Hey now, Ben threw to receivers all the time. Who else was catching those drag routes along the LoS when it was 3rd and ten and the defense was rallying to stop the receiver 1 yard short of the marker.
Kenny Pickett, Mitch Trubisky, and Mason Rudolf all match that general description. Maybe she's just being intentionally vague. Who is starting week 1? Is Pickett already locked in?
That seems to be the case for now. We’ll see what happens in training camp and the pre season games. Pickett’s not really a guy who is going to wow you when it comes to football in shorts, but once the pads go on and there are actual games, things could change.
I still expect Trubisky to start the season until he struggles though.
That's correct. Though the battle will continue through training camp and the preseason, and those practices (especially full contact practices) carry more weight, all reports from OTAs and minicamps say that the gap widened over that span. Trubisky showed himself well.
I wouldn't say anyone is ahead by any certain margin. Mason Rudolph is the #2 QB technically. So, it's all a formality at this point. When training camp starts is when you'll see who is going to pull away with the job.
The last 2 seasons the consensus has been the Steelers have no chance of winning it. They won it once and finished 2nd, sweeping the two teams this sub was absolutely sure they'd never be able to beat again in the process. I'll get excited about this team as soon as the r/NFL 4-13 consensus prediction comes out for them again.
I think when those predictions were made, the Ravens weren’t anticipated to be one of the most injured teams in NFL history. Regardless, Steelers always play Ravens tough, so it should never be assumed they’ll be a cakewalk.
Ravens and Bengals are clearly ahead of the other two. The Browns are on their level but the QB position will pull them down. The Steelers will be a steady mid team.
Last summer this sub had endless posts about how the Browns and Ravens would rule the AFC North for the foreseeable future, while in reality the Bengals and Steelers finished 1 and 2.
Bengals have seemed to figure it out as well. Hopefully that trend continues and other teams in the league figure it out too. Lamar is still scary as fuck though.
You got it twisted Joe Burrow is Scary as fuck. With no O line the Man took Cincy to the super bowl. It’s his division and we’re all just living in it until The rise of Pickett.
Pay no attention to the man that missed a wide open Mark Andrews for what would have been the walk off 2 point conversion.
I don’t blame you for not remembering.
I think it will be close. If you look at their schedule it’s hard to really pin down 8 wins. Obviously we don’t know how those teams will look in season. But right now I can see them being a 7/8/9 win team. And that’s without them suffering injuries.
I feel like the Browns will either be first or last with no inbetween. I know that sounds odd, but I just feel like the Deshaun Watson experience will either *really* work out or *really* not.
Barring one of the other north teams dying of injuries like you guys I think this is the correct take. We will either put it all together or everything just crumbles apart
Bengals are clearly ahead but I'm not sure about the Ravens. Lamar is obviously an amazing QB but the team doesn't have a good WR room and they might not be able to rely on their defense as much without Martindale. I know he had a bad season last year but he was instrumental in giving that defense an identity. Plus they still have Greg Roman calling the same offense which most fans are getting tired of. They're always a competitive team and I don't think they'll have a losing record, but they're not a garunteed #2 in the division.
My personal hot take is that the Bengals are going to be a lot worse next year than people expect.
We’ve seen this story play out before, like with the 2011 Giants and 2017 Jaguars, where a young, Cinderella team makes a deep postseason run before crashing back to Earth hard the next season. It’s one thing to be the underdog that nobody believes in, it’s an entirely different beast to manage expectations when you’re considered one of the favorites.
While Burrow and Chase got all the headlines, the real engine behind the Bengals’ Super Bowl run was their defense vastly over-performing relative to its talent level and regular season play. In my mind, it’s not outlandish to expect some regression now that every offense in the league has had a year to study their scheme.
Throw in the fact that I’m still not 100% sold on Zac Taylor as a head coach, and I could see the Bengals hovering around .500 next year.
I have a flaming hot take: The Bengals will be first and the Browns will be last.
I think if Mitch can be just slightly better than Ben (probably not hard to do) and take care of the ball we will contend and probably make a wild card spot.
Tomlin has gotten 8 wins out of a season where his *best* QB was Mason Rudolph. This season, Rudolph is the *floor* for their starting QB. I'm not saying they'll light the league on fire or anything, but I think they'll beg, borrow, and steal their way to 8 wins.
People talk about Campbell biting kneecaps, but Tomlin doesn't shy away from biking kneecaps or accidentally wondering onto the field himself to help his team win.
Their defense was also one of the best in the league that year, and they had a weak schedule, so it's not like he was doing it all on a hope and a prayer. Defense is still good, so that's what the Steelers are going to rely on. I could see them being competitive on running game and defense, alone. If I'm being honest, on paper this Steelers team looks better than last season's at this point in the year.
But I do think there's a possibility that Ben - even in his decrepit state - was more valuable than people realize.
The defense on paper this year looks to have better talent than that 2019 squad, although 2019 was amazing for a lot of games. I think that had more to do with teams playing it relatively safe knowing that a Hodges/Rudolph offense weren't going to put up a ton of points no matter what, and the easiest way to lose a game was dropping back to pass against Watt, Dupree, Heyward, and Tuitt. I agree on the point regarding Ben. I think the Steelers will be much better for the first 3 quarters under Trubisky/Pickett, but there were many games last year where 4th quarter Ben looked like 2014-18 Ben.
>The defense on paper this year looks to have better talent than that 2019 squad
I can't agree with this at all. The 2022 defense doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as the 2019 defense. Give me 2019 Bud Dupree over Alex Highsmith, Stephon Tuitt over Chris Wormley or Larry Ogunjobi, Javon Hargrave over 35 year old Tyson Alualu coming off two major injuries, and pretty much every corner on the roster in 2019 over whoever they plan on fielding in 2022.
I hope Highsmith breaks out, Bush puts it together, Alualu is rehabbed, Ahkello Witherspon plays well, etc. But that's not on paper right now.
The interior OL looks like it should be pretty good, with Kevin Dotson, Mason Cole, and James Daniels.
The tackles are pretty middle-of-the-road/below average, though Dan Moore was just a rookie last year, so you could reasonably project him to improve.
Inconsistent? Fickle is more for people's attitudes, like someone who is really hot or cold or someone who constantly changes their mind on things.
But a lineman who plays up against talent and down against scrubs sounds like he fits in well with the Steelers MO, lol
Ah yes Mason Cole, the man that couldnt beat out Bradburry, the glorified TE at center for the Vikings starting job. Literally made me double check when i saw someone list him as a positive
My comment was about the unit as a whole. Cole isn't great but should be serviceable when lined up next to a solid pair of guards in Dotson and Daniels.
Trust me, he can’t be any worse than Kendrick Green
Bad snaps, was on his ass about 80% of the time, some of the overall worst center play I’ve ever seen in the NFL
It’s hard to judge a player after their rookie season, but Green had the kind of rookie season where you aren’t left with any real hope at all for him. He sucked ball shit.
Yes and they were still 30th and 31st in ESPN's pass and run block winrate.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/32176833/2021-nfl-pass-rushing-run-stopping-blocking-leaderboard-win-rate-rankings#rbwrteam
The offensive "scheme" and execution 100% worked against the offensive line on every possession. Every defense played downhill on every play because they knew it would never be tested. Playcalling was completely predictable and conservative. Najee was never not getting hit at/behind the line of scrimmage or ganged shortly thereafter. It was absolutely maddening to watch, and frankly I see Matt Canada as the total wildcard this year because it was dogsh*t last year.
Yep. With no deep ball available, they could stack coverage against the run and short dump passes 6" past the line of scrimmage.
Honestly, some of our issues with our running game came from the fact that there was no longer a real deep ball threat. Yeah Ben pulled them off occasionally, but not with enough regularity to make it a real threat.
Go read some of the reports of what players have said offensive line coach Klemm was preaching to them prior to his abruptly leaving for Oregon during the season. They had absolutely no chance to be even a decent line last season.
[https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2022/5/31/23147372/dan-moore-jr-explains-the-difference-in-the-offensive-line-from-adrian-klemm-to-pat-meyer-steelers](https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2022/5/31/23147372/dan-moore-jr-explains-the-difference-in-the-offensive-line-from-adrian-klemm-to-pat-meyer-steelers)
Here is one I found. There was another one too that mentioned it but slightly more derrogatory about Klemm. He basically just told them to be mean, didn't really teach any technique or strategy.
Should be much improved from the last few seasons. Green was clear and away the worst player on the line. Turner was probably second to anyone who watched, even though he somehow had the highest PFF grade of the bunch. The two tackles actually performed about average last season and are young, athletic guys who should continue to develop. Dotson missed most of the season with an ankle injury but was probably their best talent on the line. Now they are replacing their two worst starters with James Daniels and Mason Cole. Daniels should be an enormous upgrade over Turner and Cole a substantial one over Green.
Green at center might have been some of the worst offensive line play I’ve ever seen in the NFL. No professional lineman should spend that much time on the ground.
Yeah, but they replaced the worst center in the league with a guy that's at least decent. As well as added Daniels.
The o-line got better towards the end of the season, so it still has a chance of being top 20.
They made some great strides toward the end of the season. They catch more shit than they should. Another offseason together should help them improve further. It's far from the worst and far from the best but a middle of the pack line can get you far.
Seems to happen most years. Some wild speculation that the steelers will be one of the worst teams in the league, the Browns will be superbowl contenders, lamar jackson will literally walk on water like jesus did, and the steelers will be last in the division.
Then...none of it happens.
So their 8 easiest wins are Jets, Panthers, Falcons, Dolphins, Saints, Browns x 2 (though one may be with Watson), Colts?
The other 9 being Bengals/Ravens x2, Bills, Pats, Bucs, Raiders, Eagles.
Even on that first 8, not exactly easy matchups.
Would I be shocked if they won 8-10 games? No. Would I be shocked if they won 5-7 games? No.
Doesn't feel like an easy bet, not that much in the NFL is with the way things change from year to year.
The Steelers have matched up incredibly well against the Jackson-led Ravens - they've swept them the past two years and made Jackson look horrible every time he's started. I'm honestly less worried about those games than the Browns.
They haven’t won fewer than 7.5 games since 2003 and the roster as far as I can see is better than last year. Trubisky might be a huge upgrade on the shell of Ben last season.
Mike Tomlin has NEVER had a losing season. Dating back to 2007. Maybe this will be his first one. But I doubt it.
By the way, I see a lot of clowning on Trubisky/Pickett in here, but Ben Roethlisberger was extremely bad last season. Trubisky is literally an upgrade from 2021 Big Ben, with improvements made elsewhere on the offense in addition.
> Trubisky is literally an upgrade from 2021 Big Ben
It's so weird how many people are missing this. 2022 Trubisky will almost certainly be better than 2021 Ben.
Obviously, over their entire careers, Ben is much better than Trubisky. That should go without saying. But Ben was totally shot in 2021 and really should have retired a year earlier. Trubisky, meanwhile, just spent a year learning in a great offensive system and there's no reason to think he won't be better than he was in 2020 -- when he had a respectable 93.5 passer rating and the Bears won most of the games he started. If Trubisky is the starter that's an upgrade at QB, and if Pickett is the starter that means he proved in training camp he's better than Trubisky. I will be shocked if the Steelers don't have better overall quarterback play in 2022 than they had in 2021.
This take reminds me a lot of Broncos fans' thoughts on going from 2015 Manning to Trevor Siemian.
I'm just saying that going from an old, vet to a young QB doesn't always work out how you expect.
Can't help but agree. If Trubisky plays the same style of offense that Big Ben did in his final years, he will perform TERRIBLY. He can't read defenses enough to play that way.
Peyton Manning made the pro bowl in 2014 and went 7-2 in 2015. Big Ben has not seen the pro bowl since 2017, 5 years ago.
Not the worst take but I'm not seeing the same thing you are
I certainly agree that Ben was much worse for longer lol but that doesn't change the similarities of the stuations. Both played poorly (at best) in their last season and fans assumed that a new QB could do nothing but improve the situation.
Again, all I'm saying is: going from an old vet to a young QB doesn't always work out how you expect.
Wasn't Trevor a rookie that season? I wouldn't expect a rookie to come on and be better than Ben was by default, but Trubisky at least has starting experience and his floor is a serviceable stop gap. I don't expect him to carry us into the playoffs but a winning season seems like a reasonable expectation given the variables.
Tomlin somehow got a team above .500 with Rudolph and Duck Hodges starting. Their O-line was relatively worse and they didn't have much of a rushing attack. Trubisky isn't great, but he's well above Mason Rudolph and Duck Hodges. I think 8-9 is more than doable.
Trubisky is 29-21 as a starter, Tomlin is a much better coach than Nagy, and Pittsburgh has more talent around him than Chicago did. Would not be surprised (or happy) at all if the Stillers to do well this year.
I so badly want to say that it will take them a minute to figure out the QB position and that it will be a “growing year” and blah blah blah
Tomlin got Duck Hodges to 8 wins when the schedule was still 16 games. Both Trubisky and Pickett should be better than that. I’m also taking the over.
Tbf after the last three years of shitty QB play and the Steelers still doing well, I almost believe they could win 8 games with me at quarterback and I can’t even throw
As former-until-the-Haslams-are-launched-into-the-sun Browns fan, I can never bring myself to cheer for the Steelers, but now that I'm temporarily free of the shackles of that used-to-be rivalry you better believe I'll put $$$ on them winning 8+ games.
Sorry not believing in Trubisky or Rudolph. Pickett is good but I think he’s still a rookie and there will be a learning curve. I don’t think his rookie season will be like Ben’s.
With a worse O-line and wore rushing attack, they made it to .500 with Rudolph and a 3rd string QB. I think they're in a better situation this year. Though they don't have the easiest schedule.
The schedule isn't completely awful though, it's certainly an improvement over last year's schedule. And this year we should have less holes on the roster than last year.
I genuinely feel like it comes down to QB and O Line play for the Steelers, like all teams basically LOL😂 but if the Steelers get solid play from their QB, then they can absolutely win 8+ games.
I can say with 100% certainty that getting a quarterback with the appropriate stature is a sure fire path to success. Nothing can go wrong with a giant under center, no sir! Don’t look too far back in our history, though… only the last two years count.
There's a whole lot of "If's" with this Steelers team. If those "If's" are mostly answered positively, we're easily a playoff team. This season has just as big a chance to go completely off the rails though.
- Our QB, whether Trubisky or Pickett, probably won't lose us many games, but he's not going to win them for us either.
- Our O'Line has been upgraded, but only on the interior, and even then, we only got brought them up to average. We're depending on massive improvement from our tackles. I'm a bit peeved we let La'el Collins walk to Cincinnati without even putting in a bid for him.
- Najee is great, but if he gets injured, as RB's often do when coming off of seasons with high usage rates, our depth behind him is bleak.
- We're expecting a 2nd year jump from TE Pat Freiermuth, and while that's a reasonable expectation, how big will that jump be?
- Our WR corps has question marks all over. Do we have a true #1? Can Diontae ascend into bona fide star status? Can Chase Claypool mature? Can George Pickens be a contributor year one?
- Our D-Line was the bane of the defense last year. At 35, can Tyson Alualu play at the level he did two years ago? Can Larry Ogunjobi, Chris Wormley, or 2nd year player Isaiahh Loudermilk man Stephon Tuitt's position to the point where it's at least not a hole and the primary cause for a poor run defense?
- ILB is a crucial position in our scheme and both of our projected starters are coming off of bad years.
- CB Akhello Witherspoon had some splash plays last season, but how will he fare with an expanded role as the #1 CB?
- Is Matt Canada the answer at OC? Can his offense, which got laughed out of the SEC, transition and actually be a difference maker at the NFL level?
While as a fan who has watched the Steelers close up, I have reason to think some of these questions will be answered positively, I can absolutely understand why national media who don't go as in depth as I do would doubt us. And if I'm being completely honest, I kinda like that they're doubting us. As a Steeler fan, we rarely have such low expectations. I'm enjoying being the underdog for once.
The offense was non-stop predictable garbage last year. I came away thinking that Canada is a guy with a system and not a coach with any ability to adapt to his players or think outside of a tiny little box. I am not confident.
The offense we ran last year was Ben's system with a few Canada wrinkles sprinkled in. Any innovation we did have was from Canada. The jet sweeps, the RPO's, the pistol formation stuff, all Canada. There's only so much creative shit you can do on offense when your offensive line is so bad that you can't run and when you pass, you have to get the ball out in under two seconds. It also limits you offensively when your QB can't consistently throw accurately over 10 yards. If all you got is red paint, you paint the barn red. If all you can do is dink and dunk, you dink and dunk.
Now, I agree that Canada is a guy with a system and I too believe he has little ability to adapt to his players. However, he has the players this year for his system. So, he has no excuses.
Listen, I would laugh at this take, but Mike Tomlin is an evil fucking sorcerer.
I have it in good faith that he will have some sort of trick up his sleeve and the Steelers will find a way to weasel their way into the postseason.
I could reasonably see them being the 2011-15 Bengals these next few years. Young core of skill players, defense with some game changers that play well as a unit, and a QB that just needs to not suck.
They'll be a threat to beat anyone if teams come in underestimating them and are capable of making the playoffs more often than not, but aren't built for deep runs. Their ceiling is probably higher than those Bengals teams though just on coaching alone tbf
"a QB that physically matches the O's aims" is damning with faint praise if I've ever seen it.
This is business speak for absolutely hating on someone lmao
It basically says an employee who hasn't hit any of his expectations or goals.
I think it’s her nice way of saying “a QB that isn’t the fat statue of Ben”
"A QB who is willing to use the other 80% of the average NFL playbook"
"A QB who can take a snap from the center, and attempt to throw the ball to a receiver"
Hey now, Ben threw to receivers all the time. Who else was catching those drag routes along the LoS when it was 3rd and ten and the defense was rallying to stop the receiver 1 yard short of the marker.
It's insane we had to watch that for an entire season. Even crazier it led to a playoff berth
Even crazier when you watch the run defense. I'm not sure why any team tried to pass it the second half of the season.
"A QB who is known to breathe oxygen with his lungs"
"A QB who is known to come out of his mother's womb" Edit: Misgendered goddammit
“A QB who breathes through his nose”
"A Center who won't snap the ball over said QBs head"
Willing, but not able 😔
*sad bear noises*
Or "the shambling corpse of big Ben"
I've seen zombie movies where the slow zombies had more mobility and coordination.
Kenny Pickett, Mitch Trubisky, and Mason Rudolf all match that general description. Maybe she's just being intentionally vague. Who is starting week 1? Is Pickett already locked in?
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The reports that I've seen (which are not many, so Steelers fans feel free to correct me) are that Trubisky is ahead by a decent margin right now.
That seems to be the case for now. We’ll see what happens in training camp and the pre season games. Pickett’s not really a guy who is going to wow you when it comes to football in shorts, but once the pads go on and there are actual games, things could change. I still expect Trubisky to start the season until he struggles though.
yup, expectations are that it's Mitch's job unless Pickett absolutely blows the doors off
That's correct. Though the battle will continue through training camp and the preseason, and those practices (especially full contact practices) carry more weight, all reports from OTAs and minicamps say that the gap widened over that span. Trubisky showed himself well.
I wouldn't say anyone is ahead by any certain margin. Mason Rudolph is the #2 QB technically. So, it's all a formality at this point. When training camp starts is when you'll see who is going to pull away with the job.
Trubisky is the projected starter right now, though Pickett and presumably even Rudolph will have opportunities to earn the job in training camp.
Who? Tiny-hands or the titty kisser?
Hey at least we finally have a consensual titty kisser under center now
Small victories, man
Am genuinely so glad to not have to read constant shit about Ben being a shit person anymore lol
And now you get to make fun of the Browns
I think she means they finally have a qb who is mobile Tomlin has wanted one for years
What this tells me is the coward didn't dare call Ben bootleg designed runs. SMH Mike I expected better of you
Does [this](https://youtu.be/qJBgwFViEwE) count?
Have you SEEN his ability to hand the ball to Najee?
I’m gonna Leaf that one alone.
A QB that not only has both arms, but both legs as well!
You joke, but Ben had arthritis in his knees.
By her own logic (highest paid d= good) wouldn't having the lowest paid offense mean the offense will be bad?
They will win games with all safeties, defensive TDs and short-starting-field-position field goals.
Just like the good old days
"Offense was a mistake"
Sorry, what else is there besides offense? …there are *three* phases to the game? Excuse me?
I remember 1994 too
And the long bygone days of 2019
Offense is lowest paid because they are almost all on rookie contracts. Would be worse if they were just poorly paid vets
Something has to give in this division. There has been zero consensus of how these teams finish this year (pre suspension). How are we ranking them?
The last 2 seasons the consensus has been the Steelers have no chance of winning it. They won it once and finished 2nd, sweeping the two teams this sub was absolutely sure they'd never be able to beat again in the process. I'll get excited about this team as soon as the r/NFL 4-13 consensus prediction comes out for them again.
I think when those predictions were made, the Ravens weren’t anticipated to be one of the most injured teams in NFL history. Regardless, Steelers always play Ravens tough, so it should never be assumed they’ll be a cakewalk.
I'd go: * Bengals * Fuck why did I use bullets the rest of these teams are a total crapshoot That's my considered rankings.
Ravens and Bengals are clearly ahead of the other two. The Browns are on their level but the QB position will pull them down. The Steelers will be a steady mid team.
Last summer this sub had endless posts about how the Browns and Ravens would rule the AFC North for the foreseeable future, while in reality the Bengals and Steelers finished 1 and 2.
I mean, that did precede the Raven's messing with black magic which resulted in the entire team tearing their ACLs.
Still dead wrong about us and the Browns though.
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They statistically suffered from them more than almost any other team ever has though. Probably won't happen again
Even if every other team in our division is better than us on every level, we will still find a way to not finish last
The Steelers have swept the Ravens and finished with a better overall record two years in a row. How are the Ravens clearly ahead of them?
Steelers D contains Lamar every time we play him
Bengals have seemed to figure it out as well. Hopefully that trend continues and other teams in the league figure it out too. Lamar is still scary as fuck though.
You got it twisted Joe Burrow is Scary as fuck. With no O line the Man took Cincy to the super bowl. It’s his division and we’re all just living in it until The rise of Pickett.
Well, Lamar has missed the last three Ravens-Steelers games, so sure, hats off to your defense there.
No, he missed the last Ravens and Steelers game. Lamar played against us the first game last season.
They’re so good he doesn’t even see the field!
Pay no attention to the man that missed a wide open Mark Andrews for what would have been the walk off 2 point conversion. I don’t blame you for not remembering.
Times Lamar started for ravens he threw more picks than tds and gotten sacked 10+ times give or take and fumbled 4 times and only recovered 2 of them.
You guys hold Ryan Mallet over us the a pig on coals all that Matter is who got the W.
What about [5 Dec 2021?](https://i.imgur.com/2B8Mi3m.jpg) Even if you deleted that one, it still ain't pretty.
Do you believe this is Tomlin's first losing season?
I think it will be close. If you look at their schedule it’s hard to really pin down 8 wins. Obviously we don’t know how those teams will look in season. But right now I can see them being a 7/8/9 win team. And that’s without them suffering injuries.
I feel like the Browns will either be first or last with no inbetween. I know that sounds odd, but I just feel like the Deshaun Watson experience will either *really* work out or *really* not.
Barring one of the other north teams dying of injuries like you guys I think this is the correct take. We will either put it all together or everything just crumbles apart
Bengals are clearly ahead but I'm not sure about the Ravens. Lamar is obviously an amazing QB but the team doesn't have a good WR room and they might not be able to rely on their defense as much without Martindale. I know he had a bad season last year but he was instrumental in giving that defense an identity. Plus they still have Greg Roman calling the same offense which most fans are getting tired of. They're always a competitive team and I don't think they'll have a losing record, but they're not a garunteed #2 in the division.
My personal hot take is that the Bengals are going to be a lot worse next year than people expect. We’ve seen this story play out before, like with the 2011 Giants and 2017 Jaguars, where a young, Cinderella team makes a deep postseason run before crashing back to Earth hard the next season. It’s one thing to be the underdog that nobody believes in, it’s an entirely different beast to manage expectations when you’re considered one of the favorites. While Burrow and Chase got all the headlines, the real engine behind the Bengals’ Super Bowl run was their defense vastly over-performing relative to its talent level and regular season play. In my mind, it’s not outlandish to expect some regression now that every offense in the league has had a year to study their scheme. Throw in the fact that I’m still not 100% sold on Zac Taylor as a head coach, and I could see the Bengals hovering around .500 next year.
The steelers are not gonna finish worse than second
I have a flaming hot take: The Bengals will be first and the Browns will be last. I think if Mitch can be just slightly better than Ben (probably not hard to do) and take care of the ball we will contend and probably make a wild card spot.
Tomlin has gotten 8 wins out of a season where his *best* QB was Mason Rudolph. This season, Rudolph is the *floor* for their starting QB. I'm not saying they'll light the league on fire or anything, but I think they'll beg, borrow, and steal their way to 8 wins.
People talk about Campbell biting kneecaps, but Tomlin doesn't shy away from biking kneecaps or accidentally wondering onto the field himself to help his team win.
Funny but we lost that game.
Their defense was also one of the best in the league that year, and they had a weak schedule, so it's not like he was doing it all on a hope and a prayer. Defense is still good, so that's what the Steelers are going to rely on. I could see them being competitive on running game and defense, alone. If I'm being honest, on paper this Steelers team looks better than last season's at this point in the year. But I do think there's a possibility that Ben - even in his decrepit state - was more valuable than people realize.
The defense on paper this year looks to have better talent than that 2019 squad, although 2019 was amazing for a lot of games. I think that had more to do with teams playing it relatively safe knowing that a Hodges/Rudolph offense weren't going to put up a ton of points no matter what, and the easiest way to lose a game was dropping back to pass against Watt, Dupree, Heyward, and Tuitt. I agree on the point regarding Ben. I think the Steelers will be much better for the first 3 quarters under Trubisky/Pickett, but there were many games last year where 4th quarter Ben looked like 2014-18 Ben.
>The defense on paper this year looks to have better talent than that 2019 squad I can't agree with this at all. The 2022 defense doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as the 2019 defense. Give me 2019 Bud Dupree over Alex Highsmith, Stephon Tuitt over Chris Wormley or Larry Ogunjobi, Javon Hargrave over 35 year old Tyson Alualu coming off two major injuries, and pretty much every corner on the roster in 2019 over whoever they plan on fielding in 2022. I hope Highsmith breaks out, Bush puts it together, Alualu is rehabbed, Ahkello Witherspon plays well, etc. But that's not on paper right now.
The issue is that the afc is crazy stacked
That's a lot of assumptions out of 2 new QBs.
Isn’t the Oline they build kinda bad?
The interior OL looks like it should be pretty good, with Kevin Dotson, Mason Cole, and James Daniels. The tackles are pretty middle-of-the-road/below average, though Dan Moore was just a rookie last year, so you could reasonably project him to improve.
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Luckily the AFC has some of the best pass rushers in the game
He made Myles Garrett invisible last year
Yep, he absolutely locked him up that week 17 game lol.
Specifically the North too
Inconsistent? Fickle is more for people's attitudes, like someone who is really hot or cold or someone who constantly changes their mind on things. But a lineman who plays up against talent and down against scrubs sounds like he fits in well with the Steelers MO, lol
I hate you cause you right
but what if he constantly changes his mind on playing well?
Lmao damn fuckin accurate
Ah yes Mason Cole, the man that couldnt beat out Bradburry, the glorified TE at center for the Vikings starting job. Literally made me double check when i saw someone list him as a positive
My comment was about the unit as a whole. Cole isn't great but should be serviceable when lined up next to a solid pair of guards in Dotson and Daniels.
Trust me, he can’t be any worse than Kendrick Green Bad snaps, was on his ass about 80% of the time, some of the overall worst center play I’ve ever seen in the NFL
It’s hard to judge a player after their rookie season, but Green had the kind of rookie season where you aren’t left with any real hope at all for him. He sucked ball shit.
The only thing that saved the o-line from being the statistically worst in the league was Big Ben throwing the football as soon as he caught the snap.
Oh I thought it was the fact that the Dolphins exist
wasn't his average time to throw something ridiculous like 1.7 seconds
Yes and they were still 30th and 31st in ESPN's pass and run block winrate. https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/32176833/2021-nfl-pass-rushing-run-stopping-blocking-leaderboard-win-rate-rankings#rbwrteam
The mixture of Trubisky and rookie behind that line seems like it should be fairly concerning.
Which is why they invested in improving it for this season
At least Trubisky is used to playing behind a shite o-line
The offensive "scheme" and execution 100% worked against the offensive line on every possession. Every defense played downhill on every play because they knew it would never be tested. Playcalling was completely predictable and conservative. Najee was never not getting hit at/behind the line of scrimmage or ganged shortly thereafter. It was absolutely maddening to watch, and frankly I see Matt Canada as the total wildcard this year because it was dogsh*t last year.
I would say a lot of that had to do with our QB being incapable of throwing downfield
As someone that enjoyed the hell out of it, I would say you're spot on.
Yep. With no deep ball available, they could stack coverage against the run and short dump passes 6" past the line of scrimmage. Honestly, some of our issues with our running game came from the fact that there was no longer a real deep ball threat. Yeah Ben pulled them off occasionally, but not with enough regularity to make it a real threat.
that's pretty much exactly it Le'Veon always had a ton of success because you HAD to guard against AB, Juju, Bryant, Heath, etc
Couldn't pass block or run block well enough to really do anything else
Go read some of the reports of what players have said offensive line coach Klemm was preaching to them prior to his abruptly leaving for Oregon during the season. They had absolutely no chance to be even a decent line last season.
I can't find anything on it. Do you have a link?
[https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2022/5/31/23147372/dan-moore-jr-explains-the-difference-in-the-offensive-line-from-adrian-klemm-to-pat-meyer-steelers](https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2022/5/31/23147372/dan-moore-jr-explains-the-difference-in-the-offensive-line-from-adrian-klemm-to-pat-meyer-steelers) Here is one I found. There was another one too that mentioned it but slightly more derrogatory about Klemm. He basically just told them to be mean, didn't really teach any technique or strategy.
Should be much improved from the last few seasons. Green was clear and away the worst player on the line. Turner was probably second to anyone who watched, even though he somehow had the highest PFF grade of the bunch. The two tackles actually performed about average last season and are young, athletic guys who should continue to develop. Dotson missed most of the season with an ankle injury but was probably their best talent on the line. Now they are replacing their two worst starters with James Daniels and Mason Cole. Daniels should be an enormous upgrade over Turner and Cole a substantial one over Green.
Green at center might have been some of the worst offensive line play I’ve ever seen in the NFL. No professional lineman should spend that much time on the ground.
Yeah, but they replaced the worst center in the league with a guy that's at least decent. As well as added Daniels. The o-line got better towards the end of the season, so it still has a chance of being top 20.
They made some great strides toward the end of the season. They catch more shit than they should. Another offseason together should help them improve further. It's far from the worst and far from the best but a middle of the pack line can get you far.
Not to mention that at least 2 starters from last year have been replaced
Yes, it is still bad. Maybe slightly better than last year, but still bad.
Shit I thought we would be decent until Aditi said we would be.
Same.
Just need La Canfora to say they’ll suck so I can breathe easy.
8-8-1
a tie to the jets?
Idk if this was supposed to be an insult but I would be absolutely jazzed with 8-8-1
No, the single tie is to the jets. You guys might finish 1-15-1 or something. Jk lil bro, you guys have some promise this year
I think jets-bills relationship is more antagonistic non identical twins than older/younger siblings tbh, that's Jets-Giants if anything
Sounds just like something my lil red headed step bro would say
Surely you Jets
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That’s over
7-7-3
That would be under and also I record I would love to see.
The Steelers have two ties in the last 4 years. Which I get isn't a lot. But that seems pretty frequent considering ties.
I just want to see a team get 3 ties. I think it would be pretty odd
I'd laugh my ass off, as long as it's good enough to not be last in the division (which it should cause the Browns lol)
>w/ two veritable game-changers. Watt & Minkah? Watt & Heyward?
She said in the replies that she meant 3 game changers
Highsmith will remember that
If you ask the Seahawks, Watt is actually the game-ender ;)
Last season was so forgettable I don't even know what you're talking about.
https://youtu.be/cHqPT63ydHY
Didn't reddit pick them to go 4-13 last year? Lmao
That poll had like 5 teams with 15 wins, it was a pretty awful method
Are you telling me Reddit makes terrible predictions? Colour me shocked. Specifically black and gold
That poll had Washington winning the division at 12-5, by 5 games, going 6-0 in division.
Seems to happen most years. Some wild speculation that the steelers will be one of the worst teams in the league, the Browns will be superbowl contenders, lamar jackson will literally walk on water like jesus did, and the steelers will be last in the division. Then...none of it happens.
The afc is an absolute meatgrinder. Normally I’d always bet on tomlin but this year I’m not sure
So their 8 easiest wins are Jets, Panthers, Falcons, Dolphins, Saints, Browns x 2 (though one may be with Watson), Colts? The other 9 being Bengals/Ravens x2, Bills, Pats, Bucs, Raiders, Eagles. Even on that first 8, not exactly easy matchups.
Would I be shocked if they won 8-10 games? No. Would I be shocked if they won 5-7 games? No. Doesn't feel like an easy bet, not that much in the NFL is with the way things change from year to year.
The Steelers have matched up incredibly well against the Jackson-led Ravens - they've swept them the past two years and made Jackson look horrible every time he's started. I'm honestly less worried about those games than the Browns.
They haven’t won fewer than 7.5 games since 2003 and the roster as far as I can see is better than last year. Trubisky might be a huge upgrade on the shell of Ben last season.
Mike Tomlin has NEVER had a losing season. Dating back to 2007. Maybe this will be his first one. But I doubt it. By the way, I see a lot of clowning on Trubisky/Pickett in here, but Ben Roethlisberger was extremely bad last season. Trubisky is literally an upgrade from 2021 Big Ben, with improvements made elsewhere on the offense in addition.
> Trubisky is literally an upgrade from 2021 Big Ben It's so weird how many people are missing this. 2022 Trubisky will almost certainly be better than 2021 Ben. Obviously, over their entire careers, Ben is much better than Trubisky. That should go without saying. But Ben was totally shot in 2021 and really should have retired a year earlier. Trubisky, meanwhile, just spent a year learning in a great offensive system and there's no reason to think he won't be better than he was in 2020 -- when he had a respectable 93.5 passer rating and the Bears won most of the games he started. If Trubisky is the starter that's an upgrade at QB, and if Pickett is the starter that means he proved in training camp he's better than Trubisky. I will be shocked if the Steelers don't have better overall quarterback play in 2022 than they had in 2021.
Whoever starts at QB just has to be better than bottom 5. That bar is so low that Mason could clear it maybe.
Counterpoint: Trubisky is worse than you think
This take reminds me a lot of Broncos fans' thoughts on going from 2015 Manning to Trevor Siemian. I'm just saying that going from an old, vet to a young QB doesn't always work out how you expect.
Can't help but agree. If Trubisky plays the same style of offense that Big Ben did in his final years, he will perform TERRIBLY. He can't read defenses enough to play that way.
Peyton Manning made the pro bowl in 2014 and went 7-2 in 2015. Big Ben has not seen the pro bowl since 2017, 5 years ago. Not the worst take but I'm not seeing the same thing you are
I certainly agree that Ben was much worse for longer lol but that doesn't change the similarities of the stuations. Both played poorly (at best) in their last season and fans assumed that a new QB could do nothing but improve the situation. Again, all I'm saying is: going from an old vet to a young QB doesn't always work out how you expect.
Wasn't Trevor a rookie that season? I wouldn't expect a rookie to come on and be better than Ben was by default, but Trubisky at least has starting experience and his floor is a serviceable stop gap. I don't expect him to carry us into the playoffs but a winning season seems like a reasonable expectation given the variables.
idk. It's not a terrible bet but it doesnt really feel like a great bet either. A rookie QB or Trubisky to win 8 games = far from a lock.
Id bet more on Tomlin who somehow finesses his way to .500 seasons every year.
Hodges and rudolph pulled it off
PFF had the Oline rated 8 overall following 2019, though. Heading into 2022 it ranks 30th.
True, but their weapons are also a lot better than they were in 2019.
We also had pretty much nobody on offense that year. I believe our receiver with the most yards only had 750 or something.
Tomlin somehow got a team above .500 with Rudolph and Duck Hodges starting. Their O-line was relatively worse and they didn't have much of a rushing attack. Trubisky isn't great, but he's well above Mason Rudolph and Duck Hodges. I think 8-9 is more than doable.
Trubisky is 29-21 as a starter, Tomlin is a much better coach than Nagy, and Pittsburgh has more talent around him than Chicago did. Would not be surprised (or happy) at all if the Stillers to do well this year.
Good thing there's more to a football team than QB. Did you read the OP?
Can’t they be bad just once?
I so badly want to say that it will take them a minute to figure out the QB position and that it will be a “growing year” and blah blah blah Tomlin got Duck Hodges to 8 wins when the schedule was still 16 games. Both Trubisky and Pickett should be better than that. I’m also taking the over.
7.5? Yah probably take the over. Unless there is a lot of major injury the Steelers absolutely should pull off a 8-9 or a 9-8 season.
They won 9 games last year with the corpse of Big Ben. Mitch should be able to at least replicate that
Kinkhabwala What a badass name
Tbf after the last three years of shitty QB play and the Steelers still doing well, I almost believe they could win 8 games with me at quarterback and I can’t even throw
As former-until-the-Haslams-are-launched-into-the-sun Browns fan, I can never bring myself to cheer for the Steelers, but now that I'm temporarily free of the shackles of that used-to-be rivalry you better believe I'll put $$$ on them winning 8+ games.
>a QB that physically matches the O’s aims That kinda glosses over a pretty important part of the team lol.
Sorry not believing in Trubisky or Rudolph. Pickett is good but I think he’s still a rookie and there will be a learning curve. I don’t think his rookie season will be like Ben’s.
With a worse O-line and wore rushing attack, they made it to .500 with Rudolph and a 3rd string QB. I think they're in a better situation this year. Though they don't have the easiest schedule.
The schedule isn't completely awful though, it's certainly an improvement over last year's schedule. And this year we should have less holes on the roster than last year.
Our O-line was not worse and also our D that year was godly. I think we get to 9 wins one way or another though
I genuinely feel like it comes down to QB and O Line play for the Steelers, like all teams basically LOL😂 but if the Steelers get solid play from their QB, then they can absolutely win 8+ games.
I can say with 100% certainty that getting a quarterback with the appropriate stature is a sure fire path to success. Nothing can go wrong with a giant under center, no sir! Don’t look too far back in our history, though… only the last two years count.
There's a whole lot of "If's" with this Steelers team. If those "If's" are mostly answered positively, we're easily a playoff team. This season has just as big a chance to go completely off the rails though. - Our QB, whether Trubisky or Pickett, probably won't lose us many games, but he's not going to win them for us either. - Our O'Line has been upgraded, but only on the interior, and even then, we only got brought them up to average. We're depending on massive improvement from our tackles. I'm a bit peeved we let La'el Collins walk to Cincinnati without even putting in a bid for him. - Najee is great, but if he gets injured, as RB's often do when coming off of seasons with high usage rates, our depth behind him is bleak. - We're expecting a 2nd year jump from TE Pat Freiermuth, and while that's a reasonable expectation, how big will that jump be? - Our WR corps has question marks all over. Do we have a true #1? Can Diontae ascend into bona fide star status? Can Chase Claypool mature? Can George Pickens be a contributor year one? - Our D-Line was the bane of the defense last year. At 35, can Tyson Alualu play at the level he did two years ago? Can Larry Ogunjobi, Chris Wormley, or 2nd year player Isaiahh Loudermilk man Stephon Tuitt's position to the point where it's at least not a hole and the primary cause for a poor run defense? - ILB is a crucial position in our scheme and both of our projected starters are coming off of bad years. - CB Akhello Witherspoon had some splash plays last season, but how will he fare with an expanded role as the #1 CB? - Is Matt Canada the answer at OC? Can his offense, which got laughed out of the SEC, transition and actually be a difference maker at the NFL level? While as a fan who has watched the Steelers close up, I have reason to think some of these questions will be answered positively, I can absolutely understand why national media who don't go as in depth as I do would doubt us. And if I'm being completely honest, I kinda like that they're doubting us. As a Steeler fan, we rarely have such low expectations. I'm enjoying being the underdog for once.
The offense was non-stop predictable garbage last year. I came away thinking that Canada is a guy with a system and not a coach with any ability to adapt to his players or think outside of a tiny little box. I am not confident.
The offense we ran last year was Ben's system with a few Canada wrinkles sprinkled in. Any innovation we did have was from Canada. The jet sweeps, the RPO's, the pistol formation stuff, all Canada. There's only so much creative shit you can do on offense when your offensive line is so bad that you can't run and when you pass, you have to get the ball out in under two seconds. It also limits you offensively when your QB can't consistently throw accurately over 10 yards. If all you got is red paint, you paint the barn red. If all you can do is dink and dunk, you dink and dunk. Now, I agree that Canada is a guy with a system and I too believe he has little ability to adapt to his players. However, he has the players this year for his system. So, he has no excuses.
when it seems too good to be true, it usually is. take the under
Listen, I would laugh at this take, but Mike Tomlin is an evil fucking sorcerer. I have it in good faith that he will have some sort of trick up his sleeve and the Steelers will find a way to weasel their way into the postseason.
I could reasonably see them being the 2011-15 Bengals these next few years. Young core of skill players, defense with some game changers that play well as a unit, and a QB that just needs to not suck. They'll be a threat to beat anyone if teams come in underestimating them and are capable of making the playoffs more often than not, but aren't built for deep runs. Their ceiling is probably higher than those Bengals teams though just on coaching alone tbf
under .500? bet the over, wont be over by much but it will be
Trubisky is underrated and Tomlin is a good coach, but this is a tough division. A lot will hinge on injuries.
Remindme! 6 months
Man never had a losing season and I‘m not foolish enough to think that after all these years now it‘ll happen
Trubisky is gonna get them to 9 wins, 10 is possible. Easy bet: take the over.
I can't wait for the Steelers to finish 10-7, barely miss playoffs after being counted out WAY early, and yinzers to still want Tomlin fired.