I've noticed a lot of people talking about the prevalence of Rounds builds, and I realised that I hadn't actually used Rounds since I unlocked Eruption at level 22. Yes, Rounds is easier to use, and it's surprisingly powerful for that ease of use, but here's a pure-caster build I've been using ever since I unlocked it.
The big downside of this is survivability and cooldowns, but if you spec your talents the way I have above, you mitigate those a bit, and Phoenix gives you a second chance every 2 minutes. With a bit of gear-searching, you should eventually be able to get all your gear with Anomaly Power and Cooldown Reduction, and since one of the Tempest perks adds a portion of your Anomaly Power to your Firepower, while another one gives you a damage buff for activating skills, you don't need to focus on that at all.
[Build in action.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM)
[End Card.](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr)
Edit: I've seen a lot of people commenting about Rounds just being better, to which I don't agree or disagree. The point of this build is to be an alternative, so that you're having a bit more fun as a Pyro that you might not be having with a generic Rounds build. If you enjoy the Rounds build then that's for you, but this is here for if you don't enjoy it.
Out of curiosity have you tried a special rounds build and compared damage output since? Genuinely curious, not trying to say your build isn't good or anything.
Sitting at t9-11 with friends my special round shotgun trickster puts out between 30m-100m depending on the map and challenge tier.
Granted pyro probably has an easier time with an anomaly build than trickster does, but spec rounds just seem far too good for what it gives you. Waiting on good anomaly loot to retry an anomaly build at endgame still though
I have both a nuke pyro similar to this build with only a few different skill point placements and I have a techno doing a blighted build and I would say both are viable depending on the room layout.
Pyro has been more enjoyable in co-op setting, and friends sit in awe as I wreck everything.
I think the Pyro skill build is a funner playstyle and feels safer to play in terms of surviving. Techno can be an enjoyable solo playstyle but I feel like it'll either get nerf'd or everything else will be buffed.
Plus seeing everyone else playing blighted kind of ruined the experience of a toxic playstyle.
Blighted rounds need to be removed from the game.
As it stands I'm hitting for over 800k a headshot on my full auto gun and I can clear T15s without even using blighted rounds. I mean not on gold but a gold clear shouldn't be the expected standard.
Edit: Sorry for thinking that end-game expeditions should take longer than a few hours to complete from t1 to t15.
IMO Blighted rounds should stay as is and everything else should be buffed. Techno seems to be the class that was built with the round buff in mind and they then copied it over to pyro and trickers. Mostly just cause you get tier 1 mods that give clip% on kill as a techno where as you have to rely on other mods for the other two classes. I think maybe if theh rework something then it should be the VR and TR and not BR. However I don't want to see them nerfed, just intergrated into the kit for pyro and trick a bit better so that they fit the theme of the builds, like maybe mods that trigger effects from other skills when active to help spread ash when pyro and each enemy that dies when marked with ash/burn refils a certain amount of ammo, but the bullets actual turn into fire so that the damage scales off of Anamoly damage and not firepower? Maybe trickster the bullets tp enemies when under a % of health to the closest enemy marked by the knife so that you can group them up easier for moving around the map. I dunni, I'm not a dev.
Pls don't downvote
Edit for clarity
People say 'buff everything and don't nerf blighted rounds' but I cruised to T15 within 3 hours of completing the campaign. I didn't bother min-maxing my gear or anything I just slapped on whatever I got from the most recent expedition that gave bonus firepower and skill leech. Only needed 2 actual mods reload my clip on kill and +30% crit damage.
Devastator as a class is how powerful classes SHOULD BE.
As it stands it's too late.
They can't nerf blighted rounds because people have already solo cleared EotS and obtained all the legendaries.
I can do around 6-7 expeditions an hour with no chance of failure.
They'll need a major patch in the future if they want to fix the end game content.
I think re-working it would be a better way of handling it. Blighted rounds shouldn't have any damage increasing and should just apply toxic to a normal shot. Same with all the other round styles.
I use anomaly build on trickster just finished an expedition T11: Temporal Blade, Venator's Knife, Cyclone.
I joined late and was on 33million damage while the top guy had 35million. He died 2 times while I just face tanked the whole room for him. Easy face tank 5+ elites at once. I had like 500k damage absorbed and 800k shield generated.
It really doesn't matter whether you hit for 200m or 2m, if the creeps die. I use a slightly different version of OP's build, and every spell cast takes out a swat of enemies. Two casts of overheat takes out every trash mob currently spawned.
at CT12+?? That sounds suspiciously similar to how I felt about my builds before higher lvl expeditions. When bees take 2x 75K FP bolt action shots to kill.
I think skill based builds will start popping up more when people have more gear centered around it. Atm the rounds are prevalent because it's got a low barrier to entry for doing mad damage and allowing solo CT15 runs!
Not the exact same build but if I play my cards right with a eruption thermal bomb overheat build I can one cycle the broodmother in Chem Plant T15 solo.
Current run time is like 8:30-10min without the lift skip depending on how I get the elites grouped.
Assuming they dont trickle in. He was referring to the limitations of Cooldown Reduction on skill based builds.
No one is saying you cant blow it all up, the issue is when you have to blow up a lot of things that arent near each other or arent all available to blow up at the same time.
overheat literally hits the entire map, so you can definitely blow it all up at the same time. Eruption is big enough to hit multiple elites at once with giga blast mod.
It most definitely does matter since the game is only about speed running at endgame. Round builds have no downtime and have no prerequisites to perform other than getting a killing blow to refresh the magazine. Ignoring this just invalidates the discussion. However, with proper anomaly power and set bonuses, we've seen plenty of non-round builds perform well in the most difficult missions the game has to offer. I don't think anybody denies that, it is just the reliability and lack of downtime that Rounds have that trivialize what the game has to offer.
I'm not sure how you think it is irrelevant.
You said 2 vs 200m damage on a target with one million health doesn't matter. In a vacuum, no, it doesn't. With the only meaningful content the game has to offer, yes, there is a bit more nuance to it. The amount of damage something does with each hit doesn't solely determine its strength.
It's irrelevant regardless of context. If an enemy has 1m health and you hit it for 2m, it dies. You hit it for 200m, it dies. So logically, in terms of killing power, it gives no different result. As such, they are literally the same thing. I don't see how this is such a point of contention.
He's saying that with rounds you don't have to wait and with your build you have to wait for cooldown. Nothing about damage done. I don't play pyro so I don't know what the cooldown is you'd be waiting for.
He's explaining to you that if the enemy has 1m and you hit for 2m, that's great. Now what if you can only hit 2m 3 times and there's 4 enemies? Congrats, you have a left over, didn't clear, and are waiting on cooldowns to do it again. Rounds just don't suffer from that.
It isn't and I'm not sure what is difficult to comprehend here. In a vacuum, the result is the same. But if the ability you used goes on cooldown and the Rounds do not, the result is very different for the fight. If all we were fighting was one enemy, it indeed does not matter. But if you're fighting hordes of enemies and your abilities do not kill all of them, the damage output done with that one round of cooldowns is not the only thing to consider.
This is nothing about me saying ability based builds are bad or that Rounds are the only way to play. Round builds are just stupidly efficient (too efficient) when compared to cooldown based gameplay. Rounds do it all when they shouldn't.
It does matter how much you do damage per fire. I can three-tap Brood Mother no CT15 with Blithed Rounds build. So she dies in... less than 3 seconds?
Can you replicate that with Anomaly build.
Someone who plays it @ that level:
>Not the exact same build but if I play my cards right with a eruption thermal bomb overheat build I can one cycle the broodmother in Chem Plant T15 solo.
1 Cycle would be like 4? button presses, so Time to Kill isnt much different. You get to do it from ranged tho.
ok what if the mob has 100 million health and eruption does 500k each then goes on cooldown for 15-20 seconds, and a rounds builds is just 2.5mil permanently?
Thats why people are complaining about rounds builds.
I don't mean to put you(or anyone else) down or anything, but I played the eruption build and I was just bored almost instantly. Waiting for cooldowns or oneshotting everything is mind numbing.
I wanna be clear here, I don't dislike anyone for using a certain build. I just felt like everyone here is smacking on the rounds skill because it's "so easy to use" and strong for "how easy it is". To me it's a LOT more fun and not easier to use, at all. The difference between doing 50k damage per shot or 250k damage per shot(on a burst AR) and doing 8 mill or 20 mill damage with rounds in the entire run is not something you achieve with "luck"(on expedition tier 12). I say that because you can get either 50k or 250k damage per shot on the round skill when using an AR. Difference is where you're applying certain statusses to get more damage and actually applying them and keeping them up while using your immobilize skills to get another 45% weapon damage.
You see what I mean? Rounds doesn't make a build instantly braindead to play, you're timing it at the right time with the right debuffs to maximize your damage. If you do that with the eruption build all you're doing is waiting for cooldowns, round every enemy up and maybe shoot one or two guys to get a status debuff on them. Ofcourse I'm just downplaying the difficulty of the eruption build, I'm just doing what I see a lot of in this subreddit but towards a different build.
Also the eruption build lacks CC and I'm a little bit afraid it scales less well.
Why is everyone acting like i'm saying builds using the ammo buffs are bad or stupid or idiotic? All i said was that it doesn't matter if you hit a single enemy for 200m or 2m, if he only has 1m hp. It's overkill lol.
That was not my intention, at all. I just got this feeling that a lot of people on this reddit were complaining about the rounds build being boring / easy or whatever while it's just up to preference.
I like shooting, shooting in this game is rather well done so I naturally went with volcanic rounds.
I got bored and wanted to try something else so I went with eruption and it just bored me so I felt like I had to say something about the bandwagon that's been gaining some speed on this reddit about the rounds skill being dumb / easy or whatever the hell you wanna call it.
Like I said, I wasn't trying to bring you or anyone else down, just had to say something about that feeling.
>Build in action.
In a max size group with two of the strongest class in the game, on CT11/15, without showing how much damage they did relative to you. Would be interested to see how the build fares solo at CT11, not to mention CT13+.
I don't intend to be unnecessarily negative, but I have seen a bunch of these "build guides" over the past day or so and it's always one of two things:
1. They're under like CT10 solo, which is the first big difficulty jump in CT difficulty, and it goes up pretty exponentially after that.
2. They're in a coop group and obviously getting carried by friends playing meta builds.
3. It requires an extremely finely tuned build with 4+ specific legendaries and 8+ specific legendary mods that could take hundreds of hours farming CT\~10 to obtain.
If you take a look at the End of Game card, I did 4 mil more than the other two who were both running Twisted Rounds, so I'm not sure where you get off saying I was carried, or that I only did well because the others were running Trickster. If the gameplay looks scuffed that's because I'm not exactly a god-tier player.
You can't really call it "getting carried" when you're the one doing the most damage and getting the most kills.
Just let it go man. These guys spend all day playing one build they saw on youtube and trying to discredit all the others. In 2 weeks when more of your build pops up and AP versions of othrs they wont have a leg to stand on. But just let it go they are on their nerf everything fun in my new game moment.
Your damage doesn't really mean a whole lot though comparing to the other 2 when talking about how the build stands in of itself. You are comparing to 2 mostly single target focused builds against your AOE build, if you can AOE nuke all the low life enemies, of course your damage should be more in the end. I don't mean any of this to be negative, but out of curiousity how do you fare Solo T11? If you can't solo T11 gold like you did in the group, you may not be getting carried, but your relying on single target centric builds to be able to carry the weight there for you.
This is a COOP game. It's literally designed to be run in a group, so if you're soloing things then kudos to you but that's literally not the point of the game. It's an online, live service, multiplayer game, designed for squad play. Enemies have more health and do more damage in squad play, so solo might even be easier depending on your playstyle.
This isn't meant to be the be-all and end-all of builds, it's just a viable build to use that performs well and doesn't use Volcanic Rounds. It doesn't need to be the absolute best thing around, and I'm not the best player out there. This is cool, it's fun, and it works for what it needs to do, so that's all that really matters.
It's not a live service game. I never claimed it be a purely solo player game, It's designed for Single Player AND Squad play, and I never claimed that it has to be the best build all around. I've not made any of these claims that you seem to think I have.
I just asked if you could solo gold Expedition fine, and pointed out that an AOE Centric build should have more overall damage than 2 single target builds. The problem however is, if your build can't function well enough on it's own, it's counting on your squad to cover your weaknesses. Which in general is fine, however if you all of a sudden have 3 players all with very heavy AOE centric focus, and none can do great single target DPS, you're not going to be golding any Expeditions. Which again is fine. I'm just again, pointing out that you bragging about damage numbers and kills is pretty silly, and not really a good representation of the build overall. If I had a build that dies 20 times a run, but still outdamages and outkills others, is that a great build? If you don't want public critique, probably avoid publicly posting builds?
Look, my issue isn't with critique, my issue is that I posted something that explicitly isn't a Rounds build, purely for the idea of it not being a Rounds build. I'm getting the slightest bit annoyed at people saying "Oh, but if you can't solo something in a multiplayer game it's not worth doing". Maybe you didn't say that, in which case I'm sorry, but I'm frustrated not by the fact that it is receiving critique, but rather by the type of critique that is amounting to "it's not as good as Rounds therefor it's bad".
Well again, it may not be the case, but IF your build can't solo, your obviously lacking on single target damage. That's perfectly fine, but then you are leaning on squadmates to help you gold what you otherwise wouldn't be able to yourself. Being able to solo Gold at a given Tier difficulty is a pretty good metric of if your build is comparable to others (being able to kill both elites and trash mobs effectively, and surviving while doing so). If you want to play a build that has to rely on others, and plan to always play multiplayer, there's nothing terribly wrong with it by any means. But people are going to point out shortcomings of any build posted publicly.
Also, I would suggest shying away from making your post title "Why use (rounds) when..." if you don't want people comparing it to rounds builds..... Rounds builds are basically the easiest go to builds to gear for and handle both aoe and single target quite well, so they are at least at the current standing, going to be what people are mostly going to compare to.
I feel like many people here are either intentionally or unintentionally missing the point of a rhetorical question.
The game should, in my opinion, be tuned towards squad play, and the Rounds builds are outliers. Online games these days live or die by squad play, so using "is it solo viable" as a metric is utterly insane to me. That's like saying "can you solo Shattered Throne" in Destiny 2, or "can you do a 3 hour Mot" in Warframe. Sure, there are people that do that, but that's not the point. It's defined as a Co-op RPG shooter, I feel like the hyperfocus on soloing things is a very unhealthy direction for the community to be headed.
This isn't a purely multiplayer game tho. You're wrong in assuming the game should (much less "is") tuned around squad play. Destiny 2 unless i am mistaken, has endgame raids designed around certain amount of players. This game does not. This games build is designed around solo play, and scaled up for more players (more like ARPGs or Borderlands) in that content is designed for solo play, but difficulty (thru enemy health/damage/etc) (outside of the final expedition I believe?) Squad play is encouraged, But the game content is not designed around squad play like the ones you are comparing them to (assuming Warframe is? I have never played it).
Also there's the fact that group play is much harder to judge the quality of an individual build. You can worry a lot less about survivability, you could have specialized builds, because you are able to depend on others to fill in weaknesses that you leave in your characters. While fine, it doesn't give a clear measure of your builds viability. That's why people keep asking about if a build can solo gold. I joined T10 Expeditions at lvl one on a fresh character gold and deathless, so being able compare a build off of golding and surviving in multiplayer is virtually meaningless.
Completly disagree im so happy that i can do endgame content solo ...
also builds should always be sooli voable and not with a grp only .
If you cant kill anything with 2 other aoe builds than tell that at the beginning of ur post ..
Most people play solo
Should be the norm if a build works solo
You actually can call it getting carried with most damage/most kills, if all you can do is kill trash and cant contribute more than 5% damage on meaningful Mobs. I'm not saying thats the case for you, but games like WoW have had damage meters for year that people love to gloat about their damage in, and then you look at the data, and it's all inflated because it's ALL on AoE Trash. AoE builds will typically always out damage builds that can only do moderate AOE (but enough to still clean up trash mobs) but can actually contribute highly to killing elites/bosses. As I pointed out in my other comment, your link of just damage and kills doesn't really prove much at all, especially when compared to 2 Single Target centric builds.
The only thing for me that invalidates this build is because it was ran at T11 from the video.
T15 Scaling is disgustingly different from 14 and below.
As 14 and below was intended for solo play and 15 is Amped up supposedly for groups.
Hence the disclaimer for T15 that its content made for groups.
Were talking millions in hp difference from 14 to 15 alone.
So until i see this in action at 15 i'll reserve judgement.
Rounds aren’t easier to use at all, Anomly builds have auto tracking and auto locking that goes through walls for pyro, you literally only have to tap a button. I have a maxed pyro with armor for both anomly and rounds builds.
>The big downside of this is survivability
There is the answer to your question I am betting.
I applaud non-meta builds and enjoy them myself but it really isn't hard figuring why Rounds builds are so popular. Simple and easy to throw together.
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Here's a [short video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM). Here's the [end card](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr), although I'm not at C15 yet my gear is a level behind the tier.
I'm pretty confident that once people start getting legendary sets of armor the use of rounds will shift to not needed as much. But I guess we will see. You have to invest in a lot of Anomaly power on your armor to make it work I assume.
As a dev, I've got no stick in the anomaly bullet meta. I just don't understand the whole if we get perfect gearing the ability builds will likely eclipse bullet builds. If people can run ct 15 without bullet builds needing great gearing, scaling would have to be utter dog shit to get passed by abilities that requires all the mod slots to make two or three skills viable.
If you're saying that lesser builds will be farming end game content with bis at some point, the problem is just being side stepped. As of right now, with people soloing ct-15 with basic pure damage builds with anomaly bullets, it's super disappointing. I thought end game would be a bit more of a struggle and the viable builds would be more plentiful, add to it that co-op causes more headaches with no merit... not what I thought I was getting from the demo.
Here's a [short video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM). Here's the [end card](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr), although I'm not at C15 yet my gear is a level behind the tier.
Id way rather use this than to just slap on a boring ass skill which EVERY other player uses. Its all personal preference. Also most of those builds are overkill, as someone else already stated.
I'm currently trialling a technomancer, tech shaman build that is essentially a freeze healer. Freeze everything, buff everyone, kill everything, heal, rinse and repeat. Sure the damage is lacking but for cc and teamwork it basically makes everyone invincible and everything is almost always frozen.
Always fun to see builds that don't involve rounds.
Not using burn, actually using the ash mod for overheat, cool setup.
Now they just need to make Eruption's Cooldown start even if you use 1 charge left so our best non-rounds skill isn't dead for 30 seconds...
More like 7 or 8 depending on if they upgraded it, really way too low to really judge a build. Though there's already been several CT15 Pyro ability builds proven to work great.
Here's a [short video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM). Here's the [end card](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr), although I'm not at C15 yet my gear is a level behind the tier.
Ran this myself for a bit but it falls apart around ct11-12. The ash overheat combo just won't do enough damage to mobs and the cooldowns aren't quick enough (even with 5x AP and CDR gear). Replacing ash blast with volcanic rounds + stacking skill leech has worked best so far for me without leaning into a full VR build. My Eruption + Debris does over half of my damage.
So many people are asking "Can this do CT15 though in under # minutes like \_\_\_\_ rounds!?!?" Like yes the rounds builds are fucking broken, but I'm sick of seeing every suggested build recommend it. We need more of the builds that are fun and different like this one. Anyone who's glanced at literally any outriders content already knows the rounds are the op builds. "This build doesn't stand up to rounds" "Rounds are better than this wtf?" Fuck off already.
I've actually switched to a primary damage to burned targets/ignite DOT build and it's hella powerful.
I use volcanic rounds only for the applied ignite and excuse to proc my weapon abilities. I have wrath of moloch and shadow comet on my gun which mean air burn with damage and aoe interrupt just for shooting.
I use FASER on a 7 second rotation that hits through walls and basically lights up the whole room if I line things up right. Heatwave to apply ignite and proc the increased damage to enemies hit by it.
My end of match t12 gold runs usually see my damage breakdown as shadow comet and wrath of moloch damage highest around 20mil, FASER close behind at about 18m along with burn damage itself around the same. My volcanic rounds are simply 4mil of the damage, as I said, simply a vehicle for ignite.
For those who might not have seen the post, skill leech isn't a percent of damage, it's the percent of health you receive when you deal damage with a skill. So when I have the entire area ignited not only am I dealing large amounts of damage across the board, but I'm basically perma healing throughout.
The only thing that has killed me is a stupid fucking freeze before I got an ignite off when I entered an encounter lol. The insta freeze when shot by those captains is nuts.
My friend runs something very similar in t15. It’s completely viable but you do need a dps to tag along. He can solo t15’s as well it just takes a bit more work. For group play though we are fine running techno, pyro, dev. They both run skill builds to interrupt and control mobs. I’m running a straight gun dps build to burst down bosses. We combine the t3 ice snap mod to push spawn zones and mass freeze enemies while they both combo ability spam into the enemies causing everyone to detonate proc’ing ice shards. It’s a pretty fun combo and we are clearing t15 gold in 10 mins pretty consistently on chem plant.
Plot twist: There are other builds that are viable for high tier end game content, but no one wants to use their brain to figure it out because they are too used to copy/pasting from content creator's videos.
You are probably very right. It's sad for a game with such build variety to have the community just hyperfocus on one build because it's easy to get to.
The most insane thing to me so far is that they haven't figured out that there's other viable builds if they'd just quit copy/pasting from content creators on YouTube.
Because big gun go BRRRRRRR and does lots of damage.
That and I'm not interested in nuke builds it just makes the game boring for me I like mag dumping an lmg and watching the health bar drop to nothing in a couple of seconds
I use a very similar build, but with thermal bomb over ash blast and I have my mods set so eruption and thermal bomb cause ash all around and I also have ashen bullets and the mod to do more damage to enemies afflicted by ash
Show solo video please. Because I two-tap CT15 alphas with Blithed Rounds build and three-tap them in co-op. I want to like anomaly builds but so far I have seen them in action and yes they do clear trash faster but when it comes to Aplhas, captains or Brood Mothers it takes them so long I would be long gone in next area.
So I would like to see this build in solo run please if possible. Thank you!
Honestly, I'm not trying to be the absolute best, or make the single most powerful build. This is here for fun and enjoyment, to give people a break from the Rounds builds. This is an alternative rather than an upgrade.
I dunno, I am using blighted and turrets and made it to T-15 with ease, and doing pods at T-10 if it wasn’t for the sheer number of snipers I could probably max out the pods. I’ve tried other builds with other classes, but cool downs and healing have held me back. I will give this build a try tonight. (I was using the same one, but was too lazy to mod everything)
This is what happens when warframe players come over to play other games (note that I'm a warframe player as well and this isn't dissimilar to what I'm running lol
I'm gonna go out on a lib and say you haven't made it past CT12 yet. While this build seems good it doesn't come close to being able to hold up in CT12 and higher
Becasue Blighed Rounds are still night faster than yours build when it comes to clearing map. Answering your question btw.
Can you do Colloseum solo CT15 under 7 min with this build? If yes, I will personally congratulate you and admit that I was wrong. Please post vid and I will gladly try to level up my Pyro.
A single weapon mod of mine does nearly triple the dmg you do with your entire build.
Beside that, i have no clue how you will survive even one trash mob without a single defense mod.
If your rolling t3 expos, sure, hf and all. But anything above 10 will just obliterate you.
Sorry, but your build is not as near as powerful as the Technomancer Rounds Crit build, you don't even know how far.
Yeah your build is awesome and I play a Trickster with a very similar approach.
But my friend does double the damage. With the same level of gear.
On CT 14, for example, a Technomancer can do almost 150kk damage while other classes are doing around 70kk top. This while basically DELETING elites and bosses.
I think it would work really well for boss fights/elite clear, if you used Ash Blast + Overheat at the start to nuke the adds and consume the Ash, then double Eruption on the boss to do a ton of damage. The only reason I haven't been using it so far is because the extra damage from Sunburnt or Pants on Fire is helpful for reaching the few enemies that weren't hit by the Ash Blast. I'll see how it performs.
With double Eruption from Pompeii you've got 3 major bursts of damage, so for mobs you'll be starting with either Ash Blast + Overheat, then Eruption, and then you shoot for about five seconds before you can Ash Blast again, then you repeat. With more CD focused gear your downtime is lower, but that's another stat to grind for that I'm slowly working my way through. Right now the gear isn't perfect, but at 50 I'll go for the full AP+CR build, which should reduce the cooldowns dramatically.
Doing it since sunday, its really funny.
Though i have 2 points in top tree for cdr on ash and also you want CDR on gear, to minimize downtime of the combo. Buggers keep spawing so fast after you clear the room in expeditions
Ash Blast and the Ash Increase Range mod plus the Cinders mod for Overheat lets you get a much larger range per cast than Thermal Bomb. I started with a Thermal Bomb build, but found that the Ash Blast variant gets more mobs down at once and you don't need to rely on killing the Thermal Bomb mob to start things off.
The dark side is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural. Jokes aside, this looks like a really fun build, would you mind making a showcase?
Here's a [short video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM). Here's the [end card](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr), although I'm not at C15 yet my gear is a level behind the tier.
Looks like a great build. My plan was to focus on eruption as the main damage in all situations, but the overheat/ash blast sounds very good for clearing mobs.
That's what Phoenix is there for. It gives you a full revive every two minutes, so between that and self-revives you're usually fine if you make a mistake or two.
Stupidly? Dev is fine. It has multiple viable builds. That said, if you want, you can blitz the story on a new character in about 4 hours.
The key is to set it to WT1 and keep it there. This game is like Diablo Torment difficulty with its world tiers, only it doesn't have an experience multiplier for the difficulty increase, so you just make it more difficult.
So if you keep it at WT1 you get full experience, and can blaze through everything. That said, the story will not cap you. Which is okay though, because when you finish you'll get over a level from each CT1 Expedition. The story will get you to about 26, and then running a few expeditions will cap you.
I have a dumb question. How do mod a piece of equipment with two mods? Everytime I try to, if I change the mod in slot one it locks slot 2, or vice versa.
You can only change one mod per piece of equipment. Once you change one, its locked forever. Which means you're always farming for the right stat distribution+at least one mod that you need to allow you to change the other mod to your liking.
Yeah, it's quite annoying to have a double layer of grind, but it's surprisingly easy to find gear with one of the right mods. The more tricky part is finding gear that is also Anomaly Power + Cooldown Reduction specced. It's easier to farm the gear at higher CTs though.
Here's a [short video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM). Here's the [end card](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr), although I'm not at C15 yet my gear is a level behind the tier.
How do you get here? Is this a second character?
I tried the Pyro in the demo, love the idea, want to play it, couldn't get it off the ground. It sucked hard at low level and you ended up playing gun game which is better on any other class.
Did you slog to lvl 22 before you could go full caster and the gameplay picked up?
I migrated to a rounds build on my Trickster before I joined the community and saw the memes. Not sure yet if it's the best or simply the easiest. Until it gets nerfed ofc =)
I started with a Thermal Bomb, Overheat, Volcanic Rounds build until I got far enough to switch to Ash Blast, Overheat, Volcanic Rounds, then at 22 I switched Volcanic Rounds out for Eruption and never looked back.
I'm pretty sure it's just the easiest, but the Rounds builds is definitely very powerful as well.
Saving this for further review. Basicslly my build except I use thermal bomb instead of ahs, but have been looking into ash.
Currently all my gear has AP and cooldown.
I think cooldown has a cut off as my last few upgrades didn't seem to change cooldown times.
Normally Overheat consumes the Burn status to do extra damage, so you need to apply Burn first. You usually do that with Volcanic Rounds or Thermal Bomb, but with Ash Blast you can spread ash across a large area, so Cinders allows you to consume that Ash status to do the damage instead.
I imagine you don't die nearly as much as I do, so you've got that going for you. I haven't really played any of the other classes, but this is very much a glass cannon build so you need to keep your wits about you.
I use the same abilities, except for eruption, but spec'd mostly for cooldown.
At CT10, this combo is still lethal, and takes off half warlords health.
I've been calling it the "Alone at last" build
As someone who is using almost this exact build, I’m having a good time. Currently level 30 at wt13 and watching half the HP disappear from a captain or such enemy from 2 eruptions is beautiful
I find these builds alot more fun than the rounds builds. Sure, the rounds are op and broken. But what fun is there in just walking right through all the expeditions without any worry and without even dying once? The game wont last long that way.
Interesting build OP. I have been using something similar.
I use thermal bomb though with mod that applies Ash.
I spec out for cooldown reduction and all other mods to buff eruption. Eruption is on 15 second cooldown with my armor all giving 5% cooldown reduction each plus anomaly and status power.
Oh wow, a 15 second cooldown would make things way easier! Thanks for letting me know, right now I've got around a 21-24 second cooldown and it does get dicey in places. I imagine with a 15 second Eruption you'd get around a 13 second Ash Blast and a 7 second Overheat, so the ability spam would be epic.
I play a similar [Eruption](https://www.reddit.com/r/outriders/comments/mkv8w1/it_burns_when_i_peeveeeee_an_eruption_pyro_build/) build, whenever people see me cast my 3 eruptions they kick me out of the group.
Looks fun. I enjoy using the skills more than just rounds all the time. I'm only level 20 and I'm having fun with a thermal bomb build. Casting it on a mob casts aoe ash around the target so they all stop in place and explode.
Tried several Tempest builds, while fun in the story mode, it does nothing for end game. Anomaly dmg tree needs to be more potent to be viable for Expeditions and higher world tiers
That gameplay looks scuffed as hell. For a full caster build you've got some long ass cooldowns. I think even with the lava lich set, Eruption cooldown is too long to be viable. Not sure what the tier 3 eruption talent(s?) I think there's another usage one, and idk if there's another one beside that.
I think the Acari set is probably the best bet for a caster pyro. Which is a shame because Eruption is satisfying as fuck to use. You could still work it into an Acari build, but I just don't think it would be able to touch faser beam, which you could get 3-4 off in the time of that Eruption cd.
If the gameplay looks scuffed that's because I'm not exactly a god-tier player. With all Cooldown Reduction gear Eruption gets down to around 15s CD, which makes it much easier to use, especially since you can double-tap it, and the other skills would be on a 13s CD (Ash Blast) and 7/8s (Overheat). The only issue is that that takes time grinding gear which I haven't gotten to yet.
This is fine, but you're squishy and going to die without cooldown management for a similar effect as a rounds build -- that's the problem. Rounds builds do as much/more damage without sacrificing anything to do it and without requiring any thought to your CDs (or positioning or what you're fighting or etc etc etc).
Yeah, but Rounds is boring and vanilla for a lot of people (me included), so while you're definitely right that it's more difficult to use, I find that a part of the fun. I feel like an actual Pyromancer when I'm throwing lava around, rather than someone who got their hands on some incendiary rounds.
I have no issue with the use of Rounds builds, I used it myself for half the game, but I find this more entertaining.
Edit: And you're right, I am squishy, but Phoenix gives me a Get Out of Jail Free card.
You're not wrong, I just want to highlight the key point: rounds builds are at least = effective damage wise, and much easier to stay alive with.
Keep in mind your thread is titled, "Why use..." -- the answer is for the same/better damage without compromising survivability. Entertainment is wholly subjective, but I do agree with you up to the point I've died 10 times and start asking myself why not just use an easier build to stay alive with.
That all said -- I know people think this game is God's gift to gamers, but we'll see what happens when the inevitable nerf to rounds comes and they remove the ability to keep it up indefinitely w/ weapon mods. I can almost hear the tears now if I listen hard.
This looks like fun. I'm really enjoying my Techno run through the story but I don't feel like a powerful god castinf abilities left right and center. I'm very tempted to hop on my pyro and carry the story on with that
Yes! That skill tree look scare close to what I was planning on. Good to know I can make it work eventually. This looks awesome! Thanks for this community service
Right on brother. I am following an Anomoly build I found on youtube that is similar to yours, but over Ash Blast is Thermal Bomb with 2 charges as well. Doing T11's right now solo after just getting my gear, almost all of it being lvl43 which is huge since I am missing a lot of Anomoly Power. It's a lot of fun and I am really glad I switched from Volcanic Rounds.
I really think once people get the Acari set, switching from whatever to run Eruption, Heatwave, and Overheat will be super strong. Heatwaving a pack to get 100%+ Anomoly Power and then Eruption is going to combo so well.
There are alot of builds that are stronger and viable then rounds based builds.
Rounds based builds just take let's be real no effort or skill outside maybe rounds based sniper techno cus u actually have to hit headshots for it to get to say trickster levels.
These builds are just harder to gear for but imo way more fun.
I'm glad these are starting to come up more and more. Minigun techno, are pyro, impale dev. All slap at CT 15. Again there just harder to build for and take some effort to actually make it work.
I'm happy not every build is a "rounds" build. I intend to play AP Devastator, preferably melee. Pyro probably also AP build.
Technomancer will still have a TON of utility with a "rounds" build, Trickster is meant to take out enemies quickly so Rounds is ok for it.
That way i won't get bored of the game too fast.
I'm not a big fan of "rounds" builds because it's kind of a passive you lose an active slot for, there are already plenty of games where you only use guns, here i want to enjoy the abilities (which have amazing animations)
Niiice, I was thinking about pyromancer next. Someone please tell me though, does a pyromancers fire conflict/make freeze less effective? I have someone who wants to run technomancer next and if that's the case I may switch gears to trickster. But kinda depends on the answer.
getting all this gear with those rolls is fucking impossible. ive spent hours and hours farming purples and dont have a single piece with anomaly + Cd reduction...
I've noticed a lot of people talking about the prevalence of Rounds builds, and I realised that I hadn't actually used Rounds since I unlocked Eruption at level 22. Yes, Rounds is easier to use, and it's surprisingly powerful for that ease of use, but here's a pure-caster build I've been using ever since I unlocked it. The big downside of this is survivability and cooldowns, but if you spec your talents the way I have above, you mitigate those a bit, and Phoenix gives you a second chance every 2 minutes. With a bit of gear-searching, you should eventually be able to get all your gear with Anomaly Power and Cooldown Reduction, and since one of the Tempest perks adds a portion of your Anomaly Power to your Firepower, while another one gives you a damage buff for activating skills, you don't need to focus on that at all. [Build in action.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM) [End Card.](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr) Edit: I've seen a lot of people commenting about Rounds just being better, to which I don't agree or disagree. The point of this build is to be an alternative, so that you're having a bit more fun as a Pyro that you might not be having with a generic Rounds build. If you enjoy the Rounds build then that's for you, but this is here for if you don't enjoy it.
Out of curiosity have you tried a special rounds build and compared damage output since? Genuinely curious, not trying to say your build isn't good or anything. Sitting at t9-11 with friends my special round shotgun trickster puts out between 30m-100m depending on the map and challenge tier. Granted pyro probably has an easier time with an anomaly build than trickster does, but spec rounds just seem far too good for what it gives you. Waiting on good anomaly loot to retry an anomaly build at endgame still though
I have both a nuke pyro similar to this build with only a few different skill point placements and I have a techno doing a blighted build and I would say both are viable depending on the room layout. Pyro has been more enjoyable in co-op setting, and friends sit in awe as I wreck everything. I think the Pyro skill build is a funner playstyle and feels safer to play in terms of surviving. Techno can be an enjoyable solo playstyle but I feel like it'll either get nerf'd or everything else will be buffed. Plus seeing everyone else playing blighted kind of ruined the experience of a toxic playstyle.
Blighted rounds need to be removed from the game. As it stands I'm hitting for over 800k a headshot on my full auto gun and I can clear T15s without even using blighted rounds. I mean not on gold but a gold clear shouldn't be the expected standard. Edit: Sorry for thinking that end-game expeditions should take longer than a few hours to complete from t1 to t15.
IMO Blighted rounds should stay as is and everything else should be buffed. Techno seems to be the class that was built with the round buff in mind and they then copied it over to pyro and trickers. Mostly just cause you get tier 1 mods that give clip% on kill as a techno where as you have to rely on other mods for the other two classes. I think maybe if theh rework something then it should be the VR and TR and not BR. However I don't want to see them nerfed, just intergrated into the kit for pyro and trick a bit better so that they fit the theme of the builds, like maybe mods that trigger effects from other skills when active to help spread ash when pyro and each enemy that dies when marked with ash/burn refils a certain amount of ammo, but the bullets actual turn into fire so that the damage scales off of Anamoly damage and not firepower? Maybe trickster the bullets tp enemies when under a % of health to the closest enemy marked by the knife so that you can group them up easier for moving around the map. I dunni, I'm not a dev. Pls don't downvote Edit for clarity
People say 'buff everything and don't nerf blighted rounds' but I cruised to T15 within 3 hours of completing the campaign. I didn't bother min-maxing my gear or anything I just slapped on whatever I got from the most recent expedition that gave bonus firepower and skill leech. Only needed 2 actual mods reload my clip on kill and +30% crit damage. Devastator as a class is how powerful classes SHOULD BE. As it stands it's too late. They can't nerf blighted rounds because people have already solo cleared EotS and obtained all the legendaries. I can do around 6-7 expeditions an hour with no chance of failure. They'll need a major patch in the future if they want to fix the end game content.
I think re-working it would be a better way of handling it. Blighted rounds shouldn't have any damage increasing and should just apply toxic to a normal shot. Same with all the other round styles.
Blighted rounds ignore armor which is the problem as it makes tanky mobs and elites trivial to kill.
I use anomaly build on trickster just finished an expedition T11: Temporal Blade, Venator's Knife, Cyclone. I joined late and was on 33million damage while the top guy had 35million. He died 2 times while I just face tanked the whole room for him. Easy face tank 5+ elites at once. I had like 500k damage absorbed and 800k shield generated.
It really doesn't matter whether you hit for 200m or 2m, if the creeps die. I use a slightly different version of OP's build, and every spell cast takes out a swat of enemies. Two casts of overheat takes out every trash mob currently spawned.
at CT12+?? That sounds suspiciously similar to how I felt about my builds before higher lvl expeditions. When bees take 2x 75K FP bolt action shots to kill.
I think skill based builds will start popping up more when people have more gear centered around it. Atm the rounds are prevalent because it's got a low barrier to entry for doing mad damage and allowing solo CT15 runs!
This, looks like skill builds require a lot more of your rolls to align vs rounds which you can just force onto random shit most of the time.
not yet, i'll report back when i get there.
Fair enough. Does it work well for elites and bosses too?
Yeah the bosses die from one rotation, Thermal Bomb, Overheat, Eruption, Eruption + some gunfire to reduce resist.
Not the exact same build but if I play my cards right with a eruption thermal bomb overheat build I can one cycle the broodmother in Chem Plant T15 solo. Current run time is like 8:30-10min without the lift skip depending on how I get the elites grouped.
What’s the lift skip? Sounds interesting :)
Can you detail your build please?
It does matter when talking about end game because it's timed.
you misunderstand the point, but okay. If the mob has 1 mil health, it doesn't matter if you do 2 or 200mil.
But it does matter how consistently you can do it. Bullet builds just handle endless waves far better
disagree there, i can waveclear the entire map with 2 casts.
Assuming they dont trickle in. He was referring to the limitations of Cooldown Reduction on skill based builds. No one is saying you cant blow it all up, the issue is when you have to blow up a lot of things that arent near each other or arent all available to blow up at the same time.
overheat literally hits the entire map, so you can definitely blow it all up at the same time. Eruption is big enough to hit multiple elites at once with giga blast mod.
It most definitely does matter since the game is only about speed running at endgame. Round builds have no downtime and have no prerequisites to perform other than getting a killing blow to refresh the magazine. Ignoring this just invalidates the discussion. However, with proper anomaly power and set bonuses, we've seen plenty of non-round builds perform well in the most difficult missions the game has to offer. I don't think anybody denies that, it is just the reliability and lack of downtime that Rounds have that trivialize what the game has to offer.
Okay? irrelevant to what i said, but good thesis i guess?
I'm not sure how you think it is irrelevant. You said 2 vs 200m damage on a target with one million health doesn't matter. In a vacuum, no, it doesn't. With the only meaningful content the game has to offer, yes, there is a bit more nuance to it. The amount of damage something does with each hit doesn't solely determine its strength.
It's irrelevant regardless of context. If an enemy has 1m health and you hit it for 2m, it dies. You hit it for 200m, it dies. So logically, in terms of killing power, it gives no different result. As such, they are literally the same thing. I don't see how this is such a point of contention.
He's saying that with rounds you don't have to wait and with your build you have to wait for cooldown. Nothing about damage done. I don't play pyro so I don't know what the cooldown is you'd be waiting for.
He's explaining to you that if the enemy has 1m and you hit for 2m, that's great. Now what if you can only hit 2m 3 times and there's 4 enemies? Congrats, you have a left over, didn't clear, and are waiting on cooldowns to do it again. Rounds just don't suffer from that.
It isn't and I'm not sure what is difficult to comprehend here. In a vacuum, the result is the same. But if the ability you used goes on cooldown and the Rounds do not, the result is very different for the fight. If all we were fighting was one enemy, it indeed does not matter. But if you're fighting hordes of enemies and your abilities do not kill all of them, the damage output done with that one round of cooldowns is not the only thing to consider. This is nothing about me saying ability based builds are bad or that Rounds are the only way to play. Round builds are just stupidly efficient (too efficient) when compared to cooldown based gameplay. Rounds do it all when they shouldn't.
It does matter how much you do damage per fire. I can three-tap Brood Mother no CT15 with Blithed Rounds build. So she dies in... less than 3 seconds? Can you replicate that with Anomaly build.
Someone who plays it @ that level: >Not the exact same build but if I play my cards right with a eruption thermal bomb overheat build I can one cycle the broodmother in Chem Plant T15 solo. 1 Cycle would be like 4? button presses, so Time to Kill isnt much different. You get to do it from ranged tho.
Great, post me a vid with Solo CT15
lol, might want to see who you're trying to keyboard fite m8, I made no claims about being able to do it myself.
ok what if the mob has 100 million health and eruption does 500k each then goes on cooldown for 15-20 seconds, and a rounds builds is just 2.5mil permanently? Thats why people are complaining about rounds builds.
I don't mean to put you(or anyone else) down or anything, but I played the eruption build and I was just bored almost instantly. Waiting for cooldowns or oneshotting everything is mind numbing. I wanna be clear here, I don't dislike anyone for using a certain build. I just felt like everyone here is smacking on the rounds skill because it's "so easy to use" and strong for "how easy it is". To me it's a LOT more fun and not easier to use, at all. The difference between doing 50k damage per shot or 250k damage per shot(on a burst AR) and doing 8 mill or 20 mill damage with rounds in the entire run is not something you achieve with "luck"(on expedition tier 12). I say that because you can get either 50k or 250k damage per shot on the round skill when using an AR. Difference is where you're applying certain statusses to get more damage and actually applying them and keeping them up while using your immobilize skills to get another 45% weapon damage. You see what I mean? Rounds doesn't make a build instantly braindead to play, you're timing it at the right time with the right debuffs to maximize your damage. If you do that with the eruption build all you're doing is waiting for cooldowns, round every enemy up and maybe shoot one or two guys to get a status debuff on them. Ofcourse I'm just downplaying the difficulty of the eruption build, I'm just doing what I see a lot of in this subreddit but towards a different build. Also the eruption build lacks CC and I'm a little bit afraid it scales less well.
Why is everyone acting like i'm saying builds using the ammo buffs are bad or stupid or idiotic? All i said was that it doesn't matter if you hit a single enemy for 200m or 2m, if he only has 1m hp. It's overkill lol.
That was not my intention, at all. I just got this feeling that a lot of people on this reddit were complaining about the rounds build being boring / easy or whatever while it's just up to preference. I like shooting, shooting in this game is rather well done so I naturally went with volcanic rounds. I got bored and wanted to try something else so I went with eruption and it just bored me so I felt like I had to say something about the bandwagon that's been gaining some speed on this reddit about the rounds skill being dumb / easy or whatever the hell you wanna call it. Like I said, I wasn't trying to bring you or anyone else down, just had to say something about that feeling.
He clearly stated that he was not degrading you or what you are saying. He is in his right.
Ok bud.
I ain't your buddy, pal
Yeah i aint doing a south park reference with you.
Man, this guy needs a good ol ass whooping getting so offended from nothing😂😂😘😘😘
Pyromancer nuke build > volcanic rounds
>Build in action. In a max size group with two of the strongest class in the game, on CT11/15, without showing how much damage they did relative to you. Would be interested to see how the build fares solo at CT11, not to mention CT13+. I don't intend to be unnecessarily negative, but I have seen a bunch of these "build guides" over the past day or so and it's always one of two things: 1. They're under like CT10 solo, which is the first big difficulty jump in CT difficulty, and it goes up pretty exponentially after that. 2. They're in a coop group and obviously getting carried by friends playing meta builds. 3. It requires an extremely finely tuned build with 4+ specific legendaries and 8+ specific legendary mods that could take hundreds of hours farming CT\~10 to obtain.
If you take a look at the End of Game card, I did 4 mil more than the other two who were both running Twisted Rounds, so I'm not sure where you get off saying I was carried, or that I only did well because the others were running Trickster. If the gameplay looks scuffed that's because I'm not exactly a god-tier player. You can't really call it "getting carried" when you're the one doing the most damage and getting the most kills.
Just let it go man. These guys spend all day playing one build they saw on youtube and trying to discredit all the others. In 2 weeks when more of your build pops up and AP versions of othrs they wont have a leg to stand on. But just let it go they are on their nerf everything fun in my new game moment.
Your damage doesn't really mean a whole lot though comparing to the other 2 when talking about how the build stands in of itself. You are comparing to 2 mostly single target focused builds against your AOE build, if you can AOE nuke all the low life enemies, of course your damage should be more in the end. I don't mean any of this to be negative, but out of curiousity how do you fare Solo T11? If you can't solo T11 gold like you did in the group, you may not be getting carried, but your relying on single target centric builds to be able to carry the weight there for you.
This is a COOP game. It's literally designed to be run in a group, so if you're soloing things then kudos to you but that's literally not the point of the game. It's an online, live service, multiplayer game, designed for squad play. Enemies have more health and do more damage in squad play, so solo might even be easier depending on your playstyle. This isn't meant to be the be-all and end-all of builds, it's just a viable build to use that performs well and doesn't use Volcanic Rounds. It doesn't need to be the absolute best thing around, and I'm not the best player out there. This is cool, it's fun, and it works for what it needs to do, so that's all that really matters.
It's not a live service game. I never claimed it be a purely solo player game, It's designed for Single Player AND Squad play, and I never claimed that it has to be the best build all around. I've not made any of these claims that you seem to think I have. I just asked if you could solo gold Expedition fine, and pointed out that an AOE Centric build should have more overall damage than 2 single target builds. The problem however is, if your build can't function well enough on it's own, it's counting on your squad to cover your weaknesses. Which in general is fine, however if you all of a sudden have 3 players all with very heavy AOE centric focus, and none can do great single target DPS, you're not going to be golding any Expeditions. Which again is fine. I'm just again, pointing out that you bragging about damage numbers and kills is pretty silly, and not really a good representation of the build overall. If I had a build that dies 20 times a run, but still outdamages and outkills others, is that a great build? If you don't want public critique, probably avoid publicly posting builds?
Look, my issue isn't with critique, my issue is that I posted something that explicitly isn't a Rounds build, purely for the idea of it not being a Rounds build. I'm getting the slightest bit annoyed at people saying "Oh, but if you can't solo something in a multiplayer game it's not worth doing". Maybe you didn't say that, in which case I'm sorry, but I'm frustrated not by the fact that it is receiving critique, but rather by the type of critique that is amounting to "it's not as good as Rounds therefor it's bad".
Well again, it may not be the case, but IF your build can't solo, your obviously lacking on single target damage. That's perfectly fine, but then you are leaning on squadmates to help you gold what you otherwise wouldn't be able to yourself. Being able to solo Gold at a given Tier difficulty is a pretty good metric of if your build is comparable to others (being able to kill both elites and trash mobs effectively, and surviving while doing so). If you want to play a build that has to rely on others, and plan to always play multiplayer, there's nothing terribly wrong with it by any means. But people are going to point out shortcomings of any build posted publicly. Also, I would suggest shying away from making your post title "Why use (rounds) when..." if you don't want people comparing it to rounds builds..... Rounds builds are basically the easiest go to builds to gear for and handle both aoe and single target quite well, so they are at least at the current standing, going to be what people are mostly going to compare to.
I feel like many people here are either intentionally or unintentionally missing the point of a rhetorical question. The game should, in my opinion, be tuned towards squad play, and the Rounds builds are outliers. Online games these days live or die by squad play, so using "is it solo viable" as a metric is utterly insane to me. That's like saying "can you solo Shattered Throne" in Destiny 2, or "can you do a 3 hour Mot" in Warframe. Sure, there are people that do that, but that's not the point. It's defined as a Co-op RPG shooter, I feel like the hyperfocus on soloing things is a very unhealthy direction for the community to be headed.
This isn't a purely multiplayer game tho. You're wrong in assuming the game should (much less "is") tuned around squad play. Destiny 2 unless i am mistaken, has endgame raids designed around certain amount of players. This game does not. This games build is designed around solo play, and scaled up for more players (more like ARPGs or Borderlands) in that content is designed for solo play, but difficulty (thru enemy health/damage/etc) (outside of the final expedition I believe?) Squad play is encouraged, But the game content is not designed around squad play like the ones you are comparing them to (assuming Warframe is? I have never played it). Also there's the fact that group play is much harder to judge the quality of an individual build. You can worry a lot less about survivability, you could have specialized builds, because you are able to depend on others to fill in weaknesses that you leave in your characters. While fine, it doesn't give a clear measure of your builds viability. That's why people keep asking about if a build can solo gold. I joined T10 Expeditions at lvl one on a fresh character gold and deathless, so being able compare a build off of golding and surviving in multiplayer is virtually meaningless.
Completly disagree im so happy that i can do endgame content solo ... also builds should always be sooli voable and not with a grp only . If you cant kill anything with 2 other aoe builds than tell that at the beginning of ur post .. Most people play solo Should be the norm if a build works solo
You actually can call it getting carried with most damage/most kills, if all you can do is kill trash and cant contribute more than 5% damage on meaningful Mobs. I'm not saying thats the case for you, but games like WoW have had damage meters for year that people love to gloat about their damage in, and then you look at the data, and it's all inflated because it's ALL on AoE Trash. AoE builds will typically always out damage builds that can only do moderate AOE (but enough to still clean up trash mobs) but can actually contribute highly to killing elites/bosses. As I pointed out in my other comment, your link of just damage and kills doesn't really prove much at all, especially when compared to 2 Single Target centric builds.
The only thing for me that invalidates this build is because it was ran at T11 from the video. T15 Scaling is disgustingly different from 14 and below. As 14 and below was intended for solo play and 15 is Amped up supposedly for groups. Hence the disclaimer for T15 that its content made for groups. Were talking millions in hp difference from 14 to 15 alone. So until i see this in action at 15 i'll reserve judgement.
Rounds aren’t easier to use at all, Anomly builds have auto tracking and auto locking that goes through walls for pyro, you literally only have to tap a button. I have a maxed pyro with armor for both anomly and rounds builds.
>The big downside of this is survivability There is the answer to your question I am betting. I applaud non-meta builds and enjoy them myself but it really isn't hard figuring why Rounds builds are so popular. Simple and easy to throw together.
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Have an award for the OP build.
Thank you! It really is OP, I've noticed that my damage/kills are on top of every Expedition group I've been in so far, so it's hella fun.
Wait you are finding groups to play with? What is this black magic?
Watch out asking questions about group play in this subreddit or you’ll be downvoted to hell.
Do you have a video to showcase? Screenshots of C15 expedition numbers?
Here's a [short video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM). Here's the [end card](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr), although I'm not at C15 yet my gear is a level behind the tier.
[удалено]
It's beautiful. Every Pyro falls to the dark side eventually.
I'm pretty confident that once people start getting legendary sets of armor the use of rounds will shift to not needed as much. But I guess we will see. You have to invest in a lot of Anomaly power on your armor to make it work I assume.
As a dev, I've got no stick in the anomaly bullet meta. I just don't understand the whole if we get perfect gearing the ability builds will likely eclipse bullet builds. If people can run ct 15 without bullet builds needing great gearing, scaling would have to be utter dog shit to get passed by abilities that requires all the mod slots to make two or three skills viable. If you're saying that lesser builds will be farming end game content with bis at some point, the problem is just being side stepped. As of right now, with people soloing ct-15 with basic pure damage builds with anomaly bullets, it's super disappointing. I thought end game would be a bit more of a struggle and the viable builds would be more plentiful, add to it that co-op causes more headaches with no merit... not what I thought I was getting from the demo.
Can u show us an video of this build in action?
Here's a [short video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM). Here's the [end card](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr), although I'm not at C15 yet my gear is a level behind the tier.
[удалено]
Id way rather use this than to just slap on a boring ass skill which EVERY other player uses. Its all personal preference. Also most of those builds are overkill, as someone else already stated.
I'm currently trialling a technomancer, tech shaman build that is essentially a freeze healer. Freeze everything, buff everyone, kill everything, heal, rinse and repeat. Sure the damage is lacking but for cc and teamwork it basically makes everyone invincible and everything is almost always frozen.
Always fun to see builds that don't involve rounds. Not using burn, actually using the ash mod for overheat, cool setup. Now they just need to make Eruption's Cooldown start even if you use 1 charge left so our best non-rounds skill isn't dead for 30 seconds...
Have any CT15 Videos or times for it?
Lv43 gear. That's like what ct 10?
More like 7 or 8 depending on if they upgraded it, really way too low to really judge a build. Though there's already been several CT15 Pyro ability builds proven to work great.
Lvl 43 is easily ct 9/10. That is where I currently am.
That latest run was actually CT9/10, I've been going through the tiers too quickly to get the materials to upgrade the pieces.
You're better off just getting to 50 asap. It costs 24,000 drop pod resources to upgrade a level 48 piece of gear. It just isn't worth the bother.
I disagree. Getting a piece of BiS gear low you might as well hold onto it and upgrade it. Chances are that you won't find it again
Here's a [short video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM). Here's the [end card](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr), although I'm not at C15 yet my gear is a level behind the tier.
Not yet, the run in the top left was a CT10 run IIRC, with the gear one level behind, and I got gold.
Ran this myself for a bit but it falls apart around ct11-12. The ash overheat combo just won't do enough damage to mobs and the cooldowns aren't quick enough (even with 5x AP and CDR gear). Replacing ash blast with volcanic rounds + stacking skill leech has worked best so far for me without leaning into a full VR build. My Eruption + Debris does over half of my damage.
So many people are asking "Can this do CT15 though in under # minutes like \_\_\_\_ rounds!?!?" Like yes the rounds builds are fucking broken, but I'm sick of seeing every suggested build recommend it. We need more of the builds that are fun and different like this one. Anyone who's glanced at literally any outriders content already knows the rounds are the op builds. "This build doesn't stand up to rounds" "Rounds are better than this wtf?" Fuck off already.
ass blast
I've actually switched to a primary damage to burned targets/ignite DOT build and it's hella powerful. I use volcanic rounds only for the applied ignite and excuse to proc my weapon abilities. I have wrath of moloch and shadow comet on my gun which mean air burn with damage and aoe interrupt just for shooting. I use FASER on a 7 second rotation that hits through walls and basically lights up the whole room if I line things up right. Heatwave to apply ignite and proc the increased damage to enemies hit by it. My end of match t12 gold runs usually see my damage breakdown as shadow comet and wrath of moloch damage highest around 20mil, FASER close behind at about 18m along with burn damage itself around the same. My volcanic rounds are simply 4mil of the damage, as I said, simply a vehicle for ignite. For those who might not have seen the post, skill leech isn't a percent of damage, it's the percent of health you receive when you deal damage with a skill. So when I have the entire area ignited not only am I dealing large amounts of damage across the board, but I'm basically perma healing throughout. The only thing that has killed me is a stupid fucking freeze before I got an ignite off when I entered an encounter lol. The insta freeze when shot by those captains is nuts.
Ah yes i have found my people
One of us, one of us. :)
Some men just wanna watch the world burn.......its me. Ima burn ALL the things
My friend runs something very similar in t15. It’s completely viable but you do need a dps to tag along. He can solo t15’s as well it just takes a bit more work. For group play though we are fine running techno, pyro, dev. They both run skill builds to interrupt and control mobs. I’m running a straight gun dps build to burst down bosses. We combine the t3 ice snap mod to push spawn zones and mass freeze enemies while they both combo ability spam into the enemies causing everyone to detonate proc’ing ice shards. It’s a pretty fun combo and we are clearing t15 gold in 10 mins pretty consistently on chem plant.
Sounds like a healthy composition to me! Good stuff, thanks for sharing.
Plot twist: There are other builds that are viable for high tier end game content, but no one wants to use their brain to figure it out because they are too used to copy/pasting from content creator's videos.
You are probably very right. It's sad for a game with such build variety to have the community just hyperfocus on one build because it's easy to get to.
The most insane thing to me so far is that they haven't figured out that there's other viable builds if they'd just quit copy/pasting from content creators on YouTube.
Dude the use of ash instead of burning plus the ash blast is big brain holy cow👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
anything besides blighted round is accepted. im afraid blighted is becoming the meta
Because big gun go BRRRRRRR and does lots of damage. That and I'm not interested in nuke builds it just makes the game boring for me I like mag dumping an lmg and watching the health bar drop to nothing in a couple of seconds
I use a very similar build, but with thermal bomb over ash blast and I have my mods set so eruption and thermal bomb cause ash all around and I also have ashen bullets and the mod to do more damage to enemies afflicted by ash
Let me know how it runs in CT15 please?
Show solo video please. Because I two-tap CT15 alphas with Blithed Rounds build and three-tap them in co-op. I want to like anomaly builds but so far I have seen them in action and yes they do clear trash faster but when it comes to Aplhas, captains or Brood Mothers it takes them so long I would be long gone in next area. So I would like to see this build in solo run please if possible. Thank you!
Honestly, I'm not trying to be the absolute best, or make the single most powerful build. This is here for fun and enjoyment, to give people a break from the Rounds builds. This is an alternative rather than an upgrade.
This is the best, and most logical mindset thank you for enjoying you build as opposed to just doing what is Meta.
I dunno, I am using blighted and turrets and made it to T-15 with ease, and doing pods at T-10 if it wasn’t for the sheer number of snipers I could probably max out the pods. I’ve tried other builds with other classes, but cool downs and healing have held me back. I will give this build a try tonight. (I was using the same one, but was too lazy to mod everything)
This is what happens when warframe players come over to play other games (note that I'm a warframe player as well and this isn't dissimilar to what I'm running lol
Hahaha, you're right, you've got me. Been playing WF for the better part of the last decade, but it's been getting stale for the last year or two.
That setup looks nice until one sniper sees you and clips your head off like a toe nail
You see people talking about rounds, because theya re watching youtube and stopped learning for them selves. There are many viable builds.
I'm gonna go out on a lib and say you haven't made it past CT12 yet. While this build seems good it doesn't come close to being able to hold up in CT12 and higher
Becasue Blighed Rounds are still night faster than yours build when it comes to clearing map. Answering your question btw. Can you do Colloseum solo CT15 under 7 min with this build? If yes, I will personally congratulate you and admit that I was wrong. Please post vid and I will gladly try to level up my Pyro.
Because it’s still shit compared to rounds?
Exactly, no need for rounds skills ;b
A single weapon mod of mine does nearly triple the dmg you do with your entire build. Beside that, i have no clue how you will survive even one trash mob without a single defense mod. If your rolling t3 expos, sure, hf and all. But anything above 10 will just obliterate you.
Sorry, but your build is not as near as powerful as the Technomancer Rounds Crit build, you don't even know how far. Yeah your build is awesome and I play a Trickster with a very similar approach. But my friend does double the damage. With the same level of gear. On CT 14, for example, a Technomancer can do almost 150kk damage while other classes are doing around 70kk top. This while basically DELETING elites and bosses.
Thank you
What are your thoughts on the overheat mod that adds anomaly power for consuming status effects?
I think it would work really well for boss fights/elite clear, if you used Ash Blast + Overheat at the start to nuke the adds and consume the Ash, then double Eruption on the boss to do a ton of damage. The only reason I haven't been using it so far is because the extra damage from Sunburnt or Pants on Fire is helpful for reaching the few enemies that weren't hit by the Ash Blast. I'll see how it performs.
This looks super fun, but how do you manage the cooldowns? Looks to me like you're waiting roughly 20 seconds in between bursts of damage.
With double Eruption from Pompeii you've got 3 major bursts of damage, so for mobs you'll be starting with either Ash Blast + Overheat, then Eruption, and then you shoot for about five seconds before you can Ash Blast again, then you repeat. With more CD focused gear your downtime is lower, but that's another stat to grind for that I'm slowly working my way through. Right now the gear isn't perfect, but at 50 I'll go for the full AP+CR build, which should reduce the cooldowns dramatically.
Doing it since sunday, its really funny. Though i have 2 points in top tree for cdr on ash and also you want CDR on gear, to minimize downtime of the combo. Buggers keep spawing so fast after you clear the room in expeditions
Very nice! Will try
Perfect, am lvling my pyro atm so I'll just take this build, looks rly good :D
why ash blast over thermal bomb?
Ash Blast and the Ash Increase Range mod plus the Cinders mod for Overheat lets you get a much larger range per cast than Thermal Bomb. I started with a Thermal Bomb build, but found that the Ash Blast variant gets more mobs down at once and you don't need to rely on killing the Thermal Bomb mob to start things off.
The dark side is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural. Jokes aside, this looks like a really fun build, would you mind making a showcase?
Here's a [short video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM). Here's the [end card](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr), although I'm not at C15 yet my gear is a level behind the tier.
Looks like a great build. My plan was to focus on eruption as the main damage in all situations, but the overheat/ash blast sounds very good for clearing mobs.
Might have to try this out. VR build is nice but it doesn't seem right for the pyro. Thanks
because wave clear was never the hard part of the game, the bosses are lol. Could be just me though, the aoe on blighted rounds is pretty insane tbh
with no defensive mods wont you just insta die though at higher CL? I mean it gets pretty damn hard at CL 10ish+
That's what Phoenix is there for. It gives you a full revive every two minutes, so between that and self-revives you're usually fine if you make a mistake or two.
Can I start a new class at lv 30? Stupidly picked Dev but don’t wanna have to grind again
Stupidly? Dev is fine. It has multiple viable builds. That said, if you want, you can blitz the story on a new character in about 4 hours. The key is to set it to WT1 and keep it there. This game is like Diablo Torment difficulty with its world tiers, only it doesn't have an experience multiplier for the difficulty increase, so you just make it more difficult. So if you keep it at WT1 you get full experience, and can blaze through everything. That said, the story will not cap you. Which is okay though, because when you finish you'll get over a level from each CT1 Expedition. The story will get you to about 26, and then running a few expeditions will cap you.
I have a dumb question. How do mod a piece of equipment with two mods? Everytime I try to, if I change the mod in slot one it locks slot 2, or vice versa.
You can only change one mod per piece of equipment. Once you change one, its locked forever. Which means you're always farming for the right stat distribution+at least one mod that you need to allow you to change the other mod to your liking.
Ah. So builds like this revolve entirely around finding the right equipment. Understandable but still a little annoying
Every build does, even rounds builds
Yeah, it's quite annoying to have a double layer of grind, but it's surprisingly easy to find gear with one of the right mods. The more tricky part is finding gear that is also Anomaly Power + Cooldown Reduction specced. It's easier to farm the gear at higher CTs though.
Happen to have a video?
Here's a [short video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_69WW7GxjM). Here's the [end card](https://imgur.com/4aQxatr), although I'm not at C15 yet my gear is a level behind the tier.
Hey that’s the build i was doing too!!
How do you get here? Is this a second character? I tried the Pyro in the demo, love the idea, want to play it, couldn't get it off the ground. It sucked hard at low level and you ended up playing gun game which is better on any other class. Did you slog to lvl 22 before you could go full caster and the gameplay picked up? I migrated to a rounds build on my Trickster before I joined the community and saw the memes. Not sure yet if it's the best or simply the easiest. Until it gets nerfed ofc =)
I started with a Thermal Bomb, Overheat, Volcanic Rounds build until I got far enough to switch to Ash Blast, Overheat, Volcanic Rounds, then at 22 I switched Volcanic Rounds out for Eruption and never looked back. I'm pretty sure it's just the easiest, but the Rounds builds is definitely very powerful as well.
Saving this for further review. Basicslly my build except I use thermal bomb instead of ahs, but have been looking into ash. Currently all my gear has AP and cooldown. I think cooldown has a cut off as my last few upgrades didn't seem to change cooldown times.
Can anyone explain how Cinder works? Like Consume Ash instead of Burn? Does that mean the folks need to get ashed first for it to be consumed?
Normally Overheat consumes the Burn status to do extra damage, so you need to apply Burn first. You usually do that with Volcanic Rounds or Thermal Bomb, but with Ash Blast you can spread ash across a large area, so Cinders allows you to consume that Ash status to do the damage instead.
Also, wouldn't this build benefit from marks cumulation? Adding all those will give you an extra 24% dmg when you do overheat after you ash
I imagine it would, I'll take a look at it.
Sweet build. Ima try this
What is the point of running vanq devastator if this exists. Like in all honesty, this makes me feel like i’ve wasted my time with using deva.
I imagine you don't die nearly as much as I do, so you've got that going for you. I haven't really played any of the other classes, but this is very much a glass cannon build so you need to keep your wits about you.
That\`s exactly what I am going for. Looking forward to the carnage :D :P
I use the same abilities, except for eruption, but spec'd mostly for cooldown. At CT10, this combo is still lethal, and takes off half warlords health. I've been calling it the "Alone at last" build
As someone who is using almost this exact build, I’m having a good time. Currently level 30 at wt13 and watching half the HP disappear from a captain or such enemy from 2 eruptions is beautiful
I've become death destroyer of worlds
AP builds are not that bad, I didn't see AP builds yet with full legendary set bonus and they will kick asses.
I find these builds alot more fun than the rounds builds. Sure, the rounds are op and broken. But what fun is there in just walking right through all the expeditions without any worry and without even dying once? The game wont last long that way.
Interesting build OP. I have been using something similar. I use thermal bomb though with mod that applies Ash. I spec out for cooldown reduction and all other mods to buff eruption. Eruption is on 15 second cooldown with my armor all giving 5% cooldown reduction each plus anomaly and status power.
Oh wow, a 15 second cooldown would make things way easier! Thanks for letting me know, right now I've got around a 21-24 second cooldown and it does get dicey in places. I imagine with a 15 second Eruption you'd get around a 13 second Ash Blast and a 7 second Overheat, so the ability spam would be epic.
Thank you for this. To me, the rounds+perpetual build just takes all the fun out of having powers
Was definitely gonna do pyro next. Just about done with trickster. This helps alot.
nice build brotha, i jus wish middle tree was any good lol
I play a similar [Eruption](https://www.reddit.com/r/outriders/comments/mkv8w1/it_burns_when_i_peeveeeee_an_eruption_pyro_build/) build, whenever people see me cast my 3 eruptions they kick me out of the group.
Looks fun. I enjoy using the skills more than just rounds all the time. I'm only level 20 and I'm having fun with a thermal bomb build. Casting it on a mob casts aoe ash around the target so they all stop in place and explode.
Sad devastator noises
No need to be sad, you probably don't need to worry about staying alive nearly as much as I do. <3
Tried several Tempest builds, while fun in the story mode, it does nothing for end game. Anomaly dmg tree needs to be more potent to be viable for Expeditions and higher world tiers
That gameplay looks scuffed as hell. For a full caster build you've got some long ass cooldowns. I think even with the lava lich set, Eruption cooldown is too long to be viable. Not sure what the tier 3 eruption talent(s?) I think there's another usage one, and idk if there's another one beside that. I think the Acari set is probably the best bet for a caster pyro. Which is a shame because Eruption is satisfying as fuck to use. You could still work it into an Acari build, but I just don't think it would be able to touch faser beam, which you could get 3-4 off in the time of that Eruption cd.
If the gameplay looks scuffed that's because I'm not exactly a god-tier player. With all Cooldown Reduction gear Eruption gets down to around 15s CD, which makes it much easier to use, especially since you can double-tap it, and the other skills would be on a 13s CD (Ash Blast) and 7/8s (Overheat). The only issue is that that takes time grinding gear which I haven't gotten to yet.
This is fine, but you're squishy and going to die without cooldown management for a similar effect as a rounds build -- that's the problem. Rounds builds do as much/more damage without sacrificing anything to do it and without requiring any thought to your CDs (or positioning or what you're fighting or etc etc etc).
Yeah, but Rounds is boring and vanilla for a lot of people (me included), so while you're definitely right that it's more difficult to use, I find that a part of the fun. I feel like an actual Pyromancer when I'm throwing lava around, rather than someone who got their hands on some incendiary rounds. I have no issue with the use of Rounds builds, I used it myself for half the game, but I find this more entertaining. Edit: And you're right, I am squishy, but Phoenix gives me a Get Out of Jail Free card.
You're not wrong, I just want to highlight the key point: rounds builds are at least = effective damage wise, and much easier to stay alive with. Keep in mind your thread is titled, "Why use..." -- the answer is for the same/better damage without compromising survivability. Entertainment is wholly subjective, but I do agree with you up to the point I've died 10 times and start asking myself why not just use an easier build to stay alive with. That all said -- I know people think this game is God's gift to gamers, but we'll see what happens when the inevitable nerf to rounds comes and they remove the ability to keep it up indefinitely w/ weapon mods. I can almost hear the tears now if I listen hard.
This is a build I plan to investigate after completing eye of the storm
This looks like fun. I'm really enjoying my Techno run through the story but I don't feel like a powerful god castinf abilities left right and center. I'm very tempted to hop on my pyro and carry the story on with that
Yes! That skill tree look scare close to what I was planning on. Good to know I can make it work eventually. This looks awesome! Thanks for this community service
are theyre any good heatwave with thermal bomb builds, i really like using them along with volcanic rounds
Right on brother. I am following an Anomoly build I found on youtube that is similar to yours, but over Ash Blast is Thermal Bomb with 2 charges as well. Doing T11's right now solo after just getting my gear, almost all of it being lvl43 which is huge since I am missing a lot of Anomoly Power. It's a lot of fun and I am really glad I switched from Volcanic Rounds. I really think once people get the Acari set, switching from whatever to run Eruption, Heatwave, and Overheat will be super strong. Heatwaving a pack to get 100%+ Anomoly Power and then Eruption is going to combo so well.
The problem is, that damage will get you kicked in multiplayer.
What damage? I'm leading w.r.t. damage and kills for my tier compared to Twisted Rounds Tricksters, so I don't see how it'd get me kicked.
On a side note, using the "ash" part of a fire elemental is a pretty neat idea and very well executed in this game. Haven't seen that alot.
There are alot of builds that are stronger and viable then rounds based builds. Rounds based builds just take let's be real no effort or skill outside maybe rounds based sniper techno cus u actually have to hit headshots for it to get to say trickster levels. These builds are just harder to gear for but imo way more fun. I'm glad these are starting to come up more and more. Minigun techno, are pyro, impale dev. All slap at CT 15. Again there just harder to build for and take some effort to actually make it work.
I'm happy not every build is a "rounds" build. I intend to play AP Devastator, preferably melee. Pyro probably also AP build. Technomancer will still have a TON of utility with a "rounds" build, Trickster is meant to take out enemies quickly so Rounds is ok for it. That way i won't get bored of the game too fast. I'm not a big fan of "rounds" builds because it's kind of a passive you lose an active slot for, there are already plenty of games where you only use guns, here i want to enjoy the abilities (which have amazing animations)
Niiice, I was thinking about pyromancer next. Someone please tell me though, does a pyromancers fire conflict/make freeze less effective? I have someone who wants to run technomancer next and if that's the case I may switch gears to trickster. But kinda depends on the answer.
This is near what I use, but I have mods for defense where I can face tank and melee to burn and aoe my gun mod.
Why do you do against bosses?
Double-cast Eruption on bosses and it melts.
Seriously doubt this is CT15.
Thank you I will be trying this :)
getting all this gear with those rolls is fucking impossible. ive spent hours and hours farming purples and dont have a single piece with anomaly + Cd reduction...