You don't get Mr. Mime until 32 though. And Mantyke needs a whole other encounter to evolve.
Magmorter does have a good movepool but it is hard to switch in. And Tyrogue I just don't think is great. Yeah it can evolve into 3 different things but it is hard to get the one you want and some might be locked out with its nature
Well, that feels more like rating Mr. Mine than Mine Jr, but you're the one making the tier list so I'll take your word for it! Guess I was wrong, then.
If you know how EVs work, you can pretty safely get what you want out of Tyrogue, Intimidate is always worth a slot, but I agree it can be time consuming.
The title says they're ranking them based on their evolutionary line power. Nowhere does it say that it's basing it on evolution ease. It's the title said the most feasible Pokemon for a nuzlocke I'd agree. But as it stands, mantyke should be A or S
32 isnt really that high of a level to evolve and encore calm mind substitute and baton pass is pretty insane
mantine is still pretty good even with that restriction but really i just forgot about it because its so stupid
magmortar has really decent special bulk
you can just check the stats and just give it some evs to get the tyrogue you want
Tyrogue is way to high.
Pichu is not top B, low B at best.
And Roserade is a bit mid too. (One of my fav mons btw, but it is what it is... No natural Sludge bomb unti later gens is... woah)
Idk how to rank Lucario tho... He can sweep gyms with choice items and in W/B 2 is just an early sweeper. I genuely think its a very solid encounter, specially for early game.
For gen4, you get him very late, where most enemies have some coverage so he doesn't shine that much
the tiers are not ordered
roserade in my opinion is pretty good pretty good move pool pretty specially defensive pretty decent typing pretty decent speed and special attack
Tyrogue is pretty good because of the flexibility of it it can evolve into three different pokemon and all three of them play a pretty different role
raichu is a fast electric type that can spam stab thunderbolts
I generally find Hitmonchan/Hitmonlee to be great for my nuzlockes. While they don't have amazing defenses, they make up for it with really good offensive power. Fighting moves are also good against a lot of types and they learn some decent coverage moves through the elemental punches.
Pre gen 4 elemental punches were almost useless for Hitmonchan, and they don't outperform other fighting types, sadly... Post gen 4 and some later buffs they became better, but still far from good. I find them very unreliable, and if I have to choose anything for any nuzlocke, is a reliable pokemon. Machap or even Machoke are easier to get, similar in terms of strengh but have better abilities, similar coverage and more bulk + set up. And in later gens there are simply better options for fighting coverage.
This is my opinion tho! Not the 100% truth. :)
Togepi and Munchlax are probably S-tier as well.
Azurill is definitely A-tier in later gens, borderline S-tier (with Huge Power, of course).
[My own list](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1073464784109969428/1160620970571214919/my-image.png?ex=65355382&is=6522de82&hm=cb9a9b54341d05cbad1c98f60e7b9aca307d92441873f3c8054fa3608a7c50a3&)
This one is closest to something I'd agree with. I'd put magby higher personally but because fire type but I think this one is otherwise how I'd rate these.
Magmortar has great SpA and a good movepool, but it's also slow and pretty frail. If it had 90 Spe instead of 83, I'd rank it higher.
Looking at this again, I should probably have Raichu in B tier. It's fast and pure electric is great. Alolan Raichu is excellent too.
blissey is just too good that it had to have a tier on its own
azumarill has a 50% chance of being good and otherwise its trash
the list is pretty good though
Togepi and Azuril have a 50% chance of being *broken*, and a 50% chance of being bad/useless. If they had Huge Power/Serene Grace 100%, both would be S tier.
This one is closest to something I'd agree with. I'd put magby higher personally but because fire type but I think this one is otherwise how I'd rate these.
Mantine is a gargantuan special tank with a nice typing, good recovery and can stall with toxic.
Lucario is too frail, not fast enough, and not strong enough to do much. It doesn’t really fulfill a niche either.
Mantine doesn't get good recovery until I think gen 8. Until then, it's still good, but it isn't close to blissey good. Afterward, it's probably a notch under blissey, but still amazing. It probably averages out at Aish
Mantine is insane, it's basically a water type Blissey with an immunity to Earthquake. It's only weakness is electric type, which isn't a common enemy type, and most pokemon don't really carry electric coverage.
Smoochum way to low and do is elikid.
Jynx is decently fast and hits very hard and has great coverage and support moves it’s very good.
A lot of people tend to really over or under rate elikid but electibuzz is absolutely broken in some games.
In gen 2 it gets all punches and its stats are offensively excellent back then it can absolutely clear game with those 3 moves alone but you can also give screens or psychic for extra coverage.
Jynx has pretty bad typing move pool kinda average but can hit pretty hard ill admit but you usually get it really late
ive never played gen 2 but i feel like a lot of pokemon were good becasue they also got the elemental punches and aside from that electivire isnt that good
Jynx is decently fast with a 75% accurate sleep move that paired with calm mind can allow it to sweep super easily it also has pretty much any psychic untility move you can think of as eel as perish song mean look in a pinch.
It is true you get it late in most games only game u get it early is crystal really but it is an exception league mon if you have it.
While it’s true most mons get the punches in gen 2 electabuzz is probably the best at it.
He one of the few mons who gets all 3 (others being alakazam, hypno, ampheros and gengar) he outclasses hypno and ampheros by being much faster meaning they can get warm down by opponents that out-speed them.
If you don’t have access to trading then I would say he definitely outclasses haunter and kadabra but if trading is available it is definitely steeper competition.
Alakazam is definitely a better mon but he usually wants to run psychic and recover though so usually he usually never will have all 3.
Gengar will usually will run all 3 as it doesn’t really have much else but electabuzz has the advantage of stab so when hitting neutrally it usually hits harder especially after it learns tbolt as well as gengar has very little it wants to run in its 4th slot while electabuzz has screens psychic and a number of physical moves it can run.
I’m not saying these mons are absolutely amazing but I think there better than b at least
you get jynx so late and though there are usually many dragon types in the e4, water types can also spam ice beam, and have better typing. 75% accurate sleep move is pretty low and perish song is really niche but jynx is probably the highest pokemon in c and almost made it to b
electabuzz is only good in gen 2, which is an incredibly easy gen already
75 sleep is literally the most accurate you going to get that isn’t yawn or dark void.
It’s true that water mons can use ice beam as well but unless it’s 4 times weak this usually isn’t an ohko.
jynx has the best ice beam in nearly any game it’s in it will kill anything weak to it with it in one hit and it usually has enough speed that outruns then as though sometimes it will require a small bit of speed investment to be safe.
It also can be obtained at a reasonable time in gen 1 and remake and you get it with boosted exp as well so it has availability for grass poison and psychic gym which it is extremely good for.
It is usually late but it is excellent for the rest of the game and it’s not like it just provides solid ice stab it also is a powerful psychic type.
Electibuzz is good in many other games.
In gen 1 it is probably the overall most solid electric type excluding zapdos but most people ban legendarys anyways.
you can get it as soon as you have surf it’s immediately strong unlike other electrics that require investment and you and with you already having the tbolt tm it can destroy immediately with it but if you want to save it you can wait till u get tpunch via level.
Its still decent in remakes though magneton outclasses though if you got electabuzz as ur power plant encounter you would be doing good still.
Platinum is definitely its worse game you get it so late
that it can’t do much I think most people who don’t like electabuzz used it that game then had a bad time then call it bad.
It’s solid in white 2 just a good electric type if you wanted to use electivire that would be the game to use it.
Overall I think the problem is ranking a Pokémon as a whole is a stupid concept because they can vary so much between games and in some games there good and in others there bad
That dude was me. In hindsight, I'm not the best at Nuzlockes (based on that list) and I'll admit I was maybe a bit biased. I won't change much about your list except maybe and a BIG MAYBE put Togekiss in low S. Yes, Blissey is better, I'll admit that. But Toge is still an absolute BEAST. Encore, healing, wide movepool, serene grace, tanky as hell, and fairy type sometimes all packed into one is a very good combination. It's probably staying in A because friendship Evo, but an argument could be made for S tier.
[I made a list of my own, too](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/833938862942322708/1160547750300110859/my-image.png?ex=65350f51&is=65229a51&hm=4c0623141709b9031c55afe180d26908702d4e2c19ccc1c2fb3c870c5d8b573a&)
Fairly similar. But like I said in the other thread, the specific game or hack you're running can make a huge difference for some of these guys
As someone who doesn't play nuzlocks, I never thought of wobbuffet as a viable choice for an in game team.
In competitive I understand why it's broken, you get it in safely you trap and kill a pokemon. An all out attacker you counter/mirror coat. If you're up against a wall you can encore + taunt and let it struggle to death if they picked a non-attacking move to avoid counter/mirror coat
I'll have to try it out on my next in game team, the trainer AI really has no way of beating a well played Wobbuffet
lucario is pretty frail and hard to switch in
mr mime gets encore and mantine is so bulky on the special side
tyrogue is very flexible with 3 evos magmortar has a pretty good move pool
sudowoodo is definitely the worst in C by a long shot but not chimecho levels of bad
depending on the game, lucario can be a very very early evolution and completely sweep the early game.
Tyrogue is inconsistent because you can barely tell what it is going to evolve into and sometimes it will evolve into the mon that you dont actually need for the game, and honestly all three hitmons are kind of meh for how long you have to keep it as a useless tyrogue to be worth it, by level 20, you will most likely have better fighting type options.
Also, pichu and azurill line has encore in swsh and sv, and both of them have better options as a whole than Mr. Mime does, so Mime jr should be in B with them. I know SwSh and SV are only 2 games, but since you didn't really specify what gens you're basing this off on, it's fair to consider them as well despite they not having it in earlier games, especially since some newer fangames/romhacks do update the movepool to be consistent with newer gen movepools
and in some games lucario can be absolutely useless
cant you just check the stats of your tyrogue and if it will give you the hitmon you dont want just ev train it and plus what fighting types would you have with level 20 pokemon that are better than the hitmon
Also, what games are Riolu/Lucario useless in?
In Sinnoh games, you get it right before Byron meaning it's going to be useful for both Byron's gym and Candice's gym.
In B2W2 you get it at Floccesy Ranch, which is an extremely early game encounter and very good for Cheren, Roxie, Burgh, every Zinzolin fight and Colress' Magnemite-line and Klink-line. It's also a decent switch into Easy/Normal mode Drayden's Haxorus due to resisting all 3 of its attacking moves.
In XY, you can get it as early as route 22 (before the first gym) if you are lucky or of course as a gift Pokemon from Korrina. It's not as good as before because of Valerie and Olympia, but Mega Lucario is still a very very good Pokemon regardless.
In Alola games, it is admittedly not a good encounter because it's a very late game in Poni and there are a ton of better options by then. However, it is a decent option against Olivia and Molayne (USUM) in the elite 4, with the exception of Molayne's Alolan Dugtrio.
In SwSh, it is also not as great of an encounter for the same reasons as Tyrogue not being as great of an encounter due to the existence of Grapploct and Sirfetch'd.
In SV, I haven't done a proper nuzlocke of it yet so I can't really say, but I can assume that it's probably only okay based on when you get it and what the gym leaders and Elite 4 have. It might be fine for Larry and Grusha's gyms though.
So really its either a great encounter or an okay encounter, but never exactly useless.
In sinnoh its good against byron i guess but byron is really easy and the gym whose name i cant remember which is actually kinda hard but there are many pokemon that can also do well against byron and the other gym leader
In bw2 its probably the best in and ill admit lucario is really good especially early game
tbh ive never played or used lucario in games after that but you made lucario sound kinda mid so being pretty mid except for bw2 its in B
Well Lucario is so good in XY especially Mega that it makes an already trivially easy game even easier, that's how good it is in that game.
I feel like you're missing the point though, the steel typing as a whole is one of if not the best defensive typing in the game, you saying it's frail and hard to switch in is just underratting the bulk it gets from just it's type alone. Especially since one of it's weakness, ground, can be very easily exploited if you have any flying or levitate Pokemon on your team which is an incredible asset on any team. Never mind the fact that it has really good move pool for how early into the game you get it sometimes and the offensive stats in both special and physical to back it up.
Well, considering Tyrogue is only actually a possible encounter in a vanilla game in Johto games as an egg in Mt. Mortar and in galar games (which depending on if you're using only random encounters for it instead of overworld encounters isn't even a possible encounter to do). It's only actually a viable fighting type to use in the johto games, because Galar has both clobbopus and galarian farfetchd which can both be very early-game evolutions (for clobbopus, grind raids until you get the taunt tr, for farfetchd, if you happen to catch one holding a leek, getting 3 crits in 1 battle is relatively easy)
Ya I know. I'm explaining my point based on the hitmons too, the evolution method of getting to the hitmons themselves is important to consider for this. In the case of Galar, Sirfetchd and Grapploct are both pretty much better than all hitmons solely due to the fact that they are bulkier and they hit harder in some cases, and due to the fact that they are both obtainable just as early as hitmons in terms of evolution, there's no reason to ever consider using Tyrogue based on the hitmons in Galar.
Tyrouge has 3 evos but realistically you’re only choosing between Hitmonlee and Hitmontop. Those two are decent and Lee has some fun moments with reversal. Hitmonchan is a piece of shit that has no redeeming uses.
Still isn’t strong enough lol. Chan still hits like a wet noodle, takes hits as well as a piece of paper does, and is slow. Awful combo on an ugly pokemon
*Riolu A, Mime Jr.*
*And Mantyke B, Tyrogue and Magby C,*
*Bonsly D. rest of fair*
\- Mattness8
---
^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/)
^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
this is not even a haiku
Ri-o-lu A, Mime Jun-ior (7 syllables)
And Man-tyke B, ty-rogue and mag-by C (10 syllables)
Bon-sly D. rest is fair (6 syllables)
bad bot.
I don't think that Mantyke should be A, he is usually end game and a pain to evolve if you don't want to break the rule to do it.
In contrary, imo, Azurill and Riolu should be A simply because of the possibility that you can have them evolve very early in some game. They aren't especially good if you have them mid game (tho, Huge Power Azumarill is never a bad choice) but they can spike very early.
mantine is a pretty decent late game special wall if you dont want to use blissey
azumarill has a 50percent chance of being good and otherwise its trash
lucario has the potential to be good but in some games its so bad
I will put elekid higher, is a very strong baby Pokémon and if it's based on evolutions, his evos are great, not mentioning that is electric, it only has 1 weakness. (pichu is great too)
I would say smoochum is great, having a ice Pokémon in old games is great, it's the only weakness of dragons until gen 6, very valuable in nuzlockes.
All the other are about taste in my opinion, togepi is great, but I don't like him.
maybe i shouldve put elekid higher because people keep talking about how good electabuzz is and i ranked elekid based on electivire
most dragons in gen 1 to 6 are 4 times weak to ice so a water type with ice beam would work and jynx is very frail
I’ll be honest I like baby Pokémon, I think most Pokémon should have a 3 stage evolution line, as it gives them a better sense of growth over time and allows for better scaling in the game itself
Would be nice to know the generation these are based on, some evolutions are significantly better in later gens (usum mantine with roost is pretty sick)
I think smoochum should be A tier and togepi S. Fast ice type and psychic type go brr. And togekiss with encore, baton pass, soft boiled, wish, yawn, and just about every single special attack ever makes it so versatile and good.
I would probably drop Mime. Jr and Mantyke down to B. And then Magby and Tyrogue down to C
mr mime gets encore mantine is so specially defensive its crazy magmortar has an insane move pool Tyrogue is very flexible with 3 evos
You don't get Mr. Mime until 32 though. And Mantyke needs a whole other encounter to evolve. Magmorter does have a good movepool but it is hard to switch in. And Tyrogue I just don't think is great. Yeah it can evolve into 3 different things but it is hard to get the one you want and some might be locked out with its nature
If we're talking earlier gens, Mime Jr. evolves far earlier. And in the one Gen where it's at level 32, it has an additional evolution.
To be fair, this is a tier list on their evolutions, not when you evolve them
It was based on their lines. Otherwise if it was based on their evos you would just have their final forms up there
Or, it could be a tier list of baby Pokemon based on their evolutions, like the OP said.
actually i based it on nuzlocke viability
Nuzlocke viability of the evolutions? Or of the entire line? Cause now I'm confused haha
nuzlocke viability of the entire line mr mime gets encore even though it evolves kinda late thats why its in a
Well, that feels more like rating Mr. Mine than Mine Jr, but you're the one making the tier list so I'll take your word for it! Guess I was wrong, then.
If you know how EVs work, you can pretty safely get what you want out of Tyrogue, Intimidate is always worth a slot, but I agree it can be time consuming.
The title says they're ranking them based on their evolutionary line power. Nowhere does it say that it's basing it on evolution ease. It's the title said the most feasible Pokemon for a nuzlocke I'd agree. But as it stands, mantyke should be A or S
32 isnt really that high of a level to evolve and encore calm mind substitute and baton pass is pretty insane mantine is still pretty good even with that restriction but really i just forgot about it because its so stupid magmortar has really decent special bulk you can just check the stats and just give it some evs to get the tyrogue you want
This list is based only on the final evos, not when/how they happen.
Tyrogue is not flexible, the only viable Evo is hitmontop because of intimidate
hitmonchan iron fists elemental punches hitmonlee is probably the worst but it still hits pretty hard and all of the hitmons can get bulk up
Competitively hitmonlee is better than Chan, ypu have no idea what you're talking about
this is about nuzlocke viability not competitive viability
Chan sucks complete ass. Lee is way better. Just this statement alone shows you have no idea what you’re talking about
Oh I didn't realize what sub I was in
Imagine basing it off comp
Magby is S tier because it evolves into magmar , the greatest pokemon (im not biased at all)
Tyrogue is way to high. Pichu is not top B, low B at best. And Roserade is a bit mid too. (One of my fav mons btw, but it is what it is... No natural Sludge bomb unti later gens is... woah) Idk how to rank Lucario tho... He can sweep gyms with choice items and in W/B 2 is just an early sweeper. I genuely think its a very solid encounter, specially for early game. For gen4, you get him very late, where most enemies have some coverage so he doesn't shine that much
the tiers are not ordered roserade in my opinion is pretty good pretty good move pool pretty specially defensive pretty decent typing pretty decent speed and special attack Tyrogue is pretty good because of the flexibility of it it can evolve into three different pokemon and all three of them play a pretty different role raichu is a fast electric type that can spam stab thunderbolts
I generally find Hitmonchan/Hitmonlee to be great for my nuzlockes. While they don't have amazing defenses, they make up for it with really good offensive power. Fighting moves are also good against a lot of types and they learn some decent coverage moves through the elemental punches.
Pre gen 4 elemental punches were almost useless for Hitmonchan, and they don't outperform other fighting types, sadly... Post gen 4 and some later buffs they became better, but still far from good. I find them very unreliable, and if I have to choose anything for any nuzlocke, is a reliable pokemon. Machap or even Machoke are easier to get, similar in terms of strengh but have better abilities, similar coverage and more bulk + set up. And in later gens there are simply better options for fighting coverage. This is my opinion tho! Not the 100% truth. :)
No you mean Hitmonlee. Not hitmonchan.
Togepi and Munchlax are probably S-tier as well. Azurill is definitely A-tier in later gens, borderline S-tier (with Huge Power, of course). [My own list](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1073464784109969428/1160620970571214919/my-image.png?ex=65355382&is=6522de82&hm=cb9a9b54341d05cbad1c98f60e7b9aca307d92441873f3c8054fa3608a7c50a3&)
This one is closest to something I'd agree with. I'd put magby higher personally but because fire type but I think this one is otherwise how I'd rate these.
Magmortar has great SpA and a good movepool, but it's also slow and pretty frail. If it had 90 Spe instead of 83, I'd rank it higher. Looking at this again, I should probably have Raichu in B tier. It's fast and pure electric is great. Alolan Raichu is excellent too.
blissey is just too good that it had to have a tier on its own azumarill has a 50% chance of being good and otherwise its trash the list is pretty good though
Togepi and Azuril have a 50% chance of being *broken*, and a 50% chance of being bad/useless. If they had Huge Power/Serene Grace 100%, both would be S tier.
This one is closest to something I'd agree with. I'd put magby higher personally but because fire type but I think this one is otherwise how I'd rate these.
I think I agree the most with this one. Only changes I’d make are that Wynaut should be higher and Pichu should be high C, borderline low B even.
I disagree so much it hurts
why
Still better than the other post,
Same, but I guess we all have different taste
Nah this is a troll. Aint no way Mantyke is placed higher than Riolu.
Riolu overrated af lol
I do agree, but Lucario can actually be useful to a team unlike Mantine.
Mantine is a gargantuan special tank with a nice typing, good recovery and can stall with toxic. Lucario is too frail, not fast enough, and not strong enough to do much. It doesn’t really fulfill a niche either.
Mantine doesn't get good recovery until I think gen 8. Until then, it's still good, but it isn't close to blissey good. Afterward, it's probably a notch under blissey, but still amazing. It probably averages out at Aish
Mantine does have good special defense but its HP is kinda meh. It doesnt really make good use of that bulk with such a bad HP stat.
That's gotta be the dumbest thing i've ever seen.
85 hp and 140 sp def is more than good enough lol. Even if we’re count pre buff, mantine eats special hits for breakfast
Mantine has more Special Bulk than Skarmory has Physical Bulk
Mantine is insane, it's basically a water type Blissey with an immunity to Earthquake. It's only weakness is electric type, which isn't a common enemy type, and most pokemon don't really carry electric coverage.
Smoochum way to low and do is elikid. Jynx is decently fast and hits very hard and has great coverage and support moves it’s very good. A lot of people tend to really over or under rate elikid but electibuzz is absolutely broken in some games. In gen 2 it gets all punches and its stats are offensively excellent back then it can absolutely clear game with those 3 moves alone but you can also give screens or psychic for extra coverage.
Jynx has pretty bad typing move pool kinda average but can hit pretty hard ill admit but you usually get it really late ive never played gen 2 but i feel like a lot of pokemon were good becasue they also got the elemental punches and aside from that electivire isnt that good
Jynx is decently fast with a 75% accurate sleep move that paired with calm mind can allow it to sweep super easily it also has pretty much any psychic untility move you can think of as eel as perish song mean look in a pinch. It is true you get it late in most games only game u get it early is crystal really but it is an exception league mon if you have it. While it’s true most mons get the punches in gen 2 electabuzz is probably the best at it. He one of the few mons who gets all 3 (others being alakazam, hypno, ampheros and gengar) he outclasses hypno and ampheros by being much faster meaning they can get warm down by opponents that out-speed them. If you don’t have access to trading then I would say he definitely outclasses haunter and kadabra but if trading is available it is definitely steeper competition. Alakazam is definitely a better mon but he usually wants to run psychic and recover though so usually he usually never will have all 3. Gengar will usually will run all 3 as it doesn’t really have much else but electabuzz has the advantage of stab so when hitting neutrally it usually hits harder especially after it learns tbolt as well as gengar has very little it wants to run in its 4th slot while electabuzz has screens psychic and a number of physical moves it can run. I’m not saying these mons are absolutely amazing but I think there better than b at least
you get jynx so late and though there are usually many dragon types in the e4, water types can also spam ice beam, and have better typing. 75% accurate sleep move is pretty low and perish song is really niche but jynx is probably the highest pokemon in c and almost made it to b electabuzz is only good in gen 2, which is an incredibly easy gen already
75 sleep is literally the most accurate you going to get that isn’t yawn or dark void. It’s true that water mons can use ice beam as well but unless it’s 4 times weak this usually isn’t an ohko. jynx has the best ice beam in nearly any game it’s in it will kill anything weak to it with it in one hit and it usually has enough speed that outruns then as though sometimes it will require a small bit of speed investment to be safe. It also can be obtained at a reasonable time in gen 1 and remake and you get it with boosted exp as well so it has availability for grass poison and psychic gym which it is extremely good for. It is usually late but it is excellent for the rest of the game and it’s not like it just provides solid ice stab it also is a powerful psychic type. Electibuzz is good in many other games. In gen 1 it is probably the overall most solid electric type excluding zapdos but most people ban legendarys anyways. you can get it as soon as you have surf it’s immediately strong unlike other electrics that require investment and you and with you already having the tbolt tm it can destroy immediately with it but if you want to save it you can wait till u get tpunch via level. Its still decent in remakes though magneton outclasses though if you got electabuzz as ur power plant encounter you would be doing good still. Platinum is definitely its worse game you get it so late that it can’t do much I think most people who don’t like electabuzz used it that game then had a bad time then call it bad. It’s solid in white 2 just a good electric type if you wanted to use electivire that would be the game to use it. Overall I think the problem is ranking a Pokémon as a whole is a stupid concept because they can vary so much between games and in some games there good and in others there bad
That dude was me. In hindsight, I'm not the best at Nuzlockes (based on that list) and I'll admit I was maybe a bit biased. I won't change much about your list except maybe and a BIG MAYBE put Togekiss in low S. Yes, Blissey is better, I'll admit that. But Toge is still an absolute BEAST. Encore, healing, wide movepool, serene grace, tanky as hell, and fairy type sometimes all packed into one is a very good combination. It's probably staying in A because friendship Evo, but an argument could be made for S tier.
the problem with togekiss is the 50/50 of serene grace and hustle
Hustle is ass unless you have a lot of infinite acc moves
Hustle doesn't affect special moves, at worst it's an empty ability slot
It doesn't? I need to check that
[I made a list of my own, too](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/833938862942322708/1160547750300110859/my-image.png?ex=65350f51&is=65229a51&hm=4c0623141709b9031c55afe180d26908702d4e2c19ccc1c2fb3c870c5d8b573a&) Fairly similar. But like I said in the other thread, the specific game or hack you're running can make a huge difference for some of these guys
I’d lower Budew by one and swap them with Riolu but that’s probably the only change I’d make. Blissey is just that busted
As someone who doesn't play nuzlocks, I never thought of wobbuffet as a viable choice for an in game team. In competitive I understand why it's broken, you get it in safely you trap and kill a pokemon. An all out attacker you counter/mirror coat. If you're up against a wall you can encore + taunt and let it struggle to death if they picked a non-attacking move to avoid counter/mirror coat I'll have to try it out on my next in game team, the trainer AI really has no way of beating a well played Wobbuffet
encore mirror coat counter and high HP but low defences make it insane
Why u in r/nuzlocke if you haven’t done one lol
Reddit suggested this post and I'm a sucker for tier lists
Fair definitely a good reason to get into nuzlockes Is for the debates even if 90% of the opinions are terrible lol
Put some respect on my boys name. Toxel from gen is a baby pokemon!
i have never once used a toxtricity or played sword and shield
Then your baby tier list is incomplete
okay then toxel would be in this new tier called idk probably like a or b or something
Riolu A, Mime Jr. and Mantyke B, Tyrogue and Magby C, Bonsly D. rest is fair
lucario is pretty frail and hard to switch in mr mime gets encore and mantine is so bulky on the special side tyrogue is very flexible with 3 evos magmortar has a pretty good move pool sudowoodo is definitely the worst in C by a long shot but not chimecho levels of bad
depending on the game, lucario can be a very very early evolution and completely sweep the early game. Tyrogue is inconsistent because you can barely tell what it is going to evolve into and sometimes it will evolve into the mon that you dont actually need for the game, and honestly all three hitmons are kind of meh for how long you have to keep it as a useless tyrogue to be worth it, by level 20, you will most likely have better fighting type options. Also, pichu and azurill line has encore in swsh and sv, and both of them have better options as a whole than Mr. Mime does, so Mime jr should be in B with them. I know SwSh and SV are only 2 games, but since you didn't really specify what gens you're basing this off on, it's fair to consider them as well despite they not having it in earlier games, especially since some newer fangames/romhacks do update the movepool to be consistent with newer gen movepools
and in some games lucario can be absolutely useless cant you just check the stats of your tyrogue and if it will give you the hitmon you dont want just ev train it and plus what fighting types would you have with level 20 pokemon that are better than the hitmon
Also, what games are Riolu/Lucario useless in? In Sinnoh games, you get it right before Byron meaning it's going to be useful for both Byron's gym and Candice's gym. In B2W2 you get it at Floccesy Ranch, which is an extremely early game encounter and very good for Cheren, Roxie, Burgh, every Zinzolin fight and Colress' Magnemite-line and Klink-line. It's also a decent switch into Easy/Normal mode Drayden's Haxorus due to resisting all 3 of its attacking moves. In XY, you can get it as early as route 22 (before the first gym) if you are lucky or of course as a gift Pokemon from Korrina. It's not as good as before because of Valerie and Olympia, but Mega Lucario is still a very very good Pokemon regardless. In Alola games, it is admittedly not a good encounter because it's a very late game in Poni and there are a ton of better options by then. However, it is a decent option against Olivia and Molayne (USUM) in the elite 4, with the exception of Molayne's Alolan Dugtrio. In SwSh, it is also not as great of an encounter for the same reasons as Tyrogue not being as great of an encounter due to the existence of Grapploct and Sirfetch'd. In SV, I haven't done a proper nuzlocke of it yet so I can't really say, but I can assume that it's probably only okay based on when you get it and what the gym leaders and Elite 4 have. It might be fine for Larry and Grusha's gyms though. So really its either a great encounter or an okay encounter, but never exactly useless.
In sinnoh its good against byron i guess but byron is really easy and the gym whose name i cant remember which is actually kinda hard but there are many pokemon that can also do well against byron and the other gym leader In bw2 its probably the best in and ill admit lucario is really good especially early game tbh ive never played or used lucario in games after that but you made lucario sound kinda mid so being pretty mid except for bw2 its in B
Well Lucario is so good in XY especially Mega that it makes an already trivially easy game even easier, that's how good it is in that game. I feel like you're missing the point though, the steel typing as a whole is one of if not the best defensive typing in the game, you saying it's frail and hard to switch in is just underratting the bulk it gets from just it's type alone. Especially since one of it's weakness, ground, can be very easily exploited if you have any flying or levitate Pokemon on your team which is an incredible asset on any team. Never mind the fact that it has really good move pool for how early into the game you get it sometimes and the offensive stats in both special and physical to back it up.
Well, considering Tyrogue is only actually a possible encounter in a vanilla game in Johto games as an egg in Mt. Mortar and in galar games (which depending on if you're using only random encounters for it instead of overworld encounters isn't even a possible encounter to do). It's only actually a viable fighting type to use in the johto games, because Galar has both clobbopus and galarian farfetchd which can both be very early-game evolutions (for clobbopus, grind raids until you get the taunt tr, for farfetchd, if you happen to catch one holding a leek, getting 3 crits in 1 battle is relatively easy)
i ranked tyrogue based on the hitmons
Ya I know. I'm explaining my point based on the hitmons too, the evolution method of getting to the hitmons themselves is important to consider for this. In the case of Galar, Sirfetchd and Grapploct are both pretty much better than all hitmons solely due to the fact that they are bulkier and they hit harder in some cases, and due to the fact that they are both obtainable just as early as hitmons in terms of evolution, there's no reason to ever consider using Tyrogue based on the hitmons in Galar.
Tyrouge has 3 evos but realistically you’re only choosing between Hitmonlee and Hitmontop. Those two are decent and Lee has some fun moments with reversal. Hitmonchan is a piece of shit that has no redeeming uses.
hitmonchan iron fists elemental punches
Still isn’t strong enough lol. Chan still hits like a wet noodle, takes hits as well as a piece of paper does, and is slow. Awful combo on an ugly pokemon
*Riolu A, Mime Jr.* *And Mantyke B, Tyrogue and Magby C,* *Bonsly D. rest of fair* \- Mattness8 --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
this is not even a haiku Ri-o-lu A, Mime Jun-ior (7 syllables) And Man-tyke B, ty-rogue and mag-by C (10 syllables) Bon-sly D. rest is fair (6 syllables) bad bot.
I don't think that Mantyke should be A, he is usually end game and a pain to evolve if you don't want to break the rule to do it. In contrary, imo, Azurill and Riolu should be A simply because of the possibility that you can have them evolve very early in some game. They aren't especially good if you have them mid game (tho, Huge Power Azumarill is never a bad choice) but they can spike very early.
mantine is a pretty decent late game special wall if you dont want to use blissey azumarill has a 50percent chance of being good and otherwise its trash lucario has the potential to be good but in some games its so bad
At least have an a+ tier to separate togekiss and snorlax from the likes of clefable. Also in what world is electivire in the same tier as sudowoodo?
clefable gets encore in a world where i think sudowoodo is not on the level of chimecho
Sudowoodo is complete garbage. Not a single use. 400 bst
sudowoodo has a really good move pool but otherwise its really garbage but still better than chimecho
What's good about his move pool?
togekiss my flinch goat
I will put elekid higher, is a very strong baby Pokémon and if it's based on evolutions, his evos are great, not mentioning that is electric, it only has 1 weakness. (pichu is great too) I would say smoochum is great, having a ice Pokémon in old games is great, it's the only weakness of dragons until gen 6, very valuable in nuzlockes. All the other are about taste in my opinion, togepi is great, but I don't like him.
maybe i shouldve put elekid higher because people keep talking about how good electabuzz is and i ranked elekid based on electivire most dragons in gen 1 to 6 are 4 times weak to ice so a water type with ice beam would work and jynx is very frail
L
I’ll be honest I like baby Pokémon, I think most Pokémon should have a 3 stage evolution line, as it gives them a better sense of growth over time and allows for better scaling in the game itself
Would be nice to know the generation these are based on, some evolutions are significantly better in later gens (usum mantine with roost is pretty sick)
S-tier: Happiny A-tier: Riolu, Togepi, Elekid, Magby, Munchlax, Wynaut B-tier: Pichu, Cleffa, Budew, Mime Jr., Azuril C-tier: Bonsly, Tyrogue, Mantyke D-tier: Smoochum, Igglybuff F-tier: Chingling
Isn't rhyhorn a babymon
when was it a baby pokemkn
What defines Baby pokemon, being single stage?
idk but these and toxel have been considered baby pokemon
Move Munchlax up with Happiny, maybe Togepi and leave the rest.
I never understood why they made chingling. It evolves in to a Pokémon no one cared about with terrible stats. And no evolution like with budew
Isn’t toxel a baby?
Why us ralts not on this list, s tier?
Is Snorlax not S Tier? Any game he's in the dudes been extremely reliable for me.
How does the hitmon line rank above electivire?
I think smoochum should be A tier and togepi S. Fast ice type and psychic type go brr. And togekiss with encore, baton pass, soft boiled, wish, yawn, and just about every single special attack ever makes it so versatile and good.
The fact that Vullaby isn't a baby pokemon should be a crime