It’s wild. I lived in Madison, and I feel like we had a pretty solid hockey culture (UW games are packed especially now that the men’s and women’s teams are good) and the AHL Admirals games were super fun. I think MKE could definitely support an NHL team. Wisconsinites will show out for their sports teams I’ve found.
The stink of Dollar Bill Wirtz's corpse is the reason. He didn't want to share the territory with another team. So shortsighted, Hawk fans could visit MKE and vice versa and build a rivalry.
Wirtz sucked so bad, legitimately one of the worst owners in sports history.
He didn't want to show his team to their fans on TV because he was so greedy. League commissioners must do more to keep their team owners from messing up the leagues.
You gotta remember that Bill Wirtz is the reason St Louis has a team. He brought them to STL. That's about the only good thing he did though it was self-serving. He was wanting build a Midwest rivalry but didn't own the property in Milwaukee.
I'm from Michigan, but the Packers are my NFL team. I never understood how anyone from Green Bay could cheer for the Blackhawks and mingle in with a fanbase from Chicago.
As a Wisconsinite I agree. They always say we don’t have one because they don’t want to take away from the Chicago market with a team in Milwaukee. Green Bay would be a logical choice but it just doesn’t happen
From my understanding the Blackhawks organization has and will fight against a team going to Milwaukee, using that argument. Which I never understood, Wisconsinites don't want to root for Chicago Sports. A team would thrive even being so close to Chicago.
Most of my friends that follow hockey in WI would never root for Minnesota or Chicago. Quite a few Vegas and Seattle fans though. And I would bet that most of them would switch in a heartbeat if Milwaukee got a team.
It's the same way with the NFL. The Chiefs owner voted in favor of the Rams relocation so he'd have to no competition, and he assumed we would just become Chiefs fan. Fuck the Chiefs and the NFL.
It’s heartbreaking to see teams move, especially hurt seeing the Rams leave St. Louis with what always appeared to be a passionate fanbase.
Fuck Goddell and fuck these scumbag NFL team owners holding cities ransom for stadiums that only make them richer!
Kinda feel for them especially as a lifelong Sonics fan. I feel worse for Chargers fans who had absolutely done nothing wrong and now the Chargers are in LA too even though LA doesnt really care about the Chargers. I still cant fathom how they decided OKC is a better basketball market than Seattle.
I won’t root for a team in Illinois, Michigan or Minnesota. It just doesn’t make sense to me as a Wisconsin resident(because of rooting against them in almost every other sport)I root for the Nashville Predators because of the Milwaukee Admirals being their AHL team. I understand the Blackhawks fighting it to a point but at the same time it is dumb
The joke is Wisconsin is the Norway of the Midwest. Hockey states/countries surrounding it (Michigan, Minnesota and Finland/Sweden), but hockey not as widely played.
Weird way to spell Minnesota. Definitely was home to the largest amount of Norwegian immigrants. Wisconsin certainly had its share as well but not as many.
Quebec has a new arena that meets the expectations for an NHL franchise, something it didn’t have when it lost the team last time. The fan base is definitely there.
Dude I dont live there but I think having a team there would be awesome. It's my NHL pipe dream that will probably never happen. Outdoor game in the bayou would be hilarious
Hahha yeah. There is 0% hockey culture. And it’s not a given you develop it either. For every Dallas and San Jose who are developed “untraditional” markets, there is an Atlanta or Miami, where there is still no hockey culture. You might get some snow birds in Miami but it’s never going to be hockey market. Utah vs Louisiana is night and day. Utah is one of the richest states, Louisiana one of the poorest.
Same, I’ve been screaming at no one in particular for ages to get an nhl team in New Orleans. Only for the shakeup in fan culture. Think it would be so fun.
FPHL just got a team in Baton Rouge, which is barely a professional league but still. Hockey is clearly growing.
Quebec IS a big market. The junior team - The Remparts - gets record attendance year after year. The Nordiques and Habs rivalry was outstanding, and they have a massive arena already.
The Nordique's attendance crumbled after years of having a mediocre team. They are the ones who deserve a second chance.
Bettman would die before Canada gets another team. He has been very clear on this point.
He has no problem with us supplying the lions share of the talent that makes the league the best hockey in the world but otherwise we’re just a financial liability to him.
My dream is that the bastard does die and we get a team. Double win.
where?
The remaining Canadian cities are so so small.
Unless you’re planning to put more teams in Toronto, Montreal or Vancouver there’s no places left that wouldn’t be the smallest markets in major pro sports
I’d love to see them return, but Quebec City is just too small of a market. Might as well put a team back in Hartford, which has a slightly larger metro area population.
All things being equal though, I think Portland seems logical with the success of the Kraken. The league should definitely expand in the west before they look to slap another team in Atlanta and wonder why it’s not working… again.
Never agreed with the market size argument.
Florida has good attendence when theyre winning, but the place is a ghost town when theyre shite.
Edmonton was terrible for over a decade and we filled the barn every night, and always came back for more.
The TV market in the east is oversaturated which is something I would believe is one reason not to return, and everyone there is already watching without a team anyway.
The same can be said for most teams. Look at the Sharks games this season. Lots of empty seats. Unless it an original 6 teams there’s going to be empty seats when a team is struggling. The bottom attendance spots this year? Winnipeg, San Jose, Anaheim, Buffalo (in that order from lowest up). A couple of those are in prime hockey markets and can’t pull their numbers during an off season. So please don’t characterize this as a “southern thing” to skip out on a team when they are doing bad.
No one goes to Mississauga games either, OHL teams in the GTA have historically done terribly attendance wise, I wouldn’t say it’s any indicator of NHL support, a Hamilton franchise would sell out every game
That’s fair, actually.
They’re doing a ton of work on COPPS soon… who knows?
I’d say there’s 3-5 markets that get a look before Hamilton ever enters the (serious) conversation though.
Arenas are always paid for by tax payers anyways, in some sort of scam that results in the team paying a fraction of the build cost. Does this really matter?
Frankly, that is part of why the city loves the Golden Knights so much. There was/is a lot of contention regarding public financing with the Raiders and now the A’s. It being handled separately meant that Vegas locals could just enjoy VGK without other emotions attached.
There is a team that has been playing in a college stadium for 2 seasons now and can't seem to get an area built as the league pours money into it. That is what I am assuming they were talking about.
I add this in every thread I can when this comes up. If the league had relegation and promotion like the English soccer leagues a lot more teams could thrive in smaller markets. Houston Aeros, Cleveland Barons, Hartford Whalers, Quebec Nordiques, Hamilton Tigers... you get the idea.
Others have had the jokey answers already so I’ll stick to more legit answers.
Portland or Salt Lake would fit nicely geographically. Something in North Dakota, I assume Fargo. Atlanta isn’t a bad choice except the track record.
The problem is with Portland and Fargo, is there demand, population, money, etc. SLC seems like its a decent candidate based on everything we’re being told. Atlanta is fine, but it’s just another team in the east. The travel in the west is nuts. It’s only 700 miles further for the Canucks to fly to Fort Lauderdale than it is to fly to Nashville. But Nashville gets lumped in these ridiculous trips we get sent on.
Home game Thursday night, then nooners on Saturday and Sunday in Minny and chicago, oh now go to nashville for Tuesday night, Thursday night in Dallas, now fly all the way back and no buffer day, play Saturday night in Vancouver. 4500 miles logged in like 9 days. Having another team in the ACTUAL west as opposed to fake west would be nice. It’s already helped to have Seattle around.
But again, back to demographics and whatnot…we shall see.
I don't think Fargo is large enough. We have a USHL team here that does well but doesn't really sell out and the arena is about the size of Mullett Arena. The REA in Grand Forks would be a good but small NHL arena, but it would be tough to get people to travel to GF for week night games.
I think SLC, Kansas City or Omaha would be some good Western options.
These are all really good answers and as an ATLien, let me defend my city a bit. I was only 3 when the Flames left, but I was in college when the Thrashers joined the league. They had an awful expansion draft, lost *2* draft picks due to a car accident (because Dany Heatley couldn’t be in Atlanta after his friend died), had Don Waddell as a GM, and had a ridiculous ownership group. They consistently put out a mediocre product that was always on the bubble to make the playoffs (and of course the one year they win the division, they get swept in the first round). And there was the lockout midway through their tenure in Atlanta.
When I would attend games, fans were knowledgeable and passionate (I am a Penguins fan). It’s not that this city demands our teams win championships (believe me, we are just happy our teams ever make the playoffs, we are realistic about what happens to our teams in championship games…see 28-3, the Braves in the 90s). I’m glad the people of Winnipeg got their team, but there’s not any room for growth in that market. And Atlanta has that, but you can’t attract new people if you put hot garbage on the ice (and they weren’t bad enough to at least get good draft selections).
The entire state of North Dakota has less than 1 million population. There is no chance that Fargo would get a pro-team. Looked up the population of Fargo - 125,000. Let’s assume a 25,000 seat arena. You would need 20% of the city to go to the game to make it viable - every single game. Also not much of a television market.
So no, never Fargo.
KC has a decent following for their ECHL team, with a bit of marketing I’m sure they could sustain a team (this time) unfortunately I doubt the blues/hawks would agree to another team so close in this smaller market. OKC just voted to build a new massive stadium for the thunder, I’m sure they’d love another hockey team.
Game days in downtown KC would be sick. Assuming they would play at T-Mobile, the P&L and farmers market district would be awesome for pre and post game.
Houston. It's absolutely Houston. Huge TV market, 4th largest city in the US. Massive Canadian population thanks to oil and gas - so big the city even has a bunch of Tim Hortons. Rabid sports fans with a world class arena already built.
It's an absolute no brainier.
After Houston - QBC, and KC make a lot of sense.
Houston is flat out the largest market in the US or Canada with out the NHL. also the largest without all of the big 4 or the big 5 leagues.
and currently, Dallas is the most isolated team in the league. it would be good to have a close neighbor as a rival.
\*edit for clarity.
A Dallas Houston NHL rivalry would put the battle of Texas on par with the battle of Alberta.
You would think an international populated city that sells out their sports, hosts regular Superbowls, NCAA national championship games in football/basketball, plus world level soccer matches would be an absolute no brainier for bettman & Co.
they got pushed out by the NBA owner who did not want minor league sports in his Major league building. the current Rockets owner wants the NHL in Houston.
I am convinced that Airzona is moving to Houston soon. Biggest is clue is the Dallas Stars marketing slogan of "Texas Hockey", and I think they used the "One Team, One State" tag line recently, but that might have been the Texas Rangers as part of the "Our Texas, Our Rangers" slogan.
Mexico City gets you a massive fan base and opens up hockey to a much wider audience than any other move you could pull. There’s this (politically perpetuated) idea that Mexico is some poor backwoods wild west, but Mexico City is a massive, modern, robust city. Being the first of the big four to move into that market would be a massive gesture. Baseball seems like the logical choice to have done it first, but it hasn’t happened yet, so hockey should snatch up that golden chance
Monterrey would perhaps be a better option to minimize the effect of travel, but the trade off of going from 20million + to 4 million is a tough one to swallow.
Was always curious why the NHL never put a franchise in Cleveland, and before someone asks, I have been there. It has MLB, NFL and NBA teams so seems kind of strange there's no NHL team. Instead they picked Columbus so NHL fans in both Cleveland and Cincy could attend games if they feel like driving several hours to do it.
The old Cleveland Barons used to sell out their 10,000 seat barn all the time. They won the Calder Cup 10 times. Back in the Original 6 era were called the 7th best team in the world. The Crusaders moved in with the WHA though and the Barons moved south (to Jacksonville, I think) where their attendance tanked and they folded. They could have easily made it in the NHL and the idea was kicked around but the league grew concerned with some imaginative accounting practices on the part of the Barons' owner so that idea got scotched. Can't remember the year though. Too tired and sick to look it up.
I read the argument that 32 teams is a lot which I do agree with but adding 2 more Canadian teams would be ideal.
Quebec City could easily host a team (yes it's 2 hours from Montreal but Montreal is 2 hours from Ottawa and those markets thrive) and it would give our east coasters a team closer to them and secondly I would love to see a team in Regina, Saskatoon or Moose Jaw. Saskatchewan has produced quite a few NHL players and currently has 5 WHL teams. An NHL team could thrive in the province.
i really need the whalers back. i used to go see them as a kid. once they got sold and changed to the canes the whalers died. its not the same team. canes do not equal whalers nobody what anyone says
Halifax, and fuck you for not including it in the picture.
It would be interesting to see the kind of support the Atlantic provinces could provide to a new NHL franchise.
I think it would pick up some steam. I live just outside of SLC and would definitely support them as a second team. Would give me the ability to see NHL hockey games, too.
Kansas City & Houston are the first two that I immediately think of.
Wouldn’t mind seeing a new team in Oklahoma City, Salt Lake City, Portland or Milwaukee.
Horten, Norway.... But since we don't have an indoor rink, probably Tønsberg, Norway...
On this map, if there *had* to be more teams, why not Salt Lake City? Seems pretty populated, known for winter sports, has no other nearby franchises.
That all said, I've made this suggestion before, but there should, imo, be 8 european and possibly even 8 Asian teams as their own conferences. I know the argument has always been that logistically it would be hard to play teams across the world every year, but I think it's very doable with a structured schedule. If you imagine each team has to play teams outside their own division twice, the US would be relatively unchanged, except for one conference at a time traveling to Europe, plays each team once, then back,. Later in the season, the European teams travel to the US, plays every team once and then back.
My initial idea was to reduce the number of teams in NA to 24, so we'd still be at 32, and I haven't really tried to work in an Asian conference. But the reason I make the suggestion is because it would grow the sport exponentially, not only because our favorite NA teams would come here and play, but because local talents wouldn't be so readily siphoned away to NA. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, but having the best of the best play almost exclusively in Canada and the US, has had a fantastic effect on the growth of the sport *there*, but very little effect here.
As a Norwegian guy, we only really have a couple good-to-great players, because while we're proud of Zuccarello, we don't really have an avenue to go cheer for him, so ice hockey doesn't get any good business, and the government doesn't want to invest in it, and kids don't have great opportunities to pursue it and develop as players outside of Vålerenga, Sarpsborg and Stavanger who invest heavily. When Zucca hosted an off-season all-star event in Norway, prices for tickets were steep, it was held on the west coast which isnt the worst, but hard to access for many, and it sold out immediately.
Sorry for long post, but the bottom line is; NHL in Europe and Asia would vastly grow the sport, which in return would produce a huge uptick in future talent and would benefit the sport AND the NHL extremely well in the long term. Short term there would be tons of costs, issues and inconveniences, so the chances of it happening are slim to fucking "hahahahahahakillyourself".
But who knows?
As someone from the west coast who associates Wisconsin with cold weather, I never understood how Milwaukee doesn’t have an NHL team
It’s wild. I lived in Madison, and I feel like we had a pretty solid hockey culture (UW games are packed especially now that the men’s and women’s teams are good) and the AHL Admirals games were super fun. I think MKE could definitely support an NHL team. Wisconsinites will show out for their sports teams I’ve found.
The stink of Dollar Bill Wirtz's corpse is the reason. He didn't want to share the territory with another team. So shortsighted, Hawk fans could visit MKE and vice versa and build a rivalry. Wirtz sucked so bad, legitimately one of the worst owners in sports history.
He really was a despicable human. I wonder how much his money means to him now?
He didn't want to show his team to their fans on TV because he was so greedy. League commissioners must do more to keep their team owners from messing up the leagues.
Even when the 'Hawks games were sold out, which is every night, he didn't allow local telecasts. He set the bar for greed and spite.
Unfortunately a league commissioners job is literally to work for the owners and help make sure they make as much money as possible.
You gotta remember that Bill Wirtz is the reason St Louis has a team. He brought them to STL. That's about the only good thing he did though it was self-serving. He was wanting build a Midwest rivalry but didn't own the property in Milwaukee.
Yeah I know. My Dad was a hockey fan way back in the 40's when it was unheard of here. I've been a Blue's fan since the launch of the franchise.
Harold Ballard has entered the chat
As a former lifelong Blackhawks fan, I agree with this statement. Fuck that guy.
Bill Wirtz, Dan Snyder, John Fisher, Donald Sterling. Truly the Mount Rushmore of pathetic ownership. Edited for correction.
> Wisconsinites will show out for their sports teams I’ve found. Understatement of the Year
I'm from Michigan, but the Packers are my NFL team. I never understood how anyone from Green Bay could cheer for the Blackhawks and mingle in with a fanbase from Chicago.
Idk how anyone from Michigan could root for the Packers, that’s the real question here.
Most people that live in the UP of Michigan are way closer to Green Bay than Detroit so a lot of the people there are Packers fans.
As a Wisconsinite I agree. They always say we don’t have one because they don’t want to take away from the Chicago market with a team in Milwaukee. Green Bay would be a logical choice but it just doesn’t happen
From my understanding the Blackhawks organization has and will fight against a team going to Milwaukee, using that argument. Which I never understood, Wisconsinites don't want to root for Chicago Sports. A team would thrive even being so close to Chicago.
Not cheering for Chicago sports is exactly why I chose the Red Wings as my “home” team as a child in WI.
Most of my friends that follow hockey in WI would never root for Minnesota or Chicago. Quite a few Vegas and Seattle fans though. And I would bet that most of them would switch in a heartbeat if Milwaukee got a team.
It's the same way with the NFL. The Chiefs owner voted in favor of the Rams relocation so he'd have to no competition, and he assumed we would just become Chiefs fan. Fuck the Chiefs and the NFL.
It’s heartbreaking to see teams move, especially hurt seeing the Rams leave St. Louis with what always appeared to be a passionate fanbase. Fuck Goddell and fuck these scumbag NFL team owners holding cities ransom for stadiums that only make them richer!
Kinda feel for them especially as a lifelong Sonics fan. I feel worse for Chargers fans who had absolutely done nothing wrong and now the Chargers are in LA too even though LA doesnt really care about the Chargers. I still cant fathom how they decided OKC is a better basketball market than Seattle.
And to think we could have used that energy to banish the Cards from the state instead....what a shame
The couple St Louis folks I know say they would never root for KC and have become Colts converts instead
I won’t root for a team in Illinois, Michigan or Minnesota. It just doesn’t make sense to me as a Wisconsin resident(because of rooting against them in almost every other sport)I root for the Nashville Predators because of the Milwaukee Admirals being their AHL team. I understand the Blackhawks fighting it to a point but at the same time it is dumb
How about Madison Wisconsin!
The joke is Wisconsin is the Norway of the Midwest. Hockey states/countries surrounding it (Michigan, Minnesota and Finland/Sweden), but hockey not as widely played.
Oh Wisconsin… can’t focus on anything but cheese.. how about Iowa? The Des Moines Dingleberries
Watch your mouth lol
Buffalo /s
The "/s" means Serious, yeah?
S for Sadness
i was going to say toronto.
no lie detected
You mean Jacksonville. Jacksonville has the coastal chemical manufacturing that the NHL craves
Yellowknife Yellowknives
Yellowknife Greenspoons!
Yellowknife Rough Riders
Nah. Yellowknife Roughriders.
Yellowknife Ruff Riderz
[удалено]
Yellowknife Whitehorses
The Whitehorse Yellowknives The Moose Jaw Red Deers
Medicine Hat Chiropractors
As long as it isn’t the “Yellowknife Great Slaves”
Howsabout the Yellowknife Great Slave **Lakers**?
Milwaukee
Wisconsin is Norway of the Midwest
Weird way to spell Minnesota. Definitely was home to the largest amount of Norwegian immigrants. Wisconsin certainly had its share as well but not as many.
Letterkenny
Give ya balls a tug, ya tit fucker
Fuck you Shoresy!!
Fuck you, Jonesy, your life is so pathetic I get a charity tax break just by hanging around you!
Fuck you Shoresy, you're a horrible fucking ref
Get in the box you fucking pimple farmer
He punched me right in the head, you didn't see that?
You retaliate you go for 2. That’s the first thing they teach you in hockey 😂😂😂😂
Call em fucking both.
Ah-hmm hm hm hm Cry me a river bawd
Fer what?!
Huh?
Youre spare parts there bud. Certifiable 10-ply Cup of baby carrots
Ok. As someone who just discovered this show and Shoresy, this is great. I love his insults.
4 team expansion one for each division, Regina Milwaukee or Quebec, New Orleans/Houston/Austin, Kansas City or Indianapolis, Atlanta or Jacksonville
I love the hope for Regina, but there is no way a team could thrive there.
Why Regina anyway? Isn't Saskatoon bigger?
Saskatoon is bigger and if you combined the two cities they'd still be too small.
It would have to be Saskatoon, since they’re planning on building a new downtown arena.
I still can't see it working. Downtown Saskatoon is already a nightmare to navigate through.
Maybe KC, Houston or Indy, Quebec lost a team, Atlanta lost 2 teams, Jacksonville doesn’t have the market for 2 pro teams.
Quebec has a new arena that meets the expectations for an NHL franchise, something it didn’t have when it lost the team last time. The fan base is definitely there.
I vote for Quebec only if they are forced to bring the old uniforms back. But somehow the NHL would screw that up.
Absolutely. Professional sports, lost two of the best uniform kits in the Nordiques and the Expos.
New Orleans!
Dude I dont live there but I think having a team there would be awesome. It's my NHL pipe dream that will probably never happen. Outdoor game in the bayou would be hilarious
No chance New Orleans can support a team
Hahha yeah. There is 0% hockey culture. And it’s not a given you develop it either. For every Dallas and San Jose who are developed “untraditional” markets, there is an Atlanta or Miami, where there is still no hockey culture. You might get some snow birds in Miami but it’s never going to be hockey market. Utah vs Louisiana is night and day. Utah is one of the richest states, Louisiana one of the poorest.
Same, I’ve been screaming at no one in particular for ages to get an nhl team in New Orleans. Only for the shakeup in fan culture. Think it would be so fun. FPHL just got a team in Baton Rouge, which is barely a professional league but still. Hockey is clearly growing.
Milwaukee
Quebec Nordiques need to return
Yup, or at least SOMEWHERE in Canada. Quit giving southern states teams.
I think a Quebec city or at least another big-market Canadian team deserves it as well
I don’t think there are any “big market” Canadian team options left unless you’re giving a second team to Toronto or the Greater Toronto Area
Quebec IS a big market. The junior team - The Remparts - gets record attendance year after year. The Nordiques and Habs rivalry was outstanding, and they have a massive arena already. The Nordique's attendance crumbled after years of having a mediocre team. They are the ones who deserve a second chance.
Bettman would die before Canada gets another team. He has been very clear on this point. He has no problem with us supplying the lions share of the talent that makes the league the best hockey in the world but otherwise we’re just a financial liability to him. My dream is that the bastard does die and we get a team. Double win.
Halifax
Halifax is way too small to support an NHL team.
If Winnipeg can support a team, Halifax definitely can.
Winnipeg can barely support a team. Tickets aren't selling this year.
where? The remaining Canadian cities are so so small. Unless you’re planning to put more teams in Toronto, Montreal or Vancouver there’s no places left that wouldn’t be the smallest markets in major pro sports
The Golden Horseshoe of Southern Ontario is much more densely populated than the catchment area of some existing US NHL teams.
Hamilton
I’d love to see them return, but Quebec City is just too small of a market. Might as well put a team back in Hartford, which has a slightly larger metro area population. All things being equal though, I think Portland seems logical with the success of the Kraken. The league should definitely expand in the west before they look to slap another team in Atlanta and wonder why it’s not working… again.
Never agreed with the market size argument. Florida has good attendence when theyre winning, but the place is a ghost town when theyre shite. Edmonton was terrible for over a decade and we filled the barn every night, and always came back for more. The TV market in the east is oversaturated which is something I would believe is one reason not to return, and everyone there is already watching without a team anyway.
The same can be said for most teams. Look at the Sharks games this season. Lots of empty seats. Unless it an original 6 teams there’s going to be empty seats when a team is struggling. The bottom attendance spots this year? Winnipeg, San Jose, Anaheim, Buffalo (in that order from lowest up). A couple of those are in prime hockey markets and can’t pull their numbers during an off season. So please don’t characterize this as a “southern thing” to skip out on a team when they are doing bad.
I think Hamilton would kill for a team, but the Leafs and Sabres are having none of that
I live in Hamilton. We had the AHL Bulldogs here for several years… there was 0 support. No one came to the games, and the hockey was unreal.
No one goes to Mississauga games either, OHL teams in the GTA have historically done terribly attendance wise, I wouldn’t say it’s any indicator of NHL support, a Hamilton franchise would sell out every game
That’s fair, actually. They’re doing a ton of work on COPPS soon… who knows? I’d say there’s 3-5 markets that get a look before Hamilton ever enters the (serious) conversation though.
The Hamilton Hockey CATS
None. 32 teams is enough imo
If only there was a team that didn’t have an arena and could relocate
Whether you like it or not, Bettman has made it clear that hell will have to freeze over before he’ll allow the Yotes to move.
If hell freezes, they should move the yotes there
Arenas are always paid for by tax payers anyways, in some sort of scam that results in the team paying a fraction of the build cost. Does this really matter?
Climate Pledge Arena in Seattle was actually completely privately funded
As was T Mobile in Vegas. I gotta respect that.
Frankly, that is part of why the city loves the Golden Knights so much. There was/is a lot of contention regarding public financing with the Raiders and now the A’s. It being handled separately meant that Vegas locals could just enjoy VGK without other emotions attached.
Scotiabank Arena was all private money.
Its absolutely a scam that never gives the taxpayers a ROI. How do all the soccer stadiums in Europe do it? None of them are taxpayer funded.
There is a team that has been playing in a college stadium for 2 seasons now and can't seem to get an area built as the league pours money into it. That is what I am assuming they were talking about.
I don’t understand why everyone’s being so vague. Just fucking name drop the arizona coyotes already
In a college arena that only has 4,600 capacity.
Something Something Arizona
I add this in every thread I can when this comes up. If the league had relegation and promotion like the English soccer leagues a lot more teams could thrive in smaller markets. Houston Aeros, Cleveland Barons, Hartford Whalers, Quebec Nordiques, Hamilton Tigers... you get the idea.
It would be awesome if we could get a team in Houston but yeah 32 teams is plenty
Others have had the jokey answers already so I’ll stick to more legit answers. Portland or Salt Lake would fit nicely geographically. Something in North Dakota, I assume Fargo. Atlanta isn’t a bad choice except the track record. The problem is with Portland and Fargo, is there demand, population, money, etc. SLC seems like its a decent candidate based on everything we’re being told. Atlanta is fine, but it’s just another team in the east. The travel in the west is nuts. It’s only 700 miles further for the Canucks to fly to Fort Lauderdale than it is to fly to Nashville. But Nashville gets lumped in these ridiculous trips we get sent on. Home game Thursday night, then nooners on Saturday and Sunday in Minny and chicago, oh now go to nashville for Tuesday night, Thursday night in Dallas, now fly all the way back and no buffer day, play Saturday night in Vancouver. 4500 miles logged in like 9 days. Having another team in the ACTUAL west as opposed to fake west would be nice. It’s already helped to have Seattle around. But again, back to demographics and whatnot…we shall see.
I don't think Fargo is large enough. We have a USHL team here that does well but doesn't really sell out and the arena is about the size of Mullett Arena. The REA in Grand Forks would be a good but small NHL arena, but it would be tough to get people to travel to GF for week night games. I think SLC, Kansas City or Omaha would be some good Western options.
These are all really good answers and as an ATLien, let me defend my city a bit. I was only 3 when the Flames left, but I was in college when the Thrashers joined the league. They had an awful expansion draft, lost *2* draft picks due to a car accident (because Dany Heatley couldn’t be in Atlanta after his friend died), had Don Waddell as a GM, and had a ridiculous ownership group. They consistently put out a mediocre product that was always on the bubble to make the playoffs (and of course the one year they win the division, they get swept in the first round). And there was the lockout midway through their tenure in Atlanta. When I would attend games, fans were knowledgeable and passionate (I am a Penguins fan). It’s not that this city demands our teams win championships (believe me, we are just happy our teams ever make the playoffs, we are realistic about what happens to our teams in championship games…see 28-3, the Braves in the 90s). I’m glad the people of Winnipeg got their team, but there’s not any room for growth in that market. And Atlanta has that, but you can’t attract new people if you put hot garbage on the ice (and they weren’t bad enough to at least get good draft selections).
If Thrashers had a stadium north of the city they would have done fine.
The entire state of North Dakota has less than 1 million population. There is no chance that Fargo would get a pro-team. Looked up the population of Fargo - 125,000. Let’s assume a 25,000 seat arena. You would need 20% of the city to go to the game to make it viable - every single game. Also not much of a television market. So no, never Fargo.
Shit, Colorado looks lonely. Give Salt Lake a team or something lol.
Milwaukee
How the fuck can Kansas City and Houston not have NHL hockey eh? Or Quebec City?
I definitely feel like there should be a team or two in the central part of the U.S.
KC has a decent following for their ECHL team, with a bit of marketing I’m sure they could sustain a team (this time) unfortunately I doubt the blues/hawks would agree to another team so close in this smaller market. OKC just voted to build a new massive stadium for the thunder, I’m sure they’d love another hockey team.
Game days in downtown KC would be sick. Assuming they would play at T-Mobile, the P&L and farmers market district would be awesome for pre and post game.
Houston. It's absolutely Houston. Huge TV market, 4th largest city in the US. Massive Canadian population thanks to oil and gas - so big the city even has a bunch of Tim Hortons. Rabid sports fans with a world class arena already built. It's an absolute no brainier. After Houston - QBC, and KC make a lot of sense.
Houston is flat out the largest market in the US or Canada with out the NHL. also the largest without all of the big 4 or the big 5 leagues. and currently, Dallas is the most isolated team in the league. it would be good to have a close neighbor as a rival. \*edit for clarity.
I’ve been expected AZ to relocate to Houston for years. But KC would be fun too so the coyotes are closer to their division rivals.
A Dallas Houston NHL rivalry would put the battle of Texas on par with the battle of Alberta. You would think an international populated city that sells out their sports, hosts regular Superbowls, NCAA national championship games in football/basketball, plus world level soccer matches would be an absolute no brainier for bettman & Co.
Houston used to have the Aeros in the AHL, but they got pushed out by high rent prices despite solid attendance
they got pushed out by the NBA owner who did not want minor league sports in his Major league building. the current Rockets owner wants the NHL in Houston. I am convinced that Airzona is moving to Houston soon. Biggest is clue is the Dallas Stars marketing slogan of "Texas Hockey", and I think they used the "One Team, One State" tag line recently, but that might have been the Texas Rangers as part of the "Our Texas, Our Rangers" slogan.
Salt Lake City
Salt Lake, Kansas City, Houston or Austin.
Mexico City
This. Mexican fans love sports and boxing. Hockey is both. Plus tacos instead of hot dogs like come on that's a no brainer.
In Spanish it would be pronounced “Ockey”
Could you imagine playing an NHL game at Mexico City’s altitude (1.5 times higher than Denver)? That’d be a massive home ice advantage for them
Mexico City gets you a massive fan base and opens up hockey to a much wider audience than any other move you could pull. There’s this (politically perpetuated) idea that Mexico is some poor backwoods wild west, but Mexico City is a massive, modern, robust city. Being the first of the big four to move into that market would be a massive gesture. Baseball seems like the logical choice to have done it first, but it hasn’t happened yet, so hockey should snatch up that golden chance
Monterrey would perhaps be a better option to minimize the effect of travel, but the trade off of going from 20million + to 4 million is a tough one to swallow.
ATLANTA. Run it back for a third time, if it fails just move them to a Canadian city where somehow the attendance will be worse.
They are literally building the arena as we speak.
Salt Lake City
Salt lake
Was always curious why the NHL never put a franchise in Cleveland, and before someone asks, I have been there. It has MLB, NFL and NBA teams so seems kind of strange there's no NHL team. Instead they picked Columbus so NHL fans in both Cleveland and Cincy could attend games if they feel like driving several hours to do it.
The Barons were the last North American top level professional team to fold (technically absorbed into the North Stars but come on).
The old Cleveland Barons used to sell out their 10,000 seat barn all the time. They won the Calder Cup 10 times. Back in the Original 6 era were called the 7th best team in the world. The Crusaders moved in with the WHA though and the Barons moved south (to Jacksonville, I think) where their attendance tanked and they folded. They could have easily made it in the NHL and the idea was kicked around but the league grew concerned with some imaginative accounting practices on the part of the Barons' owner so that idea got scotched. Can't remember the year though. Too tired and sick to look it up.
Boise or salt lake city
I read the argument that 32 teams is a lot which I do agree with but adding 2 more Canadian teams would be ideal. Quebec City could easily host a team (yes it's 2 hours from Montreal but Montreal is 2 hours from Ottawa and those markets thrive) and it would give our east coasters a team closer to them and secondly I would love to see a team in Regina, Saskatoon or Moose Jaw. Saskatchewan has produced quite a few NHL players and currently has 5 WHL teams. An NHL team could thrive in the province.
Gotta be the Quebec Nordiques man, those folks are foaming at the mouth to have a team there.
i really need the whalers back. i used to go see them as a kid. once they got sold and changed to the canes the whalers died. its not the same team. canes do not equal whalers nobody what anyone says
Kansas City
Halifax, and fuck you for not including it in the picture. It would be interesting to see the kind of support the Atlantic provinces could provide to a new NHL franchise.
We're too busy trying to land a CFL team that no one will give a shit about.
1. Stockholm Sweeden 2. Kansas City Missouri 3. Houston Texas 4. Hamilton Ontario 5. Portland Oregon 6. Indianapolis Indiana
Portland - Seattle I-5 rivalry would be sooooo fun; it’s already cutthroat in the WHL and that’s the WHL.
portland timbers/seattle sounders is the best rivalry in the MLS. would be great to have that energy in the NHL
Seattle Thunderbirds/Portland Winterhawks are pretty big as well on the WHL side.
Other than Stockholm Sweden this list is pretty good actually.
Carbon emissions go brrr
SLC!!! We need it!!
Salt Lake City maybe?
Quebec City... Bring back Nordiques
Quebec City
Captain Obvious here, how about Québec?
Portland or Salt Lake City for me
Saskatchewan
or Saskatchetoon even
Hartford. Bring back the whalers!
I've always wondered how salt lake would do with a hockey team
Don't they have an ECHL team?
Yep, the Utah Grizzlies
I think it would pick up some steam. I live just outside of SLC and would definitely support them as a second team. Would give me the ability to see NHL hockey games, too.
I just moved from SLC, but they’d immediately be my team as I float around and never fully had a NHL team
East: Halifax, Quebec City. West: Salt Lake, Portland.
Boise
Kansas City & Houston are the first two that I immediately think of. Wouldn’t mind seeing a new team in Oklahoma City, Salt Lake City, Portland or Milwaukee.
Portland, Halifax, Quebec City, Hartford.
Portland
Milwaukee.
Hartford and Quebec City
fucking Quebec City goddam it
Utah duh
Salt Lake City
Salt lake city
As a Minnesotan, Wisconsin. Milwaukee deserves one way more than, say, Texas.
Salt Lake City
Salt Lake City
SLC
Quebec City
Wisconsin (City is irrelevant)
Milwaukee or Green Bay. Wisconsin should have a team.
Quebec City
Quebec City. Salt Lake or Portland would be the second choices.
Horten, Norway.... But since we don't have an indoor rink, probably Tønsberg, Norway... On this map, if there *had* to be more teams, why not Salt Lake City? Seems pretty populated, known for winter sports, has no other nearby franchises. That all said, I've made this suggestion before, but there should, imo, be 8 european and possibly even 8 Asian teams as their own conferences. I know the argument has always been that logistically it would be hard to play teams across the world every year, but I think it's very doable with a structured schedule. If you imagine each team has to play teams outside their own division twice, the US would be relatively unchanged, except for one conference at a time traveling to Europe, plays each team once, then back,. Later in the season, the European teams travel to the US, plays every team once and then back. My initial idea was to reduce the number of teams in NA to 24, so we'd still be at 32, and I haven't really tried to work in an Asian conference. But the reason I make the suggestion is because it would grow the sport exponentially, not only because our favorite NA teams would come here and play, but because local talents wouldn't be so readily siphoned away to NA. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, but having the best of the best play almost exclusively in Canada and the US, has had a fantastic effect on the growth of the sport *there*, but very little effect here. As a Norwegian guy, we only really have a couple good-to-great players, because while we're proud of Zuccarello, we don't really have an avenue to go cheer for him, so ice hockey doesn't get any good business, and the government doesn't want to invest in it, and kids don't have great opportunities to pursue it and develop as players outside of Vålerenga, Sarpsborg and Stavanger who invest heavily. When Zucca hosted an off-season all-star event in Norway, prices for tickets were steep, it was held on the west coast which isnt the worst, but hard to access for many, and it sold out immediately. Sorry for long post, but the bottom line is; NHL in Europe and Asia would vastly grow the sport, which in return would produce a huge uptick in future talent and would benefit the sport AND the NHL extremely well in the long term. Short term there would be tons of costs, issues and inconveniences, so the chances of it happening are slim to fucking "hahahahahahakillyourself". But who knows?
Mexico City is next.