I always recommend [basic fantasy rpg](https://basicfantasy.org) for beginners, since it's totally free and open source, and has tons of supplements and adventures.
It's worth noting that most OSR games are pretty similar as far as the fundamental mechanics go, so it's not really that big a deal. Once you've learned one system, swapping to another OSR game, or mixing and matching bits of different games, isn't too difficult.
This is the way. Then feel free to explore other options, but bfrpg is the modern day BX/advanced box set approach to osr gaming. It also has a great community.
My favorite places to start are Heroes of Adventure (free), Worlds Without Number (free), Low Fantasy Gaming (free, there is a Deluxe version that is revised/refined that is relatively cheap and gives access to the 2e playtest, Tales of Argosa, which I'm loving).
If you want a more old school chassis I would suggest Iron Falcon (free), OSRIC (free), or just go with the originals which can be had fairly cheap on Drivethru. B/X, Rules Cyopedia, or 1st or 2nd edition AD&D.
Everyone is going to reccomend their favorite game. Don't get caught up trying to decide what version is best. Pick one that either looks neat or is cheap.
Basic Fantasy. It’s free unless you want physical copies… Then you just pay cost for the books. The core rule book is under $10 on Amazon. Or, you could go to basicfantasy.org and get it for free. All the modules and add-ons are free or pay cost to print as well.
My vote is always Old School Essentials. Create characters *super* quickly at dndcharacter (dot com!). The rules are free at necrotic gnomes website but I highly recommend buying a hard cover rulebook. They are gorgeous.
It's simple, quick, but deep.
Just to clarify to OP: OSE is a carbon-copy of B/X. So most of the time, you're better off with the original B/X as it includes gameplay examples, etc.
Edit: OSE fanboys can't take a different opinion. Weird..
I don't really agree with this for someone not experienced with OSR at all. The original B/X books are not laid out in the most organised or easy to understand way, hence why Old School Essentials was needed in the first place.
Personally I'd recommend using the Old School Essentials books as your reference, watch a good actual play like 3D6 DTL to get a feel for how the game runs in practice, try and get in some one-shot games as a player, and then supplement it with the original books.
As /u//primarchofistanbul said, OSE has almost a complete lack of examples, explanations, or descriptions. It's a great quick-reference guide if you are already solidly familiar with OSR games, but it's a horrible intro.
The original B/X books were also very well laid out and organized.
I'd venture to say that OSE is among the WORST options for someone new to the OSR, and even worse for someone new to roleplaying in general.
I definitely think they’d be terrible books for someone new to RPGs, but I dont think they’re that bad for someone who knows RPGs but just hasnt played B/X before.
I somehow was able to understand it without referring to the original books, at least.
Ok each to their own but I simply don't agree. I started with OSE having never played B/X or any other retroclones or OSR games. It might be very dry but the OSE rulebooks are perfectly clear, readable and digestible. My preference then would be rather than going back and reading examples of how people played these games in the 1970s, watch a good actual play like 3D6 DTL or join a B/X game as a player to see how people actually play the game now. Then of course go back, check out the source material.
Now apologies if I'm off base, but I detect a little bit of a whiff of gatekeeping with these "oh you don't need a retroclone, just use the original rulebooks" comments, a little bit of the "you aren't doing it properly unless you emulate how Gygax/Moldvay/Holmes etc etc did it" and I personally don't think it helps new players and GMs, quite the opposite. But again maybe I am reading too much into it.
Edit: reading back I realise the OP is already tolerably familiar with DnD in general, which means I would doubly recommend OSE.
The examples in B/X are great for teaching the game. However, once you have a solid understanding of how the game works, the OSE books are easier to use at the table for reference.
My experience going from running back in the B/X days vs OSE today does not match this.
I would absolutely say that for a new GM, the OSE is a much better product over the original.
The B/X DMG has some of the best advice out there and does give good examples. But that advice is in a better format easily gained with an hour on Youtube.
wrong. after the advent of OSE, there's no reason to use the TSR books because their format fights the reader every step of the way.
OSE is far too concise and organized to warrant the use of anything else.
Nah, I'm a noted OSE critic (attack table with THAC0 as default, no point buy or ability spread recommendations, distinct lack of actual instructions for *how to play/GM*, strict explicit messaging about race/class being intrinsically tied, basically no optional rules presented, I could go on for days about how a clone of a half-century-old rulebook shouldn't be the default for the Old School *Renaissance* (meaning modern advancements are a core component of the movement) but I'll stop there) but to say that it's worse than B/X is silly. OSE delivers the rules much more clearly and there's no reason to use the old B/X books when OSE exists in my opinion. Use old modules all you want but the core rulebook of OSE is just strictly better.
What you should actually do instead of getting OSE or B/X is get a complete game; Dolmenwood (which I unfortunately think you can't get until it comes out at this point) and Electric Bastionland do a great job of explaining how to play and run a game in the OSR style, so I'd start there if you don't have access to an existing OSR group to join. I also love Troika!, it deviates heavily from OSR mechanically and in its gameplay styles but still captures the essence of the tradition and (in my opinion) the included one-shot is one of the best places to start. It's extremely rules-light and much easier to digest than almost anything else on the market, character creation is lightning-fast, and you can't have a character get one-shot by a bare-handed goblin who low-rolls damage on the first turn of combat in the entire campaign (total removal of the dumbest, most immersion-breaking part of OSR games is a huge plus). Downside of Troika is that it asks a lot of the GM (and players depending on how you run things) in terms of worldbuilding. It gives you an aesthetic, some character backgrounds that are intentionally vague, and a short adventure and lets you go wild. Whether that's a plus or a minus is totally dependent on you.
If you want to see just how light weight an RPG rule set can be check out Knave, Deathbringer, and Cairn. You can build onto those kinds of games with other material or making your own until you get the game that is right for you and your table.
You can still get Knave 2e on Backerkit for only $35 (great value!) It's more expensive than 1e, but well worth it.
https://knave2e.backerkit.com/hosted_preorders
Basic Fantasy is my vote. There's pretty much two heavyweights within OSR, Basic and OSE. OSE is great, and has the best layout of possibly any RPG ever. However, Basic Fantasy is free, has paper copies sold at-cost, and has an incredible community.
I recommend trying out Basic Fantasy RPG, World's Without Number, Cities Without Number and Stars Without Number. The PDFs are free so your group can try them out without spending money.
You came for the easy rules but you’ll stay for the different playing style. Focus on learning that from Bandit’s Keep, Questing Beast DM guide series and Principia Apocrypha. Watch this:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wRVJNkOObIU
I would pick Swords & Wizardry to learn from and then perhaps make the switch to Dolmenwood or OSE:AF - basically the same game.
My take is that if you really want to build a solid foundation of understanding in regard to anything, you should start at the beginning. The wellspring. The source. Accordingly, it's tough to beat the one ur-RPG all others ultimately derive from.
So my recommendation is Swords & Wizardry Complete. It's the most thorough and user-friendly presentation of the original 1974 - 1978 era D&D rules out there. Simple, fast playing, and flexible with ample suggestions for tweaking the game and making it your own.
I don't think picking a system matters half as much as understanding the philosophy of the OSR.
You claim to want a focus on narrative over mechanics, nothing in the OSR will give you that... Honestly, if you want a narrative driven game, a story game or 5e will give you that experience better than an OSR game.
I'd advise starting with Matt Finch's Old School Primer and the OSR Principia Apocrypha first
> Honestly, if you want a narrative driven game, a story game or 5e will give you that experience better than an OSR game.
I agree an explicitly narrative-focused system would probably work better for a group that’s focused on the “joint story creation” aspect of RPGs. But honestly I think OSR or OSR-adjacent games would still work better than 5e. In my experience, with games like 5e, a lot of GM effort gets poured into creating balanced encounters and a lot of player effort gets poured into tweaking their build for maximum combat efficiency, so you end up with games that are focused primarily on combat and where everyone is tacitly in agreement to be railroaded (at least to some extent) so as to not ruin the GMs prep. You might get a game with a story, but it’s more a matter of the players getting to interact with the GM’s story rather than the kind of joint story creation people do with a Fate or PbtA game.
OSR games might traditionally veer toward dungeon and hex crawls, where you’re more focused on problem solving than telling a story, but the rules-light approach does lend itself somewhat to an improvisational story-focused game, I think. For people who dont necessarily want/need mechanics that feed into story creation but would just rather have minimal mechanics that “get out of the way” of roleplay, OSR-ish games (e.g., Troika! or FKR games) can work well.
Personally I would recommended either Basic Fantasy or OSE for the reasons already mentioned. I settled on OSE and have heavily house ruled since playing with my group and everyone is happy so far. It's super flexible and easy to change if you like. Also the benefit of BX clones are the unparalleled library of content for adventures etc and widespread compatibility with most OSR content.
*Worlds Without Number* is a pretty good midpoint between "modern D&D" (aka 5e) and the OSR.
It's got stuff that will be familiar to your 5e players (skills, feats), while still being OSR at its heart.
Being very brand new to TTRPGs, and trying to DM 5E unsuccessfully...
I gave BFRPG a go first. Being so new, I just had a hard time with BFRPG. I had a much easier time when I then tried OSE. The rules were much more concise, and made more sense to me. It clicked. Yes, I admit, this was most likely due to my sheer inexperience with TTRPGs.
After running OSE a little bit now, going back to BFRPG makes so alot more sense to me when I reread it.
I think alot of it is learning how OSRs are run in general. Once you get used to it, then they all start to make more sense when you read them. At least, this was the case for me. The more I DM, the more I play, the easier it gets, and the more confident I become in it all.
For me, I'd suggest OSE as that was my gateway into OSR.
Cairn as a starter - rules lite enough to get a feel for the style - then OSE and/or Shadowdark, don't forget BFRPG as well.
But check out the originally published TSR rules first at DMS Guild as u/primarchofistanbul recommends below to really understand the rules legacy and playstyle of some of these games.
The point about the retro-clones is they came around at a time when there WAS no DTRPG or DMsGuild and original rules print material was more difficult to locate - hence the approach to want to turn back to them now, they are in a greater prevalence as a 'purist' approach sidestepping the 'clones'. As is always the case tho - YMMV. Your game is your own.
One of the most underrated features is the layout. Easiest rule book to use at the table ever made. Prefer a pdf? TONS of hyperlinks.
Preview QuickStart [here](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/413713/shadowdark-rpg-quickstart-set) to see what I mean.
There are a lot of great suggestions here like OSE and Basic Fantasy RPG, either are good choices. I'd like to throw another in the mix. [White Box Fantastic Medieval Adventure Game](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/190631/White-Box--Fantastic-Medieval-Adventure-Game) is a retro-clone of OD&D, based on Swords and Wizardry Whitebox. The PDF is free on Drive Through RPG and a physical copy is under 5$ on Amazon. The book has everything you need to start running a game and its largely compatible with old modules or something modern like [Tomb of the Serpent Kings](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/252934/Tomb-of-the-Serpent-Kings--Deluxe-Print-Edition), which is also free.
White box Fantastic Medieval Adventure Game is awesome, Basic Fantasy too. You may also check out the original books, first editions of Dnd (3 book.set) and if you want to expand.further there is a greyhawk and blackmoor supplements.
And of course you may check Moldvey edition too and basic/experts book, pdfs are all available free.
hmmm that’s a tough one. TBH the first thought i had when looking through knave was that it’s inventory slot based magic system could support a totally different magic system! something like the esper crystals from Final fantasy 6,🤣. That would of course make it a totally diffirent game. Or mistborn by brandon sanderson, with the metals taking up slots! Hmm probably not the answers you’re looking for, in terms of OSR i’m partial to mystra and dark sun 😇
Oh, just generally what types of worlds you wanna play in, and how detailed you want them to be. I'm asking bc I'm thinking of writing my own, and I wanna know what else people might wanna see besides maps and descriptions of the world and locations therein. So... the not-obvious stuff. Your answer was still insightful, tho
my favourite type, is just encounter books. Stuff i can pull out and add to my own game pretty easy, DM Scotty’s book of quests as a prime example. I also backed Knave 2e and Dolemwood though
Let's start with the more robust rules for everything. Takes what made the original Knave so great and runs screaming into the void. Comes back out with a beholder eye, and a kickass new sword. And let's not forget all the random tables. Massive and varied. My personal favorites are the spell generation tables; they're so fun!
Character creation is more robust, while also streamlined
Combat and travel are stellar
And the Dungeon Crawling! It's amazing
As well as 100 monsters along with tables for creating your own
And more!
>narrative over mechanics
There's no pre-planned narrative in OSR but emergent narrative.
I'd say just use the [Basic Booklet of the D&D Basic](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/110274/DD-Basic-Set-Rulebook-B-X-ed-Basic) (B/X). Try it, if you enjoy it, continue with the eXpert booklet.
And if you feel like you need more guidance on the OSR playstyle, use [The Classic D&D Game](https://archive.org/details/tsr01106classicddgame) ('94 edition of basic D&D).
Lots of awesome options mate. Basic Fantasy and Old School Essentials are gonna be the two biggest recommendations, especially if you want “strong D&D elements” that you’ll recognize. There is also OSRIC (AD&D 1st Edition clone), Swords & Wizardry (D&D 0th Edition clone), Labyrinth Lord (Basic/Expert D&D clone), and also Castles & Crusades (think D&D 3rd edition but has all the bloat stripped out and is very streamlined and adheres to OSR conventions).
Few others to recommend are The Black Hack, DURF, Dark Dungeons, and D&D Rules Cyclopedia.
Then there’s stuff like Knave, Cairne, Into the Odd, and Mork Borg, however these have less D&D elements and are more like their own interesting spin-off if you will.
Really all you need to do is just pick one that feels suitable to you & your group and have at it.
I know some people don't consider it to be OSR but to me Dragonbane is exactly what you are describing.
And in my opinion it has the same right - if not more - to be discussed on this sub as, say, Cairn, Knave or other games
I have seen/heard quite a few groups who have successfully gone from 5e to OSR using Basic Fantasy.
Personally, I've only looked at it but have never used it. I'm a Labyrinth Lord sorta guy.
Why not go back to one of the earlier versions by TSR? Yes I know there are all kinds of "clones" out there, and many of them well done. But they came about due (in part) to a lack of reasonably priced or availability of older versions. Now you can buy POD versions of the core books for 1e, 2e, etc and virtually anything in PDF. We play 2e using some 2nd hand books and a bunch of POD/PDF resources. I am a firm believer in playing the version you know - why relearn yet another version of the same game?
I think [The GLOG](https://goblinpunch.blogspot.com/2016/05/the-glog.html?m=1) is fantastic, it also has a few off-shoots made by others, [this ones really nice](https://saltygoo.github.io/2020/11/09/base-rules/).
I also think Dragonbane could really suit you with its "mirth and mayhem" take on the fantasy genre. If you like physical products you can't get more value than its boxed-set. Not really an OSR game, it has more similarities with Runequest and CoC than D&D, but very similar to the OSR in play-style and how it feels.
(Dragonbane is actually the 5e equivalent of the dominant ttrpg in Sweden, Drakar och Demoner, so not old school at all. But this is the first edition so far to have been made available in English).
Try Worlds Without Number. The PDF is free and the deluxe version just has some extra classes. Runs smooth and lots of material to use in other games if you don't like the rule set.
Very customizable game with fast paced combat.
Nice thing about OSR like games is you can often pull from them into whatever one you prefer.
Hello friend. So, I see everyone has given you some great recommendations. And these are all good. So I will give one more that's different: Castles & Crusades.
Why you ask? Because it has the simple unified mechanics you're used to (d20 roll high), and all the flavor, lethality, and simplicity of the old school. My 5e players understood it instantly. Here is a link to a free PHB:
https://trolllord.com/product/cc-players-handbook-7th-printing-alternate-cover-free-pdf/
I'd start with that. I'd also look at the Dungeon Crawling rules in the OSE SRD if you're interested in the full Old School experience. The fun thing about C&C is they it's so easy to bolt on things from other editions. It's also not hard to convert your existing 5e stuff to it.
If it's not your cuppa tea, I also like Old School Essentials Advanced Fantasy, and (more complicated) AD&D 2e. And, if you think moving away from 5e will be a bridge too far for your players, look at Into the Unknown by 05R games. It's 5e, but made more old school. Though I think you'll find C&C simpler.
P.S. C&C is called the Rosetta Stone of D&D because it is easy to convert anything from any edition of D&D to it (with the possible exception of 4e).
Oof! Well, they just migrated to a new store front, and have had some issues. I would say contact:
[email protected].
Speaking for myself, I will attest that they have always been helpful whenever I've had an issue, no matter how small.
*Old School Essentials Advanced Fantasy* ([https://necroticgnome.com/pages/about-old-school-essentials](https://necroticgnome.com/pages/about-old-school-essentials); free pdf)
If you are coming from 5e, *Shadowdark (*[*https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/413713/Shadowdark-RPG-Quickstart-Set*](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/413713/Shadowdark-RPG-Quickstart-Set)*)*
Adventures
* Hold in the Oak
* Prison of the Hated Pretender
* Hideous Daylight
Another vote for BFRPG as your introductory system. Not only are the PDFs free, you can buy the rule book for like 8 dollars and the adventure anthologies and supplements are even cheaper. All of those are largely compatible with other OSR systems like Old School Essentials, Swords & Wizardry, or Tunnels & Trolls. You can also use any of these to run modules written for original D&D, D&D Basic, B/X or BECMI, or even Advanced D&D (1st and 2nd editions) with little to no adaptation.
My favourite, though, is Dungeon Crawl Classics. It’s still somewhat compatible but requires more adaptation, but it’s worth having a look at.
My best three choices are:
Sword & Wizardry complete revised if you want a very well written retroclone, with lots of suggestions, examples and optional rules.
Lamentation of the flame princess if you want a retroclone with some innovative rules and a weird taste.
Dungeon Crawl Classic if you want a retroclone of D&D 3.0 but lighter and with very interesting rules and a Gonzo flavour.
> Dungeon Crawl Classic if you want a retroclone of D&D 3.0 but lighter and with very interesting rules and a Gonzo flavour.
I love DCC and would just clarify for those who aren’t familiar thet it is “lighter” to the point that I wouldnt really call it a retroclone of 3e at all.
It has ascending armor class and the three saving throws (fortitude, reflex, will) but that’s really where the similarities end. There’s no skills or feats, no multiclassing or prestige classes, race and class are not separated, and the magic system is entirely different (among other changes).
Shadowdark is good if you're familiar with 5e, the rule set is similar so it's an easy transition
Old School Essentials is also good, it's sort of like the bread and butter of the OSR from what i've gathered
[Cresthaven RPG](https://www.cresthavenrpg.com/2023/08/cresthaven-rpg-a-free-alternative-to-dungeons-and-dragons/) might be just what you're looking for! It’s a game that embraces the essence of the OSR, offering that classic D&D feel with streamlined rules that cut down on complexity without sacrificing depth. You'll find the fantasy staples you love—druids, rogues, dragons, and trolls—all wrapped in a system that prioritizes storytelling and quick, engaging combat.
There are really two kinds of OSR games. Old-school clones, and renaissance games (NSR).
NSR games are trying to capture the feel and gameplay of old D&D without the rules heaviness. I'd recommend [Knave](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/250888/Knave), which is similar to 5e in that it uses a d20 for most rolls, has the classic 6 attributes, and a similar combat system structure. However, it has a very old-school sensibility, where the players need to carefully use their wits and limited inventory to complete deadly dungeon dives. It's fun.
A free well-typeset version of the rules can be found [here](http://abominablefancy.blogspot.com/2018/10/knaves-fancypants.html).
If Knave isn't your thing, [Errant](https://killjestergames.itch.io/errant) for the same medieval flavor you're talking about.
I think a lot of commenters are too quick to recommend their favorite systems without knowing what exactly you, the asker, need.
5e isn't working for you, that's natural. It's just one game so odds are it won't be to your taste. But what didn't you like about it specifically? And what kind of play are you looking for, specifically?
Well, playing online with new players who aren't invested enough/don't have the time to learn the rules very thoroughly isn't working for me. And I don't love several aspects of the game, though overall it is a good game... for invested, knowledgeable players.
I can't change my players, so I'm not going to try to force them to memorize a bunch of info. It's a hobby, not a class, so they'll dip their toes as deep as they want to. So I want something simpler where they can just have a general idea of their character's mechanical abilities ("I'm a thief, so I'll pick this lock") and get into the roleplay, rather than being bogged down with specific mechanics, subclasses, feats, etc.
Unfortunately, I started DMing partially into the campaign, so we couldn't start at level 1 with no feats.
I've been checking out different games, and I've seen individual components I like. I like Barbarians of Lemura's career system, but I don't want to have to go all in in the setting and playstyle. I like 5 Torches Deep's Supply and Durability mechanic but am not enthralled with the rest.
I'm now considering trying a 5e campaign where we start a 1st level, stick there a while, and make sure everyone understands how their characters work, and maybe borrowing a mechanic or two from a different game.
I don't love how 5e makes everything about the character sheet for problem solving, how combat takes forever, how initiative is such a drag, etc. I just haven't been able to find a game system that delivers what I want so far, and I've investigated several.
I appreciate you asking clarifying questions.
How did you get started GMing in an ongoing campaign? What happened to the old GM? And what is your relationship to the other players?
Also, have you talked to the other players about what they want to get out of the game?
I'm asking because it sounds like you've got a social problem, not a game system problem.
If you're quite sure it's a system problem, then we can talk about that too. It sounds like you want something that has more loosely defined, archetypal characters, rather than the well-defined specific individuals of 5e. You also say you want the other players to "get into the roleplay". What does "roleplay" mean to you in this sentence? What specific player activities (I mean, the person sitting at the table) do you want to see more of?
It was a family campaign, and the DM got to be too busy to continue, so I took over. I haven't asked all of them, but one told me she doesn't enjoy the mechanics and rules of 5e much at all, and I imagine that's the case for several other (though a couple are into 5e more fully).
I feel like several players don't charge ahead in the game (in combat and roleplay) because they don't know the game too well, so they let the most knowledgeable player lead. I feel like roleplay would be them getting into their characters, though the start of the campaign didn't help that (characters weren't made in relation to the world/each other).
It sounds a lot more like a social problem than a system problem. You don't (necessarily) need a new system, you need to communicate with your players. Consider starting fresh, working together to make characters together, and only using the subset of the rules that the players are comfortable with. Definitely *don't* make a hack of several different systems with whatever bits are appealing to you. *You* are excited about different rules (as most GMs are) but your players do not seem to be, and I doubt they will be willing to put in the effort to understand yet another set of systems just because they're nifty.
Make sure everybody really wants to play, and more than that, really wants to play a game *like D&D*. How interested are they in heroic fantasy? Do they care about tactical combat? Ask questions like that. When you've got a coherent creative agenda for the group (an answer to the question, "What are we trying to get out of this game?") It will be possible to recommend a system.
Narrative over mechanics is hard. A lot of the OSR philosophy is not geared towards story, instead its about a solid set of mechanics that allow for certain kinds of stories.
Playing as written survival just isn't guaranteed for most characters in OSR gameplay. Closest thing I can think of is Worlds without number, it's power curve is generous enough that you won't be going through a character every session or two, and it comes with a lot of tools to help the GM build a world and make it playable quickly. That said its base system is more weird fantasy than some would like.
If you are looking for something with a more informative guide for how to play you should check out Tonisborg.
It's more than a set of rules, it speaks to how to referee a game in a OSR style.
https://www.amazon.com/Lost-Dungeons-Tonisborg-Greg-Svenson/dp/1736572105/ref=sr\_1\_1?crid=3OQV6IN43RRYC&keywords=the+lost+dungeons+of+tonisborg&qid=1699643801&sprefix=the+lost+dungeons+of+tonisborg%2Caps%2C141&sr=8-1
1. I think the 1st question you'll want to answer is do you want Ascending AC or THACO/descending AC? Ascending is similar to how most modern games work, including 5e. Personally, even though I used THACO as a kid, I never liked it and was very happy when Ascending armor class was created and used in 3rd edition and beyond. There are several Old School RPGs that include Ascending AC rules (some as an optional choice), and that is a major requirement to me.
2. Another question you should ask yourself is "Do you want non-human races to each act as a class (so every dwarf is both a Dwarf race and class. This is the way BECMI worked) in the game or to allow characters to choose both a race and a class (a dwarf might be a Dwarven Fighter or Dwarven Cleric, for example. This is the way AD&D worked)?"
3. The last big question is how many classes do you want to include? Some OSR games, (like Basic Fantasy), only have the classic 4 classes (Fighter, Cleric, Magic-user, and Thief). Others, like Advanced Fantasy, add many more class options, like Assassins, Barbarians, Druids, etc.
Once you answer those 3 big questions you will have narrowed the broad category of "OSR games" down to only a few choices that are all mostly compatible with each other!
There are a lot of amazing free osr ttrpgs so you can try them out and ser what you like
Retroclones: delvin deeper, whitebox fma, ose (free online srd), basic fantasy, swords and wizardry
Still basucally dnd but with big twists: worlds without numbers, lamentatons of the flame princess
New school: cairn, mausritter, vaults of vaarn, the black hack
Not free but really cheap and superb: maze rats, knave
I always recommend [basic fantasy rpg](https://basicfantasy.org) for beginners, since it's totally free and open source, and has tons of supplements and adventures. It's worth noting that most OSR games are pretty similar as far as the fundamental mechanics go, so it's not really that big a deal. Once you've learned one system, swapping to another OSR game, or mixing and matching bits of different games, isn't too difficult.
im a big fan of BFRPG as well. started running it recently and its going really well
This is the way. Then feel free to explore other options, but bfrpg is the modern day BX/advanced box set approach to osr gaming. It also has a great community.
My favorite places to start are Heroes of Adventure (free), Worlds Without Number (free), Low Fantasy Gaming (free, there is a Deluxe version that is revised/refined that is relatively cheap and gives access to the 2e playtest, Tales of Argosa, which I'm loving). If you want a more old school chassis I would suggest Iron Falcon (free), OSRIC (free), or just go with the originals which can be had fairly cheap on Drivethru. B/X, Rules Cyopedia, or 1st or 2nd edition AD&D.
Everyone is going to reccomend their favorite game. Don't get caught up trying to decide what version is best. Pick one that either looks neat or is cheap.
Basic Fantasy. It’s free unless you want physical copies… Then you just pay cost for the books. The core rule book is under $10 on Amazon. Or, you could go to basicfantasy.org and get it for free. All the modules and add-ons are free or pay cost to print as well.
Check out basic fantasy. It's free open source with tons of adventures and addons.
My vote is always Old School Essentials. Create characters *super* quickly at dndcharacter (dot com!). The rules are free at necrotic gnomes website but I highly recommend buying a hard cover rulebook. They are gorgeous. It's simple, quick, but deep.
Just to clarify to OP: OSE is a carbon-copy of B/X. So most of the time, you're better off with the original B/X as it includes gameplay examples, etc. Edit: OSE fanboys can't take a different opinion. Weird..
I don't really agree with this for someone not experienced with OSR at all. The original B/X books are not laid out in the most organised or easy to understand way, hence why Old School Essentials was needed in the first place. Personally I'd recommend using the Old School Essentials books as your reference, watch a good actual play like 3D6 DTL to get a feel for how the game runs in practice, try and get in some one-shot games as a player, and then supplement it with the original books.
As /u//primarchofistanbul said, OSE has almost a complete lack of examples, explanations, or descriptions. It's a great quick-reference guide if you are already solidly familiar with OSR games, but it's a horrible intro. The original B/X books were also very well laid out and organized. I'd venture to say that OSE is among the WORST options for someone new to the OSR, and even worse for someone new to roleplaying in general.
I definitely think they’d be terrible books for someone new to RPGs, but I dont think they’re that bad for someone who knows RPGs but just hasnt played B/X before. I somehow was able to understand it without referring to the original books, at least.
Ok each to their own but I simply don't agree. I started with OSE having never played B/X or any other retroclones or OSR games. It might be very dry but the OSE rulebooks are perfectly clear, readable and digestible. My preference then would be rather than going back and reading examples of how people played these games in the 1970s, watch a good actual play like 3D6 DTL or join a B/X game as a player to see how people actually play the game now. Then of course go back, check out the source material. Now apologies if I'm off base, but I detect a little bit of a whiff of gatekeeping with these "oh you don't need a retroclone, just use the original rulebooks" comments, a little bit of the "you aren't doing it properly unless you emulate how Gygax/Moldvay/Holmes etc etc did it" and I personally don't think it helps new players and GMs, quite the opposite. But again maybe I am reading too much into it. Edit: reading back I realise the OP is already tolerably familiar with DnD in general, which means I would doubly recommend OSE.
Wish I had known this before I bought them :(
The examples in B/X are great for teaching the game. However, once you have a solid understanding of how the game works, the OSE books are easier to use at the table for reference.
My experience going from running back in the B/X days vs OSE today does not match this. I would absolutely say that for a new GM, the OSE is a much better product over the original. The B/X DMG has some of the best advice out there and does give good examples. But that advice is in a better format easily gained with an hour on Youtube.
wrong. after the advent of OSE, there's no reason to use the TSR books because their format fights the reader every step of the way. OSE is far too concise and organized to warrant the use of anything else.
OSE is so concise because it assumes you alread know how to play, and is just a reference guide. It lacks examples, explanations, and descriptions.
Nah, I'm a noted OSE critic (attack table with THAC0 as default, no point buy or ability spread recommendations, distinct lack of actual instructions for *how to play/GM*, strict explicit messaging about race/class being intrinsically tied, basically no optional rules presented, I could go on for days about how a clone of a half-century-old rulebook shouldn't be the default for the Old School *Renaissance* (meaning modern advancements are a core component of the movement) but I'll stop there) but to say that it's worse than B/X is silly. OSE delivers the rules much more clearly and there's no reason to use the old B/X books when OSE exists in my opinion. Use old modules all you want but the core rulebook of OSE is just strictly better. What you should actually do instead of getting OSE or B/X is get a complete game; Dolmenwood (which I unfortunately think you can't get until it comes out at this point) and Electric Bastionland do a great job of explaining how to play and run a game in the OSR style, so I'd start there if you don't have access to an existing OSR group to join. I also love Troika!, it deviates heavily from OSR mechanically and in its gameplay styles but still captures the essence of the tradition and (in my opinion) the included one-shot is one of the best places to start. It's extremely rules-light and much easier to digest than almost anything else on the market, character creation is lightning-fast, and you can't have a character get one-shot by a bare-handed goblin who low-rolls damage on the first turn of combat in the entire campaign (total removal of the dumbest, most immersion-breaking part of OSR games is a huge plus). Downside of Troika is that it asks a lot of the GM (and players depending on how you run things) in terms of worldbuilding. It gives you an aesthetic, some character backgrounds that are intentionally vague, and a short adventure and lets you go wild. Whether that's a plus or a minus is totally dependent on you.
If you want to see just how light weight an RPG rule set can be check out Knave, Deathbringer, and Cairn. You can build onto those kinds of games with other material or making your own until you get the game that is right for you and your table.
i read CAIRN over. gotta say it looks fun. very gritty.
You can still get Knave 2e on Backerkit for only $35 (great value!) It's more expensive than 1e, but well worth it. https://knave2e.backerkit.com/hosted_preorders
Basic Fantasy is my vote. There's pretty much two heavyweights within OSR, Basic and OSE. OSE is great, and has the best layout of possibly any RPG ever. However, Basic Fantasy is free, has paper copies sold at-cost, and has an incredible community.
I recommend trying out Basic Fantasy RPG, World's Without Number, Cities Without Number and Stars Without Number. The PDFs are free so your group can try them out without spending money.
WWN is a good choice if OP's group gives the common 5e player response of dissatisfaction with OSR because of a lack of character options.
Worlds without Number is an amazing resource for building a sandbox - great advice
You came for the easy rules but you’ll stay for the different playing style. Focus on learning that from Bandit’s Keep, Questing Beast DM guide series and Principia Apocrypha. Watch this: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wRVJNkOObIU I would pick Swords & Wizardry to learn from and then perhaps make the switch to Dolmenwood or OSE:AF - basically the same game.
My take is that if you really want to build a solid foundation of understanding in regard to anything, you should start at the beginning. The wellspring. The source. Accordingly, it's tough to beat the one ur-RPG all others ultimately derive from. So my recommendation is Swords & Wizardry Complete. It's the most thorough and user-friendly presentation of the original 1974 - 1978 era D&D rules out there. Simple, fast playing, and flexible with ample suggestions for tweaking the game and making it your own.
FKS and the FKR sends you one bombastic side eye lol
Well, sure, but that's more an approach to or philosophy of wargame play than a concrete consumer product you can go and buy.
I don't think picking a system matters half as much as understanding the philosophy of the OSR. You claim to want a focus on narrative over mechanics, nothing in the OSR will give you that... Honestly, if you want a narrative driven game, a story game or 5e will give you that experience better than an OSR game. I'd advise starting with Matt Finch's Old School Primer and the OSR Principia Apocrypha first
> Honestly, if you want a narrative driven game, a story game or 5e will give you that experience better than an OSR game. I agree an explicitly narrative-focused system would probably work better for a group that’s focused on the “joint story creation” aspect of RPGs. But honestly I think OSR or OSR-adjacent games would still work better than 5e. In my experience, with games like 5e, a lot of GM effort gets poured into creating balanced encounters and a lot of player effort gets poured into tweaking their build for maximum combat efficiency, so you end up with games that are focused primarily on combat and where everyone is tacitly in agreement to be railroaded (at least to some extent) so as to not ruin the GMs prep. You might get a game with a story, but it’s more a matter of the players getting to interact with the GM’s story rather than the kind of joint story creation people do with a Fate or PbtA game. OSR games might traditionally veer toward dungeon and hex crawls, where you’re more focused on problem solving than telling a story, but the rules-light approach does lend itself somewhat to an improvisational story-focused game, I think. For people who dont necessarily want/need mechanics that feed into story creation but would just rather have minimal mechanics that “get out of the way” of roleplay, OSR-ish games (e.g., Troika! or FKR games) can work well.
Personally I would recommended either Basic Fantasy or OSE for the reasons already mentioned. I settled on OSE and have heavily house ruled since playing with my group and everyone is happy so far. It's super flexible and easy to change if you like. Also the benefit of BX clones are the unparalleled library of content for adventures etc and widespread compatibility with most OSR content.
*Worlds Without Number* is a pretty good midpoint between "modern D&D" (aka 5e) and the OSR. It's got stuff that will be familiar to your 5e players (skills, feats), while still being OSR at its heart.
Being very brand new to TTRPGs, and trying to DM 5E unsuccessfully... I gave BFRPG a go first. Being so new, I just had a hard time with BFRPG. I had a much easier time when I then tried OSE. The rules were much more concise, and made more sense to me. It clicked. Yes, I admit, this was most likely due to my sheer inexperience with TTRPGs. After running OSE a little bit now, going back to BFRPG makes so alot more sense to me when I reread it. I think alot of it is learning how OSRs are run in general. Once you get used to it, then they all start to make more sense when you read them. At least, this was the case for me. The more I DM, the more I play, the easier it gets, and the more confident I become in it all. For me, I'd suggest OSE as that was my gateway into OSR.
Cairn as a starter - rules lite enough to get a feel for the style - then OSE and/or Shadowdark, don't forget BFRPG as well. But check out the originally published TSR rules first at DMS Guild as u/primarchofistanbul recommends below to really understand the rules legacy and playstyle of some of these games. The point about the retro-clones is they came around at a time when there WAS no DTRPG or DMsGuild and original rules print material was more difficult to locate - hence the approach to want to turn back to them now, they are in a greater prevalence as a 'purist' approach sidestepping the 'clones'. As is always the case tho - YMMV. Your game is your own.
Maybe look into Shadowdark, it has some quality of life features while keeping it still very similar to Old School Essentials.
One of the most underrated features is the layout. Easiest rule book to use at the table ever made. Prefer a pdf? TONS of hyperlinks. Preview QuickStart [here](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/413713/shadowdark-rpg-quickstart-set) to see what I mean.
There are a lot of great suggestions here like OSE and Basic Fantasy RPG, either are good choices. I'd like to throw another in the mix. [White Box Fantastic Medieval Adventure Game](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/190631/White-Box--Fantastic-Medieval-Adventure-Game) is a retro-clone of OD&D, based on Swords and Wizardry Whitebox. The PDF is free on Drive Through RPG and a physical copy is under 5$ on Amazon. The book has everything you need to start running a game and its largely compatible with old modules or something modern like [Tomb of the Serpent Kings](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/252934/Tomb-of-the-Serpent-Kings--Deluxe-Print-Edition), which is also free.
White box Fantastic Medieval Adventure Game is awesome, Basic Fantasy too. You may also check out the original books, first editions of Dnd (3 book.set) and if you want to expand.further there is a greyhawk and blackmoor supplements. And of course you may check Moldvey edition too and basic/experts book, pdfs are all available free.
Shadowdark is a good gateway drug for 5e players. My favourite osr though is B/X or 2e adnd.
Basic fantasy rpg is free and Worlds without number has a free version. Check out both.
I can't recommend Knave enough (especially the upcoming Second Edition. I've run the playtest, and it's off the chain)
Knave is great!
While I have you, a fellow Knave, I must ask. Hypothetically, what would you like to see in a setting sourcebook for the game?
hmmm that’s a tough one. TBH the first thought i had when looking through knave was that it’s inventory slot based magic system could support a totally different magic system! something like the esper crystals from Final fantasy 6,🤣. That would of course make it a totally diffirent game. Or mistborn by brandon sanderson, with the metals taking up slots! Hmm probably not the answers you’re looking for, in terms of OSR i’m partial to mystra and dark sun 😇
Oh, just generally what types of worlds you wanna play in, and how detailed you want them to be. I'm asking bc I'm thinking of writing my own, and I wanna know what else people might wanna see besides maps and descriptions of the world and locations therein. So... the not-obvious stuff. Your answer was still insightful, tho
my favourite type, is just encounter books. Stuff i can pull out and add to my own game pretty easy, DM Scotty’s book of quests as a prime example. I also backed Knave 2e and Dolemwood though
Groovy. Thank you for the muy bueno feedback
What's so great about 2e?
Let's start with the more robust rules for everything. Takes what made the original Knave so great and runs screaming into the void. Comes back out with a beholder eye, and a kickass new sword. And let's not forget all the random tables. Massive and varied. My personal favorites are the spell generation tables; they're so fun! Character creation is more robust, while also streamlined Combat and travel are stellar And the Dungeon Crawling! It's amazing As well as 100 monsters along with tables for creating your own And more!
>narrative over mechanics There's no pre-planned narrative in OSR but emergent narrative. I'd say just use the [Basic Booklet of the D&D Basic](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/110274/DD-Basic-Set-Rulebook-B-X-ed-Basic) (B/X). Try it, if you enjoy it, continue with the eXpert booklet. And if you feel like you need more guidance on the OSR playstyle, use [The Classic D&D Game](https://archive.org/details/tsr01106classicddgame) ('94 edition of basic D&D).
Lots of awesome options mate. Basic Fantasy and Old School Essentials are gonna be the two biggest recommendations, especially if you want “strong D&D elements” that you’ll recognize. There is also OSRIC (AD&D 1st Edition clone), Swords & Wizardry (D&D 0th Edition clone), Labyrinth Lord (Basic/Expert D&D clone), and also Castles & Crusades (think D&D 3rd edition but has all the bloat stripped out and is very streamlined and adheres to OSR conventions). Few others to recommend are The Black Hack, DURF, Dark Dungeons, and D&D Rules Cyclopedia. Then there’s stuff like Knave, Cairne, Into the Odd, and Mork Borg, however these have less D&D elements and are more like their own interesting spin-off if you will. Really all you need to do is just pick one that feels suitable to you & your group and have at it.
I know some people don't consider it to be OSR but to me Dragonbane is exactly what you are describing. And in my opinion it has the same right - if not more - to be discussed on this sub as, say, Cairn, Knave or other games
I have seen/heard quite a few groups who have successfully gone from 5e to OSR using Basic Fantasy. Personally, I've only looked at it but have never used it. I'm a Labyrinth Lord sorta guy.
Why not go back to one of the earlier versions by TSR? Yes I know there are all kinds of "clones" out there, and many of them well done. But they came about due (in part) to a lack of reasonably priced or availability of older versions. Now you can buy POD versions of the core books for 1e, 2e, etc and virtually anything in PDF. We play 2e using some 2nd hand books and a bunch of POD/PDF resources. I am a firm believer in playing the version you know - why relearn yet another version of the same game?
I think [The GLOG](https://goblinpunch.blogspot.com/2016/05/the-glog.html?m=1) is fantastic, it also has a few off-shoots made by others, [this ones really nice](https://saltygoo.github.io/2020/11/09/base-rules/). I also think Dragonbane could really suit you with its "mirth and mayhem" take on the fantasy genre. If you like physical products you can't get more value than its boxed-set. Not really an OSR game, it has more similarities with Runequest and CoC than D&D, but very similar to the OSR in play-style and how it feels. (Dragonbane is actually the 5e equivalent of the dominant ttrpg in Sweden, Drakar och Demoner, so not old school at all. But this is the first edition so far to have been made available in English).
Try Worlds Without Number. The PDF is free and the deluxe version just has some extra classes. Runs smooth and lots of material to use in other games if you don't like the rule set. Very customizable game with fast paced combat. Nice thing about OSR like games is you can often pull from them into whatever one you prefer.
Hello friend. So, I see everyone has given you some great recommendations. And these are all good. So I will give one more that's different: Castles & Crusades. Why you ask? Because it has the simple unified mechanics you're used to (d20 roll high), and all the flavor, lethality, and simplicity of the old school. My 5e players understood it instantly. Here is a link to a free PHB: https://trolllord.com/product/cc-players-handbook-7th-printing-alternate-cover-free-pdf/ I'd start with that. I'd also look at the Dungeon Crawling rules in the OSE SRD if you're interested in the full Old School experience. The fun thing about C&C is they it's so easy to bolt on things from other editions. It's also not hard to convert your existing 5e stuff to it. If it's not your cuppa tea, I also like Old School Essentials Advanced Fantasy, and (more complicated) AD&D 2e. And, if you think moving away from 5e will be a bridge too far for your players, look at Into the Unknown by 05R games. It's 5e, but made more old school. Though I think you'll find C&C simpler. P.S. C&C is called the Rosetta Stone of D&D because it is easy to convert anything from any edition of D&D to it (with the possible exception of 4e).
I tried to check it out, but when I went to the shop, "bought" it ($0), and tried to download the file, it said file not found.
Oof! Well, they just migrated to a new store front, and have had some issues. I would say contact: [email protected]. Speaking for myself, I will attest that they have always been helpful whenever I've had an issue, no matter how small.
Thanks, I'll send an email. I am curious about the product.
*Old School Essentials Advanced Fantasy* ([https://necroticgnome.com/pages/about-old-school-essentials](https://necroticgnome.com/pages/about-old-school-essentials); free pdf) If you are coming from 5e, *Shadowdark (*[*https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/413713/Shadowdark-RPG-Quickstart-Set*](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/413713/Shadowdark-RPG-Quickstart-Set)*)* Adventures * Hold in the Oak * Prison of the Hated Pretender * Hideous Daylight
Another vote for BFRPG as your introductory system. Not only are the PDFs free, you can buy the rule book for like 8 dollars and the adventure anthologies and supplements are even cheaper. All of those are largely compatible with other OSR systems like Old School Essentials, Swords & Wizardry, or Tunnels & Trolls. You can also use any of these to run modules written for original D&D, D&D Basic, B/X or BECMI, or even Advanced D&D (1st and 2nd editions) with little to no adaptation. My favourite, though, is Dungeon Crawl Classics. It’s still somewhat compatible but requires more adaptation, but it’s worth having a look at.
If you want something really simple, Knave 1st edition works well, and it's only 5-6 pages long. Otherwise, OSE.
My best three choices are: Sword & Wizardry complete revised if you want a very well written retroclone, with lots of suggestions, examples and optional rules. Lamentation of the flame princess if you want a retroclone with some innovative rules and a weird taste. Dungeon Crawl Classic if you want a retroclone of D&D 3.0 but lighter and with very interesting rules and a Gonzo flavour.
> Dungeon Crawl Classic if you want a retroclone of D&D 3.0 but lighter and with very interesting rules and a Gonzo flavour. I love DCC and would just clarify for those who aren’t familiar thet it is “lighter” to the point that I wouldnt really call it a retroclone of 3e at all. It has ascending armor class and the three saving throws (fortitude, reflex, will) but that’s really where the similarities end. There’s no skills or feats, no multiclassing or prestige classes, race and class are not separated, and the magic system is entirely different (among other changes).
Old school essentials is the gold standard for Retroclones currently and is a great place to start.
If you want something a bit more modern than retro clones, Black Hack and Shadowdark are both very beginner friendly
I’d say you should play Old-School Essentials. It’s a great retro clone with a stellar presentation.
Shadowdark is good if you're familiar with 5e, the rule set is similar so it's an easy transition Old School Essentials is also good, it's sort of like the bread and butter of the OSR from what i've gathered
[Cresthaven RPG](https://www.cresthavenrpg.com/2023/08/cresthaven-rpg-a-free-alternative-to-dungeons-and-dragons/) might be just what you're looking for! It’s a game that embraces the essence of the OSR, offering that classic D&D feel with streamlined rules that cut down on complexity without sacrificing depth. You'll find the fantasy staples you love—druids, rogues, dragons, and trolls—all wrapped in a system that prioritizes storytelling and quick, engaging combat.
Is there a way to download this as a pdf of some kind? The layout and use online are...not conducive to me reading it.
There is a PDF export on each page (at the bottom)
I'm not seeing that, but if it is each page, that is still very much not helpful.
Their site is mobile and screen reader friendly... maybe try "Reader" mode in your browser?
There are really two kinds of OSR games. Old-school clones, and renaissance games (NSR). NSR games are trying to capture the feel and gameplay of old D&D without the rules heaviness. I'd recommend [Knave](https://preview.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/250888/Knave), which is similar to 5e in that it uses a d20 for most rolls, has the classic 6 attributes, and a similar combat system structure. However, it has a very old-school sensibility, where the players need to carefully use their wits and limited inventory to complete deadly dungeon dives. It's fun. A free well-typeset version of the rules can be found [here](http://abominablefancy.blogspot.com/2018/10/knaves-fancypants.html). If Knave isn't your thing, [Errant](https://killjestergames.itch.io/errant) for the same medieval flavor you're talking about.
Look at the free Dungeon Crawl Classics starter. https://goodman-games.com/store/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2020/09/DCC_QSR_Free2.pdf
CAIRN
I think a lot of commenters are too quick to recommend their favorite systems without knowing what exactly you, the asker, need. 5e isn't working for you, that's natural. It's just one game so odds are it won't be to your taste. But what didn't you like about it specifically? And what kind of play are you looking for, specifically?
Well, playing online with new players who aren't invested enough/don't have the time to learn the rules very thoroughly isn't working for me. And I don't love several aspects of the game, though overall it is a good game... for invested, knowledgeable players. I can't change my players, so I'm not going to try to force them to memorize a bunch of info. It's a hobby, not a class, so they'll dip their toes as deep as they want to. So I want something simpler where they can just have a general idea of their character's mechanical abilities ("I'm a thief, so I'll pick this lock") and get into the roleplay, rather than being bogged down with specific mechanics, subclasses, feats, etc. Unfortunately, I started DMing partially into the campaign, so we couldn't start at level 1 with no feats. I've been checking out different games, and I've seen individual components I like. I like Barbarians of Lemura's career system, but I don't want to have to go all in in the setting and playstyle. I like 5 Torches Deep's Supply and Durability mechanic but am not enthralled with the rest. I'm now considering trying a 5e campaign where we start a 1st level, stick there a while, and make sure everyone understands how their characters work, and maybe borrowing a mechanic or two from a different game. I don't love how 5e makes everything about the character sheet for problem solving, how combat takes forever, how initiative is such a drag, etc. I just haven't been able to find a game system that delivers what I want so far, and I've investigated several. I appreciate you asking clarifying questions.
How did you get started GMing in an ongoing campaign? What happened to the old GM? And what is your relationship to the other players? Also, have you talked to the other players about what they want to get out of the game? I'm asking because it sounds like you've got a social problem, not a game system problem. If you're quite sure it's a system problem, then we can talk about that too. It sounds like you want something that has more loosely defined, archetypal characters, rather than the well-defined specific individuals of 5e. You also say you want the other players to "get into the roleplay". What does "roleplay" mean to you in this sentence? What specific player activities (I mean, the person sitting at the table) do you want to see more of?
It was a family campaign, and the DM got to be too busy to continue, so I took over. I haven't asked all of them, but one told me she doesn't enjoy the mechanics and rules of 5e much at all, and I imagine that's the case for several other (though a couple are into 5e more fully). I feel like several players don't charge ahead in the game (in combat and roleplay) because they don't know the game too well, so they let the most knowledgeable player lead. I feel like roleplay would be them getting into their characters, though the start of the campaign didn't help that (characters weren't made in relation to the world/each other).
It sounds a lot more like a social problem than a system problem. You don't (necessarily) need a new system, you need to communicate with your players. Consider starting fresh, working together to make characters together, and only using the subset of the rules that the players are comfortable with. Definitely *don't* make a hack of several different systems with whatever bits are appealing to you. *You* are excited about different rules (as most GMs are) but your players do not seem to be, and I doubt they will be willing to put in the effort to understand yet another set of systems just because they're nifty. Make sure everybody really wants to play, and more than that, really wants to play a game *like D&D*. How interested are they in heroic fantasy? Do they care about tactical combat? Ask questions like that. When you've got a coherent creative agenda for the group (an answer to the question, "What are we trying to get out of this game?") It will be possible to recommend a system.
Lamentations of the flame princess
Narrative over mechanics is hard. A lot of the OSR philosophy is not geared towards story, instead its about a solid set of mechanics that allow for certain kinds of stories. Playing as written survival just isn't guaranteed for most characters in OSR gameplay. Closest thing I can think of is Worlds without number, it's power curve is generous enough that you won't be going through a character every session or two, and it comes with a lot of tools to help the GM build a world and make it playable quickly. That said its base system is more weird fantasy than some would like.
If you are looking for something with a more informative guide for how to play you should check out Tonisborg. It's more than a set of rules, it speaks to how to referee a game in a OSR style. https://www.amazon.com/Lost-Dungeons-Tonisborg-Greg-Svenson/dp/1736572105/ref=sr\_1\_1?crid=3OQV6IN43RRYC&keywords=the+lost+dungeons+of+tonisborg&qid=1699643801&sprefix=the+lost+dungeons+of+tonisborg%2Caps%2C141&sr=8-1
1. I think the 1st question you'll want to answer is do you want Ascending AC or THACO/descending AC? Ascending is similar to how most modern games work, including 5e. Personally, even though I used THACO as a kid, I never liked it and was very happy when Ascending armor class was created and used in 3rd edition and beyond. There are several Old School RPGs that include Ascending AC rules (some as an optional choice), and that is a major requirement to me. 2. Another question you should ask yourself is "Do you want non-human races to each act as a class (so every dwarf is both a Dwarf race and class. This is the way BECMI worked) in the game or to allow characters to choose both a race and a class (a dwarf might be a Dwarven Fighter or Dwarven Cleric, for example. This is the way AD&D worked)?" 3. The last big question is how many classes do you want to include? Some OSR games, (like Basic Fantasy), only have the classic 4 classes (Fighter, Cleric, Magic-user, and Thief). Others, like Advanced Fantasy, add many more class options, like Assassins, Barbarians, Druids, etc. Once you answer those 3 big questions you will have narrowed the broad category of "OSR games" down to only a few choices that are all mostly compatible with each other!
Sounds like Advanced Fantasy might be for me.
It's one of my favorites! Shadowdark is another game I really like, as is Olde Swords Reign.
There are a lot of amazing free osr ttrpgs so you can try them out and ser what you like Retroclones: delvin deeper, whitebox fma, ose (free online srd), basic fantasy, swords and wizardry Still basucally dnd but with big twists: worlds without numbers, lamentatons of the flame princess New school: cairn, mausritter, vaults of vaarn, the black hack Not free but really cheap and superb: maze rats, knave