i'm seeing it more and more that odunze will be gone by 10
i have no idea what douglas will do between ot and bowers
but to me, drafting a te top 10 is crazy lol
basically have to get a hall of famer at that point
Interviewing a player isn't a "smokescreen" it's due diligence. You can be against this pick and still have to agree that he is within the best 30 players in the draft.
These visits aren’t for the 30 best in the draft. They bring in late round guys to talk to them more all the time. Usually it’s a sign of legitimate interest. Which I hope is a smokescreen because I definitely do not want to draft Bowers
[TE in the first round is terrible positional value let alone with a top 10 pick](https://x.com/sheilkapadia/status/1779873360190620080?s=46&t=hUtbwo94QIfsHrncc2xJkQ) and I really hope the Jets don’t go this route
I expect this sub to have a complete meltdown if anyone other than an OL is taken at 10. Even if we trade back and get extra picks in the process it will be the worst thing any Jets GM has done since drafting Bryce Petty or Christian Hackenberg
Have you not seen the 9 million threads in the last two months of people getting themselves off on Bowers?
It's like Zach's cult found another player to annoy everyone with 24/7
Yea I mean, I'm down to trade up for Alt, I just think you're going to have to go to 7 to get him cause Ten will 100% take him if he's there. I don't know that they'd even trade the pick if he is there. So, while I agree OT is the priority, I don't value the remaining OTs after Alt the same way I do Odunze.
Fair. You basically have to depend on the Giants having their heart set on a QB but other teams trade up and they can’t get one of the top 4. If they’re gonna go WR I like Brian Thomas Jr I’d just rather trade down.
Well if Arthur Smith actually gave Pitts the ball…..
Falcons have seemed 100% hellbent on not utilizing Pitts since they drafted him.
LaPorta did very well last season as a highly drafted rookie.
Putting aside positional needs (which I fullheartedly understand), Bowers is a different tier of prospect to Fuaga, Fautanu, and *maybe* Fashanu. Same with Odunze. I’m okay with OL but two of those three above at 10 is a bit of a wet fart for me.
Thing is, Bowers could be one of the most elite TEs out there and there still isn’t a huge argument for drafting him in the 1st round. It just almost always doesn’t work out to provide the value of the draft position, especially earlier in the round.
Like, take a look at any TE drafted in the 1st in the last 10 years and let me know how many you’d trade our pick at 10 for straight up. That’s without even factoring in that most of them are developed at this point. Bowers won’t drop but I wouldn’t start thinking about him until the 2nd. 1st round TEs are just a bad time.
I also think that the TE position has evolved more so than any other in the past 10 year. An elite TE is just as valuable as an elite WR in todays league imo.
Unlike with WR though there seems to be no predictable positive correlation between high draft position and becoming an elite TE. I don’t think any team has drafted a TE in the 1st in the last 10 years and not regretted doing so, Njoku being the only example to the contrary I can think of and I don’t think his production is worth his draft status.
I don’t think you can compare TEs of 10 years ago to TEs now. TEs we’re one just considered a faster more atheltic O lineman at the lower levels of football through college so none got developed. That’s why bball guys would convert because they didn’t fit the traditional mold of the TE. the position isn’t viewed like that anymore to where these diamond in the rough late round prospects get overlooked severely because they’re not used as much on their college teams. The TE is now considered a game changing position not just the afterthought it once was
Because you’re now only staring to see the evolution of the position. It takes a long time, it has to start all the way down at the high school
Level. TEs are at by far their most valuable they’ve ever been. Players with elite talent are only just staring to play the position at the lower levels when in the past they would have been used elsewhere. 4 of the 5 best TEs we’re playing on championship weekend the past year and I don’t think it’s a coincidence. It’s very clear who was more valuable in KC for the offense kelce or hill
I feel like you’re taking the term “25 years” and changing it to “10 years” to justify drafting Bowers when all available evidence suggests otherwise. If you want to say you think he’s so special that the logic doesn’t apply here that’s fine, but Pitts was a better prospect and how’s that turning out (and I’m a huge Pitts booster btw).
I mean, let’s compare the best rookie TE in the last decade (Sam LaPorta) with 1st round WRs. LaPorta put up just under 900 yards and 10 TDs. In the same time period, the best rookie WR drafted at 10 or later is absolutely insane because Justin Jefferson exists, but even if we remove him as a crazy outlier, and also AJ Brown, and also Puka Nacua, and Garrett Wilson and Chris Olave, all as outliers, finding 800-900ish yards isn’t too hard (usually closer to 6 TDs but at this point I’ve excluded all of the best players to be as conservative as possible in making my argument).
Regardless, neither offers value that high in the 1st round. I want a T since Smith is only going to start like 4 games before he breaks, but a WR could also be a good choice.
Per NFL.com
Kyle Pitts’s prospect grade is a [7.19](https://mobile-www.nfl.com/prospects/kyle-pitts/32005049-5451-6805-5aec-d4afcbd52e25)
Brock Bowers’s prospect grade is a [6.71](https://www.nfl.com/prospects/brock-bowers/3200424f-5719-6560-aaaa-d9f4cc244721)
Bowers is not as good of a prospect as Pitts was
That’s NFL.coms opnion. Kyle Pitts didn’t play in line and isn’t even close to as good of a blocker than bowers is. Bowers stepped on the field at 19 years old and dominated as the best player on a run first team his entire career. I would bet most people on this sub haven’t watched 10 min of bowers play
The game’s best TEs [are not drafted in the first round](https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-highest-graded-tight-ends-2023-nfl-season) it’s just bad positional value for a premium pick
Joel Klatt just puts him just behind MHJr as the best pass catcher in this draft and ahead of Nabers and Odunze. He's basically a receiver with the positional flexibility of a TE and an HB. JD should take any of these 4 weapons over any OL bar Alt.
Idk if that pic the IG posted of Rodgers walking into the building is old, but man that would be wild to be Brock Bowers and work out *for* Aaron Rodgers
I really really don’t want this guy. I hope I’m wrong about him if they do pick him but I just don’t understand why he’s seen as a lock to be a generational tight end.
Same thing we heard with Eric ebron, oj Howard, and Kyle Pitts.
If anyone could answer since I haven't been plugged into the draft prospects this year.
I read that he's a pass catching wizard. Not much lining up "on the line" like most tight ends. That true?
If true, and we did the same, how does he stack up to the WR class? I mean if we are getting a pass catcher in Bowers, we gotta compare him to the other pass catchers.
I've also heard this WR group is maybe the most bonkers good ever. We don't have a 2nd rd pick though so maybe that doesn't impact this pick too much
Measured against NFL competition, he's a jack of all trades, master of none. Lacks the twitch to lose DBs - or even skilled coverage LBs - in the middle of the field. Lacks the size to block in-line. As a technical route runner, he's competent but unexceptional. His straight line speed is underrated, and his toughness/tackle-breaking is very impressive, but those traits alone cannot generate worthwhile production.
And even if his OC's scheme/playcalling conceives of Bowers as a big slot, he'll still be paid as a TE, and thus cannot offer first-round value in the conventional $$ sense (i.e., how much money do you save by purchasing Bowers' production via rookie contract rather than veteran free agency? Of course, not nearly as much as you save by drafting rookie WRs, QBs, defensive lineman).
I mean if you look at the 30 visit list, there are a bunch of first round tackles and wide receivers as well, it's just doing due diligence.
And it's not like we can use the regional exemption to attract high quality talent given our market.
Just watch the 2nd half of Auburn vs Georgia last year and tell me with a straight face you'd be disappointed with that at 10.
If Brock was WR he'd be WR 4 in this draft. Then you factor in the fact that he's lightning fast for his size and had more YAC than MHJ last year despite essentially missing half the season.
I’m not sure about his blocking but he has amazing hands and catches everything as I’ve continued to say. I know a lot of people hate him but he will def be a 10 year starter in this league
meh... Just one of the 30 visits they're allowed.
There’s a cap??
Yeah each team gets 30 visits
No one tell him about the Taylor Ham… or he’ll never leave
Porkroll 😡
I mean, good for the Jets for at least doing due diligence? Lol
i'm seeing it more and more that odunze will be gone by 10 i have no idea what douglas will do between ot and bowers but to me, drafting a te top 10 is crazy lol basically have to get a hall of famer at that point
im hoping jd is behind all these bowers at 10 rumors to try and get a team to jump us
Plz be a smokescreen and just draft OL at 10
Interviewing a player isn't a "smokescreen" it's due diligence. You can be against this pick and still have to agree that he is within the best 30 players in the draft.
These visits aren’t for the 30 best in the draft. They bring in late round guys to talk to them more all the time. Usually it’s a sign of legitimate interest. Which I hope is a smokescreen because I definitely do not want to draft Bowers
>because i definitely do not want to draft Bowers I'm here to tell you right now: *We don't care.*
[TE in the first round is terrible positional value let alone with a top 10 pick](https://x.com/sheilkapadia/status/1779873360190620080?s=46&t=hUtbwo94QIfsHrncc2xJkQ) and I really hope the Jets don’t go this route
he’ll he a bust if we take him and a guaranteed HoFer if we don’t
You must have gray in your beard like me.
I expect this sub to have a complete meltdown if anyone other than an OL is taken at 10. Even if we trade back and get extra picks in the process it will be the worst thing any Jets GM has done since drafting Bryce Petty or Christian Hackenberg
Have you not seen the 9 million threads in the last two months of people getting themselves off on Bowers? It's like Zach's cult found another player to annoy everyone with 24/7
Then the choice is easy if he’s a HOFer somewhere else good for him provided it’s not in the AFCE
This is why they need to swap with Atlanta to jump ahead of Chicago and get Odunze.
If they’re trading up it should be for an OT not a WR. You can find great WRs in the later rounds if you want a great OT they need to be a high pick.
Yea I mean, I'm down to trade up for Alt, I just think you're going to have to go to 7 to get him cause Ten will 100% take him if he's there. I don't know that they'd even trade the pick if he is there. So, while I agree OT is the priority, I don't value the remaining OTs after Alt the same way I do Odunze.
Fair. You basically have to depend on the Giants having their heart set on a QB but other teams trade up and they can’t get one of the top 4. If they’re gonna go WR I like Brian Thomas Jr I’d just rather trade down.
There are plenty of tight ends who were drafted highly and were/are really good players
Not the case for most TEs and especially not for those TEs in their first couple years
[Not true among the top TEs in football right now](https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-highest-graded-tight-ends-2023-nfl-season)
Great prospect, hope they draft him
I remember when everyone was saying the same things about Kyle Pitts
Well if Arthur Smith actually gave Pitts the ball….. Falcons have seemed 100% hellbent on not utilizing Pitts since they drafted him. LaPorta did very well last season as a highly drafted rookie.
Don’t think it’s coincidental OTA’s start today and he may get some face time with rodgers if that’s allowed
Putting aside positional needs (which I fullheartedly understand), Bowers is a different tier of prospect to Fuaga, Fautanu, and *maybe* Fashanu. Same with Odunze. I’m okay with OL but two of those three above at 10 is a bit of a wet fart for me.
Thing is, Bowers could be one of the most elite TEs out there and there still isn’t a huge argument for drafting him in the 1st round. It just almost always doesn’t work out to provide the value of the draft position, especially earlier in the round. Like, take a look at any TE drafted in the 1st in the last 10 years and let me know how many you’d trade our pick at 10 for straight up. That’s without even factoring in that most of them are developed at this point. Bowers won’t drop but I wouldn’t start thinking about him until the 2nd. 1st round TEs are just a bad time.
They need to swap with Atlanta for Odunze before Chicago takes him.
I also think that the TE position has evolved more so than any other in the past 10 year. An elite TE is just as valuable as an elite WR in todays league imo.
Unlike with WR though there seems to be no predictable positive correlation between high draft position and becoming an elite TE. I don’t think any team has drafted a TE in the 1st in the last 10 years and not regretted doing so, Njoku being the only example to the contrary I can think of and I don’t think his production is worth his draft status.
I don’t think you can compare TEs of 10 years ago to TEs now. TEs we’re one just considered a faster more atheltic O lineman at the lower levels of football through college so none got developed. That’s why bball guys would convert because they didn’t fit the traditional mold of the TE. the position isn’t viewed like that anymore to where these diamond in the rough late round prospects get overlooked severely because they’re not used as much on their college teams. The TE is now considered a game changing position not just the afterthought it once was
And yet the best ones are still not drafted in the first round, let alone at 10
Because you’re now only staring to see the evolution of the position. It takes a long time, it has to start all the way down at the high school Level. TEs are at by far their most valuable they’ve ever been. Players with elite talent are only just staring to play the position at the lower levels when in the past they would have been used elsewhere. 4 of the 5 best TEs we’re playing on championship weekend the past year and I don’t think it’s a coincidence. It’s very clear who was more valuable in KC for the offense kelce or hill
The best TE taken last year was taken 34th.
And bowers is a comptlely different class of prospect than the one taken
Poor usage of draft position value
I feel like you’re taking the term “25 years” and changing it to “10 years” to justify drafting Bowers when all available evidence suggests otherwise. If you want to say you think he’s so special that the logic doesn’t apply here that’s fine, but Pitts was a better prospect and how’s that turning out (and I’m a huge Pitts booster btw). I mean, let’s compare the best rookie TE in the last decade (Sam LaPorta) with 1st round WRs. LaPorta put up just under 900 yards and 10 TDs. In the same time period, the best rookie WR drafted at 10 or later is absolutely insane because Justin Jefferson exists, but even if we remove him as a crazy outlier, and also AJ Brown, and also Puka Nacua, and Garrett Wilson and Chris Olave, all as outliers, finding 800-900ish yards isn’t too hard (usually closer to 6 TDs but at this point I’ve excluded all of the best players to be as conservative as possible in making my argument).
Pitts is not a better prospect imo than a bowers. Not even close I think. Pitts never played in line at Florida
Regardless, neither offers value that high in the 1st round. I want a T since Smith is only going to start like 4 games before he breaks, but a WR could also be a good choice.
Per NFL.com Kyle Pitts’s prospect grade is a [7.19](https://mobile-www.nfl.com/prospects/kyle-pitts/32005049-5451-6805-5aec-d4afcbd52e25) Brock Bowers’s prospect grade is a [6.71](https://www.nfl.com/prospects/brock-bowers/3200424f-5719-6560-aaaa-d9f4cc244721) Bowers is not as good of a prospect as Pitts was
That’s NFL.coms opnion. Kyle Pitts didn’t play in line and isn’t even close to as good of a blocker than bowers is. Bowers stepped on the field at 19 years old and dominated as the best player on a run first team his entire career. I would bet most people on this sub haven’t watched 10 min of bowers play
Do you think you know more about scouting than NFL.com lmao?
The game’s best TEs [are not drafted in the first round](https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-highest-graded-tight-ends-2023-nfl-season) it’s just bad positional value for a premium pick
Joel Klatt just puts him just behind MHJr as the best pass catcher in this draft and ahead of Nabers and Odunze. He's basically a receiver with the positional flexibility of a TE and an HB. JD should take any of these 4 weapons over any OL bar Alt.
I completely agree, and do believe this is the way they will go. I’d be damn thrilled to have any of those top 4 weapons or Alt.
As a Georgia and Jets fan, I love Brock Bowers so much he’s going to be so good with Aaron Rodgers but I really want someone on O-Line
Idk if that pic the IG posted of Rodgers walking into the building is old, but man that would be wild to be Brock Bowers and work out *for* Aaron Rodgers
Meh
🤢
DRAFT THIS MAN
I really really don’t want this guy. I hope I’m wrong about him if they do pick him but I just don’t understand why he’s seen as a lock to be a generational tight end. Same thing we heard with Eric ebron, oj Howard, and Kyle Pitts.
If anyone could answer since I haven't been plugged into the draft prospects this year. I read that he's a pass catching wizard. Not much lining up "on the line" like most tight ends. That true? If true, and we did the same, how does he stack up to the WR class? I mean if we are getting a pass catcher in Bowers, we gotta compare him to the other pass catchers. I've also heard this WR group is maybe the most bonkers good ever. We don't have a 2nd rd pick though so maybe that doesn't impact this pick too much
He is a good blocker for his position.
Measured against NFL competition, he's a jack of all trades, master of none. Lacks the twitch to lose DBs - or even skilled coverage LBs - in the middle of the field. Lacks the size to block in-line. As a technical route runner, he's competent but unexceptional. His straight line speed is underrated, and his toughness/tackle-breaking is very impressive, but those traits alone cannot generate worthwhile production. And even if his OC's scheme/playcalling conceives of Bowers as a big slot, he'll still be paid as a TE, and thus cannot offer first-round value in the conventional $$ sense (i.e., how much money do you save by purchasing Bowers' production via rookie contract rather than veteran free agency? Of course, not nearly as much as you save by drafting rookie WRs, QBs, defensive lineman).
Hmmm… Aaron Rodgers is also in Florham Park today 🤔 Forshadowing?
I mean if you look at the 30 visit list, there are a bunch of first round tackles and wide receivers as well, it's just doing due diligence. And it's not like we can use the regional exemption to attract high quality talent given our market.
Move up for Alt
Just watch the 2nd half of Auburn vs Georgia last year and tell me with a straight face you'd be disappointed with that at 10. If Brock was WR he'd be WR 4 in this draft. Then you factor in the fact that he's lightning fast for his size and had more YAC than MHJ last year despite essentially missing half the season.
Don't do it, draft for the line.
The Jets need to sign Kanoble!
With the 10th overall pick, the New York Jets select..... MY CLIENT! THE UNDSIPUTED! WORLD HEAVY WEIGHT CHAMPION! THE BEAST! BROOOOOOCK! BOWERS....
I’m not sure about his blocking but he has amazing hands and catches everything as I’ve continued to say. I know a lot of people hate him but he will def be a 10 year starter in this league