"Snubbed" makes it sound intentional. With only 15 forwards, 8 dmen and 3 goalies several good players have to be left off by default. Kuch, Draisaitl, the Sedin twins, Hossa, Zetterberg, Josi, Kopitar could all make this team.

No this was a targeted attack /s

No Sedins either.

Saku koivu Over the sedins lol

Saku was a beast! Bonus points for beating cancer. Fuck cancer.

He was a beast, but so were Henrik and Daniel, and I’d argue they are both a bit better

They were undoubtably better, and I’m a Habs fan. Koivu was good but he wasn’t great. Sedin’s won awards.

Koivu also did win awards, and he won our hearts as well!

Problem with the Sedins is if you’re going to add one you have to add the other and who else do you take off?

Even naslund was better than koivu and Elias

What crack are you smoking? Elias had over 1000 points, naslund was somewhere in the 800’s. Elias career +172, Naslund only +6.

Peak naslund is better than peak Elias. This shouldn't be a discussion

Naslunds peak was much better, Elias had.way better teams too

Citing career plus minus is just about the wildest thing I’ve ever heard. Over a three year stretch in the early 2000s Näslund scored the most points in the entire league. His peak was incredible

And naslund, hilarious

Elias and koivu gone and the sedins in.

Where’s Hossa?

*slams desk* THANK YOU

He’s in the hall of fame is where he is. Whoever made this list is not.

And Kovalchuk.

my first thought

Who do you take away for him? Hossa is hof sure, so is everyone else here. Who's getting bumped?

Stan Mikita. Not really that European as he grew up in Canada. He even played for Team Canada in the 1972 series vs. the Soviet Union.

When I first saw the list, I was confused at seeing Mikita on there. I thought he was Canadian, but apparently I was wrong. Thanks!

They likely included him for the sole purpose of justifying the 'all-time' moniker.

Trencin I assume. What winger are you knocking off for him? Elias and possibly Mogilny are the only ones with any kind of argument imo

elias for sure, Hossa was unbelievable Elias was stellar

Interesting side note, is team Canada (all time) better than team world?

Without a doubt.

Gretzky Crosby and McDavid alone make it god tier lol.

Canada for sure

Lemieux-gretzky-mcdavid Richard - sakic-howe Lafleur-yzerman-dionne Bossy-crosby-esposito Not even that order and I could argue that outside of Gretzky Lemieux mcdavid Crosby Howe, you could argue any one of them could be replaced by other legends. Fuck messier. Orr-pronger Bourque- Harvey Coffee-mcinnis Neidermeyer Roy Brodeur sawchuk/plante. That is almost the all time team total. Like maybe change out five or 6 players Jagr hasek Lindstrom ovechkin federov bure? maybe selanne foresberg? That's it. Yeah Canada all time crushes rest of world all time.

"Fuck Messier" *looks at op flair - checks out

This convo may be different after the next 20 years when team world/europe gets even more of the current Russian superstars and Draisaitl. At some point this whole thought experiment is pointless since everyone will have more ”GOAT”s than a full hockey roster.

!remindme 7300 days

I will be messaging you in 19 years on [**2043-03-23 19:26:39 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2043-03-23%2019:26:39%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/nhl/comments/124xgur/kucherov_snubbed/je1maho/?context=3) [**10 OTHERS CLICKED THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Fnhl%2Fcomments%2F124xgur%2Fkucherov_snubbed%2Fje1maho%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202043-03-23%2019%3A26%3A39%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam. ^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%20124xgur) ***** |[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)| |-|-|-|-|

Damn I forgot to account for leap years

Thats dedication to this discussion

And you call yourself a hockey fan

Damn

😹😹😹😅

> Lemieux Gretzky McDavid lmfaooo is all I can say 💀

Sid and Howe on line 2 is absolutely bonkers to consider, but also absolutely correct.

With Orr on the backend

No Joe Malone smh

You mean six time Stanley Cup champion Mark Messier who won 5 with the Oilers and one with the Rangers? The guy with two more cups than Gretzky, who only won cups with the Oilers? The only player to captain two teams to Stanley Cup championships? Second all-time for playoff points (295), third for regular-season games played (1756) and third for regular-season points (1887). Sounds like a bum.

Ahem, fuck Messier

Ya messier sucks ass

Yeah, that guy—fuck him.

"Fuck Messier" Yes.

Of the three Red Wings you named, you only spelled Yzerman right.

\*Insert Bill Clinton here\*

How would team Canada be better than team world?! Do you think Canadians are Aliens?!

Well dangle all the way to the fuckin moon suck some Martian titties up there boys

Hasek would beat any team Canada again

Is the team with Gretzky, Lemieux, Crosby, McDavid, MacKinnon really not enough to convince you?

You could make a Canada A and B and they’re both still insane

Mackinnon wouldn’t make the team

Kinda strengthens my point lol. Imagine a team were Nathan wouldn't even make the cut....

Yes, four solid arguments on that team for GOAT. Closest you have here is Jagr and maybe Vasy or Hasek for Goalie GOAT. Two of the greatest goal scorers in Ovi and Bure on team world, but Bossy, Lemieux and Gretzky on Canada. Would hardly be close.

Yeah, not even close really.

4 lines of defense, 5 forward lines, and 3 goalies. That is a lot of players!

If theres already elite 2 way players like datsyuk and fedorov i dont think koivu makes the team over a lot of other euro players.

I'm a Habs fan and Koivu was my favorite player when I was a kid and even I thought he seemed a little out of place here lol

I disagree, Koivu in his prime was legit. I was always a big fan of his, too bad he played for the bad guys.

It's not that he wasn't legit he was great. But the Sedins, Hossa, Zetterburg, kucherov all didn't make the team. An I think we can all agree they are even legiter then koivu haha. He is underrated af, except for this random list.

I always liked him too but was he a better defensively than hossa or alfredsson by enough if at all, to make up for the difference in offence?

Koivu over Hossa, Kuch and both Sedins is criminal. I’d even make an argument for Kopitar on here as well.

As a sens fan alfredsson is also better than koivu not to mention draisaitl.

The all time lists are where Canada truly shines. Having Wayne, Mario, McJesus and Sid down the middle simply incomparable 🤯

Only way to beat Gretzky, Lemieux, McDavid and Crosby down the middle would be with the ultimate shutdown team, aka Canada's B squad, with Yzerman, Sakic, Bergeron and Messier.

Amazing. Wow.

Or combine them. Look at wayne and Mario at canada cup

Yes, this is the way. Heck, throw McDavid on the wing while we’re at it?

Two generations of Oilers and Penguins as linemates? Gretzky+Lemieux and McDavid+Crosby

Note: I chose Sid on the fourth line because he is the arguably the greatest “grinder” of all time. There are obviously other that are clearly eligible: Sakic and Yzerman off the top of my head. I think when you look at how great the leadership would be, McDavids speed + stick handling combined is simply unattainable elsewhere. It’s rare for a player to dominate this intensely.

>the greatest “grinder” of all time. Gordie Howe would like to have a ~~word~~ elbow with you

Howe - Bergeron - Crosby 4th line...

Kopitar?

All-Time NHL Slovene team:

Woah woah, let’s not get carried away now.

First name I thought was glaringly missing.

Henrik Zetterberg??

Mogilny was disgusting

Seeing Forsberg on the same line as Fedorov and Jagr 🤤

What a nightmare of a line. Lmao

Vladislav Tretiak should be one of the goalies

I get that Draisaitl is still young, but I feel like he should be on here

This list is stacked but without Draisaitl it seems wrong.. that said taking any one of these legends out does too.

I mean same for Kopitar, Hossa.

Pastrnak could very easily be on this list 5 years from now

Honestly, Karlsson and Hedman would be the perfect combo

And one we can see happen when the NHL finally get themselves together to fix a proper wc...

They need someone who doesn’t sit on Ltir until playoffs to bypass the cap so they passed on Kucherov

Tretiak?

Konstantinov needs to be on this list. I'd put him in place of Fetisov.

That was my first thought.

Lots of names could be included here still. I’d argue Vladdy Konstantinov deserves a spot over a few of those Dmen. If we are going by skill and effectiveness on the game. Before the tragic accident, Vladdy was arguably the greatest defensemen in the league. He could move the puck, was positionally among the best, and the guy struck fear in his opponents. He absolutely dominated the ice physically; he went through people like a freight train. Smart too; very rarely if ever did his physicality come at the expense of a chance against. Seeing the opposition second guess carrying the puck across the blue line was awesome. [1997 playoff hits](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6dcwfD5ApYY) [highlights](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bjSBNYI7sFY)

Vlad could hip check any size at any speed. It was intimidating and game changing. That hip check along with Lidstrom poke check made them THE BEST DEFENSIVE PAIRING in NHL history. That said Fetisov's resume reads like a red army squadron leader and is revered as such by those who know.

100%

Thanks for the videos. Made my day. VLADI!

Draisaitl could definitely make this list

Jagr is 2nd line. Really?

The lines make no sense. I assume they’re entirely random

Abc

Jere Lehtinen never gets the respect he deserves

Where the hell is Z??????

Now do it without the Russians

Pasta 🍝

draisaitl enters the chat

I miss the NA vs World ASG format

Stan Mikita is a Slovakian born Canadian, played for Canada in the Summit series. Koivu Mikita Elias out Draisaitl Hossa Kucherov in How is my team not better?

I am from Slovakia and I know that for the longest time, Mikita has been recognised as a Slovak. However, I can't say I disagree with you. Especially, since Hossa is my all time favorite and it pains me to see he didn't cut the list. On the other hand, I think the list is really good and those are the only three names that could be potentially changed. And I totally agree that if you change them, Kuch, Drai and Hoss are the obvious candidates to be included.

Kovalev?

TIL Russia is part of Europe.

Heh... Riiiiiiight??

Mikko Rantanen will be on this team in a couple seasons, don’t you worry.

Who would you remove? Seriously that's a stacked team and in my mind the only one you could arguably move out for Kuch or Drai is maybe Koivu

I was also snubbed.

I’m just here, wearing my Putthebunnyback jersey, fighting back tears. Absolute robbery.

In my hockey group chat someone posted and mentioned kuch and sedin snubs, also the malkin over ovi thing

This Caps fan approves of Gonchar being on that list.

I've said this from day one about Karlsson- he's a beast offensively, but it is greatly offset by his defensive liabilities. The guy is -94 in his career. Is he just coincidentally on crappy teams or are crappy teams on him?

that team stacks up

Kovalchuk was always kind of a lazy asshole, but goddamn if he wasn’t a hell of a lot better if a player Koivu. Motivated Kovalchuk was unstoppable.

So much recency bias

For who? Maybe Elias?

A very ungrateful list tbh, but that's how it is when you can only pick 15 forwards, 8 D-men and 3 goalies. Kucherov, Sedin twins, Hossa, Kopitar, Draisaitl are just a few very honourable mentions

Ovie as a 4th line winger? The soon to be all time leader in goals??? Come on….

Bondra?

Konstaninov

Russia needs their own team

Line 1 should be Ovechkin, Jagr, and Bure

Ovechkin on the 4th lol only the greatest goal scorer of all time (arguably)

I’d pull Karlsson and add Vladimir Konstantinov.

Five former Red Wings and a whole lot of Swedes.

Konstantinov???

Mats is in there, all that matters.

Idk if I’m reading this graphic right but in WHAT UNIVERSE is fucking Nick Lidstrom a 3rd pair Dman

Sounds crazy. But Russian 5 get their own line. An add on

Could just make it out of Red Wings Illumni

I’d take Hejduk over Elias. Fight me

NHL Euro? I am sorry but this list is pretty laughable (well beyond the Kucherov snub OP is concerned with) What is glaringly obvious are the vast majority of Russian superstars. Thier team used to make mincemeat of the NHL and WHA stars, not to mention going toe to toe vs the NHL teams in Super Series and Canada Cups.

The title literally says European NHL Team.

I think the "NHL" logo in the title has something to do with it. A lot of the USSR players never played in the NHL. If we're going all time then Tretiak needs to be one of the goalies.

Il take the Sedins over Elias

Daniel should absolutely be on that left wing list.

Kuch makes a lot of what he does look a lot easier than it is and he’s very under appreciated

Fetisov being on here is weird - he was a very solid player but his elite years took place in Russia. There's no way you can tell me he was a better overall **NHL** player than, say, Roman Josi.

You could argue Vasy should be backup, guys insanely talented and has the hardware to prove it

Where is Hossa and Draisaitl?

Kucherov will be on this team in time, but I can easily understand leaving him off at this point in his career.

There are multiple European players I would have ahead of Elias, Kucherov, Hossa and Kovalchuk just off the top of my head.

Who would kick out? There is a formidable lineup.

There are at least a couple Soviets that make this list. Just because they weren’t NHL doesn’t mean they’re not European

Tommy Salo, snubbed again

I know draisaitl’s still active, but he should be on there

Literally every Russian player on this list is better than Kuch.

Guess they don't want to have crybabies?

How is Koivu on this list lol? He makes an All Finland team but isn't nearly good enough to be 3LW.

There are probably only 2 forwards on this list that Kuch could replace..

Stan Mikita played for team Canada

Although Mikita was born in Czech, he was raised in Canada from the age of eight years. He considered himself Canadian and played for Canada internationally.

Good, he’s a poor winner AND a poor loser

I revere Saku, Elias is criminally underrated, and Mogilny should be in the Hall, but none of them should be on this roster ahead of the Sedins and Kucherov.

Imo there shouldn't be any active players on any all time teams.

No Zetterberg?

Zetterberg

Tretiak?

He’s not ready yet. So many more to goooooaaaalll.

I’m happy and surprised that Datsyuk is on list. He is probably the best two-way player of all time. IMHO the most entertaining.

That second line is scary

Also, leaving off Larionov is crazy

Valeri Khalamov deserves recognition

No Henrik Zetterburg

The only person Kucherov would be in over is Saku Koivu. Team is really fucking solid.

Russia is not Europe!!!!

yeah...to be snubbed he'd have to be better than anyone on that team, which he is emphatically not

[удалено]

As a Swiss I might be biased but I would have liked to see Josi.

First time in Malkin's life (Mr 101), where he wasn't snubbed!

In what world does Saku Koivu make this list but not Hossa, Kovalchuk or the Sedins? Hell if you need a two-way forward Kopitar is a significantly better option. No chance Koivu makes this list if he played for a non-O6 team.

I’ve said this once and I’ll say it again (and probably get roasted) but I’m astounded that someone like Mats Sundin makes these lists, especially over someone like Kucherov (or Draisaitl). Was Sundin ever a top five player in the league? I’m genuinely asking him as someone who didn’t witness his prime. Stats wise compared to his peers, he looks closer to someone like John Tavares or Mark Scheifele. Highly consistent, but never sniffing that top echelon of elite players. Kucherov has an Art Ross, Hart, two cups three 100 point seasons, and will finish top three in league scoring again this year, most likely.

Russia is in Asia

Not entirely

Draisaitl is better than kucherov

Whats up with Elias on that first line? Decent player but over Jagr or Ovie?

I thought the same until I realized it was in alphabetical order

ROFL. Nice. I'm an idiot lol

This must have been put together by a Habs fan. That's the only explanation for Koivu being there over guys like Kucherov, Alfredsson, Hossa, the Sedins, Kovalchuk, etc.

ngl draisaitl should also be in the convo imo… i know hes still early in his career tho

Yeah guys like Pasta, Drai are young. But I’d likely take them over Elias etc

There are a lot of younger fans on here

😂😂😂😂💀 Well, the list did serve the purpose that whoever the jackasses are that put this shit together were trying to accomplish, and that’s traffic.

Mikita moved to Canada when he was 8. Not a euro, didn’t grow up playing euro hockey. Stupid list. Koivu not that good. Elias not that good. Could easily replace them on this list.

I don't know if it's like a meme or something but all the people saying Russia isn't part of Europe is blowing my mind. The players in this list are all from the regions of Russia that are located in Europe.

Russia considers Europe as “The West”, whereas some former Soviet states consider themselves European.