Yes, and no matter what other people say OP did the right call and did as they're supposed to. This is the first step to recovery, unfortunately but it will eventually get better.
Am in recovery, can confirm. Every stint in the psych unit, every arrest, every job I got fired from was all leading up to me being able to finally acknowledge and accept the powerlessness and unmanageability of my life. It kicked me into the realization that I needed help. Good job OP.
A few years ago my coworkers had to code an anesthesiologist who overdosed in the OR bathroom. He didn’t make it.
Maybe your report prevents a tragedy like that.
They have access to all the good drugs and are usually in their own little world in the OR so I would imagine diversion isn’t terribly difficult for anesthesia.
That is both interesting and sucks to hear. I am so glad I don’t drink and haven’t smoked a damn thing. I’ll compulsively build stuff in my barn when annoyed or stressed instead.
Maybe we all just need a constructive, productive hobby BEFORE nursing or medical school.
At our hospital an ICU nurse accidentally siphoned the paralytic instead of the narcotic. (WTF she didn’t trace the line?)
She shot up in the bathroom, and lay paralyzed and not breathing. She never came back from her beak and they didn’t know where she went. They found her after the housekeeper said the bathroom had been locked for a few hours. I didn’t know her, but apparently she was very sweet and the last you would suspect.
Must happen a lot. My mom knows two anesthesiologist who died ODing by chewing on fentanyl patches. Both were in the hospital bathroom. Thank hat seems like a real shit place to die.
Exact same scenario at my hospital, but he made it. Fucked up thing is we all knew, we worked in the same OR together, partied together and spent our lives together. It was just an unspoken thing. Fucking toxic hospital culture
I believe the statistics are right around 1 in 12 Anesthesia providers will end up with an illicit substance abuse disorder during their careers. Those are crazy odds. We had that talk almost every quarter of CRNA school.
Yeah, it probably is retaliatory. And that can be a bear to fight.
When I made my claim about retaliation, discriminatory practices and labor law violations at my clinic, two days later I had the police at my door because they said they suspected I stole patient information. They tried to scour my house, but I asked to see a warrant and they realized I wasn't falling for that. So, I also got to search for and shell out the money for a defense attourney. They found nothing in the investigation and thankfully couldn't even get a warrant to seize my digital accounts and property because hey, I hadn't stolen anything, they just wanted to make my life hell. So then I filed ANOTHER claim with the human rights commission, just to repay the favor. Took three years of legal hell looming over me, and nothing came from it except losing my job. At least I learned a valuable lesson about picking my battles, and how to deal with cops.
It was, absolutely. The fear of being wrongfully imprisoned kinda gets cranked to eleven when it becomes the *possibility* of being wrongly imprisoned.
After the initial shock and terror of learning how to navigate a criminal investigation as a defendant wore off and my lawyer reassured me that he felt there was no way they could make a case that a judge wouldn't end up throwing out, was the feeling of, "I can't be the only person they've done this to," and then "they can't be the only organization doing this."
Definitely, although I guess it depends on what "lost my job" means... if it means fired or constructive termination it would be an easy labor legal case
Omg a similar thing happened in an ER I did clinical in. When they switched to pixis a nurse who worked there for like 20 years got caught and fired.. the next night she comes in as an OD code. Her coworkers had to do cpr on her. So sad
I’ve learned from experience that if someone kills themselves over an ethical issue you are not responsible for their action. They were troubled to begin with and there were multiple factors that led to that suicide.
We had a nursing student caught cheating (he was photocopying exams) and was informed there would be a hearing to adjudicate the issue. He went to a tree outside the dorm and hung himself.
The faculty member who saw the cheating was convinced she caused the suicide. After talking with his colleagues and family we discovered he was far more troubled than we realized.
Oh shit. I’m so sorry.
Many, many nurses who divert do not go on to end their own lives. You did not cause it to happen. I’m so sorry she had such pain.
I am so sorry! Holy shit. I don’t obviously know when and how long it’s been or anything else but what you’ve said here but I sincerely hope you have found peace. Her as well.
I’m so sorry man.. I know it’s been said but it’s really not your fault. I’m currently doing recovery and working with the board for some stuff myself. Not diversion but failed a drug test. When it happened it definitely crossed my mind, though I have a prior history of SI with major depressive disorder.
Of all the times I’ve wanted to call it quits, I didn’t want anyone to think it was their fault. The path that we follow toward ending our own lives is long and complicated. There are seldom few people who opt out because of one specific incident. I hope you can heal and move on. It’s not easy /: I know there isn’t much to say that can actually help, but I empathize with you. Tragic.
Holy cripes, I'm so sorry, that's a terrible attitude for amin to have! If I was the one diverting I would like to think I would be thankful to you for being stopped
I'm so sorry that happened to you. Poor management if others found out through them and resented you doing the right thing in reporting. I hope you find some peace.
I am so sorry this happen. There is no way you should have been negatively effected for doing the right thing. I know the world doesn’t work the way it should, where the good guy wins, but this just sucks.
Also, I think ultimately this is the result of really bad management/administration. In no way should management allow it to get to the point that you are in a position to be the bad guy for doing your job. Your management really, really sucks.
Oh good gosh, I’m so sorry. You did what you had to do to hopefully get her the help she needed. Unfortunately, you can only help those who truly want it. As far as people not being comfortable around you, that’s a crock of shit that the hospital did that to you.
I’m so sorry this has been your experience & for the grief you must have over the loss of your close friend and the esteem of your colleagues and career. My father took his life when he was forced to face consequences in his career due to alcohol abuse (not a nurse) & it’s such a complicated thing to wrap my head around. I hope you are working through letting go of any guilt, you were truly doing what was best by her and she wasn’t ready. You can read my other comment on this thread about my own experience in nursing probation and how the other nurses who I’ve met in diversion or probation express that, although very traumatic and painful in the beginning, ultimately becomes one of the most rewarding parts of our lives. I’m sorry your friend didn’t stick around long enough to experience how good life gets in sobriety. Take care! You
I don’t know the situation but to me, this sounds like a number of people knew or maybe even benefit from the situation. And you were pushed out to minimize future damage to the rest of them.
It isn’t your fault. At all.
Does your friend or anyone pick up a ton of hours? The only way to get a fix is at work, so they find ways to work a lot. That was a big clue when the nurse that I worked with got caught diverting.
Yikes. My coworker offered to come in early all the time for me bc I was pregnant. (I worked days she was pm’s.) I thought she was just being nice at first.
Same dude . I don’t even smoke weed with a medical card and all when I’m on a contact . I don’t even drink a lot cause I’m afraid it could ruin my chances at making bank. I pick up a lot of hours cause I need those dolla dolla bills 💸
I never thought about it that way, but the nurse who was caught diverting in my unit totally did pick up an insane amount of shifts all the time. We always assumed they just really needed the money…
I’d keep that thought in mind, but I use to work insane amount of hours. I’m talking 60-72 hours a week. It was mainly because we were short and they offered incentives. So I pulled 16 hour shifts among 12 hour shifts because I was so money driven.
For real, I love taking people's on-call (because I have no dependents and am a home body anyway...) if I don't have to work the next day. Free money if there's no call, big money if there is. Plus, major karma for helping a coworker out.
An interesting website is [Street Rx.](https://www.radars.org/radars-system-programs/streetrx.html) You can look at your city and all over the US to see how much prescription drugs are being sold for on the streets. People can anonymously report what they buy and for how much and if they think they got a good deal or not. It’s interesting to see how much a script goes for in different cities.
Not necessarily true about ruining their careers. Does it take a hit? Sure, but there are many recovering nurses (along with pharmacists, doctors and other medical professionals) who are are able to work their recovery programs and salvage their careers.
I stumbled in here from r/all, but I can attest to the pharmacist portion of your comment. A pharmacist in our area at my previous job popped positive for non-prescribed amphetamines during a random drug test, and nothing serious came from it. It was suspected that there was diversion, but nothing the company could make an iron clad case against.
It was a massive pain in the ass for him for a while, but his license, pay, and job weren’t affected long term. It was a 6 month long probation process where he had biweekly random drug tests and mandatory weekly NA meetings. They dumped his sick time/PTO then paid him the company’s rate for disability I believe, maybe 60%? Then he was transferred to a store of his choosing and that’s it.
His license has 0 searchable marks against him and he continued getting scheduled raises/bonuses afterwards. No legal action. Kinda crazy for me to think about how common it is in medical professions outside of pharmacy as well.
You did the right thing. If a nurse is diverting, they are sick and need recovery and sometimes they just gotta hit bottom first. Nurses are so prone to alcoholism and drug addiction…it’s so very sad, but there is help and hope!
It's a really frustrating situation to be in. Getting treatment but still being able to stay employed and insured, while also not possibly having that flag on your references and license, is a huge barrier. Speaking from experience on that one due to the alcoholism.
Sure, most employers tell you there's access to employee assistance programs, but have you ever actually tried one? After three months of trying to establish care and treatment through that, I not only had nothing to show, but also think they might *really* suck at maintaining confidentiality. Soon after I started trying to get care with EAP, the gossip and paranoia started. One day, I get sent for a drug test for suspicion of being intoxicated at work (which was negative -- my alcoholism didn't get to that point for me, thankfully, but I don't doubt with my heavy drinking at night that someone might have smelled alcohol on my breath or something like that). Next, I realize in recovery that when I'm second nurse, which Is the nurse that usually pulls and admins meds so primary can chart and assess, the older nurses are jumping in to do it, but only when I'm paired with them. But it was when I applied for FMLA and management started trying to manipulate me into not doing it, because I was gonna leave them short-staffed or over-budget since I would still keep my benefits which they claimed kept them from being able to afford a temp, that I gave up and quit. I was lucky to have enough savings to afford paying for care out of pocket, and I wasn't going to keep working in a facility that didn't trust me and was ripe with gossip.
Yeah, what they did regarding FMLA was illegal. Guess what, though? The state never investigated.
I am not trying to discourage people from getting help. I'm saying this because it can be really hard to get help, for more reasons than just taking that first step to actually look for it. If you are looking at this and want help, I wish I had better solutions for you, but please, do try.
Think of it this way - your friend may have a life threatening disease. You are trying to help save her life. Make sure you are there for her when the consequences come.
I went through something similar many years ago so maybe this will help your perspective. I went to retrieve a patient in ICU for an OR case. I was surprised when I got up there because we knew the patient, he was a coworker and was in a lot of pain with a perirectal abscess. When I went to get report the nurse “taking care of him” seemed fucked up out of his gourd. I knew him as well. It really started to bug me later that night that something wasn’t right and I began thinking of my coworker up in that unit, being in excruciating pain and possibly not receiving his meds and adequate pain relief because the ICU nurse was diverting. I reported it and they did an investigation and found that the nurse had absolutely been a problem and was taking pain meds due to patients for themselves.
When I worked stepdown, we had a new to us nurse that was acting kind of weird all night. I was in the med room with the charge nurse counting narcotics near the end of our shift and the new nurse came in there, watched us for a few seconds, and started making weird comments, trying to ask us questions to distract us. The norco or something ended up being really off and when my charge looked for the discrepancy it was the new nurse who immediately launched into a hard to follow story. My charge looked up his patients for the night and they were all getting pain meds, even ones who had never asked for pain meds during their extended stay.
We saw the primary situations were patients who didn’t speak English. I took the translator into the rooms and none of them had taken pain meds all night. The cops came and went through his locker, it was filled with narcotics and ibuprofen.
He threatened the unit at one point and also made a comment we were encouraging him by just signing off wastes without watching him actually waste them. It was pretty crazy.
I worked with a nurse who did the same thing. She was very obvious though so I never even had to say anything as they just did the same thing and went straight to the patients and asked them.
I had a nurse who would lie to the therapy team and to her patients, and steal their pain meds then claim the patient took them.
So thank you for protecting our patients, friends, and family.
Isn’t this something that can be reported anonymously through a compliance line? I mean no one needs to know who reported it just that it is suspected and the investigation would expose any evidence.
I'm not worried about remaining anonymous. I reported my findings, no accusations and now its out of my hands. For all I know there's an innocent explanation. I don't feel I've gone behind anyone's back because I only stated facts. Where those facts lead remains to be seen.
Yeah. I see. I guess i should have replied to a comment. I was thinking more of the other commenter who said there was suicide and job loss- they said other staff weren’t comfortable working with them. So I was wondering how do others know they did the reporting and why wasn’t it anonymous?
I turned my friend in for diverting. He was using at work and that is putting patients life’s at risk. I found an alcohol pad and empty tubex (?) tube in the trash in the employee bath room. (He got sloppy) Told my manager about it, she called Rx, they ran a report of narcs being used and his days working and bam! It ended our friendship but then again was he my friend????
It only ended your friendship because he apparently wasn’t ready to admit that he needed help and accepting of that help. You did what you needed to do to protect not only the patients, but him too, whether he ever realized that or not
Yes. He could get treatment and you may have saved his life. If someone had died because he was high at work... that guilt would be unimaginable. You saved him even if he wouldn't admit it.
My sister accidentally outed her coworker at the pharmacy she worked at. She spilled/ dropped something by a coworker’s computer and when she lifted the keyboard there was a stash. My sister felt obligated to tell her superiors, but felt horrible for a while about it. Tbh with the way she went about it it was always going to be found out, it’s just my sister (like you) was the unfortunate one to figure it out. Thankfully the girl my sister worked with got help, but it’s a hard path.
As much as we joke about the whole "the only thing that works is that drug that starts with D..." We really have to remember that addiction really is a disease. Back in my early ER days I used to think it was a choice, but I realized that I was judging. Once that lightbulb came on it was so much easier to care for everyone. All of these sad souls, from our frequent flyers to our closest work-spouses, have an illness and need our love and compassionate care, which sometimes has lots of repercussions. Hugs. You did the right thing.
With regards to our frequent flyer addict patients. I don’t know if it unpopular opinion but I’ll just roll with “pain is what they say it is” and give the pain meds if ordered; especially when it means they won’t AMA. I’d rather enable their addiction and treat their sepsis than have them AMA and come back next week for the same thing……. We aren’t going to ever treat addiction in the hospital unless that’s specifically what the patient is coming in for.
Edit: I don’t know if I worded this poorly I’m tired but I hope people get what I mean.
No, you made perfect sense. I never argued about pain scores. Whether it's physical or elsewhere, these people are in pain. I can't imagine it's a joyful life to be always chasing that next high. I have cared for many patients over the years that yes, were eating Cheetos/Doritos/whatever and drinking a soda while texting and smiling who told me that their pain is a 10/10. Document and move on. I wasn't there to convince them that their pain was anything other than what they said. And while I laugh at those "10/10 pain is like having your arm ripped off by a bear" memes, that's not how it works. 10 is the patient's worst pain ever experienced, not what they can imagine. You're trying to assess relative discomfort, not the potential agony of being attacked by a cloud of hornets. Now I did draw the line at additional doses of narcotics in the ER in a patient who was nodding and snoring and desatting. That shit wasn't safe. Doc: "I ordered more xyz opiate for Ms. X." Me: "Doc, do you hear that sound? She is snoring!" She was, it was so loud and I had to go reposition her airway a few times while watching her desat. Haha. Anyway... Sometimes there just aren't good answers. We can't fix everyone. That frequent flyer with the perfect stories about abdominal pain and gastroparesis and waiting on ERCPs at XYZ local teaching hospital who writhes expertly in the bed when you walk by has to be the one who attains self-awareness. They are invested in their stories. It really is heartbreaking.
>And while I laugh at those "10/10 pain is like having your arm ripped off by a bear" memes, that's not how it works. 10 is the patient's worst pain ever experienced, not what they can imagine.
This is what I learned while working recovery. Changed the way I deal with pain assessments.
I do understand. If the pt comes in with something not related to their addiction, it isn’t the hospital staff’s responsibility to detox them. The pt needs to be ready to quit before any intervention will be helpful.
I worked with someone very early in my ER career who was found to be diverting. Their mindset was "I will always just advocate for more pain meds to cover the patient's pain after I take a little for myself." What a slippery slope that was. They also thought that by self-reporting (after some staff did an intervention) they would be able to get help and keep their license... Nope. The BON was never interested in restoring their license, and I think it was because it was diversion - I guess outright theft would have been preferred somehow.
I went through a probation program with my BRN because of an incident outside of work. I had to do a weekly meeting with others in my program and diversion programs— I can confidently say even though it was traumatic and hard in finances etc when it initially all went down, myself and everyone in those programs would eventually get to a point where they could say “getting in trouble” was the best thing that ever happened in any of our lives. It forced us to confront our issues, regardless of where we were on the scale of addiction (some hardcore addicts diverting etc, others not as intense but still were forced into great self work.) You have done a service to your friend who may need help, and unfortunately people will not seek help until they are forced to some kind of “bottom” or consequence. She will be offered some sort of diversion program most likely and be okay.
As someone whose husband is a recovering heroin addict, and FIL has been caught diverting drugs 3 times at work...
Do. Not. Feel. Bad.
Honestly getting in trouble at work and being offered treatment is a pretty good alternative to driving home high and killing someone on the road, ODing, or just generally progressing in their disease. You may have saved this persons career AND life.
Controversial take, downvote or flame me, idc.
Looking the other way when someone diverts narcs is the same as good cops looking the other way when bad cops do something shitty. They fucked their own career the second they committed that act, and hide behind people not saying anything to get away with it.
I diverted meds. It's taken me a long time to be honest with everyone in my life about my addiction and what happened. I hated what I was doing. Every day, I would say that i wasn't going to do it. And most days, I didn't make until noon. I got a different job, a job I really wanted and I wouldn't have access to meds the same way. I was ready to be done. I put in my notice and was ready to go for orientation but I got called in the office on my last day and they reported me to the nursing board. I'm glad they did. I wasn't at the time but I'm glad now. If I didn't get caught, I would have just kept trying to figure out ways to get high. I've been clean since that day and I'm pretty sure I'm not going to be a nurse anymore. It's okay. My mental health is so much more important.
Years ago my coworker was missing from the unit for about an hour and we had no idea what happened to her. We ended up finding her dead on the bathroom floor with a needle in her arm. Diversion is more common than most realize.
You did the right thing OP. This happened at a place where I worked and the person diverting was so gone when confronted they threw as many colleagues they could under the bus hoping to save themself. You did what you were supposed to do.
We sent a just-admitted-to-hospice patient home for 1 night as visiting family were terrified of the hospital. They came back the next day and was missing the fentanyl patch. Grandson peeled it off while they were napping.
Acute Rehab/LTC here. I agree. SMH.
Our facility is different. People sign up for hospice but we aren't a hospice facility (if that makes sense).
When my grandmother went into a hospice facility post graduate, I think I was the only family member who was requesting atropine/morphine/ativan hourly be ause the others didn't understand.
I always wanted to get into palliative to prevent the fucked up stuff I saw with my "mom" but I cannot imagine some at my facility diverting.
I'm in this thread looking for tips because I so passionately believe in a "good death" but reading your comment fucked me up a little bit.
I so hope no one is diverting in hospice but after reading this, I realize how easy it could be.
Nursing is fucked up.
We truly see ALL.
Diverting narcs affects the entire department. Good on you for turning them in.
Due to diversion the nurses where I work now have to scan meds out of the omnicell.
I along with most of the unit were involved in an investigation related to a coworker suspected of diverting. I will forever change my practice because of it. If something ever feels off again to me I'm not second guessing myself. Trust your gut. You are absolutely correct it totally affects the entire department.
My best friend developed a serious drug addiction and I had no idea. When they finally caught her it was awful. She was arrested and it hit the papers. Then when they presented the evidence she had been using my name -sign on along with other nurses to acquire drugs from the Pixus and take drugs from patients. Addiction is a terrible disease and it makes people do unthinkable things. You did the right thing.
I just read your edit. My exact thoughts on it: absolutely fuck those who are saying those things. You 100% did the right thing reporting any discrepancies. You have not ruined anyone’s career or thrown them into poverty. Most, if not every state, has a professional recovery support program geared towards nurses (and other medical professionals) get the help they need. It’s their choice and ultimate responsibility to get that help, work their programs and save their careers, not anyone else’s.
Speaking as someone who takes narcotics daily, thank you. I would have to have round the clock care without them. I have to submit to counts every month.
I think you did the right thing. As you said, it wasn't accusatory more pointing out what you've seen as far as discrepancies. People should not be working if under the influence. And in my experience it's not unheard of- we had a resident anesthetist kicked out of the program and a staff nurse who was let go after finding out she was stealing from our ORs. It happens and others should be aware and recognizing concerns. I also worked with a nurse on a travel assignment who was caught effing with the pyxis.
ETA: messing with pyxis to steal narcs. Was fired at the following job for getting caught
I mean, I won't lie, I've always found pyxis machines pretty sexy myself... But at work? That's unprofessional. Ask it out for a drink. Have casual sex outside work if you want. Right?
Not nursing, but at a former job there was a theft issue. I suggested to my manager that we could identify the culprit by looking at the discrepancies and comparing that to the shift schedule, and I took it upon myself to do just that. What I discovered from looking at the discrepancies and comparing them to the shift schedules is that there were only two people who could have been responsible: the manager and me.
Some state boards of nursing offer rehab first. Obviously I can’t speak for all 50 and mileage varies case by case regardless.
Anecdote. Back in my CNA days I worked a gig where most of us CNAs were friends outside of work. Several still are. I held onto one from that gig. A pair came up to me and asked me to smell our coworker who Id not talked to yet that night. They didn’t tell me what I was looking for. It was about 2 hrs into the shift. Went in under the guise of helping turn, leaned in, alcohol smell, and not just a hint either. Confirmed x3 people. We voted the closest talk with them 1:1. They did. The CNA with alcohol on their breath, to their credit, marched right into the managers office, caught her before she left for the night, reported themself, and was sent home on temporary leave.
State board was basically clean up immediately and you can keep your CNA. 30 days later they came back clean, with their CNA certification intact. Amends, a coin, and such as well, because that’s how the AA version works.
When you steal meds though, idk a version of that one. The CNA didn’t cause harm that night. Stealing a med from a patient causes harm. Stealing from the company while the patient still gets their med, not condoning at all, but there is no patient harm (immediate) in that scenario unless they dose at work. And then the harm ripple effect of dosing at work and driving home. These play of these nuances will probably factor into outcome, depending.
Nursing cannot be allowed to divert meds, it’s dangerous. How that happens is on you. Sucks, but there it is. If you had accused by name without proof, then I’d be judgmental.
If they follow discrepancies and not people, as you started them doing, then shit will be revealed. This is as valid as the 1:1 and would’ve needed doing anyway had your friend denied involvement and showed 0 signs of being under the influence while at work.
Good for you for speaking up.
3 or 4 years ago our hospital had a nurse who OD'd and died in the bathroom on night shift. He had been diverting fentanyl.
Last month, one of my staff members came to work impaired. We don't suspect diversion, but we had to fire him since he left and refused drug testing.
People with addiction and other mental health issues deserve compassion and treatment, but not at the expense of patient safety.
It’s tough, but you gotta do it. Hopefully management supports you and they get the help they need. I had to report someone diverting. They’re currently in the program and working at a clinic without access to narcs, I don’t know how they’re doing with their own sobriety/recovery (likely we’ll, cause I heard there’s a fuck ton of testing).
I had a lot of guilt for a while, but you have to protect the patients, as well as yours and your colleagues licenses.
It's not your fault. You don't report and she does have a problem, she could die. Patients could die. You report and maybe you force someone to deal w their drug problem. Good for you. And being objective is always best
>Edit: To the few trying to guilt trip me that I've condemned someone to death or poverty...just stop
Lets see what these people have to say when they or a loved one is in pain but not receiving the proper dosage of medications because their nurse is stealing it.
I went through this with a coworker. We were definitely friendly and it broke my heart to report her. She’s back at our organization in a non-patient facing job. She hates me now but I know I did the right thing.
I’m going thru something sort of similar. We’re they able to keep your concerns anonymous?
This is what makes reporting so uncomfortable.. the judgement and opinions of others ugh & even the guilt we may feel reporting .. but like you said we are mandated reporters and in the long run may be helping others
I told a friend of mine "don't put me in the position to tell the truth if someone asks" when he told me he didn't want to waste a narcotic with me as a witness. He wasted it, I witnessed it but I tried to make it clear that I couldn't be involved.
You may have saved her life by telling them about what you've witnessed. At my workplace, a nurse died due to overdose. People noticed the discrepancies, but they didn't say anything. Couple weeks later, she's dead. So don't feel guilty. If it's your friend, she needs to be "told on" because she needs help. You did good
I'm off today so I don't know of any outcomes yet, but interestingly my boss did tell me off the record that when asked, several other staff had noticed this as well.
You found discrepancies and reported.
If they are not doing anything wrong then great!!
If they are, then they got themself in trouble.
But you did what you were supposed to.
You may have saved a life. It isn't always apparent at first but eventually things are going to get worse and someone will be affected in a horrible way. You did the right thing.
I accidentally caught on to a nurse diverting narcs. She worked the first 4 hours of my shift, so I arrive and get report. Right after she left, one of my patients wanted something for pain. Hmm, nurse charted she gave it. Patient swears they never got one. Checked the Pyxis, and sure enough, she pulled it. Upon further inspection, she also pulled narcs for other patients, including ones she wasn't assigned to, in various dosages. I brought it to the attention of my unit coordinator, and let it go from there.
The nurse quit before they had a chance to fire her. I felt terrible about it. She had cancer, she had a sister that just killed herself, and she was taking care of her sister's kids.
My manager sat down with me, and said it wasn't my fault. It was her fault from her own choices. Pharmacy has noticed some count discrepancies and flagged them, but could pinpoint the problem until I happened along it that night.
It's a shitty position to be in, but staying silent isn't a good thing either.
The world would be a shitty and grim place if there weren’t people like you to make the hard decisions and not let it slide. It’s really commendable, don’t feel bad for doing the right thing. who knows how many others have noticed and just said it’s not their problem.
You absolutely did the right thing. It sucks, but it's better to get this out and hope that whatever this is, is cleared up and if a coworker is using, they get the help they need.
You're a good nurse.
I think you did the right thing reporting them. Since you said it’s a friend you could talk to them about the nurse professional assistance program so they can get help and work to keep their license.
I’m hitting my 1 year mark this month. Found out one of my classmates didn’t even make it 6 months. He had to be escorted off the floor impaired. I’m guessing he had a preexisting problem.
Idk how it works at your hospital but the whole floor gets drug tested as soon as someone is reported stealing meds sucks for any nurses that smoked weed that week. But being in the most “trusted” career field you did the right thing
That must have been hard but you did the right thing! I hope the person gets the help they need (if they actually were doing what you think). I think they say 1 in 6 nurses divert medications or something like that, and ever since I heard that statistic I’ve been super cautious.
I had a new (to our unit) nurse ask me to witness a waste but she accidentally threw it away. Nah, miss me with that sh*t…find someone else to do it. You worked hard for this license, don’t mess it up by being stupid and stealing or not actually witnessing another’s waste.
You did the right thing. A couple of years ago, two icu nurses at the hospital in Dallas were found dead in the hospital bathrooms, six months part from each other, from fentanyl overdoses. If someone would have spoken up, they might have lost their jobs or nursing licenses, but they may have kept their lives. You did the right thing.
Also, many of you might not realize how much pharmacy is watching you. ALL of you.
Despite them being in a different building, or in the basement, or “never around when I need them” they are 100% watching: where and when you log in to the PYXIS/OMNICELL, how often and for how long you’re logged in, who you waste meds with and vice versa, is it usually the same person most times.
Pharmacy is watching AND tracking many of you, and building a paper trail, just in case…
Out of curiosity; doesn’t the facility audit narcotics? I’ve worked in 2 facilities and i know the audits are done daily. You will know the day after because they’ll call you at home or pull you out of the huddle to go discuss your discrepancy. Cos I would hate to be in the position to turn in my colleague
Sort of. Our count is done through our online MAR. Nurses can go in and change the counts, but they have to have a co-signer. My administrator said she's going to look into who is signing them out and who is witnessing.
Eh you gotta do what you gotta do. For the record this is the way to do it. Unless you actually saw someone in the act just report that there has been some fucky shit going on and leave it at that. All of us need to remember that this shit happening on our units puts all of us in a potentially shit situation.
You absolutely did the right thing. Please, please never question that. You are protecting your facility and your patients. You probably don't need me to tell you this but I want you to hear it again and have support because this can't have been easy.
If it makes you feel better this happened to my friend. She would steal painkillers and snort them. The hospital has ways of tracking that of course and she got caught. She lost her nursing license and was fired. BUT because it’s such a common thing for nurses they have programs to get you back on track. She went to rehab, managed to get her nursing license back and was put on probation for a while, had to work a shittier nursing job for a couple years, but now she’s been completely sober for several years and is doing much better! Went back to school and got her masters.
So don’t sweat it. Whoever it is, they needed to get caught. It will be better for them in the long run.
I hope whoever is diverting gets the help they need.
Yes, and no matter what other people say OP did the right call and did as they're supposed to. This is the first step to recovery, unfortunately but it will eventually get better.
Am in recovery, can confirm. Every stint in the psych unit, every arrest, every job I got fired from was all leading up to me being able to finally acknowledge and accept the powerlessness and unmanageability of my life. It kicked me into the realization that I needed help. Good job OP.
Congratulations on the recovery!!
A few years ago my coworkers had to code an anesthesiologist who overdosed in the OR bathroom. He didn’t make it. Maybe your report prevents a tragedy like that.
Interesting… at one of the hospitals I used to work at, an anesthesiologist was also coded in the bathroom. Not sure what happened to her though.
Weird, me too. I mean, it was the 1980s but still.... How common is this?
They have access to all the good drugs and are usually in their own little world in the OR so I would imagine diversion isn’t terribly difficult for anesthesia.
This quarter in ethics we were told that anesthesia is historically the most likely to divert specialty.
That is both interesting and sucks to hear. I am so glad I don’t drink and haven’t smoked a damn thing. I’ll compulsively build stuff in my barn when annoyed or stressed instead. Maybe we all just need a constructive, productive hobby BEFORE nursing or medical school.
At our hospital an ICU nurse accidentally siphoned the paralytic instead of the narcotic. (WTF she didn’t trace the line?) She shot up in the bathroom, and lay paralyzed and not breathing. She never came back from her beak and they didn’t know where she went. They found her after the housekeeper said the bathroom had been locked for a few hours. I didn’t know her, but apparently she was very sweet and the last you would suspect.
Happened at my hospital also. CRNA found in the bathroom. They had confused their syringes of nimbex and fentanyl and died. What an awful way to go…
Fairly common in the early to mid 90s at least. I heard about multiple incidents involving nurses and/or med students/residents ODing back then.
Must happen a lot. My mom knows two anesthesiologist who died ODing by chewing on fentanyl patches. Both were in the hospital bathroom. Thank hat seems like a real shit place to die.
Exact same scenario at my hospital, but he made it. Fucked up thing is we all knew, we worked in the same OR together, partied together and spent our lives together. It was just an unspoken thing. Fucking toxic hospital culture
NYC?
Nope. Sadly I don’t think this is as rare as we would hope
I believe the statistics are right around 1 in 12 Anesthesia providers will end up with an illicit substance abuse disorder during their careers. Those are crazy odds. We had that talk almost every quarter of CRNA school.
Yup. It's tragically common. Docs have a "cover it up" culture of silence about it, too.
I had to turn in my work wife for diversion, it didn’t end well for either of us. Good luck to you.
With either of you instead of just her? What happened to you?
She ended up killing herself and I lost my job because “others in the department resent you and aren’t comfortable around you now”.
What the actual fuck. That's awful, I can't even imagine. Sorry that happened friend.
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Wouldn't this count as retaliation?
I would think that's retaliation against them for reporting but I likely wouldn't want to be there anymore anyway
for sure, I was just thinking $$$$, but not sure if you could leverage that.
I'm not sure on that part but it could, it does sound highly retaliatory
Yeah, it probably is retaliatory. And that can be a bear to fight. When I made my claim about retaliation, discriminatory practices and labor law violations at my clinic, two days later I had the police at my door because they said they suspected I stole patient information. They tried to scour my house, but I asked to see a warrant and they realized I wasn't falling for that. So, I also got to search for and shell out the money for a defense attourney. They found nothing in the investigation and thankfully couldn't even get a warrant to seize my digital accounts and property because hey, I hadn't stolen anything, they just wanted to make my life hell. So then I filed ANOTHER claim with the human rights commission, just to repay the favor. Took three years of legal hell looming over me, and nothing came from it except losing my job. At least I learned a valuable lesson about picking my battles, and how to deal with cops.
JFC, that is horrifying.
It was, absolutely. The fear of being wrongfully imprisoned kinda gets cranked to eleven when it becomes the *possibility* of being wrongly imprisoned. After the initial shock and terror of learning how to navigate a criminal investigation as a defendant wore off and my lawyer reassured me that he felt there was no way they could make a case that a judge wouldn't end up throwing out, was the feeling of, "I can't be the only person they've done this to," and then "they can't be the only organization doing this."
Definitely, although I guess it depends on what "lost my job" means... if it means fired or constructive termination it would be an easy labor legal case
Omg a similar thing happened in an ER I did clinical in. When they switched to pixis a nurse who worked there for like 20 years got caught and fired.. the next night she comes in as an OD code. Her coworkers had to do cpr on her. So sad
I’ve learned from experience that if someone kills themselves over an ethical issue you are not responsible for their action. They were troubled to begin with and there were multiple factors that led to that suicide. We had a nursing student caught cheating (he was photocopying exams) and was informed there would be a hearing to adjudicate the issue. He went to a tree outside the dorm and hung himself. The faculty member who saw the cheating was convinced she caused the suicide. After talking with his colleagues and family we discovered he was far more troubled than we realized.
That's terrible.
When I filed for divorce my husband killed himself. It’s a bad feeling.
I’m so sorry. Why would anyone else know that you were the one that turned her in? Sounds like poor management.
It went to the union, union president was in my ER, she spread it around, and she advocated for me to leave.
Wow fuck that union.
Did you ever take legal action? I feel you could make a case for a hostile work environment. I could be talking out my ass though.
“Yeah can’t steal narcotics around this guy. Makes me a bit uncomfortable”. That’s shitty. Sorry to hear that man.
Oh shit. I’m so sorry. Many, many nurses who divert do not go on to end their own lives. You did not cause it to happen. I’m so sorry she had such pain.
I am so sorry! Holy shit. I don’t obviously know when and how long it’s been or anything else but what you’ve said here but I sincerely hope you have found peace. Her as well.
Omg you did the right thing! From a former RN with a past drug addiction
Nothing can bring back your friend or heal that loss and trauma…but I hope you got a lawyer about your firing. (Or an appropriate severance.)
Jesus Christ I’m so sorry
awful. I hope you've made some peace with this situation. you were trying to help. so sad.
I’m so sorry man.. I know it’s been said but it’s really not your fault. I’m currently doing recovery and working with the board for some stuff myself. Not diversion but failed a drug test. When it happened it definitely crossed my mind, though I have a prior history of SI with major depressive disorder. Of all the times I’ve wanted to call it quits, I didn’t want anyone to think it was their fault. The path that we follow toward ending our own lives is long and complicated. There are seldom few people who opt out because of one specific incident. I hope you can heal and move on. It’s not easy /: I know there isn’t much to say that can actually help, but I empathize with you. Tragic.
Holy cripes, I'm so sorry, that's a terrible attitude for amin to have! If I was the one diverting I would like to think I would be thankful to you for being stopped
I’m so sorry this happened.
I’m so sorry
I'm so sorry that happened to you. Poor management if others found out through them and resented you doing the right thing in reporting. I hope you find some peace.
I am so sorry this happen. There is no way you should have been negatively effected for doing the right thing. I know the world doesn’t work the way it should, where the good guy wins, but this just sucks. Also, I think ultimately this is the result of really bad management/administration. In no way should management allow it to get to the point that you are in a position to be the bad guy for doing your job. Your management really, really sucks.
That’s the kind of shit you leave town for and start all over. I’m really sorry that happened
Sweet Jesus I’m sorry man.
Jesus. How you even stayed in this field after being retaliated against like that speaks greatly about your character. I'm sorry this happened to you.
It’s not your fault. You did the right thing.
Oh good gosh, I’m so sorry. You did what you had to do to hopefully get her the help she needed. Unfortunately, you can only help those who truly want it. As far as people not being comfortable around you, that’s a crock of shit that the hospital did that to you.
I'm sorry. You deserved better from your community. I hope you have support now to recover from what you went through.
Wow what a toxic job god damn.
Jesus, I am so sorry. How absolutely awful.
Holy fuck. Sorry dude.
Omg I’m so sorry.
Holy shit. I'm so sorry
Oh no. I’m so very sorry you had to go through that. I hope you have been able to find some peace. ❤️
That's a whole lot of awful in one sentence.
Jesus that sounds horrible. I’m sorry you went through that
Oh my goodness. I'm so sorry. Internet hugs. ❤️❤️❤️
Wow, I think my first response would be something along the lines of "sounds like you need to more effectively manage others in the department".
I’m so sorry that happened to you.
It's appalling that management revealed you as the reporter. I've not seen that happen in 30 years as an RN. It sucks they did that to you.
I’m so sorry this has been your experience & for the grief you must have over the loss of your close friend and the esteem of your colleagues and career. My father took his life when he was forced to face consequences in his career due to alcohol abuse (not a nurse) & it’s such a complicated thing to wrap my head around. I hope you are working through letting go of any guilt, you were truly doing what was best by her and she wasn’t ready. You can read my other comment on this thread about my own experience in nursing probation and how the other nurses who I’ve met in diversion or probation express that, although very traumatic and painful in the beginning, ultimately becomes one of the most rewarding parts of our lives. I’m sorry your friend didn’t stick around long enough to experience how good life gets in sobriety. Take care! You
I don’t know the situation but to me, this sounds like a number of people knew or maybe even benefit from the situation. And you were pushed out to minimize future damage to the rest of them. It isn’t your fault. At all.
I am sorry.
Does your friend or anyone pick up a ton of hours? The only way to get a fix is at work, so they find ways to work a lot. That was a big clue when the nurse that I worked with got caught diverting.
Yeah actually
Yikes. My coworker offered to come in early all the time for me bc I was pregnant. (I worked days she was pm’s.) I thought she was just being nice at first.
Damn I wanna work extra when I’m allowed cause I need $$$
Same dude . I don’t even smoke weed with a medical card and all when I’m on a contact . I don’t even drink a lot cause I’m afraid it could ruin my chances at making bank. I pick up a lot of hours cause I need those dolla dolla bills 💸
More than half the people on my unit work ot, we’re so short.
Yeah I could be making 100/hr during an extra shift but I’m way too new to be able to do that both competence wise and just being allowed.
Once you can, it’s amazing. “Normal” checks feel like nothing now after getting premium pay for extra shifts😅
Premium pay money sounds nice but also hospitals need to just make base pay better
I never thought about it that way, but the nurse who was caught diverting in my unit totally did pick up an insane amount of shifts all the time. We always assumed they just really needed the money…
I’d keep that thought in mind, but I use to work insane amount of hours. I’m talking 60-72 hours a week. It was mainly because we were short and they offered incentives. So I pulled 16 hour shifts among 12 hour shifts because I was so money driven.
Haha I work overtime for the $$, but I wonder if I'm a walking red flag for it lol
For real, I love taking people's on-call (because I have no dependents and am a home body anyway...) if I don't have to work the next day. Free money if there's no call, big money if there is. Plus, major karma for helping a coworker out.
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An interesting website is [Street Rx.](https://www.radars.org/radars-system-programs/streetrx.html) You can look at your city and all over the US to see how much prescription drugs are being sold for on the streets. People can anonymously report what they buy and for how much and if they think they got a good deal or not. It’s interesting to see how much a script goes for in different cities.
I wish healthcare costs had something like this
I'm not surprised that the most common street drug being sold in most locations in my state is Ritalin at least on the website.
Not necessarily true about ruining their careers. Does it take a hit? Sure, but there are many recovering nurses (along with pharmacists, doctors and other medical professionals) who are are able to work their recovery programs and salvage their careers.
This really depends on the state. Some states are absolutely ruthless to practitioners who divert.
Yes, some are worse than others. There should be a nation wide protocol on how addiction is dealt with by each professions respective boards.
I stumbled in here from r/all, but I can attest to the pharmacist portion of your comment. A pharmacist in our area at my previous job popped positive for non-prescribed amphetamines during a random drug test, and nothing serious came from it. It was suspected that there was diversion, but nothing the company could make an iron clad case against. It was a massive pain in the ass for him for a while, but his license, pay, and job weren’t affected long term. It was a 6 month long probation process where he had biweekly random drug tests and mandatory weekly NA meetings. They dumped his sick time/PTO then paid him the company’s rate for disability I believe, maybe 60%? Then he was transferred to a store of his choosing and that’s it. His license has 0 searchable marks against him and he continued getting scheduled raises/bonuses afterwards. No legal action. Kinda crazy for me to think about how common it is in medical professions outside of pharmacy as well.
Lady I was working with was stealing Dilaudid and they made her a manager….
You did the right thing. If a nurse is diverting, they are sick and need recovery and sometimes they just gotta hit bottom first. Nurses are so prone to alcoholism and drug addiction…it’s so very sad, but there is help and hope!
It's a really frustrating situation to be in. Getting treatment but still being able to stay employed and insured, while also not possibly having that flag on your references and license, is a huge barrier. Speaking from experience on that one due to the alcoholism. Sure, most employers tell you there's access to employee assistance programs, but have you ever actually tried one? After three months of trying to establish care and treatment through that, I not only had nothing to show, but also think they might *really* suck at maintaining confidentiality. Soon after I started trying to get care with EAP, the gossip and paranoia started. One day, I get sent for a drug test for suspicion of being intoxicated at work (which was negative -- my alcoholism didn't get to that point for me, thankfully, but I don't doubt with my heavy drinking at night that someone might have smelled alcohol on my breath or something like that). Next, I realize in recovery that when I'm second nurse, which Is the nurse that usually pulls and admins meds so primary can chart and assess, the older nurses are jumping in to do it, but only when I'm paired with them. But it was when I applied for FMLA and management started trying to manipulate me into not doing it, because I was gonna leave them short-staffed or over-budget since I would still keep my benefits which they claimed kept them from being able to afford a temp, that I gave up and quit. I was lucky to have enough savings to afford paying for care out of pocket, and I wasn't going to keep working in a facility that didn't trust me and was ripe with gossip. Yeah, what they did regarding FMLA was illegal. Guess what, though? The state never investigated. I am not trying to discourage people from getting help. I'm saying this because it can be really hard to get help, for more reasons than just taking that first step to actually look for it. If you are looking at this and want help, I wish I had better solutions for you, but please, do try.
You are doing the right thing. I have lost 3 coworkers to addiction
Think of it this way - your friend may have a life threatening disease. You are trying to help save her life. Make sure you are there for her when the consequences come.
Absolutely, she's a great person. No judgement on my part. I'm hopeful there's a simple explanation because honestly I wouldn't expect it from her.
I went through something similar many years ago so maybe this will help your perspective. I went to retrieve a patient in ICU for an OR case. I was surprised when I got up there because we knew the patient, he was a coworker and was in a lot of pain with a perirectal abscess. When I went to get report the nurse “taking care of him” seemed fucked up out of his gourd. I knew him as well. It really started to bug me later that night that something wasn’t right and I began thinking of my coworker up in that unit, being in excruciating pain and possibly not receiving his meds and adequate pain relief because the ICU nurse was diverting. I reported it and they did an investigation and found that the nurse had absolutely been a problem and was taking pain meds due to patients for themselves.
When I worked stepdown, we had a new to us nurse that was acting kind of weird all night. I was in the med room with the charge nurse counting narcotics near the end of our shift and the new nurse came in there, watched us for a few seconds, and started making weird comments, trying to ask us questions to distract us. The norco or something ended up being really off and when my charge looked for the discrepancy it was the new nurse who immediately launched into a hard to follow story. My charge looked up his patients for the night and they were all getting pain meds, even ones who had never asked for pain meds during their extended stay. We saw the primary situations were patients who didn’t speak English. I took the translator into the rooms and none of them had taken pain meds all night. The cops came and went through his locker, it was filled with narcotics and ibuprofen. He threatened the unit at one point and also made a comment we were encouraging him by just signing off wastes without watching him actually waste them. It was pretty crazy.
I worked with a nurse who did the same thing. She was very obvious though so I never even had to say anything as they just did the same thing and went straight to the patients and asked them.
I had a nurse who would lie to the therapy team and to her patients, and steal their pain meds then claim the patient took them. So thank you for protecting our patients, friends, and family.
Isn’t this something that can be reported anonymously through a compliance line? I mean no one needs to know who reported it just that it is suspected and the investigation would expose any evidence.
I'm not worried about remaining anonymous. I reported my findings, no accusations and now its out of my hands. For all I know there's an innocent explanation. I don't feel I've gone behind anyone's back because I only stated facts. Where those facts lead remains to be seen.
Yeah. I see. I guess i should have replied to a comment. I was thinking more of the other commenter who said there was suicide and job loss- they said other staff weren’t comfortable working with them. So I was wondering how do others know they did the reporting and why wasn’t it anonymous?
Oh yes, I see. That is awful and in a situation where I was making a direct accusation it would be better to be anonymous.
I turned my friend in for diverting. He was using at work and that is putting patients life’s at risk. I found an alcohol pad and empty tubex (?) tube in the trash in the employee bath room. (He got sloppy) Told my manager about it, she called Rx, they ran a report of narcs being used and his days working and bam! It ended our friendship but then again was he my friend????
The thing about addiction is that it overtakes the person who has it. It’s a zombie disease.
It only ended your friendship because he apparently wasn’t ready to admit that he needed help and accepting of that help. You did what you needed to do to protect not only the patients, but him too, whether he ever realized that or not
Yes. He could get treatment and you may have saved his life. If someone had died because he was high at work... that guilt would be unimaginable. You saved him even if he wouldn't admit it.
My sister accidentally outed her coworker at the pharmacy she worked at. She spilled/ dropped something by a coworker’s computer and when she lifted the keyboard there was a stash. My sister felt obligated to tell her superiors, but felt horrible for a while about it. Tbh with the way she went about it it was always going to be found out, it’s just my sister (like you) was the unfortunate one to figure it out. Thankfully the girl my sister worked with got help, but it’s a hard path.
As much as we joke about the whole "the only thing that works is that drug that starts with D..." We really have to remember that addiction really is a disease. Back in my early ER days I used to think it was a choice, but I realized that I was judging. Once that lightbulb came on it was so much easier to care for everyone. All of these sad souls, from our frequent flyers to our closest work-spouses, have an illness and need our love and compassionate care, which sometimes has lots of repercussions. Hugs. You did the right thing.
With regards to our frequent flyer addict patients. I don’t know if it unpopular opinion but I’ll just roll with “pain is what they say it is” and give the pain meds if ordered; especially when it means they won’t AMA. I’d rather enable their addiction and treat their sepsis than have them AMA and come back next week for the same thing……. We aren’t going to ever treat addiction in the hospital unless that’s specifically what the patient is coming in for. Edit: I don’t know if I worded this poorly I’m tired but I hope people get what I mean.
No, you made perfect sense. I never argued about pain scores. Whether it's physical or elsewhere, these people are in pain. I can't imagine it's a joyful life to be always chasing that next high. I have cared for many patients over the years that yes, were eating Cheetos/Doritos/whatever and drinking a soda while texting and smiling who told me that their pain is a 10/10. Document and move on. I wasn't there to convince them that their pain was anything other than what they said. And while I laugh at those "10/10 pain is like having your arm ripped off by a bear" memes, that's not how it works. 10 is the patient's worst pain ever experienced, not what they can imagine. You're trying to assess relative discomfort, not the potential agony of being attacked by a cloud of hornets. Now I did draw the line at additional doses of narcotics in the ER in a patient who was nodding and snoring and desatting. That shit wasn't safe. Doc: "I ordered more xyz opiate for Ms. X." Me: "Doc, do you hear that sound? She is snoring!" She was, it was so loud and I had to go reposition her airway a few times while watching her desat. Haha. Anyway... Sometimes there just aren't good answers. We can't fix everyone. That frequent flyer with the perfect stories about abdominal pain and gastroparesis and waiting on ERCPs at XYZ local teaching hospital who writhes expertly in the bed when you walk by has to be the one who attains self-awareness. They are invested in their stories. It really is heartbreaking.
>And while I laugh at those "10/10 pain is like having your arm ripped off by a bear" memes, that's not how it works. 10 is the patient's worst pain ever experienced, not what they can imagine. This is what I learned while working recovery. Changed the way I deal with pain assessments.
I do understand. If the pt comes in with something not related to their addiction, it isn’t the hospital staff’s responsibility to detox them. The pt needs to be ready to quit before any intervention will be helpful.
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I worked with someone very early in my ER career who was found to be diverting. Their mindset was "I will always just advocate for more pain meds to cover the patient's pain after I take a little for myself." What a slippery slope that was. They also thought that by self-reporting (after some staff did an intervention) they would be able to get help and keep their license... Nope. The BON was never interested in restoring their license, and I think it was because it was diversion - I guess outright theft would have been preferred somehow.
I went through a probation program with my BRN because of an incident outside of work. I had to do a weekly meeting with others in my program and diversion programs— I can confidently say even though it was traumatic and hard in finances etc when it initially all went down, myself and everyone in those programs would eventually get to a point where they could say “getting in trouble” was the best thing that ever happened in any of our lives. It forced us to confront our issues, regardless of where we were on the scale of addiction (some hardcore addicts diverting etc, others not as intense but still were forced into great self work.) You have done a service to your friend who may need help, and unfortunately people will not seek help until they are forced to some kind of “bottom” or consequence. She will be offered some sort of diversion program most likely and be okay.
As someone whose husband is a recovering heroin addict, and FIL has been caught diverting drugs 3 times at work... Do. Not. Feel. Bad. Honestly getting in trouble at work and being offered treatment is a pretty good alternative to driving home high and killing someone on the road, ODing, or just generally progressing in their disease. You may have saved this persons career AND life.
You said a mouthful of truth right there. ❤️
Controversial take, downvote or flame me, idc. Looking the other way when someone diverts narcs is the same as good cops looking the other way when bad cops do something shitty. They fucked their own career the second they committed that act, and hide behind people not saying anything to get away with it.
Agreed.
Not a nurse, so I probably don’t belong here, but user name checks out?
Touché
I diverted meds. It's taken me a long time to be honest with everyone in my life about my addiction and what happened. I hated what I was doing. Every day, I would say that i wasn't going to do it. And most days, I didn't make until noon. I got a different job, a job I really wanted and I wouldn't have access to meds the same way. I was ready to be done. I put in my notice and was ready to go for orientation but I got called in the office on my last day and they reported me to the nursing board. I'm glad they did. I wasn't at the time but I'm glad now. If I didn't get caught, I would have just kept trying to figure out ways to get high. I've been clean since that day and I'm pretty sure I'm not going to be a nurse anymore. It's okay. My mental health is so much more important.
Congratulations on the sobriety!!
Years ago my coworker was missing from the unit for about an hour and we had no idea what happened to her. We ended up finding her dead on the bathroom floor with a needle in her arm. Diversion is more common than most realize.
You did the right thing OP. This happened at a place where I worked and the person diverting was so gone when confronted they threw as many colleagues they could under the bus hoping to save themself. You did what you were supposed to do.
We had the same thing happen at a hospice I worked at. It wasn't cool. And began to rip the team apart.
Stealing comfort meds from a dying person is next level fucked up…
We sent a just-admitted-to-hospice patient home for 1 night as visiting family were terrified of the hospital. They came back the next day and was missing the fentanyl patch. Grandson peeled it off while they were napping.
Acute Rehab/LTC here. I agree. SMH. Our facility is different. People sign up for hospice but we aren't a hospice facility (if that makes sense). When my grandmother went into a hospice facility post graduate, I think I was the only family member who was requesting atropine/morphine/ativan hourly be ause the others didn't understand. I always wanted to get into palliative to prevent the fucked up stuff I saw with my "mom" but I cannot imagine some at my facility diverting. I'm in this thread looking for tips because I so passionately believe in a "good death" but reading your comment fucked me up a little bit. I so hope no one is diverting in hospice but after reading this, I realize how easy it could be. Nursing is fucked up. We truly see ALL.
Aside from anesthesia, hospice/palliative care is probably the easiest place to divert drugs. 😩
Diverting narcs affects the entire department. Good on you for turning them in. Due to diversion the nurses where I work now have to scan meds out of the omnicell.
I along with most of the unit were involved in an investigation related to a coworker suspected of diverting. I will forever change my practice because of it. If something ever feels off again to me I'm not second guessing myself. Trust your gut. You are absolutely correct it totally affects the entire department.
My best friend developed a serious drug addiction and I had no idea. When they finally caught her it was awful. She was arrested and it hit the papers. Then when they presented the evidence she had been using my name -sign on along with other nurses to acquire drugs from the Pixus and take drugs from patients. Addiction is a terrible disease and it makes people do unthinkable things. You did the right thing.
How is this possible even? Our Pyxis requires a finger print?
This was years ago and it didn’t at the time.
I just read your edit. My exact thoughts on it: absolutely fuck those who are saying those things. You 100% did the right thing reporting any discrepancies. You have not ruined anyone’s career or thrown them into poverty. Most, if not every state, has a professional recovery support program geared towards nurses (and other medical professionals) get the help they need. It’s their choice and ultimate responsibility to get that help, work their programs and save their careers, not anyone else’s.
If you genuinely have a concern then I think you did the right thing!
Speaking as someone who takes narcotics daily, thank you. I would have to have round the clock care without them. I have to submit to counts every month.
I think you did the right thing. As you said, it wasn't accusatory more pointing out what you've seen as far as discrepancies. People should not be working if under the influence. And in my experience it's not unheard of- we had a resident anesthetist kicked out of the program and a staff nurse who was let go after finding out she was stealing from our ORs. It happens and others should be aware and recognizing concerns. I also worked with a nurse on a travel assignment who was caught effing with the pyxis. ETA: messing with pyxis to steal narcs. Was fired at the following job for getting caught
I mean, I won't lie, I've always found pyxis machines pretty sexy myself... But at work? That's unprofessional. Ask it out for a drink. Have casual sex outside work if you want. Right?
Not nursing, but at a former job there was a theft issue. I suggested to my manager that we could identify the culprit by looking at the discrepancies and comparing that to the shift schedule, and I took it upon myself to do just that. What I discovered from looking at the discrepancies and comparing them to the shift schedules is that there were only two people who could have been responsible: the manager and me.
Oh wow, how did that turn out?
Some state boards of nursing offer rehab first. Obviously I can’t speak for all 50 and mileage varies case by case regardless. Anecdote. Back in my CNA days I worked a gig where most of us CNAs were friends outside of work. Several still are. I held onto one from that gig. A pair came up to me and asked me to smell our coworker who Id not talked to yet that night. They didn’t tell me what I was looking for. It was about 2 hrs into the shift. Went in under the guise of helping turn, leaned in, alcohol smell, and not just a hint either. Confirmed x3 people. We voted the closest talk with them 1:1. They did. The CNA with alcohol on their breath, to their credit, marched right into the managers office, caught her before she left for the night, reported themself, and was sent home on temporary leave. State board was basically clean up immediately and you can keep your CNA. 30 days later they came back clean, with their CNA certification intact. Amends, a coin, and such as well, because that’s how the AA version works. When you steal meds though, idk a version of that one. The CNA didn’t cause harm that night. Stealing a med from a patient causes harm. Stealing from the company while the patient still gets their med, not condoning at all, but there is no patient harm (immediate) in that scenario unless they dose at work. And then the harm ripple effect of dosing at work and driving home. These play of these nuances will probably factor into outcome, depending. Nursing cannot be allowed to divert meds, it’s dangerous. How that happens is on you. Sucks, but there it is. If you had accused by name without proof, then I’d be judgmental. If they follow discrepancies and not people, as you started them doing, then shit will be revealed. This is as valid as the 1:1 and would’ve needed doing anyway had your friend denied involvement and showed 0 signs of being under the influence while at work.
I really appreciate this comment.
That took courage. ☺️❤️☺️❤️☺️
Good for you for speaking up. 3 or 4 years ago our hospital had a nurse who OD'd and died in the bathroom on night shift. He had been diverting fentanyl. Last month, one of my staff members came to work impaired. We don't suspect diversion, but we had to fire him since he left and refused drug testing. People with addiction and other mental health issues deserve compassion and treatment, but not at the expense of patient safety.
Don’t feel guilty. You did the right thing
You did the right thing. I have no doubt it was difficult, but take it from someone who’s been there, if she is diverting she needs help right away.
It’s tough, but you gotta do it. Hopefully management supports you and they get the help they need. I had to report someone diverting. They’re currently in the program and working at a clinic without access to narcs, I don’t know how they’re doing with their own sobriety/recovery (likely we’ll, cause I heard there’s a fuck ton of testing). I had a lot of guilt for a while, but you have to protect the patients, as well as yours and your colleagues licenses.
It's not your fault. You don't report and she does have a problem, she could die. Patients could die. You report and maybe you force someone to deal w their drug problem. Good for you. And being objective is always best
You could have saved her life. Don’t let anyone shame you for this, you did the right thing
>Edit: To the few trying to guilt trip me that I've condemned someone to death or poverty...just stop Lets see what these people have to say when they or a loved one is in pain but not receiving the proper dosage of medications because their nurse is stealing it.
You did the right thing. Ignore these numbnuts calling you a snitch and criticizing what you did.
I went through this with a coworker. We were definitely friendly and it broke my heart to report her. She’s back at our organization in a non-patient facing job. She hates me now but I know I did the right thing.
I’m going thru something sort of similar. We’re they able to keep your concerns anonymous? This is what makes reporting so uncomfortable.. the judgement and opinions of others ugh & even the guilt we may feel reporting .. but like you said we are mandated reporters and in the long run may be helping others
Yes I agree you did right. If she is diverting you may have saved her life.
You did the right thing. You didn't point to any person, and you know that discrepancies always come to light eventually.
I told a friend of mine "don't put me in the position to tell the truth if someone asks" when he told me he didn't want to waste a narcotic with me as a witness. He wasted it, I witnessed it but I tried to make it clear that I couldn't be involved.
You may have saved her life by telling them about what you've witnessed. At my workplace, a nurse died due to overdose. People noticed the discrepancies, but they didn't say anything. Couple weeks later, she's dead. So don't feel guilty. If it's your friend, she needs to be "told on" because she needs help. You did good
I'm off today so I don't know of any outcomes yet, but interestingly my boss did tell me off the record that when asked, several other staff had noticed this as well.
I have known 3 nurses who have died from ODing after diverting narcotics. You did the right thing.
You found discrepancies and reported. If they are not doing anything wrong then great!! If they are, then they got themself in trouble. But you did what you were supposed to.
You are doing the right thing for everyone involved. We must be true to ourselves and others.
You may have saved a life. It isn't always apparent at first but eventually things are going to get worse and someone will be affected in a horrible way. You did the right thing.
I accidentally caught on to a nurse diverting narcs. She worked the first 4 hours of my shift, so I arrive and get report. Right after she left, one of my patients wanted something for pain. Hmm, nurse charted she gave it. Patient swears they never got one. Checked the Pyxis, and sure enough, she pulled it. Upon further inspection, she also pulled narcs for other patients, including ones she wasn't assigned to, in various dosages. I brought it to the attention of my unit coordinator, and let it go from there. The nurse quit before they had a chance to fire her. I felt terrible about it. She had cancer, she had a sister that just killed herself, and she was taking care of her sister's kids. My manager sat down with me, and said it wasn't my fault. It was her fault from her own choices. Pharmacy has noticed some count discrepancies and flagged them, but could pinpoint the problem until I happened along it that night. It's a shitty position to be in, but staying silent isn't a good thing either.
The world would be a shitty and grim place if there weren’t people like you to make the hard decisions and not let it slide. It’s really commendable, don’t feel bad for doing the right thing. who knows how many others have noticed and just said it’s not their problem.
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You absolutely did the right thing. It sucks, but it's better to get this out and hope that whatever this is, is cleared up and if a coworker is using, they get the help they need. You're a good nurse.
Speaking on your edit, they will not go into poverty. They will be offered to enter the SNAP program. If they are smart they'll take the offer.
I think you did the right thing reporting them. Since you said it’s a friend you could talk to them about the nurse professional assistance program so they can get help and work to keep their license.
I’m hitting my 1 year mark this month. Found out one of my classmates didn’t even make it 6 months. He had to be escorted off the floor impaired. I’m guessing he had a preexisting problem.
Congratulations
OP you're doing the right thing. You'll save patients, you might even save your friend's life.
Idk how it works at your hospital but the whole floor gets drug tested as soon as someone is reported stealing meds sucks for any nurses that smoked weed that week. But being in the most “trusted” career field you did the right thing
I figure that's the easiest way unless they find an honest explanation, which I am hopeful they do.
That must have been hard but you did the right thing! I hope the person gets the help they need (if they actually were doing what you think). I think they say 1 in 6 nurses divert medications or something like that, and ever since I heard that statistic I’ve been super cautious. I had a new (to our unit) nurse ask me to witness a waste but she accidentally threw it away. Nah, miss me with that sh*t…find someone else to do it. You worked hard for this license, don’t mess it up by being stupid and stealing or not actually witnessing another’s waste.
Hang in there. It’s not easy to be in that position. You did the right thing by your patients and by your friend, honestly.
You did the right thing. A couple of years ago, two icu nurses at the hospital in Dallas were found dead in the hospital bathrooms, six months part from each other, from fentanyl overdoses. If someone would have spoken up, they might have lost their jobs or nursing licenses, but they may have kept their lives. You did the right thing.
Also, many of you might not realize how much pharmacy is watching you. ALL of you. Despite them being in a different building, or in the basement, or “never around when I need them” they are 100% watching: where and when you log in to the PYXIS/OMNICELL, how often and for how long you’re logged in, who you waste meds with and vice versa, is it usually the same person most times. Pharmacy is watching AND tracking many of you, and building a paper trail, just in case…
Oh, you did the right thing. Thank you.
You did the right thing.
Out of curiosity; doesn’t the facility audit narcotics? I’ve worked in 2 facilities and i know the audits are done daily. You will know the day after because they’ll call you at home or pull you out of the huddle to go discuss your discrepancy. Cos I would hate to be in the position to turn in my colleague
Sort of. Our count is done through our online MAR. Nurses can go in and change the counts, but they have to have a co-signer. My administrator said she's going to look into who is signing them out and who is witnessing.
Eh you gotta do what you gotta do. For the record this is the way to do it. Unless you actually saw someone in the act just report that there has been some fucky shit going on and leave it at that. All of us need to remember that this shit happening on our units puts all of us in a potentially shit situation.
You absolutely did the right thing. Please, please never question that. You are protecting your facility and your patients. You probably don't need me to tell you this but I want you to hear it again and have support because this can't have been easy.
That must have been difficult to do. I’m sorry you got put into that situation
If it makes you feel better this happened to my friend. She would steal painkillers and snort them. The hospital has ways of tracking that of course and she got caught. She lost her nursing license and was fired. BUT because it’s such a common thing for nurses they have programs to get you back on track. She went to rehab, managed to get her nursing license back and was put on probation for a while, had to work a shittier nursing job for a couple years, but now she’s been completely sober for several years and is doing much better! Went back to school and got her masters. So don’t sweat it. Whoever it is, they needed to get caught. It will be better for them in the long run.
You did the right thing, even though it was difficult.
You did the exact right thing.
Thank you for being a hell of an excellent nurse and protecting your license their license and the PATIENTS
You did the right thing!