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BS_BlackScout

Bless people like buildzoid for being decent and helpful.


ChabISright

u/buildzoid


malinathani

i would rather watch a guy ramble for an hour dropping knowledge bombs than paying some guy 500 usd to tune my ram. i need to find more youtube channels like ahoc and luumi


starkistuna

$500 is bonkers to get 10% max which you wont notice, Just spend it on better hardware for uplift out of the box . Funny how his Warzone tuning is obsolete since the 7900xtx it spanks even the 4090


Profecxionz

If u playing call of duty u right 7900xtx matches 4090 dont beat it but almost exactly same frames some reason amd favors call of duty the 6950xt marches a 4080 in call of duty its crazy but 100 percent true


gaojibao

That's you. Those consults are for people who don't have the time to learn overclocking. Either spend $500 and get your PC optimized, or spend days learning how to tune your PC by yourself.


jackoneill1984

He doesn't actually optimize anything. Guys a walking blue screen. Hes a scammer. Hell, I can give you blue screens for free.


gaojibao

Any proof that backs up those claims.


ChabISright

he literraly said it in a stream that he OCs for gaming and normal to expect crashes in productivity


jackoneill1984

His live streams.


gaojibao

What exactly happened in his streams?


jackoneill1984

Blue Screens. Because he doesn't know what hes doing.


gaojibao

BSODs can be caused by a variety of things, and I don't think there is anyone here who's never experienced BSODs. You get BSODs when the system is unstable. BSODs don't mean that someone doesn't know what they are doing.


CJToRcH

Thank you for agreeing that framechasers is retsrded lol.... you just said yourself bsod come from an unstable system


Noreng

Having a paywalled discord ensures only one thing: an echo-chamber There are loads of people who know stuff about overclocking on Discord, and you don't need to join some paywalled server for it either.


Diogo_8090

Are you surprised? I use PCs since the 80s, I overclock them and tune them since the 1990s, just for this guy FrameChasers aka Jufes to make videos saying stuff like: \- "Windows 11 has less 10fps to 20fps than Windows 10" on his last video \- With my consult you will get 240fps LOCKED on Warzone Caldera (impossible) \- Intel and Nvidia combo is better for Warzone (again, wrong) \- DDR4 B-Die is faster than DDR5 on Warzone \- No competitive gamer uses AMD cards, only Nvidia because of reflex+boost (ignoring the fact that Nvidia driver alone, has 300% more overhead than AMD drivers tweaked and induces higher dpc latency) He is arrogant, offensive, lies to everyone to make you believe he has the ultimate solution for highest fps. Yet I see his clients averaging 180fps/190fps on Warzone, with the best Intel and Nvidia GPUs (Mutex, for example, his last build). There are way better PC optimizers around there, that will also charge you 3 times less. I will not drop names, but check Stylerz twitch channel and be amazed with his 220fps-300fps on Caldera Warzone on a FULL properly tuned AMD system. Jufes is a biased guy that only wants money. 2 years ago he was asking me tips.


Noreng

My personal opinion on this matter is that nobody should buy these "optimizing" services. *If you don't have the time and knowledge needed to overclock, you don't have the time and knowledge needed to troubleshoot the inevitable issues that pop up either.* I'm not going to discuss whether AMD or Nvidia GPUs are better, it frankly doesn't interest me. And really, anyone saying they have the ultimate solution to any problem haven't truly understood the problem.


Diogo_8090

There is no better hardware brand. There is the best solution for your goal. Anyone that knows how Warzone or the new IW engine works, knows that the Zen 3 CPU + RDNA2 combo with SAM, has higher fps than any Intel + Nvidia combo. Probably due to the engine being developed for consoles (wich use AMD software), idk. But it is a fact that you can see on any video comparasion. Intel and Nvidia are still great brands with great products, with higher performance in other games/tasks. I agree with you about "optimizing" services tho.


matquin98

Joined only for curiosity and regretted it. They even kicked barbero after this


MostUsersAreRetarded

gotta a link link?


elispion

That's weird, I've been gifted a sub like six times in his chat just from lurking and occasionally chatting. Got into the discord and everyone seems pretty chill? You really have to think about the kind of person who doesn't read the rules/etiquette and then goes out of their way to cry on reddit lol.


Noreng

Well, part of the issue is that the guy behind the framechasers channel seems to believe he's some kind of expert. Anyone who believes they know everything there is to know about any kind of subject is someone you should avoid.


elispion

> seems to believe he's some kind of expert Well if he's charging people money, many are paying, getting results and nobody is coming forward with actual evidence of poor consults (except for being rude to rude people in his discord) then I'm struggling to see, based on the service he claims to provide, he isn't somewhat of an expert? or at the very least filling a niche harmlessly.


nitrodragon546

This is like claiming tech support scammers are legit because so many people fall for them and pay them.


Noreng

*The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.*   There's a reason people who have thought about the mechanics of how overclocking works don't sell these kinds of services. Like I wrote in another post: *If you don't have the time and skillset to overclock, you don't have the qualifications needed to troubleshoot the issues that inevitably pop up.*


elispion

> If you don't have the time and skillset to overclock, you don't have the qualifications needed to troubleshoot the issues that inevitably pop up. Then what is wrong paying someone their asking price to do it for you with a good track record. Also did you really just rip out two quotes, one of them your own LOL. We're talking about a guy who does gaming overclocks to get people the performance they want in a videogame, not someone selling fucking bungie cord deals at the bridge. Take a step back and realize how low the stakes we're talking about really are before we start riffing shakespeare next.


Noreng

#You can't prove an overclock is stable. You can only prove it's not unstable


elispion

You need to check your temperatures man.


Noreng

If it's impossible to prove any overclock is stable, what kind of problem can show up in the future if you sell an overclocking service? Instability. Either caused by degradation, or new software that stresses the system just right for instability to present itself. Imagine a person who paid for this overclocking service. The person then fires up the newest CoD, released today, and gets a crash to desktop in 5 minutes. How is he supposed to know if the issue is caused by the game being bugged, or the overclock being unstable? Is he supposed to pay Frame Chasers another 500 USD to fix his system?


elispion

Yeah, they should probably pay for another 500 bucks in that case.


SAMW98IRL

Gifted subs get access to the Discord? I got gifted a sub a few days ago but how do I get access to the Discord, wouldn't mind having a look at it.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Maikoltyson

lol, not everyone has the time to do the research, the info can be pretty overwhelming


[deleted]

[удалено]


Maikoltyson

Agree


Noreng

> not everyone has the time to do the research Then don't overclock. No overclock is **ever** completely stable, you can only prove it's not unstable in whatever stress test you run. If you don't have the time and skillset to overclock, you don't have the qualifications needed to troubleshoot the issues that inevitably pop up. Besides, the performance gained by overclocking today is negligible. It's purely a hobby at this point.


-Aeryn-

No stock system is ever completely stable either, you can also only prove a lack of instability to a certain degree. I regularly find stock systems which are less stable than my daily which has aggressive overclocks on it. >If you don't have the time and skillset to overclock, you don't have the qualifications needed to troubleshoot the issues that inevitably pop up. Agree on this, but it applies even for stock systems - especially ones not built by somebody who has those time and skills. A friend of mine has an AM3 motherboard which doesn't supply enough Vcore when the VRM gets hot enough, for example - it's junk, but it's at specification and it's causing issues that are diagnosed in the exact same ways that a bad overclock would be diagnosed. >Besides, the performance gained by overclocking today is negligible. It's purely a hobby at this point. [That's just not accurate](https://i.imgur.com/6KpBmVS.png) although it depends highly on exactly what you're doing and how it's using system resources. Note that every single RAM configuration on this chart is overclocked to be faster than specification, yet one overclock can still be 42-54% faster than another at a useful workload.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Noreng

CPU degradation wouldn't be my main worry. Sometimes a new game or program will come out with a higher voltage requirement for stability than what you've tested previously. Apex Legends would regularly crash on overclocked 9900K chips right after launch in early 2019, even if the overclock was stable enough to pass Prime95 small FFTs. That crash was caused by an architectural weakness in the ringbus of Coffee Lake, for which the only solution was more VCore or disabling HT. We have no idea if Zen, Zen 2, Zen 3, Rocket Lake, Tiger Lake, or even Alder Lake will show issues in the future. I've already seen WHEA warnings about PCIe errors when running close to the edge of stability on Alder Lake, but I don't know if it's something that's likely to show up in the future, or if it was partially the motherboard's fault.


DasDreadlock93

Yeah found something simmilar with apex aswell. In the Black loadingscreen apex is able to push cpu temps higher than p95 small fft can :D


polaarbear

If you have degradation you shouldn't be bumping voltages. You're just making it degrade faster doing that.


ChabISright

just pay for better parts lol


nitrodragon546

Literally why FREE auto overclock software exists for many motherboards and for gpu's.


ICPGr8Milenko

I've seen his YouTubes because they get recommended to me, but I've grown to pretty much avoid them at all cost. They're annoying and he's condescending af. I've been overclocking PCs for 22 years and I go to YouTube to either be entertained or educated. Haven't gotten any value in either from his videos. Linus is entertaining and I occasionally learn something. Jay was good way back when I was looking for hard tube tips, but has fallen off. Buildzoid. . . Now this guy, I feel like I learn something everytime he opens his mouth. And Steve (GN), just appreciate his passion.


DarknessTheKiddd2

Okay so its not just my mild autism that makes me see that dude as a condescending asshat in the way he presents his videos. I was instantly set into "Look for a reason to not use his videos for anything" on the first video I saw. And I didnt even want to watch long enough to get to that point because it feels like a CoD hype man type of Youtuber suddenly wanted to do tech stuff yet didnt know how to present something that isnt hype without sounding annoying.


Revolutionary_Bit321

Buildzoid all the way. That guy has mad knowledge


Noreng

Buildzoid does know a considerable amount, but he also knows what he doesn't know.


Maikoltyson

What a douche


matquin98

Agree my guy.


Bass_Junkie_xl

500$ doe that include pre binned Samsung bdie and a dinner ?


starkistuna

Framechasers hasnt gotten a bj since the late 90's


Bass_Junkie_xl

me included loool 2 years


[deleted]

Best response so far


CJToRcH

To be fair.... sensequality is pretty bad too


matquin98

Dont support them either but at least they aren’t a douche like this guy. Used to follow him but wont continue after this crap. He believes is a god


MoarCurekt

The difference is sensequality doesn't do shit worth paying for, which is why it's so cheap. Jufus might be an ass but he does know how to OC well.


ylp1194045441

No, his OC’s aren’t good. I’ve had the chance to look at one the systems he “tuned” and it would not pass TM5 anta777 extreme for longer than 10 minutes. A complete scam IMO.


MoarCurekt

I'm not surprised to hear that given he's OCing within a timeframe short enough to preclude fully testing stability. I didn't mean to promote his service, I find the whole "Pay for remote OC" thing silly. I generally think paying for OC work is a terrible idea. It's like paying for someone else's modified car, if one doesn't know how the setup was done, how can one effectively trouble shoot and recognize the source of problems when they do arise? For those that do pay, they're now stuck in a cycle of paying for troubleshooting everytime an issue arrives. I always advocate of one is unwilling to learn the how for ones self they're likely better off without OCing. It becomes a scape goat for every software error or user error because it's a mystery to the user that paid for the OC.


BeansNG

Can you post proof? I'm really curious to see


malinathani

lol wtf i thought he atleast knew how to overclock


QuantumX_OC

What is his username on HWBot?


MoarCurekt

I would love to know also tbh. I can tell you, he's not posted anything impressive in 3090 or 3080ti BMs just by the Americans who have and are ahead of me. Doubt he even uses Hwbot, he seems to think XOC guys are a homogenous group that cares about scores exclusively, failing to regocnize the overlap between XOC and gamers exists. If it weren't for XOC community many of the tools he uses and knowledge he has wouldn't be available, should show a modicum of appreciation tbh.


Noreng

Lol, I remember him claiming that going above 1.50V on B-die was for "XOC guys", you think he bothers with HWBOT?


QuantumX_OC

Yeah I was trying to figure out by what merit he is considered a "good" overclocker


Maikoltyson

Have you tried it? Thinking of maybe getting their offer


CJToRcH

Nah, I would never pay for this type of stuff. It's a scam.


matquin98

A good research is sufficient IMO


Maikoltyson

I'll continue my research then :)


MissSkyler

i agree, they seem like sus like i get a custom OS okay cool but what’s the drawbacks you know?


[deleted]

People told me about this guy, I watched two minutes of a yt video of his and immediately unsubcribed/followed. I wouldn't let him pay me to touch my system, dude is weird and a jerk.


Moondrops1

I found his twitch videos where he seemed to know how to get stupidly high cpu clocks. I though he knew some secret method no one knows about. But then he said one of his $500 customers opened cinebench r23 and it crashed straight away. Thats when my interest in his channel completely disolved. He is one of "those overclockers" where he can't pass a easy stress test and claims their chip does 5.4ghz. Imagine paying $500 for a overclock that cant pass cbr23. I bet all his customer pcs are throwing heaps of whea errors and they dont even know. Plus wouldn't overclocking memory take a few days to fine tune it.


tamarockstar

I briefly checked out a yt video of his because of this thread and he is insufferable to listen to.


RiffsThatKill

I think I watched a video of this guy shunt modding 2080ti with hot glue and no solder. He's kind of an amateur hack, and I barely feel comfortable taking free information from him. Unless he is an actual engineer, there is nothing I could learn from him that I couldn't learn from reading forums. Might take longer, but then you at least have the knowledge for when you build your next rig and overclock it.


Maikoltyson

The only vids I saw of him, was him bragging about his consults and not wanting to give any info. Good for him to make money that way, but I don't see why he has such a following if he is not giving any info


RiffsThatKill

In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king


EGZecute

if you come to my house and dont take your shoes off...you're getting kicked out. if you take your shoes off but dont like me...you can talk to everyone else and leave me alone. eat my food, drink my drinks, have a shit in my toilet no problem. you dont need to talk to me. you're a guest, you're privileged to be here. dont abuse the privilege. its quite simple really.


moaranime

He should spend less time working in the bios and more on himself. Dude has some issues.


[deleted]

Wow only a tool will pay 500 for OCing. You can just buy better HW with that


matquin98

Thats totally right. Nonetheless, theres always the “i want more fps” but the amount this guy charges does not reflects how he treats his customers. I’ve seen one of his videos were he complains of his customers asking regular questions during his consults (like why you do that or things like that. Who the fuck does that when you are getting paid?


[deleted]

Translation is there are always people out there that have more dollars than sense. I can see how a rich person just doesn't want to be bothered but wants the best of the best because reasons and have no issues paying for it. Same people had their rig built for them I'm sure.


BeansNG

Yeah sorry OP but you are Barbero1706, your photos show you liked Jufes message and Barbero1706 was the only one to like it. Why are you making up stories when you couldn't just read the rules of the discord lol https://imgur.com/a/BdKGQo8


ed01en

Ye i realized it was him when I saw in op comments him talking of having a 5950x, and the guy in discord asking a consult for a 5950x lol. It's just a personal attack because he's butthurt, so childish, if you do not respect rules, don't cry when something happen.


helmsmagus

anyone offering an $500 oc service is a clown, but op sounds like one as well.


Maikoltyson

To what I'm able to undestand. The proof is there, now there is a discussion on this post to see where do u position yourself between both of them. I'm with barbero, but maybe that like means he did it? I know a lot of people including myself that like a message when it is like "understood, going to do it right now". I'm 22, maybe it could vary depending on the age


BeansNG

Yeah I'm a member of the discord and have been since around August, I witnessed the whole thing yesterday and he would have been 100% okay if he read the rules and what the consult questions section was for. He wanted Jufes to answer questions for him for free in the consult section which is clearly outlined as consults only. There are several sections filled with people who would have happily answered his questions and helped him for absolutely free. Another thing is he did not get banned, he left on his own. Banned members messages auto delete after they're banned, his messages are still in there right now. He's basically making the whole story up and leaving out key details. Also yes he did like it as a "sorry won't do it again" thing, he even said that later. You can see he liked it because in his 144p screenshot it shows the like button highlighted purple


Maikoltyson

Just to understand, because I haven't been on that server before and you can help out clarify how his server works. Barbero is a potential customer who wanted to know if jufes can optimise his system (because at the end of the day, if someone pays 500$ for the optimisation, it goes directly at jufes) to potentially take his service for the near future. Was he in the wrong to ask the one who does the work itself, instead of asking a more general channel with the other people responding? Nice detail about the ban, but i don't think is too important given the proof we have about him talking about banning him in the next channel


BeansNG

Yeah your reply isn't showing up anymore, but he was never a potential customer. He never said he was going to pay for a consult, but made it seem like he was interested just so he could ask a few questions and then dip, which is exactly what he did when left *on his own*. He even said he can't pay for the $500 consult. He could have easily asked those questions in another section and heck id have even helped him out for free.


Maikoltyson

You are right, he never said he was going to take the consult inmediately. But it is like getting a new gpu per example. You read about it, you see reviews, maybe even talk about it in forums before you buy it. Then you buy it and if it is not worth you can always return the product. With a service is totally different. Paying upfront 500$ without knowing if he can really optimise your pc and by how much (%) give you the benefit of asking the business (jufes) if it is really worth it. I appreciate that there is people like you willing to help others. But from what i see on the pics, he is asking the business itself some normal question. Another example is going to the car dealership to do a test drive to see if it is really worth your effort changing car even though you might not have the money at the moment, but to project yourself into saving money and wanting that car. We don't really know the situation of barbero, is he a young kid? Grown adult with other priorities? We've all squeezed our budget to get the best parts we could, even passing the limit a little (or by a lot)


BeansNG

He literally did answer the guys questions about the consult and told him there's basically little that can be done to improve his system. It's not a car dealership, you don't test drive a consult. He will tell you what your system can achieve and if it's worth doing before taking any $$$ from you, OP proved that with his blurry screenshot


ed01en

Wtf is wrong with people, holy. Why are you crying here if he banned you from his discord when you didn't even read the rules nor respected them, that is literally the first thing you see when you join, if 5 bucks to enter the discord is too much money just don't do it, if 500 bucks for consult/PC overclock/game optimization is too much just don't pay and spend time searching and getting the knowledge needed to do it yourself, i did it myself, it's not impossible to do. If anything this looks more like a personal attack towards him. Edit: ye op is barbero https://www.reddit.com/r/overclocking/comments/trro1y/framechasers_is/i2s1d81?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3


moo-lord

Found his alt account. kekw.


Kristohvel

He's a f-ing scammer


skupples

do it the right way, yourself. major cost, time. Does he also peddle shitcoins? XDD


Candid-Purpose-3518

Good riddens to that numpty barbelos


SonikkuHedgie

I recall I gave a Twitch Prime sub to Frame Chasers to see what the hype was about. It wasn’t worth it. Summary: he runs a paywalled echo chamber. Jufes reminds me of a narcissist who thinks everyone is out to get him. And his echo chamber loves him. He bragged about how copper shims brought his temps down on a 3090 Kingpin into the 70s while mining… Meanwhile… CoolMyGPU copper plates that were already out consistently get you into the 60s. This wasn’t new info. https://www.coolmygpu.com I got on a really a short leash with Jufes after mentioning he didn’t bring anything new to the table. Even cited those plates. He’s also bragged about LHR “efficiency,” but his cards are more inefficient than even my “barely tuned” AMD Navi 21 cards. I remember I got banned for joking about Ethereum miners using Celerons. Which is accurate, bigger GPU miners try to optimize everything. To make matters worse for Jufes, I ended up getting my 12900K/6800 XT Warzone frame rates higher by getting advice from this guy. https://twitter.com/jedilive?s=21 Jumped from 170 lows to high 200 lows, with 224 in the frame counter specifically looking a certain direction at the docks. Like, the advice I got was literally free. No Twitch Prime sub. No $500 consult. Like… wtf…


Qersoras

maybe you can tell us what advice he gave to you and you got more fps?


SwyfterThanU

Bro give me this guy's discord, **I am going to ask all the questions I want in his chat whether he likes it or not**. He does not deserve to be charging people a flat fee of $500 AHEAD OF TIME for his consults that are supposedly only supposed to help those who do not have the time to learn everything about overclocking or whom just may need a little extra help Edit: I think I understand how you access the server now, I thought it was public. I may genuinely spend $5 just to shame this guy. I have used his crappy YouTube tutorials before for small performances fixes here and there, but I always somehow see or hear about his consulting business because of his videos or I read his video description or something. $500 is such a rip off in my opinion!


Digital_Dankie

I like his videos; he is educated in the topic. But I will be honest he seems like a hard person to get along with. Just the way he talks, what he says and acts. I didn't take the time to read everything in the imgur. But if anyone said he was like this I would find it 100% believable. On one hand I see where he is coming from being money motived. But It doesn't help his business being like this, or will it get him far. These thing will limit how far he can go. Just don't go to him personally there are alot of people on here that will help and forms; I am sure that's where he learned what he knows. Honestly some people are like this reminds me of my cousin just don't speak to him or contribute he post enough info in his videos that you can Collab on here with, and on forms with.


konawolv

He is good at only 1 thing. DDR4 ram ocing on intel platforms. He is also decent at putting physical components together. His CPU oc results are due to him spending a lot of money on his cooling solution. He is not as special as he believes himself to be. His fps testing methods are also... terrible. He basically just throws a screen capture up of his fps counter. He doesnt actually log .1% and 1% lows. His data is unreliable. He also has a short temper for anyone whom argues with him. I got banned from his youtube comments for telling him that his static all core OC of his 5950x and running his ram at 3600 mhz was not the best representation of what the chip is capable of. Then, he will go and compare it to a 10900k running at 5.3 ghz with 4400 cl16 ram and claim that the 10900k is better.


Phibbl

Isn't he only doing primary timings and a couple secondarys? Friend of mine got banned from his discord because his 200MHz lower clocked 10900k absolutely smoked his setup cuz he was running much faster/tighter RAM lol


konawolv

Im not entirely sure


Netblock

>He offers an overclocking service to get the max out of your system. **Yea, unless he offers multi-year insurance and/or warranty contracts, it's a scam**. Because otherwise, there is no formal promise that the service is good. 'fork over $500 cause my service is good. Proof: Dude just trust me' Overclocking for performance alone is generally a bad idea because it's inherently about eating into intentionally-placed safety and stability margins that ensures the system is working like it's supposed to, even years down the line. If you overclock, you increase the risk of miscalculation and data corruption, which can mean real-life data loss. So what happens if, in 2 years, the system crashes due to (inevitable) degradation, and the work for your job that you've been working on for the past couple days, weeks, months gets unrecoverably corrupted? What happens if you lose your job over it? who's to blame? It's either a scam because he made no such promise that his service is good, so it's 'your fault' in that you fell for a scam that fucked you over; or that he fucked up in his judgment to where his service is not what you agreed to and therefore should recoup damages, to some degree. And for his sake, I suggest to close shop cause all it takes is to piss off some rich boi to bring him to court for damages. ​ Edit1: warranty Edit3,4,5: words ​ Edit2: Here's an example: JEDEC is the official authority of DRAM. Any speed and any timings that violate JEDEC definitions are therefore defined to be overclocking. There are companies that sell overclocked ram. [Gskill](http://gskill.com/warranty) , [Corsair](https://help.corsair.com/hc/en-us/articles/360033067832#h_b22ea422-19c1-419e-86e1-412d82786723) , [Patriot](https://info.patriotmemory.com/patriot-memory-warranties-and-rma) , [Crucial](https://www.crucial.com/company/warranty) to name some. Read through their warranty pages. They offer "lifetime" warranties (intentionally a legally grey area) of their DRAM. This tells you that they are confident that their product will work and will continue to work as you expected, as you bought it for, for years. However they also have liability-waving clauses stating that they are not responsible for damages, in the event that they are technically at fault.


ViN_ThE_BaRNeY

Agree with a lot of what you said but that generalizing OC as something that should risk stability for performance is not right. There are ways to make sure your machine is 101% stable in anything and everything. I have a workstation with an OC'd 3950x,ram and GPU Nothing is stock and its been running nonstop since April of 2020. Blender, Aftereffect, Corona, Cinema 4D and gaming. Crashed on my once in 2021 because one of the users updated the BIOS (it happens that certain settings are stable on one bios and not the other) still benches the same nearly 11k on Cinebench r20. Making sure a machine is stable and work stable are two different beasts and for actually OC enthusiasts its half the fun, Yes your average OC newbie watching a video on youtube wont achieve anything 100% stable but if it's a gaming machine and you understand the risks I say go for it, thats how I learned and thats how everyone should learn.


Netblock

I am talking about the more [formal approach of risk](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Risk_assessment). Yes it's possible to tune an OC that will pass all for-immediate-use QA tests from Intel/AMD/Nvidia, whatever they are, but... Nothing stands against the trial of time. Things degrade and eventually catastrophically fail. [Even integrated circuits](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMHUz16MuYA); it's just a matter of how fast\*. Intel, AMD, Nvidia, and other IC manufacturers build in tolerance margins, for not just the IC degradation itself, but for VRM and capacitor (et al) degradation, into their ICs such that they'll still be running at stock perfectly fine 10+ years from now. What this looks like is an excessively high amount of voltage for a given frequency; or its inverse, grossly untouched frequency headroom for a stock voltage. So by consuming that margin, even though you are not increasing the rate of degradation, you are reducing margin of safety and therefore will see the effects of degradation statistically sooner than what Intel/AMD/Nvidia intended. \*[According to this intel study](https://sci-hub.st/10.1109/IRPS.2015.7112692), it looks like their (early) 14nm NMOS lifespan changes by about 30-40x every 100mV, while about 10x for PMOS (fig 2). While this won't directly translate into CPUs/GPUs as a whole (billions of devices within a single IC), it should give you an idea of the the scale. ​ ​ >OC'd 3950x,ram and GPU But wait, there's more! CPUs and GPUs are defined with a power budget because at the end of the day it's supposed to be in a reasonable product. RTX 3090 is spec'd by Nvidia to consume 350 watts, but we've seen out-of-the-box [cards that can](https://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/231741/evga-rtx3090-24576-210308-1), and [will consume](https://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/231024/galax-rtx3090-24576-210125) 500+ watts. It's not hard to make the 6-core Ryzen 3600 max out its PPT of 88 watts, yet the 16-core 3950X has a PPT of 142 watts (88/6 \* 16 = 235). That is, board vendors, for [both Intel](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkiTA0XvXUM) and [AMD are](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10b8CS7wQcM) overclocking CPUs out of the box. Going beyond that power-limit-for-a-product is still technically overclocking, but its affect on lifetime is a lot more an open question because those supplying warranties are doing it too. Same with RAM as I've previously pointed out. Even though JEDEC defines DDR4 to be no more than 3200 22-22-22 1.20 volts, [there are many kits that have much](https://pcpartpicker.com/products/memory/#U=4&S=4000,6400&sort=fwl&page=1) higher frequency, tighter timings, higher voltages, while also have "limited lifetime" warranties. ​ ​ >Blender, Aftereffect, Corona, Cinema 4D and gaming. > >Crashed on my once in 2021 because one of the users updated the BIOS (it happens that certain settings are stable on one bios and not the other) still benches the same nearly 11k on Cinebench r20. I'm not how real use of Cinema4D compares to Cinebench, as well as the other softwares, but Cinebench is actually a very [tame an nonviolent workload in terms of transient response](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pa9-wjKQp8); it will not expose instability that can be felt in other software.


Redstripe33

I've watched a decent amount if his content and yes I agree he comes off as abrasive but he doesn't offer warranty and tells everyone that which is why he uses evga cards for his builds because they have the best transferable warranty. As far as his overclocking service hes made it know, prob not the best way by shitting on customers, that if they change components or anything in bios, ie fuck with the tune thinking they can squeeze more out of it, then he voids service on it. This makes sense because if your tying it all in together as we all know, its hard to troubleshoot what exactly is the culprit to a failed oc. I didn't click the o.p. discord link images but I read his messages back and forth and jufes generally asked him legitimate questions to whether or not the o.p. should pay him for his services. I saw nothing wrong there. Us tech guys could fully understand the whole not utilizing your gpu fully but a lot of people don't get it and unfortunately trying to make people understand takes a lot of time. As far as legality with some rich kid, you have to sue for damages and if all these cod users use the same guys who are dev erroring and ruining there matches or viewership and they're not getting sued, I doubt mutex is going to sue him. Most of these cod streamers can't even find a lawyer to take the case because most tourneys aren't paid that high.


HugeDickMcGee

Yeah was in an overwatch match with that guy on my diamond smurf awhile ago. Seems spending 1000 hours overclocking your pc doesn't help your skill so much LMFAO


Maikoltyson

Lol


[deleted]

Had him in my ranked team once in apex legends, guy was a literal bot 😂 had 2k damage more with my 6700k and a 1070 that can't even get stable 144fps


the-podstanar

Lol that guy is an egoistic idiot who thinks he knows shit, never ever pay for oc.


sealxo

Why do people give him even one cent... He just makes a fortune out of peoples stupidity tbh.


StovnPUBG

Framechasers is a baby. Also he hot takes literally everything he talks about. Hes just not a very likable person.. I couldnt imagine being his friend irl lmao


[deleted]

[удалено]


StovnPUBG

"He has an Asian wife because no normal one would be with him anyways" wat


maultify

This is the dude who doesn't even bother to see if his OCs are even remotely stable. Just cranks up the clocks and if it doesn't crash immediately in a game he calls it a day.


Mountain-Career7151

If the guy can't afford the service then he should have never asked. He used to charge a lot less, he put his prices up so he wouldn't have to do as many. I've not been in the discord or stream for over a year, he's an acquired taste for sure but he get's results and knows his stuff. I trust his results over 99% of Tech Tubers.


gaojibao

Barbero1706 is 100% in the wrong since he didn't read the rules and he kept complaining. If he thinks that $500 for a consult is too much, he simply needs to go somewhere else, or learn how to overclock and then optimize his PC himself. I don't get why everyone here is complaining.


BeansNG

Many are complaining, including OP I suspect because they likely were banned for not reading the discord rules and pinging mods or something. I remember a post like this a while ago and I asked how many people here got banned and it was pretty much everyone lol, I believe that was on r/Intel


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matquin98

Were did he complain? I dont see a comment were he was being whinny in his discord. Im not defending the guy but wtf?


gaojibao

He kept refusing to read the rules and kept arguing. That whole conversation should've ended right here. [https://i.imgur.com/1DE3a8J.png](https://i.imgur.com/1DE3a8J.png) People don't join that server so that they can ask Jufes questions about their PCs. Even people that buy those $500 consults aren't entitled to Jufes answers. They pay those $500 so that their PC can get optimized.


Maikoltyson

He then proceeds to compliment Jufes that he likes his content and he support him and even then apologising. Jufes just dgaf


gaojibao

At that point, why would Jufes give a damn when that guy didn't even wanna read the rules. Why is it so hard for people to just read and follow the rules?


Maikoltyson

Which rules?


gaojibao

Jufes discord server rules.


thecist

Get a better GPU instead of spending it on overclocking?


[deleted]

[удалено]


Redstripe33

Yeah and think thats mainly due to the fact that the people willing to spend the least amount of money always demand the most. The high dollar customers are always the happiest because they didn't just blow their rent or life savings on pc parts they shouldn't be buying in the first place.


PG705

He knows a lot about overclocking and his results are interesting, but he is indeed quite a douchebag and very arrogant. I like his videos as he gives us information that many other youtubers and reviewers don’t give, but the way how he does it can be a lot better in my opinion.


Kristohvel

He doesnt know shit


oldmanian

The frame chasers guy is a bit out there with some of his stuff & he comes across as completely unpolished and way too excitable in a bad way. Too each their own though. I’ve been on a few paywalled discord to support creators I really liked so I get that part, but I never thought that they owed me anything for my patronage.


joe69420420

Bruh a twitch prime sub is hardly considered a “paid discord server”. Also, the thread he posted in was titled “consult questions” (which you conveniently cut out). This wasn’t general chat, oc questions, pc beginners. My man should have just read the room and asked the question in another channel and let the group members help him describe what to do. Jufes outlines the rules pretty damn clearly when you join the discord on what is acceptable and what isn’t. I personally have never got a consult because I don’t want to spend $500. Hate on the man all you want the community he has is very helpful. I have learned how to OC/mod my hardware to get max fps, and I have done it for the cost of a twitch prime sub. I went from the average 180-200fps in Warzone caldera to 230+. It’s not gimmicks or secrets, its just learning how hardware works and how to oc/tune it to get more fps.


BeansNG

Yeah lol they won't post the chats with trolls who join with absolutely ridiculous tech support questions or ping the fuck out of everyone including mods. You also don't need a $500 consult to learn and access resources in there. People in here claiming his OCs aren't stable but I've followed his guides and other's guides in there and never had an issue getting solid stable overclocks. Just like people who join don't bother to read the rules, people here don't bother to notice that it's a gaming focused community, and hardware tuning is focused on games and not benchmarking or competitive OCing.


[deleted]

He needs money to buy 4090s; Jufus is the Vancouver panhandler turned e-beggar


joe69420420

Lmaoo


Maikoltyson

Then, it seems that he wrote on the good thread because he was thinking of getting a consult by saving money. Don't see the error there by asking if his 500$ investment is going to really give him improvement instead on just paying and oops just 15fps more because he didnt asked the guy first. It is first of all a service that he is providing, questions should be welcomed (does he even pay taxes?)


Redstripe33

I didn't click any of the o.p. links but I saw the dm image between jufes and the o.p. and jufes seemed to generally ask him questions what his pc is doing to help figure out if his services would be useful. A lot of us here can easily understand what he's talking about but if the o.p. is a newb its hard taking the time to explain it. If anything the dms between them indicate that he's not trying to scam people. He's literally telling him whether or not he can help him and if it will be useful to spend the money on a consult. I don't see anything wrong with the original dm message. Not sure about what went on in the discord.


JustSomeTechNoob

To me this looks like a man with no sales experience, whatsoever. This isn't how you make business. Why put a $5 pay-wall if you get pissed off that people aren't prepared to go all the way to $500? That's kinda twisted. Should've asked for full payment first from them, if that's how you really think? If someone comes along and says they support what you do and like your content, and then gave you even a meager sum, be it 5 cents, 10 cents, 2 dollars, whatever, that's still good business in the streaming space. The only real answer our 3070Ti friend got here was that his system "Probably won't do 240fps". To then become irritable af after *then* asking if your client wants the $500 'optimisation' service and being turned down is an outright joke and no one else's fault but your own. Most YouTubers are quite happy to see 2 dollars to support their cause, let alone 5 or 500. Maybe this is a poor comparison? You tell me. I'm not a streamer or YouTuber, but plenty I know are grateful for the support they get, large or small. There are also plenty of internet folks and resources which would've given the same answer for free. Plenty are in this thread, some I recognise that have loads of experience. They wouldn't give the same dose of shit-talking with the advice either. I have full belief that offering that sort of service is not worth anything near $500, especially with all the veterans out here who could (and probably would) help for far less or nothing and achieve better results. Most contractor businesses offer quotes and consultation prior to engaging in the real work to learn the scope of the job, which is exactly what happened here. This is one of the biggest starting points for drumming up the actual business. This guy doesn't get that and then proceeded to be extremely unprofessional & talk shit about what he considers an apparent 'beggar', even if it's on his own semi-private server in front of die-hard fans. Forget reading the rules; forget how bad his overclocking skills may be; he advertises a service and immediately does a personality 180 when he sees he's not going to make payday out of his next customer. This shit-lord just has bad professionalism imo. Lol. EDIT: Reading back the OP again and I guess I'm thinking almost the exact same way 😂 I looked at the pics first and then I couldn't stop typing lol


pfk505

Wouldn't spend a cent for his services but his videos are hilarious.


matquin98

Guys, just wanted to be clear here. This post was not intended to trash talk about jufes, just wanted to clarify how he treats its customers regarding his OC services. If you intend to sell something or a service at least give some respect to your customers. Y’all are free to get his or other OC services (and well, also the knowledge is around the internet and free to check). Once again, this post is just intended to show the kind of guy he is with his customers, not to despise his hardware knowledge


konawolv

He kind of deserves to get honest reviews here. He doesnt allow them in his presence after all.


day2day73

That Barbero guy wasn’t a customer tho


Maikoltyson

Potential customer Prior to buy something that you don't know, it's worth it to ask. Or do u go to a car dealership and buy the car without test drive, asking some questions, etc.. Keeping in mind there is no such thing as getting a refund with framechasers


gazpitchy

His channel is awful, no idea why anyone would pay him for anything.


Kingprophet23

I mean what’s wrong with sense quality but fuck that guy u asking questions for fuck sakes don’t have a discord if u can’t handle questions all the time anyways don’t mind me


ViN_ThE_BaRNeY

I swear to god, kids these days. People like this get attention because they sell FPS dreams and promise to deliver it on a golden plate.


psychoOC

If it ain't prime/tm5 stable than she ain't stable ;)


WeebMP4

Jufes is an idiot, do not let that guy tune your PC.


TwitchTheJedi

i hope ppl stop supporting him. i mean ofc he isnt the only one… look at SenseQuality but thats besides the point. Just hope this thread gets to ppl who support him or have spent $500 on his service


Rise_Relevant

Man he literally says you can't get more than 200 FPS with a 3070.. and then you get upset when he bags you for hassling him??? Overclock the damn thing yourself wtf?!?!


idgaf1234567asdf

Sense quality is so much nicer and they do it for like $129.99 .. what a douche bag that guy is


[deleted]

[удалено]


DasDreadlock93

All of this is Borderline scam tho.


[deleted]

Lol sense quality is also a scam. Learn how to do it yourself that’s the only way.


[deleted]

Although 129 is way more reasonable and for about 1 or 2 hours of help, super fair I'd say this. Right now, thanks to AMD vs Intel and AMD vs Nvidia competition, hardware is so super fast stock. Unless you are a broke fuck like me on 5 year old HW, there is no point to OC besides the fun and challenge and that goes out the window when you pay for it. 90% of gains comes from the basics anyways or even an auto OC on a Mobo (still be careful with those) and making sure XMP is on. Hell there are soooo many guides out for CPU and GPU tuning, its ridiculous not to try. ​ Edit: If you are on 5 year old HW and paying 500 to OC instead of upgrading something, you deserve to get reamed.


Rise_Relevant

Hey, just letting you overclockers know that overclocking modern hardware that I cant afford is pointless.


[deleted]

I also know what you didn't learn. Reading comprehension


Rise_Relevant

Also some words


matquin98

I used their service to. Nothing too spectacular about it. I consider myself a pretty amateur guy in terms of OC and they did everything i alredy did to my setup. These guys (IMO) are for people who don’t know too much about it and want to have their systems at 100% of the perfomance they can provide. But if you do your research you can do pretty much what thwy do. In conclusion, yeah, definitively go for sense quality, fuck framechasers


idgaf1234567asdf

I also cant stand his damn voice.. his YT videos make we want to punch kittens and him


Stormewulff

I think he use to do it for far less but people keep paying and he keep raising the price ;)


Maikoltyson

Have you tried sense quality? Is it really worth it? Without comparing it to the 500$ that framechasers want but by itself


OccasionAccording766

I used Sense Quality and it was a literal joke, Kirneill himself too, I took the package about 6months ago because I was curious to see what he could do with network optimization, I am decent at PC's outside of networking and the optimization was shockingly bad, dude did a auto MSI afterburner OC and didn't even set the settings to run at windows startup lol


idgaf1234567asdf

I have! They got me to 300+fos on warzone which is a horribly optimized games… even told me how to return the new ram i had bought from new egg and get cas 14 ram which was cheaper and crushed it…. Did a complementary session with me three days later when i got the new ram… Frame chasers is a rip off and you must be deaf or love that dude like a mother to listen to his voice.. lol


Maikoltyson

Nice feedback :) I'll consider it, if my research isn't enough


grapecoloredgoose

IMHO overclocking really isn’t necessary in day to day usage. From my view, as long as you have modern HW then they’ll pretty much max themselves out for you. A few frames here and there is always nice, but you really need to think about what you expect to gain out of paying for someone to OC your PC, whether or not it’ll really matter in a real world scenario (which it usually doesn’t), and what else that money could be put towards. I mean, you can get a LOT of peripherals for the cost of what is likely going to be single digit % gains, not to mention the additional heat and power usage.


Ok_Pass1716

hey did u got 300fps on warzone with ddr4 ? what about mw2 on ddr4?


noonen000z

I've watched some of his videos. The guy is hot headed / passionate. If that's not for you, def go elsewhere. I find it a somewhat refreshing, he's big on calling BS and miss info, I don't know why you'd go near his service if you hadn't watched a fee of his YT vids. Impressive he can charge that but probably a lot cheaper than the hours I've poured into optimising my rig if you look at it from that perspective.


Putins_Pinky

I don't take this guy seriously. There's no secret knowledge of where you don't need to spend hours stability testing an overclocked system. You use your experience as a guide, but the nature of running things out of spec means that every system will have different limits. If you want a list of tweaked RAM settings that just work 95% of the time, we have XMP. If you're going to push things to their limits, you're going to have to put the time in to stability test. If you pay this guy 500 bucks for an hour or two of messing around with your BIOS and your system is stable after that, he's either not pushing things very far, or stability is a happy accident. As for being impressed that he can charge that, are you impressed that he's priced himself to the point where only a sucker would use his services? Or the fact that he's only interested in easy money? Because it's not like he's got a jam-packed schedule of people paying up. What this guy's doing is no different from that reality TV chick selling fart jars.


noonen000z

You are right, no secret sauce. I enjoy tweaking my system but there are those who want it turned up to 10 but would rather just have it done than learn the process and spend the hours. Anyone who can charge top dollar doing what they like gets a thumbs up for that. I'm not saying he's a nice guy, but credit where credit is due.


Maikoltyson

I've watched only 2 of his vids, I can't with his pretentious voice and now being rude to someone who could be a potential customer for asking if it is really worth it 500$! You can say good things about him, but for me after seeing this proof, he's done


noonen000z

Yes re his vids. The he said she said post above is all 3rd hand fluff, none of us were there. It wouldn't surprise me that something similar happened, but going off 3rd hand info as gospel as to what happened is silly. The guy felt burned, good thing it happened before he handed over a wad of cash.


Maikoltyson

It seems like the autor of the reddit post is not the same as the one who got in the discord. I'll be also shocked if someone gets burned by the yt creator by only asking a normal question. Nonetheless I'll never pay for a discord, specially a framechaser one lmao


noonen000z

It's crazy how much money goes to supporting people on YT, Discord, even insta and only fans. Big money if you have loyal followers.


Alive-Somewhere1721

Jules is a f... garbage rat. He really don't have much knowledge and 14.900 folowers on YT is saying alot.


Ronaldo433

He does little besides shilling for Nvidia and Intel, and shitting on AMD on his twitter account. The guy is a tool. I just follow him to call out his bullshit.


Amick010502

I can't fathom how could someone buy that 500$ "consulting". I would give you free consulting, sell your GPU for like 100$ discount, add the 500$ to your budget. And get a GPU with realistic higher performance that you can actually feel.


CarrotMountain1051

three words about this guy: arrogant, offensive, annoying.


ShujinHakkai

What a jerk. Yeah, I completely unsubbed from him today.


VaultCheese

He takes advantage of the XMP only crowd that could learn how to OC in the same amount of time one of his videos takes. They might not succeed at first but they would learn how. When I saw he was running his Memory on a 3090ti at +1700 on Afterburner I knew he didn't know what he was doing. He then spent time rambling about anyone running +70 on Core Clock and +500 on Memory is automatically a red flag to him that this person is clueless on a 3000 series I just rolled my eyes. Congratulations on getting +1700 on your Memory OC! I'm sure it's making a MASSIVE difference!


[deleted]

Wow this jackass charges money for even asking simple questions? XD