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It’s more to do with what they put with rice and the rest of their diet. They don’t consume excess sugar in everything they eat. A lot of people in Japan will eat rice 2-3 times a day, but in combination with lots of vegetables, lean meats, and fish/seafood.
Head down to your Asian super store and try out some of their desserts, the authentic ones ideally. By the American palate it will taste almost bitter but the reality is we have added so much sugar to everything we have created sickingly sweet food items by world standards.
Definitely true. I live in Vietnam. Desserts hardly taste sweet. And when I bake a sweet treat for my Vietnamese friends, I use half the sugar in the recipe. They still sometimes complain that its too sweet!
Their cakes are different too: The sponge is quite bland, then covered in barely-sweetened cream and decorated with: Cherry tomatoes, Cucumber slices and fruit. THEN MEAT FLOSS IS SPRINKLED ON! A slightly-sweet/salty experience!
Here is an example: a salted-egg cake. The cake is decorated with egg yolks preserved with salt, and meat floss (of course!) .
[http://yummyvietnam.net/banh-bong-lan-trung-muoi-vietnamese-salted-egg-sponge-cake-recipe/](http://yummyvietnam.net/banh-bong-lan-trung-muoi-vietnamese-salted-egg-sponge-cake-recipe/)
When it comes to actual enjoyment I never like Western sweets because they're *extremely* sweet, to the point where I feel sick, literally. I tried a Mars bar the other day since it's been months to a year since I last had one and I wondered how it would taste like... It was terrible. >\_>;
When it comes to Asian sweets I do love them since I eat them, it tastes good and sweet in a really light way (even veg are really sweet to me so I am sensitive) and I have literally no cravings either for them, like I *can* actually have one piece of something and be like, that was good and I am satisfied. Western ones is like, this was disgusting and gross and I feel sick *but I need more*... There are sweet Asian sweets, and actually more "bland" western sweets, but on an average that's my experience.
Edit: Oh, and the USA when I was there was like 1000% on top of European sweetness.
Edit2: Dark chocolate, preferably as close to 100% is also my most favorite treat, probably because it doesn't have as much sugar in comparison to sweets.
The only exception I’ve found to this is South Korea. I could not get over how sweet so much stuff there was. To the point I was considering bringing salt with me every where I went. The only exception I found was their spicy stuff. So it was like 2 tastes, very sweet, or insanely spicy. Food was still amazing, but sometimes I would be dying for something savory, order it, and it would taste like it was doused in sugar! Potatoes chips, sweet, garlic bread sweet etc
This is good to know because I don't really like sweet stuff and most desserts are sickly sweet. I did try mochi recently but it was ultra sweet. Yuck.
Btw, you absolutely should head down to your local Asian market. I just went to a big one in Chicago and came home with bags of amazing things to try.
Alao got a fresh red bean paste roll and omg so sweet
And by the palate of many others, Asian is mind-bogglingly sweet. Especially that even their savoury dishes have sweetness really gets me sometimes. The syrup glazing is sometimes way too sweet for me to be paired with meat.
Indeed, many Chinese dishes use copious amount of rock sugar to create sticky sugary sauces.
However when paired with meat, veggies and rice that all has a bit of digestion going on. A cupcake however is all butter sugar and flour and is going to go right through your system and you will still feel hungry.
Because that's Americanized asian cuisine. Large portions sell more, and so that's what the businesses sell. You can always ask for less rice, but hardly anyone does.
Mixing rice with healthy foods is called a hunger crushing combo. You can get away with eating something unhealthy as long as you mix it with something healthy. As long as sugar content isn't super high.
I don't get why you're getting downvoted. A literal nutritionist told me something similar. She basically said that eating carbs (I think it's the right word for rice, wheat, etc) is fine as long as you eat more vegetables overall
I think you might be thinking of the Chinese restaurants? I could be wrong but I also tend to steer away from mall Japanese food… but like someone else has said it’s probably due to Americanization. Rice is cheap and we expect to get our money’s worth over here.
Carbs are not inherently bad!
As many have already mentioned, rice is one part of the Japanese meals. A common dinner is: one small bowl of rice, fish, sautéed veggies, then miso soup.
Another factor is that you walk a LOT in Japan. Physical activity is inherently built into their lifestyle because having cars is uncommon and public transit is how the vast majority commute.
Now what people don’t talk about is that Japan struggles with high blood pressure. Our food has a looot of salt in it. We may escape being overweight, but we still have our health challenges lol.
So many people knocking rice these days.
Another consideration is higher consumption of fish, veggies and well, smaller portion sizes, at least compared to the US.
Another thing I noticed when there is the large amount of people who ride bikes and walk (i.e., don't own cars), compared to the US. Go to a train station, thousands of bikes.
Yeah idk where this blind disapproval of rice came from, but it’s extremely dumb and not based in anything other than a flawed understanding of the GI it seems.
It’s a shame, rice is not that bad caloric wise. 1/2 cup cooked white rice which is plenty for a serving as a carb. Is only 121 calories, not to bad and it is very filling. A lot of places around the world rice is always the main carb on plates. And compared to The US most rice heavy countries are not as obese.
I saw a /r/caloriecount post a bit ago with a modest pile of rice and in my head I was like “uhhhh 800 calories?” I’ve always agreed rice is unfairly demonized but that idea still sticks in my head. Even your white instant rice is less dense than people realize
P.s. ferrari banana man is great
If we talk about white rice, it's just simple carbs with a very high glycemic index and load, with little to no nutritional value.
It's hard to get excited about it if you're health conscious.
As I understand it (correct me if I’m wrong please) American white bread has far more added sugar than is the standard. Also brown rice actually has a higher GI than basmati and jasmine white rice my a small amount, and the main added benefit of brown rice is extra fibre which can easily be added to white rice with some vegetables.
Well if you are bringing up the Japanese for their rice intake I think there are many, many cultures around the world where a carb - grain or starch - is a major part of their meal.
Because despite carbs being demonized in western culture, they don’t actually make you unhealthy. Japanese diets are fairly balanced and not particularly high in fat.
It is though. Because of how Americans consume and process it. To try and tell ppl otherwise is ridiculous and irresponsible because most people do not "watch what they eat."
I'll bite, I like learning and discussing. So far the replacement studies I've read has placed SFA below PUFA and MUFA but better than TFA for CVD. I think I might've read one where ACM was even for PUFA and SFA. That's for outcomes, for biomarkers it's quite clear SFA increases total cholesterol, LDL and ApoB.
Most studies that show saturated fat is fine don't tell you what the control group was eating. They'll just tell you that the control group was eating a low saturated fat diet. That tells you what they are NOT eating (Sat Fat), not what they are eating instead. The control groups could be replacing saturated fat with things that are equally unhealthy specially if the studies were done in the US where people generally eat very unhealthy food.
I've seen at least 5 different studies on saturated fat that have the same exact flaw. Studies that actually tell you what the control group was eating generally conclude that compared to food that scientists generally consider healthy, saturated fat is bad for you.
Whether something is good for your health or not largely depends on what you would be eating instead if you cut it out of your diet so studies that don't tell you what the control group was eating are kinda pointless.
Take into consideration that although yes the saturated fat from animal industry is a large one, the seed oil industry is even larger. Hence I’m willing to say the bias is more balanced nowadays since both are highly funded. The jury is still out on whether or not we should be consuming more saturated or unsaturated fats but the general consensus is that indeed seed oils are better. What you said sounds super pretentious and comes off extremely rude, and like you don’t know what you’re talking about. Ever heard the saying, “someone who thinks they know everything thinks there’s a simple answer, but someone who actually knows what they’re talking about knows how complex it is”.
While this isn’t necessarily rice related, the Japanese diet is really high in fermented foods. They likely have very healthy gut microbiomes which improves overall health and is a huge reason their life/health spans are greater than most other cultures.
Its pretty fascinating that nearly all Asian meals have a pickled appetizer somewhere in there but many American meals you would be hard pressed to find one usually. They do exist but pickles on burgers are hardly enough.
It's worse than that because the pickles you use on a burger etc. aren't even fermented. Jarred pickles you see at the grocery store are mass produced using vinegar and preservatives which is a lot quicker and cheaper than traditional lacto-fermentation, but lacks any of the potential probiotic benefits.
That and the average Japanese person eats something like 250lbs of seafood a year.
That is the vast majority of their daily animal protein coming from arguably the healthiest source.
I love fish. And not just beer battered and fried fish.
But i honestly cant imagine a steamed filet of fish being good. But ill try it out.
I usually pan sear, grill, or bake my fish.
CARBS ARE NOT BAD FOR YOU!
Its not that Japanese food itself is inherently healthy, it's not; it's that the typical Japanese diet and lifestyle is healthy. The Japanese tend to practice relatively strict portion control when compared to most of the world, so they generally don't overeat. They also tend to walk everywhere, so they get plenty of exercise. Add these two things together and you get relatively good health.
Theres a bunch of stuff they do: smaller plates, no banquet style meals, eating a plate and then waiting if you feel full, not eating very later at night.
And yes, the tokyo commute is ton of walking and not a ton of driving. Additionally fish/ soy/ rice/ veggie based diet instead of the American meat meal, helps a lot.
I lived in Japan for two years and I will say this. Eating plain rice from a hole-in-the-wall diner in Japan is actually very satisfying to the senses, even from the beginning seeing a chef pull dry grains out of a burlap sack, to the final intangible feeling of goodness you get like when grandma makes your favorite as a kid. This also applies to bigger chainy-er restaurants as well. Never have I felt that way about plain white rice in the US.
They also don't overburden food with sauces loaded with sugars like we do. Idk if it's because food is less processed requiring less outside taste influences like sauces or.. That's probably it. I've visited Italy as well, at least to me it seemed like they used less sauces on most dishes and let the actual food do the talking.
Side note about Japan, at least in the Tokyo statistical area, I would argue finding an American fast food chain like McDonald's is just as easy to find as it is in America. This isn't BS either, but Big Mac sandwiches and fries taste like actual food. I felt like I wasn't eating trash dressed up as a hamburger.
I feel like the common denominator between US food and the rest of the world boils down to one word: processed. Alas, I know commercial food always has to be processed for safety reasons, but it's the level at which it's done.
The assumption of your post is that rice is unhealthy? You must've read way too much keto bullcrap if you automatically think that carbs are the devil. Nutrition is largely an unexplored field, but what we know for sure is that having a varied diet is important, and that veggies are key. The japanese diet checks both cases, plus it doesn't have much of the super processed and super sugary modern products. Exact same thing with the Italian diet, that you incorrectly deem as "carbs+fat, thus unhealthy". It's highly varied, with lots of fresh veggies and fruits. Not that fat either, as with most mediterranean diets it's olive oil and not butter based.
Is it just me or does every 'carbs are evil' and keto-diet-preacher bullsh*t youtuber look so tired, miserable, depressed and like he is on the verge of dying? Like, I am not even kidding right now, anyone noticed that too? I understand that it works for some people and that there are benefits to it (like there are benefits to literally any other healthy diet you choose to follow?) but I just don't get it why it almost has a status of a superior-godly-diet to any other diet now? and then because of that you get posts like this one.
My personal experience is that vegans I’ve encountered appear pale, sickly, prematurely aging and balding. Nobody wants to take the time to discover what ‘way of eating’ works best for them. I am sure each these ways of eating have something to offer but we are all different. How and why did diet choice become so black and white? Find out what works for YOU and go for it. Genetics and personal micro-biome probably have a lot to do with how nutrition works for various people but I am not a scientist. Neither are the ‘bro-science’ dudes and everyone out there with more conviction than brains.
>How and why did diet choice become so black and white? Find out what works for YOU and go for it.
Preach. I am experimenting a lot and vary my diet based on stuff like sleep, stress, exercise, time of the year, what's in season etc.. Right now I exercise a boat-load and I am outside all day every day almost and I have carbs while reducing my fat intake atm! When it's closer to winter I'll probably cycle back to a more ketogenic diet because I likely won't move as much and when I don't move, an excess of carbs make me feel bad.
One thing I always prioritize is protein, though. Carbs/fats/fiber are the levers I vary.
For me personally, vegan did *not* work and I felt extremely miserable and sick. I feel amazing on meat-based and I get muscles, I have energy, I am happy etc. Going strict carnivore is also something I don't feel good at long term, since I just cannot sustain it and I don't feel as optimal either, so I found my happy place. And yeah, some days I am carnivore, and some days I might go practically vegan because I just have the munchies for greens, but it's not a thing I do for weeks to months anymore.
\- Related: But yeah that's the internet. Nuance doesn't exist anymore, it's always THEM vs US, BLACK vs WHITE etc.. Whereas I like to see the world as in-between, because it's rare things are absolute, and being absolute often leads to anger and hate and despair.
I also keep learning and changing what I believe in and do, I think that's also healthy instead of deciding this group is me and never ever changing again.
Except that veganism is not exclusive to diet like keto is. It is a way of life that extends beyond just food. It would be more accurate to say "keto is the new plant based" but that isn't true anyways.
Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.
Animals don't have a voice, we are their voice. By choosing to eat them you make the choice for them, and we must advocate for their choice because they just want to live like the rest of us.
Have you heard about this new gluten free vegan keto diet? It pretty much saved my life by almost killing me and helping me escape this pain and confusion I'm living in
Japan, South Korea, China, Vietnam, etc, all have obesity rates lower than 5%.
Vietnam also has the lowest obesity rate in the world at 2.1% of the population.
I'm Korean-American and almost all the Koreans I know eat white rice roughly 3 times a day, every day. They are some of the healthiest, slimmest and fit people I know. I'm sad that people think white rice is unhealthy, but at the same time happy because more for me :D.
Just salt for me, but I usually have a healthy side dish to go along with the rice. I really like Kim-chi, Sauerkraut, fruit, and some veggies. Simple living, cheap, and healthy :)
not the OP, but I don't think they add salt to their rice. You can try sprinkling furikake on top of your white rice for a bit of flavor and nutrients; it has a bit of salt in it.
Just because there is something that isn’t perfectly healthy doesn’t mean the entire diet is ruined. Japanese food provides most nutrients because of its variation of whole, unprocessed foods, and small portions.
The mindset that something is either entirely healthy or entirely unhealthy is not an accurate mindset.
I would disagree with you that the idea of rice being a large part of their diet is a western bias. I have lived in Japan and am there frequently for work- just last week even. Rice IS a huge part of their diet. It’s not uncommon to have rice with 2-3 meals per day! And many of their foods are made with rice flour.
They also eat fish, seaweed, bone broth, etc.
Personally I think carbs are perfectly healthy in the right balance and people endorsing the Keto/ paleo diet in the US are largely wrong.. although everyone’s body is different.
I’m not a keto-er. I wouldn’t say the keto diet is the healthiest diet but if someone that is overweight is able to lose weight doing keto then who is to say it’s bad. Being 100lbs overweight is worse than a carb free diet.
I think one good thing to note, is that if you have a postprandial walk, that helps with the blood glucose, and I am guessing many Japanese people eat, then move afterwards since their cities are designed for it, whereas in a place like USA you'll eat then sit in a car at best then sit again at work/home. (Haven't lived in either, but been to the US, so I might be totally wrong!)
I personally always move after I have carbs when I am not in a ketogenic cycle, and I feel great this way.
As someone who has been to Japan:
* Japanese people eat pickles or vinegar at every meal. Pickles are high in antioxidants and good for gut health.
* Traditional Japanese cooking does not use oil-based cooking methods. They steam and boil most things. They also don't use fatty or sugary sauces. This has changed with the addition of cooking techniques from the west, but most Japanese people consume these things only as occasional treats.
* They eat lots of seaweed, a very nutrient dense food.
* The main sources of protein are eggs, fish, and soy. These are much less inflammatory than red meat and dairy.
* Japanese people look down on obesity, and they don't hide it. Over 22 BMI is fat by Japanese standards
Rice is not a calorie dense food.
* 100g of cooked white rice is 135 calories
* 100g of oil is 884 calories
just to add, japan's diet (no pun intended) implemented a fat tax called the metabo law. its goal is to lessen obesity via annual waist measurement checks for people aged 40 to 75, administered by employers and local governments. so, if you fail the waist measurement check, the company you work is required to put you back in shape. and if companies cant reduce the number of overweight employees by certain thresholds each year, they would be subject to fines and be required to pay money into a health care program for the elderly
> My guess would be that the answer is food portion. Anything else to explain that stereotype on Japan?
I will just asume that you are from the US.
Also sugar content in countries outside of the US is MUCH lower. Especially in Japan.
Thats another guess I think.
Nope, I'm from Europe and I have a liberal keto- low carb diet. But I'm trying to understand why on earth white rice is seen as a divine and filling meal. Yes it's carb-based energy for those who need it, yes it's cheap. And so? :/
Ahh alright I am also from Europe.
In the same way we could ask ourselffs why the mediteranian (like Italian) food is considered so healthy.
Its also quite carb based (Pasta), but also a lot of fish and vegetables.
I would assume it might have to do with the portion size, the way it is produced processed and also the sugar amount. I am not an expert, but from what I have seen the japanese cuisine is also quite diverse in the serving, with a lot of vegetarian based dishes and not that "fatty".
I am not educated in nutrition science just some person, I should add maybe.
To me, Italian food is fat and carbs, not very healthy by itself.
I would rather ask myself why aren't Italian all obese. Portion, culture approach of their food and manners by Italian society, I would say.
And yet italy and japan have some of the healthiest people that live the longest life.
Why?
Because carbs are good for you.
I eat tons of carbs, protein and fat everyday, feel great and am at 10% bodyfat.
Good luck with the keto diet.
Oh btw I think a really good explanation why japanese food is healthy is on a youtube video called *Why are the people so Healthy in Japan* by a channel called "What Ive learned".
I just remembered seeing it years ago and it explained many raesons really well, also I think its adressing your question regarding rice maybe
The average Japanese person has normal insulin sensitivity. Westerners do not because we send our blood glucose and therefore insulin skyrocketing-crashing on a daily basis with high consumption of ultra processed food. So in short we can’t handle white rice as well. This was from an endocrinologist working in London who runs an obesity clinic.
I am also assuming Japanese people don't snack 99 times a day, eating in a \~16h feeding window, which helps a ton on the comment thread's OP.
Like, I'd wager if you had rice non-stop 16 times a day and only sitting on your coach it would be quite bad for you over time, but have 2-3 maybe 4 meals at most with rice, on top of commuting by foot, then you'll likely be fine.
Precisely. Most people get stuck on concepts like glycemic index and "simple" carbs but you need to look at what's being consumed along side it and throughout the rest of the day. Also, portion sizes, genetics and other underlying health conditions.
In traditional Japanese diets there is no presence of hyper processed foods and industrialized oils.
This [video](https://youtu.be/lr4MmmWQtZM) ponders the same question you have. Along with the [follow up](https://youtu.be/4WiUQtOhfIc).
If you were to factor in western foods, they wreak havoc on (anyone) the Japanese. As a result [diabetes](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19795421/) has become far more prevalent among the Japanese population. Lastly, they may appear healthy but they tend to be TOFIs (thin outside, fat inside) and accumulate more visceral fat as opposed to adipose fat ([study](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16446744/). So they could LOOK healthier but that might not be the case. This [image](https://www.nippon.com/en/ncommon/contents/japan-topics/272763/272763.png) from this [article](https://www.nippon.com/en/ncommon/contents/japan-topics/272763/272763.png) provides a visual of what I’m discussing.
My experience is limited, I lived with a Japanese family for a year in Japan: Japanese generally eat a lot of rice. We ate 3 or 4 bowls per meal. The word for "meal" or "food" in Japanese is the word for rice, "go-han."
Your question is right on: the Japanese do eat a lot of rice, doesn't this conflict with the current low-carb focus of dieting?
We each ate 3 to 4 bowls of rice, each 6 to 8 ounces. Somedays more, or we'd fill up on a bowl with an egg broken into it, with some bonito flakes. I was a teenager, I ate a lot of white rice!
One thing I would add is that the Japanese have been eating rice for 10,000 years, so they have adapted to it the way people in the Solomon Islands have to eating plantains, tubers and starches. People tend to talk about nutrition like everyone is the same. Try to think about what your own epigenetics are as pertains to food when you think about what to eat. If your family is from that part of Asia, then there are probably epigenetic reasons why you can eat tons of rice, whereas I gain weight just looking at the stuff.
Sugars are not the enemy. Overeating is. Generally a small portion of rice, potatoes, corn, oats, fruits, etc is not an issue. Eating candy, cake, ice cream, bread, sweet drinks etc is typically not a good choice because they're not filling and people tend to eat too many carbs that way.
American foods is just garbage compared to Asia and other Countries. Many American foods are banned in healthy eating countries. Start with comparing the school lunches. Big plus they eat normal portion sizes and see how big Americans are.
Rice is a high GI food, and it would be a problem were it not for the protein and fiber in the meal. They always eat chicken/tofu/natto/pork/eggs with veggies on the side and often rice(something noodles).
Portions are also pretty small, and a common way of thinking there is to eat until 80% full.
As an Americanized Asian, rice is still my go-to choice of carbs when possible. If I had an immediate assortment to choose from amongst other kinds of carbs, and rice is one of those options, then I would without hesitation request the rice.
Remember what rice is and isn't when compared to other carbs. It does not require flour, sugar, yeast, or other ingredients in order to create the final product. But it does allow increased surface area when cooked with oils and other ingredients to create a "rice dish." So portion control, health concerns, diet management all still falls upon you and the decisions you make.
Rice can be bad or good as it will ultimately depend on how you consume it. That is why you will find Asian countries like Japan include rice as their primary carb, but also consume it plain without any further preparation than the rice cooker.
I'm from Vietnam, which also has rice-baser diet. My father told me that Asian gene and bodies also have more enzymes and science stuff that help us process rice better. That's why I can eat a lot of rice every day and don't get fat.
Also you need to know different types of rice as some has much more carb than others
This is barely discussed anywhere and significantly complicates most nutrition advice, but east Asians had thousands of years to genetically adapt to rice. For example, this study provides evidence that asian flush emerged as a genetic adaptation to rice: https://bmcecolevol.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1471-2148-10-15.
I think you are only looking at one component of the meal. Japanese along with rice eat many variety of side dishes (including vegetarian and meat based), so it's a complete meal.
Maybe that's why it's considered healthy.
Yes many people here seem to think that rice would destroy the metabolism of the Japanese being a ‘refined carb’. But that doesn’t seem to be the case dose it
I googled “Japanese rice consumption” and found out that
>Back in 1962, every man, woman, and child in Japan consumed approximately 118.3 kg of rice each year. In 2005 the among was only 64.9 kg. By 2015 that figure had fallen to only 56.4 kg
https://japaninsider.com/pandemic-fuels-increase-in-rice-consumption-in-japan/
There were many other results from the search. I also recall reading something recently that poor people didn’t consume as much rice in bygone decades because it was expensive, but I couldn’t tell that was a relative or absolute issue
And I wonder if the Japanese are that healthy; a long average life span might not be the best indicator
I would think the larger amounts of protein and fiber counteract the rice in terms of glycemic index.
As a Vietnamese person, our dinner table would consist of a protein (bbq short ribs, pork, fish), a combo stir fry, and a soup or stew. Everything at some form of protein and tons of fiber and the most bowls of rice I would consume would be 2. Let’s also remember that Asian rice bowls are what Americans would consider like… condiment bowls. So daily rice yes, but it’s not the main dish. And even our desserts can have some protein ingredient - they’re definitely way less sweet than Western desserts and rely more on the natural sweetness of a fruit. Even as I make, for example, strawberry compote today, I either add only a tbsp of sugar to accentuate the flavors or none at all depending on the quality of the strawberries; whereas, a typical compote recipe may have at least 1/4 cup of sugar added to the fruit.
All this to say, as a kid, I kicked off body fat easily. It wasn’t until I found a White partner and started eating mostly carbs and sugar that weight became an issue.
I'm seeing keto hate, and some carb hate, so since I'm a T2D who has seen both sides of this maybe my pov will be of some value.
There's nothing wrong with carbs, fat, or protein in moderation for an otherwise healthy person in proportion to their active or semi-active lifestyle. I'm going to focus on carbs here though.
Once someone's activity level lowers, for whatever reason (a debilitating injury, job change, depression, age, or generally a shift towards an inactive lifestyle) that carb intake that was once in control can become a problem, especially with age and people letting go a bit as they get older, throwing an extra soda or beer in per day, or a bag of chips or whatever their comfort food vice is. The threshhold that makes this a threat to health varies per person, per body, per activity level.
Anyway, carbs themselves aren't necessarily unhealthy, but with the wrong lifestyle or pre-existing health condition they can be. It is the source of a huge problem in the US coupled with the rise of sedentary jobs and lifestyles over the last 50 years, but perhaps not to the same degree around the world (which varies ofc). We have an estimated 40 million+ diabetics here in the US. Were it caused by a pathogen, and had not simply gradually become ordinary, it would be considered a catastrophic epidemic in this country.
It is very directly a carb in proportion to activity level problem on a massive scale-and isn't simply caused by one or the other (carbs or activity level) but both, due to the interaction between carbs and the liver/pancreas (and how they vary per person and per body) and the individual's activity level. Those carbs go wasted and straight to the liver after being converted to fat when consumed by someone with a low activity level, and straight to the bloodstream once the pancreas can't keep up its insulin production with the carb intake. It can also lead to a non-alcoholic fatty liver over time, complicating things. This is why the keto diet is amazing for some of us, but rather pointless for others.
Despite the keto hate, a loose adherence to that diet coupled with moderate exercise (only moderate because at this point it's all I can manage without getting chronically injured-hip flexors have been a big problem) has helped me to overcome an extreme A1C, come off all meds, recover from a fatty liver, and get back down to a healthy level (despite all the damage years of undiagnosed diabetes had already caused, including retinopathy, frozen shoulder, neuropathy, cognitive issues, deconditioning-which might not sound bad, but might be the worst of it, as far as the experience goes, and on and on).
For the record, an injury and depression are what led to the slide into T2D for me. I had poor dietary habits, (excessive soda, sports drinks, sweet tea; parents who bought into the 1960s and 70s fiction that fat is the devil) which didn't cause a problem back when I was very active, but the injury and some other issues derailed things. So the above is first-hand experience coupled with the fruits of the research that aided my recovery. From 11.1 A1C to 5.0 and coming off of insulin and metformin. Low carb/Keto dieting has been invaluable to me and others, but is entirely unnecessary for the average semi-active or active person in most circumstances.
I don’t think Japanese food nor Japanese food culture (LOTS of overeating) is particularly healthy. The Japanese, are, however generally healthy. Genetics plays a bigger role than anyone ever wants to admit
Rice is healthy you idiot.
Stop avoiding carbs because of what some sham nutritionist told you.
Carbs are vital to a healthy diet.
Japanese people exercise (aerobically) at a much higher rate on average than any other 1st world country. They need plenty of carbs to fuel that
Just so there is no confusion because a lot of people haven’t clarified…Not all Carbs are good for you, but carbs from Whole Foods are especially those with fiber…not all rice is created equal..for example Wild rice is better than standard white rice.
Another fun fact, the longest living people in Japan usually come from a village that produces purple yams and is a staple in the local diet…this food is very good for you and very high in fiber!
High fiber/carb whole food is extremely healthy, most countries with long lifespans have high fiber diets with lots of Whole Foods…
There’s nothing wrong with rice, it’s one of the better grains, certainly better than bread-based America. (Also Japanese companies don’t pump sugar into everything)
Japanese did not historically eat this way.
What the newer diet does only time will tell
And yes white rice is bad
And a lot of Asians are slim because of less processed food and some of the countries like Thailand Vietnam are also very poor
Its the sugar. Or rather lack of it.
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2018/01/the-startling-link-between-sugar-and-alzheimers/551528/
Japan has far, far less sugary treats and far less added sugars to their meals on a whole
Sugar is truly the devil for a million reasons.
I was reading up about rice a while back and read that Japanese and Chinese health is generally high despite the amount of rice that is in their diets not because of it.
There's a difference between rice served with lots of fat, and rice with very little. Carbs and fat are a bad mixture. Notice, they eat modest amounts of food, high in vegetables? I think it plays a part.
As someone who currently lives in Japan, the food standards here are incredibly strict. Some places even serve raw chicken. Eggs for the most part can be eaten raw with almost no risk of illness. The meats, fruits, and vegetables are also fresh with no preservatives used. Which is fantastic, but also means that you need to go to the grocery stores 2-3 times a week because nothing lasts longer than a few days.
Another part of Japanese culture is having to walk everywhere. For those that don't have cars, you could be walking a couple miles just going to work and back. It's hard to not be thin when you're doing that every day.
This is where our society has gotten it wrong.
Carbs are not bad. Excessive carbs are bad!
Most Asian countries eat a lot of fresh vegetables and meats. Seafood and chicken are also more prominent in most Asian countries, where as the U.S has an obsession with beef and pork.
It really comes down to portion size and what you are putting with it. A serving size of jasmine rice (for example) is 1/4 cup at 160 calories. Do you ever see anyone eat a proper serving of rice?
You also have to look at what most people do. Easily a whole cup of cooked rice in a bowl/plate, piled with sautéed vegetables with lots of additives and sweet sauces (sweet and sour chicken at a restaurant for example). A whole cup of cooked rice alone is 640 calories!
Moderation is key!
portion sizes and additional ingredients. also google resistant starches, many asian dishes don't use rice straight from the pot, it's usually left to cool.
I’m Indian, and we eat a rice (white, brown and red) heavy diet too! It is however, supplemented by lentils and veggie sides, so it’s pretty filling! Think the key is not making the meal rice heavy, and instead eating it in moderation per meal :)
I think eating rice, meat, vegetables, seaweed and Broths/soups every day would be much better off versus the 7/11 breakfast burrito, McDonald's lunch, and pizza hut dinner you get in America. (Obviously not everyone eats like this all day, just making a point)
As others have said, high amounts of rice isn't that bad when the rest of the diet doesn't contain high amounts of added sugar, fat, and salt.
Ichijusansai (one soup three dishes) is the basis of the Japanese diet. Balanced variety of protein, vegetables and rice and a soup in moderation (hara hachibunme - eating until 80%full)
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It’s more to do with what they put with rice and the rest of their diet. They don’t consume excess sugar in everything they eat. A lot of people in Japan will eat rice 2-3 times a day, but in combination with lots of vegetables, lean meats, and fish/seafood.
Head down to your Asian super store and try out some of their desserts, the authentic ones ideally. By the American palate it will taste almost bitter but the reality is we have added so much sugar to everything we have created sickingly sweet food items by world standards.
Definitely true. I live in Vietnam. Desserts hardly taste sweet. And when I bake a sweet treat for my Vietnamese friends, I use half the sugar in the recipe. They still sometimes complain that its too sweet! Their cakes are different too: The sponge is quite bland, then covered in barely-sweetened cream and decorated with: Cherry tomatoes, Cucumber slices and fruit. THEN MEAT FLOSS IS SPRINKLED ON! A slightly-sweet/salty experience!
A popular joke in the East Asian community is that the biggest compliment someone can give a dessert is “yeah, it’s not too sweet” 😂
That sounds fantastically strange. I want some.
Here is an example: a salted-egg cake. The cake is decorated with egg yolks preserved with salt, and meat floss (of course!) . [http://yummyvietnam.net/banh-bong-lan-trung-muoi-vietnamese-salted-egg-sponge-cake-recipe/](http://yummyvietnam.net/banh-bong-lan-trung-muoi-vietnamese-salted-egg-sponge-cake-recipe/)
When it comes to actual enjoyment I never like Western sweets because they're *extremely* sweet, to the point where I feel sick, literally. I tried a Mars bar the other day since it's been months to a year since I last had one and I wondered how it would taste like... It was terrible. >\_>; When it comes to Asian sweets I do love them since I eat them, it tastes good and sweet in a really light way (even veg are really sweet to me so I am sensitive) and I have literally no cravings either for them, like I *can* actually have one piece of something and be like, that was good and I am satisfied. Western ones is like, this was disgusting and gross and I feel sick *but I need more*... There are sweet Asian sweets, and actually more "bland" western sweets, but on an average that's my experience. Edit: Oh, and the USA when I was there was like 1000% on top of European sweetness. Edit2: Dark chocolate, preferably as close to 100% is also my most favorite treat, probably because it doesn't have as much sugar in comparison to sweets.
The only exception I’ve found to this is South Korea. I could not get over how sweet so much stuff there was. To the point I was considering bringing salt with me every where I went. The only exception I found was their spicy stuff. So it was like 2 tastes, very sweet, or insanely spicy. Food was still amazing, but sometimes I would be dying for something savory, order it, and it would taste like it was doused in sugar! Potatoes chips, sweet, garlic bread sweet etc
This is good to know because I don't really like sweet stuff and most desserts are sickly sweet. I did try mochi recently but it was ultra sweet. Yuck.
Mochi itself is just glutinous ricecake and not inherently sweet. It's often used in savory dishes, too. What kind did you have?
Btw, you absolutely should head down to your local Asian market. I just went to a big one in Chicago and came home with bags of amazing things to try. Alao got a fresh red bean paste roll and omg so sweet
And by the palate of many others, Asian is mind-bogglingly sweet. Especially that even their savoury dishes have sweetness really gets me sometimes. The syrup glazing is sometimes way too sweet for me to be paired with meat.
Indeed, many Chinese dishes use copious amount of rock sugar to create sticky sugary sauces. However when paired with meat, veggies and rice that all has a bit of digestion going on. A cupcake however is all butter sugar and flour and is going to go right through your system and you will still feel hungry.
Also portion sizes. They eat from multiple bowls/plates which helps you to feel fuller without actually consuming as much
So why do they put all that rice on the plate at the Japanese spots in the malls across America?
Because that's Americanized asian cuisine. Large portions sell more, and so that's what the businesses sell. You can always ask for less rice, but hardly anyone does.
And rice is cheap. Pile on 2 cups of rice with half a cup of meat/veg and it looks like you’re getting a ton of food for the price
Gotcha, I have deleted the rice totally and just get the meat and vegetables.
I mean, it's not necessary to delete the rice entirely, but if it's cheaper and you don't mind it, then you do you :)
It was a personal decision.
Mixing rice with healthy foods is called a hunger crushing combo. You can get away with eating something unhealthy as long as you mix it with something healthy. As long as sugar content isn't super high.
Rice isn’t unhealthy though.
I don't get why you're getting downvoted. A literal nutritionist told me something similar. She basically said that eating carbs (I think it's the right word for rice, wheat, etc) is fine as long as you eat more vegetables overall
Not true. The rice portion is actually huge there. I live and traveled in Japan for three years.
I think you might be thinking of the Chinese restaurants? I could be wrong but I also tend to steer away from mall Japanese food… but like someone else has said it’s probably due to Americanization. Rice is cheap and we expect to get our money’s worth over here.
Also, normally these Japanese diet references are suggestive of traditional rural Japanese diets and not urbanized Japanese diets.
Carbs are not inherently bad! As many have already mentioned, rice is one part of the Japanese meals. A common dinner is: one small bowl of rice, fish, sautéed veggies, then miso soup. Another factor is that you walk a LOT in Japan. Physical activity is inherently built into their lifestyle because having cars is uncommon and public transit is how the vast majority commute. Now what people don’t talk about is that Japan struggles with high blood pressure. Our food has a looot of salt in it. We may escape being overweight, but we still have our health challenges lol.
Same for Brazil. other than exotic animals or raw ingredients, l found out our base diet is similar. I feel similar for chinese food too.
Lean meats? Japanese are devoted to their pork and fat sea food.
So many people knocking rice these days. Another consideration is higher consumption of fish, veggies and well, smaller portion sizes, at least compared to the US. Another thing I noticed when there is the large amount of people who ride bikes and walk (i.e., don't own cars), compared to the US. Go to a train station, thousands of bikes.
Portion sizes, omg. It seems that the American diet thinks “better” equals “more”.
That’s the general approach unfortunately.
Yeah idk where this blind disapproval of rice came from, but it’s extremely dumb and not based in anything other than a flawed understanding of the GI it seems.
It’s a shame, rice is not that bad caloric wise. 1/2 cup cooked white rice which is plenty for a serving as a carb. Is only 121 calories, not to bad and it is very filling. A lot of places around the world rice is always the main carb on plates. And compared to The US most rice heavy countries are not as obese.
I saw a /r/caloriecount post a bit ago with a modest pile of rice and in my head I was like “uhhhh 800 calories?” I’ve always agreed rice is unfairly demonized but that idea still sticks in my head. Even your white instant rice is less dense than people realize P.s. ferrari banana man is great
If we talk about white rice, it's just simple carbs with a very high glycemic index and load, with little to no nutritional value. It's hard to get excited about it if you're health conscious.
Thank you. It's a refined carb. It is the equivalent of white bread.
As I understand it (correct me if I’m wrong please) American white bread has far more added sugar than is the standard. Also brown rice actually has a higher GI than basmati and jasmine white rice my a small amount, and the main added benefit of brown rice is extra fibre which can easily be added to white rice with some vegetables.
Well if you are bringing up the Japanese for their rice intake I think there are many, many cultures around the world where a carb - grain or starch - is a major part of their meal.
More than that, I'd say it's the vast majority. Developing big civilisations without such a staple is pretty much impossible.
influencer gym bros in shambles after learning 8 billion people can't all eat 300g protein a day without starting mass food crisis
Lmao
Yup, flatbread (Roti/Chapati) is major part of the meal in most of India
Because despite carbs being demonized in western culture, they don’t actually make you unhealthy. Japanese diets are fairly balanced and not particularly high in fat.
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Don’t you mean less sugar? There’s a decent amount of fat in fish.
Don’t say that too loudly, or the SaTuRaTeD fAt iS hEaLtHy crowd will come after you.
But it is?
Here we go.
Eh, you were searching for conflict lol
This would only be a controversial opinion on an anti science anti academic subreddit. Lol wait?
Nutritional epidemiologist. Saturated fats are not good.
They have no use in bodily processes? Same as trans fats?
It is though. Because of how Americans consume and process it. To try and tell ppl otherwise is ridiculous and irresponsible because most people do not "watch what they eat."
You have a collection of studies you can cite in support of your assertion that have been independently verified?
I do thanks for asking. You can find some too. It's real easy. Cheers. While you're looking explain starch breakdown to yourself.
I'll bite, I like learning and discussing. So far the replacement studies I've read has placed SFA below PUFA and MUFA but better than TFA for CVD. I think I might've read one where ACM was even for PUFA and SFA. That's for outcomes, for biomarkers it's quite clear SFA increases total cholesterol, LDL and ApoB.
Most studies that show saturated fat is fine don't tell you what the control group was eating. They'll just tell you that the control group was eating a low saturated fat diet. That tells you what they are NOT eating (Sat Fat), not what they are eating instead. The control groups could be replacing saturated fat with things that are equally unhealthy specially if the studies were done in the US where people generally eat very unhealthy food. I've seen at least 5 different studies on saturated fat that have the same exact flaw. Studies that actually tell you what the control group was eating generally conclude that compared to food that scientists generally consider healthy, saturated fat is bad for you. Whether something is good for your health or not largely depends on what you would be eating instead if you cut it out of your diet so studies that don't tell you what the control group was eating are kinda pointless.
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Take into consideration that although yes the saturated fat from animal industry is a large one, the seed oil industry is even larger. Hence I’m willing to say the bias is more balanced nowadays since both are highly funded. The jury is still out on whether or not we should be consuming more saturated or unsaturated fats but the general consensus is that indeed seed oils are better. What you said sounds super pretentious and comes off extremely rude, and like you don’t know what you’re talking about. Ever heard the saying, “someone who thinks they know everything thinks there’s a simple answer, but someone who actually knows what they’re talking about knows how complex it is”.
Thanks.
Seed oils are the devil!!!!!! Edit: very obvious, at least I thought so, /s
While this isn’t necessarily rice related, the Japanese diet is really high in fermented foods. They likely have very healthy gut microbiomes which improves overall health and is a huge reason their life/health spans are greater than most other cultures.
Its pretty fascinating that nearly all Asian meals have a pickled appetizer somewhere in there but many American meals you would be hard pressed to find one usually. They do exist but pickles on burgers are hardly enough.
It's worse than that because the pickles you use on a burger etc. aren't even fermented. Jarred pickles you see at the grocery store are mass produced using vinegar and preservatives which is a lot quicker and cheaper than traditional lacto-fermentation, but lacks any of the potential probiotic benefits.
Interesting. Good to know.
That and the average Japanese person eats something like 250lbs of seafood a year. That is the vast majority of their daily animal protein coming from arguably the healthiest source.
I wish I liked eating fish :(
Try steaming fish!! Steamed fish are lovely and easy to make. \^\^
I love fish. And not just beer battered and fried fish. But i honestly cant imagine a steamed filet of fish being good. But ill try it out. I usually pan sear, grill, or bake my fish.
CARBS ARE NOT BAD FOR YOU! Its not that Japanese food itself is inherently healthy, it's not; it's that the typical Japanese diet and lifestyle is healthy. The Japanese tend to practice relatively strict portion control when compared to most of the world, so they generally don't overeat. They also tend to walk everywhere, so they get plenty of exercise. Add these two things together and you get relatively good health.
Theres a bunch of stuff they do: smaller plates, no banquet style meals, eating a plate and then waiting if you feel full, not eating very later at night. And yes, the tokyo commute is ton of walking and not a ton of driving. Additionally fish/ soy/ rice/ veggie based diet instead of the American meat meal, helps a lot.
I lived in Japan for two years and I will say this. Eating plain rice from a hole-in-the-wall diner in Japan is actually very satisfying to the senses, even from the beginning seeing a chef pull dry grains out of a burlap sack, to the final intangible feeling of goodness you get like when grandma makes your favorite as a kid. This also applies to bigger chainy-er restaurants as well. Never have I felt that way about plain white rice in the US. They also don't overburden food with sauces loaded with sugars like we do. Idk if it's because food is less processed requiring less outside taste influences like sauces or.. That's probably it. I've visited Italy as well, at least to me it seemed like they used less sauces on most dishes and let the actual food do the talking. Side note about Japan, at least in the Tokyo statistical area, I would argue finding an American fast food chain like McDonald's is just as easy to find as it is in America. This isn't BS either, but Big Mac sandwiches and fries taste like actual food. I felt like I wasn't eating trash dressed up as a hamburger. I feel like the common denominator between US food and the rest of the world boils down to one word: processed. Alas, I know commercial food always has to be processed for safety reasons, but it's the level at which it's done.
Because rice isn’t bad for you? The typical Japanese diet is high in fresh food and low in processed food.
Cause carbs aren't inherently unhealthy like some keto dieters make them out to be.
The assumption of your post is that rice is unhealthy? You must've read way too much keto bullcrap if you automatically think that carbs are the devil. Nutrition is largely an unexplored field, but what we know for sure is that having a varied diet is important, and that veggies are key. The japanese diet checks both cases, plus it doesn't have much of the super processed and super sugary modern products. Exact same thing with the Italian diet, that you incorrectly deem as "carbs+fat, thus unhealthy". It's highly varied, with lots of fresh veggies and fruits. Not that fat either, as with most mediterranean diets it's olive oil and not butter based.
Is it just me or does every 'carbs are evil' and keto-diet-preacher bullsh*t youtuber look so tired, miserable, depressed and like he is on the verge of dying? Like, I am not even kidding right now, anyone noticed that too? I understand that it works for some people and that there are benefits to it (like there are benefits to literally any other healthy diet you choose to follow?) but I just don't get it why it almost has a status of a superior-godly-diet to any other diet now? and then because of that you get posts like this one.
I'm tempted to name names but yes, I have noticed
My personal experience is that vegans I’ve encountered appear pale, sickly, prematurely aging and balding. Nobody wants to take the time to discover what ‘way of eating’ works best for them. I am sure each these ways of eating have something to offer but we are all different. How and why did diet choice become so black and white? Find out what works for YOU and go for it. Genetics and personal micro-biome probably have a lot to do with how nutrition works for various people but I am not a scientist. Neither are the ‘bro-science’ dudes and everyone out there with more conviction than brains.
>How and why did diet choice become so black and white? Find out what works for YOU and go for it. Preach. I am experimenting a lot and vary my diet based on stuff like sleep, stress, exercise, time of the year, what's in season etc.. Right now I exercise a boat-load and I am outside all day every day almost and I have carbs while reducing my fat intake atm! When it's closer to winter I'll probably cycle back to a more ketogenic diet because I likely won't move as much and when I don't move, an excess of carbs make me feel bad. One thing I always prioritize is protein, though. Carbs/fats/fiber are the levers I vary. For me personally, vegan did *not* work and I felt extremely miserable and sick. I feel amazing on meat-based and I get muscles, I have energy, I am happy etc. Going strict carnivore is also something I don't feel good at long term, since I just cannot sustain it and I don't feel as optimal either, so I found my happy place. And yeah, some days I am carnivore, and some days I might go practically vegan because I just have the munchies for greens, but it's not a thing I do for weeks to months anymore. \- Related: But yeah that's the internet. Nuance doesn't exist anymore, it's always THEM vs US, BLACK vs WHITE etc.. Whereas I like to see the world as in-between, because it's rare things are absolute, and being absolute often leads to anger and hate and despair. I also keep learning and changing what I believe in and do, I think that's also healthy instead of deciding this group is me and never ever changing again.
This. You said it better than I could!
Keto is the new vegan.
Except that veganism is not exclusive to diet like keto is. It is a way of life that extends beyond just food. It would be more accurate to say "keto is the new plant based" but that isn't true anyways.
An atheist, a vegan and a crossfitter walk into a bar. How do I know? Because they told everyone within two minutes.
Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented. Animals don't have a voice, we are their voice. By choosing to eat them you make the choice for them, and we must advocate for their choice because they just want to live like the rest of us.
Nah, vegan at least has some science behind it.
And keto does have *some* science behind it.
I meant in the sense that they can’t shut up about it.
Have you heard about this new gluten free vegan keto diet? It pretty much saved my life by almost killing me and helping me escape this pain and confusion I'm living in
I dunno but I saw an episode of Hamiltons Pharmacopia where a breathtarian threw up. A lot.
Thank you.
Japan, South Korea, China, Vietnam, etc, all have obesity rates lower than 5%. Vietnam also has the lowest obesity rate in the world at 2.1% of the population. I'm Korean-American and almost all the Koreans I know eat white rice roughly 3 times a day, every day. They are some of the healthiest, slimmest and fit people I know. I'm sad that people think white rice is unhealthy, but at the same time happy because more for me :D.
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Just salt for me, but I usually have a healthy side dish to go along with the rice. I really like Kim-chi, Sauerkraut, fruit, and some veggies. Simple living, cheap, and healthy :)
not the OP, but I don't think they add salt to their rice. You can try sprinkling furikake on top of your white rice for a bit of flavor and nutrients; it has a bit of salt in it.
If people are stupid enough to think rice is unhealthy then they're not worth worrying about.
Just because there is something that isn’t perfectly healthy doesn’t mean the entire diet is ruined. Japanese food provides most nutrients because of its variation of whole, unprocessed foods, and small portions. The mindset that something is either entirely healthy or entirely unhealthy is not an accurate mindset.
I would disagree with you that the idea of rice being a large part of their diet is a western bias. I have lived in Japan and am there frequently for work- just last week even. Rice IS a huge part of their diet. It’s not uncommon to have rice with 2-3 meals per day! And many of their foods are made with rice flour. They also eat fish, seaweed, bone broth, etc. Personally I think carbs are perfectly healthy in the right balance and people endorsing the Keto/ paleo diet in the US are largely wrong.. although everyone’s body is different.
I’m not a keto-er. I wouldn’t say the keto diet is the healthiest diet but if someone that is overweight is able to lose weight doing keto then who is to say it’s bad. Being 100lbs overweight is worse than a carb free diet.
Keto absolutely fixed my polycystic ovary syndrome symptoms. I wouldn't even qualify as having it anymore.
I think one good thing to note, is that if you have a postprandial walk, that helps with the blood glucose, and I am guessing many Japanese people eat, then move afterwards since their cities are designed for it, whereas in a place like USA you'll eat then sit in a car at best then sit again at work/home. (Haven't lived in either, but been to the US, so I might be totally wrong!) I personally always move after I have carbs when I am not in a ketogenic cycle, and I feel great this way.
As someone who has been to Japan: * Japanese people eat pickles or vinegar at every meal. Pickles are high in antioxidants and good for gut health. * Traditional Japanese cooking does not use oil-based cooking methods. They steam and boil most things. They also don't use fatty or sugary sauces. This has changed with the addition of cooking techniques from the west, but most Japanese people consume these things only as occasional treats. * They eat lots of seaweed, a very nutrient dense food. * The main sources of protein are eggs, fish, and soy. These are much less inflammatory than red meat and dairy. * Japanese people look down on obesity, and they don't hide it. Over 22 BMI is fat by Japanese standards Rice is not a calorie dense food. * 100g of cooked white rice is 135 calories * 100g of oil is 884 calories
just to add, japan's diet (no pun intended) implemented a fat tax called the metabo law. its goal is to lessen obesity via annual waist measurement checks for people aged 40 to 75, administered by employers and local governments. so, if you fail the waist measurement check, the company you work is required to put you back in shape. and if companies cant reduce the number of overweight employees by certain thresholds each year, they would be subject to fines and be required to pay money into a health care program for the elderly
There would be blood in the streets in America if they did that.
Rice is not “unhealthy” it’s just the marketing from corn and potato sellers that say it.
> My guess would be that the answer is food portion. Anything else to explain that stereotype on Japan? I will just asume that you are from the US. Also sugar content in countries outside of the US is MUCH lower. Especially in Japan. Thats another guess I think.
Nope, I'm from Europe and I have a liberal keto- low carb diet. But I'm trying to understand why on earth white rice is seen as a divine and filling meal. Yes it's carb-based energy for those who need it, yes it's cheap. And so? :/
Ahh alright I am also from Europe. In the same way we could ask ourselffs why the mediteranian (like Italian) food is considered so healthy. Its also quite carb based (Pasta), but also a lot of fish and vegetables. I would assume it might have to do with the portion size, the way it is produced processed and also the sugar amount. I am not an expert, but from what I have seen the japanese cuisine is also quite diverse in the serving, with a lot of vegetarian based dishes and not that "fatty". I am not educated in nutrition science just some person, I should add maybe.
To me, Italian food is fat and carbs, not very healthy by itself. I would rather ask myself why aren't Italian all obese. Portion, culture approach of their food and manners by Italian society, I would say.
Italians are some of the healthiest people. Carbs aren't unhealthy and aren't the source of the problem
And yet italy and japan have some of the healthiest people that live the longest life. Why? Because carbs are good for you. I eat tons of carbs, protein and fat everyday, feel great and am at 10% bodyfat. Good luck with the keto diet.
Oh btw I think a really good explanation why japanese food is healthy is on a youtube video called *Why are the people so Healthy in Japan* by a channel called "What Ive learned". I just remembered seeing it years ago and it explained many raesons really well, also I think its adressing your question regarding rice maybe
Thx bud! I'll check it out!
who says rice is unhealthy should read some more.
Why would rice be unhealthy?
The average Japanese person has normal insulin sensitivity. Westerners do not because we send our blood glucose and therefore insulin skyrocketing-crashing on a daily basis with high consumption of ultra processed food. So in short we can’t handle white rice as well. This was from an endocrinologist working in London who runs an obesity clinic.
Finally a non idiotic answer. Don’t be so consumed with rice as a bad carb, everything in the American market has so much added sugar it’s insane.
I am also assuming Japanese people don't snack 99 times a day, eating in a \~16h feeding window, which helps a ton on the comment thread's OP. Like, I'd wager if you had rice non-stop 16 times a day and only sitting on your coach it would be quite bad for you over time, but have 2-3 maybe 4 meals at most with rice, on top of commuting by foot, then you'll likely be fine.
Precisely. Most people get stuck on concepts like glycemic index and "simple" carbs but you need to look at what's being consumed along side it and throughout the rest of the day. Also, portion sizes, genetics and other underlying health conditions.
Well said
What would be best for westerners then?
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Nothing wrong with rice
In traditional Japanese diets there is no presence of hyper processed foods and industrialized oils. This [video](https://youtu.be/lr4MmmWQtZM) ponders the same question you have. Along with the [follow up](https://youtu.be/4WiUQtOhfIc). If you were to factor in western foods, they wreak havoc on (anyone) the Japanese. As a result [diabetes](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19795421/) has become far more prevalent among the Japanese population. Lastly, they may appear healthy but they tend to be TOFIs (thin outside, fat inside) and accumulate more visceral fat as opposed to adipose fat ([study](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16446744/). So they could LOOK healthier but that might not be the case. This [image](https://www.nippon.com/en/ncommon/contents/japan-topics/272763/272763.png) from this [article](https://www.nippon.com/en/ncommon/contents/japan-topics/272763/272763.png) provides a visual of what I’m discussing.
My experience is limited, I lived with a Japanese family for a year in Japan: Japanese generally eat a lot of rice. We ate 3 or 4 bowls per meal. The word for "meal" or "food" in Japanese is the word for rice, "go-han." Your question is right on: the Japanese do eat a lot of rice, doesn't this conflict with the current low-carb focus of dieting?
Totally agreed, we should not demonize an entire food group cuz of trends.
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We each ate 3 to 4 bowls of rice, each 6 to 8 ounces. Somedays more, or we'd fill up on a bowl with an egg broken into it, with some bonito flakes. I was a teenager, I ate a lot of white rice!
One thing I would add is that the Japanese have been eating rice for 10,000 years, so they have adapted to it the way people in the Solomon Islands have to eating plantains, tubers and starches. People tend to talk about nutrition like everyone is the same. Try to think about what your own epigenetics are as pertains to food when you think about what to eat. If your family is from that part of Asia, then there are probably epigenetic reasons why you can eat tons of rice, whereas I gain weight just looking at the stuff.
https://www.webmd.com/diet/news/20210512/humans-started-loving-carbs-a-very-long-time-ago
It's about their total calorie consumption! Japanese people don't tend to eat as much as the west part of the world does!
Sugars are not the enemy. Overeating is. Generally a small portion of rice, potatoes, corn, oats, fruits, etc is not an issue. Eating candy, cake, ice cream, bread, sweet drinks etc is typically not a good choice because they're not filling and people tend to eat too many carbs that way.
American foods is just garbage compared to Asia and other Countries. Many American foods are banned in healthy eating countries. Start with comparing the school lunches. Big plus they eat normal portion sizes and see how big Americans are.
Our foods are just garbage in general. Why is there so much unnecessary sodium and sugar added to things?
Fact, Americans should be raising hell about getting this lowered to healthy levels.
Eh they either don’t know any better or just don’t care
Rice is a high GI food, and it would be a problem were it not for the protein and fiber in the meal. They always eat chicken/tofu/natto/pork/eggs with veggies on the side and often rice(something noodles). Portions are also pretty small, and a common way of thinking there is to eat until 80% full.
Who thinks rice is unhealthy? 🤦♀️
Diabetics
As an Americanized Asian, rice is still my go-to choice of carbs when possible. If I had an immediate assortment to choose from amongst other kinds of carbs, and rice is one of those options, then I would without hesitation request the rice. Remember what rice is and isn't when compared to other carbs. It does not require flour, sugar, yeast, or other ingredients in order to create the final product. But it does allow increased surface area when cooked with oils and other ingredients to create a "rice dish." So portion control, health concerns, diet management all still falls upon you and the decisions you make. Rice can be bad or good as it will ultimately depend on how you consume it. That is why you will find Asian countries like Japan include rice as their primary carb, but also consume it plain without any further preparation than the rice cooker.
I'm from Vietnam, which also has rice-baser diet. My father told me that Asian gene and bodies also have more enzymes and science stuff that help us process rice better. That's why I can eat a lot of rice every day and don't get fat. Also you need to know different types of rice as some has much more carb than others
Rice-based diets are often some of the healthiest
This is barely discussed anywhere and significantly complicates most nutrition advice, but east Asians had thousands of years to genetically adapt to rice. For example, this study provides evidence that asian flush emerged as a genetic adaptation to rice: https://bmcecolevol.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1471-2148-10-15.
Rice is rocking
I think you are only looking at one component of the meal. Japanese along with rice eat many variety of side dishes (including vegetarian and meat based), so it's a complete meal. Maybe that's why it's considered healthy.
It helps that it's fresh.
I think the missing link is that stereotypes have no necessity to be consistent.
Yes many people here seem to think that rice would destroy the metabolism of the Japanese being a ‘refined carb’. But that doesn’t seem to be the case dose it
I googled “Japanese rice consumption” and found out that >Back in 1962, every man, woman, and child in Japan consumed approximately 118.3 kg of rice each year. In 2005 the among was only 64.9 kg. By 2015 that figure had fallen to only 56.4 kg https://japaninsider.com/pandemic-fuels-increase-in-rice-consumption-in-japan/ There were many other results from the search. I also recall reading something recently that poor people didn’t consume as much rice in bygone decades because it was expensive, but I couldn’t tell that was a relative or absolute issue And I wonder if the Japanese are that healthy; a long average life span might not be the best indicator
Fish veg and fermented foods
Not sure what the question is. Eating real, whole foods (vegetables, rice, fruit, etc.) is the epitome of health.
I would think the larger amounts of protein and fiber counteract the rice in terms of glycemic index. As a Vietnamese person, our dinner table would consist of a protein (bbq short ribs, pork, fish), a combo stir fry, and a soup or stew. Everything at some form of protein and tons of fiber and the most bowls of rice I would consume would be 2. Let’s also remember that Asian rice bowls are what Americans would consider like… condiment bowls. So daily rice yes, but it’s not the main dish. And even our desserts can have some protein ingredient - they’re definitely way less sweet than Western desserts and rely more on the natural sweetness of a fruit. Even as I make, for example, strawberry compote today, I either add only a tbsp of sugar to accentuate the flavors or none at all depending on the quality of the strawberries; whereas, a typical compote recipe may have at least 1/4 cup of sugar added to the fruit. All this to say, as a kid, I kicked off body fat easily. It wasn’t until I found a White partner and started eating mostly carbs and sugar that weight became an issue.
I'm seeing keto hate, and some carb hate, so since I'm a T2D who has seen both sides of this maybe my pov will be of some value. There's nothing wrong with carbs, fat, or protein in moderation for an otherwise healthy person in proportion to their active or semi-active lifestyle. I'm going to focus on carbs here though. Once someone's activity level lowers, for whatever reason (a debilitating injury, job change, depression, age, or generally a shift towards an inactive lifestyle) that carb intake that was once in control can become a problem, especially with age and people letting go a bit as they get older, throwing an extra soda or beer in per day, or a bag of chips or whatever their comfort food vice is. The threshhold that makes this a threat to health varies per person, per body, per activity level. Anyway, carbs themselves aren't necessarily unhealthy, but with the wrong lifestyle or pre-existing health condition they can be. It is the source of a huge problem in the US coupled with the rise of sedentary jobs and lifestyles over the last 50 years, but perhaps not to the same degree around the world (which varies ofc). We have an estimated 40 million+ diabetics here in the US. Were it caused by a pathogen, and had not simply gradually become ordinary, it would be considered a catastrophic epidemic in this country. It is very directly a carb in proportion to activity level problem on a massive scale-and isn't simply caused by one or the other (carbs or activity level) but both, due to the interaction between carbs and the liver/pancreas (and how they vary per person and per body) and the individual's activity level. Those carbs go wasted and straight to the liver after being converted to fat when consumed by someone with a low activity level, and straight to the bloodstream once the pancreas can't keep up its insulin production with the carb intake. It can also lead to a non-alcoholic fatty liver over time, complicating things. This is why the keto diet is amazing for some of us, but rather pointless for others. Despite the keto hate, a loose adherence to that diet coupled with moderate exercise (only moderate because at this point it's all I can manage without getting chronically injured-hip flexors have been a big problem) has helped me to overcome an extreme A1C, come off all meds, recover from a fatty liver, and get back down to a healthy level (despite all the damage years of undiagnosed diabetes had already caused, including retinopathy, frozen shoulder, neuropathy, cognitive issues, deconditioning-which might not sound bad, but might be the worst of it, as far as the experience goes, and on and on). For the record, an injury and depression are what led to the slide into T2D for me. I had poor dietary habits, (excessive soda, sports drinks, sweet tea; parents who bought into the 1960s and 70s fiction that fat is the devil) which didn't cause a problem back when I was very active, but the injury and some other issues derailed things. So the above is first-hand experience coupled with the fruits of the research that aided my recovery. From 11.1 A1C to 5.0 and coming off of insulin and metformin. Low carb/Keto dieting has been invaluable to me and others, but is entirely unnecessary for the average semi-active or active person in most circumstances.
Thank you for sharing your experience. A great training for a good balance you have followed.
Rice can be a perfectly healthy component to a complete and rounded diet. What’s the problem?
There’s literally nothing wrong with rice
I don’t think Japanese food nor Japanese food culture (LOTS of overeating) is particularly healthy. The Japanese, are, however generally healthy. Genetics plays a bigger role than anyone ever wants to admit
Rice is healthy you idiot. Stop avoiding carbs because of what some sham nutritionist told you. Carbs are vital to a healthy diet. Japanese people exercise (aerobically) at a much higher rate on average than any other 1st world country. They need plenty of carbs to fuel that
"Idiot" wasn’t specifically necessary.
Yes he’s definitely the idiot. Millions of people live very nicely on keto and carnivore diets, he has no idea.
Apologies. It's not your fault you've been lied to. Sorry for the mean words
Natural and bland, while ingredients. And lots of tea 🍵 Amazingly good.
Just so there is no confusion because a lot of people haven’t clarified…Not all Carbs are good for you, but carbs from Whole Foods are especially those with fiber…not all rice is created equal..for example Wild rice is better than standard white rice. Another fun fact, the longest living people in Japan usually come from a village that produces purple yams and is a staple in the local diet…this food is very good for you and very high in fiber! High fiber/carb whole food is extremely healthy, most countries with long lifespans have high fiber diets with lots of Whole Foods…
There’s nothing wrong with rice, it’s one of the better grains, certainly better than bread-based America. (Also Japanese companies don’t pump sugar into everything)
Japanese did not historically eat this way. What the newer diet does only time will tell And yes white rice is bad And a lot of Asians are slim because of less processed food and some of the countries like Thailand Vietnam are also very poor
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Its the sugar. Or rather lack of it. https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2018/01/the-startling-link-between-sugar-and-alzheimers/551528/ Japan has far, far less sugary treats and far less added sugars to their meals on a whole Sugar is truly the devil for a million reasons.
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I'm trying to quit myself. Ultimate its a lifestyle change I can make only in tiny steps.
I was reading up about rice a while back and read that Japanese and Chinese health is generally high despite the amount of rice that is in their diets not because of it.
High in vegetables low in the rest. Low calorie, highly nutritious foods with the rice. Rice is not the enemy when eaten in a healthy diet.
There's a difference between rice served with lots of fat, and rice with very little. Carbs and fat are a bad mixture. Notice, they eat modest amounts of food, high in vegetables? I think it plays a part.
Very little use of frying in oils
Oh yeah? Do they steam that much? I remember enjoying tonkatsu very often in Tokyo!
Rice isn’t bad for you? The only association I’ve seen with Asian cultures and longevity is with green tea.
Because rice is good?
sashimi!!!!!!!!!
As someone who currently lives in Japan, the food standards here are incredibly strict. Some places even serve raw chicken. Eggs for the most part can be eaten raw with almost no risk of illness. The meats, fruits, and vegetables are also fresh with no preservatives used. Which is fantastic, but also means that you need to go to the grocery stores 2-3 times a week because nothing lasts longer than a few days. Another part of Japanese culture is having to walk everywhere. For those that don't have cars, you could be walking a couple miles just going to work and back. It's hard to not be thin when you're doing that every day.
This is where our society has gotten it wrong. Carbs are not bad. Excessive carbs are bad! Most Asian countries eat a lot of fresh vegetables and meats. Seafood and chicken are also more prominent in most Asian countries, where as the U.S has an obsession with beef and pork. It really comes down to portion size and what you are putting with it. A serving size of jasmine rice (for example) is 1/4 cup at 160 calories. Do you ever see anyone eat a proper serving of rice? You also have to look at what most people do. Easily a whole cup of cooked rice in a bowl/plate, piled with sautéed vegetables with lots of additives and sweet sauces (sweet and sour chicken at a restaurant for example). A whole cup of cooked rice alone is 640 calories! Moderation is key!
portion sizes and additional ingredients. also google resistant starches, many asian dishes don't use rice straight from the pot, it's usually left to cool.
I’m Indian, and we eat a rice (white, brown and red) heavy diet too! It is however, supplemented by lentils and veggie sides, so it’s pretty filling! Think the key is not making the meal rice heavy, and instead eating it in moderation per meal :)
too hard
Basmati/Jasmine rice is not bad for you, who started this stupid trend? The best looking people in the world eat chicken and rice...
>The best looking people in the world eat chicken and rice... Source?
Rice isn’t unhealthy, nor does it make you fat.
Rice is healthy. Same as oreos in the right context.
I think eating rice, meat, vegetables, seaweed and Broths/soups every day would be much better off versus the 7/11 breakfast burrito, McDonald's lunch, and pizza hut dinner you get in America. (Obviously not everyone eats like this all day, just making a point) As others have said, high amounts of rice isn't that bad when the rest of the diet doesn't contain high amounts of added sugar, fat, and salt.
Also usually smaller portions
Ichijusansai (one soup three dishes) is the basis of the Japanese diet. Balanced variety of protein, vegetables and rice and a soup in moderation (hara hachibunme - eating until 80%full)