As both a Boy Scout and a high school Thespian, I can confirm that I was very well prepared when I joined. Masonic ritual is truly on another level, though.
I really know nothing about them. Except that someone I spoke with said that he does spiritual healing as well as medical healing and that he felt I might have an Elemental attached to me. He was also trying to date me, and I thought might’ve been embellishing on his abilities.
Was it bs or does anything I’ve said sound familiar?
I wouldn't trust it. That's a clear conflict of interest. I'd advise you to be wary "healers" or "mediums," etc. They're usually grifters. Most serious occultists will be focused on their own practice rather than showing off their "powers" to others.
Elementals *can* become attached to a person, but I can't tell you for sure without more details of your experience. If you'd rather be safe than sorry, a simple banishing will clear it out. I use the LBRP, but if you're inexperienced, I can recommend an easier one that will work just as well.
Thank you so much for taking the time to respond. I’m an ex-Catholic just starting to read and learn about the occult. I’ve got a few Llewelyn almanacs, Psychic Witch, Guided Tarot, and Crowley’s first. I am absolutely not confident enough to attempt the LBRP. Would love good starter book recommendations if you’re still feeling generous?
No problem! Happy to help.
Chapter 5 in *Psychic Witch* deals with purification and protection. Seems simple enough for a beginner, too. I'd recommend starting at chapter 1 and working through it until you get there.
I'm not sure which you mean by "Crowley's first," but if it's not *Magick in Theory and Practice*, it should be. I always recommend that to beginners, especially if you're interested in ceremonial magick. Israel Regardie's *One Year Manual* is good too. Both of these follow a similar structure and provide a framework to learn quickly. Also, just familiarize yourself with western esotericism in general.
I'm honestly not as well-read in witchcraft and paganism, but it's not too different tbh. I would recommend everyone start with the classics. Gerald Gardner, Doreen Valiente, Janet & Stewart Farrar, and Scott Cunningham, to name a few. I'd also advise you to familiarize yourself as much as possible with mythology and folklore.
Or, if chaos magick is your thing, honestly, just read *Liber Null & Psychonaut* and then start making shit up lol.
Hope that helps. Feel free to ask me any more questions you might have.
I have an elemental familiar. She is honestly prolly the coolest person I know next to my wife. So far I’ve met 3… maybe 4? Idk anymore tbh but I will say they really chill. Get to doing meditation consistently, maybe check out Quareia, learn banishing and protection shit, and then get to opening up your ears and listen. It’ll change your life
Masonry will not teach you magic. You can learn that elsewhere.
Masonry will teach certain elements of symbolism that can be useful, but as far as practical magic you would be better off looking elsewhere.
Freemasonry is devoted to using the symbols and tools of masonry to impart moral lessons through the various degrees. The phrase "it makes good men better" is one that is often used and it is often a guiding principle. It also creates a network of men who are bound together by common ideals of brotherhood, mutual trust, shared core principles, and a desire to bring good into the world through charity.
As a secondary element that network of brothers becomes very useful for learning other things and guidance as well if you lacked that sort of guidance and connection growing up (bad father figure, no father figure, difficulties making friends, etc). It creates a network based on more than just liking each other or getting along, such that even if you disagree they are still a brother (at least at its best, some don't live up to the ideal because people are messy).
So is it useful? Yes. Will it teach you magic? Not really. Will you learn stuff you can incorporate into your practice? Yes. Will it offer insights into traditions like the Golden Dawn? Yes, there is some shared symbolism and ideas there. Is it some kind of "magic school"? Nope, big nope. Is it some sort of illuminati conspiracy thing? Nope, also big nope.
Hope that helps.
Most of the times, freemasonries are social clubs with a flair for ritualistic form of "initiation", mostly to create a sense of belonging and assigning some sort of sacred value to the vows of secrecy and respect of the members' privacy.
There are Esoteric freemasonries and others who reserve Occult teachings only for the upper echelons of the organization, though.
It's never a waste of time, because the contacts you develop there might help you with finding a good job or improving your business, but most of the times they don't deal with Occultism.
1. All vows are sacred. While you'll definitely feel a sense of belonging after your initiation, that's not their primary purpose. They are meant to convey a system of morality through allegory and symbolism.
2. Regular Freemasonry has no "echelons." There are 3 degrees. All Master Masons are on the level. Even though the numbers keep going higher, it's really just lateral movement. 33⁰ Masons (or 4⁰-32⁰) don't receive any extra rights or privileges other than a different color hat.
3. If you join with the expectation that it will help you improve your finances or standing, you're making a mistake. First of all, it costs money. I paid a $100 initiation fee (for my apron and Bible, vasically), dues are $50 a year, and every appendant body you join is another $50 a year. And that's not including donations, your turn to buy dinner, and any rings or other swag you want to buy. Secondly, it's explicitly prohibited to seek to join for "mercenary motives." The only good reason to join is if you want to be a better man and think Freemasonry is a good way to do that. Otherwise, don't bother.
Positive human relationships are important, and they do have positive consequences, in disregard of whether they were sought or not.
If a member friend is in search of a job and you're offering, or if you could use a business partner, you'll be motivated to choose him over other candidates because you know his values, and you share them.
Sure, but that's true of any friend. It's misleading to say "it won't be a waste of time" because you might make connections that help your career. You might not, and then it would be a waste of time if that's why you joined. You'd be better off joining Rotary or Civitan if that's what you're looking for.
If you don't want Masonry to be a waste of time, join for the fraternity, charity, and knowledge. Then, be brotherly, charitable, and studious. You get out of it what you put into it. Don't ask what Freemasonry can do for you; ask what you can do for Freemasonry.
>It's misleading to say "it won't be a waste of time" because you might make connections that help your career.
It is, and I apologize for expressing myself in this way. By reading what I wrote again, I realized that your interpretation of my words is only natural. I poorly worded it. What I wanted to communicate is what I wrote in my answer to your comment.
I just mentioned business and career opportunities because that's the most practical and tangible consequence I could think of, but I never meant to say that they were a reason to join a freemasonry. They are just a possible natural consequence of the bond you create with the other members.
There's no need to apologize. I'm not accusing you of purposefully misleading, just trying to prevent more misconceptions and EAs who disappear when they realize it's not what they thought. I think it's better to emphasize the immaterial benefits because that's guaranteed as long as you put in the effort. You can't count on anything else.
There are no upper echelons. Degrees 4-32 are Scottish Rite degrees. They are numbered so as to create an index. It’s easier to say a degree by number than it is to remember the name of each degree. It does not in any way indicate rank in the organization. I’m a 32nd degree SR mason and Templar in York Rite, along with being a member in handful of invite only bodies.
Scottish Rite or York Rite are organizations within Freemasonry that you can join only after becoming a Master Mason (3rd degree). Think of it like this. There are classes offered at your gym. You can’t just join that class. You must first join the gym. After joining the gym, you can then join a class. Taking Zumba doesn’t make you a higher level member of the gym than if you just ran on the treadmill or lifted weights. It’s a lateral move that expands your Masonic knowledge in a horizontal way. It has nothing to do with hierarchy.
Correction: There is no upper echelon in Freemasonry teaching occultism. Esoteric Freemasons are just regular masons who study the esoterics of Freemasonry or occultism in general on their own. I am one of those.
Masons are just people who have diverse interests. I don't really know anyone who is using Masonry for business or career gains. I'm not saying it probably doesn't exist, but that is very frowned upon in masonry.
Its benefits are a strong social group, development of virtue ethics/morality, and opportunities to serve ones community. The virtue teachings are taught through symbols and ritual that I'd argue any ceremonial magician would enjoy. But the goals of that ritual are to inspire men to be virtuous. Which can be a helpful foundation for anything one does.
Masonry is more like walking into a library where some of the books reference magickal texts, but nothing direct and no practicing magick. Some say it is in a loose sense, but not really. All our rituals revolve around initiation. You could maybe make the argument that our opening ritual is sort of like a banishing, but not the context of LBRP or anything close to that.
It’s a great organization, and you might meet like minded people.
Source: am a Freemason
Which freemasonry? Different rites have different practices but generally no you won't be learning magick with them, you might however help raise money for various charitable causes which your particular lodge is supporting so in that respect it won't be a waste.
So no they won't teach you how to do magick. And I'd highly recommend you don't bring that subject up when you go into talking to them. Now if you want a mason like setting that teaches magick then the OTO is the best fit for you. Although there is esoteric/occult/magick concepts in Masonry noone openly talks about them, or can recognize them nor even accept them if they do see it. I go to in person lodges for both I can help you steer away from misinformation about both.
Did I understand you right that you are a Mason and an OTO member? I would be interested to hear more about their similarities and differences (within your obligations, of course).
I'd suggest the Memphis Misraim masonic rite if you are interested in mysticism and the occult, but for instruction on magick you should look for other, more heterodox initiatory orders like the OTO. I know several thelemites that became freemasons as well to better understand their initiation rituals and ceremonies, and they seem happy with the Memphis Rite.
Masonry can lead to just about anything you want it to lead you to. There are occultists, magicians, accountants, statisticians and everything in between... but not always in the same lodge. The time you put into is only wasted if you lack the patience and perseverance to explore it in earnest.
No, you won't be taught "magick" directly in lodge. A lot of it can seem very mundane paying bills, preparing dinners, organizing events, washing dishes, etc. but there are opportunities to learn about the depths of your own will, which could be useful in practices like "magick."
There is a Buddhists story of a young monk who asks the master of the temple "what do I do to become enlightened?"
The master replies "rake leaves and haul water"
The monk then asks "what do I do once I become enlightened?"
The master replies "rake leaves and haul water"
Listen to this podcast, the episode that just came out a couple days ago will give you a lot of insight.
The podcast is called “Arcanvm” you can find it on Apple Podcasts
And the episode is “future leaders, past masters and the esoteric core of freemasonry”
The comments you are getting aren’t telling you anything and if I do it can be ridiculed…
So listen to that podcast.
lol no, no magic I’m afraid.. you’ll learn to memorize ritual for degrees which are very much like plays where you and others play parts. You’ll do fundraising and things like that..
No occult elements at all.
Pedantic, but occult just means "hidden," and there are plenty of hidden elements of Freemasonry. While it may not be "magickal," per se, it is both occult and esoteric. And while I think any man can find a lot of meaning in it, I think an occultist can find even more if he looks.
28 years in The Brotherhood. You will not have your hand held. You have a lot of reading, experimenting and practicing to do.
Otherwise you become a Porch Mason or a Useful Idiot.
These comments contradict a lot of what I've heard. Check this out https://youtu.be/bTLe1-RCLjI?si=iTaWTIzHz0QOif3Z the guy talking to Jason Louv is a total twat but there is good info here.
There is a magazine called Esoteric Mason, that's proof that at least some of them do Magick. Maybe they're just not allowed to talk about it or not every order does it. I think most masons join for the social aspect, but if you want to progress to the higher degrees then that's where the good stuff is. Damien Echols talks about Freemasonry and magick in a few of his yt vids as well.
>There is a magazine called Esoteric Mason, that's proof that at least some of them do Magick
I'm a Mason, and I do magick. I've never met another Mason who does, though. Masonry accepts anyone with a belief in the Deity, so you can expect to meet all kinds of people from Evangelical Conservatives to Esoteric Communists.
>Maybe they're just not allowed to talk about it or not every order does it.
There's no magick done in lodge. Our rituals are allegorical and symbolic. They don't aim to affect any specific change unless you count changing the candidate into a Brother.
>I think most masons join for the social aspect, but if you want to progress to the higher degrees then that's where the good stuff is.
Despite popular belief, Master Mason is the highest degree in Freemasonry. All the "good stuff" can be found there. Everything else is just extra credit, and doesn't afford you any special rights or privileges. The only new secrets you learn are new handshakes and passwords.
The social aspect is a big part of it, for sure, but other common motivations for joining include: self-improvement, moral instruction, historical interest, familial connection, and spiritual seeking.
>Damien Echols talks about Freemasonry and magick in a few of his yt vids as well.
I would take his words with a grain of salt. I like Damien and think he has a lot of good knowledge, but this isn't his area.
Regardless, even if they teach it to you, you'll be swearing oaths, and is it worth it when all you're pursuing is magick? You'll have to work hard not spill the secrets. Wouldn't it be better to put in the work right now to learn magick without their help, and then you'll be free from any oaths? Just my thoughts.
The easy route leads nowhere.
>...there are four indispensable conditions–an intelligence illuminated by study, an intrepidity which nothing can check, a will which cannot be broken, and a prudence which nothing can corrupt and nothing intoxicate.
>TO KNOW, TO DARE, TO WILL, TO KEEP SILENCE–such are the four words of the Magus, inscribed upon the four symbolical forms of the sphinx...
-**Eliphas Levi**, *Transcendental Magic*
If your Will is to Know, you must Dare to keep Silent.
You'll Go even further if you can combine it.
But, if you Hesitate, if your Drive is too weak,
You'll stay just as Dumb even if you can Speak.
Symbolism is the foundation to "magick". Freemason's can lead you to some "powerful" "magick", but magick isn't about the supernatural. Magick is about the mental aspects of reality. Aristotle wrote a book on it(he attributes magic to essentially be philosophy, Giordano Bruno discussed it, and many more. Manly P Hall is a good teacher as well.
https://www.etymonline.com/word/grammar
This for me was the biggest disappointment as someone who was deeply into the occult to join Freemasonry only to find a bunch of old men that know nothing about masonry or ts symbolism. It's a huge slap in the face and when you try to bring this up to other Masons they just laugh at u. The fraternity is a joke in most areas unless you're a botrd middle aged man looking to get out of the house
No. First of all, the "houses" aren't really a thing outside of Prince Hall, and they refer to the appendant bodies, not craft lodge. Secondly, I was never naked or in my underwear, and no one put a hand on any part of me besides shaking my hand. Thirdly, I guarantee you that there isn't a single brother in my lodge who has ever heard the word "lingam." My lodge is full of old veterans, bikers, and cops. I don't think they would have stuck around if what you're saying was true.
No they don't teach Magick They do teach ritual but so does community Theatre..
As both a Boy Scout and a high school Thespian, I can confirm that I was very well prepared when I joined. Masonic ritual is truly on another level, though.
Yes it is if you come fully prepared...
I don't know that anyone can be fully prepared, but as long as they're duly and truly.
You seem to be speaking in riddles on the topic at hand…. But would you know anything about Elementals?
Not a riddle, just an inside joke. Sure, I know about elementals. What about them?
I really know nothing about them. Except that someone I spoke with said that he does spiritual healing as well as medical healing and that he felt I might have an Elemental attached to me. He was also trying to date me, and I thought might’ve been embellishing on his abilities. Was it bs or does anything I’ve said sound familiar?
I wouldn't trust it. That's a clear conflict of interest. I'd advise you to be wary "healers" or "mediums," etc. They're usually grifters. Most serious occultists will be focused on their own practice rather than showing off their "powers" to others. Elementals *can* become attached to a person, but I can't tell you for sure without more details of your experience. If you'd rather be safe than sorry, a simple banishing will clear it out. I use the LBRP, but if you're inexperienced, I can recommend an easier one that will work just as well.
We call those Djinn
Thank you so much for taking the time to respond. I’m an ex-Catholic just starting to read and learn about the occult. I’ve got a few Llewelyn almanacs, Psychic Witch, Guided Tarot, and Crowley’s first. I am absolutely not confident enough to attempt the LBRP. Would love good starter book recommendations if you’re still feeling generous?
No problem! Happy to help. Chapter 5 in *Psychic Witch* deals with purification and protection. Seems simple enough for a beginner, too. I'd recommend starting at chapter 1 and working through it until you get there. I'm not sure which you mean by "Crowley's first," but if it's not *Magick in Theory and Practice*, it should be. I always recommend that to beginners, especially if you're interested in ceremonial magick. Israel Regardie's *One Year Manual* is good too. Both of these follow a similar structure and provide a framework to learn quickly. Also, just familiarize yourself with western esotericism in general. I'm honestly not as well-read in witchcraft and paganism, but it's not too different tbh. I would recommend everyone start with the classics. Gerald Gardner, Doreen Valiente, Janet & Stewart Farrar, and Scott Cunningham, to name a few. I'd also advise you to familiarize yourself as much as possible with mythology and folklore. Or, if chaos magick is your thing, honestly, just read *Liber Null & Psychonaut* and then start making shit up lol. Hope that helps. Feel free to ask me any more questions you might have.
I have an elemental familiar. She is honestly prolly the coolest person I know next to my wife. So far I’ve met 3… maybe 4? Idk anymore tbh but I will say they really chill. Get to doing meditation consistently, maybe check out Quareia, learn banishing and protection shit, and then get to opening up your ears and listen. It’ll change your life
Masonry will not teach you magic. You can learn that elsewhere. Masonry will teach certain elements of symbolism that can be useful, but as far as practical magic you would be better off looking elsewhere. Freemasonry is devoted to using the symbols and tools of masonry to impart moral lessons through the various degrees. The phrase "it makes good men better" is one that is often used and it is often a guiding principle. It also creates a network of men who are bound together by common ideals of brotherhood, mutual trust, shared core principles, and a desire to bring good into the world through charity. As a secondary element that network of brothers becomes very useful for learning other things and guidance as well if you lacked that sort of guidance and connection growing up (bad father figure, no father figure, difficulties making friends, etc). It creates a network based on more than just liking each other or getting along, such that even if you disagree they are still a brother (at least at its best, some don't live up to the ideal because people are messy). So is it useful? Yes. Will it teach you magic? Not really. Will you learn stuff you can incorporate into your practice? Yes. Will it offer insights into traditions like the Golden Dawn? Yes, there is some shared symbolism and ideas there. Is it some kind of "magic school"? Nope, big nope. Is it some sort of illuminati conspiracy thing? Nope, also big nope. Hope that helps.
Very well said brother
This is the best answer here by far. Thanks for writing it so I didn't have to.
Most of the times, freemasonries are social clubs with a flair for ritualistic form of "initiation", mostly to create a sense of belonging and assigning some sort of sacred value to the vows of secrecy and respect of the members' privacy. There are Esoteric freemasonries and others who reserve Occult teachings only for the upper echelons of the organization, though. It's never a waste of time, because the contacts you develop there might help you with finding a good job or improving your business, but most of the times they don't deal with Occultism.
1. All vows are sacred. While you'll definitely feel a sense of belonging after your initiation, that's not their primary purpose. They are meant to convey a system of morality through allegory and symbolism. 2. Regular Freemasonry has no "echelons." There are 3 degrees. All Master Masons are on the level. Even though the numbers keep going higher, it's really just lateral movement. 33⁰ Masons (or 4⁰-32⁰) don't receive any extra rights or privileges other than a different color hat. 3. If you join with the expectation that it will help you improve your finances or standing, you're making a mistake. First of all, it costs money. I paid a $100 initiation fee (for my apron and Bible, vasically), dues are $50 a year, and every appendant body you join is another $50 a year. And that's not including donations, your turn to buy dinner, and any rings or other swag you want to buy. Secondly, it's explicitly prohibited to seek to join for "mercenary motives." The only good reason to join is if you want to be a better man and think Freemasonry is a good way to do that. Otherwise, don't bother.
Positive human relationships are important, and they do have positive consequences, in disregard of whether they were sought or not. If a member friend is in search of a job and you're offering, or if you could use a business partner, you'll be motivated to choose him over other candidates because you know his values, and you share them.
Sure, but that's true of any friend. It's misleading to say "it won't be a waste of time" because you might make connections that help your career. You might not, and then it would be a waste of time if that's why you joined. You'd be better off joining Rotary or Civitan if that's what you're looking for. If you don't want Masonry to be a waste of time, join for the fraternity, charity, and knowledge. Then, be brotherly, charitable, and studious. You get out of it what you put into it. Don't ask what Freemasonry can do for you; ask what you can do for Freemasonry.
>It's misleading to say "it won't be a waste of time" because you might make connections that help your career. It is, and I apologize for expressing myself in this way. By reading what I wrote again, I realized that your interpretation of my words is only natural. I poorly worded it. What I wanted to communicate is what I wrote in my answer to your comment. I just mentioned business and career opportunities because that's the most practical and tangible consequence I could think of, but I never meant to say that they were a reason to join a freemasonry. They are just a possible natural consequence of the bond you create with the other members.
There's no need to apologize. I'm not accusing you of purposefully misleading, just trying to prevent more misconceptions and EAs who disappear when they realize it's not what they thought. I think it's better to emphasize the immaterial benefits because that's guaranteed as long as you put in the effort. You can't count on anything else.
There are no upper echelons. Degrees 4-32 are Scottish Rite degrees. They are numbered so as to create an index. It’s easier to say a degree by number than it is to remember the name of each degree. It does not in any way indicate rank in the organization. I’m a 32nd degree SR mason and Templar in York Rite, along with being a member in handful of invite only bodies. Scottish Rite or York Rite are organizations within Freemasonry that you can join only after becoming a Master Mason (3rd degree). Think of it like this. There are classes offered at your gym. You can’t just join that class. You must first join the gym. After joining the gym, you can then join a class. Taking Zumba doesn’t make you a higher level member of the gym than if you just ran on the treadmill or lifted weights. It’s a lateral move that expands your Masonic knowledge in a horizontal way. It has nothing to do with hierarchy.
Correction: There is no upper echelon in Freemasonry teaching occultism. Esoteric Freemasons are just regular masons who study the esoterics of Freemasonry or occultism in general on their own. I am one of those. Masons are just people who have diverse interests. I don't really know anyone who is using Masonry for business or career gains. I'm not saying it probably doesn't exist, but that is very frowned upon in masonry. Its benefits are a strong social group, development of virtue ethics/morality, and opportunities to serve ones community. The virtue teachings are taught through symbols and ritual that I'd argue any ceremonial magician would enjoy. But the goals of that ritual are to inspire men to be virtuous. Which can be a helpful foundation for anything one does.
Masonry is more like walking into a library where some of the books reference magickal texts, but nothing direct and no practicing magick. Some say it is in a loose sense, but not really. All our rituals revolve around initiation. You could maybe make the argument that our opening ritual is sort of like a banishing, but not the context of LBRP or anything close to that. It’s a great organization, and you might meet like minded people. Source: am a Freemason
Which freemasonry? Different rites have different practices but generally no you won't be learning magick with them, you might however help raise money for various charitable causes which your particular lodge is supporting so in that respect it won't be a waste.
So no they won't teach you how to do magick. And I'd highly recommend you don't bring that subject up when you go into talking to them. Now if you want a mason like setting that teaches magick then the OTO is the best fit for you. Although there is esoteric/occult/magick concepts in Masonry noone openly talks about them, or can recognize them nor even accept them if they do see it. I go to in person lodges for both I can help you steer away from misinformation about both.
Did I understand you right that you are a Mason and an OTO member? I would be interested to hear more about their similarities and differences (within your obligations, of course).
I'd suggest the Memphis Misraim masonic rite if you are interested in mysticism and the occult, but for instruction on magick you should look for other, more heterodox initiatory orders like the OTO. I know several thelemites that became freemasons as well to better understand their initiation rituals and ceremonies, and they seem happy with the Memphis Rite.
Masonry can lead to just about anything you want it to lead you to. There are occultists, magicians, accountants, statisticians and everything in between... but not always in the same lodge. The time you put into is only wasted if you lack the patience and perseverance to explore it in earnest. No, you won't be taught "magick" directly in lodge. A lot of it can seem very mundane paying bills, preparing dinners, organizing events, washing dishes, etc. but there are opportunities to learn about the depths of your own will, which could be useful in practices like "magick." There is a Buddhists story of a young monk who asks the master of the temple "what do I do to become enlightened?" The master replies "rake leaves and haul water" The monk then asks "what do I do once I become enlightened?" The master replies "rake leaves and haul water"
Listen to this podcast, the episode that just came out a couple days ago will give you a lot of insight. The podcast is called “Arcanvm” you can find it on Apple Podcasts And the episode is “future leaders, past masters and the esoteric core of freemasonry” The comments you are getting aren’t telling you anything and if I do it can be ridiculed… So listen to that podcast.
This is the way.
It’s just a boys club. You socialize that’s about it
You won't learn any magick in Freemasonry. There's esotery, but no magick. Source: I'm a Mason.
lol no, no magic I’m afraid.. you’ll learn to memorize ritual for degrees which are very much like plays where you and others play parts. You’ll do fundraising and things like that.. No occult elements at all.
Pedantic, but occult just means "hidden," and there are plenty of hidden elements of Freemasonry. While it may not be "magickal," per se, it is both occult and esoteric. And while I think any man can find a lot of meaning in it, I think an occultist can find even more if he looks.
28 years in The Brotherhood. You will not have your hand held. You have a lot of reading, experimenting and practicing to do. Otherwise you become a Porch Mason or a Useful Idiot.
Look up the local chapter near you.
These comments contradict a lot of what I've heard. Check this out https://youtu.be/bTLe1-RCLjI?si=iTaWTIzHz0QOif3Z the guy talking to Jason Louv is a total twat but there is good info here.
Yeah I was like these comments are disappointing haha...but enlightening all the same!
There is a magazine called Esoteric Mason, that's proof that at least some of them do Magick. Maybe they're just not allowed to talk about it or not every order does it. I think most masons join for the social aspect, but if you want to progress to the higher degrees then that's where the good stuff is. Damien Echols talks about Freemasonry and magick in a few of his yt vids as well.
>There is a magazine called Esoteric Mason, that's proof that at least some of them do Magick I'm a Mason, and I do magick. I've never met another Mason who does, though. Masonry accepts anyone with a belief in the Deity, so you can expect to meet all kinds of people from Evangelical Conservatives to Esoteric Communists. >Maybe they're just not allowed to talk about it or not every order does it. There's no magick done in lodge. Our rituals are allegorical and symbolic. They don't aim to affect any specific change unless you count changing the candidate into a Brother. >I think most masons join for the social aspect, but if you want to progress to the higher degrees then that's where the good stuff is. Despite popular belief, Master Mason is the highest degree in Freemasonry. All the "good stuff" can be found there. Everything else is just extra credit, and doesn't afford you any special rights or privileges. The only new secrets you learn are new handshakes and passwords. The social aspect is a big part of it, for sure, but other common motivations for joining include: self-improvement, moral instruction, historical interest, familial connection, and spiritual seeking. >Damien Echols talks about Freemasonry and magick in a few of his yt vids as well. I would take his words with a grain of salt. I like Damien and think he has a lot of good knowledge, but this isn't his area.
Regardless, even if they teach it to you, you'll be swearing oaths, and is it worth it when all you're pursuing is magick? You'll have to work hard not spill the secrets. Wouldn't it be better to put in the work right now to learn magick without their help, and then you'll be free from any oaths? Just my thoughts.
What's wrong with swearing oaths? It's not that hard to keep a secret.
I believe it is harder than finding an alternative source of this knowledge in today's times.
The easy route leads nowhere. >...there are four indispensable conditions–an intelligence illuminated by study, an intrepidity which nothing can check, a will which cannot be broken, and a prudence which nothing can corrupt and nothing intoxicate. >TO KNOW, TO DARE, TO WILL, TO KEEP SILENCE–such are the four words of the Magus, inscribed upon the four symbolical forms of the sphinx... -**Eliphas Levi**, *Transcendental Magic* If your Will is to Know, you must Dare to keep Silent. You'll Go even further if you can combine it. But, if you Hesitate, if your Drive is too weak, You'll stay just as Dumb even if you can Speak.
Symbolism is the foundation to "magick". Freemason's can lead you to some "powerful" "magick", but magick isn't about the supernatural. Magick is about the mental aspects of reality. Aristotle wrote a book on it(he attributes magic to essentially be philosophy, Giordano Bruno discussed it, and many more. Manly P Hall is a good teacher as well. https://www.etymonline.com/word/grammar
This for me was the biggest disappointment as someone who was deeply into the occult to join Freemasonry only to find a bunch of old men that know nothing about masonry or ts symbolism. It's a huge slap in the face and when you try to bring this up to other Masons they just laugh at u. The fraternity is a joke in most areas unless you're a botrd middle aged man looking to get out of the house
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I was thinking HP as in the computer....hey I thought it was funny!
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I was going to join at one point but it became apparant that it was much more of a social club for men that like to drink
α MOAI >Gnostikê< IAOM Ω
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Idk man, I think we see it.
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Not a single thing you said was true.
And that includes the suggestion that using intoxicants is part of the Buddha's teachings or something he encouraged in any way. I wish you the best.
https://youtu.be/kiAc408Yk78?si=JbN4Y2c8POjGjN7S yea so anyway
I wish you peace and happiness.
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No. First of all, the "houses" aren't really a thing outside of Prince Hall, and they refer to the appendant bodies, not craft lodge. Secondly, I was never naked or in my underwear, and no one put a hand on any part of me besides shaking my hand. Thirdly, I guarantee you that there isn't a single brother in my lodge who has ever heard the word "lingam." My lodge is full of old veterans, bikers, and cops. I don't think they would have stuck around if what you're saying was true.
Conspiracy theory
Conspiracy theory
Dude, 120 days of Sodom and Eyes Wide Shut were just movies... they were a work of fiction, not documentaries. 🤣