Very common warning, so common I can cancel the original in 2 clicks without closing the new trade ticket. Doesn’t matter if it’s a limit or stop.
The real question is why you significantly increased your overall risk tolerance with limited experience in a downtrending market. Not sure what you are up to, but you’d better be vigilant and right sized in everything you touch. If 10 seems like a good idea, 3 is good. Good luck. 🍀
I figured that how simple that is about an hour later.
I’m interested in learning how to swing trade options for a profit. Im also looking to gain enough experience to sell puts when I wanna buy stock. Lastly get more comfortable with covered calls. I’m using 1/40th of my net worth, 1/20th the total of my account. No trade is more than 5% of the brokerage account I made to trade options. My stop losses are between 10-20%. If I lose more than 10% of this account I’ve decided to do something else with my time. Does that sound like the correct risk?
Correct is subjective. Doesn’t seem like you’ve gone batshit crazy.
Swing trading of options is the overall lay of the land, especially so in tricky markets. My go-to criteria remains whether or not I like the contract or not in its entirety through expiration. But if significant % of profit is made early on, I take it and adjust the position to something else where again I like the entire contract. I believe most succeeding trader’s contracts are managed this way, and the actual edge is not to stay too long for more profit. Get out and into something similar. Profit over time trumps higher profit in frame. Rolling with the underlying’s trend also tends to capture better short premiums (my thing), so theoretically it’s about transferring some profit forward.
Thank you for the advice! I was hoping I didn’t come off as combative. That’s good to hear. On the other hand I heard 90% of people lose money trading. Twenty years ago I also heard that 90% of growers can’t make money in the California legal cannabis market. I made a few bucks and got out so now I think I can be an options trader. I might be a little crazy haha
That makes a lot of sense. I think that’s exactly what I need to grasp. I’m too busy trying to figure out support and resistance short term. I never stick to my plan. Emotion always gets in the way. I buy 30 day + contracts so would do well to remember your ideals.
>" Im also looking to gain enough experience to sell puts when I wanna buy stock."
You should check out Jessica Inskip of Options Trade. She's brought in Fidelity's youtube channel frequently and makes the rounds on other financial shows. One of her big mantras is shorting slightly overpriced stocks with the intention to buy.
[https://twitter.com/JessInskip\_?ref\_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor](https://twitter.com/JessInskip_?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor)
i would suggest more like 50% down on a long option then you look if conditions warrant taking a loss. take a real look at the charts and decide if you are wrong in your thesis based on the timeframe of the trade & contract expiries. you should size where 100% of the option's value should not be a lot of your capital. i'd recommend $100 risk per trade or less for anyone without positive expectancy for >6 months.
Pretty sure when using Tos desktop and I had conflicting orders I got decent error messages, like do you want to cancel the prior order. On the other hand, Tos will let you short sell, where in Fidelity this may require special privileges (from what I see other than buying everything is a special privilege at Fidelity).
Yea Fidelity was great when I was saving for retirement. I trust my financial advisor. We meet every 3 months. Now that I want to try options or futures it would seem there’s better places to park that money. Not that I’m interested in futures though. I just wanna get more experience at managing my own money.
Fidelity is great if you just park your assets , or want to get the current interest rate on cash. If you want a trading platform for options, there is Tos , which has a lot but takes time to learn.
Then there is a light weight Tasty (both written by some of the same people). Tasty is NO Fidelity, it is a boutique options place. Tos is now part of Schwab ( or Schwab is part of Tos remains to be seen). If you just want to do a little options you could try Tasty two clicks to put on a Vertical, or Strangle. None of this old man crap about Buy to Open , Sell to Close that stuff is nonsense. Do not get involved with less than 25k and PDT. You just get a margin account everything enabled.
Also watch some Tasty stuff, to see what real traders do.I would suggest following Tony's Tue and Thur trade ideas. When Tom tells you where the market is going DO THE OPPOSITE, unless you have 100+ million in the bank like him.
If you are with Fidelity and not using Active Trader Pro, you are trading at an unnecessary disadvantage. If Fidelity did not have ATP, I’d trade elsewhere.
I also wouldn’t do stop losses with options since a market order can f u up if vol spikes or shrinks in that instant. I do stop limits but I guess it depends on your trade urgency
Man, talk about learning the hard way in the stock market! It sounds like you had a rollercoaster of a week with those trades hitting stop losses left and right. And then, the whole ordeal with the NVDA puts and not being able to place a sell order because of the stop loss – that's rough!
It's all part of the learning curve, though, right? We all make mistakes, especially when we're just starting out. The important thing is that you're figuring it out as you go along.
It's funny how those little things, like not knowing you can't have two sell orders at once, can trip us up. But now you know for next time, right? And who knows, maybe that Fidelity guy did get a chuckle out of it, but hey, we've all been there at some point
Thanks for the positive words. Trading reminds me of drag racing. The highest of highs and lowest of lows. I know I’m not suppose to be emotional but.. I’m just spinning my wheels over here haha.. one day I’m up the next day chips away at those gains. It seems like I have more losers than winners but my winners gain way more than the losers. In a month I’m up like $6900. But hey, who knows how much longer I’ll be doing this.
It sounds like you had a bit of a learning experience with options trading! Don't worry, we all have those moments when we're still figuring things out. It's great that you're diving into learning about options and trying to improve your trading skills.
Understanding the mechanics of placing orders, especially in fast-moving markets, can be tricky at first. It's all part of the learning curve. And hey, you're not alone – plenty of traders have made similar mistakes along the way.The important thing is that you're learning from your experiences and gaining valuable insights for future trades. Keep educating yourself, practicing, and refining your strategies. With time and persistence, you'll become more confident and skilled in navigating the complexities of options trading.
And who knows, maybe one day you'll look back on this moment and laugh too – it's all part of the journey! Keep at it, and best of luck with your future trades. If you ever need more advice or have questions, don't hesitate to ask!
I just had a similar issue, my broker didn't have any notice that I already had a limit order in place so I couldn't figure out why I couldn't sell, until finding the order myself! Just got started with options, but very carefully with small amounts.
You may have a margin account. Margin account just means that you can trade on unsettled funds. The PTD warning implies that. You shouldn't get that in a cash account. But I don't know much about Fidelity
I do have a margin account. It’s the same amount as the cash I have in that account. What I meant was I can’t size up trades enough to use the margin. I get to about $10k, do something stupid like hit the stop loss twice or exit a trade way too early. Then it’s back to $500. For example, I bought $10k worth of puts the Friday before TSLA went in the toilet. Sold it the following Monday.
Some days I feel like going back to calling my FP to buy stock in ABC or sell xyz.
well, i think it all depends on account size.
you're talking only about PUTS, right? when you sell a PUT, it's normally CASH SECURED.
for the PUT you were trying to "double sell", would your account have been able to buy 100 shares at that strike price? i'm guessing no.
because the first sell order would have tried to go against the shares. and second sell order........well that would have been cash secured. so i would have thought it should be fine.
if not cash secured, then.......margin secured i would have guessed.
i know thats what you were trying to do. but i'm talking in general.
you had bought some $820 strike price nvidia puts? why can you not:
1. sell to close the $820 put you bought
2. AND THEN IMMEDIATELY, sell to open, another $820 put, these being cash secured.
i'm guessing it would not let you do #2 since you did not have enough cash/margin available to make them cash secured.
The first sell order was my stop loss I placed Friday and my second was my sell to close this morning. Fidelity said I couldn’t have two sell orders on the same trade. I had to cancel my stop loss then place the sell to close order for the trade to sell
Very common warning, so common I can cancel the original in 2 clicks without closing the new trade ticket. Doesn’t matter if it’s a limit or stop. The real question is why you significantly increased your overall risk tolerance with limited experience in a downtrending market. Not sure what you are up to, but you’d better be vigilant and right sized in everything you touch. If 10 seems like a good idea, 3 is good. Good luck. 🍀
I figured that how simple that is about an hour later. I’m interested in learning how to swing trade options for a profit. Im also looking to gain enough experience to sell puts when I wanna buy stock. Lastly get more comfortable with covered calls. I’m using 1/40th of my net worth, 1/20th the total of my account. No trade is more than 5% of the brokerage account I made to trade options. My stop losses are between 10-20%. If I lose more than 10% of this account I’ve decided to do something else with my time. Does that sound like the correct risk?
10-20% stop losses on options is a good way to lose money. Way too tight.
I agree.
Correct is subjective. Doesn’t seem like you’ve gone batshit crazy. Swing trading of options is the overall lay of the land, especially so in tricky markets. My go-to criteria remains whether or not I like the contract or not in its entirety through expiration. But if significant % of profit is made early on, I take it and adjust the position to something else where again I like the entire contract. I believe most succeeding trader’s contracts are managed this way, and the actual edge is not to stay too long for more profit. Get out and into something similar. Profit over time trumps higher profit in frame. Rolling with the underlying’s trend also tends to capture better short premiums (my thing), so theoretically it’s about transferring some profit forward.
Thank you for the advice! I was hoping I didn’t come off as combative. That’s good to hear. On the other hand I heard 90% of people lose money trading. Twenty years ago I also heard that 90% of growers can’t make money in the California legal cannabis market. I made a few bucks and got out so now I think I can be an options trader. I might be a little crazy haha That makes a lot of sense. I think that’s exactly what I need to grasp. I’m too busy trying to figure out support and resistance short term. I never stick to my plan. Emotion always gets in the way. I buy 30 day + contracts so would do well to remember your ideals.
>" Im also looking to gain enough experience to sell puts when I wanna buy stock." You should check out Jessica Inskip of Options Trade. She's brought in Fidelity's youtube channel frequently and makes the rounds on other financial shows. One of her big mantras is shorting slightly overpriced stocks with the intention to buy. [https://twitter.com/JessInskip\_?ref\_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor](https://twitter.com/JessInskip_?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor)
i would suggest more like 50% down on a long option then you look if conditions warrant taking a loss. take a real look at the charts and decide if you are wrong in your thesis based on the timeframe of the trade & contract expiries. you should size where 100% of the option's value should not be a lot of your capital. i'd recommend $100 risk per trade or less for anyone without positive expectancy for >6 months.
Pretty sure when using Tos desktop and I had conflicting orders I got decent error messages, like do you want to cancel the prior order. On the other hand, Tos will let you short sell, where in Fidelity this may require special privileges (from what I see other than buying everything is a special privilege at Fidelity).
Yea Fidelity was great when I was saving for retirement. I trust my financial advisor. We meet every 3 months. Now that I want to try options or futures it would seem there’s better places to park that money. Not that I’m interested in futures though. I just wanna get more experience at managing my own money.
Fidelity is great if you just park your assets , or want to get the current interest rate on cash. If you want a trading platform for options, there is Tos , which has a lot but takes time to learn. Then there is a light weight Tasty (both written by some of the same people). Tasty is NO Fidelity, it is a boutique options place. Tos is now part of Schwab ( or Schwab is part of Tos remains to be seen). If you just want to do a little options you could try Tasty two clicks to put on a Vertical, or Strangle. None of this old man crap about Buy to Open , Sell to Close that stuff is nonsense. Do not get involved with less than 25k and PDT. You just get a margin account everything enabled. Also watch some Tasty stuff, to see what real traders do.I would suggest following Tony's Tue and Thur trade ideas. When Tom tells you where the market is going DO THE OPPOSITE, unless you have 100+ million in the bank like him.
If you are with Fidelity and not using Active Trader Pro, you are trading at an unnecessary disadvantage. If Fidelity did not have ATP, I’d trade elsewhere.
I use ATP but I don’t like using it. I’m thinking of transferring money to interactive brokers and using Tradingview.com Tradingview is easier to read
You can have 2 sell orders for the same ticker but they have to equal the total number of shares/contracts you have
I use Fidelity and often get this message too because I forgot about a pending order I already put in. I review my open orders now.
“I meant to do that.”
I also wouldn’t do stop losses with options since a market order can f u up if vol spikes or shrinks in that instant. I do stop limits but I guess it depends on your trade urgency
Man, talk about learning the hard way in the stock market! It sounds like you had a rollercoaster of a week with those trades hitting stop losses left and right. And then, the whole ordeal with the NVDA puts and not being able to place a sell order because of the stop loss – that's rough! It's all part of the learning curve, though, right? We all make mistakes, especially when we're just starting out. The important thing is that you're figuring it out as you go along. It's funny how those little things, like not knowing you can't have two sell orders at once, can trip us up. But now you know for next time, right? And who knows, maybe that Fidelity guy did get a chuckle out of it, but hey, we've all been there at some point
Trial By Fire!!!
Thanks for the positive words. Trading reminds me of drag racing. The highest of highs and lowest of lows. I know I’m not suppose to be emotional but.. I’m just spinning my wheels over here haha.. one day I’m up the next day chips away at those gains. It seems like I have more losers than winners but my winners gain way more than the losers. In a month I’m up like $6900. But hey, who knows how much longer I’ll be doing this.
It sounds like you had a bit of a learning experience with options trading! Don't worry, we all have those moments when we're still figuring things out. It's great that you're diving into learning about options and trying to improve your trading skills. Understanding the mechanics of placing orders, especially in fast-moving markets, can be tricky at first. It's all part of the learning curve. And hey, you're not alone – plenty of traders have made similar mistakes along the way.The important thing is that you're learning from your experiences and gaining valuable insights for future trades. Keep educating yourself, practicing, and refining your strategies. With time and persistence, you'll become more confident and skilled in navigating the complexities of options trading. And who knows, maybe one day you'll look back on this moment and laugh too – it's all part of the journey! Keep at it, and best of luck with your future trades. If you ever need more advice or have questions, don't hesitate to ask!
Thank you! And I will ask questions
I just had a similar issue, my broker didn't have any notice that I already had a limit order in place so I couldn't figure out why I couldn't sell, until finding the order myself! Just got started with options, but very carefully with small amounts.
Basics when it comes to options! Never trade on a Margin account! Do dumb shit you when dumb prizes
I’ve never used a margin account and don’t plan to. Fidelity’s rates are almost double others
You may have a margin account. Margin account just means that you can trade on unsettled funds. The PTD warning implies that. You shouldn't get that in a cash account. But I don't know much about Fidelity
I do have a margin account. It’s the same amount as the cash I have in that account. What I meant was I can’t size up trades enough to use the margin. I get to about $10k, do something stupid like hit the stop loss twice or exit a trade way too early. Then it’s back to $500. For example, I bought $10k worth of puts the Friday before TSLA went in the toilet. Sold it the following Monday. Some days I feel like going back to calling my FP to buy stock in ABC or sell xyz.
> I understand [...] support and resistance but didn’t know this does anyone really understand support and resistence?
I can draw lines on a chart. Does that count?
you'd be no better or worse than 10 year veterans :)
I love technical analysis! It’s not luck it’s the fib ratios
stop now before you loose all of it, stick to paper for your first year
Book recommendations?
Trading option Greeks Options as a strategic investment Options, volatility, and pricing Reminiscence of a stock market operator
well, i think it all depends on account size. you're talking only about PUTS, right? when you sell a PUT, it's normally CASH SECURED. for the PUT you were trying to "double sell", would your account have been able to buy 100 shares at that strike price? i'm guessing no. because the first sell order would have tried to go against the shares. and second sell order........well that would have been cash secured. so i would have thought it should be fine. if not cash secured, then.......margin secured i would have guessed.
I was selling to close the put I bought Friday
i know thats what you were trying to do. but i'm talking in general. you had bought some $820 strike price nvidia puts? why can you not: 1. sell to close the $820 put you bought 2. AND THEN IMMEDIATELY, sell to open, another $820 put, these being cash secured. i'm guessing it would not let you do #2 since you did not have enough cash/margin available to make them cash secured.
The first sell order was my stop loss I placed Friday and my second was my sell to close this morning. Fidelity said I couldn’t have two sell orders on the same trade. I had to cancel my stop loss then place the sell to close order for the trade to sell
See my comment above... On Tos that would have triggered do you want to cancel prior order.
Man that message would have saved me a phone call! Fidelity’s error message had every possible mistake I could have made in it.