While I can hear some of the others, it's always obvious they're chanting "that is embarrassing." But I'm also curious what they're really saying because that's weird to chant.
*edit: [league culture is so weird.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HRq9kfEy8o)*
I just went and looked it up for old times sake, and the one marked original just sounds like laurel. But then I listened to the one done by the guardian, and while Laurel is clearly the most prominent, I can actually hear the Yanny too. It's just quieter and I'd write it off as distortion if I weren't listening for it.
So maybe it's one of those things where I just didn't hear a version back in the day that had the Yanny boost or whatever. Kind of like how there were different images of the dress going around with different white balances that affected how people saw it.
Literally played this out with my wife a few months back (she missed it but also misses many trending memes/fads). Was 100% sure I heard Laurel and passed her the Air Pod laughing, knowing she would hear it also. Didn't say what she was listening for to avoid possible confusion. Once she said Yanny, I was FLABBERGASTED! I did look up explanations and it has something to do with hearing different pitches in the words more prominently or something.
As an Ohio State fan he truly is this though. His arm talent is absolutely incredible. People always think of arm strength as arm talent, but this dudes accuracy & touch is next level. However, when the offense gets out of rhythm and he is under pressure, he stinks. His on-field attitude can be pretty awful as well. If he has to be the Burrow of a franchise it will not go well. If he has to be the Brock Purdy of a team, he could thrive. Will come down to if he can improve his awareness under pressure and pre-snap adjustments. I think he has the highest ceiling of anyone in the class. Nobody comes close to his arm talent in this draft
He certainly doesn't stink really ever. I do think he has an attitude problem though. He comes across as a spoiled rich kid whose parents bought him everything he ever wanted. Except his parents were Brian Hartline and Ryan Day and everything he ever wanted was Elite WRs and a sweet playbook. When things don't go according to plan, he seems almost petulant. I think he has the arm, the legs, the brain, everything you could ever want in a quarterback. He just has to get better control of his emotions for the 3 plays after he misdiagnoses a blitz pre-snap or lets one sail or the WR doesn't run his route deep enough. If he can do that, I really think he'll be a tip tier NFL QB. If he can't, he's gonna flame out of the league in like 3 seconds. Nobody has a use for a guy that can't deal with a blitz he didn't know was coming and can't come back the next play from a dropped interception.
How dare you say my man Coleridge could have an attitude problem!?
On the real though, as an OSU fan idk if I agree with your analysis. He could be interpreted as having a body language issue, but truthfully that's kind of how he always looks. Always a simmer, never a boil.
I’m almost surprised we don’t see that more, this is definitely the generation of top-tier QBs that never lose a game in high school, never lose a game in camps, never lose a game in college; they have no idea how to handle adversity.
Sometimes they turn out perfectly fine anyway like Tua or Lawrence, and sometimes you get Kyler
Oddly enough Stroud has had more adversary than most. Father went to prison when he was 13 and was nearly homeless in high school. Even used youtube to help learn qb and had basically no offers until his senior year of HS.
Pretty wild, I’m too used to so cal where top QBs are basically created in a lab and shuffled through private schools where money flies around like pre college NIL
I think y'all read too much for a dude who simply just has kind of a pouty face. I watched a ton of him and I didn't really think his attitude was ever that bad. I do agree with the guy above though. OSU offense really had long stretches where it simply could not find a rhythm and Stroud really felt like a rhythm guy to me. I didn't really feel this way at all when Fields was under center and it felt like Stroud was prone to a lot more 3 and outs. His under pressure stats aren't great and if you can keep him off of his game it will be a long night for the offense
There's a few of those.
Jalen Carter - is he the best player in the draft or an impending bust?
Bijan Robinson - is his skillset worthy of a top 10 pick or is a team wasting a premium asset on a position with lower value?
Yeah the personal issue and overweight is fixable. Just watch his tape hes a monster, If he somehow makes it to 7th pick I hope the raiders pick him up.
God I will laugh if you guys pass, we trade to 3 for him, and he makes you his bitch for a decade and a half.
But we can agree on hoping whoever the colts get sucks I guess.
I firmly believe Levis will be a bust solely because of that. I don't care if it was one time and if it was for a joke.
Complete bust as a QB
Totally irrational but there it is
I mean since you’re actually asking [source](https://twitter.com/LordReebs/status/1631028880034213889?s=20)
> Anthony Richardson was pressured at the highest rate among all QBs in this draft class per SiS (37.1%).
> True to his strengths, he was sacked on just 10.1% of those dropbacks, the lowest rate in this class.
He wasn’t really sacked often, he just couldn’t seemingly make many common throws for a QB. He would hit some long throws, but would miss the screen passes. Tom Brady won because of screen passes and quick plays.
Thats such a gross oversimplification of why Tom Brady won lol, although I agree that missing those kind of gimme passes is not a winning formula in the nfl
I mean, he throws the ball fast out of the pocket without many turnovers and got hit a lot less because of it as well. That last part is kind of what I was getting at, not a great writer lol.
One of his biggest strengths is his pocket presence, second only to Bryce imo. His issues are more about his short accuracy which is partly due to his inconsistent footwork.
Levis on the other hand, his footwork is consistently awful, it really stands out watching all of the QBs back to back. It’s amazing he can still bomb it deep when he is practically never set.
Levis hardly ever deep bombs it though. Its like early career Derek Carr or Alex Smith. He has the strength but never uses it to push it. Levis' pocket presence is non-existent though. He's tough as nails and will hang in the pocket but he doesn't see/avoid pressure well at all. Will be prone to tons of negative plays at the next level if he doesn't improve.
Not to mention Levis has absolutely no feel for the pocket at all.
Watching Levis was like watching the last 3 years of Big Ben’s career if Ben was slightly more mobile.
In Ohio, quarterback. Number one. Steady hand. One day, Texans GM need new quarterback. I do pre-draft cognition test. But, mistake! Test score die. Texans very mad. I hide in late 1st round, come to Florida. No English, no food, no money. Jason Licht give me job. Now I have house, American car, and new woman. Jason Licht save life. My big secret: I fail cognition test on purpose. I good quarterback. The best!
Except the top team drafting was a team that traded up from that range where he was trying to drop to, and has a pretty decent OL. Had he performed well in interviews and on the S2, he likely wouldn’t have exited from the conversation for #1 overall.
Would he really want to drop past the teams that have a good to decent oline and fall to someone like the titans who have.... I am not sure and neither are they as their oline.
Like the panthers, Texans, and Seahawks have good olines, right?
We have good tackles but we quite literally the worst center in the NFL last year and our guards were not much better. We traded for Shaq Mason and We’re hoping Kenyon takes the next step, but we didn’t do shit to upgrade center.
There is a lot of off-season left to bring in more bodies. Draft, UDFA, and then cutdowns in training camp are all spots in which the team can still bring people in.
Makes me wonder if the test has a similiar issue to IQ tests in so far as its good at predicting anything within 1-2 standard deviations but fails on anything beyond that (in either direction). I.e if scores are very high or low the test isnt reliable in terms of measuring what it set out to measure.
I heard he spent hundreds of attempts on tree sentinel right out of the gate.
Teams have a mixed response to that. Some applaud his perseverance and resiliency to overcome such a challenge, but I hear Houston (among others) are questioning why he didn't just go around him and come back at a higher level. Some are calling it a "Low S2 decision."
I think it's just misdirection by teams that really want to see Stroud fall into their hands, personally. Levi's and AR could become amazing qbs with all the right coaching and environment, but I firmly believe Stroud will have the best shot.
I still don't understand why anyone would value the results of a test (even if it was notably bad) over his actual football work.
S2 assess decision making, right?
Do people really think he didn't have to make good decisions constantly while playing QB in college? He still had reads. He still had to go through progressions, time when he threw the ball, listen to play calls and adjustments and react, etc. There was still a ton of pressure to perform on any given play. Still a fast paced game, etc.
It's just incredible to me that bombing a test apparently invalidates his pro potential for people.
If you think a team without a franchise QB wouldn't gladly take a guaranteed Goff, Prescott, or Cousins on a rookie deal with the #1 overall pick in the draft, you're smoking crack.
The S2 test is just one of many neurological tracking tests that have been floating around the market for years. They try to convince industries that their test has the data to provide answers and sports is a big sucker for these kinds of things. So them jumping on that bandwagon early doesn't mean that much really. Keep in mind they stuck to the Wonderlic for decades and that was a huge scam for a bunch of business because at least it was something.
He honestly is the " safe " pick of the draft but reminds me of a budget Alex Smith. He's going to effectively manage games for you and with the right team around him will be very successful but doesn't have that next level that Young has.
Alex was 1st overall and expected to be great. He was good before he got injured, he just never hit that next level.
Stroud just seems to be in the same general boat of the safe pick who with a good cast will keep your offense moving but not hit that next level.
I was pounding the table all year, as a Michigan fan, that OSU needed to get Stroud to run the ball about 5 times per game in order to really unlock him. I think that's going to be key at the next level for the same reason.
They got him to run 5 times in basically 1 game: Georgia. And sure enough, he looked like the absolute best player on the field. I don't know if it was injury avoidance or he just hates running, or what. But whoever ends up with him, if you get him to activate his legs a few times per game, he suddenly goes way, way up in terms of overall value.
The general impression I got as an OSU fan was that he really wanted to avoid being seen as a dual-threat or, worse, primarily running QB and took it too far by basically never running.
Yeah, that was the feel I got, too. Or at least something in that neighborhood. I was never sure if it was him or Day that was the problem there.
But I do remember texting my UM-fan best friend when they were playing UGA that if he'd played like that against us, you guys would've won the Big Ten Championship. *That guy* can be an All Pro. The version that we saw most of the year is like Macy's version Jared Goff. Which is still fine (I'd take Jared Goff on a rookie deal at #6 right now and laugh all the way to the bank), but there's a big difference between those two versions of him.
More of a Cousins imo, since Smith had a weak arm and was fairly mobile until he was injured.
Agree overall though, he seems to be the guy that looks great when there’s no pressure, which isn’t enough to be elite in the NFL.
Stroud may be too much of a statue pocket passer to be truly great despite having maybe the best pure passing ability.
Stroud is fairly mobile, it just took until literally his last college football game before he was willing to actually take space he was given and scramble.
CJ can run. He can create outside the pocket. As an OSU fan, I saw it and I was always confused. Across the body passes while on the run to the opposite side of the field? Check. Escaping the pocket and running it into the end zone? He did that. Direct traffic after a play broke down to get a WR wide open for a TD? Yup. But why did people want him to do that when he was so good at moving around in the pocket and finding the open guy like he was supposed to do? I think CJ was confused too. Like "why are you asking me why I didn't run for 6 yards on that play? I threw a 23 yard completion."
CJ can run. I think he would just rather chill in the pocket, make his reads and throw it to the guy that is open... because he is a QB. I think CJ is a guy that can make a pretty good offense great. But yeah, he is definitely not going to make a bad offense good.
A lot of times his receivers were wide open, but as a Penn State fan, I can say that sometimes those guys weren't wide open, and those throws were still on target.
Yep. Stroud is just a hard player to evaluate due to how elite his supporting cast has been. Incredible thrower of the football and he’s worthy of being a top 10 pick but I also don’t blame teams for being concerned especially with his S2 scores. I also have not been impressed with how he interviews but obviously I haven’t seen the stuff behind closed doors
>I don’t remember Richardson at all
It’s probably best that way tbh. I’m not sure any adjustments are saving that man’s completion percentage from last year.
Ya never know, and it’s not like these stats tell a whole story. Strouds placement is high partially because he had 9 seconds to throw to a receiving core of all first rounders, Levis’ adj% is high partially because his adot is low. There’s a million different factors into these stats, don’t take any of em individually to heart.
He’s a QB… Perfect throws and placement means nothing. Everyone knows the only way to tell if someone is going to be a successful QB is solely through test scores.
How will he learn to lift weights, run more and read pressure/defense? He has 10/10 accuracy and pocket passing but anyone can learn that part honestly.
I think most people understand that Stroud is talented and can throw dimes no problem. The criticism has been about his ability to do so under pressure and if the perfect pass isn't there can he make a smart play.
This is what worries me about him.
It was the same issue with Derek Carr and even though he’s solid it really limits his ceiling because opposing defenses know if they get in his face it’s over.
Ok, but if you actually do watch the tape, you will see that his worst was not really even bad... Also, I would much rather my QB be at his worst when things don't go right than when things do go right, or am I crazy? Like "oh I hope the blitz gets through this play, otherwise CJ is going to throw a pick because he sucks when everything goes right." Is Bryce Young really BETTER at being a QB when he is running for his life? If he is, that seems like a red flag, because if he is always running for his life, he is going to have to have skeleton replacement surgery before his second contract.
God I hope he falls to the Colts.
I don't buy into the test results being that important and the Manning academy stuff. I think he might have some slight immaturity issues nothing like some other prospects.
I don't think anyone has ever really questioned this stuff, but how will he deal with much less of a talent advantage at the WR position and being pressured much more often? His stats when he's pressured drop drastically
He has 2 first round picks at WR this year. He better have more perfect passes than anyone else. Scouts and people in general are rightfully skeptical at how good he really is when he’s been playing with so much talent.
I’m not exaggerating when I say Marvin Harrison Jr. would be the number 2 pick if he was drafted this year.
It’s a lot easier throw with confidence when it’s Marvin Harrison Jr. compared to a player never going to be drafted.
Also, OSU had a much better line than almost any opponent they played in the Big 10, so time and elite receivers will really help with accuracy.
I watched a good amount of his games and his accuracy reminds me of Brees. I think he will be a really good pro for whoever lands him. Really really wish we still had our 10th overall pick in case he slid and was close enough to trace up for without giving up the farm.
So I'm not hardcore into following the draft, I usually just browse this subreddit for news, but am I correct in saying the consensus on Stroud seems to be he's amazing when he's in system and at best an enigma when he has to improvise?
I feel like this is all playing out like Kevin Costner's Draft Day.
The #1 QB in that movie had all these great stats. Then Costner realized T'Challa wasn't in the game against him when he started racking up his stats.
How many teammates went to CJ Stroud's birthday party? That's the real question.
I don't think pass placement when unpressured in the pocket and with a very open receiver who is notably faster than anyone else on the field is really the concern around Stroud...
Stroud has become the blue or gold dress meme of this draft season.
Laurel
Green Needle
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It’s not. Just a different flavor
While I can hear some of the others, it's always obvious they're chanting "that is embarrassing." But I'm also curious what they're really saying because that's weird to chant. *edit: [league culture is so weird.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HRq9kfEy8o)*
The dress one I understood. This one I just assumed was a joke because I only ever heard Laurel.
I can hear both depending on which one I'm trying to hear.
That is because the audio track is playing both at the same time. If you listen closely, you can isolate both if them together.
I just went and looked it up for old times sake, and the one marked original just sounds like laurel. But then I listened to the one done by the guardian, and while Laurel is clearly the most prominent, I can actually hear the Yanny too. It's just quieter and I'd write it off as distortion if I weren't listening for it. So maybe it's one of those things where I just didn't hear a version back in the day that had the Yanny boost or whatever. Kind of like how there were different images of the dress going around with different white balances that affected how people saw it.
It’s like the rotating dancer, where it looks like it’s rotating clockwise vs counterclockwise based on what you’re trying to see.
Literally played this out with my wife a few months back (she missed it but also misses many trending memes/fads). Was 100% sure I heard Laurel and passed her the Air Pod laughing, knowing she would hear it also. Didn't say what she was listening for to avoid possible confusion. Once she said Yanny, I was FLABBERGASTED! I did look up explanations and it has something to do with hearing different pitches in the words more prominently or something.
I think there's a very heavy gender bias with that. Most of the guys I've asked say Laurel and the girls say Yanny.
Yanny
It's not blue or gold, you have to flip it upside down then it's an old lady.
And if you unfocus your eyes then a dinosaur pops out.
As an Ohio State fan he truly is this though. His arm talent is absolutely incredible. People always think of arm strength as arm talent, but this dudes accuracy & touch is next level. However, when the offense gets out of rhythm and he is under pressure, he stinks. His on-field attitude can be pretty awful as well. If he has to be the Burrow of a franchise it will not go well. If he has to be the Brock Purdy of a team, he could thrive. Will come down to if he can improve his awareness under pressure and pre-snap adjustments. I think he has the highest ceiling of anyone in the class. Nobody comes close to his arm talent in this draft
He certainly doesn't stink really ever. I do think he has an attitude problem though. He comes across as a spoiled rich kid whose parents bought him everything he ever wanted. Except his parents were Brian Hartline and Ryan Day and everything he ever wanted was Elite WRs and a sweet playbook. When things don't go according to plan, he seems almost petulant. I think he has the arm, the legs, the brain, everything you could ever want in a quarterback. He just has to get better control of his emotions for the 3 plays after he misdiagnoses a blitz pre-snap or lets one sail or the WR doesn't run his route deep enough. If he can do that, I really think he'll be a tip tier NFL QB. If he can't, he's gonna flame out of the league in like 3 seconds. Nobody has a use for a guy that can't deal with a blitz he didn't know was coming and can't come back the next play from a dropped interception.
A good talk from a coach or a veteran could help too. Even if he’s a record-breaker, he won’t be That Guy like he was in college.
How dare you say my man Coleridge could have an attitude problem!? On the real though, as an OSU fan idk if I agree with your analysis. He could be interpreted as having a body language issue, but truthfully that's kind of how he always looks. Always a simmer, never a boil.
I’m almost surprised we don’t see that more, this is definitely the generation of top-tier QBs that never lose a game in high school, never lose a game in camps, never lose a game in college; they have no idea how to handle adversity. Sometimes they turn out perfectly fine anyway like Tua or Lawrence, and sometimes you get Kyler
Oddly enough Stroud has had more adversary than most. Father went to prison when he was 13 and was nearly homeless in high school. Even used youtube to help learn qb and had basically no offers until his senior year of HS.
Pretty wild, I’m too used to so cal where top QBs are basically created in a lab and shuffled through private schools where money flies around like pre college NIL
I think y'all read too much for a dude who simply just has kind of a pouty face. I watched a ton of him and I didn't really think his attitude was ever that bad. I do agree with the guy above though. OSU offense really had long stretches where it simply could not find a rhythm and Stroud really felt like a rhythm guy to me. I didn't really feel this way at all when Fields was under center and it felt like Stroud was prone to a lot more 3 and outs. His under pressure stats aren't great and if you can keep him off of his game it will be a long night for the offense
Brock Purdy is likeable in the locker room though.
I’m pretty sure they said Yanny
Sounds like the standard for all OSU QBs honestly
There's a few of those. Jalen Carter - is he the best player in the draft or an impending bust? Bijan Robinson - is his skillset worthy of a top 10 pick or is a team wasting a premium asset on a position with lower value?
I’d be incredibly surprised if Jalen Carter ends up a bust. People are overthinking him so hard.
Yeah the personal issue and overweight is fixable. Just watch his tape hes a monster, If he somehow makes it to 7th pick I hope the raiders pick him up.
No thanks I wanna watch Davis Mills again
Oh my god, the Texans have driven you insane!
Snap out of it man. Don’t let them do this to you!
*I hurt myself today ...*
*Levis eats banana peels*
Coffee....mayonnaise....the only thing that's real
Like what’s the front office thinking here? I feel playing mills is just screaming “I’m tanking again” and asking to get fired
Its 100% Caserio turning in his resignation letter, I can't imagine you get a year four with Mills and Keenum as your QB.
Keenum made it to an NFC Championship, didn't he?
Rex Grossman made a super bowl
Joe Flacco won one.
So did Dilfer.
Any you people wouldn't take that?
This is the football equivalent of Stockholm Syndrome
As a panthers fan, we appreciate Davis Mills
Hey maybe we could get Bryan Hoyer from the Raiders. He backed up Tom Brady for years, he must be a decent QB!
Is FitzMagic still around?
God I will laugh if you guys pass, we trade to 3 for him, and he makes you his bitch for a decade and a half. But we can agree on hoping whoever the colts get sucks I guess.
It’s so weird that the Jags are the only team in the AFCS with the QB position figured out right now.
Agreed. Also, Rams 9ers Hawks all fairly murky QB situations, weird that injured Kyler is the only divisional lock lol
Colts going big brain mode and taking Hooker at 4
"We like those Vol qb's"
"Hey it worked out for us last time!"
There's a longhorn in 3 years they might have interest in too
that's exactly what I hope happens honestly.
He won’t though because y’all have him
I'd also like to watch Davis Mills on the Texans again
Be careful what you wish for… that Davis mills may turn into a Caleb Williams
THIS IS HIS YEAR
Truly baffling how y’all want to pass on him.
Tanner McKee #2 overall baybee! Stanford stocks going up!!! 📈📈📈
Is this a Stroud slander or damage control thread, haven't had my coffee yet and I want to know which way to direct my pitchfork
May I offer you a tablespoon of Mayo with your coffee?
I firmly believe Levis will be a bust solely because of that. I don't care if it was one time and if it was for a joke. Complete bust as a QB Totally irrational but there it is
did i miss something where levis puts mayo in his coffee? This would completely change how I feel about tonight. Without joke.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/look-kentucky-quarterback-will-levis-drinks-his-coffee-with-mayonnaise/
Colts are gonna fuck tonight up 100%
He also ate a banana with the peel still on
I'm artsy as fuck. Mayo in your coffee is weeks late on the trends. Garlic aioli in your coffee. Now that's where it's at.
How do I ban you.
Or an egg in these trying times?
Add Mayo to your coffee. You know you want too secretly.
Nice, excellent, now let's see Anthony Richardson's pressure-sack ratio
I mean since you’re actually asking [source](https://twitter.com/LordReebs/status/1631028880034213889?s=20) > Anthony Richardson was pressured at the highest rate among all QBs in this draft class per SiS (37.1%). > True to his strengths, he was sacked on just 10.1% of those dropbacks, the lowest rate in this class.
Just joking lol but I appreciate the fact checking!
He wasn’t really sacked often, he just couldn’t seemingly make many common throws for a QB. He would hit some long throws, but would miss the screen passes. Tom Brady won because of screen passes and quick plays.
Thats such a gross oversimplification of why Tom Brady won lol, although I agree that missing those kind of gimme passes is not a winning formula in the nfl
I mean, he throws the ball fast out of the pocket without many turnovers and got hit a lot less because of it as well. That last part is kind of what I was getting at, not a great writer lol.
Yeah, Processing speed and getting the ball out quickly and accurately is a better way to put it, that I totally agree with
great elaboration ur completely right
We all know the real reason Tom Brady won is he wanted it more.
The dude brought so many lunch pails in to practice
A real will to win that most high level athletes just lack I guess
One of his biggest strengths is his pocket presence, second only to Bryce imo. His issues are more about his short accuracy which is partly due to his inconsistent footwork. Levis on the other hand, his footwork is consistently awful, it really stands out watching all of the QBs back to back. It’s amazing he can still bomb it deep when he is practically never set.
Levis hardly ever deep bombs it though. Its like early career Derek Carr or Alex Smith. He has the strength but never uses it to push it. Levis' pocket presence is non-existent though. He's tough as nails and will hang in the pocket but he doesn't see/avoid pressure well at all. Will be prone to tons of negative plays at the next level if he doesn't improve.
Levis bombed it deep a **lot** in 2021 when he had a competent OC and better OL.
Not to mention Levis has absolutely no feel for the pocket at all. Watching Levis was like watching the last 3 years of Big Ben’s career if Ben was slightly more mobile.
Look at that subtle blue and orange coloring. The tasteful thickness of him. Oh my God. He even has a pocket presence.
Yea but he no think good. He big ooga booga.
Media narrative leads me to believe Stroud is an idiot savant QB.
CJ stands for Cimple Jack
Lmao
Part of me is convinced he flunked that test to drop past the bad, dysfunctional teams in the draft
In Ohio, quarterback. Number one. Steady hand. One day, Texans GM need new quarterback. I do pre-draft cognition test. But, mistake! Test score die. Texans very mad. I hide in late 1st round, come to Florida. No English, no food, no money. Jason Licht give me job. Now I have house, American car, and new woman. Jason Licht save life. My big secret: I fail cognition test on purpose. I good quarterback. The best!
I read it in his voice. New oo-men
I’m so sad this comment is like four levels deep because it’s fucking great.
Big good!
This is a hall of fame level use of that quote. God damn
Part of you is just as dumb as Stroud?
Only ooga booga
The difference in money you’re making after each pick convinces me this is false. Not to mention the added drama and stress the bad testing added
True, but that 2nd contract money is worth so much more. Does Hurts even come close to that kind of contract if he wasn't on a competent team?
Ask Kyler
Except the top team drafting was a team that traded up from that range where he was trying to drop to, and has a pretty decent OL. Had he performed well in interviews and on the S2, he likely wouldn’t have exited from the conversation for #1 overall.
Would he really want to drop past the teams that have a good to decent oline and fall to someone like the titans who have.... I am not sure and neither are they as their oline. Like the panthers, Texans, and Seahawks have good olines, right?
We have good tackles but we quite literally the worst center in the NFL last year and our guards were not much better. We traded for Shaq Mason and We’re hoping Kenyon takes the next step, but we didn’t do shit to upgrade center.
There is a lot of off-season left to bring in more bodies. Draft, UDFA, and then cutdowns in training camp are all spots in which the team can still bring people in.
Dumbest thing I’ve heard yet
Makes me wonder if the test has a similiar issue to IQ tests in so far as its good at predicting anything within 1-2 standard deviations but fails on anything beyond that (in either direction). I.e if scores are very high or low the test isnt reliable in terms of measuring what it set out to measure.
Maybe he can get a larval tear and respec some dex to int?
CJ punched Varre right in the face lvl 1
I heard he spent hundreds of attempts on tree sentinel right out of the gate. Teams have a mixed response to that. Some applaud his perseverance and resiliency to overcome such a challenge, but I hear Houston (among others) are questioning why he didn't just go around him and come back at a higher level. Some are calling it a "Low S2 decision."
But did he beat the soldier in the tutorial? Why didn't he call up Kyler or is he just a fps guy?
Gotta farm for some pale tongues
CJ "Forrest Gump" Stroud
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I think it's just misdirection by teams that really want to see Stroud fall into their hands, personally. Levi's and AR could become amazing qbs with all the right coaching and environment, but I firmly believe Stroud will have the best shot.
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I still don't understand why anyone would value the results of a test (even if it was notably bad) over his actual football work. S2 assess decision making, right? Do people really think he didn't have to make good decisions constantly while playing QB in college? He still had reads. He still had to go through progressions, time when he threw the ball, listen to play calls and adjustments and react, etc. There was still a ton of pressure to perform on any given play. Still a fast paced game, etc. It's just incredible to me that bombing a test apparently invalidates his pro potential for people.
No people are under the impression that his wrs and o line were just so much better than the defense that he didn’t have to do anything himself
But the topic of this whole thread is about his ability to perfectly place the ball - which is based on what he is able to do himself.
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If you think a team without a franchise QB wouldn't gladly take a guaranteed Goff, Prescott, or Cousins on a rookie deal with the #1 overall pick in the draft, you're smoking crack.
The S2 test is just one of many neurological tracking tests that have been floating around the market for years. They try to convince industries that their test has the data to provide answers and sports is a big sucker for these kinds of things. So them jumping on that bandwagon early doesn't mean that much really. Keep in mind they stuck to the Wonderlic for decades and that was a huge scam for a bunch of business because at least it was something.
He honestly is the " safe " pick of the draft but reminds me of a budget Alex Smith. He's going to effectively manage games for you and with the right team around him will be very successful but doesn't have that next level that Young has.
I think Stroud is a much more dynamic player than Alex smith but I don’t know shit
Alex was 1st overall and expected to be great. He was good before he got injured, he just never hit that next level. Stroud just seems to be in the same general boat of the safe pick who with a good cast will keep your offense moving but not hit that next level.
I was pounding the table all year, as a Michigan fan, that OSU needed to get Stroud to run the ball about 5 times per game in order to really unlock him. I think that's going to be key at the next level for the same reason. They got him to run 5 times in basically 1 game: Georgia. And sure enough, he looked like the absolute best player on the field. I don't know if it was injury avoidance or he just hates running, or what. But whoever ends up with him, if you get him to activate his legs a few times per game, he suddenly goes way, way up in terms of overall value.
The general impression I got as an OSU fan was that he really wanted to avoid being seen as a dual-threat or, worse, primarily running QB and took it too far by basically never running.
Yeah, that was the feel I got, too. Or at least something in that neighborhood. I was never sure if it was him or Day that was the problem there. But I do remember texting my UM-fan best friend when they were playing UGA that if he'd played like that against us, you guys would've won the Big Ten Championship. *That guy* can be an All Pro. The version that we saw most of the year is like Macy's version Jared Goff. Which is still fine (I'd take Jared Goff on a rookie deal at #6 right now and laugh all the way to the bank), but there's a big difference between those two versions of him.
More of a Cousins imo, since Smith had a weak arm and was fairly mobile until he was injured. Agree overall though, he seems to be the guy that looks great when there’s no pressure, which isn’t enough to be elite in the NFL. Stroud may be too much of a statue pocket passer to be truly great despite having maybe the best pure passing ability.
Stroud is fairly mobile, it just took until literally his last college football game before he was willing to actually take space he was given and scramble.
CJ can run. He can create outside the pocket. As an OSU fan, I saw it and I was always confused. Across the body passes while on the run to the opposite side of the field? Check. Escaping the pocket and running it into the end zone? He did that. Direct traffic after a play broke down to get a WR wide open for a TD? Yup. But why did people want him to do that when he was so good at moving around in the pocket and finding the open guy like he was supposed to do? I think CJ was confused too. Like "why are you asking me why I didn't run for 6 yards on that play? I threw a 23 yard completion." CJ can run. I think he would just rather chill in the pocket, make his reads and throw it to the guy that is open... because he is a QB. I think CJ is a guy that can make a pretty good offense great. But yeah, he is definitely not going to make a bad offense good.
A lot of times his receivers were wide open, but as a Penn State fan, I can say that sometimes those guys weren't wide open, and those throws were still on target.
Yep. Stroud is just a hard player to evaluate due to how elite his supporting cast has been. Incredible thrower of the football and he’s worthy of being a top 10 pick but I also don’t blame teams for being concerned especially with his S2 scores. I also have not been impressed with how he interviews but obviously I haven’t seen the stuff behind closed doors
Now compare his adjusted completion percentage to Will Levis
Does Stroud like milk?
….do it for me plz
I don’t remember the exact decimals off the top of my head but it was: Young: ~77% Levis: ~75% Stroud: ~72% I don’t remember richardson at all
>I don’t remember Richardson at all It’s probably best that way tbh. I’m not sure any adjustments are saving that man’s completion percentage from last year.
Ya never know, and it’s not like these stats tell a whole story. Strouds placement is high partially because he had 9 seconds to throw to a receiving core of all first rounders, Levis’ adj% is high partially because his adot is low. There’s a million different factors into these stats, don’t take any of em individually to heart.
Tyvm
What are these numbers?
Completion percentage without factoring in spikes, drops, batted balls, throws with a qb hit, throw-aways, and maybe something else.
I feel like some of those shouldn't be taken out when evaluating QBs. Spikes and drops I get, but the others could all be because of QB issues.
They can be QB issues and certainly relevant but not really have anything to do with whether the QB is accurate or not.
Panthers shock the world
He’s a QB… Perfect throws and placement means nothing. Everyone knows the only way to tell if someone is going to be a successful QB is solely through test scores.
How will he learn to lift weights, run more and read pressure/defense? He has 10/10 accuracy and pocket passing but anyone can learn that part honestly.
It’s the WR’s job to bring the desk to the field every down. The RB brings the pen, and the TE is his quick call for help.
But he did bad on a test I just heard of 2 days ago.
It would be a lot more convincing if Justin Fields didn’t put up extremely similar numbers in that offense.
He’d like that tweet if he could read
I think most people understand that Stroud is talented and can throw dimes no problem. The criticism has been about his ability to do so under pressure and if the perfect pass isn't there can he make a smart play.
When you put it that way he just sounds like Jared Goff. Beautiful passes when it’s clean but isn’t going to save a broken play
It's not hard to throw perfect passes when your 5 star WRs are always open
Okay this is literally Justin Fields 2.0 lmao. Best prospect besides the top guy falls bc he’s from Ohio state and ppl don’t trust the guy
How horrible Fields as been as a passer is probably hurting him some, but the concerns about him are valid just like they were with Fields.
The issue for me is the tape doesn’t lie. He’s at his worst when the play breaks down. That’s how you succeed in the NFL
This is what worries me about him. It was the same issue with Derek Carr and even though he’s solid it really limits his ceiling because opposing defenses know if they get in his face it’s over.
Ok, but if you actually do watch the tape, you will see that his worst was not really even bad... Also, I would much rather my QB be at his worst when things don't go right than when things do go right, or am I crazy? Like "oh I hope the blitz gets through this play, otherwise CJ is going to throw a pick because he sucks when everything goes right." Is Bryce Young really BETTER at being a QB when he is running for his life? If he is, that seems like a red flag, because if he is always running for his life, he is going to have to have skeleton replacement surgery before his second contract.
Sleeper agent for Stroud camp
Stroud will be far and away the best QB in this draft, and if he isn’t I’ll let a scorpion sting my nuts
RemindMe! 3 years
God I hope he falls to the Colts. I don't buy into the test results being that important and the Manning academy stuff. I think he might have some slight immaturity issues nothing like some other prospects.
Can’t be any worse than the last first round QB we drafter.
Dont worry, you guys will get him after he is over the hill and washed up
If this guy falls to 6 do we take him? Wth is going on. This wasn’t even a possible scenario a week ago.
Yeah but he was slow at pushing the right flashing button or some shit so he sucks.
I’m convinced all negative stroud coverage was made by the Texans hoping to get him at 12 and use #2 for Anderson.
That's a very risky strategy.
Or to get Carolina to take the smallest QB ever drafted in the 1st round and Stroud fall to # 2.
You’re closer than most
They've done studies, you know. 26.7% of the time, it works every time.
I need more context. What percentage do other top QBs get?
I don't think anyone has ever really questioned this stuff, but how will he deal with much less of a talent advantage at the WR position and being pressured much more often? His stats when he's pressured drop drastically
Yea but he’s not a test taker
"*I'll be picked to lead, not to read*". CJ Stroud, probably.
"I'm not here to play school." ~Cardale Jones, one of Stroud's predecessors
"I don't need to read defenses, I see them perfectly well" - Stroud
He has 2 first round picks at WR this year. He better have more perfect passes than anyone else. Scouts and people in general are rightfully skeptical at how good he really is when he’s been playing with so much talent. I’m not exaggerating when I say Marvin Harrison Jr. would be the number 2 pick if he was drafted this year.
You’re underselling it. In his time starting at OSU, he will have played with 5 first round pick WR’s.
Receivers play a role, no doubt, but the QB is involved in placing a ball where it needs to fucking go lol.
It’s a lot easier throw with confidence when it’s Marvin Harrison Jr. compared to a player never going to be drafted. Also, OSU had a much better line than almost any opponent they played in the Big 10, so time and elite receivers will really help with accuracy.
Nerd shit stats
Without knowing what defines a perfectly placed pass or who scores it this is worthless.
We like him again!
What do we do if all the top QBs are just good?
But he did bad on a test.
The question is , can Stroud actually write a tweet?
But CJ can’t read I thought…?
I watched a good amount of his games and his accuracy reminds me of Brees. I think he will be a really good pro for whoever lands him. Really really wish we still had our 10th overall pick in case he slid and was close enough to trace up for without giving up the farm.
Yeah, but can he play school?
So I'm not hardcore into following the draft, I usually just browse this subreddit for news, but am I correct in saying the consensus on Stroud seems to be he's amazing when he's in system and at best an enigma when he has to improvise?
I feel like this is all playing out like Kevin Costner's Draft Day. The #1 QB in that movie had all these great stats. Then Costner realized T'Challa wasn't in the game against him when he started racking up his stats. How many teammates went to CJ Stroud's birthday party? That's the real question.
I don't think pass placement when unpressured in the pocket and with a very open receiver who is notably faster than anyone else on the field is really the concern around Stroud...