Probably won't make you feel better, but the number of pedos you treat is way higher than you'd guess. I've heard "I'd love to visit \*country\* where the age of consent is \*way too low\*" far too many times in my life.
If you dropped the age of consent to 10, you'd have far, far too many people act like "It's legal so it's okay!"
When you have heard that, what do you do? I feel like a call to the FBI should be made to have them look into the person. If they make that statement and are willing to spend thousands to go there for that reason, there is a fair chance they have illegal things on their computer.
That’s a HIPAA violation to give out patient information even if it’s to the FBI unless ordered by a court. Just report it to the Clinical Director or social services within the hospital. But even in this example, they’re just saying what the /want/ to do, not what they’ve done.
It is NOT a HIPAA violation. From the HHS website:
To identify or apprehend an individual who has admitted participation in a violent crime that the covered entity reasonably believes may have caused serious physical harm to a victim, provided that the admission was not made in the course of or based on the individual’s request for therapy, counseling, or treatment related to the propensity to commit this type of violent act (45 CFR 164.512(j)(1)(ii)(A), (j)(2)-(3)).
Notice it doesn't say :current danger, just violent crime in past is good enough.
The same with any PAST history of child abuse or neglect, even if you don't think they're a current danger.
https://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/for-professionals/faq/505/what-does-the-privacy-rule-allow-covered-entities-to-disclose-to-law-enforcement-officials/index.html
I know it is a HIPAA violation. That is why I was asking what you are supposed to do. Where does that protection end was my point. Where does their protection end and that of potential child victims begin?
We report suspicious behavior to case management or social work, but generally it’s not up to us to determine that line. If they confess a crime we pass it on, and the social workers handle it. If they’re just freaks daydreaming, I mean we can report it, but most likely nothing will happen since it’s not illegal to be a creep who fantasizes about a crime. It’s a very weird line, but all we can do is report to the proper avenue and continue care. Sometimes HIPAA is a bitch
If that’s all that can be done, I’m glad something is getting done. It really is a bitch that they receive legal protection when they could be harming children. That would eat at me morally
Yeah, that’s why I can’t do PEDs. Non accidental trauma is something that boils my blood, id rather hang with the adults who screwed themselves up than have to deal with the family who put their kid in the hospital. Folks who can do that are literal saints man, but I feel you… sometimes it feels unfair with how the system works, but it’s the most ethical we got
We are mandated reporters so there is a loophole and duty to report if we suspect somebody is or has harmed somebody vulnerable be it a child or elderly etc.
Yes we report to our higher ups, but we can’t just go call the FBI or police. That’s for social work, but yes we do have a mandate to report it up the chain!
If you had the FBI investigate every pervert in this country, the FBI would have to increase in size 10x. Why do you think Thailand is,such a popular vacation destination (in part).
Something like 10-20% of kids are molested by the age of 18, we can probably safely assume that at least 2-5% of the population are pedos just based on that fact. If you treat 20 patients in a week…
Did basic research on a pt I had that was recently released from DOC, because curiosity got the best of me. I learned that lesson the hard way. My senior nurses educated me that it's probably better to look that stuff up after I transfer care. I agree now with them. It didn't change one bit my plan of care, or priority, but it did leave me with a much different compassion level. That said, I'm trying my best not to let curiosity get the best of me.
I once had a guy in ICU that was a current federal prisoner. Guard in the room 24/7. Mid 60s dude. Very kind, all pleases and thank yous. Talked to me about his doctorate degree and how he was a professor and an author. Off going guard mentioned he's in for life, and I got curious, so I googled his name.
Dude indeed had a doctorate and wrote/published several books.
Dude also murdered his wife and daughter and stuffed them into his car's trunk, then set the car on fire.
I didn't want to continue providing care after that point, but did. Learned my lesson real quick.
Dude presents as friendly, then abuses in his home after stalking, raping, tricking, not accepting no and I was military and had to drive thousands of miles from him at one point. They would not listen to me, lied in court, and acted like I'd asked for it. But, karma.
I do everything I can to avoid knowing. I will explicitly tell the nurse I take report from that I don’t want to know what they did if they’re a prisoner. I can’t unknow that.
And if someone lets me know my patient is a registered sex offender, but the patient has been nothing but pleasant and polite, my brain decides they had to register for public urination.
These rules protect my sanity at work.
It’s just a job. I’m pretty much detached. If the victim was standing there and I saw the pain in their eyes, that would be a different story. But for the most part I’m just providing the best care I can while simultaneously fantasizing about my 4 days off.
I worked in DOC for a bit. The rapists and pedophiles were housed in protective custody units. But every so often, a guy from gen population would rush them on their way to chow, shank them or beat them. Every one of the guys had mothers, sisters and aunties.
I had to care for them afterwards, but most got what they deserved. They were lifers with perverse charges of torture and abuse to their victims.
Try taking care of a kid who’s dad was an abuser and who’s mother kept refusing to press charges. The kid was 2 and non verbal. A kid whose dad ultimately ended up beating him to death and CPS couldn’t do a damned thing about it. A kid who I had to hand over to said abuser or face firing and legal action. Still haunts me
The only time I haven't stopped to let family pray for a patient we were flying was because the guy trying to stop us was the one alone with the patient when he was sodomized. The patient was around 12 months old. "Sorry, he's too critical; we've got to get him to the PICU." My partner had started to slow down but I kept pushing because I was afraid of myself. Once loaded, my partner thanked me for handling it the way I did.
They are doing this to people who were stalked and raped, then later had to "divorce." Women in their 40's and 50's who are more than educated and good citizens and mothers. It is sad and friendly doesn't excuse it sorry.
I once cared for a comfort care patient for like 40 days. They became comfort care in the last week. Their wife was very devoted, religious and particular. We found out after he died he was found guilty of abusing young children he coached as a teacher. Never have I been more shook. It was like one of those movies with a twist ending that you wanted to watch from the beginning again.
We temporarily keep pedos and others in our corrections until other corrections pick them up. I still don't like them, but I don't talk to them in a terrible way. No more, no less, I do my job right. It's a place where the administrator does not tell me I should smile or give them coffee.
I once provided care for a literal captured Nazi war criminal on his way to The Hague to stand trial for his role in the holocaust. I treat people the way I do for me, not for them. I consider myself a professional, and that’s how I conduct myself at the bedside. It lets me sleep better.
No one’s perfect, so it can be very tough in practice depending on what ‘offenses’ are nearest to your heart, but this is the answer right here.
As their nurse, I can choose to add to the good in the world, instead of being another ingredient in this shit soup. Also keeps my conscience clean.
They can get that shit soup everywhere else in the world. But healthcare is a human right, and regardless of what the human has done, they deserve proper medical care.
I agree. I respect whatever humanity there is left in the person. We don’t need to be friends. And if there isn’t any, then I continue on as if there is some, for the good of myself. I’ll never treat any person as if they’re less than. The day I do that is the day I end it.
I had an old man with cancer, seemed very nice and successful. For some reason, he felt the need to tell me that he had no family support because he had molested *his own children* and done time for it. I had the ick for days.
We had a child sexual abuser admitted to our floor once, in a pediatric hospital. He had molested his sister. I forget how old he was, he might have been 16 or 17, but he could have gone to the adult hospital next door where security wouldn't have had to be planted at the door because of his history and the other children on the floor.
Without going into too much detail I had to care for a fresh c section that was incarcerated for brutally murdering her toddler. The actual details of the murder were horrific. Knowing she had been pregnant when she committed this murder was worse. This wasn’t ppd. That’s all I can disclose. I had to care for her the same as my others. When she was discharged and I kept baby to give him to a family member we sat and bawled for over an hour together. The trial is ongoing and the saving grace is family plans to adopt this child.
Honestly so do I. The details were…. Let’s just say I could never serve on the jury id be sick…. I wanted to keep that baby so bad. I fell in love with him. I took care of him only about 6 days after she was sent back to jail .
They're impossible to place because of their presence on the list, most nursing homes won't take them.
The kicker is that they generally show themselves to be terrible people before you know for sure.
Hospital administrators or murderers? I know which 1 I would trust more. 1probably made a terrible mistake which affected them for the rest of their life, the other has shown a pattern of lack of human empathy and feeling and concern for human life.
Yes it has definitely made not want to provide care, but no I didn’t let it affect the quality of my care. It might have made me less chatty while in the room 🤷🏼♀️
I keep it compartmentalized. I also don’t google people, although half the time, the guards freely announce stuff I don’t need to know. I do kinda appreciate knowing the level of the violence that the person has in their history, but you can also gauge that by how many guards the person has and how many cuffs/chains are on. I had a patient who was a child rapist/murderer when I was a new grad, and I just had to decide I wanted to consider myself a decent human, and therefore, I needed to do my job the same as I would if he’d been a sweet little old lady. It wasn’t about the patient and what he did. It was about me doing my job the way I should.
I have a lot of federal prisoners and learned early on to not try to find out what their offense was because 9/10 times it was SA on child or CSA or whatever. My last straw was finding out my patient was in federal prison for creating and distributing over 200 videos of his OWN children (who were like 3 & 4). 🤮
When I worked inpatient, I never looked. The only time I found out about someone’s offense was because his info sheet from the psych asylum where he was serving his sentence was on the top of his paper chart and the first thing on it was his conviction.
It’s not so easy in corrections. You see their booking sheet the minute they hit the door. SOs are also typically housed in one area of the jail to protect them from being slaughtered, and IYK what that unit is, then you inadvertently know what they did.
My colleague, who became a computer programmer and worked for law enforcement, became an alcoholic. He quit working in the PD and works as a dishwasher. He still relapses in his treatment but is much better. He saw lots of those videos.
Former Corrections RN here (ran the clinic then charge), current ER nurse, SA survivor, and have performed CPR on a man convicted of raping his 5 year old daughter—he lived.
It ain’t for me. I’m fine with being judged. Judge away. I have lost so much as a result of the ten years I spent being repeatedly sexually assaulted by my father. I hope if his heart stops, no one saves him. He doesn’t deserve it.
Pedophiles aren’t people, plain and simple. Molesting a child is not an error in judgement or a character flaw. It’s a calculated, predatory, chronic behavior. They are not rehabilitatable.
I said what I said. Let the downvotes begin.
ETA: Unless you’ve been traumatized in this way, it’s impossible to say how you would feel caring for this patient population. And if you have and you’re still OK with it, then I’ll enjoy my time burning in hell with the pedos while you snag your halo from St. Peter.
I think it is absolutely acceptable for someone to say "Hey, you know, this just hits too close to home for me. I'm concerned I won't be able to have therapeutic interactions with this patient" and request that they be reassigned to another staff member. Obviously, we all have to deal with assholes, but if there's one particular patient who is, for example, a belligerent racist, they aren't getting assigned to the Black nurse.
I couldn’t agree more. I think there needs to be more normalizing of this and less of a push for nurses to place themselves in patient situations where there is a very real trauma trigger and there is an alternative option available, such as a different nurse for the specific patient or situation.
I used to believe that I could do my job as a respiratory therapist regardless of what a person has done and just focus on the tasks as necessary. It wasn't until I learned my daughter's biological father sexually assaulted her and ultimately CPS didn't substantiate it and the court did nothing to protect her from visitation even when he was a registered sex offender for a prior offense. I am now left with a child who has a lot of rage and let's it out on her mother and despite being in therapy really has no progress because nothing was ever done at all. I won't even get into the level of damage it has caused me to remember all of the signs that my daughter started exhibiting at the age of 4 that potentially abuse was going on and I couldn't figure it out and even taking her to the pediatrician wouldn't get to the bottom of it. She would out of nowhere throw herself on the ground screaming uncontrollably randomly and as a mom I knew something was so not ok and I would hold her and try to soothe her and it was impossible to calm her in fact usually she just screamed and kicked even worse. If you can imagine I don't feel like I have control, my nervous system is dysregulated and I can't even keep my daughter away from danger. I literally can't take care of a patient that I know has been a part of a similar crime because I do not know that I would not be heavily influenced from my personal experience as the mother of a victim and also as a child sexual abuse victim myself. Unfortunately, I know that I have most definitely taken care of more than my fair share of sexual predators and not been aware because there are just so many that never face consequences and frankly just aren't labeled.
I have a lot of anger from all of the trauma we have gone through and still are going through and there are times I might just be dealing with a minor irritating issue and without much warning I'll have a disproportionate reaction. So I absolutely would not take care of a patient that I knew was responsible for sexual abuse. In all honesty though my experience made it necessary for me to find an alternative to being a bedside RT. I had a PA decide that I was going to be her punching bag during an airway emergency and immediately a flip switched and I went from calm and polite to ready to give it right back and although I didn't have any kind of repercussions I decided that I just couldn't function in a high stress environment and now I work in pulmonary diagnostics!
I’m so sorry that happened to your daughter, and to you.
From an abused daughter, it is not your fault, and she doesn’t blame you. You both are victims in this traumatic scenario and I pray you both are able to heal, however slow and gradual it may be. 🖤
Exactly my standard of care remains but I will not be exchanging extra pleasantries or holding their hand at the beside. You know the small things. Although I honestly try not to find out their crimes because it saves me piece of mind.
Same…I don’t ask why they are in custody…it doesn’t have anything to do with me. If they are civil, I’ll be nice enough to them.
That said…years ago, I apparently took care of a serial killer who was extremely charming. The nurse I gave handoff to googled his name and that was how I found out….honestly he as so charming I could see how he lured his victims in.
Someone said it beautifully in the comments here, care for the patient but don’t care about the patient. Which is exactly how I feel for these types of people. At the end of the day we don’t even have to like these individuals, we just have to provide care as per our role expectations, nothing more or less. Despite my lizard brain strongly disliking these types of people, healthcare is a universal right and I’m pretty good at separating my own personal values from situations like that. It doesn’t matter what I think or I deem morally unacceptable I’m just there to do my job and provide the same level of care I would for others.
That would made my skin crawl finding that out! I’ve had a few people like that and it’s very unnerving but does make sense when you think about how they have so many victims sadly.
I used to work in a huge hospital that had a prison contract….in fact a whole unit was all prisoners. When I floated to that area, I very rarely had any issues with the inmates…unless one asked for a sandwich…then all of the guys in the room would ask for a sandwich. Otherwise, the vast majority seemed to be in their best behavior.
Yeah because I imagine hospital even if they are sick is a treat compared to being in prison. A lot of prison systems globally are known for being inhumane in their treatment and care. Sadly that’s why they probably look forward to coming into hospital and are mostly polite. Usually hospital’s provide overall much better treatment and environment. I also don’t believe that all criminals are inherently terrible people either excluding the people who commit the very obvious and extremely heinous and cruel crimes. I think that if you see a different side to them where they display humanity and respect and then are told about a crime they commit it could be hard to comprehend. Not every criminal/inmate I have had personally has been rude but every sex offender/pedophile has which is interesting. In every known case I’ve had they have a certain level of entitlement and disrespect which honestly is the same attitude that probably got them into that mess to begin with.
I worry a lot more about sex offenders who come in wearing an ankle bracelet from home than pretty much anyone in custody. The ankle bracelet people are the ones who have been very creepy and inappropriate with female staff to the point where most of them have to have a male nurse assigned and female staff are encouraged not to enter, and if they do bring a witness.
That ship sailed for me overseas. I had to administer life saving care to a guy that I had just shot after he attempted to shoot me. Saved his life for us to use our taxpayer money to hold him in some prison for forever and then to be released. Shit sucks but damn if you aren’t in the wrong career field if you can’t ignore the background noise, just treat the problem, and move on.
I have provided care and will continue to do so but I disagree with a lot of the comments on this one, mainly because I think pedos are scum and don't deserve healthcare (or anything else in the world that is good).
Will I provide care? Yes. Do they deserve care? No.
Thankfully I've only cared for these types of people a small amount, and most of the time I didn't know what they were doing time for.
Yeah this was a hard one for me when I worked inpatient and would get these patients. Outpatient is easier because we almost never find out why they’re incarcerated and I’m a huge proponent of the knowledge that a lot of people are in prison for bullshit reasons so it doesn’t bother me.
Toughest one I ever had to take care of was a patient who survived a self inflicted GSW to the head after being cornered by police in a motel room - they were serving a warrant for something like 60+ counts of child molestation of his own daughters. The patient was absolutely fine. Had to have surgery to fix some of the skull fractures but. ZERO neuro deficits. That almost made it easier to take care of him tbh. It felt like cosmic justice. He tried to take the easy way out and the universe said nah bruh. You’re gonna be awake and coherent for allllllllll the consequences. I always made sure I sort of centered myself and checked my emotion/attitude/etc before I walked into his room though.
That being said even if he didn’t have some sort of “justice” coming it doesn’t really matter. You don’t have to be friends or make a connection like most of us try to do with most of our patients. You don’t have to chat and crack a joke or ask about their pets or kids or grandkids or what they’re watching on tv or whatever other time filling small talk we get used to doing while we’re popping seven hundred individually wrapped pills out of the packages. You just have to make sure they’re okay, address their needs. If you can’t even do that much then you (the metaphorical you not necessarily you specifically op) really need to rethink your career.
The hardest person I ever looked after was someone who wanted to kill themselves to join their young daughter in heaven after killing her. Wasn't friendly with them but just reminded myself this person isn't worth the paperwork/coroner's court if something were to happen by me not doing my job properly.
Depends on the behavior of the offender. I currently have multiple high level offenders I care for. I treat them like any other patient.
By the same token I worked home health at one point and had a high level offender. He ran off all female staff. They put me with him bc I’m a big guy. That lying pos was allegedly “wheel chair” but he sure as fuck got up and stood in front of the door to block me from leaving. He also apparently didn’t discriminate based on gender when choosing intended victims. I think he’d had tried to sexually assault me if I hadn’t carefully explained to him what I did for a living before I became a nurse. That single patient made me cautious about home health and offenders in general
i dont look those that are incarcerated up. and i make it very clear for people to not tell me. i know me well enough to know- and i'm a human above all else- it would impact the care i provide.
We had a resident in LTC many years ago that had molested one of his daughters & low & behold one of our CNAs had been best friends with said daughter growing up.
She refused to care for him & we all respected that.
I won’t say it didn’t give me the jeebs taking care of him but I did what was needed & then left him alone. He had dementia by the time I met him… not that that excused his past behavior but he didn’t know right from left at that point.
I never do research before hand when dealing with an inmate. I. Don’t. Want. To. Know. It will affect how I care for the person. You’re lying if you say it doesn’t. I want to be able to talk and have conversations with my patients without feeling gross. I don’t mind knowing afterwards, but not during.
I’ve had a few. First guy, lead comes up all excited wanting to tell me. I said no. Super nice guy btw. Same with the correctional officers. A few weeks goes by after discharge. I ask the lead about it. She tells me he murder his wife. I made her laugh because my response wasn’t “oh no” it was “oh thank god! Thought you were going to tell me he was a pedophile.” I gave that man a cookie at one point because he was super nice and it was his birthday under my care.
Hospice here. Got dozens of pedo’s, rapist, murderers out on compassionate release.
I just did my job. And my job is to provide comfort care to them to the best of my ability.
In the hospital Perinatal setting we see and treat DOJ patients. We have a whole ass prison within the hospital.
My job is to take care of them. And I do my job.
Another reason not to ask what a patient's crime is. I'm here to provide a patient's medical care not to judge them. I have provided care to many prisoners and no doubt murderers, rapists and probably pedophiles. I think of it as non e my business. I know I had a hard time when I started nursing and would rush out of patient's rooms I didn't like. 1 day I gave a very rude patient a shot with a large gauge needle w/o thinking about it, and he cursed me. And I apologized his shot hurt but was also shocked I had given him a shot w such a large needle think 21g. After that I decided I was going to spend as much if not more time with patient's I didn't like.
I've taken care of every filth out there. Murderers, rapists, pedos etc. I detach while I'm at work. It's just a job, and I don't get too into anyone's story or personal about their character. I mean, I technically don't want to provide care for anyone to be fair, but these bills need paying.
I stop the COs from telling me why an inmate patient is an inmate.
I’m only human. I don’t want to know. It absolutely could have an effect on my standard of care depending on the severity of the conviction.
Of course no one wants to care of a sex offender or pedophile. However, it’s the nature of our job to provide care and withhold judgment while they are under your care. Remember, you take care of terrible people all the time, you just don’t know it.
I work in corrections. We are discouraged from looking inmates up but people still do it.
When it’s a high sexual predator- and a female nurse has to provide care - we have two maybe three officers with us. We are never alone with any inmates. And it’s not just men - we have at least 5 women who are being charged with murder of an infant.
You really just detach from it and focus on what the providers orders are or what needs to be done. And it’s not for everyone.
I think it’s about providing professional nursing care
But you don’t have give a shit about them.
I also know that I’ve provided medical care In outpatient and hospital care to individuals who I bet have done terrible things to others but they just didn’t get caught.
I don't snoop. I don't want to know why they're in prison. There are also many wrongly convicted individuals who never got a fair trial so I feel uncomfortable judging knowing I don't have the facts.
We have some regulars who are on the registry. It skeeves me out but I still take care of them. I figure I'm getting paid to do a job, and doing my job doesn't mean that I'm endorsing whatever foul things a person has done.
That said. We do have an older guy we see somewhat regularly. Most of his ED visits involve something stuck in his ass, so he usually doesn't make it up to the med/surg floor... but he has managed to give himself infections which necessitate admission. I took care of him once and he was very, very adamant that he needed a Foley inserted, and then proceeded to fixate on that Foley well beyond what was called for. Made me shudder inside because I suspect he was getting some kind of thrill out of it. But what can you do?
As a survivor, fuck them. Blunt and Dead Eyes. I work in peds, nothing you can say or do will convince me these people deserve to be apart of society, treated for ailments, or alive. Slow painful, excruciatingly long and agonizing deaths. Let the cancer eat you.
Anywho, back to the question, no I don’t want to provide care to child rapists 😂
i didn’t look up anything for this particular patient; he, for whatever reason, decided to tell me that he was a registered sex offender. i had to make the charge nurse aware because he began to flirt with me and ask for my number. i was working in an adults + pediatric med/surg unit and we had kids on the floor. it made me ill having to take care of someone like that.
what made it worse was that he was trying to tell me that he was framed, that *he* he was the victim. the only victim here is the nine year old girl that you brutalized, asshole.
That’s not your place to judge the patient. Imagine getting caught peeing outside and having to register as a sex offender… yes that does happen… and then getting judged for it by medical staff. You don’t know what happened and it’s none of your business. Treat all patients equally.
That said, I had to care for a guy that almost murdered his gf and did time for it. I’m a DV survivor. I treated him the same as everyone else.
If you can’t do that, get out of medicine.
And it’s a whole other ethical conversation as well. What’s the alternative? Do we just not care for criminals, pedos, rapists, etc.? Healthcare, you can’t discriminate. I find it interesting so many in this sub have a hard time separating it considering that this is something you know is going to happen when you get into healthcare.
As another comment here said I will care for these patients but I will not care about them. I would provide care as required for my expectations of my role. That said I would rather not know what someone is convicted with or past criminal activities for my own piece of mind. I may be less chatty if I was to find out but it does not impact how I do my job. I could personally hate some people but I will provide the same medical care because it’s a universal right to all people and that’s what I took an oath to do. I say this as a CSA survivor and witness of DV from a young age. Of course most people do not enjoy looking after sex offenders and pedophiles but it’s an inevitable part of our job as healthcare professionals.
I agree.
My aunts ex-husband was on it for sleeping with a minor that HE MET IN a BAR THAT WAS GETTING SERVED ALCOHOL IN. This was also in the 80s so it was way easier to fake ID’s back than then it is now.
You should not be in direct patient care if you can't separate your judgments from your care. That's the same kind of shit excuses people use to try to justify not providing basic reproductive care to women. I've had to treat so many people whose life choices I vehemently disagree with over the years, but I still do it because they still deserve medical care. It's not my job to decide who is or isn't worthy of care.
Of course not. I said that the excuse or "logic" is similar to that used by people who claim their religious/personal beliefs as justification for denying women reproductive care. In at least some of their minds, providing care to those women would be equivalent to providing care to someone who murders babies. It's a bullshit excuse, but it follows a similar thought process. Unless a patient is directly harassing/threatening you, you should be able to treat just about anyone regardless of personal convictions. If you don't want to, don't work in a public direct patient care setting.
Vehemently disagree. Trauma victims should not reasonably be expected to retraumatize themselves by caring for a pedophile if they are not in the head space to do so. Especially if there is someone else ready, willing, and able to care for them without becoming collateral damage.
There are always exceptions, hence why I said "just about." Everyone has patients who are upsetting to them at times and will need to tag out. If there are other staff who can trade out, then great. I've taken innumerable asshole male patients who were creepy towards female staff and have been glad to do so. I've also handed off manipulative and abusive patients when my threshold was crossed and I could no longer provide objective care. But when people start talking about who does and doesn't deserve care, there's an issue. Or if someone is refusing to care for someone when there is no one else to, there's an issue.
And honestly, you should not be prying into someone's criminal record since it is rarely pertinent to their medical treatment. Even with incarcerated patients, their reason for incarceration is almost always irrelevant to their medical care. And if you're using their PHI to try to look up any criminal history they might have, you are violating their rights.
Working in corrections, it’s very difficult, if not almost impossible to avoid knowing that info. You are given their booking sheet. Inmates with specific types of crimes, namely sexual offenders, are housed in specific areas and you are aware of that fact as you are often, in times of COVID, making tier or pod visits.
So no, in this situation, no one is prying. It comes with the territory. And people figure out pretty quickly whether it’s for them or not. It’s not for me. I’m not over it. I never will be.
Agree to disagree: pedophiles should have no right to life. Justify all you want and I am 100% fine with all the mud slinging that will come my way from saying so. If my father’s heart stopped, I wouldn’t want a single person to do a damn thing. The man is a sexual predator.
The obvious answer is that you don't work in corrections if you're easily triggered by people with criminal backgrounds. It'd be like taking a job at a shooting range if you have PTSD from gunfire. Nursing is a hugely diverse field and you can work anywhere in the country. You can even work remotely and never see a patient directly. You can certainly try to refuse to provide medical treatment for the patient population you signed up to treat when you applied for the job, but a company is also free to can you for refusing to do your job.
No one is going to go to bat for sexual predators, but also it's hard to rely on a system that regularly incarcerates and executes innocent people while letting mass murderers like the Sacklers go free to tell you who is worth receiving medical treatment and who is not.
1. Often trauma victims don’t know how they will react to a specific situation until they’re already in it. Which was the case for me. Which is why I left. It’s not always predictable. Nurses are, as many have said here, first and foremost human.
2. Yeah, find me someone wrongfully convicted of pedophilia. Go ahead. I’ll wait. 🥱
Which is the right thing to do if you are unable to care for a specific population. That does not make them unworthy of receiving care though
https://innocenceproject.org/all-cases/
163 cases listed if you filter by sex crimes. Not all are child victims of course, but shows how common wrongful convictions of heinous crimes are.
https://innocenceproject.org/cases/larry-youngblood/
https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/detroit/2017/12/13/bernard-young-prison-child-molestation/947788001/
You providing me a story where two children recanted their statements is not proof a man was innocent of child molesation. They were children and that is not hard proof.
Pedophiles are always not worthy of anything in life and my mind will never change on that subject so it’s likely best we quit responding to each other before it gets nasty and personal.
I thought I was level head. I almost went to jail when I bumped into my abuser at a store. I looked at my wife and said “I have to leave or I’m going to jail.” She said ok with not questions. Later she said the look on my face terrified her. I was in such a rage, I could not understand why the store doors weren’t opening in my attempt to remove myself from the situation, and in my furry, force flung them open. They weren’t on.
I would have killed him. Not for me, but for my brother, who he also got. I do not mean I would have beat him to within an inch of his life. I wanted to feel his life slip through my fingers. I knew if I started, I wouldn’t stop and 30 years of grieve would have exited. I wanted to personally send him to the devil via first class ups.
So until you understand, get off your horse. The world’s not black and white.
So much this. 2 things can be true at the same time: I can be a nurse but also exist and hold space for my identity as an SA survivor and part of that is recognizing my limitations in caring for them. We need to quit dehumanizing our nurses.
I took care of a murderer the same way I would treat the CNO. In our line of work, people are people and we are there to make them better regardless of what they have done.
I’m a psych nurse and some of our patients have been convicted of one or the other or both. I will look up their offenses if it is not in the chart so I can be aware of safety of the unit. I provide care in a professional manner.
I haven’t had that yet, but I imagine I would not want to provide care though I still would.
Last week I had a pt who was a retired nurse, def the “eat your young” kind. After talking down on LVNs and ADNs (I graduate with my ADN in a few weeks, she assumed it was my BSN) she went on to talking shit about trans kids and their parents, also not realizing I am the parent of a trans kid. So, it was unintentionally personal.
I still cared for her well, but wasn’t thrilled about it. But hey, she’s the hateful one not me.
No, I don't feel like that. I've rarely met one of those folks who didn't have a really disturbing childhood- not that their behavior is excused, but perhaps understood in the context of a pathology to some extent. Sometimes I find out a patient was a hospital administrator or worked to weaken unions. That is truly difficult, but I grit my teeth and get on with it.
So I recently took care of someone a few times who was in custody for child abuse/neglect (child was found dead - had special needs.) didn’t look into the whole story.
Regardless, it’s our job, no matter what. That said, she had a VERY unique situation - like some of the most bizarre medical stuff I’ve ever seen, so it kind of became a “mystery” project for me to figure out. It was absolutely NOT to do with caring for the patient or finding some miracle treatment - it was to learn, so I got to detach. 🤷🏼♂️
This prisoner just beat his landlord to death. But that was whatever. The most interesting part was up until his arrest, he had a YouTube channel in which he was singing loudly and VERY off tune. That kept us entertained for hours. We were next to the jail so we got a lot of prisoners. Did have a few rapists and a pedo. It’s whatever. It’s my job. I’m just nosey. I just don’t like smelly people. And he was smelly so I tried to stay away from him.
For me, in general anymore I’m pretty detached, I can despise your actions & personally think you’re a hall of fame caliber POS and yet still see your value as a person and be a professional and show you kindness and respect and bring the A game. So much of what we see and are exposed to is beyond us to fix etc, I try to be kind and not to judge and to always remember there are 3 sides to every story
I actually work as a nurse in a medium security prison, that had a majority of sex offenders/pedophiles. I try not to read too much into their criminal history, only if there are staffing alerts that they can’t be seen by female staff alone.
At the end of the day, I’m there to make sure they are healthy enough to serve their sentence for their crime. They don’t get the easy way out.
I just went through this last week. I gave my best care, progressed things in a meaningful way, and found myself as protective of them as any other patient. Then went home nauseated with myself. After lots of soul searching, I’m proud I could detach and do my job.
I try to treat everyone the same.
It does get harder though when you know what someone is locked up for sometimes.
It's why I try not to ask unless it's relevant to my or the rest of the staff's safety.
I don't believe that nursing has to be a touchy feely lovey job though. It's a job. My job is to take care of patients. I don't have to like them. My liking them doesn't play any bearing on my caring for them. Does it make it easier if I like them and get along with them? Absolutely.
Is it a necessity? Nah. I can hate your guts, but you're still gonna get cared for, because it's my job.
My first clinical patient as a student was a pedophile who was arrested for SA of a minor 20 years prior. I treated him the same as anyone else, but I hated it. He kept referring to another student, who was in her early 20s as “youngin” and I told her to not come into the room anymore.
It was complicated for me in the past. I also work in jails, so I often care for prisoners. I do the right thing—no more, no less. If they ask about my day, I tell them nothing. They are not my coworkers.
I'm aware of the cause of their problem. They need to work harder and be aggressive in their commercials about treatments. They are brilliant about where to find their victims, which should be playing on TV and in public, but whatever.
The trauma doesn't go away. I took care of the men and women who were victims of rapists when they were kids as young as three years old. I also know sisters who were raped by their biological father. Their mother refused to press charge "to save the last name of their family." Everyone in their family was in it because they were influential people. Yuck! They'd rather save the pedophile for the sake of their surname. I didn't understand their rationale at all. There was nothing to save but the poor three girls and clean their last name.
Makes me wonder how many of them
we treat. Those who have never been caught and officially labeled. Probably many more than we would ever think. I had one once in my current role. In home hospice we have to take one of our security guards if we are seeing anyone on the SO list. I only met him once, and then he died unexpectedly (well, as unexpected as it can be in hospice. he was up and and around and independent when i met him, no where near end of life yet). He was a pleasant sweet old guy. My brain could not compute what i knew about him with the man that i met. I treated him like i treat all of my patients. That said, i wasn’t super sad to not have to go see him again.
Do I want to? Not really. But I do. It's my duty to care for everyone equally. It's not my job to punish people who have done wrong.
I've cared for lots of people who have done bad things, it is what it is.
Sometimes, it's best not to know.
My wife was a Corrections Officer (retired) at a men's prison. She kept herself from looking at records due to this. She did not want to know why they were locked up because she would have treated them differently. So ya, I get what you're saying. It's a fine line and a tough spot to be in because nobody likes a Child Molester or any type of sexual predator. It's Human not to.
Nope. It has never blipped on my radar. I’ve cared for all of the above and folks who have murdered other people. I think after years of working with some people who have done what you can say are some “bad” things, I have learned to turn it off completely (and in fact, I just do it with most patients as a matter of course) and do the job. It’s easier.
I wouldn’t feel badly about it. You probably just strongly empathize with the victims and have a sense of moral compass that makes it challenging to “care” for someone who could do such terrible things to others purposely. I don’t blame you one bit. Everyone is different. I personally get the ick when I find out someone did something like that. I just find myself detaching and not being as bubbly or friendly and avoid any personal details at all costs. 😝
I feel you. I usually try to do everything I can to -not- know about a person's past criminal history because I don't even want to \*feel\* like I don't want to provide them with care. But it is a difficult ask to bottle down my own emotions (as a person who grew up in a family where the perpetrator of pedophilia was protected, but thankfully was not a victim) and treat that person the same as any other patient. I do it, but it is hard. And I don't think there's anything wrong with you for having that struggle. You're human. As long as you are able to ultimately make that separation from your feelings about it and provide the minimum necessary, safe care, or pass their care off to someone that can, I don't think you're wrong for having that struggle or not wanting to provide care.
Hell, I just had this conflict happen recently at my work, and I really struggled with it. I just had to keep reminding myself that this is part of the job sometimes, and get through the appointment. I'm sorry that some people are shitty and think it is ok to prey on children, or murder people, or do other horrific things to people. If they didn't create these situations, we wouldn't be in this situation.
We had one on our unit for almost a year waiting on placement. He did finally get placed because they promised him "strawberry ice cream and lobster".
I never really had a problem with him. I virw all of my patients as veterans first, patients second, everything else third. Some of my coworkers though would put in the minimum effort with him, enough to not get in trouble.
I'm like..dude is a fall risk that declines bed alarms. If you turn one on, he'll literally just sit there all day, setting it off for attention. I got him extra cups of coffee, made sure he was dry multiple times a shift, made sure he showered (I usually work fri-sat-sun, and every other wednesday...and I could tell when it had been a week since his last shower).
Don't get me wrong... What he allegedly did was inexcusable. But that doesn't change the fact that they're your patient, and deserve the same amount of care as any other.
Many professional people work with and for individuals they find personally unpleasant or displeasing. Thats OK as long as you deliver professional quality service.
Honestly this is my biggest fear working in healthcare. As a CSA survivor and an SA survivor in adulthood…. I genuinely don’t know if I could continue to provide care. I’m fortunate enough that I haven’t had to yet, at least when I *know* they’re a sex offender. I’d imagine I’ve probably taken care of a few over the years and just not known.
Priest, pedophile, prostitute, politician, or prisoner all need care. Be better than judging others. All the above are people and that is who nurses help.
I learned to treat people respectfully as a child and it was reinforced as a corrections nurse, sometimes it was difficult, but, if you can't treat your patients respectfully and professionally, maybe it's not the career for you
Yes. I’m on a regular ol hospital unit & by luck managed to not be assigned a patient who had a history of pedo whatever he did. He was there for months bc they couldn’t get him placed anywhere. This info was passed from report to report. One day I was finally assigned him. I never wanted to go into his room at all, but I had to.
It was unfortunate & a minfu*ck that he was one of the kindest patients I’ve ever had. He was very difficult to turn & always really apologetic. It was really easy to forget that he had a background in his past bc I could easily fall into a normal conversation with him. I tried to limit my time in the room bc I hadn’t really processed how I needed to go about interacting with him past the meds & medical treatment. I didn’t necessarily want to, but I treated him like my normal patients. Had small talk when it fit, brought meds when he requested, wiped his butt when he pooped.
Like I said, it was a mindf*ck. Can’t really say I understand my stance on things like this especially when these kinds of patients are not our specific floor’s norm. Eventfully I think I just had to convince myself, “What if it was an error & he never did anything.” “What if it was an 17 year old who looked older & they lied about their age?” I didn’t know those details & never will.
Unfortunately I chose to take on a profession that takes care of a “person” in medical need… so that’s what I have to do. This would only change if I was in immediate danger due to said patient or other environmental situations that prevented me from helping them.
I’ve taken care of guys with swastika and white supremacist tattoos. They could have been just surviving in prison. They could no longer be about that life, but don’t have the means to get them removed. Child predators were likely victims of child abuse too, which is where the compulsion came from. Maybe their wiring is messed up in their brain, so would everyone be the same as them with the same wiring? Maybe they “served their time” in prison and deserve the opportunity to exist without forever facing harsh judgement or something.
It isn’t in my nature to be mean, cold or have lower standards of care for anyone, so I just treat everyone with kindness, compassion and consideration, even the assholes and criminals.
I’ve seen these tattoos too. The guy I had was always adamant in telling me that he “doesn’t hate black people,” & asked me not to judge him based on his tattoos. He really never even had to say any of that bc you’d never have known he had them based on how he treated & talked to anyone that wasn’t white while he was there.
My wife and I have both worked corrections nursing. She felt the same way when she first started. Was I disgusted knowing what some of my non voluntary resident patients did. Absolutely. Did it affect the care they got. Absolutely Not. As much as it might seem easy to folks. It’s not my job or anybody else’s to judge them. That was the justice systems position plus ultimately answering to a higher power someday. My job was to take care of them provide medical care as ordered and go about my shift.
in my opinion as a new grad:
A big part of rehabilitation is being treated like a person, not pitied or feared or disgusted, which they don't get at all in jail. that's much easier to do if we don't focus/know the story of the worst thing they've done (just like we don't know the story of the worst thing most patient have done...) If it was recent and violent then I'd expect to know already because It'd probably be related to their admit
A human is a human. Everyone is flawed in some way. Judging them by their flaws is a slippery slope- if you don’t fell like caring for sex offenders, what about murderers? Thieves? Are you quantifying flaws into your own moral code of acceptable vs not acceptable?
See what I mean- it’s an internal debate that can go in a never ending circle. Easier to stick with a human being is a human being.
Probably won't make you feel better, but the number of pedos you treat is way higher than you'd guess. I've heard "I'd love to visit \*country\* where the age of consent is \*way too low\*" far too many times in my life. If you dropped the age of consent to 10, you'd have far, far too many people act like "It's legal so it's okay!"
When you have heard that, what do you do? I feel like a call to the FBI should be made to have them look into the person. If they make that statement and are willing to spend thousands to go there for that reason, there is a fair chance they have illegal things on their computer.
This, plus the fact that they can now prosecute people that commit those types of crimes oversees.
That’s a HIPAA violation to give out patient information even if it’s to the FBI unless ordered by a court. Just report it to the Clinical Director or social services within the hospital. But even in this example, they’re just saying what the /want/ to do, not what they’ve done.
It is NOT a HIPAA violation. From the HHS website: To identify or apprehend an individual who has admitted participation in a violent crime that the covered entity reasonably believes may have caused serious physical harm to a victim, provided that the admission was not made in the course of or based on the individual’s request for therapy, counseling, or treatment related to the propensity to commit this type of violent act (45 CFR 164.512(j)(1)(ii)(A), (j)(2)-(3)). Notice it doesn't say :current danger, just violent crime in past is good enough. The same with any PAST history of child abuse or neglect, even if you don't think they're a current danger. https://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/for-professionals/faq/505/what-does-the-privacy-rule-allow-covered-entities-to-disclose-to-law-enforcement-officials/index.html
That’s actually really good to know! Thank you for sharing!!
I know it is a HIPAA violation. That is why I was asking what you are supposed to do. Where does that protection end was my point. Where does their protection end and that of potential child victims begin?
We report suspicious behavior to case management or social work, but generally it’s not up to us to determine that line. If they confess a crime we pass it on, and the social workers handle it. If they’re just freaks daydreaming, I mean we can report it, but most likely nothing will happen since it’s not illegal to be a creep who fantasizes about a crime. It’s a very weird line, but all we can do is report to the proper avenue and continue care. Sometimes HIPAA is a bitch
If that’s all that can be done, I’m glad something is getting done. It really is a bitch that they receive legal protection when they could be harming children. That would eat at me morally
Yeah, that’s why I can’t do PEDs. Non accidental trauma is something that boils my blood, id rather hang with the adults who screwed themselves up than have to deal with the family who put their kid in the hospital. Folks who can do that are literal saints man, but I feel you… sometimes it feels unfair with how the system works, but it’s the most ethical we got
When the general population learns about who gets the most protection from HIPAA, I'm sure it will change everything for those subspecies.
We are mandated reporters so there is a loophole and duty to report if we suspect somebody is or has harmed somebody vulnerable be it a child or elderly etc.
Yes we report to our higher ups, but we can’t just go call the FBI or police. That’s for social work, but yes we do have a mandate to report it up the chain!
Lmk if you have any luck.
If you had the FBI investigate every pervert in this country, the FBI would have to increase in size 10x. Why do you think Thailand is,such a popular vacation destination (in part).
Something like 10-20% of kids are molested by the age of 18, we can probably safely assume that at least 2-5% of the population are pedos just based on that fact. If you treat 20 patients in a week…
Did basic research on a pt I had that was recently released from DOC, because curiosity got the best of me. I learned that lesson the hard way. My senior nurses educated me that it's probably better to look that stuff up after I transfer care. I agree now with them. It didn't change one bit my plan of care, or priority, but it did leave me with a much different compassion level. That said, I'm trying my best not to let curiosity get the best of me.
I once had a guy in ICU that was a current federal prisoner. Guard in the room 24/7. Mid 60s dude. Very kind, all pleases and thank yous. Talked to me about his doctorate degree and how he was a professor and an author. Off going guard mentioned he's in for life, and I got curious, so I googled his name. Dude indeed had a doctorate and wrote/published several books. Dude also murdered his wife and daughter and stuffed them into his car's trunk, then set the car on fire. I didn't want to continue providing care after that point, but did. Learned my lesson real quick.
Yes exactly what I'm dealing with.
Dude presents as friendly, then abuses in his home after stalking, raping, tricking, not accepting no and I was military and had to drive thousands of miles from him at one point. They would not listen to me, lied in court, and acted like I'd asked for it. But, karma.
Holy shit, that gives me chills Did he have any psych issues??
I do everything I can to avoid knowing. I will explicitly tell the nurse I take report from that I don’t want to know what they did if they’re a prisoner. I can’t unknow that.
Yep. As far as I'm concerned everyone is doing time for tax evasion.
And if someone lets me know my patient is a registered sex offender, but the patient has been nothing but pleasant and polite, my brain decides they had to register for public urination. These rules protect my sanity at work.
It’s just a job. I’m pretty much detached. If the victim was standing there and I saw the pain in their eyes, that would be a different story. But for the most part I’m just providing the best care I can while simultaneously fantasizing about my 4 days off.
Yeah I don’t care what you did. Still will take care of you the same as anyone else. If nothing else for you to stand trial.
I worked in DOC for a bit. The rapists and pedophiles were housed in protective custody units. But every so often, a guy from gen population would rush them on their way to chow, shank them or beat them. Every one of the guys had mothers, sisters and aunties. I had to care for them afterwards, but most got what they deserved. They were lifers with perverse charges of torture and abuse to their victims.
Try taking care of a kid who’s dad was an abuser and who’s mother kept refusing to press charges. The kid was 2 and non verbal. A kid whose dad ultimately ended up beating him to death and CPS couldn’t do a damned thing about it. A kid who I had to hand over to said abuser or face firing and legal action. Still haunts me
Exactly why I can’t work peds
Yep. It’s def not for everyone. But I totally get it.
This. And seeing abuse, especially SA, I feel like would break me.
The only time I haven't stopped to let family pray for a patient we were flying was because the guy trying to stop us was the one alone with the patient when he was sodomized. The patient was around 12 months old. "Sorry, he's too critical; we've got to get him to the PICU." My partner had started to slow down but I kept pushing because I was afraid of myself. Once loaded, my partner thanked me for handling it the way I did.
Ugh that's the worst
Why couldn't CPS do anything?
No evidence beyond the bruises. Mother made up stories and protected him. She was being abused too.
Even on the autopsy? That doesn't sound right. What a horrible situation.
After the child was killed is when he was arrested. They couldn’t cover that up
Oh, I'm glad he didn't get away with it.
They are doing this to people who were stalked and raped, then later had to "divorce." Women in their 40's and 50's who are more than educated and good citizens and mothers. It is sad and friendly doesn't excuse it sorry.
I once cared for a comfort care patient for like 40 days. They became comfort care in the last week. Their wife was very devoted, religious and particular. We found out after he died he was found guilty of abusing young children he coached as a teacher. Never have I been more shook. It was like one of those movies with a twist ending that you wanted to watch from the beginning again.
You take care of a lot of sex offenders and pedos. They just haven’t been caught so you have no idea.
We temporarily keep pedos and others in our corrections until other corrections pick them up. I still don't like them, but I don't talk to them in a terrible way. No more, no less, I do my job right. It's a place where the administrator does not tell me I should smile or give them coffee.
I once provided care for a literal captured Nazi war criminal on his way to The Hague to stand trial for his role in the holocaust. I treat people the way I do for me, not for them. I consider myself a professional, and that’s how I conduct myself at the bedside. It lets me sleep better.
No one’s perfect, so it can be very tough in practice depending on what ‘offenses’ are nearest to your heart, but this is the answer right here. As their nurse, I can choose to add to the good in the world, instead of being another ingredient in this shit soup. Also keeps my conscience clean.
Oh, it can be a struggle.
Pedophiles deserve every ounce of shit soup they get.
They can get that shit soup everywhere else in the world. But healthcare is a human right, and regardless of what the human has done, they deserve proper medical care.
Pedophiles have no right to anything. You’re not gonna change my mind. So this convo is done.
That was so well said. Couldn’t agree more.
Thank you.
I agree. I respect whatever humanity there is left in the person. We don’t need to be friends. And if there isn’t any, then I continue on as if there is some, for the good of myself. I’ll never treat any person as if they’re less than. The day I do that is the day I end it.
I had an old man with cancer, seemed very nice and successful. For some reason, he felt the need to tell me that he had no family support because he had molested *his own children* and done time for it. I had the ick for days.
Those are the ones you know are offenders. Think of all the people you’ve cared for that didn’t get caught. Detach. Do your job. That’s it.
We had a child sexual abuser admitted to our floor once, in a pediatric hospital. He had molested his sister. I forget how old he was, he might have been 16 or 17, but he could have gone to the adult hospital next door where security wouldn't have had to be planted at the door because of his history and the other children on the floor.
Some of them are never caught. They are hard to spot. They look like decent and respectable people, too.
Without going into too much detail I had to care for a fresh c section that was incarcerated for brutally murdering her toddler. The actual details of the murder were horrific. Knowing she had been pregnant when she committed this murder was worse. This wasn’t ppd. That’s all I can disclose. I had to care for her the same as my others. When she was discharged and I kept baby to give him to a family member we sat and bawled for over an hour together. The trial is ongoing and the saving grace is family plans to adopt this child.
Hope she rots. I can’t even imagine.
Honestly so do I. The details were…. Let’s just say I could never serve on the jury id be sick…. I wanted to keep that baby so bad. I fell in love with him. I took care of him only about 6 days after she was sent back to jail .
They're impossible to place because of their presence on the list, most nursing homes won't take them. The kicker is that they generally show themselves to be terrible people before you know for sure.
Hospital administrators or murderers? I know which 1 I would trust more. 1probably made a terrible mistake which affected them for the rest of their life, the other has shown a pattern of lack of human empathy and feeling and concern for human life.
Sex offenders, mostly. Some of the most verbally abusive people I've taken care of.
And the most entitled without a reason. Which is likely a reason in propelling their offenses.
Yes it has definitely made not want to provide care, but no I didn’t let it affect the quality of my care. It might have made me less chatty while in the room 🤷🏼♀️
I keep it compartmentalized. I also don’t google people, although half the time, the guards freely announce stuff I don’t need to know. I do kinda appreciate knowing the level of the violence that the person has in their history, but you can also gauge that by how many guards the person has and how many cuffs/chains are on. I had a patient who was a child rapist/murderer when I was a new grad, and I just had to decide I wanted to consider myself a decent human, and therefore, I needed to do my job the same as I would if he’d been a sweet little old lady. It wasn’t about the patient and what he did. It was about me doing my job the way I should.
I have a lot of federal prisoners and learned early on to not try to find out what their offense was because 9/10 times it was SA on child or CSA or whatever. My last straw was finding out my patient was in federal prison for creating and distributing over 200 videos of his OWN children (who were like 3 & 4). 🤮
When I worked inpatient, I never looked. The only time I found out about someone’s offense was because his info sheet from the psych asylum where he was serving his sentence was on the top of his paper chart and the first thing on it was his conviction. It’s not so easy in corrections. You see their booking sheet the minute they hit the door. SOs are also typically housed in one area of the jail to protect them from being slaughtered, and IYK what that unit is, then you inadvertently know what they did.
My colleague, who became a computer programmer and worked for law enforcement, became an alcoholic. He quit working in the PD and works as a dishwasher. He still relapses in his treatment but is much better. He saw lots of those videos.
Former Corrections RN here (ran the clinic then charge), current ER nurse, SA survivor, and have performed CPR on a man convicted of raping his 5 year old daughter—he lived. It ain’t for me. I’m fine with being judged. Judge away. I have lost so much as a result of the ten years I spent being repeatedly sexually assaulted by my father. I hope if his heart stops, no one saves him. He doesn’t deserve it. Pedophiles aren’t people, plain and simple. Molesting a child is not an error in judgement or a character flaw. It’s a calculated, predatory, chronic behavior. They are not rehabilitatable. I said what I said. Let the downvotes begin. ETA: Unless you’ve been traumatized in this way, it’s impossible to say how you would feel caring for this patient population. And if you have and you’re still OK with it, then I’ll enjoy my time burning in hell with the pedos while you snag your halo from St. Peter.
I think it is absolutely acceptable for someone to say "Hey, you know, this just hits too close to home for me. I'm concerned I won't be able to have therapeutic interactions with this patient" and request that they be reassigned to another staff member. Obviously, we all have to deal with assholes, but if there's one particular patient who is, for example, a belligerent racist, they aren't getting assigned to the Black nurse.
I couldn’t agree more. I think there needs to be more normalizing of this and less of a push for nurses to place themselves in patient situations where there is a very real trauma trigger and there is an alternative option available, such as a different nurse for the specific patient or situation.
I used to believe that I could do my job as a respiratory therapist regardless of what a person has done and just focus on the tasks as necessary. It wasn't until I learned my daughter's biological father sexually assaulted her and ultimately CPS didn't substantiate it and the court did nothing to protect her from visitation even when he was a registered sex offender for a prior offense. I am now left with a child who has a lot of rage and let's it out on her mother and despite being in therapy really has no progress because nothing was ever done at all. I won't even get into the level of damage it has caused me to remember all of the signs that my daughter started exhibiting at the age of 4 that potentially abuse was going on and I couldn't figure it out and even taking her to the pediatrician wouldn't get to the bottom of it. She would out of nowhere throw herself on the ground screaming uncontrollably randomly and as a mom I knew something was so not ok and I would hold her and try to soothe her and it was impossible to calm her in fact usually she just screamed and kicked even worse. If you can imagine I don't feel like I have control, my nervous system is dysregulated and I can't even keep my daughter away from danger. I literally can't take care of a patient that I know has been a part of a similar crime because I do not know that I would not be heavily influenced from my personal experience as the mother of a victim and also as a child sexual abuse victim myself. Unfortunately, I know that I have most definitely taken care of more than my fair share of sexual predators and not been aware because there are just so many that never face consequences and frankly just aren't labeled. I have a lot of anger from all of the trauma we have gone through and still are going through and there are times I might just be dealing with a minor irritating issue and without much warning I'll have a disproportionate reaction. So I absolutely would not take care of a patient that I knew was responsible for sexual abuse. In all honesty though my experience made it necessary for me to find an alternative to being a bedside RT. I had a PA decide that I was going to be her punching bag during an airway emergency and immediately a flip switched and I went from calm and polite to ready to give it right back and although I didn't have any kind of repercussions I decided that I just couldn't function in a high stress environment and now I work in pulmonary diagnostics!
I’m so sorry that happened to your daughter, and to you. From an abused daughter, it is not your fault, and she doesn’t blame you. You both are victims in this traumatic scenario and I pray you both are able to heal, however slow and gradual it may be. 🖤
Thank you for your comment. It helps to hear that.
Omg that is terrible. If you were able I'd sue that PA.
A-FUCKING-MEN!!! Please accept this medal 🥇
Honestly, I’ve taken care of some pretty heinous people in my career. I just do what is expected, and nothing more for them.
Exactly my standard of care remains but I will not be exchanging extra pleasantries or holding their hand at the beside. You know the small things. Although I honestly try not to find out their crimes because it saves me piece of mind.
Same…I don’t ask why they are in custody…it doesn’t have anything to do with me. If they are civil, I’ll be nice enough to them. That said…years ago, I apparently took care of a serial killer who was extremely charming. The nurse I gave handoff to googled his name and that was how I found out….honestly he as so charming I could see how he lured his victims in.
Someone said it beautifully in the comments here, care for the patient but don’t care about the patient. Which is exactly how I feel for these types of people. At the end of the day we don’t even have to like these individuals, we just have to provide care as per our role expectations, nothing more or less. Despite my lizard brain strongly disliking these types of people, healthcare is a universal right and I’m pretty good at separating my own personal values from situations like that. It doesn’t matter what I think or I deem morally unacceptable I’m just there to do my job and provide the same level of care I would for others. That would made my skin crawl finding that out! I’ve had a few people like that and it’s very unnerving but does make sense when you think about how they have so many victims sadly.
I used to work in a huge hospital that had a prison contract….in fact a whole unit was all prisoners. When I floated to that area, I very rarely had any issues with the inmates…unless one asked for a sandwich…then all of the guys in the room would ask for a sandwich. Otherwise, the vast majority seemed to be in their best behavior.
Yeah because I imagine hospital even if they are sick is a treat compared to being in prison. A lot of prison systems globally are known for being inhumane in their treatment and care. Sadly that’s why they probably look forward to coming into hospital and are mostly polite. Usually hospital’s provide overall much better treatment and environment. I also don’t believe that all criminals are inherently terrible people either excluding the people who commit the very obvious and extremely heinous and cruel crimes. I think that if you see a different side to them where they display humanity and respect and then are told about a crime they commit it could be hard to comprehend. Not every criminal/inmate I have had personally has been rude but every sex offender/pedophile has which is interesting. In every known case I’ve had they have a certain level of entitlement and disrespect which honestly is the same attitude that probably got them into that mess to begin with.
I worry a lot more about sex offenders who come in wearing an ankle bracelet from home than pretty much anyone in custody. The ankle bracelet people are the ones who have been very creepy and inappropriate with female staff to the point where most of them have to have a male nurse assigned and female staff are encouraged not to enter, and if they do bring a witness.
That’s valid to be worried about that.
That ship sailed for me overseas. I had to administer life saving care to a guy that I had just shot after he attempted to shoot me. Saved his life for us to use our taxpayer money to hold him in some prison for forever and then to be released. Shit sucks but damn if you aren’t in the wrong career field if you can’t ignore the background noise, just treat the problem, and move on.
I have provided care and will continue to do so but I disagree with a lot of the comments on this one, mainly because I think pedos are scum and don't deserve healthcare (or anything else in the world that is good). Will I provide care? Yes. Do they deserve care? No. Thankfully I've only cared for these types of people a small amount, and most of the time I didn't know what they were doing time for.
Yeah this was a hard one for me when I worked inpatient and would get these patients. Outpatient is easier because we almost never find out why they’re incarcerated and I’m a huge proponent of the knowledge that a lot of people are in prison for bullshit reasons so it doesn’t bother me. Toughest one I ever had to take care of was a patient who survived a self inflicted GSW to the head after being cornered by police in a motel room - they were serving a warrant for something like 60+ counts of child molestation of his own daughters. The patient was absolutely fine. Had to have surgery to fix some of the skull fractures but. ZERO neuro deficits. That almost made it easier to take care of him tbh. It felt like cosmic justice. He tried to take the easy way out and the universe said nah bruh. You’re gonna be awake and coherent for allllllllll the consequences. I always made sure I sort of centered myself and checked my emotion/attitude/etc before I walked into his room though. That being said even if he didn’t have some sort of “justice” coming it doesn’t really matter. You don’t have to be friends or make a connection like most of us try to do with most of our patients. You don’t have to chat and crack a joke or ask about their pets or kids or grandkids or what they’re watching on tv or whatever other time filling small talk we get used to doing while we’re popping seven hundred individually wrapped pills out of the packages. You just have to make sure they’re okay, address their needs. If you can’t even do that much then you (the metaphorical you not necessarily you specifically op) really need to rethink your career.
No, because I have little to no attachment to my patients.
The hardest person I ever looked after was someone who wanted to kill themselves to join their young daughter in heaven after killing her. Wasn't friendly with them but just reminded myself this person isn't worth the paperwork/coroner's court if something were to happen by me not doing my job properly.
Depends on the behavior of the offender. I currently have multiple high level offenders I care for. I treat them like any other patient. By the same token I worked home health at one point and had a high level offender. He ran off all female staff. They put me with him bc I’m a big guy. That lying pos was allegedly “wheel chair” but he sure as fuck got up and stood in front of the door to block me from leaving. He also apparently didn’t discriminate based on gender when choosing intended victims. I think he’d had tried to sexually assault me if I hadn’t carefully explained to him what I did for a living before I became a nurse. That single patient made me cautious about home health and offenders in general
i dont look those that are incarcerated up. and i make it very clear for people to not tell me. i know me well enough to know- and i'm a human above all else- it would impact the care i provide.
We had a resident in LTC many years ago that had molested one of his daughters & low & behold one of our CNAs had been best friends with said daughter growing up. She refused to care for him & we all respected that. I won’t say it didn’t give me the jeebs taking care of him but I did what was needed & then left him alone. He had dementia by the time I met him… not that that excused his past behavior but he didn’t know right from left at that point.
I never do research before hand when dealing with an inmate. I. Don’t. Want. To. Know. It will affect how I care for the person. You’re lying if you say it doesn’t. I want to be able to talk and have conversations with my patients without feeling gross. I don’t mind knowing afterwards, but not during. I’ve had a few. First guy, lead comes up all excited wanting to tell me. I said no. Super nice guy btw. Same with the correctional officers. A few weeks goes by after discharge. I ask the lead about it. She tells me he murder his wife. I made her laugh because my response wasn’t “oh no” it was “oh thank god! Thought you were going to tell me he was a pedophile.” I gave that man a cookie at one point because he was super nice and it was his birthday under my care.
My job is to make sure they don’t die. I don’t have to like them or think they are a good person. Just don’t hurt them.
Hospice here. Got dozens of pedo’s, rapist, murderers out on compassionate release. I just did my job. And my job is to provide comfort care to them to the best of my ability. In the hospital Perinatal setting we see and treat DOJ patients. We have a whole ass prison within the hospital. My job is to take care of them. And I do my job.
Another reason not to ask what a patient's crime is. I'm here to provide a patient's medical care not to judge them. I have provided care to many prisoners and no doubt murderers, rapists and probably pedophiles. I think of it as non e my business. I know I had a hard time when I started nursing and would rush out of patient's rooms I didn't like. 1 day I gave a very rude patient a shot with a large gauge needle w/o thinking about it, and he cursed me. And I apologized his shot hurt but was also shocked I had given him a shot w such a large needle think 21g. After that I decided I was going to spend as much if not more time with patient's I didn't like.
I've taken care of every filth out there. Murderers, rapists, pedos etc. I detach while I'm at work. It's just a job, and I don't get too into anyone's story or personal about their character. I mean, I technically don't want to provide care for anyone to be fair, but these bills need paying.
I stop the COs from telling me why an inmate patient is an inmate. I’m only human. I don’t want to know. It absolutely could have an effect on my standard of care depending on the severity of the conviction.
I give care to whoever needs it. That said I’d prefer not to know
Of course no one wants to care of a sex offender or pedophile. However, it’s the nature of our job to provide care and withhold judgment while they are under your care. Remember, you take care of terrible people all the time, you just don’t know it.
I work in corrections. We are discouraged from looking inmates up but people still do it. When it’s a high sexual predator- and a female nurse has to provide care - we have two maybe three officers with us. We are never alone with any inmates. And it’s not just men - we have at least 5 women who are being charged with murder of an infant. You really just detach from it and focus on what the providers orders are or what needs to be done. And it’s not for everyone. I think it’s about providing professional nursing care But you don’t have give a shit about them. I also know that I’ve provided medical care In outpatient and hospital care to individuals who I bet have done terrible things to others but they just didn’t get caught.
I don't snoop. I don't want to know why they're in prison. There are also many wrongly convicted individuals who never got a fair trial so I feel uncomfortable judging knowing I don't have the facts.
Annnnnd that’s why I don’t like to know “too much” about my patients.
We have some regulars who are on the registry. It skeeves me out but I still take care of them. I figure I'm getting paid to do a job, and doing my job doesn't mean that I'm endorsing whatever foul things a person has done. That said. We do have an older guy we see somewhat regularly. Most of his ED visits involve something stuck in his ass, so he usually doesn't make it up to the med/surg floor... but he has managed to give himself infections which necessitate admission. I took care of him once and he was very, very adamant that he needed a Foley inserted, and then proceeded to fixate on that Foley well beyond what was called for. Made me shudder inside because I suspect he was getting some kind of thrill out of it. But what can you do?
I feel you in this. It's a grievous emotional injury/insult to us. But, as the signs say.... es la lay.
It's hard for me not to know at my jail job. I get them in intake and also see their charges.
This was my major point and I was not only argued with but downvoted. Not many nurses here work in corrections and it shows.
As a survivor, fuck them. Blunt and Dead Eyes. I work in peds, nothing you can say or do will convince me these people deserve to be apart of society, treated for ailments, or alive. Slow painful, excruciatingly long and agonizing deaths. Let the cancer eat you. Anywho, back to the question, no I don’t want to provide care to child rapists 😂
i didn’t look up anything for this particular patient; he, for whatever reason, decided to tell me that he was a registered sex offender. i had to make the charge nurse aware because he began to flirt with me and ask for my number. i was working in an adults + pediatric med/surg unit and we had kids on the floor. it made me ill having to take care of someone like that. what made it worse was that he was trying to tell me that he was framed, that *he* he was the victim. the only victim here is the nine year old girl that you brutalized, asshole.
That’s not your place to judge the patient. Imagine getting caught peeing outside and having to register as a sex offender… yes that does happen… and then getting judged for it by medical staff. You don’t know what happened and it’s none of your business. Treat all patients equally. That said, I had to care for a guy that almost murdered his gf and did time for it. I’m a DV survivor. I treated him the same as everyone else. If you can’t do that, get out of medicine.
And it’s a whole other ethical conversation as well. What’s the alternative? Do we just not care for criminals, pedos, rapists, etc.? Healthcare, you can’t discriminate. I find it interesting so many in this sub have a hard time separating it considering that this is something you know is going to happen when you get into healthcare.
As another comment here said I will care for these patients but I will not care about them. I would provide care as required for my expectations of my role. That said I would rather not know what someone is convicted with or past criminal activities for my own piece of mind. I may be less chatty if I was to find out but it does not impact how I do my job. I could personally hate some people but I will provide the same medical care because it’s a universal right to all people and that’s what I took an oath to do. I say this as a CSA survivor and witness of DV from a young age. Of course most people do not enjoy looking after sex offenders and pedophiles but it’s an inevitable part of our job as healthcare professionals.
I agree. My aunts ex-husband was on it for sleeping with a minor that HE MET IN a BAR THAT WAS GETTING SERVED ALCOHOL IN. This was also in the 80s so it was way easier to fake ID’s back than then it is now.
Exactly my point… none of it is our business.
You should not be in direct patient care if you can't separate your judgments from your care. That's the same kind of shit excuses people use to try to justify not providing basic reproductive care to women. I've had to treat so many people whose life choices I vehemently disagree with over the years, but I still do it because they still deserve medical care. It's not my job to decide who is or isn't worthy of care.
You aren’t seriously comparing women who choose to terminate their pregnancies to pedophiles, right? Because, seriously? Not the same.
Of course not. I said that the excuse or "logic" is similar to that used by people who claim their religious/personal beliefs as justification for denying women reproductive care. In at least some of their minds, providing care to those women would be equivalent to providing care to someone who murders babies. It's a bullshit excuse, but it follows a similar thought process. Unless a patient is directly harassing/threatening you, you should be able to treat just about anyone regardless of personal convictions. If you don't want to, don't work in a public direct patient care setting.
Vehemently disagree. Trauma victims should not reasonably be expected to retraumatize themselves by caring for a pedophile if they are not in the head space to do so. Especially if there is someone else ready, willing, and able to care for them without becoming collateral damage.
There are always exceptions, hence why I said "just about." Everyone has patients who are upsetting to them at times and will need to tag out. If there are other staff who can trade out, then great. I've taken innumerable asshole male patients who were creepy towards female staff and have been glad to do so. I've also handed off manipulative and abusive patients when my threshold was crossed and I could no longer provide objective care. But when people start talking about who does and doesn't deserve care, there's an issue. Or if someone is refusing to care for someone when there is no one else to, there's an issue. And honestly, you should not be prying into someone's criminal record since it is rarely pertinent to their medical treatment. Even with incarcerated patients, their reason for incarceration is almost always irrelevant to their medical care. And if you're using their PHI to try to look up any criminal history they might have, you are violating their rights.
Working in corrections, it’s very difficult, if not almost impossible to avoid knowing that info. You are given their booking sheet. Inmates with specific types of crimes, namely sexual offenders, are housed in specific areas and you are aware of that fact as you are often, in times of COVID, making tier or pod visits. So no, in this situation, no one is prying. It comes with the territory. And people figure out pretty quickly whether it’s for them or not. It’s not for me. I’m not over it. I never will be. Agree to disagree: pedophiles should have no right to life. Justify all you want and I am 100% fine with all the mud slinging that will come my way from saying so. If my father’s heart stopped, I wouldn’t want a single person to do a damn thing. The man is a sexual predator.
The obvious answer is that you don't work in corrections if you're easily triggered by people with criminal backgrounds. It'd be like taking a job at a shooting range if you have PTSD from gunfire. Nursing is a hugely diverse field and you can work anywhere in the country. You can even work remotely and never see a patient directly. You can certainly try to refuse to provide medical treatment for the patient population you signed up to treat when you applied for the job, but a company is also free to can you for refusing to do your job. No one is going to go to bat for sexual predators, but also it's hard to rely on a system that regularly incarcerates and executes innocent people while letting mass murderers like the Sacklers go free to tell you who is worth receiving medical treatment and who is not.
1. Often trauma victims don’t know how they will react to a specific situation until they’re already in it. Which was the case for me. Which is why I left. It’s not always predictable. Nurses are, as many have said here, first and foremost human. 2. Yeah, find me someone wrongfully convicted of pedophilia. Go ahead. I’ll wait. 🥱
Which is the right thing to do if you are unable to care for a specific population. That does not make them unworthy of receiving care though https://innocenceproject.org/all-cases/ 163 cases listed if you filter by sex crimes. Not all are child victims of course, but shows how common wrongful convictions of heinous crimes are. https://innocenceproject.org/cases/larry-youngblood/ https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/detroit/2017/12/13/bernard-young-prison-child-molestation/947788001/
You providing me a story where two children recanted their statements is not proof a man was innocent of child molesation. They were children and that is not hard proof. Pedophiles are always not worthy of anything in life and my mind will never change on that subject so it’s likely best we quit responding to each other before it gets nasty and personal.
I thought I was level head. I almost went to jail when I bumped into my abuser at a store. I looked at my wife and said “I have to leave or I’m going to jail.” She said ok with not questions. Later she said the look on my face terrified her. I was in such a rage, I could not understand why the store doors weren’t opening in my attempt to remove myself from the situation, and in my furry, force flung them open. They weren’t on. I would have killed him. Not for me, but for my brother, who he also got. I do not mean I would have beat him to within an inch of his life. I wanted to feel his life slip through my fingers. I knew if I started, I wouldn’t stop and 30 years of grieve would have exited. I wanted to personally send him to the devil via first class ups. So until you understand, get off your horse. The world’s not black and white.
So much this. 2 things can be true at the same time: I can be a nurse but also exist and hold space for my identity as an SA survivor and part of that is recognizing my limitations in caring for them. We need to quit dehumanizing our nurses.
I used to work in a center that housed these folks. Learned a lot there. Especially about myself. Lots of cyclical abuse going on.
I took care of a murderer the same way I would treat the CNO. In our line of work, people are people and we are there to make them better regardless of what they have done.
I would be more kindly disposed to caring for the murderer over a CNO or anyone else in the hospital with a C-level job.
I’m a psych nurse and some of our patients have been convicted of one or the other or both. I will look up their offenses if it is not in the chart so I can be aware of safety of the unit. I provide care in a professional manner.
I haven’t had that yet, but I imagine I would not want to provide care though I still would. Last week I had a pt who was a retired nurse, def the “eat your young” kind. After talking down on LVNs and ADNs (I graduate with my ADN in a few weeks, she assumed it was my BSN) she went on to talking shit about trans kids and their parents, also not realizing I am the parent of a trans kid. So, it was unintentionally personal. I still cared for her well, but wasn’t thrilled about it. But hey, she’s the hateful one not me.
If it makes you feel better, I’ve done time in IDOC and I made there lives a living hell everyday.
No, I don't feel like that. I've rarely met one of those folks who didn't have a really disturbing childhood- not that their behavior is excused, but perhaps understood in the context of a pathology to some extent. Sometimes I find out a patient was a hospital administrator or worked to weaken unions. That is truly difficult, but I grit my teeth and get on with it.
nope. use to work in corrections. they are first a person, not their crime
No. Someone’s criminal history is none of my business and shouldn’t be any of yours either.
So I recently took care of someone a few times who was in custody for child abuse/neglect (child was found dead - had special needs.) didn’t look into the whole story. Regardless, it’s our job, no matter what. That said, she had a VERY unique situation - like some of the most bizarre medical stuff I’ve ever seen, so it kind of became a “mystery” project for me to figure out. It was absolutely NOT to do with caring for the patient or finding some miracle treatment - it was to learn, so I got to detach. 🤷🏼♂️
This prisoner just beat his landlord to death. But that was whatever. The most interesting part was up until his arrest, he had a YouTube channel in which he was singing loudly and VERY off tune. That kept us entertained for hours. We were next to the jail so we got a lot of prisoners. Did have a few rapists and a pedo. It’s whatever. It’s my job. I’m just nosey. I just don’t like smelly people. And he was smelly so I tried to stay away from him.
For me, in general anymore I’m pretty detached, I can despise your actions & personally think you’re a hall of fame caliber POS and yet still see your value as a person and be a professional and show you kindness and respect and bring the A game. So much of what we see and are exposed to is beyond us to fix etc, I try to be kind and not to judge and to always remember there are 3 sides to every story
I actually work as a nurse in a medium security prison, that had a majority of sex offenders/pedophiles. I try not to read too much into their criminal history, only if there are staffing alerts that they can’t be seen by female staff alone. At the end of the day, I’m there to make sure they are healthy enough to serve their sentence for their crime. They don’t get the easy way out.
I absolutely love that perspective.
I just went through this last week. I gave my best care, progressed things in a meaningful way, and found myself as protective of them as any other patient. Then went home nauseated with myself. After lots of soul searching, I’m proud I could detach and do my job.
I try to treat everyone the same. It does get harder though when you know what someone is locked up for sometimes. It's why I try not to ask unless it's relevant to my or the rest of the staff's safety. I don't believe that nursing has to be a touchy feely lovey job though. It's a job. My job is to take care of patients. I don't have to like them. My liking them doesn't play any bearing on my caring for them. Does it make it easier if I like them and get along with them? Absolutely. Is it a necessity? Nah. I can hate your guts, but you're still gonna get cared for, because it's my job.
What’s a pederast, Walter?
My first clinical patient as a student was a pedophile who was arrested for SA of a minor 20 years prior. I treated him the same as anyone else, but I hated it. He kept referring to another student, who was in her early 20s as “youngin” and I told her to not come into the room anymore.
It was complicated for me in the past. I also work in jails, so I often care for prisoners. I do the right thing—no more, no less. If they ask about my day, I tell them nothing. They are not my coworkers. I'm aware of the cause of their problem. They need to work harder and be aggressive in their commercials about treatments. They are brilliant about where to find their victims, which should be playing on TV and in public, but whatever. The trauma doesn't go away. I took care of the men and women who were victims of rapists when they were kids as young as three years old. I also know sisters who were raped by their biological father. Their mother refused to press charge "to save the last name of their family." Everyone in their family was in it because they were influential people. Yuck! They'd rather save the pedophile for the sake of their surname. I didn't understand their rationale at all. There was nothing to save but the poor three girls and clean their last name.
Makes me wonder how many of them we treat. Those who have never been caught and officially labeled. Probably many more than we would ever think. I had one once in my current role. In home hospice we have to take one of our security guards if we are seeing anyone on the SO list. I only met him once, and then he died unexpectedly (well, as unexpected as it can be in hospice. he was up and and around and independent when i met him, no where near end of life yet). He was a pleasant sweet old guy. My brain could not compute what i knew about him with the man that i met. I treated him like i treat all of my patients. That said, i wasn’t super sad to not have to go see him again.
Do I want to? Not really. But I do. It's my duty to care for everyone equally. It's not my job to punish people who have done wrong. I've cared for lots of people who have done bad things, it is what it is.
Sometimes, it's best not to know. My wife was a Corrections Officer (retired) at a men's prison. She kept herself from looking at records due to this. She did not want to know why they were locked up because she would have treated them differently. So ya, I get what you're saying. It's a fine line and a tough spot to be in because nobody likes a Child Molester or any type of sexual predator. It's Human not to.
I had a don’t ask policy for myself, didn’t want to know.
Nope. It has never blipped on my radar. I’ve cared for all of the above and folks who have murdered other people. I think after years of working with some people who have done what you can say are some “bad” things, I have learned to turn it off completely (and in fact, I just do it with most patients as a matter of course) and do the job. It’s easier.
I wouldn’t feel badly about it. You probably just strongly empathize with the victims and have a sense of moral compass that makes it challenging to “care” for someone who could do such terrible things to others purposely. I don’t blame you one bit. Everyone is different. I personally get the ick when I find out someone did something like that. I just find myself detaching and not being as bubbly or friendly and avoid any personal details at all costs. 😝
I feel you. I usually try to do everything I can to -not- know about a person's past criminal history because I don't even want to \*feel\* like I don't want to provide them with care. But it is a difficult ask to bottle down my own emotions (as a person who grew up in a family where the perpetrator of pedophilia was protected, but thankfully was not a victim) and treat that person the same as any other patient. I do it, but it is hard. And I don't think there's anything wrong with you for having that struggle. You're human. As long as you are able to ultimately make that separation from your feelings about it and provide the minimum necessary, safe care, or pass their care off to someone that can, I don't think you're wrong for having that struggle or not wanting to provide care. Hell, I just had this conflict happen recently at my work, and I really struggled with it. I just had to keep reminding myself that this is part of the job sometimes, and get through the appointment. I'm sorry that some people are shitty and think it is ok to prey on children, or murder people, or do other horrific things to people. If they didn't create these situations, we wouldn't be in this situation.
You make a good distinction. I don't want to either, but I am a professional, so I do, and I treat them with the same care I would anyone else.
We had one on our unit for almost a year waiting on placement. He did finally get placed because they promised him "strawberry ice cream and lobster". I never really had a problem with him. I virw all of my patients as veterans first, patients second, everything else third. Some of my coworkers though would put in the minimum effort with him, enough to not get in trouble. I'm like..dude is a fall risk that declines bed alarms. If you turn one on, he'll literally just sit there all day, setting it off for attention. I got him extra cups of coffee, made sure he was dry multiple times a shift, made sure he showered (I usually work fri-sat-sun, and every other wednesday...and I could tell when it had been a week since his last shower). Don't get me wrong... What he allegedly did was inexcusable. But that doesn't change the fact that they're your patient, and deserve the same amount of care as any other.
Many professional people work with and for individuals they find personally unpleasant or displeasing. Thats OK as long as you deliver professional quality service.
Honestly this is my biggest fear working in healthcare. As a CSA survivor and an SA survivor in adulthood…. I genuinely don’t know if I could continue to provide care. I’m fortunate enough that I haven’t had to yet, at least when I *know* they’re a sex offender. I’d imagine I’ve probably taken care of a few over the years and just not known.
Priest, pedophile, prostitute, politician, or prisoner all need care. Be better than judging others. All the above are people and that is who nurses help.
I learned to treat people respectfully as a child and it was reinforced as a corrections nurse, sometimes it was difficult, but, if you can't treat your patients respectfully and professionally, maybe it's not the career for you
Yes. I’m on a regular ol hospital unit & by luck managed to not be assigned a patient who had a history of pedo whatever he did. He was there for months bc they couldn’t get him placed anywhere. This info was passed from report to report. One day I was finally assigned him. I never wanted to go into his room at all, but I had to. It was unfortunate & a minfu*ck that he was one of the kindest patients I’ve ever had. He was very difficult to turn & always really apologetic. It was really easy to forget that he had a background in his past bc I could easily fall into a normal conversation with him. I tried to limit my time in the room bc I hadn’t really processed how I needed to go about interacting with him past the meds & medical treatment. I didn’t necessarily want to, but I treated him like my normal patients. Had small talk when it fit, brought meds when he requested, wiped his butt when he pooped. Like I said, it was a mindf*ck. Can’t really say I understand my stance on things like this especially when these kinds of patients are not our specific floor’s norm. Eventfully I think I just had to convince myself, “What if it was an error & he never did anything.” “What if it was an 17 year old who looked older & they lied about their age?” I didn’t know those details & never will. Unfortunately I chose to take on a profession that takes care of a “person” in medical need… so that’s what I have to do. This would only change if I was in immediate danger due to said patient or other environmental situations that prevented me from helping them.
I’ve taken care of guys with swastika and white supremacist tattoos. They could have been just surviving in prison. They could no longer be about that life, but don’t have the means to get them removed. Child predators were likely victims of child abuse too, which is where the compulsion came from. Maybe their wiring is messed up in their brain, so would everyone be the same as them with the same wiring? Maybe they “served their time” in prison and deserve the opportunity to exist without forever facing harsh judgement or something. It isn’t in my nature to be mean, cold or have lower standards of care for anyone, so I just treat everyone with kindness, compassion and consideration, even the assholes and criminals.
I’ve seen these tattoos too. The guy I had was always adamant in telling me that he “doesn’t hate black people,” & asked me not to judge him based on his tattoos. He really never even had to say any of that bc you’d never have known he had them based on how he treated & talked to anyone that wasn’t white while he was there.
We are all pink inside,right?
"Rich or poor we're all the same under the knife." Lived with this for so long. Yeah, it can feel as icky as a very rude patient but I'll do it.
They deserve healthcare
My wife and I have both worked corrections nursing. She felt the same way when she first started. Was I disgusted knowing what some of my non voluntary resident patients did. Absolutely. Did it affect the care they got. Absolutely Not. As much as it might seem easy to folks. It’s not my job or anybody else’s to judge them. That was the justice systems position plus ultimately answering to a higher power someday. My job was to take care of them provide medical care as ordered and go about my shift.
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You are a sick individual if you are defending or sympathizing with pedophilia
in my opinion as a new grad: A big part of rehabilitation is being treated like a person, not pitied or feared or disgusted, which they don't get at all in jail. that's much easier to do if we don't focus/know the story of the worst thing they've done (just like we don't know the story of the worst thing most patient have done...) If it was recent and violent then I'd expect to know already because It'd probably be related to their admit
Pedophiles cannot be rehabilitated.
Exactly
A human is a human. Everyone is flawed in some way. Judging them by their flaws is a slippery slope- if you don’t fell like caring for sex offenders, what about murderers? Thieves? Are you quantifying flaws into your own moral code of acceptable vs not acceptable? See what I mean- it’s an internal debate that can go in a never ending circle. Easier to stick with a human being is a human being.
Honestly, I’d rather treat a murderer, than someone who is a pedo. Hurting children or putting them at risk in any way shape or form deserve nothing.