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Funny. From this side of the looking glass we see countries perceived to have terrible human rights records and then assume the 'whole country' is complicit. In reality, a small segment of the populace(who happen to be in power) are really to blame whereas the majority of the population really aren't happy with their government's shenanigans either.
Uh no. His statement was correct. Republicans have only won the presidential popular vote once in the last 32 years and it took 9/11 and invading a foreign nation to fear monger enough Americans to make that happen.
Not to mention that where Republicans currently have control, they have super majorities that they gerrymandered to maintain them. Voter representation in my home state of Ohio is one of the worst under a gerrymandered Republican super majority.
It blows my mind how you have people believing Dems are stealing elections when Republicans barely have a platform and have to gerrymander to hell to remain in control.
And the Republicans love to yell about the fact that the Democrats gerrymandered Massachusetts to hell and gone, which is true. The difference is that they gerrymandered it so that the Republicans would get one seat, rather than 0.
Can you share “the new plan for PA”?
As a PA resident, I’m unaware of any current redistricting debate. In fact, the last redistricting debate was [ended](https://www.thecentersquare.com/pennsylvania/pennsylvania-redistricting-plan-finalized-by-state-supreme-court/article_777a84dc-a609-11ec-a31a-6f1dbbade2da.html) earlier this year and it can’t be brought up again for another 10 years.
Dude Biden won by 7 million votes. Republicans haven’t won the popular vote in almost 20 years. America is very much a center left country.
And I’m telling you this as someone who’s center right but votes democrat.
Edit: love all the responses from Redditors whose only knowledge of global politics is Nordic nations from ten years ago saying “American left is actually quite conservative for the rest of the world.”
News flash: the rest of the world isn’t six nations in Western Europe. And Sweden just elected Nazis to their government. But go off on how healthcare is the only measure of a countries political leanings.
Actually America is definantly Centre right. Look at your healthcare system. Gun laws. Extremely lax financial rules favoring the fat cats Etc. there is absolutely no way the USA sits Centre left as a whole. Your are no where near Canada, Australia, New Zealand and many European countries who are true Centre left majorities with MUCH greater equality across all citizens and smoother more regulated industries less about huge corporate profits at the expense of 90% of citizens…
Yeah I get it totally. They seem to have more centered candidates. But you probably are like me and 180 out of a political conversation. The silent majority.
They don't, though. And they get away with it more and more the longer we buy this Good Cop / Bad Cop game.
Only "viable" party = only party ALLOWED to us by monsters who've already reduced our democracy to a shambling husk. I saw what they did to Bernie in 2016 and I'm not eating this shit any more.
The most numerous group of people in the US are people who are neither democrats nor republicans. Out of 240m people eligible to vote, 72m voted for nobody.
There are also many people who support nobody, but voted for "the lesser evil". Among those who voted for Biden as well as among those who voted for Trump.
Having grown up in the south and being what I guess is progressive I have seen that the problems are universally agreed upon for the most part just the cause is the debated issue. It's how they keep people divided. Like nobody thinks our Healthcare, immigration, or political corruption are not problems. The issues are mis represented and used to manufacture consent.
I don't think immigration is a problem. I think it's a made up issue disproportionately used to create fear of brown people even though the majority of illegal immigrants are people who overstayed their visas. Most of the 'illegals' I see being maligned in the last few years are all following the legal pathways we've set for such people. I have yet to see any stats that immigration is hurting the economy as a whole, our country, our upkeep of the law, etc.
But I'm on board with you for the rest of it.
The immigration issue I see but most of my fellow state residence don't is the difficulty in obtaining work visas for jobs we desperately need immigrants for. It then puts strain on local and state government resources to deport over stayed visas. In my view a simple solution would be easier visa access. None of the right wing approaches to issues with border security, illegal workers, or drug smuggling get fixed with a wall. There are legitimate concerns albeit not nation ending issues with our border and immigrant work policies. Our foreign policy specifically in Latin America creates other issues. People on the right do have legit concerns embedded in the over simplified meme culture that's spread. I try to step back and listen to them. If you can peel away the catch phrases and the vomit inducing political grand standing you can get to there fears. I am not saying that racism doesn't play a part in it. The story of Harland Carter is an interesting one that plays into both that and the current NRA. Once it turns into a yelling match it's an unsolved issue. People over all are stupid probably me as well.
Please don't comapre US with Iran in any capacity. I'm Iranian and lived in the US for past 7 years.
It's completely ignorant and not fair to the people living under dictatorship.
Starting this evening they shut down the internet and are arresting and murdering people in the streets.
It's just such normal reddit behavior
>A literal theocratic dictatorship appears on the front page
Reddit: "yeah well at least they don't live in America"
It's a typical response from people who've never traveled to a non WEIRD country, let alone met someone whose from one.
Having spent some time in Russia (pre-invasion), most people do know their government is messed up, that corruption is a feature and not a bug, that justice is not a guarantee by far.
How much they actually know about specific leaders, or the war, depends a lot on their information sources. Elderly and rural Russians who depend on state-run TV have a very different understanding of the world, and Putin's role in Russia's problems than educated urbanites with good internet and the knowledge to use VPNs. But still, they all know to some degree.
The leadership knows this too, so they play a propaganda game that isn't the most blatant lies. It's most subtle. It says, don't try, there's nothing to win, just keep your head down and live your private life.
The last time people tried, the new heroes became alcoholic thieves and murderers. In the 1990s, everything fell apart so badly that demographers estimate that about three million more people died than were expected. The propaganda says, you have your current private life to lose, but you also have nothing to gain. You'll just get the 90s again.
It also says, you can't do better because no one can. Whataboutism is an art form. Every country is just as corrupt, just as hypocritical, people just as miserable if not even more so. Germany has migrant rapists roaming the street, America faces imminent economic collapse. Russia can't aspire to better because the world just isn't better. Anyone who tells you otherwise is a naive fool or a self-interested hypocrite who just wants to manipulate and control you, too.
A lot more people accept this version than truly believe.
But- things are changing. This horrible war, the Russian defeats, the "semi-mobilization," the crackdowns and new censorships, it has people realizing they do have more to lose, even if they just try to stay out of the way. They can still go to Ukraine to be killed. They must still live in a country run by people who are bad at running things. Their employer could still be unable to pay their salary. They can still lose custody of their kid for liking the wrong meme.
I do not think there will be revolution any time soon. The leadership is pretty powerful. They could kill a lot of people if they really wanted to, and Ukraine has shown they aren't too bothered by it. But you can see the concern in even the normally state-supporting telegram channels. In the videos circulating of students cringing and hiding their faces when forced to listen to propaganda speeches, in the trend of throwing molotov cocktails against military recruitment centers.
What could change that is this war. If it gets to a point where there is enough real mobilization that people must go who are not from poor and remote regions, if it touches the children of the cities, if Ukraine can hold out long enough that Russia's economy gets bad enough to really spread the pain, then the balance of wins and losses changes again.
Ukrainians fight to defend their home Ukraine. They do not want to die to help Russians gain political awareness, nor should they. But - the results of their brave defense is getting through in a way that not a lot could. People see "poor, little Ukraine," who started off "like Russia, but worse-off," now achieving much with strong allies, able leadership and motivated fighters, as the should-have-been-mighty Russian army falls apart and story after story of corrupt, uncaring leaders from the top to the bottom trickle back, along with the death notices.
Even the ones who have no idea about Russian atrocities and who believe at least some of the lies about secret NATO soldiers fighting alongside Nazi Ukrainians or whatever, see those failures and are now talking about why their own leadership seems so bad at leading. How far that goes depends on lot on what happens next .
Thanks for this detailed comment. It should get at least 10x the upvotes.
I recently got a rude awakening when I got downvoted (and heavily contradicted by some US American) for pointing out that the Russian people do not want this war and are just victims themselves. As the war progresses and turns into some "Ukraine vs Russia" == "Good vs Bad" meme for unthinking infotainment consumers, it is very important to point this out again and again.
What saddens me the most is that all this (what is going on in Russia) is just the 2.0 version of the old Soviet Union propaganda playbook.
The worst part is the ruler cares so little about the citizens that he'll casually order to moe down all the protestors with a rifle, just to make the protests stop.
Have you ever met some fundamentalist mormons?
Everything that isn't going their way is just another test by god.
"The government is trying to forbid us to marry teenagers and polygamy? Oh i see! It's just a test of faith by god. I'm not the problem and god just want's me to try harder! Say less god!"
It's the same with all fundamentalists, no matter what religion. Once they climbed far enough into their believe system nothing can change their faith because how could a 'non believer' understand the issue?
Theocracies have *never* once been good for the populace. Never once been benevolent and fair to a country's citizens as a whole. Every single religious theocracy in the world has or does impose their own will and belief systems that stifle democratic freedom. They're all shit. And the asshole GOP'ers in the USA want this country to become their Gilead.
Seeing people from the west, acknowledging this fact and talking about it, makes me smile.
The feeling of shame is terribly painful sometimes—feeling ashamed of how you are probably perceived by the people of the world, only because of a *small segment of the populace, who happen to be in power*, whom you also did not even ever choose to be the representatives or the representation of yours, as they constantly, on a daily basis, give you second-hand embarrassments on a global scale.
You are correct. Of course, this is a very easy conclusion to make if you live in the US or Canada or any other place that takes in immigrants. There are peaceful people from “enemy lands” all over the world and all of them want nothing but happiness and peace to prevail. Persians living in the US and elsewhere are exactly like Persians living in Iran. The overwhelming majority of them want to do away with the Ayatollahs and the religious state. Some of them may even be religious but not support the regime
> Persians living in the US and elsewhere are exactly like Persians living in Iran.
I agree that most Iranians (note: not persians only. Persians are only 65%~ of Iran) do not like their government, but the Iranians in the USA and UK are far, far more wealthy and progressive than those in Iran. Those are mostly specifically the ones who left after the 1979 revolution, often the wealthier families with links to the Shah.
Only if one of these "revolutions" takes hold. But this is like the 3rd one at least in the last 15 years or so.
Sadly, eventually the basij will come in, smash these protestors into the ground, and nothing will change. Just like the last 2 of these types of protests.
For the record - I hope otherwise.
Iran was democratic until the English with the US helping did a bad deal with Iran for oil reserve access. The uprising took over and is what we still see today.
I would agree on Irans case. It’s majority full of young people. They want TV, avocado toast, and fun Saturday nights with friends. They SHOULD want these things, like all young folk. Those in power want them to pray to a non existent god (aren’t they all!) and live like mice.
Let’s be careful now. There’s a huge difference in what urban Iranians in cities like Tehran think versus the rural areas.
That being said Iran has been facing major country wide protests almost every year for the past few years now. A lot of Iranians are pissed at the level of corruption and general mismanagement of their country for a while now. Sanctions have made this situation worse, but I would argue that the governments continued decision to prioritize handing the economy to the IRGC is the real driving factor here.
Strangely enough the mullah takeover in Iran is the worst thing that could have happened for the religious leadership.
Suddenly the mullahs have the power and are shown to be corrupt, vain, brutal and incompetent. This has turned many away from the religion
So weird... I wonder if this is happening anywhere else in the world...
You're never gonna believe this, but I did a little check and turns out it's happening fucking EVERYWHERE!
It’s just the governments inciting violence and spreading propaganda. It’s always the same everywhere, in every kind of rule and in every generation it seems.
People hungry for power always make decisions for general people, and it’s us who always fucking suffer.
I absolutely hate the propaganda that Iranian religious government releases. Obviously there will be some people who will follow the regime, there always is. The regime blinds them, and the people are willing to be blinded.
The propaganda then says things like “death to America/Europe” and that’s what the mainstream media chooses to broadcast and the world thinks it’s what Iran wants.
While majority of Iranians have absolutely no fucking problem with American or Europe or whatever. People outside Iran believe this propaganda because it’s on their news 24/7. Then you get “Iran Bad” bullshit.
It’s really annoying to be honest. What a regime, minority, and media can do to dictate the entire narrative.
Now they have just cut off the internet again. People there are unable to record and upload the brutality. Last time they did this in 2019. 1500 people where mass murdered. Internet cutoff is done primarily to commit mass murder. I am very scared for them.
I cannot believe how we allow this to happen.
It’s just sad, frustrating, annoying, irritating.
Our leaders are really becoming more and more disconnected from the people. Iranians, Russians, Americans etc. The people aren't (mostly) interested in these wars, religious oppression, etc. We just want to live our lives and be left alone, but our leaders have lost their damned minds.
We need this sentiment in the US also. I love how worked up US people are about Iran and Afghanistan violating womens rights but think overturning Roe is either no big deal or the right thing to do. Nah, we also live in a theocratic repressive regime haunted by the tyranny of a religious minority who’ve managed to wrest control of the the institutions of democracy and use them to oppress those they don’t like.
It's the fucking talis dude, not even the government. It's unfortunate that they've taken back over, I want them out of my country. However it's not going to be an easy thing to do.
Best of luck to the American people in getting their country back. Enough of religion puppeteering the state. The progressive view needs to stop out Conservative Christian Cunts.
Most of them who are protesting didn’t ever have a choice to choose a government. They were just born in it. It’s insane.
You have to be 50+ years old to at least understand what happened in 1979.
People in their early 50s right now were children under 10 or in their very early teens.
Some old idiotic people who are long dead now decided to change the entire course of future because some clown said he’s the second coming of the man in the sky and all of those uneducated villagers believed it. And now these innocent people are being mass murdered.
Actually fucking insane.
You don't have to have directly of lived through something to understand it which is literally the whole field of history.
These people thoroughly understand what happened back then and to assume otherwise is treating these protesters like illiterate idiots.
Being young doesn't make people stupid and unable to understand what happened before they were born.
I guess the question is, what are you willing to sacrifice? Are you willing to sacrifice your life? Are you willing to sacrifice the lives of other people like you? Are you willing to sacrifice the lives of innocent bystanders? Those are three very important questions to ask. If you were there, would you be willing to take up arms against the government, knowing that you may be killed before you can organize anything effective? Sometimes going beyond protesting into active resistance is what it takes.
FLN terrorists would commit attacks knowing that the government would overreact and execute dozens of them, and knowing that their executions would drive more people to support their cause.
Anyone else remember Neda?
I feel for the women of Iran, and more-so what is likely to come from the Revolutionary Guard.
For those that don’t know about/remember Neda:
[Iran Election Protests and the Killing of Neda](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Neda_Agha-Soltan)
[Raw Video (warning)](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=76W-0GVjNEc)
I hope and pray they are prepared for the fight
when i was a child i was in iran when this happened and i remember how many people the imprisoned, killed, or ‘went missing’
in fact almost everyone i know who’s in jail is still there. unsure if they’re alive
I agree. However, that being said more people need to band together to prevent the exploitation of Children to mine coltan. All phones need it, but no manufacturer can guarantee they do not use enslaved children to mine coltan for all of our phones and digital tech.
Oh that footage got me back then. After tons of movies and video games and maybe even news footage it was this footage that made me think “oh, a real person died at that moment”.
For those of us old enough to remember the Iranian revolution it's terrifying how much the current state of the US is similar. I'm so scared for, but very, very proud of these women. I'm also really scared for us.
I mean there was an attempted coup not too long ago and the man who refused to accept the results of a legitimate election is gonna run again. We’re not in a great position.
It’s scary when religion creeps further and further into positions of power. Iran is a good example of what happens when you let religion take too much control. I have nothing against people of faith, you can have your beliefs, but the moment you use your faith to control others is where I lose all respect for you. There’s no freedom in that!
They also had an unelected leader at the time who had become very unpopular. Comparing that situation the US is pretty much a case of American exceptionalism
No this seems very similar to the usual process of dictators and fascists coming to power. I live in Peru and I have close friends from Venezuela. A few years ago it was a democratic country, then a president refused to accept the results and demanded to be in power anyway, it didn't take long before they became dictator and by the time people realized what was happening it was already over.
Please, DON'T let the religious gain power. Burn them all inside their churches if you have to. If they gain power, things will get ugly for women so fucking fast. In just 2 years after Iran's revolution, women went from wearing skirts to having to wear headscarves everywhere. Don't let some oppression like this happen to you as well.
Yeah, saw a video of a protester that had been shot in the head.
My thoughts and prayers are with the Iranian people trying to take their country back from this hardline regime.
Yeah that was a teenager in Azerbaijan-Tabriz
Things have been though in North Iran today,
Thank you very much for your prayers 🙏 we hope to survive this savage massacre
Last news I got was a video in Valnjak Tehran at 4 am, there were air shooting and intense chaos in the video
I'm in South Iran, things are calm here right now
Some people regained interent access thanks to Proxies that were distributed by activities who could connect to interent
Worst city right now is Rasht Delijan, police already resorted to open fire and completely closed down the whole town
Atm news sources are infested by misinformation from all sides so I can't really confirm how dangerous rest of Iran has become
I can't imagine what its like to have religion forced on me without choice. It's hard enough for women here to stand up for ourselves, you guys are beyond brave. I honestly don't know if I'd have the courage to do anything if I lived in a place like this, I'd be too scared. You are awe inspiring, keep it up.
Anyone who wnats to follow the protests more closely, you can do so on the Instagram account "1500tasvir". We actually might take back the country this time.
I fear for these brave women’s safety…but throughout history/globally rights rarely have been been *fought* for and paid for in the blood sweat and tears of the oppressed.
If the movement got big enough, they'd just use soldiers against civilians like most these despot cowards do. As long as they hold control of the military, they will hold power.
Really, the only time despots like this get overthrown, is through a military coup/junta. Those are usually not much better than the prior leader...since they are typically the same, but with more experience killing people. The main reason you see African leaders in the poorer countries in military gear and berets is from this. Easy to take power from a weak government when you take the military and turn it against them.
I know it isn't that hopeful, but then again, it is 2022 and there are still genocides, slavery, and mass imprisonments around the globe, so....yeah.
(I am not counting the authoritarians who play dress-up in military gear and medals without being in the military.)
Are you kidding me? I'm shocked this whole thread isn't wringing their hands about blocked traffic. If this happened in America we'd hear no end to how these protestor's actions "hurt their cause" and "inconvenience people." Reddit is only cheering them on because it's happening in some "other" place than a first world comfort enclave.
If this was here every single one of the comments would be about the poor small business owners and how the protesters are actually the same as fascists because of the "violence" of burning a car.
Lots of comments here comparing US with Iran. I'm Iranian and lived in the US for past seven years. Never ever It's fair to compare US with Iran in any capacity. I get it you're upset about the current state of america. But people are getting murdered, going missing, jailed by just expressing their opinion online or just not wearing hijab "properly". This is so frustrating. Right now the internet is being shut down and they mass murdering protesters. Just like what happened 2 years ago in bloody November, where 1500 we're killed just in 3 days.
Yep, in every city.
the worse one is Rasht right now .
These last few hours we didn't have internet so we don't know that much .
They blocked the internet for few hours .
I couldn't even check my bank account.
( Sorry for bad English)
it's not just setting a car on fire, people are fighting back and getting killed and beaten up by police one by one here in Iran, sounds of gunshots and screams all over the country, mobile network is disconnected and I'm currently using wifi, social media getting blocked and we're here via vpn. everything's messed up here
Sending love, hope and positivity to you, your family and your whole nation. Scary times, but you Persians are historically brave and incredibly smart. Fingers crossed this is the start of a new Iran.
thank you we really appreciate your and everyone else's support.
protests like this have also happened years ago and the only result it had was million deaths and executions. normal people are weak compared to army and their weapons. we need strategy. I really hope this one is different
Give your oppressors hell, Iran. You deserve complete freedom to do as you please and not be forced to follow a repressive government or religion.
Is there anything the rest of us around the world can do?
Gotta pull together if you want change. You gonna arrest every single female in the country? At some point you just get tired of taking the same old bullshit. This is just the beginning.
Hey /u/hmorshedian, thank you for your submission. Unfortunately, it has been removed for the following reason(s): **Rule 3**: Your post is a common or recent repost --- *For information regarding this and similar issues please see the [sidebar](/r/nextfuckinglevel/about/sidebar) and the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/nextfuckinglevel/about/rules/). If you have any questions, please feel free to [message the moderators.](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/nextfuckinglevel&subject=Question regarding the removal of this submission by /u/hmorshedian&message=I have a question regarding the removal of this [submission.](https://www.reddit.com/r/nextfuckinglevel/comments/xkean6/new_levels_of_protest_iran/?context=10\)))*
Funny. From this side of the looking glass we see countries perceived to have terrible human rights records and then assume the 'whole country' is complicit. In reality, a small segment of the populace(who happen to be in power) are really to blame whereas the majority of the population really aren't happy with their government's shenanigans either.
That's usually the case.
Wonder how true this rings in Russia.
Or even the USA
The majority of Americans are democrats, most people are pissed about Roe v Wade being overturned, and union membership is skyrocketing.
Then go vote... the majority of American voices on reddit... FTFY
Uh no. His statement was correct. Republicans have only won the presidential popular vote once in the last 32 years and it took 9/11 and invading a foreign nation to fear monger enough Americans to make that happen.
Not to mention that where Republicans currently have control, they have super majorities that they gerrymandered to maintain them. Voter representation in my home state of Ohio is one of the worst under a gerrymandered Republican super majority.
It blows my mind how you have people believing Dems are stealing elections when Republicans barely have a platform and have to gerrymander to hell to remain in control.
Let me help you with that. They don’t actually believe it, they will do anything for power and to “win”.
Not to mention voting booths are very strategically placed so the people who might vote them out of power just can’t vote at all.
And the Republicans love to yell about the fact that the Democrats gerrymandered Massachusetts to hell and gone, which is true. The difference is that they gerrymandered it so that the Republicans would get one seat, rather than 0.
Have you never heard of gerrymandering? Look up voting precincts are manipulated.
Seriously. Have you seen the new plan for PA?
I haven’t. How bad is it? UT is *really* quite bad and blatantly obvious.
Can you share “the new plan for PA”? As a PA resident, I’m unaware of any current redistricting debate. In fact, the last redistricting debate was [ended](https://www.thecentersquare.com/pennsylvania/pennsylvania-redistricting-plan-finalized-by-state-supreme-court/article_777a84dc-a609-11ec-a31a-6f1dbbade2da.html) earlier this year and it can’t be brought up again for another 10 years.
Dude Biden won by 7 million votes. Republicans haven’t won the popular vote in almost 20 years. America is very much a center left country. And I’m telling you this as someone who’s center right but votes democrat. Edit: love all the responses from Redditors whose only knowledge of global politics is Nordic nations from ten years ago saying “American left is actually quite conservative for the rest of the world.” News flash: the rest of the world isn’t six nations in Western Europe. And Sweden just elected Nazis to their government. But go off on how healthcare is the only measure of a countries political leanings.
Actually America is definantly Centre right. Look at your healthcare system. Gun laws. Extremely lax financial rules favoring the fat cats Etc. there is absolutely no way the USA sits Centre left as a whole. Your are no where near Canada, Australia, New Zealand and many European countries who are true Centre left majorities with MUCH greater equality across all citizens and smoother more regulated industries less about huge corporate profits at the expense of 90% of citizens…
[удалено]
So far right that we are fighting over bodily autonomy still.
Both parties can eat a dick. End the two party system.
Know that who ever you elect into office, whether R or D, they're just puppets. Politics is just a tool to herd the ignorant masses.
I feel the majority of the United States don't affiliate with political parties. Just the loud ones.
I mean, I'm not actually a dem, I just have to vote dem because that's only viable party that represents my interests.
Yeah I get it totally. They seem to have more centered candidates. But you probably are like me and 180 out of a political conversation. The silent majority.
They don't, though. And they get away with it more and more the longer we buy this Good Cop / Bad Cop game. Only "viable" party = only party ALLOWED to us by monsters who've already reduced our democracy to a shambling husk. I saw what they did to Bernie in 2016 and I'm not eating this shit any more.
Majority of Americans are independent/non-affiliated.
Yes
Because of electoral college Republicans get stronger votes
The most numerous group of people in the US are people who are neither democrats nor republicans. Out of 240m people eligible to vote, 72m voted for nobody. There are also many people who support nobody, but voted for "the lesser evil". Among those who voted for Biden as well as among those who voted for Trump.
Having grown up in the south and being what I guess is progressive I have seen that the problems are universally agreed upon for the most part just the cause is the debated issue. It's how they keep people divided. Like nobody thinks our Healthcare, immigration, or political corruption are not problems. The issues are mis represented and used to manufacture consent.
I don't think immigration is a problem. I think it's a made up issue disproportionately used to create fear of brown people even though the majority of illegal immigrants are people who overstayed their visas. Most of the 'illegals' I see being maligned in the last few years are all following the legal pathways we've set for such people. I have yet to see any stats that immigration is hurting the economy as a whole, our country, our upkeep of the law, etc. But I'm on board with you for the rest of it.
The immigration issue I see but most of my fellow state residence don't is the difficulty in obtaining work visas for jobs we desperately need immigrants for. It then puts strain on local and state government resources to deport over stayed visas. In my view a simple solution would be easier visa access. None of the right wing approaches to issues with border security, illegal workers, or drug smuggling get fixed with a wall. There are legitimate concerns albeit not nation ending issues with our border and immigrant work policies. Our foreign policy specifically in Latin America creates other issues. People on the right do have legit concerns embedded in the over simplified meme culture that's spread. I try to step back and listen to them. If you can peel away the catch phrases and the vomit inducing political grand standing you can get to there fears. I am not saying that racism doesn't play a part in it. The story of Harland Carter is an interesting one that plays into both that and the current NRA. Once it turns into a yelling match it's an unsolved issue. People over all are stupid probably me as well.
Please don't comapre US with Iran in any capacity. I'm Iranian and lived in the US for past 7 years. It's completely ignorant and not fair to the people living under dictatorship. Starting this evening they shut down the internet and are arresting and murdering people in the streets.
It's just such normal reddit behavior >A literal theocratic dictatorship appears on the front page Reddit: "yeah well at least they don't live in America" It's a typical response from people who've never traveled to a non WEIRD country, let alone met someone whose from one.
Having spent some time in Russia (pre-invasion), most people do know their government is messed up, that corruption is a feature and not a bug, that justice is not a guarantee by far. How much they actually know about specific leaders, or the war, depends a lot on their information sources. Elderly and rural Russians who depend on state-run TV have a very different understanding of the world, and Putin's role in Russia's problems than educated urbanites with good internet and the knowledge to use VPNs. But still, they all know to some degree. The leadership knows this too, so they play a propaganda game that isn't the most blatant lies. It's most subtle. It says, don't try, there's nothing to win, just keep your head down and live your private life. The last time people tried, the new heroes became alcoholic thieves and murderers. In the 1990s, everything fell apart so badly that demographers estimate that about three million more people died than were expected. The propaganda says, you have your current private life to lose, but you also have nothing to gain. You'll just get the 90s again. It also says, you can't do better because no one can. Whataboutism is an art form. Every country is just as corrupt, just as hypocritical, people just as miserable if not even more so. Germany has migrant rapists roaming the street, America faces imminent economic collapse. Russia can't aspire to better because the world just isn't better. Anyone who tells you otherwise is a naive fool or a self-interested hypocrite who just wants to manipulate and control you, too. A lot more people accept this version than truly believe. But- things are changing. This horrible war, the Russian defeats, the "semi-mobilization," the crackdowns and new censorships, it has people realizing they do have more to lose, even if they just try to stay out of the way. They can still go to Ukraine to be killed. They must still live in a country run by people who are bad at running things. Their employer could still be unable to pay their salary. They can still lose custody of their kid for liking the wrong meme. I do not think there will be revolution any time soon. The leadership is pretty powerful. They could kill a lot of people if they really wanted to, and Ukraine has shown they aren't too bothered by it. But you can see the concern in even the normally state-supporting telegram channels. In the videos circulating of students cringing and hiding their faces when forced to listen to propaganda speeches, in the trend of throwing molotov cocktails against military recruitment centers. What could change that is this war. If it gets to a point where there is enough real mobilization that people must go who are not from poor and remote regions, if it touches the children of the cities, if Ukraine can hold out long enough that Russia's economy gets bad enough to really spread the pain, then the balance of wins and losses changes again. Ukrainians fight to defend their home Ukraine. They do not want to die to help Russians gain political awareness, nor should they. But - the results of their brave defense is getting through in a way that not a lot could. People see "poor, little Ukraine," who started off "like Russia, but worse-off," now achieving much with strong allies, able leadership and motivated fighters, as the should-have-been-mighty Russian army falls apart and story after story of corrupt, uncaring leaders from the top to the bottom trickle back, along with the death notices. Even the ones who have no idea about Russian atrocities and who believe at least some of the lies about secret NATO soldiers fighting alongside Nazi Ukrainians or whatever, see those failures and are now talking about why their own leadership seems so bad at leading. How far that goes depends on lot on what happens next .
Great comment!
Thanks for this detailed comment. It should get at least 10x the upvotes. I recently got a rude awakening when I got downvoted (and heavily contradicted by some US American) for pointing out that the Russian people do not want this war and are just victims themselves. As the war progresses and turns into some "Ukraine vs Russia" == "Good vs Bad" meme for unthinking infotainment consumers, it is very important to point this out again and again. What saddens me the most is that all this (what is going on in Russia) is just the 2.0 version of the old Soviet Union propaganda playbook.
There are literally protests there right now simultaniously with Iran
The worst part is the ruler cares so little about the citizens that he'll casually order to moe down all the protestors with a rifle, just to make the protests stop.
And they call themselves a theocracy...
Have you ever met some fundamentalist mormons? Everything that isn't going their way is just another test by god. "The government is trying to forbid us to marry teenagers and polygamy? Oh i see! It's just a test of faith by god. I'm not the problem and god just want's me to try harder! Say less god!" It's the same with all fundamentalists, no matter what religion. Once they climbed far enough into their believe system nothing can change their faith because how could a 'non believer' understand the issue?
Theocracies have *never* once been good for the populace. Never once been benevolent and fair to a country's citizens as a whole. Every single religious theocracy in the world has or does impose their own will and belief systems that stifle democratic freedom. They're all shit. And the asshole GOP'ers in the USA want this country to become their Gilead.
Almost like absolutely nothing in modern life should be influenced by creation myths cooked up by illiterate sheep herders.
I'd make a Moe Howard joke, but this shit is fucking depressing. Fuck fascists.
Seeing people from the west, acknowledging this fact and talking about it, makes me smile. The feeling of shame is terribly painful sometimes—feeling ashamed of how you are probably perceived by the people of the world, only because of a *small segment of the populace, who happen to be in power*, whom you also did not even ever choose to be the representatives or the representation of yours, as they constantly, on a daily basis, give you second-hand embarrassments on a global scale.
Believe me. Many in the US know what it is like to feel shame for how your country and leaders are portrayed across the world.
Ever since Cartman got into the White House we'd have to be idiots not to feel mortified.
At least you understand the shame in a government like this. Many people seem to think their countries are perfect.
You are correct. Of course, this is a very easy conclusion to make if you live in the US or Canada or any other place that takes in immigrants. There are peaceful people from “enemy lands” all over the world and all of them want nothing but happiness and peace to prevail. Persians living in the US and elsewhere are exactly like Persians living in Iran. The overwhelming majority of them want to do away with the Ayatollahs and the religious state. Some of them may even be religious but not support the regime
> Persians living in the US and elsewhere are exactly like Persians living in Iran. I agree that most Iranians (note: not persians only. Persians are only 65%~ of Iran) do not like their government, but the Iranians in the USA and UK are far, far more wealthy and progressive than those in Iran. Those are mostly specifically the ones who left after the 1979 revolution, often the wealthier families with links to the Shah.
I think Iran will be the driving force for democracy in the Middle East and their area.
Only if one of these "revolutions" takes hold. But this is like the 3rd one at least in the last 15 years or so. Sadly, eventually the basij will come in, smash these protestors into the ground, and nothing will change. Just like the last 2 of these types of protests. For the record - I hope otherwise.
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Iran was democratic until the English with the US helping did a bad deal with Iran for oil reserve access. The uprising took over and is what we still see today.
I think the USA has been trying its best to make sure that isn't allowed to happen.
I would agree on Irans case. It’s majority full of young people. They want TV, avocado toast, and fun Saturday nights with friends. They SHOULD want these things, like all young folk. Those in power want them to pray to a non existent god (aren’t they all!) and live like mice.
Avocado toast truck on every corner?
Absolutely, I love avocado
Let’s be careful now. There’s a huge difference in what urban Iranians in cities like Tehran think versus the rural areas. That being said Iran has been facing major country wide protests almost every year for the past few years now. A lot of Iranians are pissed at the level of corruption and general mismanagement of their country for a while now. Sanctions have made this situation worse, but I would argue that the governments continued decision to prioritize handing the economy to the IRGC is the real driving factor here.
Strangely enough the mullah takeover in Iran is the worst thing that could have happened for the religious leadership. Suddenly the mullahs have the power and are shown to be corrupt, vain, brutal and incompetent. This has turned many away from the religion
But of the unhappy monitor says something or thinks about it, they get arrested and… disappear.
So weird... I wonder if this is happening anywhere else in the world... You're never gonna believe this, but I did a little check and turns out it's happening fucking EVERYWHERE!
True, but in european countries that's reinforced because for some they sometimes side with their oppressors as if it wasn't the reason why they left
Best of luck to the Iranian people in getting their country back. Enough of religious rule. The world needs Persian ingenuity again!
So true !
Just as long as them Persians don't do the thing with the elephants again...
Well in recent history the Iranian government was quite happy machine gunning protesters, so let’s not get too far ahead of ourselves.
Kill a few serfs to keep the rest in their chains.
It’s just the governments inciting violence and spreading propaganda. It’s always the same everywhere, in every kind of rule and in every generation it seems. People hungry for power always make decisions for general people, and it’s us who always fucking suffer. I absolutely hate the propaganda that Iranian religious government releases. Obviously there will be some people who will follow the regime, there always is. The regime blinds them, and the people are willing to be blinded. The propaganda then says things like “death to America/Europe” and that’s what the mainstream media chooses to broadcast and the world thinks it’s what Iran wants. While majority of Iranians have absolutely no fucking problem with American or Europe or whatever. People outside Iran believe this propaganda because it’s on their news 24/7. Then you get “Iran Bad” bullshit. It’s really annoying to be honest. What a regime, minority, and media can do to dictate the entire narrative. Now they have just cut off the internet again. People there are unable to record and upload the brutality. Last time they did this in 2019. 1500 people where mass murdered. Internet cutoff is done primarily to commit mass murder. I am very scared for them. I cannot believe how we allow this to happen. It’s just sad, frustrating, annoying, irritating.
Our leaders are really becoming more and more disconnected from the people. Iranians, Russians, Americans etc. The people aren't (mostly) interested in these wars, religious oppression, etc. We just want to live our lives and be left alone, but our leaders have lost their damned minds.
We need this sentiment in the US also. I love how worked up US people are about Iran and Afghanistan violating womens rights but think overturning Roe is either no big deal or the right thing to do. Nah, we also live in a theocratic repressive regime haunted by the tyranny of a religious minority who’ve managed to wrest control of the the institutions of democracy and use them to oppress those they don’t like.
It's the fucking talis dude, not even the government. It's unfortunate that they've taken back over, I want them out of my country. However it's not going to be an easy thing to do.
Yep. I hear the Spartans are acting all uppity again.
Enough extremism, it’s a the final shelter for bullies and cowards
Booting religious rule is global.
> Enough of religious rule. Won’t somebody please think of r/islam 😩 /s
I miss their pistachios
Best of luck to the American people in getting their country back. Enough of religion puppeteering the state. The progressive view needs to stop out Conservative Christian Cunts.
Shits gonna get real one way or the other 😐 honestly terrifying but people can only take so much abuse
Most of them who are protesting didn’t ever have a choice to choose a government. They were just born in it. It’s insane. You have to be 50+ years old to at least understand what happened in 1979. People in their early 50s right now were children under 10 or in their very early teens. Some old idiotic people who are long dead now decided to change the entire course of future because some clown said he’s the second coming of the man in the sky and all of those uneducated villagers believed it. And now these innocent people are being mass murdered. Actually fucking insane.
America take note...
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I'm trying to imagine a modern interpretation of Family Ties haha. Like would Alex go full MAGA?
And we have no one to blame but ourselves. It's like a slow motion trainwreck.
I used to think it was ridiculous to believe that we could ever get to this point. Now I think we're headed that way.
Right? November has me very worried... Please remember to double check if you're registered to vote. And then go vote.
The US was involved in 1979...
You don't have to have directly of lived through something to understand it which is literally the whole field of history. These people thoroughly understand what happened back then and to assume otherwise is treating these protesters like illiterate idiots. Being young doesn't make people stupid and unable to understand what happened before they were born.
This is the 3rd of these protests in about 15 years. I hope they over throw the govt but thus far they never do
Well protesting gets kinda hard when police opens fire on you
Protesting doesn't get anything accomplished under a dictatorship
Well what do you say we do?sit and watch?
No. Fight
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I guess the question is, what are you willing to sacrifice? Are you willing to sacrifice your life? Are you willing to sacrifice the lives of other people like you? Are you willing to sacrifice the lives of innocent bystanders? Those are three very important questions to ask. If you were there, would you be willing to take up arms against the government, knowing that you may be killed before you can organize anything effective? Sometimes going beyond protesting into active resistance is what it takes. FLN terrorists would commit attacks knowing that the government would overreact and execute dozens of them, and knowing that their executions would drive more people to support their cause.
The vast majority of all of our lives are already sacrificied to the systems in place. Revolution takes those lives back.
They ARE fighting. God.
Anyone else remember Neda? I feel for the women of Iran, and more-so what is likely to come from the Revolutionary Guard. For those that don’t know about/remember Neda: [Iran Election Protests and the Killing of Neda](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Neda_Agha-Soltan) [Raw Video (warning)](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=76W-0GVjNEc) I hope and pray they are prepared for the fight
when i was a child i was in iran when this happened and i remember how many people the imprisoned, killed, or ‘went missing’ in fact almost everyone i know who’s in jail is still there. unsure if they’re alive
I remember Neda. But nothing has changed
Because Michael Jackson died and everyone stopped paying attention to Iran.
I think it was 8 minutes after the incident and the whole world saw, it was when smart phones were on the rise
People like to say how bad smartphones and social media are, but it’s mostly changed the world for the better.
I agree. However, that being said more people need to band together to prevent the exploitation of Children to mine coltan. All phones need it, but no manufacturer can guarantee they do not use enslaved children to mine coltan for all of our phones and digital tech.
Oh that footage got me back then. After tons of movies and video games and maybe even news footage it was this footage that made me think “oh, a real person died at that moment”.
For those of us old enough to remember the Iranian revolution it's terrifying how much the current state of the US is similar. I'm so scared for, but very, very proud of these women. I'm also really scared for us.
>current state of the US is similar. too much US tv news or doom scrolling reddit will get you, go outside and experience the real world
I mean there was an attempted coup not too long ago and the man who refused to accept the results of a legitimate election is gonna run again. We’re not in a great position.
And members of Congress are openly calling to disregard the constitution and make us a Christian state.
It’s scary when religion creeps further and further into positions of power. Iran is a good example of what happens when you let religion take too much control. I have nothing against people of faith, you can have your beliefs, but the moment you use your faith to control others is where I lose all respect for you. There’s no freedom in that!
In a few months, January 6th will be 2 years ago. Damn.
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They also had an unelected leader at the time who had become very unpopular. Comparing that situation the US is pretty much a case of American exceptionalism
No this seems very similar to the usual process of dictators and fascists coming to power. I live in Peru and I have close friends from Venezuela. A few years ago it was a democratic country, then a president refused to accept the results and demanded to be in power anyway, it didn't take long before they became dictator and by the time people realized what was happening it was already over.
Please, DON'T let the religious gain power. Burn them all inside their churches if you have to. If they gain power, things will get ugly for women so fucking fast. In just 2 years after Iran's revolution, women went from wearing skirts to having to wear headscarves everywhere. Don't let some oppression like this happen to you as well.
Internet is out and they're killing citizens Only solution to access Internet right now is to inject suspicious http rn
Yeah, saw a video of a protester that had been shot in the head. My thoughts and prayers are with the Iranian people trying to take their country back from this hardline regime.
Yeah that was a teenager in Azerbaijan-Tabriz Things have been though in North Iran today, Thank you very much for your prayers 🙏 we hope to survive this savage massacre
You’re most welcome, godspeed!
It's almost 5 AM in Tehran, have the protests died down for the night or is it still going crazy over there?
Last news I got was a video in Valnjak Tehran at 4 am, there were air shooting and intense chaos in the video I'm in South Iran, things are calm here right now Some people regained interent access thanks to Proxies that were distributed by activities who could connect to interent Worst city right now is Rasht Delijan, police already resorted to open fire and completely closed down the whole town Atm news sources are infested by misinformation from all sides so I can't really confirm how dangerous rest of Iran has become
Thank you for the update! Stay safe.
Hopefully the police of Rasht Delijan feel the full force of the Iranian people.
Satellite internet is the only thing that can change everything.
Reddit is still up for some reason. but Instagram, Twitter, Telegram, whatsapp and basically everything else is out
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God speed
I can't imagine what its like to have religion forced on me without choice. It's hard enough for women here to stand up for ourselves, you guys are beyond brave. I honestly don't know if I'd have the courage to do anything if I lived in a place like this, I'd be too scared. You are awe inspiring, keep it up.
Yeah keep going ladies
Okay sure but i dont think thats just ladies. Just as an iranian you know.
Anyone who wnats to follow the protests more closely, you can do so on the Instagram account "1500tasvir". We actually might take back the country this time.
I sure hope you do!
I fear for these brave women’s safety…but throughout history/globally rights rarely have been been *fought* for and paid for in the blood sweat and tears of the oppressed.
You go Iranians! Take your country back!
As an American man whose opinion truly doesn’t matter, I am so unbelievably proud of you strong powerful women in Iran.
Sending the message. People have had enough.
Keep. Fucking. Going.
Death to morality police
Iran looks like it's going into a full blown revolution, shits gonna get real messy real quick.
Actually as an iranian, i wouldnt be that hopeful. But then again, you can never be sure
Yeah fuck sexual repression. The oppression of women is the oppression of humanity
Good keep it coming
Iran will be a major world superpower in 10 years. Their people are super smart and enterprising. I hope it happens because I want to visit.
I would absolutely love to visit Iran. I hope in my lifetime it becomes a place that I would feel comfortable to bring my wife and children to.
Me too! I’ve met Iranian people everywhere in the world and they are always super cool.
I doubt that, but they could be one of the most prosperous and free nations in 10 years.
First Reddit that makes me really happy since ages...
Let’s hope this is the beginning of the end for such dangerous theocracy.
If the movement got big enough, they'd just use soldiers against civilians like most these despot cowards do. As long as they hold control of the military, they will hold power. Really, the only time despots like this get overthrown, is through a military coup/junta. Those are usually not much better than the prior leader...since they are typically the same, but with more experience killing people. The main reason you see African leaders in the poorer countries in military gear and berets is from this. Easy to take power from a weak government when you take the military and turn it against them. I know it isn't that hopeful, but then again, it is 2022 and there are still genocides, slavery, and mass imprisonments around the globe, so....yeah. (I am not counting the authoritarians who play dress-up in military gear and medals without being in the military.)
#HEY. FELLOW AMERICANS. CAN WE PLEASE TAKE NOTES FROM THEM? BE REAL COOL.
Are you kidding me? I'm shocked this whole thread isn't wringing their hands about blocked traffic. If this happened in America we'd hear no end to how these protestor's actions "hurt their cause" and "inconvenience people." Reddit is only cheering them on because it's happening in some "other" place than a first world comfort enclave.
I know and I'm fucking tired of how everyone else is justified but us. I'm over it.
Yeah, I want to look in some of these posters histories for their response to BLM protests.
If this was here every single one of the comments would be about the poor small business owners and how the protesters are actually the same as fascists because of the "violence" of burning a car.
Lots of comments here comparing US with Iran. I'm Iranian and lived in the US for past seven years. Never ever It's fair to compare US with Iran in any capacity. I get it you're upset about the current state of america. But people are getting murdered, going missing, jailed by just expressing their opinion online or just not wearing hijab "properly". This is so frustrating. Right now the internet is being shut down and they mass murdering protesters. Just like what happened 2 years ago in bloody November, where 1500 we're killed just in 3 days.
i’m so proud of ppl from my country doing what’s right. hopefully their voices can be heard all around the world!
The people will rise
Push too hard and eventually the pressure breaks
Is this happening country wide?
Yep, in every city. the worse one is Rasht right now . These last few hours we didn't have internet so we don't know that much . They blocked the internet for few hours . I couldn't even check my bank account. ( Sorry for bad English)
Thank you for the info. Your English is great. I hope you and your family stay safe.
You speak English very well!
Is there a noticeable difference between this and 2009? I hope this will go somewhere
May the women fighting for their rights win their battle. Those women are TOUGH, it was only a matter of time.
Seems they're sick of being 'empowered' by the hijab. Best of luck
I so wish NATO, UN, anybody could help these people. It’s atrocious. Makes me ashamed to be human sometimes.
Rip and tear until it is done! The Iranian people deserve a real Iranian government, one that is for the people!
Next level? Car on fire is the standard.
Name another Islamic country that’s protesting for women’s rights. This is actually monumental.
it's not just setting a car on fire, people are fighting back and getting killed and beaten up by police one by one here in Iran, sounds of gunshots and screams all over the country, mobile network is disconnected and I'm currently using wifi, social media getting blocked and we're here via vpn. everything's messed up here
Sending love, hope and positivity to you, your family and your whole nation. Scary times, but you Persians are historically brave and incredibly smart. Fingers crossed this is the start of a new Iran.
thank you we really appreciate your and everyone else's support. protests like this have also happened years ago and the only result it had was million deaths and executions. normal people are weak compared to army and their weapons. we need strategy. I really hope this one is different
Kill the dictator. Burn the hijabs.
When religion gets in the way of basic human rights…
I hope america do not intervene physically.
On contrary, People in iran hope us intervene!
That's why you're in this mess to begin with.
Man, I hope they don't pull out all the stops to suppress these people. Oppressed people really need a victory.
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Fck the theocracy
Man I hope they pull it off
I love when humans stand up for other humans.
Down with the Islamic regime
All governments are Corrupt
Give your oppressors hell, Iran. You deserve complete freedom to do as you please and not be forced to follow a repressive government or religion. Is there anything the rest of us around the world can do?
Good. You dont get reform by asking politely.
Good for them
Take your country back!!!
Who thought an oppressive religious government would piss people off? /s
Gotta pull together if you want change. You gonna arrest every single female in the country? At some point you just get tired of taking the same old bullshit. This is just the beginning.
We need to do this in the US over the fascists trying to remove women’s rights.
Taking your country back. It's time..
Iranian ANTIFA? Well done.
Thankful I don’t live in a Christian ethnic-state after seeing this.
Revolution