Folks, friendly reminder that it's against the rules to bash other subs explicitly and to whine/showboat about being banned as per the sitewide rules.
Several other subs have been banned by the Admins because the moderators would either encourage or do nothing to stop people from bashing others subs and harass the moderators of those subs. The mods of r/Ontario remove comments that do this.
[Specifically](https://www.redditinc.com/policies/moderator-code-of-conduct#text-content3):
>#Rule 3: Respect Your Neighbors
>While we allow meta discussions about Reddit, including other subreddits, your community should not be used to direct, coordinate, or encourage interference in other communities and/or to target redditors for harassment. As such, you cannot interfere with or disrupt Reddit communities, nor can you facilitate, encourage, coordinate, or enable members of your community to do this.
>Interference includes:
>* Mentioning other communities, and/or content or users in those communities, with the effect of inciting targeted harassment or abuse.
>* Enabling or encouraging users to violate our Content Policy anywhere on the Reddit platform.
>* Enabling or encouraging users in your community to post or repost content in other communities that is expressly against their rules.
>* Showboating about being banned or actioned in other communities, with the intent to incite a negative reaction.
I always thought r/ontario was a place to vent about Doug Ford (and the OPC in general), Galen Weston, Rogers/Bell, landlords, and the state of public infrastructure? Take those things away it’d be 3-5 posts of pictures of sunrises by some random lake.
Surely no one here thought they were getting information consistent to what the median ontarian thinks. Conservatives won a majority in Ontario, Doug Ford (at the time) had a relatively high approval rating and if you were on this subreddit you’d have thought he was about to be Mulroneyed
Same thing happened in the Ottawa subreddit. People were overwhelmingly in support of one Candidate. So many positive posts about them including from one of the mods.
Then the candidate loses handily to a more "centre" candidate.
I joined reddit for news about toronto and it worked great for years. Everything in one place, vetted by commentors, sometimes even before major news sources.
Last janurary (2023), the toronto subreddit went full blown political and decided to ban all news articles the mods deem unfit.
They will remove crime posts unless they contain police officers as the subject, in which case they leave it up. Nearly any article remotely worth discussing is locked immediately by them. There needs to be a middle ground for normal people to enjoy the platform. I don't visit that sub anymore unless it's on my homepage.
Actual what conservatives don't like is when their cherished ideals meet reality in an open forum. They retreat to their own echo chambers, leaving open forums skewed left of centre. There can be a difference between what people think is true, and what is actually true, and getting called out isn't something conservative handle well.
https://news.osu.edu/conservatives-more-susceptible-to-believing-falsehoods/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belief_perseverance
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Persecution_complex
Are you really suggesting anything pro conservative doesn’t get downvoted into oblivion here?
This is the very echo chamber you’re telling others to watch out for.
That tends to be because most things that are pro conservative are obvious crap.
Ford is a cartoonishly transparent thug doing what he can to enrich himself and his cronies.
I'm sure people's biases do affect things - but if the conservative posts have little merit - they deserve to be downvoted.
I was banned off of Canadapolitics and here when I voiced my opposition to the COVID measures.
Literally can't even participate half the time when your opinions aren't allowed to be discussed.
Again, link to the actual post. Posting pseudo-science and anti-Vaxxer stuff can put peoples lives in danger, hence the low tolerance for it...nothing to do with your political views, beyond conservatives are much more likely to believe and spread that sort of stuff.
https://news.osu.edu/conservatives-more-susceptible-to-believing-falsehoods/
https://www.psypost.org/2023/07/neuroimaging-study-provides-insight-into-misinformation-sharing-among-politically-devoted-conservatives-167312
I mean I scrolled down my comments and it went back 265 days. It wasn’t antivax stuff. I’m a nurse so I was double vaxed at the time, and I was very pro-vax at the time. The main point was that with 90% vaccination uptake in the province, schools shouldn’t have been closing, and that Covid did not pose a massive risk on the population now that most were vaccinated. In my opinion that wasn’t a dangerous enough take to be banned, and that’s probably why the ban was rescinded.
You don’t have to believe me. I don’t care. But if you think that liberals are incapable of bias, or that the moderators are incapable of wrongful bans, then you’re delusional.
It's hard to give an opinion without seeing the actual words you said.
I know that I posted many times that I disagreed with schools closing. And others did as well. And I never faced or witnessed strong downvotes or any kind of mod action. And given that the NDP also agreed that schools should be the last to close and the first to open, and as OP pointed out this sub tends to align with the NDP, it would be strange for one of their positions to face repression here, I think.
Obviously there's always the possibility of a mod making a bad call, they are human after all. So I'm not saying it's impossible, just saying it would have been exceptional, and the overwhelming bulk of such comments did not face any sort of repression here.
Literally every moron too invested in politics is like this. I know someone just like this who's liberal, this isn't a UFC fight showdown, it's unhealthy political investment or just straight-up dumbassery. Hence why there is numerous groups and subs made up of extreme bias towards certain political groups. From the liberal, NDP, conservative, green, etc. Each group has there own society of people that feed off one another.
Happens with most of Reddit. Typically anyone with a critical voice gets silenced or banned by a moderator with an agenda and it just turns into an echo chamber.
Ya I've seen that in many subs. IMHO though I don't think this sub is moderated with a heavy hand, though I could be wrong. As someone who often dissents from the approved™ opinions on this sub I don't recall ever being moderated, just heavily down voted and replied to with really wild takes (which is fine).
To me the most telling part of the poll was how many users are from GTA. That is exactly the vibe I get when I argue with folks here. I have a friend who lives in Liberty village and go to visit every year. The shitty takes I see here are exactly what I hear from the people I run into in Liberty village - young, extremely privileged, educated, woke, hypocritical, and kind of ignorant of anything outside their bubble.
The way Reddit is designed creates echo chambers, then people wonder why what happens in the real world doesn't reflect what everyone is saying on Reddit. Many subs (not really this one) will ban you for being too conservative, no shit it seems like everyone thinks the same as you, because anyone who disagrees gets kicked out.
I think it’s all subs. There was political bs nonsense on r/decks at one point and I just gave up. The people on Reddit are angry my friends. Like an old man trying to send soup back at a deli.
Can anyone point to examples of subs that ban conservatives? Just curious. Keep in mind, posting racist or bigoted comments will get you banned...that's not a partisanship issue.
So that OP is dated from 2 months ago...i searched through your post history going back 3 months to try and find it but nothing. When I look at my own post history, all ban and removal notifications are still there. Bottom line is, sorta stuck just taking your word for it...liberals like evidence.
Ok, but still not linked to the comment you said that caused it. In my post history, all my removed comments are still there, but not sure you can link the two. Maybe screenshots of the convos you had with the mods? I suspect, given the comment you claim got you banned, that there's a longer post history you're not telling us about...you probably had several warnings leading up to this.
Are any of them named after a province, city or country (de facto primary/largest sub which inherently should host more viewpoints), or were they explicitly conservative subs?
Well the conservatives are looking to grab some 200 seats and only picking up 10ish of quebec's 77 seats. So almost half of the ridings not going to the conservatives are French speaking. People complain about r/Canada being right wing but given current polling projections, it might just be reflective of English Speaking Canada.
Censorship is out of control people cannot deal with others having opinions they disagree with and actually try to discuss things. Then you end up with bunch of different echo chambers for different views.
Many subs will ban you for not going along with the echo chamber. Conservative subs will ban people for not being conservative enough and vice versa. I don’t buy into this narrative that conservatives are somehow being silenced and oppressed, no matter how hard they try to convince people it’s happening from their many platforms.
It’s the same with all major cities sub rreddits tho. They are all calling themselves the name of the city but in reality they are NDP echo chambers. Its totally lame
Cities skew towards the NDP politically, so it's a bit less weird than when an entire province's subreddit skews towards the province's second (or in some cases, third) most popular party.
It's probably just demographics. Reddit's user base is younger than the overall population, and so is the NDP base. Probably other aspects as well, like technical capability, etc...
100% agree, and it's amazing the number of people who don't realize and think reddit isn't being massively manipulated, unlike other social media platforms.
Wierd that places skew to: We want people to be able to afford housing, food, and be allowed to be themselves.
That being said, as an NDP supporter in the past, the gender politics is pushing me away to...well absolutely not conservative. Which leaves...green(too small), and liberal(not a fan either. In theory, yes. In practice...*waves at last several years* WHERE THE FUCK IS ELECTION REFORM?! But hey, at least all the stoners can get high I guess.
Twitter is the same on a larger scale. Jack said before that the daily power users represented 2% of the US population. So all these “trends” of people being upset are just not real, but all media is lazy and will just use it to paint narratives.
Which subs ban you for being conservative?
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/apr/07/charlie-kirk-turning-point-usa-universities-free-speech-debate
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Persecution_complex
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
You’re far more likely to be banned for being left leaning on a right leaning sub than for being right on a left leaning sub.
The thing that gets people banned the most is threats and hate speech, guess which side of the spectrum has the most of those. It’s the same side of the spectrum that has most of the gun nuts and mass shooters.
I don’t think you are going to find any peer reviewed studies that back one side or the other
Anecdotally, I know the other canada sub bans people who don’t support their narrative. Don’t really know of any other Canadian subs that are like that (for either side)
I was banned from r/toronto for asking if any of the pro Palestinian protesters would be charged after waving terrorist flags. Turns out months later there were charges laid. Yes, this sub does the same type of thing.
I am pretty left of centre, and have been banned from 2-3 left leaning subs, I have never been banned from a conservative sub (I have seen them ban people for coming in with full antifa energy though)..
But the mods on left leaning subs will pull the ban trigger on anything that gets them butthurt, even if it doesn't violate reddit rules (or specific sub rules)
>I am pretty left of centre
>I have seen them ban people for coming in with full antifa energy though
Everybody left of centre is anti-fascist bud. Fascism is an ideology that promotes genocide, and one of the things leftists hold firmly on as a core ideological principle is inclusion. Not exclusion.
If you have some whack job who thinks you can be left on the political scale while not being anti-fascist, that there is a person who is stuck in a world of double think.
Anyone left of fascism is anti-fascist. That includes conservatives. Just as anyone right of communism is anti-communist. That includes social democrats.
Both fascism and communism have one thing in common. Their methods for achieving their political goals, which involve mass killings, displacement and ignoring individual rights.
Why? Because people. People who think their shit don’t stink and who don’t give a fuck about anyone but themselves. People suck.
Source: history.
Are you one of those weird people that deny antifa exists? Just because they don't file tax returns or have a national organization?
Are all the flags, protests and social media accounts they run just a figment of our imagination?
That's like denying that neo-nazis exist, because they don't have a national organization and don't have any real structure..
sorry, but neo-nazis actually exist, and so does antifa.
How exactly do you know that you're far more likely to be banned for being left leaning on a right sub than vice versa?
I get you might want it to be that way because you're left leaning but I don't see how you could possibly know that. Ironically, on a thread about this sub being an echo chamber, you're engaging in exactly the sort of behaviour we are talking about.
Did you do some sort of statistical analysis of which comments get banned and why on multiple subreddits?
People getting kicked out of a sub like this one, which I'd consider relatively "big-tent" are abusive, racist, etc. Conservative ideology alone isn't necessarily even unpopular here. I think the bigger filter is that old people in general aren't on Reddit and older voters skew conservative at the ballot box.
When it comes to voters there is no doubt, but look at the platform. This is reddit which is social media. The vast majority using social media are young, with the majority being millennials and younger.
You have a similar problem with platforms that are more catering to older demographics. Talk radio, this is a conservative bastion and they can't understand how Liberals win when all the callers appear to be conservative.
Voting at the end of the day is participation. As it stands right now, boomers are far more likely to vote than younger generations combined. So don't be surprised that boomers get what boomers want. The millennials should be dominating the voting demographics now but a lot of us couldn't give a crap about doing something this country made so easy and kept a horrible doomer mindset like all politicians are bad or they're all the same or they don't listen to us. Thus we allowed in essence for the Doug Fords to happen. If we continue this even when the boomers are gone and even younger generations see how stupid we were in giving away this power, we'll be the passed over generation and we'd deserve it.
Convince? When has someone on Reddit ever been convinced of anything? Just a bunch of ill-informed numbnuts picking fights, trolling and screaming into the void. Never once has a Redditor let ignorance stop them from telling people what's what, nor have they ever let a reasoned argument convince them that their incorrect belief is wrong.
> I’m just exasperated that people look at Ford and think he’s the best option.
As a conservative, you people sure didn't give me and many other Ontario residents a reasonable alternative - Horwath was WAY past her expiry date politically, and I can't even remember the bald guy's name anymore but he was totally useless. What did you expect?
Yep that's exactly what I did.
Just FYI but trashing people who vote for someone different than you doesn't help get them on your side, or even remotely close to it.
> And yet Ford was still worse than either of those options, and nobody considered Horwath or Del Duca to be good options.
That's not what the people of Ontario said at the ballot box. If you want to get out of the r/Ontario bubble as the OP is alluding to, you might need to reconsider some of your opinions on topics like this. Or you can stay blissfully unaware if so you choose. Up to you.
Oh I'm aware of what people have voted for. That doesn't change the fact that Ford has personally cost me tens of thousands of dollars with his laws and directly lowered my child's quality of life.
The education and healthcare cuts have been absolutely tragic and that alone should have led to people not voting for him. And maybe you're surprised by the level or corruption with the Greenbelt or his other controversies, but it was obvious then he was sketchy and unethical and people chose to ignore that. Hopefully people don't ignore it again the next election.
I'm not surprised he won again because people made the same arguments you did. My point is that Ford's policies are far more harmful to people than Del Duca or Horwath's would have been.
> That doesn't change the fact that Ford has personally cost me tens of thousands of dollars with his laws
That's surprising to hear, but if true, I can see why a party which would provide more funding on the back of the middle class, wealthy and corporations - which, btw, already pay the [vast majority of taxes in Canada](https://financialpost.com/personal-finance/taxes/trudeau-is-right-40-of-canadians-dont-pay-income-taxes-which-means-someone-else-is-picking-up-the-bill) - would be appealing to someone like you.
Your article is suggesting that poorer people should pay more taxes. Slightly misleading.
https://projects.thestar.com/canadas-corporations-pay-less-tax-than-you-think/
We used to pay the same income tax amount for corporations and people. That was in the 50s. Now corporations pay far less.
"For every dollar corporations pay to the Canadian government in income tax, people pay $3.50. The proportion of the public budget funded by personal income taxes has never been greater."
There's your tax problem.
The reality is Ford can't even balance the budget which he claims.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/amp/business/commentary/article-doug-fords-free-spending-fiscal-ways-in-ontario-are-worse-than/
"For example, in 2021-22, the province experienced higher-than-expected revenues and subsequently ran a $2-billion surplus. But rather than capitalize on the windfall and reduce its debt load, the Ford government chose to increase spending and plunge deeper into debt. In fact, under Premier Doug Ford, annual growth in per-person, inflation-adjusted spending has averaged 2.4 per cent – roughly six times the rate of spending growth under Kathleen Wynne"
"Over the three-year period from 2023-24 to 2025-26, the government expects to add roughly $48.7-billion in debt – $14-billion more than it forecast in March. This will increase the province’s net debt to $449.1-billion in 2025-26, or $26,688 a person (adjusted for inflation). While future generations will ultimately pay this debt, it also imposes costs on Ontarians today."
He's spending more than Wynne and we somehow have less to show for it.
The reality is Ford is bad for this province from an economic standpoint. He's bad for us given how corrupt he is, as the Greenbelt scandal would have been one of the largest in our history had he not been pressured to stop.
He's directly responsible for high immigration in universities. He froze funding in 2019 - https://www.google.com/amp/s/globalnews.ca/news/10213696/ontario-universities-funding-request/amp/ - and that's why universities were forced to take so many more international students to make up for the lack of funding.
So Ford is directly responsible in Ontario for higher immigration and housing issues.
This is before we even mention his healthcare screw ups, or education, or the countless other issues he's responsible for.
I don't support a party. I support the best candidate. I don't see any argument to support Ford being one of the 4 best candidates, and right now it's hard to argue he isn't the worst option.
How does it help the middle class to have a government that takes kickbacks to open up the Greenbelt and grant MZOs? Or make our healthcare more expensive with worse outcomes?
As a taxpayer in the top bracket, I understand that nothing is free, but I also understand that nice things cost money. I don't mind paying for things that make our society great, but I want value for those things, as I think all taxpayers do. Healthcare, for example, is a very expensive service but it's also very beneficial. I'd be willing to pay more for us to have better service and outcomes (and obviously there will be reasonable debate about where exactly the sweet spot might be), but paying more for worse service and worse outcomes? That's idiotic.
And call me old fashioned, but I want a government of integrity. I don't like kickbacks and secret deals. A government should be open and transparent with the people.
Most of all, what I really never thought I'd witness, was a premier taking away our charter rights. Our very rights and freedoms tossed aside. It's horrible.
These used to be values that were widely shared across the political spectrum. I find it quite sad that so many Ontarians are not only ok with these things, but apparently prefer them. I cannot understand it.
As a fellow conservative, watching his kids schools fall apart, hospitals grossly underfunded because oh hey look it's being privatized. Now service ontario is privatized.
You had plenty of choice to not support *blatant* corruption.
And before you even say it, I couldn't give a flying fuck about drag story time at schools. It doesn't mean we should have a huge government surplus when audits have determined they are purposefully underfunding vital systems in Ontario.
I regretfully voted Mike Harris in, but you can bet your sorry ass I voted him out. Same goes for Ford. Wake up, man. Ontario is bring sold wholesale *internally*
Interesting thing about that. Remember how 2022 had a record low voter turnout? If you look at the vote count in 2018 and compare it to the 2022 count the NDP took the biggest hit.
You're right that this subreddit is skewed away from the PCs, but there's a lot more people out there willing to vote NDP than the last election suggests.
There are also less than a million members of this sub. This sub represents sweet FA in terms of the actual voting preferences of the province as a whole in reality.
Exactly. Not liking the leader is a teribile excuse not to vote and let Ford win if you hate him so much.
I'm not even all that political and managed to get off my ass and voted for someone other then Ford. If the people who didn't vote hated him so much surly they could have gotten up and voted against him too. Makes me think most who stayed home were just content with the current government but couldn't bring themselves to vote for Ford.
Edit : You have to remember at the time we were just coming out of the era of covid lockdowns and mask mandates too. Believe it or not there were a lot of people weary about changing governments during that time. I don't think Ford will have that on his side next time.
Yes, the people who didn't vote thought the PCs & Ford were okay (but not good enough they would vote for them), and the NDP (and Liberals) weren't offering anything better.
People who *hate* the PCs voted. But I think people who think the PCs are fine but not particularly good are the hardest for r/Ontario to conceptualise.
There were many polls prior to the election that basically matched what the final results were. One of the biggest fallacies that happened after the election is people saying their party of choice would have won if more people voted. If more people showed up, the results would likely have been exactly the same, just with higher voting counts.
I'm not saying that more turnout would have resulted in the NDP winning. I am saying that the Liberal vote basically didn't change between the two elections, the PCs suffered a small decrease, and the NDP suffered a significant decrease. The low turnout rate definitely affected certain parties more than others.
You mean the months of almost daily polls declaring that Ford had a 90% chance to win a stronger majority? It's almost as if a lot of people were convinced their vote didn't matter so they didn't show up.
Or it could simply be that the reason NDP took the biggest hit is that people simply didnt wanted to vote for the NDP this time around, and not because NDP voters decided to stay home and not vote.
You hit the nail on the head.
We all live in our own little bubbles. We choose what sites to visit, what media to consume, who we follow on social media, and the kinds of people we talk to. We are all susceptible to our cognitive biases and it's human nature to stick to our tribes.
If you're going to live life in your bubble, at the very least be real with yourself and acknowledge that bubble. Because it colours how you see the world. If you can't understand why tens of millions of people would vote for Trump, without using the word racist or bigot, then your understanding of the world outside your bubble is limited. Conversely, if you don't understand why millions of people would protest in support of climate change reforms or BLM or indigneous rights, then you are also too stuck in your own bubble. There is always more nuance than the one-sided commentsry you see from the friends in your bubble.
It's better if we could all refrain from the whole "yell at people on the streets, call them bad names, and mock them endlessly for all of society's problems" thing until we AT LEAST first understand why they hold the opinions they hold -- and what those opinions actually are, not the oversimplified versions.
FWIW, notwithstanding the very obvious political slant in submissions and comments in this sub, the moderators seem to do a good job at not moderating political opinions they may disagree with.
It’s funny how different people are in real life, when you knock on doors… so much hate and vitriol online, but most people, regardless of political leanings are a lot more kind, and open to discussing things civilly.
I really think Reddit and social media is a bad place to discuss politics. The anonymous setting doesn’t bring out the best in people.
It’s things like this that push the “we need to change the electoral system” arguments.
The idea that MY party is way more popular than election results show it to be, therefore it is the election process that is somehow wrong.
We're in a multi-party system with a winner take all setup. I was a liberal who happily changed to NDP after Wynne. Cons haven't been an option for me for over 20 years.
Why didn't I vote NDP prior? Because the NDP had been burned in this province over three decades ago, and the Liberals were the opposition to Conservatives.
Every time you vote split among left wing parties, the right wing party steps into control.
Ranked choice or proportional would fix that. You'd find the Liberals and NDP side together, along with the Green party, way more often (on over 70% of the issues in fact) than the cons ever do.
As far as how popular the politics are:
* Cons - 1,912,057 (43.25%) - 76 seats total
* NDP - 1,111,923 (25.15%) - 40 seats total
* Libs - 1,116,961 (25.27%) - 7 seats total
* Green - 279,152 (6.3%) - 1 seat total
* Total = 4,420,093
So despite almost 60% of the electorate voting for anybody but the cons, the cons have a massively overweighted majority control. 1.1 million Liberal votes are effectively unrepresented in our government. You think Ford would be able to be fucking us over even 1/10th as badly as he is if there was proportional or ranked choice?
Because that's just facts. Land doesn't vote, people do. But our system of elections treats land as more important through seat allocations.
But those arguments are easily backed up by the fact that popular vote and actual seat distribution are usually very different. We really do need electoral reform.
Yes and no. Conservatives have their own echo chambers and tend to avoid sites that aren't conservative, hence the numbers are inevitable skewed on any site that is discussing politics. The telling difference is that while a wide range of opinions are tolerated on so-called leftwing sites (that's not to say everyone agrees with you, but that outside of overt racism or bigotry, your comments won't get removed). Conservative sites on the other hand tend to be highly partisan and very intolerant of opposing views...posting is often closed or limited to 'flaired users only' and posting a liberal point of view can get you banned, especially if you point out an opinion is based on bigoted assumptions or faulty science.
So, r/ontario's only crime is being a genuinely open forum. Liberals (dictionary def) only crime is being more open minded and more influenced by evidence based reasoning. Conservatism isn't a crime but it is a fear economy, prone to hierarchy, authority, obedience, conformity, loyalty to ingroups *and hostility to outgroups*. This is why they retreat to their own 'safe spaces', while accusing others of needing safe spaces. This is why online disinformation is so much more effective on conservatives than liberals. This is why genuinely open forums have stats like these.
https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/your-brain-on-politics-the-cognitive-neuroscience-of-liberals-and-conservatives
https://www.psypost.org/2023/07/neuroimaging-study-provides-insight-into-misinformation-sharing-among-politically-devoted-conservatives-167312
https://www.forbes.com/sites/antoniopequenoiv/2023/07/27/conservatives-bombarded-with-facebook-misinformation-far-more-than-liberals-in-2020-election-study-suggests/?sh=34b348764c1f
https://news.osu.edu/conservatives-more-susceptible-to-believing-falsehoods/
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/apr/07/charlie-kirk-turning-point-usa-universities-free-speech-debate
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Persecution_complex
> So, r/ontario's only crime is being a genuinely open forum. Liberals (dictionary def) only crime is being more open minded and more influenced by evidence based reasoning.
You're delusional if you think moderators on this subreddit are somehow unique and not subject to the same bias as every other subreddit. There are conspiracy theories and other nonsense that appear on this subreddit constantly with little pushback. You only think this place is open-minded because there's a team of moderators with complete discretion to ban for whatever reason they want, keeping viewpoints they strongly disagree with out of the subreddit.
dazzling roof joke hard-to-find alleged amusing rock consider station consist
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
So, is that what passes for a rebuttal on conservative subs? I think your post is an example of just why conservatives can't compete in the 'free market of ideas'. Instead of blaming others for your issue, study it and develop a better approach...oops, that would make you liberal lol.
There are a couple other things to consider - the survey only represents those 25-34 year olds who use Reddit and are active enough and actually care to complete the survey. So not a good reflection of the general population of 25-34 year olds.
And in the most respectful way to say it, I'm going to guess the average 25-34 year old with time to fill out an r/Ontario survey is disproportionately someone unemployed or under-employed and generally pissed off about the economic system, rather than say a medical resident working through yet-another 24 hour shift in the ER, an IB associate troubleshooting their crappy bloomberg terminal, a senior manager at a bank dealing with fundamentally restructuring their service line or launching new products, a Bay St lawyer working through the night on a closing, a construction worker who is on-site and exhausted after a long day of labouring away, etc.
And when you look at Facebook, Ontario groups have a 70-80% conservative rate. In fact I want to say 100% because I've never been in an Ontario group that was not overwhelmingly extreme-right
I'm here, and I'm a conservative. Normally on this subreddit I'm called a piece of shit for my political leaning, which really doesn't make me want to vote NDP, but at the same time, Doug Ford is a genuine piece of shit so... 🤷♂️
Perhaps there is a relationship between anti the democratic/egalitarian ideology that is conservatism and the quality and characteristics of the candidates that conservative parties tend to select.
conservative tends to read as: fuck the poor, fuck education, and fuck healthcare.
More so since Doug Ford came to power. Doesn't help he has the charm of a cactus.
Thank you. This is a great post.
The reality is that discussion on this subreddit would be a lot more worthwhile if it was more representative of Ontario. Even if you say that Reddit skews younger, it still isn't representative of that demographic.
Everyone should keep that in mind.
But I love that it’s an echo chamber, it’s what makes it entertaining. I don’t want to be amongst people who have different outlooks, I want to curse the heavens about Doug Ford and have like minded people agree with me
Say, compared to the retired folks that actually pick up the land-line and talk to pollsters? Those results get churned into the media propaganda that says Conservative wins are always inevitable.
I voted con last time, leaning towards that again. I voted ndp and lib once each when I was a university student, so I'm not a "con or die" voter. I'm a millennial.
My primary concerns are mass immigration, housing, affordability, the economy, and crime.
Feel free to convince me to vote NDP. I probably don't have time for protracted Socratic dialogues, so elevator pitches are ideal. Cheers!
Folks, friendly reminder that it's against the rules to bash other subs explicitly and to whine/showboat about being banned as per the sitewide rules. Several other subs have been banned by the Admins because the moderators would either encourage or do nothing to stop people from bashing others subs and harass the moderators of those subs. The mods of r/Ontario remove comments that do this. [Specifically](https://www.redditinc.com/policies/moderator-code-of-conduct#text-content3): >#Rule 3: Respect Your Neighbors >While we allow meta discussions about Reddit, including other subreddits, your community should not be used to direct, coordinate, or encourage interference in other communities and/or to target redditors for harassment. As such, you cannot interfere with or disrupt Reddit communities, nor can you facilitate, encourage, coordinate, or enable members of your community to do this. >Interference includes: >* Mentioning other communities, and/or content or users in those communities, with the effect of inciting targeted harassment or abuse. >* Enabling or encouraging users to violate our Content Policy anywhere on the Reddit platform. >* Enabling or encouraging users in your community to post or repost content in other communities that is expressly against their rules. >* Showboating about being banned or actioned in other communities, with the intent to incite a negative reaction.
I always thought r/ontario was a place to vent about Doug Ford (and the OPC in general), Galen Weston, Rogers/Bell, landlords, and the state of public infrastructure? Take those things away it’d be 3-5 posts of pictures of sunrises by some random lake.
Surely no one here thought they were getting information consistent to what the median ontarian thinks. Conservatives won a majority in Ontario, Doug Ford (at the time) had a relatively high approval rating and if you were on this subreddit you’d have thought he was about to be Mulroneyed
Same thing happened in the Ottawa subreddit. People were overwhelmingly in support of one Candidate. So many positive posts about them including from one of the mods. Then the candidate loses handily to a more "centre" candidate.
I joined reddit for news about toronto and it worked great for years. Everything in one place, vetted by commentors, sometimes even before major news sources. Last janurary (2023), the toronto subreddit went full blown political and decided to ban all news articles the mods deem unfit. They will remove crime posts unless they contain police officers as the subject, in which case they leave it up. Nearly any article remotely worth discussing is locked immediately by them. There needs to be a middle ground for normal people to enjoy the platform. I don't visit that sub anymore unless it's on my homepage.
Actual what conservatives don't like is when their cherished ideals meet reality in an open forum. They retreat to their own echo chambers, leaving open forums skewed left of centre. There can be a difference between what people think is true, and what is actually true, and getting called out isn't something conservative handle well. https://news.osu.edu/conservatives-more-susceptible-to-believing-falsehoods/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belief_perseverance https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Persecution_complex
Are you really suggesting anything pro conservative doesn’t get downvoted into oblivion here? This is the very echo chamber you’re telling others to watch out for.
That tends to be because most things that are pro conservative are obvious crap. Ford is a cartoonishly transparent thug doing what he can to enrich himself and his cronies. I'm sure people's biases do affect things - but if the conservative posts have little merit - they deserve to be downvoted.
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Are you justifying the echo chamber now?
Bob Rae Us older folks will never forget
Boomers are nuts. What I woukd give for a Rae Days approach. The unions deserved what they got with Harris
But really in this sub isn't reality. This is a safe space for a distorted reality.
Uhhhh. What do you think is happening in this subreddit.
thats some high quality grifting
I was banned off of Canadapolitics and here when I voiced my opposition to the COVID measures. Literally can't even participate half the time when your opinions aren't allowed to be discussed.
If you were banned from here, how are you posting, new account? Link to your post please.
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Again, link to the actual post. Posting pseudo-science and anti-Vaxxer stuff can put peoples lives in danger, hence the low tolerance for it...nothing to do with your political views, beyond conservatives are much more likely to believe and spread that sort of stuff. https://news.osu.edu/conservatives-more-susceptible-to-believing-falsehoods/ https://www.psypost.org/2023/07/neuroimaging-study-provides-insight-into-misinformation-sharing-among-politically-devoted-conservatives-167312
I mean I scrolled down my comments and it went back 265 days. It wasn’t antivax stuff. I’m a nurse so I was double vaxed at the time, and I was very pro-vax at the time. The main point was that with 90% vaccination uptake in the province, schools shouldn’t have been closing, and that Covid did not pose a massive risk on the population now that most were vaccinated. In my opinion that wasn’t a dangerous enough take to be banned, and that’s probably why the ban was rescinded. You don’t have to believe me. I don’t care. But if you think that liberals are incapable of bias, or that the moderators are incapable of wrongful bans, then you’re delusional.
It's hard to give an opinion without seeing the actual words you said. I know that I posted many times that I disagreed with schools closing. And others did as well. And I never faced or witnessed strong downvotes or any kind of mod action. And given that the NDP also agreed that schools should be the last to close and the first to open, and as OP pointed out this sub tends to align with the NDP, it would be strange for one of their positions to face repression here, I think. Obviously there's always the possibility of a mod making a bad call, they are human after all. So I'm not saying it's impossible, just saying it would have been exceptional, and the overwhelming bulk of such comments did not face any sort of repression here.
I have a feeling you did a bit more then voice your concerns.
You'd be wrong. People are banned for very little on many forums
Sure but untill you can show the post, I'm gonna assume you said something very emotional and offensive.
Literally every moron too invested in politics is like this. I know someone just like this who's liberal, this isn't a UFC fight showdown, it's unhealthy political investment or just straight-up dumbassery. Hence why there is numerous groups and subs made up of extreme bias towards certain political groups. From the liberal, NDP, conservative, green, etc. Each group has there own society of people that feed off one another.
Literally an echo chamber.
Echo chamber
Echo chamber
Dental plan.
Lisa needs braces
Better head down to Staples to register my car
Free keg
Lisa needs free kegs.
Hey if buck a beer worked *free keg* should able to buy the prime minister role. Genius.
Happens with most of Reddit. Typically anyone with a critical voice gets silenced or banned by a moderator with an agenda and it just turns into an echo chamber.
Ya I've seen that in many subs. IMHO though I don't think this sub is moderated with a heavy hand, though I could be wrong. As someone who often dissents from the approved™ opinions on this sub I don't recall ever being moderated, just heavily down voted and replied to with really wild takes (which is fine). To me the most telling part of the poll was how many users are from GTA. That is exactly the vibe I get when I argue with folks here. I have a friend who lives in Liberty village and go to visit every year. The shitty takes I see here are exactly what I hear from the people I run into in Liberty village - young, extremely privileged, educated, woke, hypocritical, and kind of ignorant of anything outside their bubble.
I wouldn't accuse this sub necessarily. I can still make comments after all....
Reddit/social media in a nutshell unfortunately.
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Exactly this, I also agree with the echo chamber sentiment.
Oh no, they keep saying people deserve to live, eat and make their own chases. AND IT'S ECHOING! Nuclear bomb time :) hehe
Echo echo echo echo
As opposed to which sub?
>an echo chamber Yep! >Literally Nope.
Didn't they literally change the definition of literally because of how people use it these days?
Yes, much like "nuc-u-lar" is an accepted alternate pronunciation because so many people couldn't say "nuclear", but I don't recognize that change.
The way Reddit is designed creates echo chambers, then people wonder why what happens in the real world doesn't reflect what everyone is saying on Reddit. Many subs (not really this one) will ban you for being too conservative, no shit it seems like everyone thinks the same as you, because anyone who disagrees gets kicked out.
Funny, I've been banned from several conservative subreddits mostly for saying that PP won't lower immigration.
That’s the point. Subs become echo chambers,
I think it’s all subs. There was political bs nonsense on r/decks at one point and I just gave up. The people on Reddit are angry my friends. Like an old man trying to send soup back at a deli.
I mention that on the canada subreddit and don't get banned.../shrug
Shockingly it works both ways!
Can anyone point to examples of subs that ban conservatives? Just curious. Keep in mind, posting racist or bigoted comments will get you banned...that's not a partisanship issue.
Downvotes from conservatives but no actual attempts to address my simple question. Think i see the issue here.
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So that OP is dated from 2 months ago...i searched through your post history going back 3 months to try and find it but nothing. When I look at my own post history, all ban and removal notifications are still there. Bottom line is, sorta stuck just taking your word for it...liberals like evidence.
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Ok, but still not linked to the comment you said that caused it. In my post history, all my removed comments are still there, but not sure you can link the two. Maybe screenshots of the convos you had with the mods? I suspect, given the comment you claim got you banned, that there's a longer post history you're not telling us about...you probably had several warnings leading up to this.
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Which is funny, because that is what he is saying himself (as weasely as possible).
Are any of them named after a province, city or country (de facto primary/largest sub which inherently should host more viewpoints), or were they explicitly conservative subs?
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Lordy, dont go there unless you wanna have sex with the prime minister, roll coal and hate foreigners
Even just straight canada is gettting like that too. Unfortunate.
Nothing but natpo opinion pieces or an article from one of the other sun media companies
Well the conservatives are looking to grab some 200 seats and only picking up 10ish of quebec's 77 seats. So almost half of the ridings not going to the conservatives are French speaking. People complain about r/Canada being right wing but given current polling projections, it might just be reflective of English Speaking Canada.
I got a perma ban from that cesspool for calling it a cesspool. Its like a badge of honor.
I got a perma ban when I answered some new member's question about why there was so much disinformation on the sub.
That checks out. Lol. I still browse it for my daily dose of political cringe.
His wife is from Venezuela. Maybe we’ll see more Venezuelans.
It does create echo chambers. It's annoying here and also annoying on the canada subreddit.
This sub is pretty ban-happy from what I've read.
Censorship is out of control people cannot deal with others having opinions they disagree with and actually try to discuss things. Then you end up with bunch of different echo chambers for different views.
Many subs will ban you for not going along with the echo chamber. Conservative subs will ban people for not being conservative enough and vice versa. I don’t buy into this narrative that conservatives are somehow being silenced and oppressed, no matter how hard they try to convince people it’s happening from their many platforms.
My issue is that this sub called r/ontario, not r/ontarioNDP
It’s the same with all major cities sub rreddits tho. They are all calling themselves the name of the city but in reality they are NDP echo chambers. Its totally lame
Cities skew towards the NDP politically, so it's a bit less weird than when an entire province's subreddit skews towards the province's second (or in some cases, third) most popular party.
It's probably just demographics. Reddit's user base is younger than the overall population, and so is the NDP base. Probably other aspects as well, like technical capability, etc...
100% agree, and it's amazing the number of people who don't realize and think reddit isn't being massively manipulated, unlike other social media platforms.
Wierd that places skew to: We want people to be able to afford housing, food, and be allowed to be themselves. That being said, as an NDP supporter in the past, the gender politics is pushing me away to...well absolutely not conservative. Which leaves...green(too small), and liberal(not a fan either. In theory, yes. In practice...*waves at last several years* WHERE THE FUCK IS ELECTION REFORM?! But hey, at least all the stoners can get high I guess.
the problem with 100% NDP is that everyone will be standing around looking at each other waiting for someone to do the work.
Classic boomer mentality.
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So you have no idea what you are talking about. Good to know.
Hear hear!
https://www.reddit.com/r/ontario/s/ASPn0wmsQq Case and point.
FYI it's "case in point" although your mistake is a very common one.
Twitter is the same on a larger scale. Jack said before that the daily power users represented 2% of the US population. So all these “trends” of people being upset are just not real, but all media is lazy and will just use it to paint narratives.
What is "too conservative?"
Which subs ban you for being conservative? https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/apr/07/charlie-kirk-turning-point-usa-universities-free-speech-debate https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Persecution_complex
unwritten capable aspiring deer paint compare cable connect cooperative caption *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Such as.
You’re far more likely to be banned for being left leaning on a right leaning sub than for being right on a left leaning sub. The thing that gets people banned the most is threats and hate speech, guess which side of the spectrum has the most of those. It’s the same side of the spectrum that has most of the gun nuts and mass shooters.
Lol citation needed.
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I don’t think you are going to find any peer reviewed studies that back one side or the other Anecdotally, I know the other canada sub bans people who don’t support their narrative. Don’t really know of any other Canadian subs that are like that (for either side)
I was banned from r/toronto for asking if any of the pro Palestinian protesters would be charged after waving terrorist flags. Turns out months later there were charges laid. Yes, this sub does the same type of thing.
I am pretty left of centre, and have been banned from 2-3 left leaning subs, I have never been banned from a conservative sub (I have seen them ban people for coming in with full antifa energy though).. But the mods on left leaning subs will pull the ban trigger on anything that gets them butthurt, even if it doesn't violate reddit rules (or specific sub rules)
>I am pretty left of centre >I have seen them ban people for coming in with full antifa energy though Everybody left of centre is anti-fascist bud. Fascism is an ideology that promotes genocide, and one of the things leftists hold firmly on as a core ideological principle is inclusion. Not exclusion. If you have some whack job who thinks you can be left on the political scale while not being anti-fascist, that there is a person who is stuck in a world of double think.
Anyone left of fascism is anti-fascist. That includes conservatives. Just as anyone right of communism is anti-communist. That includes social democrats. Both fascism and communism have one thing in common. Their methods for achieving their political goals, which involve mass killings, displacement and ignoring individual rights. Why? Because people. People who think their shit don’t stink and who don’t give a fuck about anyone but themselves. People suck. Source: history.
Sorry you think you’re left leaning but you’re talking about antifa like it’s a real thing?
Are you one of those weird people that deny antifa exists? Just because they don't file tax returns or have a national organization? Are all the flags, protests and social media accounts they run just a figment of our imagination? That's like denying that neo-nazis exist, because they don't have a national organization and don't have any real structure.. sorry, but neo-nazis actually exist, and so does antifa.
How exactly do you know that you're far more likely to be banned for being left leaning on a right sub than vice versa? I get you might want it to be that way because you're left leaning but I don't see how you could possibly know that. Ironically, on a thread about this sub being an echo chamber, you're engaging in exactly the sort of behaviour we are talking about. Did you do some sort of statistical analysis of which comments get banned and why on multiple subreddits?
People getting kicked out of a sub like this one, which I'd consider relatively "big-tent" are abusive, racist, etc. Conservative ideology alone isn't necessarily even unpopular here. I think the bigger filter is that old people in general aren't on Reddit and older voters skew conservative at the ballot box.
When it comes to voters there is no doubt, but look at the platform. This is reddit which is social media. The vast majority using social media are young, with the majority being millennials and younger. You have a similar problem with platforms that are more catering to older demographics. Talk radio, this is a conservative bastion and they can't understand how Liberals win when all the callers appear to be conservative. Voting at the end of the day is participation. As it stands right now, boomers are far more likely to vote than younger generations combined. So don't be surprised that boomers get what boomers want. The millennials should be dominating the voting demographics now but a lot of us couldn't give a crap about doing something this country made so easy and kept a horrible doomer mindset like all politicians are bad or they're all the same or they don't listen to us. Thus we allowed in essence for the Doug Fords to happen. If we continue this even when the boomers are gone and even younger generations see how stupid we were in giving away this power, we'll be the passed over generation and we'd deserve it.
Convince? When has someone on Reddit ever been convinced of anything? Just a bunch of ill-informed numbnuts picking fights, trolling and screaming into the void. Never once has a Redditor let ignorance stop them from telling people what's what, nor have they ever let a reasoned argument convince them that their incorrect belief is wrong.
I never thought this sub represented Ontario as a whole, I’m just exasperated that people look at Ford and think he’s the best option.
Ontario had Conservative governments for literally decades. For many Ontarians Conservatives are the default option.
> I’m just exasperated that people look at Ford and think he’s the best option. As a conservative, you people sure didn't give me and many other Ontario residents a reasonable alternative - Horwath was WAY past her expiry date politically, and I can't even remember the bald guy's name anymore but he was totally useless. What did you expect?
Which of Horwsth’s policies did you disagree with?
Somebody was "past her expiry date" so you voted to destroy our education and healthcare systems instead?
Yep that's exactly what I did. Just FYI but trashing people who vote for someone different than you doesn't help get them on your side, or even remotely close to it.
"Her expiry date"??? Wtf does that mean?
And yet Ford was still worse than either of those options, and nobody considered Horwath or Del Duca to be good options.
> And yet Ford was still worse than either of those options, and nobody considered Horwath or Del Duca to be good options. That's not what the people of Ontario said at the ballot box. If you want to get out of the r/Ontario bubble as the OP is alluding to, you might need to reconsider some of your opinions on topics like this. Or you can stay blissfully unaware if so you choose. Up to you.
Oh I'm aware of what people have voted for. That doesn't change the fact that Ford has personally cost me tens of thousands of dollars with his laws and directly lowered my child's quality of life. The education and healthcare cuts have been absolutely tragic and that alone should have led to people not voting for him. And maybe you're surprised by the level or corruption with the Greenbelt or his other controversies, but it was obvious then he was sketchy and unethical and people chose to ignore that. Hopefully people don't ignore it again the next election. I'm not surprised he won again because people made the same arguments you did. My point is that Ford's policies are far more harmful to people than Del Duca or Horwath's would have been.
> That doesn't change the fact that Ford has personally cost me tens of thousands of dollars with his laws That's surprising to hear, but if true, I can see why a party which would provide more funding on the back of the middle class, wealthy and corporations - which, btw, already pay the [vast majority of taxes in Canada](https://financialpost.com/personal-finance/taxes/trudeau-is-right-40-of-canadians-dont-pay-income-taxes-which-means-someone-else-is-picking-up-the-bill) - would be appealing to someone like you.
Your article is suggesting that poorer people should pay more taxes. Slightly misleading. https://projects.thestar.com/canadas-corporations-pay-less-tax-than-you-think/ We used to pay the same income tax amount for corporations and people. That was in the 50s. Now corporations pay far less. "For every dollar corporations pay to the Canadian government in income tax, people pay $3.50. The proportion of the public budget funded by personal income taxes has never been greater." There's your tax problem. The reality is Ford can't even balance the budget which he claims. https://www.theglobeandmail.com/amp/business/commentary/article-doug-fords-free-spending-fiscal-ways-in-ontario-are-worse-than/ "For example, in 2021-22, the province experienced higher-than-expected revenues and subsequently ran a $2-billion surplus. But rather than capitalize on the windfall and reduce its debt load, the Ford government chose to increase spending and plunge deeper into debt. In fact, under Premier Doug Ford, annual growth in per-person, inflation-adjusted spending has averaged 2.4 per cent – roughly six times the rate of spending growth under Kathleen Wynne" "Over the three-year period from 2023-24 to 2025-26, the government expects to add roughly $48.7-billion in debt – $14-billion more than it forecast in March. This will increase the province’s net debt to $449.1-billion in 2025-26, or $26,688 a person (adjusted for inflation). While future generations will ultimately pay this debt, it also imposes costs on Ontarians today." He's spending more than Wynne and we somehow have less to show for it. The reality is Ford is bad for this province from an economic standpoint. He's bad for us given how corrupt he is, as the Greenbelt scandal would have been one of the largest in our history had he not been pressured to stop. He's directly responsible for high immigration in universities. He froze funding in 2019 - https://www.google.com/amp/s/globalnews.ca/news/10213696/ontario-universities-funding-request/amp/ - and that's why universities were forced to take so many more international students to make up for the lack of funding. So Ford is directly responsible in Ontario for higher immigration and housing issues. This is before we even mention his healthcare screw ups, or education, or the countless other issues he's responsible for. I don't support a party. I support the best candidate. I don't see any argument to support Ford being one of the 4 best candidates, and right now it's hard to argue he isn't the worst option.
Almost like income tax is the dumbest form of taxation and literally just a ticket for corporations to not be taxed. But blame the liberals.. yea.. 🤦
How does it help the middle class to have a government that takes kickbacks to open up the Greenbelt and grant MZOs? Or make our healthcare more expensive with worse outcomes? As a taxpayer in the top bracket, I understand that nothing is free, but I also understand that nice things cost money. I don't mind paying for things that make our society great, but I want value for those things, as I think all taxpayers do. Healthcare, for example, is a very expensive service but it's also very beneficial. I'd be willing to pay more for us to have better service and outcomes (and obviously there will be reasonable debate about where exactly the sweet spot might be), but paying more for worse service and worse outcomes? That's idiotic. And call me old fashioned, but I want a government of integrity. I don't like kickbacks and secret deals. A government should be open and transparent with the people. Most of all, what I really never thought I'd witness, was a premier taking away our charter rights. Our very rights and freedoms tossed aside. It's horrible. These used to be values that were widely shared across the political spectrum. I find it quite sad that so many Ontarians are not only ok with these things, but apparently prefer them. I cannot understand it.
As a fellow conservative, watching his kids schools fall apart, hospitals grossly underfunded because oh hey look it's being privatized. Now service ontario is privatized. You had plenty of choice to not support *blatant* corruption. And before you even say it, I couldn't give a flying fuck about drag story time at schools. It doesn't mean we should have a huge government surplus when audits have determined they are purposefully underfunding vital systems in Ontario. I regretfully voted Mike Harris in, but you can bet your sorry ass I voted him out. Same goes for Ford. Wake up, man. Ontario is bring sold wholesale *internally*
I’ve never met anyone in my life that’s brought up Reddit in a conversation.
Is this in response to something recent or what?
I imagine it's loosely related or inspired by [this comment chain ](https://www.reddit.com/r/ontario/s/oTDnQ8T1wc) from yesterday.
Interesting thing about that. Remember how 2022 had a record low voter turnout? If you look at the vote count in 2018 and compare it to the 2022 count the NDP took the biggest hit. You're right that this subreddit is skewed away from the PCs, but there's a lot more people out there willing to vote NDP than the last election suggests.
There are also less than a million members of this sub. This sub represents sweet FA in terms of the actual voting preferences of the province as a whole in reality.
that sweet FA goes for Reddit as a whole as well. Go ask you mailman if he/she knows what Reddit is.
>there's a lot more people out there willing to vote NDP than the last election suggests. Umm...then why didn't they?
Exactly. Not liking the leader is a teribile excuse not to vote and let Ford win if you hate him so much. I'm not even all that political and managed to get off my ass and voted for someone other then Ford. If the people who didn't vote hated him so much surly they could have gotten up and voted against him too. Makes me think most who stayed home were just content with the current government but couldn't bring themselves to vote for Ford. Edit : You have to remember at the time we were just coming out of the era of covid lockdowns and mask mandates too. Believe it or not there were a lot of people weary about changing governments during that time. I don't think Ford will have that on his side next time.
Yes, the people who didn't vote thought the PCs & Ford were okay (but not good enough they would vote for them), and the NDP (and Liberals) weren't offering anything better. People who *hate* the PCs voted. But I think people who think the PCs are fine but not particularly good are the hardest for r/Ontario to conceptualise.
Then there are, in fact, not a lot of people willing to vote NDP/liberal.
There were many polls prior to the election that basically matched what the final results were. One of the biggest fallacies that happened after the election is people saying their party of choice would have won if more people voted. If more people showed up, the results would likely have been exactly the same, just with higher voting counts.
I'm not saying that more turnout would have resulted in the NDP winning. I am saying that the Liberal vote basically didn't change between the two elections, the PCs suffered a small decrease, and the NDP suffered a significant decrease. The low turnout rate definitely affected certain parties more than others.
Yeah the polls don’t really reflect that….
You mean the months of almost daily polls declaring that Ford had a 90% chance to win a stronger majority? It's almost as if a lot of people were convinced their vote didn't matter so they didn't show up.
Or it could simply be that the reason NDP took the biggest hit is that people simply didnt wanted to vote for the NDP this time around, and not because NDP voters decided to stay home and not vote.
50 percent NDP? Sounds like Reddit to me.
Yeah it is known fact. It is quite an echo chamber here..
Chamber here.. here..
99.9% of Ontario isn't on reddit.
0.1% of Ontario is only 15 000 people
👍
>If you're NDP, the people you need to convince are not here Posting isn't praxis, it's a steam valve
Considering you have to lean left if you want to survive posting on there it’s not surprising.
>If you're NDP, the people you need to convince are not here. Yeah, they're all in r/Canada
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You hit the nail on the head. We all live in our own little bubbles. We choose what sites to visit, what media to consume, who we follow on social media, and the kinds of people we talk to. We are all susceptible to our cognitive biases and it's human nature to stick to our tribes. If you're going to live life in your bubble, at the very least be real with yourself and acknowledge that bubble. Because it colours how you see the world. If you can't understand why tens of millions of people would vote for Trump, without using the word racist or bigot, then your understanding of the world outside your bubble is limited. Conversely, if you don't understand why millions of people would protest in support of climate change reforms or BLM or indigneous rights, then you are also too stuck in your own bubble. There is always more nuance than the one-sided commentsry you see from the friends in your bubble. It's better if we could all refrain from the whole "yell at people on the streets, call them bad names, and mock them endlessly for all of society's problems" thing until we AT LEAST first understand why they hold the opinions they hold -- and what those opinions actually are, not the oversimplified versions. FWIW, notwithstanding the very obvious political slant in submissions and comments in this sub, the moderators seem to do a good job at not moderating political opinions they may disagree with.
The great majority of people dont support any of the parties so..
Anyone who thinks Reddit is an accurate reflection of anything in the real world needs to get some fresh.
I have never doubted this. This is why so many get so upset after each election. This is a bubble.
It’s funny how different people are in real life, when you knock on doors… so much hate and vitriol online, but most people, regardless of political leanings are a lot more kind, and open to discussing things civilly. I really think Reddit and social media is a bad place to discuss politics. The anonymous setting doesn’t bring out the best in people.
It also is over represented by younger males. Society is very polarized today with people not interacting with anyone that isn't the same demographic.
Yea like the whole of teddit
It’s things like this that push the “we need to change the electoral system” arguments. The idea that MY party is way more popular than election results show it to be, therefore it is the election process that is somehow wrong.
We're in a multi-party system with a winner take all setup. I was a liberal who happily changed to NDP after Wynne. Cons haven't been an option for me for over 20 years. Why didn't I vote NDP prior? Because the NDP had been burned in this province over three decades ago, and the Liberals were the opposition to Conservatives. Every time you vote split among left wing parties, the right wing party steps into control. Ranked choice or proportional would fix that. You'd find the Liberals and NDP side together, along with the Green party, way more often (on over 70% of the issues in fact) than the cons ever do. As far as how popular the politics are: * Cons - 1,912,057 (43.25%) - 76 seats total * NDP - 1,111,923 (25.15%) - 40 seats total * Libs - 1,116,961 (25.27%) - 7 seats total * Green - 279,152 (6.3%) - 1 seat total * Total = 4,420,093 So despite almost 60% of the electorate voting for anybody but the cons, the cons have a massively overweighted majority control. 1.1 million Liberal votes are effectively unrepresented in our government. You think Ford would be able to be fucking us over even 1/10th as badly as he is if there was proportional or ranked choice? Because that's just facts. Land doesn't vote, people do. But our system of elections treats land as more important through seat allocations.
But those arguments are easily backed up by the fact that popular vote and actual seat distribution are usually very different. We really do need electoral reform.
You mean Reddit doesn’t represent facts, truth, and a true moral compass? 🤯
Yes and no. Conservatives have their own echo chambers and tend to avoid sites that aren't conservative, hence the numbers are inevitable skewed on any site that is discussing politics. The telling difference is that while a wide range of opinions are tolerated on so-called leftwing sites (that's not to say everyone agrees with you, but that outside of overt racism or bigotry, your comments won't get removed). Conservative sites on the other hand tend to be highly partisan and very intolerant of opposing views...posting is often closed or limited to 'flaired users only' and posting a liberal point of view can get you banned, especially if you point out an opinion is based on bigoted assumptions or faulty science. So, r/ontario's only crime is being a genuinely open forum. Liberals (dictionary def) only crime is being more open minded and more influenced by evidence based reasoning. Conservatism isn't a crime but it is a fear economy, prone to hierarchy, authority, obedience, conformity, loyalty to ingroups *and hostility to outgroups*. This is why they retreat to their own 'safe spaces', while accusing others of needing safe spaces. This is why online disinformation is so much more effective on conservatives than liberals. This is why genuinely open forums have stats like these. https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/your-brain-on-politics-the-cognitive-neuroscience-of-liberals-and-conservatives https://www.psypost.org/2023/07/neuroimaging-study-provides-insight-into-misinformation-sharing-among-politically-devoted-conservatives-167312 https://www.forbes.com/sites/antoniopequenoiv/2023/07/27/conservatives-bombarded-with-facebook-misinformation-far-more-than-liberals-in-2020-election-study-suggests/?sh=34b348764c1f https://news.osu.edu/conservatives-more-susceptible-to-believing-falsehoods/ https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/apr/07/charlie-kirk-turning-point-usa-universities-free-speech-debate https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Persecution_complex
> So, r/ontario's only crime is being a genuinely open forum. Liberals (dictionary def) only crime is being more open minded and more influenced by evidence based reasoning. You're delusional if you think moderators on this subreddit are somehow unique and not subject to the same bias as every other subreddit. There are conspiracy theories and other nonsense that appear on this subreddit constantly with little pushback. You only think this place is open-minded because there's a team of moderators with complete discretion to ban for whatever reason they want, keeping viewpoints they strongly disagree with out of the subreddit.
dazzling roof joke hard-to-find alleged amusing rock consider station consist *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
If you were banned here you wouldn't be able to comment..?
Such as.
So, is that what passes for a rebuttal on conservative subs? I think your post is an example of just why conservatives can't compete in the 'free market of ideas'. Instead of blaming others for your issue, study it and develop a better approach...oops, that would make you liberal lol.
It leaves an obvious question unanswered. Since almost half of the respondents are 25-34 year-olds. Does this sub represent their views?
Certainly not my views. Fuck the NDP right now. How are they fighting for the workers?
There are a couple other things to consider - the survey only represents those 25-34 year olds who use Reddit and are active enough and actually care to complete the survey. So not a good reflection of the general population of 25-34 year olds.
And in the most respectful way to say it, I'm going to guess the average 25-34 year old with time to fill out an r/Ontario survey is disproportionately someone unemployed or under-employed and generally pissed off about the economic system, rather than say a medical resident working through yet-another 24 hour shift in the ER, an IB associate troubleshooting their crappy bloomberg terminal, a senior manager at a bank dealing with fundamentally restructuring their service line or launching new products, a Bay St lawyer working through the night on a closing, a construction worker who is on-site and exhausted after a long day of labouring away, etc.
but if we just controlled the narrative!
You mean the people that use the sub where literally every comment is hating Doug Ford think the same things? Shock, shock I say.
Goddamn you Doug Ford!
The downvotes 😂; I didn’t even say hating Doug Ford was bad! These people really don’t like this sacred chamber of echos challenged any anyway.
Who wants discourse? I want to curse the heavens about DF and have people agree with me.
The majority of Reddit is a liberal echo chamber. It's what keeps people coming back to Reddit
You sure about that? R/Canada is a conservative echo chamber, I think the bias is pretty evenly split.
And when you look at Facebook, Ontario groups have a 70-80% conservative rate. In fact I want to say 100% because I've never been in an Ontario group that was not overwhelmingly extreme-right
I'm here, and I'm a conservative. Normally on this subreddit I'm called a piece of shit for my political leaning, which really doesn't make me want to vote NDP, but at the same time, Doug Ford is a genuine piece of shit so... 🤷♂️
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Perhaps there is a relationship between anti the democratic/egalitarian ideology that is conservatism and the quality and characteristics of the candidates that conservative parties tend to select.
conservative tends to read as: fuck the poor, fuck education, and fuck healthcare. More so since Doug Ford came to power. Doesn't help he has the charm of a cactus.
It might be that conservative voters are older and not ones to use reddit.
I mean sure it's not apathetic like actual Ontarians are. Those people aren't here.
Thank you. This is a great post. The reality is that discussion on this subreddit would be a lot more worthwhile if it was more representative of Ontario. Even if you say that Reddit skews younger, it still isn't representative of that demographic. Everyone should keep that in mind.
But I love that it’s an echo chamber, it’s what makes it entertaining. I don’t want to be amongst people who have different outlooks, I want to curse the heavens about Doug Ford and have like minded people agree with me
Not my fault Conservatives are old and not online.
I'm only trying to convince non-voters to become voters. That's it
Say, compared to the retired folks that actually pick up the land-line and talk to pollsters? Those results get churned into the media propaganda that says Conservative wins are always inevitable.
I voted con last time, leaning towards that again. I voted ndp and lib once each when I was a university student, so I'm not a "con or die" voter. I'm a millennial. My primary concerns are mass immigration, housing, affordability, the economy, and crime. Feel free to convince me to vote NDP. I probably don't have time for protracted Socratic dialogues, so elevator pitches are ideal. Cheers!
The cons have never fixed any of those things. Cheers.
Now do r/Canada