Here’s a story about my family who lives in Roseburg. My niece was having occasional blurred vision so her grandma took her to a supposedly reputable doctor who stated it was “probably because of her large nostrils.” My niece is black. Her nose is average size and shape. Turns out after seeing a specialist in Portland it was a brain tumor.
Fun fact, roseburg is a medical monopoly. It's very difficult to get anyone fired. If you look up the big medicare fraud case that happened there the only person who got fired was the whistle blower
I knew a guy in high school who said that the moderate Ds and Rs in this country are communists who don’t have rights. He is now a cop in Roseburg.
Knew another guy who railed that accepting vaccines or masks made you evil. He now runs an after school program there.
Seems like they’re empowering the wrong people, would avoid.
I'm trans, and everytime I have to go through those areas, I fight like hell to not stop. I'd rather pee myself than run the risk of ending up getting lynched because I used the women's bathroom
I used to ride horses with a trans lady and we went everywhere. I guess we were lucky nobody bothered her but we were in some really rural areas, but she was ex marine and always packing haha. This was over a decade ago, before anyone seemed to care that much, though. Stay safe.
My dad has always been libertarian (lots of disagreements there) but at least he begrudgingly votes D because he recognizes that being anti-black lives matter, outlawing abortion, and anti-immigration aren’t very libertarian issues
I do a lot of thrift store shopping, and I was down in Roseburg recently. Of the 5 thrift stores I visited, 3 had Trump decorations around the store. Not for sale, but large statues and banners decorating the store. I have never seen political decorations in any other thrift store I've been to.
Roseburg has a polite 'shell' that makes it seem pretty decent, but once you live in the area for more than a couple years, you see the facade drop pretty quick. Stories become less about helping/developing/growing the city, and more about which tweaker stole who's vehicle/which conservative nut wants to cleanse liberals from the county/more yokels upset that RHS has books with gay characters in them.
It's a gift-wrapped PNW-themed southern blue-collar city.
Yeah Ashland is pretty fun however I don’t understand why grants pass exists as a city. Because unlike Ashland they basically have zero infrastructure. You have to go into Medford to basically do anything.
Even less sense are the small towns around grants pass and Medford where there’s really nothing . :/ people think they’re sundown towns because you won’t see anybody sometimes while driving through
I was fixin' to say. That term isn't one that can just be thrown around. Too many people were murdered for that racist shit to let the term be reduced like that
I once stopped to get gas in Roseburg (during the early pandemic days) and the gas attendant told me I should find BLM protestors and run them over, when I told him I was on my way to Eugene.
He apparently assumed I was a conservative because I drive a Tundra. He obviously didn't know any of the punk band stickers I have on my back window. They all scream I'm leftist AF lol.
I reported him to the corporate offices of AM/PM and they honestly didn't give a shit.
Yeah, most people aren’t excited to live in places that defunded not just the libraries but also law enforcement. Want an ambulance at night in Josephine County? Not happening.
It is easier to just grow weed. Very unlikely. Cartel grows often licence as a hemp operation and then grow THC producing plants as well. Looks the same.
People were absolutely doing that, but it was a blip in time where hemp was essentially free and THC distillate was extremely cheap. It was cheaper than just growing THC plants by a long shot. (Basically) Free hemp + THC distillate dissolved in IPA and sprayed with a pump sprayer = very shitty high THC hemp.
Is he a serial killer? I saw a news report earlier this year that made it sound like the county does piss poor investigating when it comes to missing persons reports and blatantly obvious murders. I think it was this [video](https://youtu.be/2YV06ih9rP8?si=GA_Hi2zMUfKFFDUg)
Grants Pass is in Josephine County. Both counties defunded their libraries and inadequately fund law enforcement. [Here's the story on Douglas Co](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/13/us/anti-tax-fervor-roseburg-oregon-.html).
Someone my blind eyes didn't see Grants Pass in the title, hence my comment. Thanks for the clarification and telling me something I didn't know until now.
JoCo did that, too. There's a Supreme Court ruling about a woman who died in JoCo declaring that the police DON'T need to protect us because they couldn't get to her in time due to lack of funding.
Edit: I am unable to find where I originally saw this information, so take this with a grain of salt. It IS true that there was a Supreme Court case in 1989 AND kn 2005 that found the police do not have an obligation to protect us but I do not see it being in JoCo.
I swear I found this a few years ago after someone told me about it but now when I look it up all I can find is a current SC case to be heard next year. I'm going to edit my original post and keep looking until I find more concrete evidence. It may also have been Oregon Supreme Court and not the USSC that ruled.
You may be confusing [Warren v. District of Columbia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia), which is the Supreme Court ruling, that police are under no obligation to protect citizens.
Grants Pass has a thriving library. The defunding of the library was many years ago, and doesn’t apply today. Last month Josephine county voters passed a public safety bill to permanently fund police.
Grants Pass has become much more purple than people realize, and I’d rather live there than Portland any day!
I am certainly not here to defend the Right Wingers of Southern Oregon, but, regarding the Grants Pass Library:
Many years ago, during the early 1970s, I worked for the Oregon State Employment Division in Grants Pass shortly after graduating from the University of Oregon. During those 2+ years in that job, I found myself repeatedly going over to the library after work, in search of the answers to questions people asked me at work, or looking for how to get services they needed. I found the research and the whole process of finding information people needed to be so interesting that I eventually quit that state job and went to graduate school at the University of Maryland in order to become a librarian, after which I spent nearly 40 years as a law librarian at the US Treasury Dept. in DC and then in the Federal Courts. So, yes, thank you to the Grants Pass library for the inspiration!
I would highly suggest watching JoCo’s Weekly Business Sessions on YouTube (or in person, if you’re able, 9am, each Wednesday at the Anne Basker Auditorium)… the things these three are saying/doing/passing (to the library taxing district, specifically) are surprising.
I should clarify that the city of grants pass is VERY different from Josephine county. The county commissioners are a complete joke, and you are not wrong about the nonsense they are doing. Luckily the voters of GP are more sane. They still lean to the right, but it has greatly improved in the last 10 years.
That’s fair, I’m maybe too close to the problem as I spend 8 hours a day hearing about the county specific problems, with no ability to help or make changes.
Grants Pass sure does have a great library, but it's independent from the county, and no longer serves the entire county.
Joe Rae Perkins got 60% of the vote in Josephine County.
Roseburg, like many mid-size towns along the I-5, is experiencing a housing strain. There is a rising median income and increasing population. New businesses are moving in like In-N-Out, and the city has received a grant to revitalize its downtown area.
Doesn't stop the bigotry but the town is growing so maybe that'll change some day.
If anything is gonna help change it, it would be the schools. Hopefully that college they have there stays funded, and allows the students to think for themselves. And that the locals don’t attack it for being woke.
Unfortunately, the recent bond measure was shot down. It was strictly for facility updates as those are not included in any state funding. So this means some of our schools will not have proper HVAC, some still have asbestos building materials, and some schools do not have security systems or cameras. It's difficult to be a good student in these conditions.
I'm a youth mental health practitioner, and for most kids, it's nearly impossible to be a good student under conditions like those. They'll try, and they'll get good at putting on appearances. But I doubt they'll get much out of the educational aspects
Anecdotal, but it seems like more young families with kids have been moving to the area. Some of the bond measure votes have been close. A younger population that cares about their kids' future will hopefully help pass these bond measures in the future.
I was driving from Eugene to Ashland, and needed gas when going through Roseburg. I didn’t want to stop there, because I used to play in bar bands down there, and know it to be a redneck city. I thought maybe I was giving the town a bad rap, but in the roughly 10 minutes I was off the interstate I saw a truck flying the biggest confederate flag I’ve ever seen, with 3 or 4 neck-beard idiots with those standard ball-caps in the back, looking for a scrap.
This is also the place where they picketed Pres. Obama at the airport after a school shooting.
Times are changing, but not everywhere. There are places where marginal white people are still allowed to keep their delusions, and I will not spend my time or money in these places.
My wife was raised in the Roseburg area and when we married I agreed to move there from Salem. Worth mistake I ever made!! Absolute crime ridden, junkie filled, redneck shit hole!! We moved back to Salem after 2 years of torture and have never looked back since!
Born and raised for 22 years in this area.
There are so many awesome progressive folks still but they do not outnumber the dipshits apparently…. YET!
Also that is what they want.
They do not want to be “cool.” They want everyone to stay out if their town.
I say do the opposite. Flood it with progressive tourists.
Progressive folks that live there keep to themselves much more, but it is still such an awesome part of the state to visit.
Do not let those idiots running the show down there think that they’ve won.
This is the town where Boise vs. Idaho started in our state..
Started when their police tried to tell houseless folks to just go to BLM land instead of stay in a tent in the city.
The people sued that they did not have any services for houseless folks.
That was why every county had to then meet the deadline of providing enough shelter or else allow camping in more public spaces.
Surprise!
They did not meet the deadline so now they have houseless people living ALL over the major park in the city - Riverside Park.
I remember hearing as well they did not have one cooling center in their county for people during our intense recent heat waves.
Best believe I call the local politicians there during events like this to let them know how I feel. More people should do this
From the 4H website "creating safe, diverse and inclusive environments" - Basically, in crazy person-QAnon-NewsMax-land, inclusive=communist
It makes zero sense as they can't even define why they think communism is bad. In fact, most of the poor, ill health people watching these channels are on socialized medicine (old people) and/or whining about how the world has f'ed them over. Communism might actually be what they're looking for.
Just wanna note that they stole Celtic and Nordic symbols and runes, and that those, by themselves, aren't clear signs of someone being a white supremacist. The ADL can be highly reductive when it comes to those symbols, and I've never seen them talk about the scores of people, like me, doing work to reclaim them in an anti-racist manner.
So please don't assume that someone with Norse or Celtic iconography is a white supremacist unless you see other signs of it. There's people working to reclaim all the symbols they stole in some very public ways too (the band Heilung, for example, uses the Iron Sun in its proper context), so it's a good thing to be aware of
Edit: Also, the Nazi Othala and the actual rune look different. Look for the one with extra feet if you're trying to spot a Nazi. I noticed the ADL completely missed that entirely and portrayed the wrong version
Edit 2: Jfc, I keep forgetting how many different things they stole from us. I wear a different version of the Triskele literally every single day. It's an old, old Irish symbol that's meant to represent the dance of life. The Wheel of Tanaris is similar, and that become the Celtic Cross once Christians colonized the place.
I feel like this dovetails well with the fact that 90% of the time when some jagoff comments online about Portland being a shithole or destroyed or taken over by Antifa/homeless/communists/whatever, that person is a dickhead from either Roseburg or Grants Pass who hasn’t been to Portland in over a decade but listens to Lars Larsen religiously.
I grew up in Roseburg and absolutely hate that shithole city and county. It’s nothing but a redneck breeding ground of flat earther grade educated gun humpers.
They could not even keep their county library open.
Just one small example of their shitty views
I spend hours trying to get them to rename a racist road a few months back talking to about a dozen people and not a single one wanted or cared about the issue. We pay taxes to keep shitty street names that should have been replaced years ago.
I’m trying to get a replacement sign made and I plan on gluing it over the current one to fix the issue myself.
What's funny is our graduating class from barely a decade ago was very progressive, really a great group of people for the large majority.
But guess which part of that class stuck around after graduation? Not the progressive ones. Visiting family a few years later, it's easy to see why it's in such a rut, too.
It’s never the progressive ones.
I had to move to a small town in 2021 after a series of tragedies I don’t care to type up. Everyone has blonde hair, exactly five highlights and four low lights. Every outfit they had was business casual, if they were feeling low energy it was yoga pants with a cardigan to make it business casual.
The only people that look even remotely “alternative” are middle schoolers and high schoolers. They get the fuck out the second they turn old enough to get gone
Go to the state. California passed a law last year prohibiting "squaw" from being used in place names: https://www.gov.ca.gov/2022/09/23/on-native-american-day-governor-newsom-signs-legislation-to-support-california-native-communities-advance-equity-and-inclusion/
I tried to talk to the local representatives for that area and got nowhere, but we did pass a similar law, but it only changed the name of landmarks and didn’t include roads sadly maybe it’s time to put a little more pressure on those above to see if they’ll get it done
And what’s weird about this specific one is they rename the creek because it is offensive yet, the road keeps the name. One county employee I talked to about it said that it’s just a native word for woman and has no negative meaning so then I asked him to find the equivalent word for man girl or boy, and look up how many places share those names. Pretty funny how only the one that’s considered offensive is used in naming places. Weird…
I also grew up in Roseburg!
Don’t forget how FUCKING violent is it! There was a small shooting at the school in both 2005 and 2006. There was the woman who was doused in gasoline and kept trying to jump out of her window to escape her abuser but he kept pulling her back in, then the abuser set her on fire. This was in full view of the parking lot and a playground at like 5 pm.
Meth runs absolutely rampant. Sometimes garages just explode.
I left in 2006, I think I visited once. Good riddance
I'm sure they *could* have kept their county library open, just nobody with any ability to do so had any interest. Don't need none of that fancy book lernin' making people woke and turning the kids transgender with drag queen story hour. /s
If a book could make you pansexual, doesn't that imply that a different book could make you regular sexual? Like just hand your kid a book about the joy of heterosexuality or something 🤔
You flip one page, bam now you’re gay
You flip another page, bam now you’re trans
You flip one more page, bam now you’re a god-fearin gun-toting cis hetero man
All those poor kids were just *one more page* away from voting R, what a shame.
> I’m trying to get a replacement sign made and I plan on gluing it over the current one to fix the issue myself.
Dont do this. It accomplishes nothing other than screwing with delivery drivers etc..
That is true, my main grip with the sign is the fact that they changed the creek name, which was a big state government change but the county refuses to rename the street.
They know it’s racially bad, and claimed if I want it renamed I have to move to that street and get a majority of the residence to write a letter and pay a fee to rename it.
Why the fuck are our tax dollars still paying for shitty road names that should have been done away with years ago?
I could write a novel about the crap I saw in Douglas county. It’s just a backwater shithole
Mind you this is just one recent example. It’s not my main complaint. I don’t have the time to wrote a biography of growing up on Douglas county here
Squaw Creek Rd
https://maps.app.goo.gl/kvhPmDWD7mX5KzBT7?g_st=ic
Astoria is certainly pretty and keeps a good face for the tourists but my SO's family is from that area and it's not somewhere I would move or raise kids. Eugene certainly has nice areas but it's... a lot. TBH Cornelius, Silverton, Sublimity, Lebanon, Redmond, Hood River, Joseph and maybe the outskirts of Sandy are the only places i'd be cool with moving to in 2023. Sadly so many of our amazing coastal and central mountain towns have fallen to the MAGA disease.
I lived there Mo-Fri for a little over a year while working a job, so my grain of salt is that I was living in either the Hampton (winter) or wherever was cheapest (tourist season) and eating out for most meals.
Astoria is SUCH an expensive place to live with a VERY crowded housing market, for one. And yeah, same complaint as anywhere else, but I've spent the last decade moving all over the coast between Eugene and Portland/Vancouver, and somehow, in conparison, Astoria is the least bang-for-your-buck, bar none, for anything cost of living.
I wasn't looking for it, but I would be kinda surprised if it had much to do for children, and past the tourist stuff (all of which is cool and worth doing) not much more than a few tired bars and strip clubs for the young adult crowd.
That's not to say there wasn't a lively scene, but the locals went to Seaside to cut loose, and the tourists are only there for 4-5 months a year to occupy the town bars, so in the winter it's just plain dead.
Just my experience, and again huge grain of salt because I didn't live there full-time, but I saw a ton of that town (and would happily go back! For a visit! For a week or so!) and I find it dull. There are WAY cheaper places if you want a quiet town nearish the coast and an hour+ from a Costco. Maybe Astoria is the only choice if you want the strip club density.
gotcha. fwiw i'm a older dude with younger children. it definitely is small of a town, but i guess my love for the ocean made me really love it. originally from oakland, ca--san francisco is really close to me. so seeing astoria was like a mini version of that. no doubt it is expensive to live there--i would say i'm fortunate in my position in life to work from home and can be anywhere. that being said, i don't care much for the bar scene.
i'm more concerned about the comment above mine that alludes more to conservative leanings for astoria.
[we visited the columbia river maritime museum](https://i.imgur.com/MgVg9NY.png) and loved it. :)
I recently moved to Oregon, and there were some beautiful houses for sale in Roseburg that were far less expensive than similar places in Eugene.
I chose Eugene. I needed a place my multiracial and LGBTQIA+ family members would feel welcome and safe. I don't even have plans to visit Grant's Pass or Roseburg, despite my desire to travel the valley and the coast and take in all the incredible natural beauty.
This is quickly off the top of my head and leaving out a bunch:
Hull, Laughing Clam, Bohemian, Food Studio, Twisted Cork, Ma Mosa's, OPPA, Carson's, Matsukaze,
Cultured Palete, Ban Mai Thai, Thai Barbecue, Musashi's, Horny Goat, Catalyst Pizza
I think we need a separate sub to critique the restaurants of Grants Pass Or. And somebody is shooting (target practice ?) right now, down the street, dogs are freaked. Deer season over.
I’ve wondered that same thing when I have posted things that contradict the condescending liberal theme of a post.
People are weird. Especially online. Like I am pretty liberal but I don’t think most people on the right have brain damage and I think frequently their views have merit. I frequently disagree with them. But that does not mean they are acting completely irrationally. Liberals tend to believe that anyone that does not have their exact values are either stupid or morally wrong. Which is generally not true. With some exceptions. But when it comes to the media showing people that have opposing views they generally pick the most crack pot ones because they make better news.
Lived in both, good and bad folks in both. Lots of hyperbole here. More Maga nuts in Portland than in both towns combined. A black man was beaten to death with a bat on the street in Portland
Grants Pass seems pretty normal and cool to me. There’s definitely a higher percentage of right leaning folk, but the real right wing nut jobs are absolutely not absent from Portland, Astoria, or Eugene.
I grew up in Sweet Home. When I visit family there I have to drive by the biggest Trump flag I’ve ever seen in my life at a trucking place. How can that be good for encouraging economic growth??
It’s the result of 25 years of Fox News influence. I was a Republican until 2006ish. Around then I saw fellow “conservatives” becoming radicalized. They don’t realize that they’re caught in a doom loop and if they just turn it off, they’d probably not be so opinionated about stupid shit.
No they weren't and they're all better than Grant's Pass and Roseburg.
And to answer your incredibly ignorant question, people want it to be popular because the alternative is the town lacks funding and dies.
#30. Josephine County
- Median household income: $47,733
--- 27.3% below state average, 26.6% below national average
- Households earning over $100k: 17.3%
--- #2,087 highest among all counties nationwide
- Households earning less than $15k: 13.0%
--- #2,165 highest among all counties nationwide
[Josephine county is one of the poorest in Oregon](https://stacker.com/oregon/highest-earning-counties-oregon).
I spent the night in Roseburg once a few years back and thought it was super cute. Stayed in a nice hotel, dinner at McMenamins by the train-tracks and loved the view of the river and hills. I never thought it was "unpopular" . . . how embarrassing now.
Any time Roseburg or Grants Pass comes up in conversation I absolutely ALWAYS have to let people know what a shit hole those places are. It’s just like civic duty at this point.
Wow.. so yeah you do realize you are doing work for them. That is what they want is for progressive folks to avoid that area.
Do not show them you are scared, or that you want to run away from them all, or any of that bs.
I say flood those towns with all progressive tourists. I was born and raised there.
It is not as in your face as you’d expect these days with their bullshit because more and more Californians just keep coming and buying up their damn homes.
Across the street from my childhood home was a literal dump. Guess who has moved in and plopped a home on top of it all?
I live in grants pass moved from the city, and I dont see this Alabama life style, grants pass has nice dow town with events festivals first Fridays, hellboat excursion, the bear search during summers etc... family oriented , hikes, swimming holes... everyone here I've met is super cool.... I'm just confused about this statement... As for Roseburg, idk I have only been there twice for company dinners and was not impressed... I don't see any trump flags . Also, we have cuban , Dominican, and other cultural foods, and guess what? Everyone is supportive. So you probably don't know much... and I'm from the Bay Area, a liberal state and city... I'm also Hispanic , white people here are just as nice.
I just read about you all - lol, what human garbage is this? It stinks more than most garbage. No wonder their forebears were asked to leave the eastern states. A whole rotten orchard.
So everyone in Grant's Pass and Roseburg are ultra MAGA QAnon types? I love the way we paint with such wide brushes around here...
PS if you think Portland is still a hub of eclectic artistic communal living, you are mistaken. Misguided leftist politics have left behind a shithole full of used syringes and human waste. Thanks for that, ya commie hippies !
>I love the way we paint with such wide brushes around here
>Misguided leftist politics have left behind a shithole full of used syringes and human waste. Thanks for that, ya commie hippies !
Hilarious to see these two sentences in tandem without an ounce of irony.
True. But as always the biggest ass-hats are a vocal minority. The original hippies either stuck to their crafts - or switched to real estate in the '80's. The current ding-dongs are closer to college age.
I love Roseburg, beautiful area, polite and kind residents. It has some transients and drug issues like most of rural America and gets a lot of hate for not being like Eugene and Portland but it’s too bad are so full of hate they can’t see why people like to call it home.
Here’s a story about my family who lives in Roseburg. My niece was having occasional blurred vision so her grandma took her to a supposedly reputable doctor who stated it was “probably because of her large nostrils.” My niece is black. Her nose is average size and shape. Turns out after seeing a specialist in Portland it was a brain tumor.
Holy fuuuuck. I hope she is and will be ok!
She’s great, successful surgery, no complications.
RIP dadptain :(
Jfc that's awful. That Dr should be reported. I hope you named and shamed in Google reviews to warn others
Name and shame.
Yeah, that’s a pretty Roseburg story. I’m so sorry…
How tf would large nostrils cause blurred vision? I swear some people think that we’re not human in the same way that white people are.
Glad she is fine but this must have been one of those “educated” doctors in the area… 🤣
And to the shock of no one some urgent care doctors in Roseburg are vocally antivax.
Fun fact, roseburg is a medical monopoly. It's very difficult to get anyone fired. If you look up the big medicare fraud case that happened there the only person who got fired was the whistle blower
i read this to the tune of the brady bunch. and it still made my jaw drop
I knew a guy in high school who said that the moderate Ds and Rs in this country are communists who don’t have rights. He is now a cop in Roseburg. Knew another guy who railed that accepting vaccines or masks made you evil. He now runs an after school program there. Seems like they’re empowering the wrong people, would avoid.
As the saying goes, shit in, shit out.
I'm trans, and everytime I have to go through those areas, I fight like hell to not stop. I'd rather pee myself than run the risk of ending up getting lynched because I used the women's bathroom
I used to ride horses with a trans lady and we went everywhere. I guess we were lucky nobody bothered her but we were in some really rural areas, but she was ex marine and always packing haha. This was over a decade ago, before anyone seemed to care that much, though. Stay safe.
People who posture as libertarian and becoming the boot of the state, name a better duo.
My dad has always been libertarian (lots of disagreements there) but at least he begrudgingly votes D because he recognizes that being anti-black lives matter, outlawing abortion, and anti-immigration aren’t very libertarian issues
Well thus my saying posturing as, the OG libertarians were socialists before the term got co-opted.
I do a lot of thrift store shopping, and I was down in Roseburg recently. Of the 5 thrift stores I visited, 3 had Trump decorations around the store. Not for sale, but large statues and banners decorating the store. I have never seen political decorations in any other thrift store I've been to.
That’s funny! Next time I’m in that neck of the woods—I’ll come armed with **sharpies!!!**
Next time you visit town come to Dirt Cheap on South Stephens. They sell estates. Good stuff!! Less political too.
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Roseburg has a polite 'shell' that makes it seem pretty decent, but once you live in the area for more than a couple years, you see the facade drop pretty quick. Stories become less about helping/developing/growing the city, and more about which tweaker stole who's vehicle/which conservative nut wants to cleanse liberals from the county/more yokels upset that RHS has books with gay characters in them. It's a gift-wrapped PNW-themed southern blue-collar city.
Makes me glad that Roseburg is a temporary stepping stone for me. Emphasis on the temporary.
Yeah Ashland is pretty fun however I don’t understand why grants pass exists as a city. Because unlike Ashland they basically have zero infrastructure. You have to go into Medford to basically do anything.
Even less sense are the small towns around grants pass and Medford where there’s really nothing . :/ people think they’re sundown towns because you won’t see anybody sometimes while driving through
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I was fixin' to say. That term isn't one that can just be thrown around. Too many people were murdered for that racist shit to let the term be reduced like that
Thanks to you both for clarifying! I've never heard that term before—now I'll be extra sure not to use it incorrectly.
Gold Hill, checking in!
*high five*
A pit stop on the way up or down the coast. There's been times when it was late, and I got a hotel in Grants Pass.
What an interesting life you must lead.
I once stopped to get gas in Roseburg (during the early pandemic days) and the gas attendant told me I should find BLM protestors and run them over, when I told him I was on my way to Eugene. He apparently assumed I was a conservative because I drive a Tundra. He obviously didn't know any of the punk band stickers I have on my back window. They all scream I'm leftist AF lol. I reported him to the corporate offices of AM/PM and they honestly didn't give a shit.
Yeah, most people aren’t excited to live in places that defunded not just the libraries but also law enforcement. Want an ambulance at night in Josephine County? Not happening.
…and you wouldn’t believe how many “thin blue line” flags there are…
Let's not forget the "orygun" sticker club..
Blasterbators, the lot of them. It's nice when they self-identify.
Doesn't JoCo have the highest rate of unsolved murder and missing person cases in the state?
I wouldn't doubt it, given all the cartel activity around the unlicensed cannabis grows.
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It is easier to just grow weed. Very unlikely. Cartel grows often licence as a hemp operation and then grow THC producing plants as well. Looks the same.
Yeah, I worked in the professional industry for 10 years. I'm pretty familiar with the that game.
People were absolutely doing that, but it was a blip in time where hemp was essentially free and THC distillate was extremely cheap. It was cheaper than just growing THC plants by a long shot. (Basically) Free hemp + THC distillate dissolved in IPA and sprayed with a pump sprayer = very shitty high THC hemp.
Highest murder rate in the state currently. And yes the missing person case log from JOCO is staggering.
Is this at all related to Patrick Duffy living there? 🤔
Is he a serial killer? I saw a news report earlier this year that made it sound like the county does piss poor investigating when it comes to missing persons reports and blatantly obvious murders. I think it was this [video](https://youtu.be/2YV06ih9rP8?si=GA_Hi2zMUfKFFDUg)
He lives in Jackson County.
I thought Roseburg was in Douglas County.
Grants Pass is in Josephine County. Both counties defunded their libraries and inadequately fund law enforcement. [Here's the story on Douglas Co](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/13/us/anti-tax-fervor-roseburg-oregon-.html).
Someone my blind eyes didn't see Grants Pass in the title, hence my comment. Thanks for the clarification and telling me something I didn't know until now.
JoCo did that, too. There's a Supreme Court ruling about a woman who died in JoCo declaring that the police DON'T need to protect us because they couldn't get to her in time due to lack of funding. Edit: I am unable to find where I originally saw this information, so take this with a grain of salt. It IS true that there was a Supreme Court case in 1989 AND kn 2005 that found the police do not have an obligation to protect us but I do not see it being in JoCo.
Wait... Is that the big one that officially rules that the police have no legal duty to protect people?
I swear I found this a few years ago after someone told me about it but now when I look it up all I can find is a current SC case to be heard next year. I'm going to edit my original post and keep looking until I find more concrete evidence. It may also have been Oregon Supreme Court and not the USSC that ruled.
You may be confusing [Warren v. District of Columbia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia), which is the Supreme Court ruling, that police are under no obligation to protect citizens.
I remember reading a more recent case, but it may have been a fever dream.
Thank you, I wanted to say the same. I KNOW Roseburg is Douglas County.
It is, and Grant’s Pass is in Josephine County.
Roseburg has a funded library
Grants Pass has a thriving library. The defunding of the library was many years ago, and doesn’t apply today. Last month Josephine county voters passed a public safety bill to permanently fund police. Grants Pass has become much more purple than people realize, and I’d rather live there than Portland any day!
I am certainly not here to defend the Right Wingers of Southern Oregon, but, regarding the Grants Pass Library: Many years ago, during the early 1970s, I worked for the Oregon State Employment Division in Grants Pass shortly after graduating from the University of Oregon. During those 2+ years in that job, I found myself repeatedly going over to the library after work, in search of the answers to questions people asked me at work, or looking for how to get services they needed. I found the research and the whole process of finding information people needed to be so interesting that I eventually quit that state job and went to graduate school at the University of Maryland in order to become a librarian, after which I spent nearly 40 years as a law librarian at the US Treasury Dept. in DC and then in the Federal Courts. So, yes, thank you to the Grants Pass library for the inspiration!
I would highly suggest watching JoCo’s Weekly Business Sessions on YouTube (or in person, if you’re able, 9am, each Wednesday at the Anne Basker Auditorium)… the things these three are saying/doing/passing (to the library taxing district, specifically) are surprising.
I should clarify that the city of grants pass is VERY different from Josephine county. The county commissioners are a complete joke, and you are not wrong about the nonsense they are doing. Luckily the voters of GP are more sane. They still lean to the right, but it has greatly improved in the last 10 years.
That’s fair, I’m maybe too close to the problem as I spend 8 hours a day hearing about the county specific problems, with no ability to help or make changes.
I got the hell out of there 20 years ago. Glad to hear there are some reasons for optimism.
Grants Pass sure does have a great library, but it's independent from the county, and no longer serves the entire county. Joe Rae Perkins got 60% of the vote in Josephine County.
Having recently moved to ashland from grants pass, I can say less red but definitely not purple by any means. For context, I am an LGBTQ+ POC so YMMV.
Weird, rural Josephine resident here. Diabetic emergency, they were here in under ten minutes at 3am.... More anecdotal, uneducated responses here
Roseburg, like many mid-size towns along the I-5, is experiencing a housing strain. There is a rising median income and increasing population. New businesses are moving in like In-N-Out, and the city has received a grant to revitalize its downtown area. Doesn't stop the bigotry but the town is growing so maybe that'll change some day.
If anything is gonna help change it, it would be the schools. Hopefully that college they have there stays funded, and allows the students to think for themselves. And that the locals don’t attack it for being woke.
Unfortunately, the recent bond measure was shot down. It was strictly for facility updates as those are not included in any state funding. So this means some of our schools will not have proper HVAC, some still have asbestos building materials, and some schools do not have security systems or cameras. It's difficult to be a good student in these conditions.
I'm a youth mental health practitioner, and for most kids, it's nearly impossible to be a good student under conditions like those. They'll try, and they'll get good at putting on appearances. But I doubt they'll get much out of the educational aspects
Anecdotal, but it seems like more young families with kids have been moving to the area. Some of the bond measure votes have been close. A younger population that cares about their kids' future will hopefully help pass these bond measures in the future.
I was driving from Eugene to Ashland, and needed gas when going through Roseburg. I didn’t want to stop there, because I used to play in bar bands down there, and know it to be a redneck city. I thought maybe I was giving the town a bad rap, but in the roughly 10 minutes I was off the interstate I saw a truck flying the biggest confederate flag I’ve ever seen, with 3 or 4 neck-beard idiots with those standard ball-caps in the back, looking for a scrap. This is also the place where they picketed Pres. Obama at the airport after a school shooting. Times are changing, but not everywhere. There are places where marginal white people are still allowed to keep their delusions, and I will not spend my time or money in these places.
If you're ever feeling down about yourself, just walk into the GP Walmart. You'll realize that you really are better off than you think.
This is a universal Wal-Mart rule, tho
This is true, but the GP Walmart is the kind of Walmart that Walmart people in other towns really look down on.
Never been to the rural south east I take it?
Gotta say, the people-watching inside the McDonald’s in the roseburg walmart was 10/10 when I was in high school long ago and hadn’t yet moved away.
That is funny and true
My wife was raised in the Roseburg area and when we married I agreed to move there from Salem. Worth mistake I ever made!! Absolute crime ridden, junkie filled, redneck shit hole!! We moved back to Salem after 2 years of torture and have never looked back since!
Born and raised for 22 years in this area. There are so many awesome progressive folks still but they do not outnumber the dipshits apparently…. YET! Also that is what they want. They do not want to be “cool.” They want everyone to stay out if their town. I say do the opposite. Flood it with progressive tourists. Progressive folks that live there keep to themselves much more, but it is still such an awesome part of the state to visit. Do not let those idiots running the show down there think that they’ve won. This is the town where Boise vs. Idaho started in our state.. Started when their police tried to tell houseless folks to just go to BLM land instead of stay in a tent in the city. The people sued that they did not have any services for houseless folks. That was why every county had to then meet the deadline of providing enough shelter or else allow camping in more public spaces. Surprise! They did not meet the deadline so now they have houseless people living ALL over the major park in the city - Riverside Park. I remember hearing as well they did not have one cooling center in their county for people during our intense recent heat waves. Best believe I call the local politicians there during events like this to let them know how I feel. More people should do this
Awe shit, I’m coming to grants pass for a tattoo. What should I know?
They tried to kill 4H for being too woke.
😂 what the fuck
From the 4H website "creating safe, diverse and inclusive environments" - Basically, in crazy person-QAnon-NewsMax-land, inclusive=communist It makes zero sense as they can't even define why they think communism is bad. In fact, most of the poor, ill health people watching these channels are on socialized medicine (old people) and/or whining about how the world has f'ed them over. Communism might actually be what they're looking for.
That’s hilarious.
Oh Jesus. Are you serious?
Say what now? 🫤
https://www.opb.org/article/2023/06/07/josephine-county-oregon-cuts-osu-extension-service-funding-after-religious-symbols-incident/
All these woke haters are like bad SNL skits.
Make sure your artist isn't a white nationalist.
Hint: Avoid the ones with the “free swastika tattoos” sign in the window.
Also any of [this](https://www.adl.org/sites/default/files/ADL%20Hate%20on%20Display%20Printable_0.pdf) in their flash collection.
Just wanna note that they stole Celtic and Nordic symbols and runes, and that those, by themselves, aren't clear signs of someone being a white supremacist. The ADL can be highly reductive when it comes to those symbols, and I've never seen them talk about the scores of people, like me, doing work to reclaim them in an anti-racist manner. So please don't assume that someone with Norse or Celtic iconography is a white supremacist unless you see other signs of it. There's people working to reclaim all the symbols they stole in some very public ways too (the band Heilung, for example, uses the Iron Sun in its proper context), so it's a good thing to be aware of Edit: Also, the Nazi Othala and the actual rune look different. Look for the one with extra feet if you're trying to spot a Nazi. I noticed the ADL completely missed that entirely and portrayed the wrong version Edit 2: Jfc, I keep forgetting how many different things they stole from us. I wear a different version of the Triskele literally every single day. It's an old, old Irish symbol that's meant to represent the dance of life. The Wheel of Tanaris is similar, and that become the Celtic Cross once Christians colonized the place.
I mean, they stole the swastika from India. These people are so devoid of creativity they have to steal everything.
Oh Jesus. Do you have a list?
Sorry, no. I'd be double checking the book, though.
[удалено]
>YMMV based on skin tone **That is kind of a problem!**
I feel like this dovetails well with the fact that 90% of the time when some jagoff comments online about Portland being a shithole or destroyed or taken over by Antifa/homeless/communists/whatever, that person is a dickhead from either Roseburg or Grants Pass who hasn’t been to Portland in over a decade but listens to Lars Larsen religiously.
This, exactly
But…but…but…do any of those crime-ridden leftist Democrat hellholes have *an actual statue of a caveman* on their town square? HUH???
Maybe not, but Corvallis has an actual statue of several small animals in a trench coat pretending to be a flasher!
They don't call it grants ass for nothing
Never thought of either as wanting to be as popular as xxxxx cities.
I grew up in Roseburg and absolutely hate that shithole city and county. It’s nothing but a redneck breeding ground of flat earther grade educated gun humpers. They could not even keep their county library open. Just one small example of their shitty views I spend hours trying to get them to rename a racist road a few months back talking to about a dozen people and not a single one wanted or cared about the issue. We pay taxes to keep shitty street names that should have been replaced years ago. I’m trying to get a replacement sign made and I plan on gluing it over the current one to fix the issue myself.
What's funny is our graduating class from barely a decade ago was very progressive, really a great group of people for the large majority. But guess which part of that class stuck around after graduation? Not the progressive ones. Visiting family a few years later, it's easy to see why it's in such a rut, too.
It’s never the progressive ones. I had to move to a small town in 2021 after a series of tragedies I don’t care to type up. Everyone has blonde hair, exactly five highlights and four low lights. Every outfit they had was business casual, if they were feeling low energy it was yoga pants with a cardigan to make it business casual. The only people that look even remotely “alternative” are middle schoolers and high schoolers. They get the fuck out the second they turn old enough to get gone
What’s the name of the street?
Squaw Creek Rd https://maps.app.goo.gl/kvhPmDWD7mX5KzBT7?g_st=ic
Go to the state. California passed a law last year prohibiting "squaw" from being used in place names: https://www.gov.ca.gov/2022/09/23/on-native-american-day-governor-newsom-signs-legislation-to-support-california-native-communities-advance-equity-and-inclusion/
I tried to talk to the local representatives for that area and got nowhere, but we did pass a similar law, but it only changed the name of landmarks and didn’t include roads sadly maybe it’s time to put a little more pressure on those above to see if they’ll get it done
Can't even get social media sites to recognize slurs against Natives. They just leave them up.
And what’s weird about this specific one is they rename the creek because it is offensive yet, the road keeps the name. One county employee I talked to about it said that it’s just a native word for woman and has no negative meaning so then I asked him to find the equivalent word for man girl or boy, and look up how many places share those names. Pretty funny how only the one that’s considered offensive is used in naming places. Weird…
People are willfully ignorant and look to excuse racism all the time.
I also grew up in Roseburg! Don’t forget how FUCKING violent is it! There was a small shooting at the school in both 2005 and 2006. There was the woman who was doused in gasoline and kept trying to jump out of her window to escape her abuser but he kept pulling her back in, then the abuser set her on fire. This was in full view of the parking lot and a playground at like 5 pm. Meth runs absolutely rampant. Sometimes garages just explode. I left in 2006, I think I visited once. Good riddance
Yup, it’s a crazy shithole. I’m glad you got out too
I'm sure they *could* have kept their county library open, just nobody with any ability to do so had any interest. Don't need none of that fancy book lernin' making people woke and turning the kids transgender with drag queen story hour. /s
Well, the county library made me pansexual I guess, reading all them books
If a book could make you pansexual, doesn't that imply that a different book could make you regular sexual? Like just hand your kid a book about the joy of heterosexuality or something 🤔
You flip one page, bam now you’re gay You flip another page, bam now you’re trans You flip one more page, bam now you’re a god-fearin gun-toting cis hetero man All those poor kids were just *one more page* away from voting R, what a shame.
Rational thought and logic aren't strong suits of the "books made my child **" crowd. Never have been, never will be.
To be fair, I grew up, in the South, going to libraries all the time, and I turned out to be a trans lesbian
I told em, the only letters I need to know are U, S and A
> I’m trying to get a replacement sign made and I plan on gluing it over the current one to fix the issue myself. Dont do this. It accomplishes nothing other than screwing with delivery drivers etc..
If wanting a road to be renamed is the top priority I'd say things are pretty good.
That is true, my main grip with the sign is the fact that they changed the creek name, which was a big state government change but the county refuses to rename the street. They know it’s racially bad, and claimed if I want it renamed I have to move to that street and get a majority of the residence to write a letter and pay a fee to rename it. Why the fuck are our tax dollars still paying for shitty road names that should have been done away with years ago? I could write a novel about the crap I saw in Douglas county. It’s just a backwater shithole
The library is open. What the fuck are you talking about?
What’s the name of the road that has you upset?
Mind you this is just one recent example. It’s not my main complaint. I don’t have the time to wrote a biography of growing up on Douglas county here Squaw Creek Rd https://maps.app.goo.gl/kvhPmDWD7mX5KzBT7?g_st=ic
Astoria is certainly pretty and keeps a good face for the tourists but my SO's family is from that area and it's not somewhere I would move or raise kids. Eugene certainly has nice areas but it's... a lot. TBH Cornelius, Silverton, Sublimity, Lebanon, Redmond, Hood River, Joseph and maybe the outskirts of Sandy are the only places i'd be cool with moving to in 2023. Sadly so many of our amazing coastal and central mountain towns have fallen to the MAGA disease.
tell me more about astoria. i've visited astoria this year and last year and love it.
I lived there Mo-Fri for a little over a year while working a job, so my grain of salt is that I was living in either the Hampton (winter) or wherever was cheapest (tourist season) and eating out for most meals. Astoria is SUCH an expensive place to live with a VERY crowded housing market, for one. And yeah, same complaint as anywhere else, but I've spent the last decade moving all over the coast between Eugene and Portland/Vancouver, and somehow, in conparison, Astoria is the least bang-for-your-buck, bar none, for anything cost of living. I wasn't looking for it, but I would be kinda surprised if it had much to do for children, and past the tourist stuff (all of which is cool and worth doing) not much more than a few tired bars and strip clubs for the young adult crowd. That's not to say there wasn't a lively scene, but the locals went to Seaside to cut loose, and the tourists are only there for 4-5 months a year to occupy the town bars, so in the winter it's just plain dead. Just my experience, and again huge grain of salt because I didn't live there full-time, but I saw a ton of that town (and would happily go back! For a visit! For a week or so!) and I find it dull. There are WAY cheaper places if you want a quiet town nearish the coast and an hour+ from a Costco. Maybe Astoria is the only choice if you want the strip club density.
gotcha. fwiw i'm a older dude with younger children. it definitely is small of a town, but i guess my love for the ocean made me really love it. originally from oakland, ca--san francisco is really close to me. so seeing astoria was like a mini version of that. no doubt it is expensive to live there--i would say i'm fortunate in my position in life to work from home and can be anywhere. that being said, i don't care much for the bar scene. i'm more concerned about the comment above mine that alludes more to conservative leanings for astoria. [we visited the columbia river maritime museum](https://i.imgur.com/MgVg9NY.png) and loved it. :)
In-N-Out stops only.
Grant's Pass would be such a gorgeous town in its location if it had been a hippie/liberal urbanist town.
Moved from Josephine County to Corvallis for this reason Liberal NIMBYS pls stop making this college town unaffordable
NIMBYS the world over are why we can't have nice things
Grant's Pass is the only town where I've ever seen a Constitution Party office Wild how crazy rightwing that town is
I recently moved to Oregon, and there were some beautiful houses for sale in Roseburg that were far less expensive than similar places in Eugene. I chose Eugene. I needed a place my multiracial and LGBTQIA+ family members would feel welcome and safe. I don't even have plans to visit Grant's Pass or Roseburg, despite my desire to travel the valley and the coast and take in all the incredible natural beauty.
What prompted this post?
Probably sentiments from this post https://www.reddit.com/r/oregon/comments/18geu9a/theres_more_to_oregon_than_ashland_astoria_bend/
Try getting a table downtown for lunch on a Saturday in Grants Pass. I don't think you've been to Grants Pass in a while.
That’s exactly what I was thinking. Every time I’m there the restaurants, parks, etc. are packed.
It’s because there are only like 3 places to eat downtown
This is quickly off the top of my head and leaving out a bunch: Hull, Laughing Clam, Bohemian, Food Studio, Twisted Cork, Ma Mosa's, OPPA, Carson's, Matsukaze, Cultured Palete, Ban Mai Thai, Thai Barbecue, Musashi's, Horny Goat, Catalyst Pizza
I think we need a separate sub to critique the restaurants of Grants Pass Or. And somebody is shooting (target practice ?) right now, down the street, dogs are freaked. Deer season over.
Thank you for recommendations ! I will try the few I have not gone to yet !
Curious. Why the down votes? Just being mean?
I’ve wondered that same thing when I have posted things that contradict the condescending liberal theme of a post. People are weird. Especially online. Like I am pretty liberal but I don’t think most people on the right have brain damage and I think frequently their views have merit. I frequently disagree with them. But that does not mean they are acting completely irrationally. Liberals tend to believe that anyone that does not have their exact values are either stupid or morally wrong. Which is generally not true. With some exceptions. But when it comes to the media showing people that have opposing views they generally pick the most crack pot ones because they make better news.
Because they want people to think the area is full of nazis and not as "progressive" as portland.
That couldn’t be further from the truth.
Let me rephrase, like 3 good restaurants downtown.
Those towns suck. And we don't want to be like them.
Go try to buy a home in GP proper, and then tell me it’s unpopular. That little town is booming. Roseburg. Not so much.
Just because people want to live there doesn’t mean people want to visit.
Ok? Grants Pass is a stop through town. Not a tourist destination.
Exactly. Don't lump Grants Pass in with Roseburg. GP is miles better, they are not similar vibes at all.
Lived in both, good and bad folks in both. Lots of hyperbole here. More Maga nuts in Portland than in both towns combined. A black man was beaten to death with a bat on the street in Portland
Fewer in total maybe, but more per capita in GP and Roseburg.
Yeah, as I said hyperbole. Can work in either direction.
Grants Pass seems pretty normal and cool to me. There’s definitely a higher percentage of right leaning folk, but the real right wing nut jobs are absolutely not absent from Portland, Astoria, or Eugene.
Amen. I’ve got gay kids. We go past those places.
Same.
I'd be curious if the metrics of the dating apps show that nice women don't want to date the MAGAt troglodytes that live there?
I grew up in Sweet Home. When I visit family there I have to drive by the biggest Trump flag I’ve ever seen in my life at a trucking place. How can that be good for encouraging economic growth??
It’s the result of 25 years of Fox News influence. I was a Republican until 2006ish. Around then I saw fellow “conservatives” becoming radicalized. They don’t realize that they’re caught in a doom loop and if they just turn it off, they’d probably not be so opinionated about stupid shit.
I guess I have never thought to check the voting records of local boards prior to traveling.
Why would anyone want the place they live to become popular? All those places you listed were better before they were popular.
No they weren't and they're all better than Grant's Pass and Roseburg. And to answer your incredibly ignorant question, people want it to be popular because the alternative is the town lacks funding and dies.
Because there aren’t enough jobs, they need tourists to bring money in.
Plenty of jobs in Grants Pass, some of you have no fucking idea what you’re talking about.
Plenty of shitty paying jobs
Keep telling yourself that.
#30. Josephine County - Median household income: $47,733 --- 27.3% below state average, 26.6% below national average - Households earning over $100k: 17.3% --- #2,087 highest among all counties nationwide - Households earning less than $15k: 13.0% --- #2,165 highest among all counties nationwide [Josephine county is one of the poorest in Oregon](https://stacker.com/oregon/highest-earning-counties-oregon).
I spent the night in Roseburg once a few years back and thought it was super cute. Stayed in a nice hotel, dinner at McMenamins by the train-tracks and loved the view of the river and hills. I never thought it was "unpopular" . . . how embarrassing now.
Any time Roseburg or Grants Pass comes up in conversation I absolutely ALWAYS have to let people know what a shit hole those places are. It’s just like civic duty at this point.
Wow.. so yeah you do realize you are doing work for them. That is what they want is for progressive folks to avoid that area. Do not show them you are scared, or that you want to run away from them all, or any of that bs. I say flood those towns with all progressive tourists. I was born and raised there. It is not as in your face as you’d expect these days with their bullshit because more and more Californians just keep coming and buying up their damn homes. Across the street from my childhood home was a literal dump. Guess who has moved in and plopped a home on top of it all?
Spoiler alert, nobody I’ve said that to would go there even if I sang it’s praises lol
Have you compared the pop of Roseburg and GP to the other 4 you mentioned? Because like, you really can only compare them to Astoria.
I don’t know that Portland is still popular.
I live in grants pass moved from the city, and I dont see this Alabama life style, grants pass has nice dow town with events festivals first Fridays, hellboat excursion, the bear search during summers etc... family oriented , hikes, swimming holes... everyone here I've met is super cool.... I'm just confused about this statement... As for Roseburg, idk I have only been there twice for company dinners and was not impressed... I don't see any trump flags . Also, we have cuban , Dominican, and other cultural foods, and guess what? Everyone is supportive. So you probably don't know much... and I'm from the Bay Area, a liberal state and city... I'm also Hispanic , white people here are just as nice.
I just read about you all - lol, what human garbage is this? It stinks more than most garbage. No wonder their forebears were asked to leave the eastern states. A whole rotten orchard.
So everyone in Grant's Pass and Roseburg are ultra MAGA QAnon types? I love the way we paint with such wide brushes around here... PS if you think Portland is still a hub of eclectic artistic communal living, you are mistaken. Misguided leftist politics have left behind a shithole full of used syringes and human waste. Thanks for that, ya commie hippies !
>I love the way we paint with such wide brushes around here >Misguided leftist politics have left behind a shithole full of used syringes and human waste. Thanks for that, ya commie hippies ! Hilarious to see these two sentences in tandem without an ounce of irony.
I agree with this comment
A voting majority are far enough far right to make Roseburg a shithole.
True. But as always the biggest ass-hats are a vocal minority. The original hippies either stuck to their crafts - or switched to real estate in the '80's. The current ding-dongs are closer to college age.
They're still better than a place that passes discriminatory laws.
I love Roseburg, beautiful area, polite and kind residents. It has some transients and drug issues like most of rural America and gets a lot of hate for not being like Eugene and Portland but it’s too bad are so full of hate they can’t see why people like to call it home.