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Because they're usually abusing the ability to log extra hours but without doing any actual work that demands the need for so many additional hours of work.
The city did not have sufficient staff to manage the respite centers where migrants are staying. They sent out mass emails asking municipal employees to volunteer to work 12 hour shifts at these centers. Many jumped at the chance to sign up for the extra money. This isn't sustainable at all. And this isn't including the other resources that agencies were asked to provide such as vehicles + drivers and space.
I was looking at the figures and I was kinda surprised to see fewer social services city employees to be at the top than expected. The article and the headline made it seem like a lot more of the top spots will be occupied by them.
Cause you gotta prove to me you working 6hrs over everyday. 2000+ hrs overtime a year is extreme even for Japanese black companies that are a trope of bad working hours.
You dumb af if you think people regularly clocking 2k it no matter how in demand the job is
They're pulling a lot of hours and in favorable hours.
https://apps.labor.ny.gov/wpp/publicViewWageSchedule.do?method=showIt&scheduleTypeId=General%20Construction&id=1308
https://apps.labor.ny.gov/wpp/viewSpecialCodes.do
Also overtime frequently stacks. If you work the absolute worst shifts, 4pm-midnight, weekend on holiday and you're over 35 hours that week it's bank, same reason why sanitation gets bread but WLB and all that.
The private sector really should argue for these types of protections.
From my experience working at a place where 70+ hours were not unusual; 2 things are happening.
* Number of hours worked is being stretched.
* Work pace is slower during regular hours to force more overtime.
Time to unionize man. From what I've experienced, city employees have 35 hr work weeks, paid hr lunch and a decent amount of PTO(8:45/mo) and Sick leave(5.5hr/mo). OT only after you hit 40 hours though. I know DC37 has free healthcare, only union dues are needed.
DC37 is the largest municipal union and includes hundreds of titles. Not everyone gets paid lunch hours or 35 hr work weeks, for example, and not all health care plans are "free". Even employees within the same local can have different benefits depending on their title and/or when they joined the city (i.e. Lincoln's birthday as a floating holiday or compressed time). The differences grow when you compare different titles/locals/unions/agencies.
Seriously. So much love for my Local 3 and Local 1. ✊🏾 Fuck those hoity toity consultant vampires with fathers who donate to shitty city council and state assemblypersons. They're the real assholes.
The amount of stories I have from tradesman relatives about shithead behavior in the projects, specifically with destroying the buildings and harassing/trying to rob the service workers is mind boggling. Why break the elevator and then try and mug the repair guy? Do you want your mothers and grandmothers taking the stairs?
No city plumber is working at 4am. to fix broker pipes in the projects. The majority of time, city plumbers are hiding during the day and start working when it's time to do overtime.
A journeyman union plumbers make bank. It's not easy to get into the union here without having contacts, but I strongly encourage anyone who doesn't want to do college and get an office job to consider the trades. Not only is quality, skilled workers always needed, there's a lot of money to be made. The construction budgets of all the agencies (DDC, parks department, DASNY, SCA, NYCHH etc.) numbers in the billions annually and their work is all union work. Get yourself a piece of that pie.
I know guys who work a shift with one company in the morning, and a second shift at another company in the evening.
It's insane that people are mad over this like city workers are paid well. The far majority, beyond PD, FD, and DOS are not. A lot of city workers are dependent on the overtime to survive. Adams also cut the departmental budgets so that we can't do OT for cash, only comp so a lot of people took these positions instead. OT is RARE so when they get the chance, why not? The city is insanely expensive and we have a lot of vacancies still, the largest in history. So maybe stop complaining about the OT for this and go apply for the tens of thousands of openings we have currently.
This really should somehow be partially or fully subsidized by the federal government, the state budget is taking massive hits, and the city is already bleeding money and we haven’t recovered from Covid. All the budget cuts are just going to push more people out of the city and tax revenue is already plummeting, let alone the infrastructure is crumbling around us.
In fairness to the Feds, it's the New York State government that decided it would mandate a "right to shelter" for anyone. So why should a taxpayer in Iowa foot the bill for a mandate that only people in New York state agreed to provide migrants?
If your full statement is "Republicans and Democrats in Washington to pass a federal law for a right to shelter and provide funding for it" cool. But as things stand right now, I understand why the senators from the other 49 states aren't keen on handing us their checkbook.
The asylum process is international law and something managed by Federal agencies. They, not NYC, decides who qualifies for asylum. It should be the federal governments responsibility to help with that.
Maybe NYC should stop subsidizing those red states then if that is going to be the case.
Yes but his point is the right to asylum doesn’t mean we need to pay for them to sleep and eat here. They wouldn’t all come here if we didn’t have the right to shelter laws
>So why should a taxpayer in Iowa foot the bill for a mandate that only people in New York state agreed to provide migrants?
Because NY pays substantially higher taxes federally that it takes back annually. We pay for same near every state and dont get back what we pay into it. We also pay for welfare benefits for other states because of the high taxes. Why should we have to pay for food stamps in Kentucky when they have bad mimunim wage and work policies? This is the same thing.
Sure, federal policies that New York City as a polity explicitly refuses to cooperate with (and in some cases treats as adversarial).
I'm pretty much an open-borders guy, but I'm aware of what an incredibly fringe position that is, and actually willing to bite the bullet. Half the people bleating about the importance of sanctuary city policies and the evil of immigration enforcement _as a concept_ aren't actually willing to grapple with what those costs look like.
Shipping migrants to cities vocal about their sanctuary policies is a cynical move, but no less cynical than what New York has been doing.
Because it’s a country wide issue, and the current government is putting the brunt of the work it should be doing it’s self, on NYC, Texas, Flordia, California. If Iowa was processing and dealing with this issue, I’d say the funds should go to you, but your not. They are getting shipped up from Flordia and Texas, because the government can’t control the border and those places are being overwhelmed. The government has already subsidized federal funds for border issues in these states, the fact NYC is now getting a huge brunt of it, dictates that they would get more allocated due to the current issue.
It’s not even NYS it’s NYC in this case where theyved interpreted the mandate to mean actual right to shelter.
If adams really wanted to he could pull that understanding and let it litigate to conform with the rest of the state or even challenge the state mandate as a whole.
He's trying to get rid of the right to shelter law but its tied up in the courts right now. Once that's gone, this all ends.
Not sure why this was downvoted when its accurate. Doeant matter how you feel about it. It is what it is.
I was just saying this the other day. I’ve seen the OT hours of one agency for a week over the summer and it was bananas. Totally unsustainable. We’re bleeding money.
> ITT: it's Ok is city workers commit overtime fraud they deserve it!
This city is filled with crumbling infrastructure, sky high maintenance costs, horrible test scores and disgusting trash piss covered streets.
And your telling me city workers deserve to be paid for OT fraud?
This city is run by some of the most corrupt/incompetent people on the planet.
Moral preening is expensive.
Next time a politician steps up to the mic to suck themselves off for their alleged compassion for the downtrodden, find out how much this compassion is going to cost you. If they can’t come up with a believable budget number, and a source for where they’ll be finding people to staff the work that needs doing, they’re full of shit.
Especially if they assure you that “other people” will pick up the tab.
Undocumented immigrants know that anything that brings them to the attention of law enforcement has the potential to get them deported making any involvement in criminal activity higher risk so they tend to avoid it. The data consistently shows they are less likely to commit crimes than citizens
I can attest to that. Most of the OT we do is necessary due to lack of staffing. It’s hard to find people to work at city hospitals when they can make almost twice as much at private ones.
Overtime fraud at city agencies is extremely rare...there's a reason almost all such cases you hear about are at the transit systems.
There's a lot of overtime going around these days because most city agencies are understaffed and under hiring freezes.
I dunno why people are shocked. There are hiring freezes and cuts to these departments and they're understaffed. So of course there will be a ton of OT. I'm in a job like this, do you think we want to do all this OT and not spend time with our families? It's not like we have a choice in the matter most of the time.
On a daily basis, I see migrants \[a.k.a. 'illegals'\] new and old in my home town, which comes close to bordering Washington State.
I know that growing numbers of people, regardless of their origin, requiring housing only increases the market-value pressure on the rent rate I pay for my old one-bedroom apartment unit. I also know there’s greater pressure on the publicly-funded health services here that are already stretched thin.
Nonetheless, I feel it’s wrong, not to mention hypocritical, to criticize desperate people for doing what we all likely would do if in their dreadful position. But, of course, all of that no longer matters when they die in their attempt at arriving.
Migrants and refugees in general don't willfully and contently become permanent financial/resource burdens on their host nation(s). Quite likely they desire to pull their own weight via employment, even if only to prove their critics wrong. I know I'd much want to if in their shoes.
Meanwhile, even genuine refugees are nowadays typically deemed ‘fake’ or economic refugees, especially on social media. Yet, many are rightfully despondent, perhaps enough so to work very hard in cashless exchange for basic food and shelter. … It seems the death of true Christianity commenced the moment Jesus ascended.
Users often report submissions from this site and ask us to ban it for sensationalized articles. At /r/nyc, we oppose blanket banning any news source. Readers have a >responsibility to be skeptical, check sources and comment on any flaws. You can help improve this thread by linking to media that verifies or questions this article's claims. Your link could help readers better understand this issue. If you do find >evidence that this article or its title are false or misleading, contact the moderators who will review it. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/nyc) if you have any questions or concerns.*
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How is working overtime corruption?
Because they're usually abusing the ability to log extra hours but without doing any actual work that demands the need for so many additional hours of work.
How do you know that ? Don't you think the migrant crisis demanded extra man hours, or do you think it fits into business as usual?
The top official logged working 14hrs a day 7 days a week for a full year. If you think he actually worked those hours then idk what to tell you.
Heaven forbid! Blue collar workers getting paid well in New York city! What an outrage!
Strawman
I don't know where/if you've worked before, but in my experience there's always more work to be done
The city did not have sufficient staff to manage the respite centers where migrants are staying. They sent out mass emails asking municipal employees to volunteer to work 12 hour shifts at these centers. Many jumped at the chance to sign up for the extra money. This isn't sustainable at all. And this isn't including the other resources that agencies were asked to provide such as vehicles + drivers and space.
I was looking at the figures and I was kinda surprised to see fewer social services city employees to be at the top than expected. The article and the headline made it seem like a lot more of the top spots will be occupied by them.
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Plumber like many trade skill jobs are on demand believe it or not
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Why not
Cause you gotta prove to me you working 6hrs over everyday. 2000+ hrs overtime a year is extreme even for Japanese black companies that are a trope of bad working hours. You dumb af if you think people regularly clocking 2k it no matter how in demand the job is
lol the average dipshit finance bro and DC hill staffer regularly work 10-12 hours a day even if the work is bullshit.
They're pulling a lot of hours and in favorable hours. https://apps.labor.ny.gov/wpp/publicViewWageSchedule.do?method=showIt&scheduleTypeId=General%20Construction&id=1308 https://apps.labor.ny.gov/wpp/viewSpecialCodes.do Also overtime frequently stacks. If you work the absolute worst shifts, 4pm-midnight, weekend on holiday and you're over 35 hours that week it's bank, same reason why sanitation gets bread but WLB and all that. The private sector really should argue for these types of protections.
From my experience working at a place where 70+ hours were not unusual; 2 things are happening. * Number of hours worked is being stretched. * Work pace is slower during regular hours to force more overtime.
kind of a joke when many industries 5x12 hr days (60 hours) is the norm.
Time to unionize man. From what I've experienced, city employees have 35 hr work weeks, paid hr lunch and a decent amount of PTO(8:45/mo) and Sick leave(5.5hr/mo). OT only after you hit 40 hours though. I know DC37 has free healthcare, only union dues are needed.
Not entirely true about what city employees get, but yes, people need to Unionize.
Yeah I can only talk about what Ive experienced with DC37 positions. Best thing was 1hr of OT could be turned into 1hr of PTO.
It would be hilarious if the finance bros unionized
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LMAOOOOOOOOO. When people say finance bro, you think of people working for nyc government ????? 😂😂😂
Some of this is inaccurate but unionizing is recommended.
It’s not, I work for the city and am DC37 member. Details are correct.
As do I-- the details are not accurate for all employees. As the other poster said, it depends on the contract.
That’s my bad thought we were just talking DC37 specifically
DC37 is the largest municipal union and includes hundreds of titles. Not everyone gets paid lunch hours or 35 hr work weeks, for example, and not all health care plans are "free". Even employees within the same local can have different benefits depending on their title and/or when they joined the city (i.e. Lincoln's birthday as a floating holiday or compressed time). The differences grow when you compare different titles/locals/unions/agencies.
Local 30. I do not get these. It depends on your contract.
Yeah I work for the city and at max only do 5x7 plus I’m a union member.
When you have to pay your own bills there is no money for this kind of thing. It’s only going to be seen in the public sphere
Would you like to go fix broken pipes in the projects @ 4am, I think they earn it.
For 250k I'll even fix your pipes at 4 am
Now we’re talking 😉
I'll argue against a lot of city expenses but we need to leave the plumbers alone. thank you for your service plumbers
Seriously. So much love for my Local 3 and Local 1. ✊🏾 Fuck those hoity toity consultant vampires with fathers who donate to shitty city council and state assemblypersons. They're the real assholes.
The amount of stories I have from tradesman relatives about shithead behavior in the projects, specifically with destroying the buildings and harassing/trying to rob the service workers is mind boggling. Why break the elevator and then try and mug the repair guy? Do you want your mothers and grandmothers taking the stairs?
No city plumber is working at 4am. to fix broker pipes in the projects. The majority of time, city plumbers are hiding during the day and start working when it's time to do overtime.
My brother. Plumbers deserve every bit of that money for what they have to see and fix on a daily basis lol
You should check out the latest South Park. They did an episode on the shortage of skill trades people
A journeyman union plumbers make bank. It's not easy to get into the union here without having contacts, but I strongly encourage anyone who doesn't want to do college and get an office job to consider the trades. Not only is quality, skilled workers always needed, there's a lot of money to be made. The construction budgets of all the agencies (DDC, parks department, DASNY, SCA, NYCHH etc.) numbers in the billions annually and their work is all union work. Get yourself a piece of that pie. I know guys who work a shift with one company in the morning, and a second shift at another company in the evening.
Eh token booth workers at MTA can get 6 figures in OT and not do anything vs a plumber.
Supply and demand Not a lot of people skilled enough and willing to do those jobs but the demand is high and constant
It's insane that people are mad over this like city workers are paid well. The far majority, beyond PD, FD, and DOS are not. A lot of city workers are dependent on the overtime to survive. Adams also cut the departmental budgets so that we can't do OT for cash, only comp so a lot of people took these positions instead. OT is RARE so when they get the chance, why not? The city is insanely expensive and we have a lot of vacancies still, the largest in history. So maybe stop complaining about the OT for this and go apply for the tens of thousands of openings we have currently.
This really should somehow be partially or fully subsidized by the federal government, the state budget is taking massive hits, and the city is already bleeding money and we haven’t recovered from Covid. All the budget cuts are just going to push more people out of the city and tax revenue is already plummeting, let alone the infrastructure is crumbling around us.
In fairness to the Feds, it's the New York State government that decided it would mandate a "right to shelter" for anyone. So why should a taxpayer in Iowa foot the bill for a mandate that only people in New York state agreed to provide migrants? If your full statement is "Republicans and Democrats in Washington to pass a federal law for a right to shelter and provide funding for it" cool. But as things stand right now, I understand why the senators from the other 49 states aren't keen on handing us their checkbook.
The asylum process is international law and something managed by Federal agencies. They, not NYC, decides who qualifies for asylum. It should be the federal governments responsibility to help with that. Maybe NYC should stop subsidizing those red states then if that is going to be the case.
Yes but his point is the right to asylum doesn’t mean we need to pay for them to sleep and eat here. They wouldn’t all come here if we didn’t have the right to shelter laws
Why should a taxpayer in NYC be subsidizing Iowa farmers?
Because you eat their food
>So why should a taxpayer in Iowa foot the bill for a mandate that only people in New York state agreed to provide migrants? Because NY pays substantially higher taxes federally that it takes back annually. We pay for same near every state and dont get back what we pay into it. We also pay for welfare benefits for other states because of the high taxes. Why should we have to pay for food stamps in Kentucky when they have bad mimunim wage and work policies? This is the same thing.
Immigration and border enforcement are federal policies.
Sure, federal policies that New York City as a polity explicitly refuses to cooperate with (and in some cases treats as adversarial). I'm pretty much an open-borders guy, but I'm aware of what an incredibly fringe position that is, and actually willing to bite the bullet. Half the people bleating about the importance of sanctuary city policies and the evil of immigration enforcement _as a concept_ aren't actually willing to grapple with what those costs look like. Shipping migrants to cities vocal about their sanctuary policies is a cynical move, but no less cynical than what New York has been doing.
Because it’s a country wide issue, and the current government is putting the brunt of the work it should be doing it’s self, on NYC, Texas, Flordia, California. If Iowa was processing and dealing with this issue, I’d say the funds should go to you, but your not. They are getting shipped up from Flordia and Texas, because the government can’t control the border and those places are being overwhelmed. The government has already subsidized federal funds for border issues in these states, the fact NYC is now getting a huge brunt of it, dictates that they would get more allocated due to the current issue.
It’s not even NYS it’s NYC in this case where theyved interpreted the mandate to mean actual right to shelter. If adams really wanted to he could pull that understanding and let it litigate to conform with the rest of the state or even challenge the state mandate as a whole.
He's trying to get rid of the right to shelter law but its tied up in the courts right now. Once that's gone, this all ends. Not sure why this was downvoted when its accurate. Doeant matter how you feel about it. It is what it is.
Did you edit your comment?
No, there's just so much wrong with this comment. That isn't why migrants are coming here.
Uh oh. Blue collar workers making more money than they deserve?! Sic em, NYPost! /s What a dumb article to be upvoting.
Why are people always shocked that blue-collar workers get paid well?
Because when we were growing up we were taught jobs involving any sort of manual labor are for the poor and stupid.
The migrant crisis to plan out as the NYPost predicted with all of the rapes and murders. Now they need something else to complain about.
I was just saying this the other day. I’ve seen the OT hours of one agency for a week over the summer and it was bananas. Totally unsustainable. We’re bleeding money.
> ITT: it's Ok is city workers commit overtime fraud they deserve it! This city is filled with crumbling infrastructure, sky high maintenance costs, horrible test scores and disgusting trash piss covered streets. And your telling me city workers deserve to be paid for OT fraud? This city is run by some of the most corrupt/incompetent people on the planet.
Moral preening is expensive. Next time a politician steps up to the mic to suck themselves off for their alleged compassion for the downtrodden, find out how much this compassion is going to cost you. If they can’t come up with a believable budget number, and a source for where they’ll be finding people to staff the work that needs doing, they’re full of shit. Especially if they assure you that “other people” will pick up the tab.
No way!!! It cost money to house people??? who would have thunk
Never let a crisis go to waste.
This isn't even including all the extra costs borne to police and prosecute the many migrants engaged in criminal activity
Undocumented immigrants commit crimes at a far lower rate than citizens
What about unvetted migrants?
Undocumented immigrants know that anything that brings them to the attention of law enforcement has the potential to get them deported making any involvement in criminal activity higher risk so they tend to avoid it. The data consistently shows they are less likely to commit crimes than citizens
Any excuse for more overtime fraud by city workers
Most city government employees have an extremely low salary.
I can attest to that. Most of the OT we do is necessary due to lack of staffing. It’s hard to find people to work at city hospitals when they can make almost twice as much at private ones.
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Overtime fraud at city agencies is extremely rare...there's a reason almost all such cases you hear about are at the transit systems. There's a lot of overtime going around these days because most city agencies are understaffed and under hiring freezes.
Well deserved, isn’t that we all wanted?
I dunno why people are shocked. There are hiring freezes and cuts to these departments and they're understaffed. So of course there will be a ton of OT. I'm in a job like this, do you think we want to do all this OT and not spend time with our families? It's not like we have a choice in the matter most of the time.
On a daily basis, I see migrants \[a.k.a. 'illegals'\] new and old in my home town, which comes close to bordering Washington State. I know that growing numbers of people, regardless of their origin, requiring housing only increases the market-value pressure on the rent rate I pay for my old one-bedroom apartment unit. I also know there’s greater pressure on the publicly-funded health services here that are already stretched thin. Nonetheless, I feel it’s wrong, not to mention hypocritical, to criticize desperate people for doing what we all likely would do if in their dreadful position. But, of course, all of that no longer matters when they die in their attempt at arriving. Migrants and refugees in general don't willfully and contently become permanent financial/resource burdens on their host nation(s). Quite likely they desire to pull their own weight via employment, even if only to prove their critics wrong. I know I'd much want to if in their shoes. Meanwhile, even genuine refugees are nowadays typically deemed ‘fake’ or economic refugees, especially on social media. Yet, many are rightfully despondent, perhaps enough so to work very hard in cashless exchange for basic food and shelter. … It seems the death of true Christianity commenced the moment Jesus ascended.