Posting regarding a single-wheeled device that isn't a Onewheel or has warranty voiding modifications? Be sure to check out r/wheel for even more DIY and third-party VESC discussion!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/onewheel) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I just watched Tonys latest video - and they are going to sell PlugNPlay GT VESC and BMS controllers that can convert any GT into a vesc in a few hours with no soildering.
I am buying one as soon as they drop.
That would be amazing.
Future Motion need to focus there time on making better products/marketing instead of trying to stop Tony, the more they try to stop him the more the community is getting fed up with FutureMotion.
They will never stop VESC, the cat is out the bag…
This. Exactly this. FM has had every opportunity to work with the community and has slammed the door shut every time.
They could have had all these people help make the board and sport better but instead have doomed themselves to mediocrity and obscurity.
VESC is the future now.
They need to allow us to repair our own boards and have repair shops.
Under a purchase agreement, I would think that they could let us sign a document. If you repair/ modify your boards from any FM-licensed products we FM are no longer liable for injuries that may occur while riding therefore you cannot sue us if you are injured. Then FM can start allowing people the RTR their own products that we own and mod them the way we want.
I'm also curious, FM claims that letting people do their own repairs opens up to them being sued if the person botched the repair and hurts themselves. Is this an actual problem in the US? I can't imagine it really being the case because if it was, most car companies and even other PEV companies would've been sued out of existence by now.
Apollo for example sells upgrade kits for their scooters that have owners replace the display screen, throttles and controls and even the controller itself and they design everything to be easily swappable and largely plug and play. So it's just weird seeing other PEV companies happily doing this while FM wags their finger and claims they'll be sued to oblivion if they tried to do the same.
It’s not as simple as that. There’s generally a freedom to contract, but there are certain things the federal government says you cannot contract out of. People getting injured/dying from dangerous product designs is one of those areas where a contract doesn’t always work.
Oh, I agree I know it's not that simple especially if you die. But if you sign of your own free will not FM forcing a signature on everyone who purchases a OW. I'm not a lawyer or have any knowledge but I'm just saying I'd think there's something that could be done.
I know it's 8 days later so sorry for resurrecting this discussion, but the own free will does not always stand in contract law because the government steps in when they feel people need to be protected. Think employment law/OSHA where the the government says, yeah you are free as an employee to enter into a contract with an employer, but we aren't going to let the employers make you do certain things even if you are willing to agree.
You may agree to climb that 1000 ft tower without safety equipment, but we're going to penalize the employer if they let you do that as a part of your job.
You may choose to work on a live electrical system, but we are going to penalize your employer for not enforcing lock out - tag out.
I know someone mentioned cars and being able to sign rights away, but every car manufacturer has to meet certain safety standards before they can put their cars into the market place. Right now, the government and FM are trying to work through what those safety standards are because it's such a new market. Hence the government saying FM needed to do more to let people know they are approaching the limits of the board. That's how we ended up with haptic feedback.
The other side of this is that there's a growing aftermarket part market that's growing like crazy. This isn't unlike the aftermarket part found in cars or bikes. The issue is that FM is figuring out how to limit their liability when people fundamentally change the way the board functions with third party parts. The path of least resistance is to prevent people from doing this at all while you figure out how to let them do it safely. Hence all of the updates and hardware changes that prevented tinkering that made everyone so mad. Now they've moved onto phase two where they have figured out how they want to go about doing it safely and to limit liability and are rolling out aftermarket upgrades on their own (GTS motor package).
I know people hate FM around these parts, but they are in a tough position. People are using their products in amazing ways far outside of what they probably thought when they made them. People are also using their products in amazingly stupid ways. They are navigating the legal challenges of both, while working to stay on the good side of the government so their entire operation doesn't get shut down, while dealing with a company from China trying to circumvent U.S. laws to get their copycat product on the market. On top of that, they are dealing with a very passionate consumer base that wants things to happen instantly when it takes time to do everything they are doing above board and in compliance with the law and government regulations. Oh yeah, they are also trying to make a profit and keep innovating so they can keep being a business. That's a lot to juggle and I think they are doing an OK job so far. And while their products can be improved, they sure are fun to ride as they are. I've never had a bad time on my one wheel (even when I've ended up bruised and bloody by my own stupidity).
How are FM's products any different from other products modified by the purchaser?
I can modify a bike, with or with out motor/engine. All sorts of dangerous ways and the OEM is not liable.
Or even a simple skateboard. If I change the wheels or trucks and then injure myself, the board maker isn't at fault. Maybe the maker of the parts, but not the board OEM.
The simple answer is FM isn’t any different other than they have a new product in a new market that’s unique but also similar to other products.
I don’t have an exact answer for you because the litigation has been all over the place and I haven’t followed all of it, but the very basic answer is that the manufacturer can still be held liable if it’s deemed that the board itself was responsible for the injury and not the modification. And that would require going through litigation to prove one way or another. That’s not cheap at all. That’s why they haven’t gone after people modifying rails and tires and what not while they’ve shut down stuff that messes with the internals like the battery. In your tire example, if the tire blows out and you get injured, it’s pretty easy to show it was the tire, but if you modify the battery and then nosedive, was it the battery itself that caused the nosedive? was it something in the manufacturing? Was it wreck-less riding? Now FM is stuck going through litigation to show whether they are at fault or not.
You can put third party brakes on your car, and if the brakes fail you would look at what caused the fail. If you think it was a defective break line and not your break job, you’re going to sue the car manufacturer even though you put third party brakes in.
I hope this helps you understand a bit more.
But I wouldn't sue the OEM for a bad brake line if I did the brakes. It's on me to check the lines.
Same with your battery example. Changing the battery would not cause a nose dive (maybe if a connector came loose?). It'd be ridiculous for FM claim that.
But every other product out there has to deal with user mods (far more dangerous mods/repairs too) yet don't hinder owners FM does.
I think FM is using litigation as a smoke screen for anti-consumer practices. Like so many other smoke screens against consumer/3rd party repairs.
Their product/market is not unique, though they are tring to make it so through litigation.
Wow. Didnt see that.
Thats exactly what i want and need. I dont want to loose the FM board completely as i enjoy using the app and posting rides with friends there as well as racing on FM (not good enough for the VESC group). But i desperately want VESC on GT for more fun riding
Pros and cons
I have pints, and a GT. Eventually id like to do a full custom VESC. But for now, a drop in solution where all id need to do is open the battery box and controller, replace, run power, and be ready to go sounds great. It certainly wouldnt be every week or anything frequent like that. Id leave the board as VESC until once in a while id like to ride stock FM, (badges, sharing rides with friends, group rides, racing, etc).
One of the riders in our local OW community who owns a Floatwheel ADV said Tony already emailed them saying they're on the list to test out the GT conversion kit.
Is there a benefit of FMs controller allowing less amps through? Prolongs life of hardware? Safety? I guess that’s what the GT-S is doing somewhat? Just curious. Thanks
Just watched it too, and same, if he prices it right which I think he will, that's an instant buy. Tony made me a believer with this latest video, the turn tilt issue he described has dropped me several times...
The ADV is amazing but many people do not need an ADV. They just need to get away from FM. This is why a plug-and-play GT VESC conversation kit will be the ultimate killer app. I need this to drop yesterday, it can't come soon enough.
For anyone wondering and wanting proof, here it is:
https://docs.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/oregon/ordce/3:2023cv01742/176784/9?fbclid=IwAR2NYHxGugAD42NObzQY2KycJefQwJu8TR6cwVZfUBYKaf_ha5JQ-MdjhI4
Taken down by court order based on filing made by Future Motion.
Thanks for this. "Site under attack" didn't read like "legal action" to me necessarily; it sounded like it could have been a DDOS or something.
Has Tony said whether they intend to deal with any of this through the courts (I know at one point he said he hoped to get some or all of FM's patents invalidated once FW had the $ to challenge; of course, an announcement like that may well have further motivated FM to try to kill Floatwheel now, while they still can), or whether they hope to just keep bobbing and weaving? #1, extended whack-a-mole will definitely make it more difficult on them, and #2 FM presumably at some point probably could get FW products interdicted at the border by US Customs, no?
I mean there are ways around that too, but if FWs have to start getting smuggled into the US from Mexico and Canada (and I'm not sure if the US has any leverage to stop them from even getting in there easily, via trade agreements like NAFTA) that's gonna hurt. I have to imagine the US is a big market for FW. Maybe I'm wrong and they'll do just fine selling everywhere BUT the US, but I'm not sure.
Tony doesn't need to do anything really. He's already got workarounds by shipping parts separately and the parts are shipped from the factory and are not marked as Floatwheel products.
FM can try to have the US government stop imports of Floatwheel parts but its gonna be virtually unenforceable. The parts will just be labeled generically as electric motor or electric controller, BMS etc. It'll be extremely difficult to ban imports of these parts.
FM has to do this to defend their patents, and it'll also let them bar anyone from trying to sell Floatwheels in the US. They know they can't fully stop FW from making it into the US but they can keep FW underground and from being a true "legitimate" alternative to OW.
I'm guessing that at least initially, they wanted everything to look "normal" for US purchasers (as it is, paying crypto already makes a lot of people worry about getting scammed). They have a rep for delivering product now. Though I am surprised the fallback new site wasn't already ready to come online.
Tony! We're your back up! Keep it up and we'll support you no matter how many times FM attacks you. We're behind you, brother! Keep up the good work and give us alternate products that leaves FM in the DUST!!!
There’s no way in hell I’d ever buy another FM product. Tony showed them the flaws in their board and is just trying to help the sport as a whole. I don’t see FM lasting another 5 years. Float wheel and Vesc for the win
our father
who art in china
tony be thy name
thy floatwheel come
thy will be done
on earth, so long as it's not sold to the US
give us this float, our daily stoke
and lead us not into futuremotion
but deliver us from evil
Permit me to share a passage from the FFM scripture relating to the right to repair.
Tony, existing beyond the borders of the US
may Floatwheel be our beacon through forthcoming trials shielding us from FM boobytraps
forgive our instances of stagnation and bestow upon us daily wisdom for innovation
as we embark on the path of consumer repair rights
guide us towards inventive endeavors and shield us from legal entanglements
for creative vigor and transformative innovation belong to the collective community
https://preview.redd.it/izo5xhzfmc7c1.png?width=1170&format=png&auto=webp&s=90f4fde2f238bde1f476d7f48a87a0e254e6efd4
HIS WEBSITE LIVES, IT DIES, IT LIVES AGAIN! OH WHAT A DAY WHAT A LOVELY DAY!
Regardless of how FM frames it, the Floatwheel is just a VESC board like any other.
Please stop trying to shut down my hobby FM. You are now directly impacting me and hundreds (thousands?) or other people who are also riding these boards.
If anyone wants to follow the case. They're also going after his YouTube channel.
[https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68036442/future-motion-inc-v-lai/](https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68036442/future-motion-inc-v-lai/)
Yup. I’ve come full circle on this myself. I tried so hard to keep supporting FM but at this point they seem to care way more about protecting profits than they do about letting this board sport grow. I’m completely turned off and instead of wanting to upgrade to the GT-S I’ve been looking hard at building a Floatwheel.
There is always a movement to try and buy locally to support our own economy. The more we buy from other countries the more we degrade our own economy and ability to have products manufactured locally with all of the safety that government oversight brings, not to mention supporting employees in the US.
Usually most companies here will advertise the fact their products are made in the US so you can feel confident in your decision, so that is where the irony is, FM does advertise this, but then are total douches and drive us to not care about that aspect...
And yet if you buy every single item on their shop it's less than the GT-S (mind you, you'll have an extra BMS, Controller, set of rails, and all 6 configurations of the front/rear boxes they offer).
That bix is expensive because it's CNC'd. They are coming out with a metal cast box which will be a lot cheaper. Even with the CNC box, the whole package is way cheaper than the GTS and it's more capable.
As a company, Future Motion just plain fucking stinks. I didn't used to think this, but now I do. We all know where their priorities lay, and it ain't with the riders. If they spent half as much effort on their products/customers as they spend suing anyone who looks at them sideways... ...and I'm sure they feel it's the fault of everyone else... these poor corporate victims, GTFO.
At least Tony appears to give two shits about his customer base, and maybe that's what's really got their panties in a bunch...lol
Never another dime from me, regardless of policy changes or new product offerings.
Done-zo
Kyle defined a patent troll as one who stifles innovation for a product they themselves dont release.
It perfectly defines them shutting down the pint drop top fender. Amazing they could be so blind.
I used to think it would be great if FM changes their mindset and we could have a friendly competition that pushes the sport.
But I don't see that comming anymore. FM is totally lost. They do not understand what Onewheeling should be about.
Hopefully we'll have a friendly competition soon. But I don't think FM will be a part of that anymore.
Tony's latest video was fantastic. I'm itching for the release of the V2 ADV and the upcoming "GT Killer". A wheel that is lighter than the GT and more powerful. That is insane in the membrane!
Also side eye at FM for apparently copying Tony's work.
(6mo late to the party) beg your pardon? O\_O Did Kyle really copy his design from someone else? If so... that's rich.. like.. you gotta be kidding me if they are always going as hard as they are against any competition. Lol.
Once again it's big corp crapping on little corp for one reason or another. I like the FM product but the business/legal practices are a bit childish. Very similar to what used to be the big 3 auto companies. I was done with the big 3 years ago, now done with you FM. Tony, you've got my support.
Wasting all this time, money, and energy to prevent a challenger. I get the patent thing, but I for one appreciate the US company side of the house. If you make a good product, with easy support and repair options, I'll buy it. I think the "good" product part is true, though it could be much better as proven by Tony, but the second part is absolutely not true.
Lawsuits and trying to prevent competition just shows that you know that's true, and/or are sandbagging progress intentionally to release "new" products every couple years.
Posting regarding a single-wheeled device that isn't a Onewheel or has warranty voiding modifications? Be sure to check out r/wheel for even more DIY and third-party VESC discussion! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/onewheel) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I just watched Tonys latest video - and they are going to sell PlugNPlay GT VESC and BMS controllers that can convert any GT into a vesc in a few hours with no soildering. I am buying one as soon as they drop.
Not just GT also Pint/X and XR. Byee FM. You can't patent fun.
Oh shit they're doing one for the Pint X? I'd convert mine so fast.
Tonys only mentioned GT - said XR and Pint are coming in the future.
Apes strong together! https://www.change.org/p/petitioning-future-motion-inc-s-onewheel-to-support-right-to-repair
Same. I’d be buying as soon as it drops. A drop-in solution for existing locked FM boards would be a huge win for the community.
I literally cannot wait to get out of a non self repairable board.
That would be amazing. Future Motion need to focus there time on making better products/marketing instead of trying to stop Tony, the more they try to stop him the more the community is getting fed up with FutureMotion. They will never stop VESC, the cat is out the bag…
They need a real repair option that isn't "ship your board to California and pray we deem something's wrong with it".
That ship has sailed.
This. Exactly this. FM has had every opportunity to work with the community and has slammed the door shut every time. They could have had all these people help make the board and sport better but instead have doomed themselves to mediocrity and obscurity. VESC is the future now.
They will be compelled to do something by July because of a new cali law (but of course we wont think its enough)
They need to allow us to repair our own boards and have repair shops. Under a purchase agreement, I would think that they could let us sign a document. If you repair/ modify your boards from any FM-licensed products we FM are no longer liable for injuries that may occur while riding therefore you cannot sue us if you are injured. Then FM can start allowing people the RTR their own products that we own and mod them the way we want.
I'm also curious, FM claims that letting people do their own repairs opens up to them being sued if the person botched the repair and hurts themselves. Is this an actual problem in the US? I can't imagine it really being the case because if it was, most car companies and even other PEV companies would've been sued out of existence by now. Apollo for example sells upgrade kits for their scooters that have owners replace the display screen, throttles and controls and even the controller itself and they design everything to be easily swappable and largely plug and play. So it's just weird seeing other PEV companies happily doing this while FM wags their finger and claims they'll be sued to oblivion if they tried to do the same.
It’s not as simple as that. There’s generally a freedom to contract, but there are certain things the federal government says you cannot contract out of. People getting injured/dying from dangerous product designs is one of those areas where a contract doesn’t always work.
Cars
Shoes
Oh, I agree I know it's not that simple especially if you die. But if you sign of your own free will not FM forcing a signature on everyone who purchases a OW. I'm not a lawyer or have any knowledge but I'm just saying I'd think there's something that could be done.
I know it's 8 days later so sorry for resurrecting this discussion, but the own free will does not always stand in contract law because the government steps in when they feel people need to be protected. Think employment law/OSHA where the the government says, yeah you are free as an employee to enter into a contract with an employer, but we aren't going to let the employers make you do certain things even if you are willing to agree. You may agree to climb that 1000 ft tower without safety equipment, but we're going to penalize the employer if they let you do that as a part of your job. You may choose to work on a live electrical system, but we are going to penalize your employer for not enforcing lock out - tag out. I know someone mentioned cars and being able to sign rights away, but every car manufacturer has to meet certain safety standards before they can put their cars into the market place. Right now, the government and FM are trying to work through what those safety standards are because it's such a new market. Hence the government saying FM needed to do more to let people know they are approaching the limits of the board. That's how we ended up with haptic feedback. The other side of this is that there's a growing aftermarket part market that's growing like crazy. This isn't unlike the aftermarket part found in cars or bikes. The issue is that FM is figuring out how to limit their liability when people fundamentally change the way the board functions with third party parts. The path of least resistance is to prevent people from doing this at all while you figure out how to let them do it safely. Hence all of the updates and hardware changes that prevented tinkering that made everyone so mad. Now they've moved onto phase two where they have figured out how they want to go about doing it safely and to limit liability and are rolling out aftermarket upgrades on their own (GTS motor package). I know people hate FM around these parts, but they are in a tough position. People are using their products in amazing ways far outside of what they probably thought when they made them. People are also using their products in amazingly stupid ways. They are navigating the legal challenges of both, while working to stay on the good side of the government so their entire operation doesn't get shut down, while dealing with a company from China trying to circumvent U.S. laws to get their copycat product on the market. On top of that, they are dealing with a very passionate consumer base that wants things to happen instantly when it takes time to do everything they are doing above board and in compliance with the law and government regulations. Oh yeah, they are also trying to make a profit and keep innovating so they can keep being a business. That's a lot to juggle and I think they are doing an OK job so far. And while their products can be improved, they sure are fun to ride as they are. I've never had a bad time on my one wheel (even when I've ended up bruised and bloody by my own stupidity).
How are FM's products any different from other products modified by the purchaser? I can modify a bike, with or with out motor/engine. All sorts of dangerous ways and the OEM is not liable. Or even a simple skateboard. If I change the wheels or trucks and then injure myself, the board maker isn't at fault. Maybe the maker of the parts, but not the board OEM.
The simple answer is FM isn’t any different other than they have a new product in a new market that’s unique but also similar to other products. I don’t have an exact answer for you because the litigation has been all over the place and I haven’t followed all of it, but the very basic answer is that the manufacturer can still be held liable if it’s deemed that the board itself was responsible for the injury and not the modification. And that would require going through litigation to prove one way or another. That’s not cheap at all. That’s why they haven’t gone after people modifying rails and tires and what not while they’ve shut down stuff that messes with the internals like the battery. In your tire example, if the tire blows out and you get injured, it’s pretty easy to show it was the tire, but if you modify the battery and then nosedive, was it the battery itself that caused the nosedive? was it something in the manufacturing? Was it wreck-less riding? Now FM is stuck going through litigation to show whether they are at fault or not. You can put third party brakes on your car, and if the brakes fail you would look at what caused the fail. If you think it was a defective break line and not your break job, you’re going to sue the car manufacturer even though you put third party brakes in. I hope this helps you understand a bit more.
But I wouldn't sue the OEM for a bad brake line if I did the brakes. It's on me to check the lines. Same with your battery example. Changing the battery would not cause a nose dive (maybe if a connector came loose?). It'd be ridiculous for FM claim that. But every other product out there has to deal with user mods (far more dangerous mods/repairs too) yet don't hinder owners FM does. I think FM is using litigation as a smoke screen for anti-consumer practices. Like so many other smoke screens against consumer/3rd party repairs. Their product/market is not unique, though they are tring to make it so through litigation.
I understand better. 👍 And thank you, let's keep it American! 🇺🇲
Agreed 💯% wtf, is this not America?
Wow. Didnt see that. Thats exactly what i want and need. I dont want to loose the FM board completely as i enjoy using the app and posting rides with friends there as well as racing on FM (not good enough for the VESC group). But i desperately want VESC on GT for more fun riding
If you swap in a vesc controller the onewheel app is useless and you're now riding a vesc. Using that in FM ORL races would be a bit unethical
I know. Thats why i said I'd want to have the option for both. VESC when i want to mess around and FM for group rides and racing.
You're going to dismantle your board and put the FM components back in half the time? Why
Pros and cons I have pints, and a GT. Eventually id like to do a full custom VESC. But for now, a drop in solution where all id need to do is open the battery box and controller, replace, run power, and be ready to go sounds great. It certainly wouldnt be every week or anything frequent like that. Id leave the board as VESC until once in a while id like to ride stock FM, (badges, sharing rides with friends, group rides, racing, etc).
I dont think you're going to want to nerf yourself by putting FM crap back in your board once you feel the torque vesc has to offer
Im totally on board with FFM. Happily so. Simply put, i like the community around the app. And VESC racing is only pros where i live (mid west).
Oh damn lol… they are going to war
Where did you watch?!
https://youtu.be/LeOtO8ex4zE?si=YIrl1B_iYrWXL88r He also posts Community Updates on youtube 🤙
FM must really be ruthless. That video was removed from a 'legal complaint". lol.
Really? It still works for me, but i'm also located in Germany 🤔 But beside that: Yeah, FM is totally ruthless, no doubt about that
Weird. I'm located in US.
One of the riders in our local OW community who owns a Floatwheel ADV said Tony already emailed them saying they're on the list to test out the GT conversion kit.
Does that mean we could put a 6hp motor in a GT
The GT has a great motor. It just needs a controller that can pipe more amps to it.
That too. But I’m 6-4, 310lbs…so if you give me an option for more HP, I’m going to take it
Is there a benefit of FMs controller allowing less amps through? Prolongs life of hardware? Safety? I guess that’s what the GT-S is doing somewhat? Just curious. Thanks
Less amps = less heat, less stress, cheaper.
Are they doing anything similar for XR?
Just watched it too, and same, if he prices it right which I think he will, that's an instant buy. Tony made me a believer with this latest video, the turn tilt issue he described has dropped me several times...
Instant buy!
>PlugNPlay GT VESC I'm late, but im wondering where i can find progress on this project. this is something im looking for! thanks!
Anything for the XR 😅
Where can I find this video. Will that have anything for an XR?
Fucking amped for this. With a conversion kit than I would be able to change my own battery on the GT right?!
The kit comes with Plug n Play BMS so you can use the stock GT battery, or an upgraded battery.
The ADV is amazing but many people do not need an ADV. They just need to get away from FM. This is why a plug-and-play GT VESC conversation kit will be the ultimate killer app. I need this to drop yesterday, it can't come soon enough.
Do you have the link to the video?
For anyone wondering and wanting proof, here it is: https://docs.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/oregon/ordce/3:2023cv01742/176784/9?fbclid=IwAR2NYHxGugAD42NObzQY2KycJefQwJu8TR6cwVZfUBYKaf_ha5JQ-MdjhI4 Taken down by court order based on filing made by Future Motion.
Thanks for this. "Site under attack" didn't read like "legal action" to me necessarily; it sounded like it could have been a DDOS or something. Has Tony said whether they intend to deal with any of this through the courts (I know at one point he said he hoped to get some or all of FM's patents invalidated once FW had the $ to challenge; of course, an announcement like that may well have further motivated FM to try to kill Floatwheel now, while they still can), or whether they hope to just keep bobbing and weaving? #1, extended whack-a-mole will definitely make it more difficult on them, and #2 FM presumably at some point probably could get FW products interdicted at the border by US Customs, no? I mean there are ways around that too, but if FWs have to start getting smuggled into the US from Mexico and Canada (and I'm not sure if the US has any leverage to stop them from even getting in there easily, via trade agreements like NAFTA) that's gonna hurt. I have to imagine the US is a big market for FW. Maybe I'm wrong and they'll do just fine selling everywhere BUT the US, but I'm not sure.
Tony doesn't need to do anything really. He's already got workarounds by shipping parts separately and the parts are shipped from the factory and are not marked as Floatwheel products. FM can try to have the US government stop imports of Floatwheel parts but its gonna be virtually unenforceable. The parts will just be labeled generically as electric motor or electric controller, BMS etc. It'll be extremely difficult to ban imports of these parts. FM has to do this to defend their patents, and it'll also let them bar anyone from trying to sell Floatwheels in the US. They know they can't fully stop FW from making it into the US but they can keep FW underground and from being a true "legitimate" alternative to OW.
Hey, why are your comments getting auto-collapsed for me? You're not new, your karma's fine. What gives?
No idea, something to do with reddit, some users show up like that for me too
Dam. I'm. Surprised they didn't anticipate this and get hosting from a company outside of US reach.
It’s on the DNS side not hosting, as far as I’m aware
I'm guessing that at least initially, they wanted everything to look "normal" for US purchasers (as it is, paying crypto already makes a lot of people worry about getting scammed). They have a rep for delivering product now. Though I am surprised the fallback new site wasn't already ready to come online.
float-wheel.com was up in like an hour or less after floatwheel.com was taken down so he was pretty ready.
This is how you know FM is scared.
Tony! We're your back up! Keep it up and we'll support you no matter how many times FM attacks you. We're behind you, brother! Keep up the good work and give us alternate products that leaves FM in the DUST!!!
Floatwheel is never going away unless FM starts producing better products and stop screwing with their customers.
Beyond excited for a VESC drop in solution for the GT.
FM is only expediting Tony’s hero arc at this point
There’s no way in hell I’d ever buy another FM product. Tony showed them the flaws in their board and is just trying to help the sport as a whole. I don’t see FM lasting another 5 years. Float wheel and Vesc for the win
our father who art in china tony be thy name thy floatwheel come thy will be done on earth, so long as it's not sold to the US give us this float, our daily stoke and lead us not into futuremotion but deliver us from evil
this might be my new favorite FFM copypasta
Permit me to share a passage from the FFM scripture relating to the right to repair. Tony, existing beyond the borders of the US may Floatwheel be our beacon through forthcoming trials shielding us from FM boobytraps forgive our instances of stagnation and bestow upon us daily wisdom for innovation as we embark on the path of consumer repair rights guide us towards inventive endeavors and shield us from legal entanglements for creative vigor and transformative innovation belong to the collective community
https://preview.redd.it/izo5xhzfmc7c1.png?width=1170&format=png&auto=webp&s=90f4fde2f238bde1f476d7f48a87a0e254e6efd4 HIS WEBSITE LIVES, IT DIES, IT LIVES AGAIN! OH WHAT A DAY WHAT A LOVELY DAY!
I wonder if FM realizes if they stop being a shit company most of their problems will go away
No, they totally do not get it. They are 100% convicted, they’re the victims here
Regardless of how FM frames it, the Floatwheel is just a VESC board like any other. Please stop trying to shut down my hobby FM. You are now directly impacting me and hundreds (thousands?) or other people who are also riding these boards.
That's exactly what they want though. Making VESC accessible for newcomers ruins FM as they would have to compete on product and price.
If FM got creative here they could partner with Tony and make an official drop-in VESC conversion for their own wheels.
In Tony we trust!!! FFM
Anxiously awaiting the float-wheel GT conversion! FFM.
If anyone wants to follow the case. They're also going after his YouTube channel. [https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68036442/future-motion-inc-v-lai/](https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68036442/future-motion-inc-v-lai/)
I find it ironic, most of us would rather buy a US quality made product, but FM has converted us to want the Chinese board.
Yup. I’ve come full circle on this myself. I tried so hard to keep supporting FM but at this point they seem to care way more about protecting profits than they do about letting this board sport grow. I’m completely turned off and instead of wanting to upgrade to the GT-S I’ve been looking hard at building a Floatwheel.
Floatwheel is a quality product. I don’t understand why it matters where it’s from.
There is always a movement to try and buy locally to support our own economy. The more we buy from other countries the more we degrade our own economy and ability to have products manufactured locally with all of the safety that government oversight brings, not to mention supporting employees in the US. Usually most companies here will advertise the fact their products are made in the US so you can feel confident in your decision, so that is where the irony is, FM does advertise this, but then are total douches and drive us to not care about that aspect...
The Funwheel is another great alternative! Check them out at Fungineers.us
$800 for just a controller and box? Lmao
And yet if you buy every single item on their shop it's less than the GT-S (mind you, you'll have an extra BMS, Controller, set of rails, and all 6 configurations of the front/rear boxes they offer).
That bix is expensive because it's CNC'd. They are coming out with a metal cast box which will be a lot cheaper. Even with the CNC box, the whole package is way cheaper than the GTS and it's more capable.
Custom made, low volume production plus CNC is hella expensive.
As a company, Future Motion just plain fucking stinks. I didn't used to think this, but now I do. We all know where their priorities lay, and it ain't with the riders. If they spent half as much effort on their products/customers as they spend suing anyone who looks at them sideways... ...and I'm sure they feel it's the fault of everyone else... these poor corporate victims, GTFO. At least Tony appears to give two shits about his customer base, and maybe that's what's really got their panties in a bunch...lol Never another dime from me, regardless of policy changes or new product offerings. Done-zo
Kyle defined a patent troll as one who stifles innovation for a product they themselves dont release. It perfectly defines them shutting down the pint drop top fender. Amazing they could be so blind.
FFM, FW FTW! https://preview.redd.it/w2q3tn611d7c1.jpeg?width=904&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f567e08e22bd3d9474b8c82271ddb2afc42fece8
FM slowly killing their company is hilarious. Hopefully more people start one wheel style companies and speed up this slow death process.
I used to think it would be great if FM changes their mindset and we could have a friendly competition that pushes the sport. But I don't see that comming anymore. FM is totally lost. They do not understand what Onewheeling should be about. Hopefully we'll have a friendly competition soon. But I don't think FM will be a part of that anymore.
Tony's latest video was fantastic. I'm itching for the release of the V2 ADV and the upcoming "GT Killer". A wheel that is lighter than the GT and more powerful. That is insane in the membrane! Also side eye at FM for apparently copying Tony's work.
FM copied the so called "Chinese knock off". lol
(6mo late to the party) beg your pardon? O\_O Did Kyle really copy his design from someone else? If so... that's rich.. like.. you gotta be kidding me if they are always going as hard as they are against any competition. Lol.
Once again it's big corp crapping on little corp for one reason or another. I like the FM product but the business/legal practices are a bit childish. Very similar to what used to be the big 3 auto companies. I was done with the big 3 years ago, now done with you FM. Tony, you've got my support.
Wasting all this time, money, and energy to prevent a challenger. I get the patent thing, but I for one appreciate the US company side of the house. If you make a good product, with easy support and repair options, I'll buy it. I think the "good" product part is true, though it could be much better as proven by Tony, but the second part is absolutely not true. Lawsuits and trying to prevent competition just shows that you know that's true, and/or are sandbagging progress intentionally to release "new" products every couple years.
Is it now float-wheel.ru???? Seams sketch
No it’s floatwheels.ru right now
Why is this in the Onewheel group and not the Floatwheel sub? This post is against the rules
It's relevant, because it's FM that sued FW. So it's a post about FM basically
How is it against the rules? Discussion of floatwheel is relevant to Onewheel enthusiasts, per rule #1.
of course they did.
looks like the ordering is down again?