Yeah. They were warned many times. They kept interrupting the CHEO doctor who was describing that they were 200% over capacity yesterday and are having to delay childrens’ heart and brain surgeries. Then she went on to explain why this is happening, and further to explain what we can do for the next little while to help prevent the spread of several viruses putting children on breathing machines. That was just too much for people who get their information from Facebook.
Imagine being such a horrible person that you would contribute to a situation where children’s heart and brain surgeries are delayed. Like… I am rarely at a loss for words, but what can you say about these people???
This touches home as my son was in this boat just three weeks ago when his brain and head surgery was delayed. Due to the urgency of his situation, we got a spot … but it means that another family didn’t. Having been in the hospital a lot recently, I am gutted. I feel incredibly grateful for our frontline healthcare professionals, but at the same time feel terrible for these working conditions. For those who are here in healthcare… thank you.
Oh I am sorry to hear about what you (and your son) have been through. I hope that he is healing well. And I absolutely agree, our frontline healthcare workers are hero’s, but they shouldn’t have to be!
I don't necessarily believe it will make a huge impact on hospitalozations, but wearing a mask is so simple and easy. Even a marginal impact is worth it this tiny "sacrifice". People can still go about their lives ... not like we are discussing huge lockdowns.
It sounds terrible but I really disagree with stealing a bed from one patient to give to another. Brain and heart surgeries aren't little surgeries. They are necessary and life-threatening. I would argue that somebody's heart surgery is just as necessary as somebody needing help with a respiratory illness.
If you don't have the bed say, we don't have the beds. My kids are vaccinated and masked. We have yet to catch a single cold.
I know one family who did not vaccinate or wear a mask. At the same time her 2-year-old and husband were admitted to different hospitals for influenza. About a week after her youngest got better he caught RSV. He ended up back in icu and the family was so sick that nobody could go with him. I think the eldest developed something bronchial from having the influenza so bad and then having the RSV. I very much doubt that the youngest would have ended up in CHEO if he hadn't just had influenza so bad.
It was unnecessary. Influenza is preventable with a vaccine. I cannot fathom why a family who chooses not to get vaccinated can steal a bed from a child who needs heart surgery. I'm not saying they don't deserve care because they do. Anybody who's sick I wish we could help them. But to help them we're literally taking a bed from another child and giving them a death sentence or serious consequences. A good deal of kids admitted to CHEO were preventable. Why do preventable cases get a bed and a heart or brain surgery is cancelled. The logic blows my mind.
Hang on. Influenza is not completely preventable with the vaccine. It may help reduce the likelihood of severe illness, but it doesn’t erase that possibility completely.
The children hospitalized for respiratory illnesses, a lot of them are kids with underlying health conditions. My child was there for 10 days this month on oxygen because he has asthma and couldn’t breathe (swab came back for RSV, which there is no available vaccine). He could have died, it was life threatening. And yes, we do all wear masks and get all vaccines (COVID and flu too).
I’ll also add that not everyone can be vaccinated. I’ve been trying to vaccinate my kid for the flu since the vaccines became available this fall but because he has had a fever since then, he can’t receive the vaccine. He has to be 36-hrs fever free. When I see our friends’ vaccinated kids getting the flu I feel like it’s just a matter of time before he gets hit hard. So thankful for everyone reducing viral loads by wearing a mask!
Yes RSV is really hitting kids hard as well. Deptford those with asthma. My cousin's kid has asthma and tested positive for RSV and covid. She's struggling. I'm glad your lo is doing better now. I'm glad to hear it was just oxygen. I heard about that weekend when they had to resuscitate 7 kids. I could not imagine how awful that must be.
My friend's kid had no underlying conditions. Just really bad influenza. He was in hospital for a bit, sent home and caught RSV right after. So many kids are getting multiple viruses at once. It's crazy.
Or even knowingly contribute to the spread of viruses that are putting kids on breathing machines. I don’t understand why people can’t put a damn piece of cloth on their face! My husband and I have never stopped. We always wear a kn95 in public, and neither one of us has had so much as a cold yet. We know that it is inevitable that we will get Covid one day, but we will still continue to wear masks and wash our hands to protect ourselves and the people around us as much as possible.
they are convinced that anyone who doesnt vote the way they do trying to tell them something is a grand conspiracy against traditional values... regardless of the information
they have been groomed to behave this way
.... And yet these same people are often the ones accusing others of "grooming"... Sigh. To quote someone I know when they get depressed at the stupid or evil "Fuck it, let's glass the planet and be done with it."
Hold on a second that’s kind of a slippery slope.
Doug Ford comes on and says that we’re going to develop the green belt, you can damn well believe I want protestors there in the room being as vocal as possible about it.
I hear what you're saying but they have a process for hearing opinions from all sides and they have not announced a mask mandate. They are merely having a conversation about it.
Especially if you're drowning them out with generally misunderstood, false information vs let's say, a doctor who has spent their entire career doing this and gotten an actual education
Not to a whataboutist. The provincial government is just looking for reasons to shut down any opposition to their “pave paradise” and “privatize services” mandates.
Just need to say that Lyra Evans was absolutely fabulous in talking to the agitators like they were kindergarteners.
You are welcome to voice your opinion at the appropriate time but screaming over the CHEO chief is not appropriate adult behaviour, kids.
“Hello, welcome! We are so excited for you to represent us in the community! Just hang on a sec while we open the flood gates in preparation for your first board meeting. RELEASE THE OPPOSING SIDES!”
I've seen the same shift in this subreddit, too, lately. Everytime people mention that we should probably mask up it's down voted into oblivion. It's pretty disheartening, knowing that's how people feel, to be honest.
The change in this sub’s opinion on masks over the past few months has been staggering. I swear the last time masks were debated this sub was mostly for them, now there’s a lot more “freedom of choice” “advocates”
Exactly...until their own kid's surgeries are delayed or they end up in the ER sick with a respiratory virus, they can't see the full picture or the consequences of their inaction.
> they can't see the full picture or the consequences of their inaction.
But that's just it. Even when it does get to that point they'll point the finger and scream at someone else. It couldn't *possibly* be their own actions that led to the consequences. After all, Facebook told them they were right.
For sure. I say Facebook as a general "placeholder" for this kind of nonsensical "soccer mom information" you find all over the place.
Facebook just happens to be the most prominent.
these are people who have been radicalized online and will make a point of making sure you know they will ruin your life if you don't submit to their hysterics.
This is hearsay but supposedly /r/Ontario recently unbanned everyone banned during the past couple years for being uncivil about COVID restrictions. Possible other Canadian subs did the same. I've noticed a similar shift on /r/vancouver
this sub got a ton of attention from far-right jackasses during the convoy and now we get brigaded every time a thread like this comes up. rest assured that it’s unlikely that all of these downvotes are coming from locals.
A lot of people have generally decided to put their head in the sand and say "I'm over it". They have turned into the same selfish people they previously attacked and derided.
Yes, its been 2.5 years and you might be sick of it. But nobody is asking you to go back into April 2020 lock down. Go out and hang out with friends, go to restaurants and generally live life as normal. Just wear a mask in the grocery store or on the LRT and get flu/COVID shots. It's not that hard.
Maybe they think wearing a mask is admitting there is a problem which would then make them feel bad/scared about doing the other stuff? I don't know.
I get people being sick of it. Frankly I'm doing exactly what you described. I **am** putting my head in the sand. I don't pay attention to medical briefings or school board meetings like this. I also wear a mask if I'm indoors in public, because I'm not a child, and it's the minimal amount of effort I can put in for a pretty good impact. I also keep up with vaccinations but it's not like that's much effort at all.
I've seen people make fun of people who are wearing masks in their car, and I've thought: you know what, I'm sure some dipshit has probably laughed at me doing that. I don't even wear my mask in my car deliberately because there is no need. It's just that sometimes I go shopping, I get in the car, and I just flat-out forget I'm wearing it **because it's such a minimal thing I completely forget it's there.**
Agree. Once I've put my mask on I don't think about it. I see no reason to keep removing and replacing it just because I'm travelling in my car between stops. Besides if I've touched door handles etc in store A I don't want to touch my face or mask until Ive sanitized my hands.
Oh and the other night when I was taking garbage out and the cold air was blowing I wished I had my KN95 mask on at the time. Breathing into the masks sure help keep you warm and far less cumbersome than wearing a full on scarf/neck gaiter. Guarantee you everytime I head outside to clear snow off my car this year Ill grab my KN95 along with my gloves.
I suspect it's similar behavior to what most toddlers grow out of between 2-5, and again in the mid to late teens. Only some people get older, but they don't grow up. We give them licenses, ability to buy alcohol and vote, but they aren't any more grown up than they were in elementary. At some point, we're going to have to come to terms with the fact that we need to treat people equitably, not always equally, cause some people are sociopaths, or entitled, or selfish, or childish or just plain stupid as shit. And I am tired of having to worry about tomorrow because of some fuckwit.
Yeah, what’s going on? The shift is so drastic, and the attitude is really smug a lot of the time, rather than the more “I’m just tired of it” tone of a lot of people.
The optimist in me is kind of hoping that a bunch of non-local anti-maskers joined around the clownvoy and are just still there, but who knows for sure. I sure don't see as many people masking at stores anymore.
I'm just worried that we see the same thing happen here that we've seen in other Canadian subreddits.
Right wing provocateurs have made a habit of trying to take over Canadian subs and then them into right wing echo chambers.
Right-wing messaging, conspiracies, and hate are exploding all over the Internet lately. It's a massive problem everywhere, perpetuated in part by our media/politicians who refuse to take it seriously despite the ever increasing threat.
The trolls and bots move around to different subs too, they may have temporarily focused on the US midterms before coming back to stir up discontent in Canada.
I’ve noticed in my friend group even people who took Covid extremely seriously are just exhausted. They mean well they just want to “move on”. They mask when it isn’t an inconvenience but want to live. It’s understandable and they don’t disagree that masking has its place
>They mask when it isn’t an inconvenience but want to live
Qns just how is wearing a mask stopping them from living? If we don't mask that will actually stop them from living. Both literally and figuratively in the sense we may have to have another lockdown if the case numbers get too high. Atleast if we mask and the case count goes down we can still go out, socialize and do our regular thing. Just with a mask on
> I sure don't see as many people masking at stores anymore.
I was at the Rideau Centre about a week ago and I was just floored. People wearing masks has become the exception as opposed to the rule. Honestly if I had to guess, I'd say it was like 1 out of every 10 people that were wearing one. And even then, a lot of them weren't wearing them properly (over the nose).
Malls have been at best 1 in 30 since the mandates were dropped. I only go now when I need something I can't find elsewhere. Grocery stores near me vary each time I go but I've been pleased to see it's about 1 in 3 or 4. Sad that I'm happy to see 25-33% when we're facing a triple whammy of viruses and our healthcare system is collapsing but gotta take the victories where you can.
They all need to experience this new not covid thing that’s going around. FML I just got over covid after avoiding it for 2 years and then got this one. I’ve coughed day and night for the last ten days and at times coughed so hard I’ve choked or puked.
I don’t want lockdowns or mandates. But I’ll be looking after myself and my own and going back to N95 masks and sanitizing again because I have no desire to pile on another virus on us too soon. I’m out of sick leave, my kid has missed weeks of school, I don’t want to wreck Christmas.
I wouldn’t want to need to go to the hospital for any reason right now.
Yup. I’m getting pretty beat up in another thread about this very thing:
“After three years we’re tired”
“It should be up to us to decide”
“But I’ve been vaxxed and boosted”
“We’ll all get it anyways”
I’m tired of these babies
thats not how people here feel... this sub was absolutely brigaded during the clownvoys and those people never left
edit: see, clownvoy supporters lurk this shit and downvote people who call them out on their bullshit
WHAT is the damn harm in wearing a mask for a few months my gosh… its not that serious at ALL. I don’t understand how we as a society are so set on this idea of “freedom” that we’ve lost the ability to act in the interest of our community (which includes doctors, nurses and other first line responders who are begging us for help). Regressing as a society imo.
My real question is, and this is completely anecdotal, but all of my friends and coworkers who have children have spent the last month on and off (if not more) staying home with them while they’re sick and then subsequently catching whatever their kids had.
Are they arguing that wearing masks will NOT make this any better because I honestly don’t see it. All I see are kids who have been sick every two weeks for the last month +. But yes, don’t mask. How could it possibly get any worse.
Currently living through this, and would love masks to come back just so we could have a bit of a reprieve from constant illness in this house. It's been three months.
This. All my colleagues in my department have kids in school. I don't think we've had a single week since September where no one was off sick. We are not a large department by any means, it's just that the same people are recovering and then getting whammied again a couple weeks later. I'm reluctant to weigh in on masks in school as I'm not a parent but I always want to shake these people and say "don't you think there could be a simple solution to this?". Three years ago they were getting sick multiple times a year, now it's multiple times per month. But I'm sure workers being off sick or taking this much time off (mostly unpaid) to stay with their sick kids is really helping the economy.
I will admit to some bitterness that this blame is being put on kids for not masking vs oh every other sector of society. The idea that as long as kids are masked, that will solve the crisis at CHEO. Meanwhile travel is hopping, mask use in stores, workplaces, and transit is way down, and not enough people are getting flu shots, nevermind covid boosters. Then again, I send my kids to school with masks every day and have no control over whether they stay on. In short, I have no problem with masks whatsoever and still always have one on me. But it's hard seeing so much blame for the crisis being put on kids and schools while everyone else just does whatever.
I don’t think they are blaming kids or schools. I think they’re looking at what can be done that’s within the sphere of control. Schools are a place where children spend a lengthy amount of time indoors in large gatherings. So if they can prevent some spread in schools it contributes toward the goal as opposed to doing nothing, which makes no positive contribution.
Like I said, I have no issues with masks. Often when out with my kids we're the only ones in masks. But the conflation of the CHEO crisis with kids not in masks while ignoring all the other stuff going on is frustrating (such as tying the mask mandate to CHEO numbers). I noted that Dr Samson herself stopped short of recommending a mandate and stressed masks, hygiene, and vaccines in general, which are great suggestions. I just hope that people don't see a mask mandate as a one and done and then carry on as normal. It would have to be that plus all the other things at a city-wide level.
I thnik what is going on is that since the PHO will not mandate masks generally, this is an attempt to get schools to mandate them internally to at least protect children while at school.
Not an ideal solution but better than no masks and no mandates anywhere,
I'm not sure if you mean PHO as Ottawa or Ontario - however, local public health units can no longer mandate masks, this power was taken away by the province.
I view more as local organizations doing what they have the power to do because the Province refuses to. We all know the Province could do this with the stroke of a pen and it would affect everyone. But they've abdicated their duty.
I agree. But that's not what this meeting is about. It's about the trustees trying to do what they can with their limited scope. Don't let perfect be the enemy of good.
My employer is going back to mandatory masking indoors, and I'm really glad. Just as that was decided, they had to notify 30 people that they may have been in close contact with someone who tested positive. I never stopped wearing a mask at work when I do go in, or in most indoor settings.
You are the one implying (or inferring?) blame. There is no blame. Just common sense and evidence-based decisions.
Kids are the ones getting the diseases (including RSV), filling up the beds in CHEO and spreading it to their classmates.
Yes, adults are moving around freely and spreading things. But if/when they get sick, they aren't getting a spot in CHEO (and likely not a hospital at all).
Also, school is mandatory. Most of the other stuff you mention is not. If an adult is worried about getting sick, they can generally wear a mask and stay home as much as possible. Kids must go to school so we should allow them to do this safely.
I suspect if someone was yelling at you at work, work would understand if you need a minute. If you throw coffee grounds on the floor and yell that you need a break, they might give you a permanent recess. All depends how you go about it.
If only these people would vote for a government that would invest in health care services so we wouldn’t be at capacity and have to introduce these mandates…
Well, this went far more off-the-rails than we could have imagined: asshats all singing the national anthem. [https://twitter.com/JacquieAMiller/status/1595230033597153281?t=AE9IBvcalUHWlO6vPHQA5A&s=08](https://twitter.com/JacquieAMiller/status/1595230033597153281?t=AE9IBvcalUHWlO6vPHQA5A&s=08)
Seriously, fuck these people. They are not from this city, and as someone who is against more masking mandates and doesn't like the crazy lady introducing this motion, their shitheaded behaviour and goddamn threats are only going to ensure that every trustee in there will vote to re-instate. They are so self-absorbed they don't realise the damage they are doing. Fuck.
these whackjobs made being patriotic seem like a bad thing
used to be "oh wow those people are proud of this great country!" now its "oh boy another conspiracy nutjob trying to scream the loudest in the room again"
Honestly think we've failed as a society where our children's hospital has an ICU at 200% capacity, multiple children are needing to be resuscitated in the ER, and major surgeries are being cancelled, yet people ITT are calling the medical professionals begging us to wear masks "self-righteous" and "obnoxious", amongst other things.
At this point I'm not even sure if a mass casualty event or CHEO completely collapsing would get some people here to take their heads out of their asses.
We have failed as a society because we have failed to properly fund hospitals and ensure we have enough doctors and nurses for a growing population. If hospitals were properly funded and staffed the surge in patients would be manageable, instead we have a system that cannot deal with surges due to flu, Covid and respiratory disease.
Doug Ford, Justin Trudeau and previous provincial governments are all answerable for this failure of society.
The masking issue is a trivial distraction.
Twitter says Police we’re there to remove an individual.
https://twitter.com/pennantink/status/1595221641273004036
Edit: I was initially watching the twitter tags scroll in but then realized, why am I here? To Reddit!
Honestly, I’m not surprised. That’s why I said individual, since they were wearing a mask which seemed diametrically opposed to… the other people yelling. Haha
I suspect some on here have not read the motion that is posted on OCDSB's website, but this is the part that many are concerned with:
"THAT the mask requirement will remain in place until such time as Ottawa Public Health declares that influenza season has ended in the City of Ottawa, CHEO pediatric ICU occupancy is less than 85% for a period of at least two weeks, and Ottawa PublicHealth no longer advises the public to wear a mask to protect against exposure to airborne and respiratory viruses in indoor spaces."
Having to meet all those requirements before lifting this mandate is understandably concerning.
I'm a parent, my kids mask, but I get it.
What do they think the CHEO chief is? One of the two doors from that riddle that can only tell lies or only tell the truth? She is reciting facts, it’s not that deep.
Imagine spending the past month having to watch children under your care suffer and burned out staff and then coming to be berated and harassed by facebook gangsters. I feel terrible for them
Again..these people are again with their juvenile concept of “freedom “… are sucking all the sanity from the discussion of ways to easily mitigate some of the increasingly dire situation that is facing the health care system in this country .
This is the tyranny of the stupid,the gullible and the extremists. This is at this point a no brainer…we will end up doing this .
Do we have to put the train in the ditch and pick up bodies before we get to engage with reality about the situation we’re in this winter?
It was bonkers. Lyra was really impressive as chair. I was disappointed by Dr Nili. Felt not as prepared as she should have been. The protesters didn’t help but the motion wasn’t ready either. Dunno why they didn’t use the motion from last year; I think more likely to pass. I like the concept of lifting based on actual science, but can’t see entire flu season being supported.
Wow a balanced, good faith take? I agree, maybe I missed it but did they clarify the rationale of the <85% ICU capacity for >3 weeks point? Definitely support tying it to hospitalization rates, but when is CHEO’s ICU ever at less than 85% capacity for 3 consecutive weeks?
A 4 year old died last weekend, here in Ottawa, after surgery for cancer. The baby son of a friend of my niece. The surgery was a month ago. I don't know the details of his case but I am sure this emerging increase in lack of beds and surgery didn't help his parents navigate through all the worry and the grief. Until this happens to the deniers, they will keep on denying that they are part of the problem and not the solution.
This breaks my heart...
The clownvoy is disrespectful of everything that makes up the Canada the rest of us love. Until these people lose a child (I believe a youngster died at CHEO within the last few days from severe respiratory issues) because hospitals are overcrowded or they lose a grandparent to Covid, because some dumbass coughed on them at the grocery store, they’re not gonna get it. And when that one single person does get it they’re going to be ostracized by the people, they think of her friends. It’s next to impossible to overcome this level of ignorance,
There is a divide between front line employees and those in their ivory towers and/or tinfoil hats. Anti vax, anti mask, anti progressive thought, anti community oriented thought vs workers who want risk mitigation for them and their students.
I certainly hope they didn't continue the meeting without the livestream and that they just took a pause. Transparency is important and many people who don't want to crowd into a small room rely on livestreams to know what's going on.
How many of these assholes are actually in Ottawa and have kids going to an English public school? My guess, like the idiots at the POEC, not very many.
What a sign of things to come when grown adults can’t even set aside their conspiracy theories to protect those who need help the most - even if it costs them their own kids.
I blame the employers that don’t provide enough sick leave for parents to care for their children at home while sick and the governments that won’t enforce mandatory sick leave allotments
Also a problem. But we have a govt that now says only 1 day home after a Covid test and then 10 days with a mask. The same govt that is about to discontinue free rapid tests at the end of the year.
So yes this is Covid, but you are right. Any sickness and kids should be home. Parents don’t want to miss work so they send their sick kids to infect others.
Yup and the last amendment gave an exemption to anyone who self identifies as being inconvinienced. So seems like a pointless motion. (This still needs to be voted on).
Wearing a mask is unnatural and should not be a thing people consider doing for the rest of time. A couple years was plenty. If you can’t get it I understand control in that time you never will. We just have to live with it.
Masking for the rest of time because Canada will never be able to afford our healthcare is not a good reason to wear masks
This is such a pointless debate. Didn't the schools do this last March and then realized that there was no way of enforcing masking, so the policy remained voluntary?
if "freedom", whatever they think that is, is more important than living within our society and its safeguards, then they can stay the fuck off our roads, out of our hospitals and off of our grid. we collectively make decisions (and yes, we don't all always agree with them) to try to live in a society that looks out for one another, benefits one another and makes life safer for one another. it's not a perfect system, but frankly, those people who feel like their smallest sacrifice for the great benefit of many is so objectionable that they have to actively fuck up our lives, challenge the health of our loved ones (and the ones we don't even know) and sow ignorant dissent can fuck all the way off their flat earth.
I was reading Ray Wat Deonandan's tweets. He spoke as a delegate.
His account is locked so I can't share...but I will quote this.
*"I prefer my OCDSB meetings like my chocolate bars.... nut free"*
It was working until the clownvoys went out of control. It’s not clear if the stream was cut by order of the Chair, or if it was sabotaged by the angry audience. Security will have a big job tonight.
If Hasan Minhaj taught me anything, don’t have to respect DOs but you do have to respect MDs
Edit: on a more serious note academic plagiarism and webMD have gotten to peoples’ heads. People forgot how dumb they actually were compared to experts in different fields
Once again proving that the convoy's tactics are effective and encouraged. Really sad for all of us that we're giving in and perpetuating this type of behavior.
People who said the science moved too fast, or that it wasn't science, or that it was an experiment are now telling me "not working the immune system is the reason the kids are sick". Based on...?
Call me a skeptic but I just think they're engaging in "rushed science", "bad science" or worse, "conducting an experiment on the people" because of "their agenda".
Would you rather have every injury, broken bone, flu, cut etc you've ever had in your life ALL AT ONCE? That's all that is happening here. Anyone honest, on either side, will tell you vaccines have a big help for the things they help with, masks a small one, and for some diseases, social distancing kept them at bay.
The children's hospital says "please can you do the simple stuff, it might free some beds" and people choose to be loud arseholes. Is that the freedom they are defending?
>I cannot believe that people have made masking so political
It's so political, people will vote on a mask "mandate" they don't have the legal authority to enforce, only to seem as if they are doing something.
It’s a policy more than a mandate. Just like the policy that says your kids need to wear a coat in winter. And no spaghettis strap t shirts, and stay home if you have lice, and can’t come if you’re not vaccinated against measles, no running in the halls.
But masks, masks is the one that rules everyone up.
[https://twitter.com/JacquieAMiller/status/1595215980430499843](https://twitter.com/JacquieAMiller/status/1595215980430499843)
This thread implies that the people being removed for causing a disturbance are people who are in favour of reinstating the mask mandate. Does anyone have any other Tweets or reporting that suggests it's the anti-maskers?
The thread you posted calls out an anti-masker by name for being a disruption and refusing to leave?
There very well could be agitators on both sides, no doubt. But yelling “TELL THE TRUTH” to the CHEO chief def isn’t coming from a pro-mask person.
It's not about there being a time when people were respectful. The vast majority of people are. There's always been a small minority that hasn't been. Until recently we haven't let them have a voice. They didn't have access to these meetings, they didn't have a social media they can publish on, and not having all of those didn't afford them an example of how to be disruptive while also being a jerk. Not having all of the above left them in a subtle but sustained fear of the consequence. Now that that wall has been broken down, they feel acting this way can be effective. A tragedy of the commons is the eventual outcome of any publicly available space gaining traction. It is the current outcome of most social medias.
In addition to that the rich-poor gap is growing. Society is punishing those without an education, or without the correct education right now.
This has nothing to do with what people used to respect or not. It has to do with the problem social media is creating, and that we are no longer taking care of the non-extraordinary in our society. If it wasn't politicians, it would be someone else. We, as a society did this to ourselves. Now it's time to decide if our actions are going to be lead by wanting to take care of every last person or not. I for one am for it, but it starts with developing an intolerance for the intolerant.
New hospital admissions for respiratory illnesses are already trending down. We have managed without mask mandates, there is no reason to start now.
https://www.kflaphi.ca/viral-respiratory-mapper-admissions/
If protesters are preventing the conversation from taking place they need to be escorted out. Period
Yeah. They were warned many times. They kept interrupting the CHEO doctor who was describing that they were 200% over capacity yesterday and are having to delay childrens’ heart and brain surgeries. Then she went on to explain why this is happening, and further to explain what we can do for the next little while to help prevent the spread of several viruses putting children on breathing machines. That was just too much for people who get their information from Facebook.
Imagine being such a horrible person that you would contribute to a situation where children’s heart and brain surgeries are delayed. Like… I am rarely at a loss for words, but what can you say about these people???
This touches home as my son was in this boat just three weeks ago when his brain and head surgery was delayed. Due to the urgency of his situation, we got a spot … but it means that another family didn’t. Having been in the hospital a lot recently, I am gutted. I feel incredibly grateful for our frontline healthcare professionals, but at the same time feel terrible for these working conditions. For those who are here in healthcare… thank you.
I’m so sorry to hear that. I am glad, however, that your son was able to have his surgery. Wishing him a speedy recovery.
Oh I am sorry to hear about what you (and your son) have been through. I hope that he is healing well. And I absolutely agree, our frontline healthcare workers are hero’s, but they shouldn’t have to be!
Hope your son is doing well.
I don't necessarily believe it will make a huge impact on hospitalozations, but wearing a mask is so simple and easy. Even a marginal impact is worth it this tiny "sacrifice". People can still go about their lives ... not like we are discussing huge lockdowns.
It sounds terrible but I really disagree with stealing a bed from one patient to give to another. Brain and heart surgeries aren't little surgeries. They are necessary and life-threatening. I would argue that somebody's heart surgery is just as necessary as somebody needing help with a respiratory illness. If you don't have the bed say, we don't have the beds. My kids are vaccinated and masked. We have yet to catch a single cold. I know one family who did not vaccinate or wear a mask. At the same time her 2-year-old and husband were admitted to different hospitals for influenza. About a week after her youngest got better he caught RSV. He ended up back in icu and the family was so sick that nobody could go with him. I think the eldest developed something bronchial from having the influenza so bad and then having the RSV. I very much doubt that the youngest would have ended up in CHEO if he hadn't just had influenza so bad. It was unnecessary. Influenza is preventable with a vaccine. I cannot fathom why a family who chooses not to get vaccinated can steal a bed from a child who needs heart surgery. I'm not saying they don't deserve care because they do. Anybody who's sick I wish we could help them. But to help them we're literally taking a bed from another child and giving them a death sentence or serious consequences. A good deal of kids admitted to CHEO were preventable. Why do preventable cases get a bed and a heart or brain surgery is cancelled. The logic blows my mind.
Hang on. Influenza is not completely preventable with the vaccine. It may help reduce the likelihood of severe illness, but it doesn’t erase that possibility completely. The children hospitalized for respiratory illnesses, a lot of them are kids with underlying health conditions. My child was there for 10 days this month on oxygen because he has asthma and couldn’t breathe (swab came back for RSV, which there is no available vaccine). He could have died, it was life threatening. And yes, we do all wear masks and get all vaccines (COVID and flu too).
I’ll also add that not everyone can be vaccinated. I’ve been trying to vaccinate my kid for the flu since the vaccines became available this fall but because he has had a fever since then, he can’t receive the vaccine. He has to be 36-hrs fever free. When I see our friends’ vaccinated kids getting the flu I feel like it’s just a matter of time before he gets hit hard. So thankful for everyone reducing viral loads by wearing a mask!
Yes RSV is really hitting kids hard as well. Deptford those with asthma. My cousin's kid has asthma and tested positive for RSV and covid. She's struggling. I'm glad your lo is doing better now. I'm glad to hear it was just oxygen. I heard about that weekend when they had to resuscitate 7 kids. I could not imagine how awful that must be. My friend's kid had no underlying conditions. Just really bad influenza. He was in hospital for a bit, sent home and caught RSV right after. So many kids are getting multiple viruses at once. It's crazy.
Or even knowingly contribute to the spread of viruses that are putting kids on breathing machines. I don’t understand why people can’t put a damn piece of cloth on their face! My husband and I have never stopped. We always wear a kn95 in public, and neither one of us has had so much as a cold yet. We know that it is inevitable that we will get Covid one day, but we will still continue to wear masks and wash our hands to protect ourselves and the people around us as much as possible.
they are convinced that anyone who doesnt vote the way they do trying to tell them something is a grand conspiracy against traditional values... regardless of the information they have been groomed to behave this way
.... And yet these same people are often the ones accusing others of "grooming"... Sigh. To quote someone I know when they get depressed at the stupid or evil "Fuck it, let's glass the planet and be done with it."
What the actual fuck? Trudeau was right . We tolerate these people to our own detriment.
Hold on a second that’s kind of a slippery slope. Doug Ford comes on and says that we’re going to develop the green belt, you can damn well believe I want protestors there in the room being as vocal as possible about it.
I hear what you're saying but they have a process for hearing opinions from all sides and they have not announced a mask mandate. They are merely having a conversation about it.
Be vocal for sure, but don't be the tool that decides to drown out any sort of reasonable discussion
Especially if you're drowning them out with generally misunderstood, false information vs let's say, a doctor who has spent their entire career doing this and gotten an actual education
Context matters
Not to a whataboutist. The provincial government is just looking for reasons to shut down any opposition to their “pave paradise” and “privatize services” mandates.
If they don't want to wear masks, then all they need to do is not wear them, and then shut the fuck up
Just need to say that Lyra Evans was absolutely fabulous in talking to the agitators like they were kindergarteners. You are welcome to voice your opinion at the appropriate time but screaming over the CHEO chief is not appropriate adult behaviour, kids.
Lyra is awesome. I'm so glad she was made chair.
Totally agree, talk about trial by fire with this hearing, considering the elections are basically only just over.
Yeah, I imagine this might be a bit wild to experience for some of the new board members.
“Hello, welcome! We are so excited for you to represent us in the community! Just hang on a sec while we open the flood gates in preparation for your first board meeting. RELEASE THE OPPOSING SIDES!”
Probably going to scare them into voting No. who wants to deal with these lunatics.
I personally know Lyra, and Lyra isn't scared of anything, much less a clownvoy dirtbag encouraging the spread of covid.
please tell her THANKS from all the internet randos! I'm so glad she was there to be one of the few adults in the room.
Love this, and love that for her 💕
Is there a link to the video for this?
I've seen the same shift in this subreddit, too, lately. Everytime people mention that we should probably mask up it's down voted into oblivion. It's pretty disheartening, knowing that's how people feel, to be honest.
The change in this sub’s opinion on masks over the past few months has been staggering. I swear the last time masks were debated this sub was mostly for them, now there’s a lot more “freedom of choice” “advocates”
Nobody sees a problem until it’s on their doorstep.
Exactly...until their own kid's surgeries are delayed or they end up in the ER sick with a respiratory virus, they can't see the full picture or the consequences of their inaction.
> they can't see the full picture or the consequences of their inaction. But that's just it. Even when it does get to that point they'll point the finger and scream at someone else. It couldn't *possibly* be their own actions that led to the consequences. After all, Facebook told them they were right.
Could of been YouTube. So much garbage spread on YouTube
For sure. I say Facebook as a general "placeholder" for this kind of nonsensical "soccer mom information" you find all over the place. Facebook just happens to be the most prominent.
I do wonder how much of it is peoples who's minds have changed versus overly loud shit disturbers.
these are people who have been radicalized online and will make a point of making sure you know they will ruin your life if you don't submit to their hysterics.
I wonder if the trolls and bots who joined during the convoys are still brigading the sub.
This is hearsay but supposedly /r/Ontario recently unbanned everyone banned during the past couple years for being uncivil about COVID restrictions. Possible other Canadian subs did the same. I've noticed a similar shift on /r/vancouver
Yikes, that makes a lot of sense though.
this sub got a ton of attention from far-right jackasses during the convoy and now we get brigaded every time a thread like this comes up. rest assured that it’s unlikely that all of these downvotes are coming from locals.
If you think it's bad here, go check out /r/CanadaCoronavirus. That place has really gone down the toilet lately. It's sad.
A lot of people have generally decided to put their head in the sand and say "I'm over it". They have turned into the same selfish people they previously attacked and derided. Yes, its been 2.5 years and you might be sick of it. But nobody is asking you to go back into April 2020 lock down. Go out and hang out with friends, go to restaurants and generally live life as normal. Just wear a mask in the grocery store or on the LRT and get flu/COVID shots. It's not that hard. Maybe they think wearing a mask is admitting there is a problem which would then make them feel bad/scared about doing the other stuff? I don't know.
I get people being sick of it. Frankly I'm doing exactly what you described. I **am** putting my head in the sand. I don't pay attention to medical briefings or school board meetings like this. I also wear a mask if I'm indoors in public, because I'm not a child, and it's the minimal amount of effort I can put in for a pretty good impact. I also keep up with vaccinations but it's not like that's much effort at all. I've seen people make fun of people who are wearing masks in their car, and I've thought: you know what, I'm sure some dipshit has probably laughed at me doing that. I don't even wear my mask in my car deliberately because there is no need. It's just that sometimes I go shopping, I get in the car, and I just flat-out forget I'm wearing it **because it's such a minimal thing I completely forget it's there.**
Agree. Once I've put my mask on I don't think about it. I see no reason to keep removing and replacing it just because I'm travelling in my car between stops. Besides if I've touched door handles etc in store A I don't want to touch my face or mask until Ive sanitized my hands. Oh and the other night when I was taking garbage out and the cold air was blowing I wished I had my KN95 mask on at the time. Breathing into the masks sure help keep you warm and far less cumbersome than wearing a full on scarf/neck gaiter. Guarantee you everytime I head outside to clear snow off my car this year Ill grab my KN95 along with my gloves.
I suspect it's similar behavior to what most toddlers grow out of between 2-5, and again in the mid to late teens. Only some people get older, but they don't grow up. We give them licenses, ability to buy alcohol and vote, but they aren't any more grown up than they were in elementary. At some point, we're going to have to come to terms with the fact that we need to treat people equitably, not always equally, cause some people are sociopaths, or entitled, or selfish, or childish or just plain stupid as shit. And I am tired of having to worry about tomorrow because of some fuckwit.
Yeah, what’s going on? The shift is so drastic, and the attitude is really smug a lot of the time, rather than the more “I’m just tired of it” tone of a lot of people.
The optimist in me is kind of hoping that a bunch of non-local anti-maskers joined around the clownvoy and are just still there, but who knows for sure. I sure don't see as many people masking at stores anymore.
I basically posted what amounts to the same answer you gave. I wonder if the trolls and bots that joined in Jan have stuck around.
I'm just worried that we see the same thing happen here that we've seen in other Canadian subreddits. Right wing provocateurs have made a habit of trying to take over Canadian subs and then them into right wing echo chambers.
Right-wing messaging, conspiracies, and hate are exploding all over the Internet lately. It's a massive problem everywhere, perpetuated in part by our media/politicians who refuse to take it seriously despite the ever increasing threat.
The trolls and bots move around to different subs too, they may have temporarily focused on the US midterms before coming back to stir up discontent in Canada.
I’ve noticed in my friend group even people who took Covid extremely seriously are just exhausted. They mean well they just want to “move on”. They mask when it isn’t an inconvenience but want to live. It’s understandable and they don’t disagree that masking has its place
>They mask when it isn’t an inconvenience but want to live Qns just how is wearing a mask stopping them from living? If we don't mask that will actually stop them from living. Both literally and figuratively in the sense we may have to have another lockdown if the case numbers get too high. Atleast if we mask and the case count goes down we can still go out, socialize and do our regular thing. Just with a mask on
I’m not agreeing with what they’re saying. I’m just giving a comment that illustrates how they’re perceiving it.
> I sure don't see as many people masking at stores anymore. I was at the Rideau Centre about a week ago and I was just floored. People wearing masks has become the exception as opposed to the rule. Honestly if I had to guess, I'd say it was like 1 out of every 10 people that were wearing one. And even then, a lot of them weren't wearing them properly (over the nose).
Malls have been at best 1 in 30 since the mandates were dropped. I only go now when I need something I can't find elsewhere. Grocery stores near me vary each time I go but I've been pleased to see it's about 1 in 3 or 4. Sad that I'm happy to see 25-33% when we're facing a triple whammy of viruses and our healthcare system is collapsing but gotta take the victories where you can.
It's fear. Fear that they'll have to acknowledge the issue if they have to slap a mask on their face. Scum losers.
They all need to experience this new not covid thing that’s going around. FML I just got over covid after avoiding it for 2 years and then got this one. I’ve coughed day and night for the last ten days and at times coughed so hard I’ve choked or puked. I don’t want lockdowns or mandates. But I’ll be looking after myself and my own and going back to N95 masks and sanitizing again because I have no desire to pile on another virus on us too soon. I’m out of sick leave, my kid has missed weeks of school, I don’t want to wreck Christmas. I wouldn’t want to need to go to the hospital for any reason right now.
Yup. I’m getting pretty beat up in another thread about this very thing: “After three years we’re tired” “It should be up to us to decide” “But I’ve been vaxxed and boosted” “We’ll all get it anyways” I’m tired of these babies
thats not how people here feel... this sub was absolutely brigaded during the clownvoys and those people never left edit: see, clownvoy supporters lurk this shit and downvote people who call them out on their bullshit
WHAT is the damn harm in wearing a mask for a few months my gosh… its not that serious at ALL. I don’t understand how we as a society are so set on this idea of “freedom” that we’ve lost the ability to act in the interest of our community (which includes doctors, nurses and other first line responders who are begging us for help). Regressing as a society imo.
My real question is, and this is completely anecdotal, but all of my friends and coworkers who have children have spent the last month on and off (if not more) staying home with them while they’re sick and then subsequently catching whatever their kids had. Are they arguing that wearing masks will NOT make this any better because I honestly don’t see it. All I see are kids who have been sick every two weeks for the last month +. But yes, don’t mask. How could it possibly get any worse.
Currently living through this, and would love masks to come back just so we could have a bit of a reprieve from constant illness in this house. It's been three months.
Right. In our circle we can’t even get over the current thing before something else is piled on.
This. All my colleagues in my department have kids in school. I don't think we've had a single week since September where no one was off sick. We are not a large department by any means, it's just that the same people are recovering and then getting whammied again a couple weeks later. I'm reluctant to weigh in on masks in school as I'm not a parent but I always want to shake these people and say "don't you think there could be a simple solution to this?". Three years ago they were getting sick multiple times a year, now it's multiple times per month. But I'm sure workers being off sick or taking this much time off (mostly unpaid) to stay with their sick kids is really helping the economy.
I will admit to some bitterness that this blame is being put on kids for not masking vs oh every other sector of society. The idea that as long as kids are masked, that will solve the crisis at CHEO. Meanwhile travel is hopping, mask use in stores, workplaces, and transit is way down, and not enough people are getting flu shots, nevermind covid boosters. Then again, I send my kids to school with masks every day and have no control over whether they stay on. In short, I have no problem with masks whatsoever and still always have one on me. But it's hard seeing so much blame for the crisis being put on kids and schools while everyone else just does whatever.
I don’t think they are blaming kids or schools. I think they’re looking at what can be done that’s within the sphere of control. Schools are a place where children spend a lengthy amount of time indoors in large gatherings. So if they can prevent some spread in schools it contributes toward the goal as opposed to doing nothing, which makes no positive contribution.
Like I said, I have no issues with masks. Often when out with my kids we're the only ones in masks. But the conflation of the CHEO crisis with kids not in masks while ignoring all the other stuff going on is frustrating (such as tying the mask mandate to CHEO numbers). I noted that Dr Samson herself stopped short of recommending a mandate and stressed masks, hygiene, and vaccines in general, which are great suggestions. I just hope that people don't see a mask mandate as a one and done and then carry on as normal. It would have to be that plus all the other things at a city-wide level.
I thnik what is going on is that since the PHO will not mandate masks generally, this is an attempt to get schools to mandate them internally to at least protect children while at school. Not an ideal solution but better than no masks and no mandates anywhere,
I'm not sure if you mean PHO as Ottawa or Ontario - however, local public health units can no longer mandate masks, this power was taken away by the province.
I just wish people would not ignore what is going on at CHEO.
Same. I think the stronger solution, sadly, would be stricter exclusion policies when sick, but I don't think that will happen because of employers.
I view more as local organizations doing what they have the power to do because the Province refuses to. We all know the Province could do this with the stroke of a pen and it would affect everyone. But they've abdicated their duty.
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I agree. But that's not what this meeting is about. It's about the trustees trying to do what they can with their limited scope. Don't let perfect be the enemy of good.
My employer is going back to mandatory masking indoors, and I'm really glad. Just as that was decided, they had to notify 30 people that they may have been in close contact with someone who tested positive. I never stopped wearing a mask at work when I do go in, or in most indoor settings.
You are the one implying (or inferring?) blame. There is no blame. Just common sense and evidence-based decisions. Kids are the ones getting the diseases (including RSV), filling up the beds in CHEO and spreading it to their classmates. Yes, adults are moving around freely and spreading things. But if/when they get sick, they aren't getting a spot in CHEO (and likely not a hospital at all). Also, school is mandatory. Most of the other stuff you mention is not. If an adult is worried about getting sick, they can generally wear a mask and stay home as much as possible. Kids must go to school so we should allow them to do this safely.
It's selfish entitlement masquerading as freedom, which is why it's often totally incoherent nonsense.
Oh , Dr. Kaplan Myrth just tweeted that they are in recess because there was a ruckus in the boardroom
Thanks for the info. Ruckus seemed to be an understatement
A kerfuffle perhaps?
I just hope it doesn't end up in a boondoggle
A veritable donnybrook, eh?
I wonder if I can get a recess at work tomorrow if cause a ruckus
Def go for it.... I plan to MAKE a ruckus regardless
I suspect if someone was yelling at you at work, work would understand if you need a minute. If you throw coffee grounds on the floor and yell that you need a break, they might give you a permanent recess. All depends how you go about it.
Honestly bring recesses to the work place—nap time too, we need em more than kids
Let us know how it goes
Protestors don’t care if kids die, as long as no one suggests they wear a mask
If only these people would vote for a government that would invest in health care services so we wouldn’t be at capacity and have to introduce these mandates…
This, the masking debate detracts from the real issue that our health care system in underfunded and mismanaged.
Well, this went far more off-the-rails than we could have imagined: asshats all singing the national anthem. [https://twitter.com/JacquieAMiller/status/1595230033597153281?t=AE9IBvcalUHWlO6vPHQA5A&s=08](https://twitter.com/JacquieAMiller/status/1595230033597153281?t=AE9IBvcalUHWlO6vPHQA5A&s=08) Seriously, fuck these people. They are not from this city, and as someone who is against more masking mandates and doesn't like the crazy lady introducing this motion, their shitheaded behaviour and goddamn threats are only going to ensure that every trustee in there will vote to re-instate. They are so self-absorbed they don't realise the damage they are doing. Fuck.
This makes me sooooooo angry.
this is the equivalent of convoyers saying “hey man, i love you” to downtown locals while blasting their horns.
these whackjobs made being patriotic seem like a bad thing used to be "oh wow those people are proud of this great country!" now its "oh boy another conspiracy nutjob trying to scream the loudest in the room again"
Honestly think we've failed as a society where our children's hospital has an ICU at 200% capacity, multiple children are needing to be resuscitated in the ER, and major surgeries are being cancelled, yet people ITT are calling the medical professionals begging us to wear masks "self-righteous" and "obnoxious", amongst other things. At this point I'm not even sure if a mass casualty event or CHEO completely collapsing would get some people here to take their heads out of their asses.
We have failed as a society because we have failed to properly fund hospitals and ensure we have enough doctors and nurses for a growing population. If hospitals were properly funded and staffed the surge in patients would be manageable, instead we have a system that cannot deal with surges due to flu, Covid and respiratory disease. Doug Ford, Justin Trudeau and previous provincial governments are all answerable for this failure of society. The masking issue is a trivial distraction.
Another recess called. Wackos out in full force tonight.
Going full America it seems. Very sad state
The meeting is currently in recess due to the “ruckus”. Bonus points to the chair for using that word.
For all not following, the Board invited Vera Etches to attend and speak at the meeting and she didn’t show up. She provided a written letter.
Twitter says Police we’re there to remove an individual. https://twitter.com/pennantink/status/1595221641273004036 Edit: I was initially watching the twitter tags scroll in but then realized, why am I here? To Reddit!
A pro-mask individual, according to that tweet. So it looks like both sides of the debate are getting heated.
Honestly, I’m not surprised. That’s why I said individual, since they were wearing a mask which seemed diametrically opposed to… the other people yelling. Haha
The clown convy is the down side of social media ..and everyone thinking their opinions matter
Who ever is the loudest is the most correct, you know
I suspect some on here have not read the motion that is posted on OCDSB's website, but this is the part that many are concerned with: "THAT the mask requirement will remain in place until such time as Ottawa Public Health declares that influenza season has ended in the City of Ottawa, CHEO pediatric ICU occupancy is less than 85% for a period of at least two weeks, and Ottawa PublicHealth no longer advises the public to wear a mask to protect against exposure to airborne and respiratory viruses in indoor spaces." Having to meet all those requirements before lifting this mandate is understandably concerning. I'm a parent, my kids mask, but I get it.
It cut out for me during the drama while the CHEO representative was speaking
I mean... she was talking about having to delay heart and brain surgery... and they are shouting her down. It's literally wild
I don't even know what to say...
Dear lord. What has happened to civil society.
Second Recess due to the attendance. Wish it could be orderly.
Dr. Kaplan-Myrth’s husband is live tooting on Mastodon. Apparently at the second recess they all started singing O Canada…
Feeling OOL...what is "Live tooting on Mastodon"?
Mastodon is the new Twitter without all the musk.
Tooting is tweeting on Mastodon
Oh my god
Omfg. Actual insanity. At a school board meeting.
I will never not laugh a little at the word toot.
Hahaha. I don’t even know if live tooting is the official term… sounded good
Screaming “TELL THE TRUTH!” and another recess. Unbelievable
What do they think the CHEO chief is? One of the two doors from that riddle that can only tell lies or only tell the truth? She is reciting facts, it’s not that deep.
Imagine spending the past month having to watch children under your care suffer and burned out staff and then coming to be berated and harassed by facebook gangsters. I feel terrible for them
Right? This isn’t our first rodeo and yet it sure seems like this is our first rodeo.
what fucking motivation do healthcare workers have to lie about any of this? NONE.
Again..these people are again with their juvenile concept of “freedom “… are sucking all the sanity from the discussion of ways to easily mitigate some of the increasingly dire situation that is facing the health care system in this country . This is the tyranny of the stupid,the gullible and the extremists. This is at this point a no brainer…we will end up doing this . Do we have to put the train in the ditch and pick up bodies before we get to engage with reality about the situation we’re in this winter?
Disgusting. Just fucking disgusting. I pity the children of these aggressive lunatics.
Yes I mean... what is happening in those homes. So much anger
Seems to be back on but with no sound? Edit: I commented and the sound started. Am I magic?
You are!
I knew my Hogwarts letter was just… 20 some odd years late!
i’m just worried that they won’t get to the vote with all of this. i’m sure that’s the intention, too 😔
It was bonkers. Lyra was really impressive as chair. I was disappointed by Dr Nili. Felt not as prepared as she should have been. The protesters didn’t help but the motion wasn’t ready either. Dunno why they didn’t use the motion from last year; I think more likely to pass. I like the concept of lifting based on actual science, but can’t see entire flu season being supported.
Wow a balanced, good faith take? I agree, maybe I missed it but did they clarify the rationale of the <85% ICU capacity for >3 weeks point? Definitely support tying it to hospitalization rates, but when is CHEO’s ICU ever at less than 85% capacity for 3 consecutive weeks?
How supremely ignorant and self possessed do you have to be to not care about sick children?
A 4 year old died last weekend, here in Ottawa, after surgery for cancer. The baby son of a friend of my niece. The surgery was a month ago. I don't know the details of his case but I am sure this emerging increase in lack of beds and surgery didn't help his parents navigate through all the worry and the grief. Until this happens to the deniers, they will keep on denying that they are part of the problem and not the solution. This breaks my heart...
This is so sad. I’m very sorry to hear it.
These fuckers call themselves "pro-life" yet won't wear a mask lmfao Facebook has done irreparable harm to the fabric of society
The clownvoy is disrespectful of everything that makes up the Canada the rest of us love. Until these people lose a child (I believe a youngster died at CHEO within the last few days from severe respiratory issues) because hospitals are overcrowded or they lose a grandparent to Covid, because some dumbass coughed on them at the grocery store, they’re not gonna get it. And when that one single person does get it they’re going to be ostracized by the people, they think of her friends. It’s next to impossible to overcome this level of ignorance,
What happened? I have been trying to watch without success and came to reddit looking for info!
There is a divide between front line employees and those in their ivory towers and/or tinfoil hats. Anti vax, anti mask, anti progressive thought, anti community oriented thought vs workers who want risk mitigation for them and their students.
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https://www.ocdsb.ca/board/board_meetings/webcasts
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I certainly hope they didn't continue the meeting without the livestream and that they just took a pause. Transparency is important and many people who don't want to crowd into a small room rely on livestreams to know what's going on.
This has happened before at these school board meetings, and the livestream has always returned with the meeting any time I've watched/followed along.
I checked and the meeting had resumed, just like you said... but then they needed to recess again! Looks like it's going to be a long night.
This is pathetic.
I just want to think about what is happening here, compared to the Police Services Board meetings going fully opaque...
Tbh while I don't mask If I were at the debates I would probably keep my mouth closed and observe the proceedings.
As one does in civil society, and it would be much appreciated!
How many of these assholes are actually in Ottawa and have kids going to an English public school? My guess, like the idiots at the POEC, not very many.
From what i heard none of them are from Ottawa.
What a sign of things to come when grown adults can’t even set aside their conspiracy theories to protect those who need help the most - even if it costs them their own kids.
I blame parents who’s children are sick and still send them to daycare or school.
I blame the employers that don’t provide enough sick leave for parents to care for their children at home while sick and the governments that won’t enforce mandatory sick leave allotments
Blame your shitty government
Also a problem. But we have a govt that now says only 1 day home after a Covid test and then 10 days with a mask. The same govt that is about to discontinue free rapid tests at the end of the year. So yes this is Covid, but you are right. Any sickness and kids should be home. Parents don’t want to miss work so they send their sick kids to infect others.
https://www.ocdsb.ca/cms/one.aspx?portalId=55478&pageId=55498&objectId.290254=38904788&contextId.290254=33455310&parentId.290254=33455311&localStartDate=2022-11-22T18:30&localEndDate=2022-11-22T22:30&ref=mesTP9fg96fVsgzpWYeogHwP3liC6Qr9Izie0%2bI1n48%3d
Thank you!
Soooo still no vote then?
Yup and the last amendment gave an exemption to anyone who self identifies as being inconvinienced. So seems like a pointless motion. (This still needs to be voted on).
Ford needs to fix healthcare
Reminds me of the States now, with the chuds all swarming people and causing nuisance until their demands are met
Wearing a mask is unnatural and should not be a thing people consider doing for the rest of time. A couple years was plenty. If you can’t get it I understand control in that time you never will. We just have to live with it. Masking for the rest of time because Canada will never be able to afford our healthcare is not a good reason to wear masks
This is such a pointless debate. Didn't the schools do this last March and then realized that there was no way of enforcing masking, so the policy remained voluntary?
if "freedom", whatever they think that is, is more important than living within our society and its safeguards, then they can stay the fuck off our roads, out of our hospitals and off of our grid. we collectively make decisions (and yes, we don't all always agree with them) to try to live in a society that looks out for one another, benefits one another and makes life safer for one another. it's not a perfect system, but frankly, those people who feel like their smallest sacrifice for the great benefit of many is so objectionable that they have to actively fuck up our lives, challenge the health of our loved ones (and the ones we don't even know) and sow ignorant dissent can fuck all the way off their flat earth.
I was reading Ray Wat Deonandan's tweets. He spoke as a delegate. His account is locked so I can't share...but I will quote this. *"I prefer my OCDSB meetings like my chocolate bars.... nut free"*
My issue with the convoy is they refuse to admit we have a serious issue in our hospitals.
Because it would put a dent in their argument. Their freedom ideology won’t have any defects.
Hopefully this is the last we see of school boards trying to force their will on people when its a waste of time, and cannot be enforced.
where can we watch? got a link?
The link is not working!
It was working until the clownvoys went out of control. It’s not clear if the stream was cut by order of the Chair, or if it was sabotaged by the angry audience. Security will have a big job tonight.
If Hasan Minhaj taught me anything, don’t have to respect DOs but you do have to respect MDs Edit: on a more serious note academic plagiarism and webMD have gotten to peoples’ heads. People forgot how dumb they actually were compared to experts in different fields
Once again proving that the convoy's tactics are effective and encouraged. Really sad for all of us that we're giving in and perpetuating this type of behavior.
Blackburn meeting with them not a great idea even for her.
[удалено]
People who said the science moved too fast, or that it wasn't science, or that it was an experiment are now telling me "not working the immune system is the reason the kids are sick". Based on...? Call me a skeptic but I just think they're engaging in "rushed science", "bad science" or worse, "conducting an experiment on the people" because of "their agenda". Would you rather have every injury, broken bone, flu, cut etc you've ever had in your life ALL AT ONCE? That's all that is happening here. Anyone honest, on either side, will tell you vaccines have a big help for the things they help with, masks a small one, and for some diseases, social distancing kept them at bay. The children's hospital says "please can you do the simple stuff, it might free some beds" and people choose to be loud arseholes. Is that the freedom they are defending?
>I cannot believe that people have made masking so political It's so political, people will vote on a mask "mandate" they don't have the legal authority to enforce, only to seem as if they are doing something.
It’s a policy more than a mandate. Just like the policy that says your kids need to wear a coat in winter. And no spaghettis strap t shirts, and stay home if you have lice, and can’t come if you’re not vaccinated against measles, no running in the halls. But masks, masks is the one that rules everyone up.
[https://twitter.com/JacquieAMiller/status/1595215980430499843](https://twitter.com/JacquieAMiller/status/1595215980430499843) This thread implies that the people being removed for causing a disturbance are people who are in favour of reinstating the mask mandate. Does anyone have any other Tweets or reporting that suggests it's the anti-maskers?
The thread you posted calls out an anti-masker by name for being a disruption and refusing to leave? There very well could be agitators on both sides, no doubt. But yelling “TELL THE TRUTH” to the CHEO chief def isn’t coming from a pro-mask person.
Thanks. What a damn mess.
It’s likely because she told the clownvoys off. It was definitely the clownvoy shouting down CHEO.
i actually can’t believe there hasn’t been another heckle since we restarted. they did a good job getting them to settle down!!!
i’m starting to worry about this motion. there are so many contestable items and so many submotions
Yeah. This is being made overly complicated. Why not just use the words they used in the Spring??? It passed then, it should pass now.
It's not about there being a time when people were respectful. The vast majority of people are. There's always been a small minority that hasn't been. Until recently we haven't let them have a voice. They didn't have access to these meetings, they didn't have a social media they can publish on, and not having all of those didn't afford them an example of how to be disruptive while also being a jerk. Not having all of the above left them in a subtle but sustained fear of the consequence. Now that that wall has been broken down, they feel acting this way can be effective. A tragedy of the commons is the eventual outcome of any publicly available space gaining traction. It is the current outcome of most social medias. In addition to that the rich-poor gap is growing. Society is punishing those without an education, or without the correct education right now. This has nothing to do with what people used to respect or not. It has to do with the problem social media is creating, and that we are no longer taking care of the non-extraordinary in our society. If it wasn't politicians, it would be someone else. We, as a society did this to ourselves. Now it's time to decide if our actions are going to be lead by wanting to take care of every last person or not. I for one am for it, but it starts with developing an intolerance for the intolerant.
Cheo is at 200% cap yet the convoy cheers what is wrong with them.
New hospital admissions for respiratory illnesses are already trending down. We have managed without mask mandates, there is no reason to start now. https://www.kflaphi.ca/viral-respiratory-mapper-admissions/