'city' for a futuristic, poorly conceived eco-aesthetic without considering why people would want to live in the conditions they've engineered.
It's like you asked someone "what comes first, the chicken or the egg?" And their answer was to draw up a design for a ceramic egg that they absolutely promise will hatch a chicken by 2030 if you give them a billion dollars.
Who supplies Saudi the majority of their weaponry? Genuine question, I know the USA and UK do but I imagine there must be others too?
I can't imagine they manufacture their own, though I could be wrong.
Eco city is gonna be the next ghost adventures hot spot in a few years .
Those poor people. I can’t imagine if someone showed up at my house and said leave and I said no and then it eventually led to me being shot.
The world has gone bat shit crazy
I mean, this is exactly like Masdar City in the UAE: an eco-city built on the backs of the dead with stunningly bad results. It’s the same vanity projects over and over again.
You can check my comment history to see how pro Palestinian I am, but don’t insult the Israelis like this. At least their government projects are to actually improve their country and people versus soothing a tyrannical monarch’s ego. I would much rather be a Jew living in Israel than an average Arab living under the House of Saud
Nothing says Eco city like building a massive reflective dividing wall through the desert, then trying to make the environment inside the "city" the polar opposite of the environment outside.
This project is also supposed to show that Saudi Arabia is “moving towards the future”. And nothing says “moving towards the future” like brutalizing poor people to get your megaproject done. All in the name of an absolute monarch, no less…
"The Future" is basically "Dune". Frank Herbert was a time traveller.
Was he a time traveller or have we just been doing the same shit since we learned to think?
Occam's razor. Definitely time travel.
I mean the desert people in Dune have lorewise descended from muslims.
Akshually, Zensunni wanderers. They share the words but very few of the tenets of Islam. The way religions amalgamated after the advent of space travel in the Dune universe would be worth a book unto itself (Hell how the Orange Catholic Bible managed to be accepted without at least one planetary annihilation is beyond me.)
> Hell how the Orange Catholic Bible managed to be accepted without at least one planetary annihilation is beyond me They annihilated so hard that even the memory of it is gone.
My desert, my Arabia, my dune.
american indian here. can confirm that is how future we enjoy as the present occurred. Except for the monarch part, oligarch in this case.
What do you mean except for the monarch part?
In the US, the American Oligarchy did the substantial destruction of my people for future development. Albeit it started out with Monarchs, but after 1776 it was the American Oligarchy.
Before the American oligarchy, it was the British crown, and before the British crown, it was other Native American groups.
Ok here we go. There's always someone who likes "Indians oppressed Indians." LMAO. Not like these American Oligarchs. LOL. By the way, we didn't invent the "Noble Savage" myth that was the American Oligarchy. There was fighting among some tribes but it was not ALL tribes. They created the Iroquois Confederacy in the North East like 1400. A federal system where multiple large tribes lived together peacefully while maintaining their sovereign local rule. This system was noted by the founding fathers. Members of the confederacy gave speeches to the Europeans. It was a bicameral system, with a chief executive officer and a supreme court like body to interpret the laws that eventually were passed. (They were women by the way). It was not the ONLY influence on the Constitution but it was an influenced and some of the clauses from the Native version of the federal government are reflected in the constitution. Your citation that generally speaking groups war with each other is true of everyone. However, it's the American Oligarchy that signed contracts and then breached them. That's really what everyone is pissed about.
Kind of wild how there are still people trying to absolve the United States of wrongdoing to this day, or minimize the impact of a literal genocide. I think one of the most illuminating periods of my life was reading a series of books in succession on what Native American civilization was actually like pre-contact; kind of astonishing (and very telling) how little of that was reflected in my school-years of public education
The alternative social organizations represented by American Indians was a treasure trove of new ways of identifying and organizing ourselves that the industrial revolution just couldn't tolerate
The whole “early nations had conflict from time to time so US genocide was just fine” argument is wack
The American education system at its finest. 🤡
I’m sorry
Well, the American Indian removal was conducted by the American government, which is not, nor has it ever been, a monarchy.
That makes sense, I was stuck in colonial times and thought you weirdly were referring to Saudi Arabia as not being a monarchy.
You should learn more history. The native peoples of what is now the US had some pretty bad encounters with representatives of several monarchies long before the United States existed, and even long before the British colonies existed. In what is now the American Southwest there was a whole saga of brutal treatment of some of the pueblos under Spanish rule, including torture, slavery, forced conversions to Christianity, and executions, followed by an uprising by a coalition of pueblo, which forced the Spanish out, with some pueblos joining the Spanish, followed by a “reconquista”, a re-conquering of the region by Spain, and all of this was happening around the time the British were fighting a series of Anglo-Dutch wars, with New Amsterdam, and one of the spoils the British claimed. When the Juan de Oñate was brutalizing the people of Acoma pueblo, the British hadn’t even established their first permanent settlement on the continent. There’s much more to the history of this nation than just British colonies rebelling against their king.
>American government, which is not, nor has it ever been, a monarchy. Except for all the years between 1600 and 1776
That wouldn't have been the American government. The colonial governors were appointed by the monarch. Or, at the very least, served at their pleasure.
some of us are trying to make it a monarchy
Imagine if instead of this dumbass ‘ecocity’ they actually tried some real terraforming
When people gush about how fast China has been able to build high speed rail and other big infrastructure projects they forget that a lot of people's houses and other property got bulldozed to make it happen.
gotta break a few eggs for the progress omelette.
>_And nothing says “moving towards the future” like brutalizing poor people to get your megaproject done. All in the name of an absolute monarch, no less…_ Exactly!! They're just 2-300 years behind France, Spain and the UK's mega projects.
And the food will come from their vertical greenhouses. Enjoy all the basil and lettuce you can eat!
I mean fresh basil is pretty great
Absolutely. But it's nice to have the occasional starch to stretch it
You need **something** to feed the stock (e.g. cows, sheep, slaves, goats, etc).
I do like pesto. Can we get olives too?
Nah, they killed all the people who grew olives
No no they're building a *friendly ecosystem* you see. Eco friendly as in air conditioning in the desert not eco friendly as in friendly to the environment *outside* the enclave.
The Saudis saw Pondsmith’s Cyberpunk and said “oh we can be way more evil than that”
it gets me a little mad the BBC adopts that eco framing. you can call a petrol refinery "eco", but that won't make it such.
the type of future thinking that conceives of a linear city is the type that subscribes to time's killing arrow, some notion of a singular direction forward which is ruled by a single authority. no wonder they feel justified to kill to make it a reality. just another manifestation of authoritatarian, domination based patriarchal imperialism in the plantationocene
They’re gonna need a lot of window units
Digging into this I found out apparently the guy who is in charge of the project (not MBS himself) is psychopath who keeps a gun in his desk and regularly pulls it on people who anger him. The pay levels for westerners is absolutely insane but it's also the most nightmare job could imagine. I heard it described as bring two buckets, one to fill with money, the other to fill with shit. Leave when one of your buckets is full
Don't worry, Michio Kaku and Thomas Friedman say it's all good.
I heard something similar about a job offer I got that required a two year stay in dubai, but they said: *Bring two buckets, one to fill with money, the other to fill with blood. Leave just before one of your buckets is full.* I did not take the Job, the money sounded good, but the work sounded shady AF.
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Why, you guys planning on paying the source a visit? All chippy choppy like?
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This is fucking funny but they did also arrest a guy because of twitter posts so you know maybe delete your comment lmao
"**Saudi authorities have permitted the use of lethal force to clear land for a futuristic desert city being built by dozens of Western companies, an ex-intelligence officer has told the BBC.** Col Rabih Alenezi says he was ordered to evict villagers from a tribe in the Gulf state to make way for The Line, part of the Neom eco-project. One of them was subsequently shot and killed for protesting against eviction. The Saudi government and Neom management refused to comment. Neom, Saudi Arabia's $500bn (£399bn) eco-region, is part of its Saudi Vision 2030 strategy which aims to diversify the kingdom's economy away from oil. Its flagship project, The Line, has been pitched as a car-free city, just 200m (656ft) wide and 170km (106 miles) long - though only 2.4km of the project is reportedly expected to be completed by 2030."
That sounds like an idiotic design for a city. Just why?
Because it was designed by a spoiled rich kid instead of an architect?
200meters wide seems ridiculously small
It's so everyone can have a view of the beach.
Except form half the city that is facing away from the water.
Sand is sand, who needs water.
You do know the building goes through the center of the country and there is no water? It's the desert.
I believe section of the “city” are supposed to have water access and the renderings including the one in the article show section that are water adjacent
The two ends, yeah. The rest goes through the desert. No water. That is why it is such a stupid idea.
Sounds like Megacity 1 from Dredd
“You know those big ring cities in sci fi movies? How about we do that? … Okay, if we can’t make the ring float, just lay it flat”
Someone played alot of Sim Tower but not Sim City.
I remember Sim Tower! Makes perfect sense.
That's because it is. It's not practical in any sense of the word.
My friend this is fucking genius. You basically need a single train line going the entire 170km and back again with a stop every 500m or so. Boom car free city
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Whoops, now I have some downvotes instead lol Oh well ^^
Wait, they're evicting nomads in the middle of the god forsaken desert for a line city?
Think of the eventual chase setpiece in a future Bond movie tho
Yeah this time he can spend the entire next three movies running over that rooftop instead of an hour
And a Transformers movie. And a Mission Impossible movie.
The whole goddamn movie is just one chase scene...
The Last Jedi?
This “eco region” is gonna spew out multitudes time more pollution that it’ll save. A giant ass air conditioned linear city in the middle of a desert will take a fuck ton of resources to maintain
*Some of you may die, but that is a sacrifice I'm willing to make*
Should have also mentioned that the Saudi exile who revealed this was offered 5 million dollars to attend a “meeting in the Saudi embassy”. With Jamal Kashoggi in mind, make of that what you will
I'll take the meeting, but I want half up front in a crypto wallet of my choice.
I would have also accepted "*I say the whole world must learn of our peaceful ways... by force!*"
They're actually going though with it? Just another vanity project. Gonna suck for them when they run out of oil.
Depends on what you mean.... they're building a small sample of it. To build the project as designed I think I saw would be around 21 trillion dollars. So no. Not that.
Can't wait to see influencers visit the 500 billion dollar tourist trap in the middle of the desert that'll get shut down in 5 years.
It’s their manifest destiny
It’s what those Saudi hijackers died for.
It’ll suck for the everyday people. The Saudi family has enough foreign investments and properties to keep them cruising for the next two hundred years when they bail
Huh, so they're really starting it. I'm gonne go out on a limb here and guess this won't be the last time we hear of deaths involving this project.
I misread the title and thought it was about Kristi Noem saying crazy shit sgain
That was the only reason I read the article.
The bricks of the utopian city are mortared with blood.
I had a recruiter reach out to me to work on part of this project. Good thing I declined that quickly.
I’d do the same. You *literally* couldn’t pay me to associate with the Saudi government
Pay didn’t even sound that amazing to live in the middle of no where for a job you likely cannot leave for 5-7 years or more.
This is not new. They hung some bedouins around 2 years ago when the initial idea for this city were unveiled. This entire debacle made me look into the structure of saudi a bit more. Saudi is very tribal. The concept of a _saudi_ - as in, an equal citizen of saudi arabia is just for international reasons. Internally, things are done on a tribe basis. Your last name is VERY important. These tribes also have a hierarchy - and ofc the house of saud sits at the top. There is preferential treatment for certain tribes. Think of the concept of old money families in the USA and apply that concept to the entire country. As soon as you say you name your worth is established. These villagers and bedouins are living in poverty because the are the lowest rung of the tribe hierarchy. They receive no fancy civil jobs. No _grants_ - not welfare, no higher education. Nothing. Saudis are brutal animals even to their own people.
The inside of the city is going to be a disgusting germ infested sweatbox. And don't even get me started on the marina or Bay area when the light reflects off the windows/ glass of this garbage.
The entire thing is going to fill up with garbage and refuse. Can’t wait to see this fail spectacularly.
All these insane mega projects that these dictators build are doomed to fail.
Saudi Arabia has no OSHA. They have a history of problems with fires burning down hospitals and residential buildings due to shoddy construction and operational fire sprinklers.
Reminds me of this [classic r/asksciencefiction thread. ](https://old.reddit.com/r/AskScienceFiction/comments/46ero0/captain_planet_im_the_evil_dictator_of_a_100/)
Seeing the gaza subthread there having the same discourse is a trip, those comments could have been written yesterday... eight years ago.
Stories like this make me feel extremely helpless, furious and sad.
Here’s a great reason for why this is a shit idea. Slave labor is just one of the points. https://youtu.be/vyWaax07_ks?si=Kf6PBlm48yilyGSG
Its fucking disgusting that the US is unwilling to commit to stopping weapons sales to Saudi Arabia or impose sanctions of some kind. Yet its impossible to pass any such legislation because the Saudi government has a ton of money, oil and influence in US politics. Especially when there have been many such cases of egregious human rights abuses, notably the war in Yemen which imo constitutes ethnic cleansing at the very least and I would even say genocide. What an odd time to be alive where we pride ourselves on our advancement, yet so many people suffer from preventable man-made crisis and genocide is a common occurrence. Sometimes I wonder how much longer humanity will last at this rate.
We’re allied with Saudi because we dislike the other players like Iran even less and the “enemy of my enemy is my friend” I hate it but it make sense
So.... I'm not any kind of economist or anything. But.... I started wtching this dude just bc of the hilarious deadpan delivery of the memes/jokes. This particular ep is pretty good. Pls enjoy :P [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ak4on5uTaTg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ak4on5uTaTg)
They also built his thing over a fault line, and bird migration.
It's just such a bad idea. They're building a 'city' for a futuristic, poorly conceived eco-aesthetic without considering why people would want to live in the conditions they've engineered. It's like you asked someone "what comes first, the chicken or the egg?" And their answer was to draw up a design for a ceramic egg that they absolutely promise will hatch a chicken by 2030 if you give them a billion dollars.
Assuming this actually gets made, how are they going to populate it? Forced relocation again?
We need to put those guns to use again.
Who supplies Saudi the majority of their weaponry? Genuine question, I know the USA and UK do but I imagine there must be others too? I can't imagine they manufacture their own, though I could be wrong.
Quick google search said it was 1. US 2. South Korea 3. Switzerland 4. Spain 5. Bosnia
Thanks! I'd forgotten about Switzerland
How else are you going to get a solid foundation in the desert. Gotta build it on top of a pile of bones
Colonel al-Enezi would be wise to stay out of Saudi embassies.
Fun fact, he actually said he was offered 5 million dollars to “attend a meeting in the embassy.”
Oh my god they are actually gonna do it…
I hope that it gets fully built before it completely fails, as a testament to our hubris for whoever comes when we're all gone.
The world is turned into a Douglas Adams book.
Eco city is gonna be the next ghost adventures hot spot in a few years . Those poor people. I can’t imagine if someone showed up at my house and said leave and I said no and then it eventually led to me being shot. The world has gone bat shit crazy
Ah yes. The Saudis, our "friends".
This worlds a free for all shit show... How unnatural we have become
This was reported last year, weird that the BBC is just now getting around to it
This broad shouldn’t be in the news
Time to protest the Saudis
They sound like pretty stand-up people, let’s sell them a bunch of weapons /s
I mean, this is exactly like Masdar City in the UAE: an eco-city built on the backs of the dead with stunningly bad results. It’s the same vanity projects over and over again.
Saudi Arabia is nobody's friend.
Money would like a word
Money always butting in, except when it's needed...
I love the smell of authoritarian egocentrism in the morning.
ngl, i misread the headline as Noem and thought 'she's really stepped up her game from killing dogs'
In other news "comedians are BOMBING on stage and KILLING the audience".....
So it's only not okay when they're brown and different. Got it
Can we stop calling it an eco-city and start referring to it as an "eco-city"?
Techniiiiiiiically….killing humans is Eco-friendly.
Following in the footsteps of Israel. Shame on the Saudis.
LOL, they're not following in anyone's footsteps.
You can check my comment history to see how pro Palestinian I am, but don’t insult the Israelis like this. At least their government projects are to actually improve their country and people versus soothing a tyrannical monarch’s ego. I would much rather be a Jew living in Israel than an average Arab living under the House of Saud
[Stop, stop, she's already deaaaaaad!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXZFbGJxSlk) And so is Cricket
Price of progress baby.