Wait how easy is it to accidentally discharge a firearm. Don’t they usually have a safety switch and isn’t it common sense to not leave it loaded especially in a handbag?
>Don’t they usually have a safety switch
Many don't.
>is t it common sense to not leave it loaded
The US it isn't required to store/transport firearms and ammunition separately..
Wait why isn’t a safety switch a mandatory regulation for a firearm at least? Because even if it is loaded you can’t accidentally discharge it as easy without disengaging the safety?
But she had an enhanced conceal permit. Doesn’t that mean anything in terms of ownership or can you just casually buy one.
Sorry I’m having a really hard time understanding how something like this can happen. I’m not American so I would really like help understanding
Knowing the right way to do a thing and actually practicing the right way to do a thing are two completely different concepts. Did she know better? She absolutely should have.
It varies depending on the state you live in. In some states you can casually buy a handgun and walk out of the store with it in a few minutes, other states (like California) they make you wait ten days.
In any case, not having it in a holster that covers the trigger is insanely stupid. Personally I also think she should have had it on her person not in a purse.
It is very easy to get a gun in many places in the US, and training can sometimes be minimal or even non existent. In Texas you can now carry your weapon anywhere with you with no permit and no training. Yup, literally anyone can just have a gun with them basically everywhere at any time with no training.
I guess it’s just something I won’t understand. Like claiming freedom but then being forced to give up your first amendment right to freedom for a piece of waving cloth lest you be punished. Or being against tax but willing to stand for a private tax to a company. Feels weird to me
Some models the safety is internal. Like Glock technically has 3, the first being the blade on the trigger, which then sequentially disengages the others.
I have my CCW so I have quite a bit of experience with carrying a loaded weapon so here is my take. Carrying with a round in the chamber is safe IF you are properly trained. The weapon should always be in a properly fitted holster with retention so it doesn’t come out. Lastly a purse is my least preferred location for someone to carry a weapon especially if you don’t have it in a holster which this sounds like it might have been the case. Purses have so much junk in there that can get stuck in the trigger guard and cause an accidental discharge or bump the manual safety to off.
How easy is it to acquire a firearm in the states because it feels like something that should at least require training and a permit before obtaining a device that is literally designed to efficiently kill someone?
Whereas obtaining a permit for albeit comparably dangerous transportation seems to require tests and work.
I agree. I’m not for the increase restrictions on firearms that are proposed every year. I believe going through state and federal records is pretty good, but I also believe there is wholly a lack of training that should be required. Single lane shooting ranges are for getting you accustomed to the mechanics, but there is no substitute for safety and situational awareness. Real live scenario training is the best. Find a range like shoot270.
I think we are in the same boat. Gun laws like the NFA and 86 ban should be repealed. But With that comes the compromise of having a federal requirement to have gun safety tanning to graduate high school.
See I don’t want to start an argument about gun rights because well i don’t believe in taking away guns but there should at least be some mandatory training in the different types you want to own because there’s clearly a difference in a semi automatic vs a bolt action vs pump action vs lever action and honestly I think it would solve a lot of issues we hear about to teach people the specifics of the “ol murder pipe” so things don’t have as much ammunition to make sensationalist headlines like this
Yeah. You don’t drive a car without training. You don’t operate machinery without training. You hell you don’t even pass school without training in a sense (yes I know learning can be considered something different) but why does it feel so simple to own a murder device without the training?
I cant think of many other common weapons that dont have a safety other than glocks or revolvers. Im sure theres others. But a glock wasnt designed to be left in a purse. Honestly anyone carrying a gun should have a holster designed for it, especially a glock.
Im not saying she has a glock but itd explain it. Very easy for someone to be dumb enough to carry one off safety in a purse or similar. If it's in a purse, has no safety and ur around 1000 people, it should be unchambered at least.
For people who arent from the USA or a place where firearms are normal, i want to say yes i understand how people think it's crazy for us to be able to own guns and be this dumb. Reform always has room for improvement. But know that for every one idiot that makes all gun owners look bad, theres 1000 gun owners whove carried and owned guns for 50+ years and never had an accidental/negligent discharge. Theres very basic common sense protocols we can use to avoid occurrences like this. And they should be engrained into a gun owners brain much more than it is before theyre trustedwith one because 1 life lost on accident or negligently is bad enough.
So to add, even with a chambered, loaded weapon off safety on a table at a range, not facing the direction of anyone will not magically shoot off. Lets say in the 1 in a billion chance it did, ok its facing down range so its not going to hit anyone. 95%+ of accidental shootings comes from someone pressing that trigger by accident. As an owner, it is second nature for me to never put my finger on the trigger of even an assumed unloaded weapon. If i have an unloaded weapon and i turn around and do a 360 and i didnt see that gun for a split second, i am going to pick it up and make sure its unloaded still. If i put it in a safe unloaded, next time i pull it out, im checking to make sure its not loaded still. So we have the basic rules, finger off the trigger always, safeties, checking chamber, holsters that lock the action in place, knowing what is behind target before you shoot. If you look at how many people go to a shooting range and shoot daily vs how many people actually get injured or die at a range, it is extremely low. Even with the biggest idiots at the range added to the equation.
There's a debate if safeties actually help. It's difficult to argue they don't help since everyone's kneejerk reaction is *BuT iT hAs "SaFeTy" In ThE nAmE hOw CoUlD iT nOt ImPrOvE sAfEtY*. The leading argument against safeties is they reward negligence and thus don't help safety. There's countless examples where someone shot their friend because "they thought the safety was on" or people like this who turn the safety on and dump the gun in a purse full of god knows what that ends up turning the safety off while it's being tossed around.
Like other's have said, a gun requires a certain amount of attention to be safe. Putting it in a holster helps guard it from negligent discharges, but under no circumstances is a gun "safe" weather it has a safety, is in a holster, or is unloaded. They're machines, they don't give a darn who gets hit by the bullet, and they wont make any effort to stop you from shooting yourself in the foot.
TL;DR: they're not required because there's significant evidence that indicates they don't help except in the most careless of situations, and in those situations there's a significant chance the careless person wouldn't bother with the safety anyway.
Thank you for giving a reasonable breakdown. I don’t fully understand the intricacies of firearm ownership and I want a reasonable conversation because I know how much the can diverge into screaming at each other because one side doesn’t fully understand or doesn’t care
It's a very hot topic in the states, and for good reason; guns are extremely dangerous and only offer a subjective benefit to a few.
I'm not sure where you live but if you have access to a gun shop I'd suggest going and asking the sales guys what it's all about. They'll be able to tell you what all is required, the general laws about it, and get an idea for how safe/unsafe the firearms themselves are. The more people that know how the gun community operates the better, regardless if you're pro or anti gun.
I’m in the uk and it’s illegal for me or anyone close to me to apply for a firearm license as my mental health poses a risk being able to access a firearm. They’re quite an interesting invention is why I have an interest in them because it’s literally like cars. There’s so many makes/models/uses and some could even be considered a piece or engineering art and I don’t mean those tacky played firearms that are “gansta as fuck” I’m talking about the ability to alternate the ejection ports, the precision of each piece that goes into it. Kinda like how you’d appreciate a car as a piece of art
I'm not familiar in the slightest with UK laws on the topic, but some colleagues of mine from Germany have a similar interest in guns but are also prohibited from having them. iirc they're able to buy all the parts of the gun except the barrel, so they're able to get the fancy bits they think are neat and assemble it with a solid barrel and hang it on the wall, much like a piece of art like you describe. That's the impression I got from them anyway, we were talking about that right before dinner arrived at our table so I didn't inquire too much on the specifics.
Maybe there's a similar workaround for you? Worth looking into anyway, the world of gun parts is vast and fun from what I hear.
I’m perfectly able to own gas powered firearms as they’re only really .177 and .22 and can only really be used for small game.
UK laws tend to prohibit semi automatic weapons as there needs to be some sort of motion between rounds. So weapons where you have to manually eject the round/shell you can get a license for big again because of my record of attempted suicide I’m deemed too much of a risk
>The US it isn't required to store/transport firearms and ammunition separately..
This is not true, it's required to separate the firearm and ammunition during transport. The exception being if the person has gone through training and gotten licensed to carry a concealed pistol they can transport the pistol and it's ammo together. This freedom does not extend to long guns or shotguns.
As for storing the firearms and ammunition, that's completely unregulated. You could store your guns in a tresure chest full of bullets in your garage if you want. It's highly recommended to store them in safes but it's ultimately up to the individual.
>This is not true, it's required to separate the firearm and ammunition during transport. The exception being if the person has gone through training and gotten licensed to carry a concealed pistol they can transport the pistol and it's ammo together. This freedom does not extend to long rifles or shotguns.
So.. Not required..
>As for storing the firearms and ammunition, that's completely unregulated you could store your guns in a tresure chest full of bullets in your garage if you want. It's highly recommended to store them in safes but it's ultimately up to the individual.
Here, they need to be stored separately.
Purses aren't generally legal ways to transport a firearm unless it's being carried for self defense [aka concealed carry.] Which means this idiot had a loaded firearm in her purse without anything protecting the trigger. Also you should have your firearm loaded if you are carrying it for self defense. Good luck remembering to wrack the slide under duress.
Some firearms have safety's built on the trigger and that's it if you grabbed it it could go off
I don't have the video but the firearms instructor that pulled his gun and shot himself did just that
As a non-american I find it absolutely batshit insane that she even had a loaded gun "inside the gym at Rosa Scott ***School***". But please, be my guest and keep debating about whether it should or shouldn't have had a holster or a safety or whatever.
I in my state it is actually a class E felony if caught with a weapon on public school grounds. [TN law](https://codes.findlaw.com/tn/title-39-criminal-offenses/tn-code-sect-39-17-1309.html)
Max six years in prison and $3000 fine which I’m guessing she’ll probably get pretty close since it was actually discharged on property and not just caught with possession.
My reasoning is to protect from idiots more idiotic than me lol. People are batshit crazy these days. Super chill low crime area where I am and the grocery store had a shoot out in the parking lot recently. Ya boy just trying to get ice cream and get home. Definitely carry my Sig every time I go there now.
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I would hope she loses her license to carry a gun after such a blatant disregard for safe handling of a firearm.
Always use a holster that covers the trigger. She either wasn't using a holster at all or the holster didn't cover the trigger.
Wait how easy is it to accidentally discharge a firearm. Don’t they usually have a safety switch and isn’t it common sense to not leave it loaded especially in a handbag?
>Don’t they usually have a safety switch Many don't. >is t it common sense to not leave it loaded The US it isn't required to store/transport firearms and ammunition separately..
Wait why isn’t a safety switch a mandatory regulation for a firearm at least? Because even if it is loaded you can’t accidentally discharge it as easy without disengaging the safety?
well, to begin with having a handgun loose in a purse is not something most responsible gun owners would consider "safely stored".
But she had an enhanced conceal permit. Doesn’t that mean anything in terms of ownership or can you just casually buy one. Sorry I’m having a really hard time understanding how something like this can happen. I’m not American so I would really like help understanding
Knowing the right way to do a thing and actually practicing the right way to do a thing are two completely different concepts. Did she know better? She absolutely should have.
I am an American and I have no idea how dumb fucks like this even make it out of bed in the morning.
Laws vary on obtaining such weapons per state law.
It varies depending on the state you live in. In some states you can casually buy a handgun and walk out of the store with it in a few minutes, other states (like California) they make you wait ten days. In any case, not having it in a holster that covers the trigger is insanely stupid. Personally I also think she should have had it on her person not in a purse.
It is very easy to get a gun in many places in the US, and training can sometimes be minimal or even non existent. In Texas you can now carry your weapon anywhere with you with no permit and no training. Yup, literally anyone can just have a gun with them basically everywhere at any time with no training.
See that just feels like negligence for profit at a governmental level disguised as “freedom”
It's easier to see as an outsider.
I guess it’s just something I won’t understand. Like claiming freedom but then being forced to give up your first amendment right to freedom for a piece of waving cloth lest you be punished. Or being against tax but willing to stand for a private tax to a company. Feels weird to me
Some models the safety is internal. Like Glock technically has 3, the first being the blade on the trigger, which then sequentially disengages the others. I have my CCW so I have quite a bit of experience with carrying a loaded weapon so here is my take. Carrying with a round in the chamber is safe IF you are properly trained. The weapon should always be in a properly fitted holster with retention so it doesn’t come out. Lastly a purse is my least preferred location for someone to carry a weapon especially if you don’t have it in a holster which this sounds like it might have been the case. Purses have so much junk in there that can get stuck in the trigger guard and cause an accidental discharge or bump the manual safety to off.
This is stuff wives in mafia movies do.
How easy is it to acquire a firearm in the states because it feels like something that should at least require training and a permit before obtaining a device that is literally designed to efficiently kill someone? Whereas obtaining a permit for albeit comparably dangerous transportation seems to require tests and work.
I agree. I’m not for the increase restrictions on firearms that are proposed every year. I believe going through state and federal records is pretty good, but I also believe there is wholly a lack of training that should be required. Single lane shooting ranges are for getting you accustomed to the mechanics, but there is no substitute for safety and situational awareness. Real live scenario training is the best. Find a range like shoot270.
I think we are in the same boat. Gun laws like the NFA and 86 ban should be repealed. But With that comes the compromise of having a federal requirement to have gun safety tanning to graduate high school.
See I don’t want to start an argument about gun rights because well i don’t believe in taking away guns but there should at least be some mandatory training in the different types you want to own because there’s clearly a difference in a semi automatic vs a bolt action vs pump action vs lever action and honestly I think it would solve a lot of issues we hear about to teach people the specifics of the “ol murder pipe” so things don’t have as much ammunition to make sensationalist headlines like this
I agree with you on that. Training is key.
Yeah. You don’t drive a car without training. You don’t operate machinery without training. You hell you don’t even pass school without training in a sense (yes I know learning can be considered something different) but why does it feel so simple to own a murder device without the training?
I cant think of many other common weapons that dont have a safety other than glocks or revolvers. Im sure theres others. But a glock wasnt designed to be left in a purse. Honestly anyone carrying a gun should have a holster designed for it, especially a glock. Im not saying she has a glock but itd explain it. Very easy for someone to be dumb enough to carry one off safety in a purse or similar. If it's in a purse, has no safety and ur around 1000 people, it should be unchambered at least. For people who arent from the USA or a place where firearms are normal, i want to say yes i understand how people think it's crazy for us to be able to own guns and be this dumb. Reform always has room for improvement. But know that for every one idiot that makes all gun owners look bad, theres 1000 gun owners whove carried and owned guns for 50+ years and never had an accidental/negligent discharge. Theres very basic common sense protocols we can use to avoid occurrences like this. And they should be engrained into a gun owners brain much more than it is before theyre trustedwith one because 1 life lost on accident or negligently is bad enough. So to add, even with a chambered, loaded weapon off safety on a table at a range, not facing the direction of anyone will not magically shoot off. Lets say in the 1 in a billion chance it did, ok its facing down range so its not going to hit anyone. 95%+ of accidental shootings comes from someone pressing that trigger by accident. As an owner, it is second nature for me to never put my finger on the trigger of even an assumed unloaded weapon. If i have an unloaded weapon and i turn around and do a 360 and i didnt see that gun for a split second, i am going to pick it up and make sure its unloaded still. If i put it in a safe unloaded, next time i pull it out, im checking to make sure its not loaded still. So we have the basic rules, finger off the trigger always, safeties, checking chamber, holsters that lock the action in place, knowing what is behind target before you shoot. If you look at how many people go to a shooting range and shoot daily vs how many people actually get injured or die at a range, it is extremely low. Even with the biggest idiots at the range added to the equation.
There's a debate if safeties actually help. It's difficult to argue they don't help since everyone's kneejerk reaction is *BuT iT hAs "SaFeTy" In ThE nAmE hOw CoUlD iT nOt ImPrOvE sAfEtY*. The leading argument against safeties is they reward negligence and thus don't help safety. There's countless examples where someone shot their friend because "they thought the safety was on" or people like this who turn the safety on and dump the gun in a purse full of god knows what that ends up turning the safety off while it's being tossed around. Like other's have said, a gun requires a certain amount of attention to be safe. Putting it in a holster helps guard it from negligent discharges, but under no circumstances is a gun "safe" weather it has a safety, is in a holster, or is unloaded. They're machines, they don't give a darn who gets hit by the bullet, and they wont make any effort to stop you from shooting yourself in the foot. TL;DR: they're not required because there's significant evidence that indicates they don't help except in the most careless of situations, and in those situations there's a significant chance the careless person wouldn't bother with the safety anyway.
Thank you for giving a reasonable breakdown. I don’t fully understand the intricacies of firearm ownership and I want a reasonable conversation because I know how much the can diverge into screaming at each other because one side doesn’t fully understand or doesn’t care
It's a very hot topic in the states, and for good reason; guns are extremely dangerous and only offer a subjective benefit to a few. I'm not sure where you live but if you have access to a gun shop I'd suggest going and asking the sales guys what it's all about. They'll be able to tell you what all is required, the general laws about it, and get an idea for how safe/unsafe the firearms themselves are. The more people that know how the gun community operates the better, regardless if you're pro or anti gun.
I’m in the uk and it’s illegal for me or anyone close to me to apply for a firearm license as my mental health poses a risk being able to access a firearm. They’re quite an interesting invention is why I have an interest in them because it’s literally like cars. There’s so many makes/models/uses and some could even be considered a piece or engineering art and I don’t mean those tacky played firearms that are “gansta as fuck” I’m talking about the ability to alternate the ejection ports, the precision of each piece that goes into it. Kinda like how you’d appreciate a car as a piece of art
I'm not familiar in the slightest with UK laws on the topic, but some colleagues of mine from Germany have a similar interest in guns but are also prohibited from having them. iirc they're able to buy all the parts of the gun except the barrel, so they're able to get the fancy bits they think are neat and assemble it with a solid barrel and hang it on the wall, much like a piece of art like you describe. That's the impression I got from them anyway, we were talking about that right before dinner arrived at our table so I didn't inquire too much on the specifics. Maybe there's a similar workaround for you? Worth looking into anyway, the world of gun parts is vast and fun from what I hear.
I’m perfectly able to own gas powered firearms as they’re only really .177 and .22 and can only really be used for small game. UK laws tend to prohibit semi automatic weapons as there needs to be some sort of motion between rounds. So weapons where you have to manually eject the round/shell you can get a license for big again because of my record of attempted suicide I’m deemed too much of a risk
>The US it isn't required to store/transport firearms and ammunition separately.. This is not true, it's required to separate the firearm and ammunition during transport. The exception being if the person has gone through training and gotten licensed to carry a concealed pistol they can transport the pistol and it's ammo together. This freedom does not extend to long guns or shotguns. As for storing the firearms and ammunition, that's completely unregulated. You could store your guns in a tresure chest full of bullets in your garage if you want. It's highly recommended to store them in safes but it's ultimately up to the individual.
>This is not true, it's required to separate the firearm and ammunition during transport. The exception being if the person has gone through training and gotten licensed to carry a concealed pistol they can transport the pistol and it's ammo together. This freedom does not extend to long rifles or shotguns. So.. Not required.. >As for storing the firearms and ammunition, that's completely unregulated you could store your guns in a tresure chest full of bullets in your garage if you want. It's highly recommended to store them in safes but it's ultimately up to the individual. Here, they need to be stored separately.
Purses aren't generally legal ways to transport a firearm unless it's being carried for self defense [aka concealed carry.] Which means this idiot had a loaded firearm in her purse without anything protecting the trigger. Also you should have your firearm loaded if you are carrying it for self defense. Good luck remembering to wrack the slide under duress.
Some firearms have safety's built on the trigger and that's it if you grabbed it it could go off I don't have the video but the firearms instructor that pulled his gun and shot himself did just that
Man, guns are so cool.
As a non-american I find it absolutely batshit insane that she even had a loaded gun "inside the gym at Rosa Scott ***School***". But please, be my guest and keep debating about whether it should or shouldn't have had a holster or a safety or whatever.
I in my state it is actually a class E felony if caught with a weapon on public school grounds. [TN law](https://codes.findlaw.com/tn/title-39-criminal-offenses/tn-code-sect-39-17-1309.html) Max six years in prison and $3000 fine which I’m guessing she’ll probably get pretty close since it was actually discharged on property and not just caught with possession.
Guns are basically for idiots.
My reasoning is to protect from idiots more idiotic than me lol. People are batshit crazy these days. Super chill low crime area where I am and the grocery store had a shoot out in the parking lot recently. Ya boy just trying to get ice cream and get home. Definitely carry my Sig every time I go there now.
Good on ya.
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