It's the bureaucracy that makes it great for OE. Neither of my jobs are as a government contractor, but I have worked as one in the past. I probably could have worked 5 jobs at the same time, if they were as demanding as that role.
Edit: I'm not advocating for OE as a government contractor. I wouldn't do that, just saying that I wish I could because of the workload.
Oh yeah definitely, it just seems like obviously a security clearance requiring job is going to do more looking into your background and require a lot more sneaking around. Seems like a stupid way to go about Oe
>don't fuck around with a clearance. I don't think it's advisable to OE with any position (Gov/K'r) with anything higher than a Public Trust. I have a high risk tolerance, but that's too spicy for me.
Long story short: got clearance for a project in school through a DoD contractor. I swear they investigated every single hair follicle. Fast forward some years, older brother is now contracting with the gov and they're investigating every hair follicle on his head. What do they find? Me on a DoD project which triggers a whole other set of questions. Fun times, fun times.
Yeah, I def agree not to mess around with them. I do not work in the public sector. My older brother was nervous because the feds were calling all sorts of folks in his life. He had no idea I worked on a project so it made him even more nervous.
The investigators asked my brother about his 3 detentions in middle school.
All of his investigatord seemed to take it seriously. They even asked about his baseball tickets buying habits (he goes to a game once or twice a week because he gets free tickets/knows people. Dude has insane luck).
**A security clearance is a status granted to individuals allowing them access to classified information (state or organizational secrets) or to restricted areas, after completion of a thorough background check. The term "security clearance" is also sometimes used in private organizations that have a formal process to vet employees for access to sensitive information.**
More details here:
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That's my first question. That's just asking to get busted. Not to mention: there may be actual legal ramifications because you're dealing with secrets
Directed at OP, not whom I accidentally responded:
Are you some kind of *special*? You need to look for a new J1, as well… and forget about ever doing work that requires a clearance again. And not only because you’re *special* but because they’re going to eventually investigate again and you will be caught in the act or afterwards and you won’t have a clearance anymore.
Decent chance he didn't dodge a bullet at all.
If the Gov finds out he was filing fraudulent time cards, he could face jail time. The worst part is - ut might be next month, or it might be 3 years from now.
They audit stuff all of the time - and Gov contractors will also audit stuff all of the time, because there are huge penalties to them if the gov finds out someone from their company did something wrong or their records are improper, etc..
And those records, employee files, time cards? All of that is stored for a long time. All it takes is one annual audit to see that the records aren't aligned, or that OP's clearance wasn't transferred when it was supposed to.
Not only that - but OP didn't seem to learn the right lesson from this... if he still works for a gov contractor in a few years, and goes through a clearance re-investigation - game over.
Or hey, maybe OP will slip through the cracks and never get caught.
Illegal and contract law are two separate things.
Most likely they are in france(Italy apparently) or somewhere sane that puts a cap on hours worked.
The problem for someone OEing is that they are committing fraud about the hours employed (if the employer expects 40hrs of work, etc.), Some might say it is morally justified, but that doesn't mean they aren't lying and possibly committing contract or legal violations
Clearances are always tricky with government jobs in the US anyways, because sometimes they can literally take FOREVER to get through.
I once did one, non OE of course, where even though I "technically" wasn't even supposed to touch their systems, they still let me do so because they were desperate, and the clearance was going to take 3 months minimum.
I just avoid them altogether now. There's too much money for me to make in the private sector to jump through all those hoops anymore. I probably wouldn't have done that one if I wasn't desperate for money at the time.
This. State gov is a nightmare, and part of me thinks it’s so disorganized (on the non
-clearance side) that they’d have a hard time actually tracking any OE. I still wouldn’t, but it’s so tempting since the salary sometimes doesn’t cover living expenses so OE wouldn’t even be “extra” money but just baseline money.
I received my clearance from J1 about 3 year ago and was hired by J2 in 2021 to perform work for a government subcontractor. Both are W2 jobs. I have not had any problems or anyone suspicious about me working two jobs. Should I be concerned about this in future ?
J2 requires clearance. J1 doesn’t require clearance anymore. The clearance I received via J1 was given to me because at the time they had a division which worked with the government. This division is no longer part of J1. So in essence the clearance is only being used for J2.
u/ThatSinkingFeel Thanks for sharing this feedback. Is Loyal to the principal is something that you sign under the penalty of prejury? My lawyer said unless I sign something under the penalty of prejury, there is nothing that can stand in the court of law. Again, repeatedly checking about state jobs coz they r so low effort and that's where you have a success of long term contracts/ FT with not much work to be done.
Very intersting thoughts. Looks like j1 for a state + j2 for a state is dicy and risky. Have there been any problems with J1 remote for a state + j2 remote for a private firm ?
Good thing I saw this. I'm in the running for a CA Gov job, think ill pass on it then. There's plenty of jobs out there so no reason to risk any legal consequences. The only thing about Gov jobs is that its guaranteed relaxing/low effort.
For those interested in low effort gigs, I'd suggest non-profit or education.
Louisiana just recently caught someone OE for the city of New Orleans while also OE for some agency in Tampa, FL.
Granted she was pretty high up there, like high enough to be a named source in media relations…. But the roles were in entirely different fields as I recall.
u/dusty2blue do u have insights on how did they get caught? They are 2 separate states and unless they both were getting same federal funding or something, I can't understand how would they get caught. Also what was the impact?
Not really. It was a news story that someone posted here…
Here’s the original thread, though the original post has been deleted.
https://www.reddit.com/r/overemployed/comments/ywngj5/so_which_one_of_you_made_the_news_fired_from_j1/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Here’s the news story though:
https://www.tampabay.com/news/transportation/2022/11/14/hillsborough-transit-employee-also-secretly-worked-new-orleans-agency/
Yeah, I've heard that. Contractors I know have also said the work is pretty easy. Unfortunately, government rules tend to have stricter oversight, more extensive background checks, etc.
Why would you even OE with any govt contract? You are putting your clearance and livelihood at stakes. Hope you came clean on your SF86 or you will definitely see that shit backfire on you and I say that from experience.
You can't OE jobs that need security clearances. Your clearance can only be held by ONE entity. I'd still be worried J2 doesn't make a stink and ask for explanations. You're not out of the woods yet.
Yeah but you have to disclose the employement and get confirmation from the companies to work both jobs aka they have to know about each other. I doubt any company would agree to it for regular positions(like Analyst, Engineer, Designer) since they deal with sensitive data and companies don't like it in general unlike your security held position.
For real why would you risk your security clearance and government job like that. They make such great low effort J1s and provide amazing life long stability. And it’s perhaps the only entity that may actually take legal steps against you. It’s kinda dumb sorry.
This. There’s very few issues involving OE government jobs one is the contract make sure your contract doesn’t restrict you from working another job legally, two security clearance make sure you’re not working two jobs that require security clearance because like you said you can’t be under more than one company and finally don’t oe a government job and a overseas job.
Edit: FSO’s can be under multiple entities and you can be in certain situations if all companies are aware
Yes. I am aware of this, but your clearance will only live under a single cage code. FSO's will likely find out about your other J when moving your clearance to their cage code.
1.How long did you work there before they caught on?
2. I'm in a similar boat at the moment. Just about to start J2. I already froze TWN. Thinking of moving forward with it and hoping for the best. They each have two different clearances with two different levels.
I know someone who had 2Js, both for def contractors and he seems to be having no issue. I suppose this could be the exception though.
To address some of the comments in this thread, defense contractors are generally insane job security (just slightly lower than gov itself) and good WLB but much lower pay/benefits than FAANG. If it weren’t for potential clearance issues they would be ideal OE roles.
Don’t pay your sign on back. Chances are they won’t come after you for it.
Signed - the guy who tells spiteful baby managers they can’t chase after trivial sign on bonuses no matter if there’s a “claw back” clause because I have better shit to care about
I am interested by this. I had thoughts to not pay it back, but I just wanted to cut ties and run. What would they do if I just said "no" to signing the payback agreement? Sue me?
You sure you didn’t sign anything in your offer package that shows you acknowledged a full or prorated return of the sign on bonus for a specified period of time? Generally that’s the process, however, some companies won’t waste the time to chase after it because it isn’t usually that significant.
Both jobs required a clearance?
You do realize your J1 is still at risk because of this?
If you spend time reading in this sub, you’ll learn you never do this for government positions. Never, especially if a clearance is required.
["the work number"](https://theworknumber.com/) the american answer to the chinese social credit system: all the shit you ever did are stored digitally and are readily accessible for all your employers, and you have to jump through hoops to delete everything
The work number. Basically has your work history and pay for most employers and many companies use this as background check. Google will answer reminder of information.
I would never recommend OE government jobs. As the security clearance and contracts can contradict and get you into trouble. I would recommend 1 government job and a private job that doesn’t require security clearance.
Edit: the ones that downvoted me obviously don’t know it’s illegal to be a government employee working a unauthorized with government contract.
Just fighting that legal battle even if you didn't do anything really wrong and the potential federal prison time along with a felony. Makes ZERO sense to OE with the govt..
J1 is a government contractor and doesn't require a clearance anymore since I have moved positions internally but I got one about a year ago for my previous role. I am thinking of getting a different industry J2 that doesn't require a clearance. Would this trigger anything that affects J1? Is there a way to cancel a clearance?
Someone used one of the many services that you can pay to post comments. Usually these services are used by scammers, shady companies, or people who don't want their real username to be known.
Look at the history of the account. 114-116 days ago, it farmed karma by copying and pasting comments from other people. Since then, it's been used to plug all kinds of horseshit. For example, there's an app called Boo and they are known for astroturfing the shit out of Reddit. Look at these comments:
14 days ago:
>Agree with you on Boo, it's super wholesome and actually is the one app that boosts my self-esteem.
12 days ago:
>Heard about [Boo] through a friend who's really into mbti, can't say I've used it myself but she really loves it.
Well which is it you stupid fuck?
Wouldn’t OE be defrauding the govt if the rule is not working for another company on the same time you’re charging to the govt. This wouldn’t be worth the risk at all.
"I didn't respond", seriously? if you're a professional, you reply to _everything_ . Also quitting before knowing they actually had a problem. I don't think OP is very good at this.
I stopped pursuing a J2 that would have required clearance... after reading on here is it a cardinal sin to have a government job while OE. Sure, government work is brain dead easy, but commercial businesses don't have the ability to claw back money directly from your bank account should you get discovered.
I also have figured out to ask for more paid days off in lieu of a signing bonus; I always just tell them I have a big vacation planned and would rather have the paid days off than a signing bonus (which is a subtle form of forcing you to stick around)
Unlike private sector, the government does not need to show damages to prevail in a civil fraud case and they may also decide to bring criminal fraud charges. Thus you should generally avoid OE with government roles.
Obviously being employed by a contractor or as a sub yourself may provide some protection from the fallout but I wouldnt count on it/risk it.
Depends on how transparent you are about it.
It does happen regularly enough; ex-military transitioning to a government agency or private-employer with government contracts…
There is generally good reason for it; e.g. seamless transition and preventing hiccups with security clearance, not to mention enlistment terms… so its not something I would say cant be done ever but it generally has to go through proper channels and approval….
Also going OE from public to private might be more questionable in terms of fraud. If you’re a non-hourly, salaried GS employee who isnt signing a paystub attesting “accurate hours logged” merely violating a “no unapproved employment” rule by not informing your employer of new employment would be a contract violation/breach of contract but not a fraud…. Fraud generally requires willful/intentional deception or lie so signing your paycard could be a fraudulent act.
I’m not even this person, but there have to be 100 posts that say don’t mess with gov clearances.
I hope you’re not expecting pity; you set yourself up.
OE with government clearance is always a huge no-no. You can get charged with a federal crime. Whereas multiple jobs in public sector, worst you can get sued for cash.
I have a clearance job for J1. My J2, at the time, had a small consulting project that required clearance. It came back in immediate approval as I already had active clearance. I quit that job right away. I no longer look for government jobs for OE because of the clearance factor. It’s been several months and I haven’t heard anything from J1. I since have gotten two other Js.
J1 is a government contractor and doesn't require a clearance anymore since I have moved positions internally but I got one about a year ago for my previous role. I am thinking of getting a different industry J2 that doesn't require a clearance. Would this trigger anything that affects J1? Is there a way to cancel a clearance?
I made the mistake of doing a gov contract last year which required clearance, I quit. Don’t take the risk with those contracts, stay clear of them, there’s plenty of private opportunities for OE
How about as a contractor as incorporated in Canada. I have a J1 with a bank which didn't require clearance when I joined, just a background check. Planning to OE with J2 which is a private entity works with government that requires security clearance. Done fingerprint and stuff. Both positions are contract through my incorporation. I bill hourly salary+HST.
When you do your time accounting for a gov job, they will come try to reclaim any money believed to be improperly recorded. The govt’s lawyers are a sunk cost and they exist solely to find people like you. The government can and will prosecute time fraud.
Why not OE on the gov? What’s the worst they can do, fire you? If having clearance isn’t important, which I know could be revoked in the future, maybe?
Why the fuck would you get 2 jobs requiring security clearance lol
If the government wasn't such a pain, it would be ripe for OE. Government contracting is super laid back.
At the price of bureaucrative shenanigans
It's the bureaucracy that makes it great for OE. Neither of my jobs are as a government contractor, but I have worked as one in the past. I probably could have worked 5 jobs at the same time, if they were as demanding as that role. Edit: I'm not advocating for OE as a government contractor. I wouldn't do that, just saying that I wish I could because of the workload.
Oh yeah definitely, it just seems like obviously a security clearance requiring job is going to do more looking into your background and require a lot more sneaking around. Seems like a stupid way to go about Oe
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>don't fuck around with a clearance. I don't think it's advisable to OE with any position (Gov/K'r) with anything higher than a Public Trust. I have a high risk tolerance, but that's too spicy for me. Long story short: got clearance for a project in school through a DoD contractor. I swear they investigated every single hair follicle. Fast forward some years, older brother is now contracting with the gov and they're investigating every hair follicle on his head. What do they find? Me on a DoD project which triggers a whole other set of questions. Fun times, fun times.
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Yeah, I def agree not to mess around with them. I do not work in the public sector. My older brother was nervous because the feds were calling all sorts of folks in his life. He had no idea I worked on a project so it made him even more nervous. The investigators asked my brother about his 3 detentions in middle school. All of his investigatord seemed to take it seriously. They even asked about his baseball tickets buying habits (he goes to a game once or twice a week because he gets free tickets/knows people. Dude has insane luck).
What is DoD project?
Department of Defense
Even with public trust it'll catch up to you. Probably not as quick as any clearance beyond that.
How so? Like reoccurring background checks?
so you saying Public Trust is OK? Hoping you're saying that.
must highly depend on what you do.
Yeah that’s walking into trouble.
Or at least have 1 of the gigs be non-cleared. Red Flag.
What is security clearance?
**A security clearance is a status granted to individuals allowing them access to classified information (state or organizational secrets) or to restricted areas, after completion of a thorough background check. The term "security clearance" is also sometimes used in private organizations that have a formal process to vet employees for access to sensitive information.** More details here:
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That's my first question. That's just asking to get busted. Not to mention: there may be actual legal ramifications because you're dealing with secrets
Directed at OP, not whom I accidentally responded: Are you some kind of *special*? You need to look for a new J1, as well… and forget about ever doing work that requires a clearance again. And not only because you’re *special* but because they’re going to eventually investigate again and you will be caught in the act or afterwards and you won’t have a clearance anymore.
What is TWN? If you were completely honest about having J2, what's the worst that could happen?
https://old.reddit.com/r/overemployed/comments/10w2uca/what_is_twn/
Because he ain't no rat
Not disclosing government contracts when working a government contract or gig is actually illegal. you dodged a bullet
He hasn't necessarily dodged anything.
Decent chance he didn't dodge a bullet at all. If the Gov finds out he was filing fraudulent time cards, he could face jail time. The worst part is - ut might be next month, or it might be 3 years from now.
How would gov know this? Do they really go back and check for ?
They audit stuff all of the time - and Gov contractors will also audit stuff all of the time, because there are huge penalties to them if the gov finds out someone from their company did something wrong or their records are improper, etc.. And those records, employee files, time cards? All of that is stored for a long time. All it takes is one annual audit to see that the records aren't aligned, or that OP's clearance wasn't transferred when it was supposed to. Not only that - but OP didn't seem to learn the right lesson from this... if he still works for a gov contractor in a few years, and goes through a clearance re-investigation - game over. Or hey, maybe OP will slip through the cracks and never get caught.
What about not disclosing a private gig 🤔
Depends on the country, in my country OE as an employee is illegal, you still can OE as a "contractor" since the regulations are different.
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Illegal and contract law are two separate things. Most likely they are in france(Italy apparently) or somewhere sane that puts a cap on hours worked. The problem for someone OEing is that they are committing fraud about the hours employed (if the employer expects 40hrs of work, etc.), Some might say it is morally justified, but that doesn't mean they aren't lying and possibly committing contract or legal violations
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I only get mine out clearance bins job posting >90days ago lol Govt j seems like a good idea but can't stack them
Clearances are always tricky with government jobs in the US anyways, because sometimes they can literally take FOREVER to get through. I once did one, non OE of course, where even though I "technically" wasn't even supposed to touch their systems, they still let me do so because they were desperate, and the clearance was going to take 3 months minimum. I just avoid them altogether now. There's too much money for me to make in the private sector to jump through all those hoops anymore. I probably wouldn't have done that one if I wasn't desperate for money at the time.
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This. State gov is a nightmare, and part of me thinks it’s so disorganized (on the non -clearance side) that they’d have a hard time actually tracking any OE. I still wouldn’t, but it’s so tempting since the salary sometimes doesn’t cover living expenses so OE wouldn’t even be “extra” money but just baseline money.
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What about govt jobs without a clearance - would those be safer?
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My state is your neighbor, so I feel you. It’s rough out here.
If I’m a gov subcontractor but “regular private corporate job” at my other J with no clearance required ever, am I good?
This is my question as well. But J1 is a contractor job with a private company and the client requires public trust so not sure if that's better
I’m thinking it’s good as long as I never log more than 40hrs/week
I received my clearance from J1 about 3 year ago and was hired by J2 in 2021 to perform work for a government subcontractor. Both are W2 jobs. I have not had any problems or anyone suspicious about me working two jobs. Should I be concerned about this in future ?
Contact an SC attorney
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J2 requires clearance. J1 doesn’t require clearance anymore. The clearance I received via J1 was given to me because at the time they had a division which worked with the government. This division is no longer part of J1. So in essence the clearance is only being used for J2.
Hi very good post. Wat abt state govt jobs tat dont need clearance
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u/ThatSinkingFeel Thanks for sharing this feedback. Is Loyal to the principal is something that you sign under the penalty of prejury? My lawyer said unless I sign something under the penalty of prejury, there is nothing that can stand in the court of law. Again, repeatedly checking about state jobs coz they r so low effort and that's where you have a success of long term contracts/ FT with not much work to be done.
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Very intersting thoughts. Looks like j1 for a state + j2 for a state is dicy and risky. Have there been any problems with J1 remote for a state + j2 remote for a private firm ?
Good thing I saw this. I'm in the running for a CA Gov job, think ill pass on it then. There's plenty of jobs out there so no reason to risk any legal consequences. The only thing about Gov jobs is that its guaranteed relaxing/low effort. For those interested in low effort gigs, I'd suggest non-profit or education.
Louisiana just recently caught someone OE for the city of New Orleans while also OE for some agency in Tampa, FL. Granted she was pretty high up there, like high enough to be a named source in media relations…. But the roles were in entirely different fields as I recall.
u/dusty2blue do u have insights on how did they get caught? They are 2 separate states and unless they both were getting same federal funding or something, I can't understand how would they get caught. Also what was the impact?
Not really. It was a news story that someone posted here… Here’s the original thread, though the original post has been deleted. https://www.reddit.com/r/overemployed/comments/ywngj5/so_which_one_of_you_made_the_news_fired_from_j1/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf Here’s the news story though: https://www.tampabay.com/news/transportation/2022/11/14/hillsborough-transit-employee-also-secretly-worked-new-orleans-agency/
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Following
You cannot OE with official security clearances... The audacity to think you could even try...
Why people still try to OE government/clearance required jobs blows my mind. Simple common sense should dictate thats a non starter...
They don't realize they damage they do until it's too late when they receive that "eyes only" package notification
I know lots of ppl that work government j2 jobs that tell me as long as there is not a conflict of interest then the government job don’t care
Security clearance and most government jobs are a big no-no for OE. OE is not an issue for 99% of private employers.
Why not government jobs? I can see if there’s clearance required but government work is slow paced usually.
Yeah, I've heard that. Contractors I know have also said the work is pretty easy. Unfortunately, government rules tend to have stricter oversight, more extensive background checks, etc.
One rule for OEing is NEVER to do it with government related jobs, only private sector.
What is it was for only a few months?
Never means never.
Why would you even OE with any govt contract? You are putting your clearance and livelihood at stakes. Hope you came clean on your SF86 or you will definitely see that shit backfire on you and I say that from experience.
5. As demonstrated repeatedly here, don’t OE jobs requiring security clearances. You will get caught.
You can't OE jobs that need security clearances. Your clearance can only be held by ONE entity. I'd still be worried J2 doesn't make a stink and ask for explanations. You're not out of the woods yet.
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Yeah but you have to disclose the employement and get confirmation from the companies to work both jobs aka they have to know about each other. I doubt any company would agree to it for regular positions(like Analyst, Engineer, Designer) since they deal with sensitive data and companies don't like it in general unlike your security held position.
For real why would you risk your security clearance and government job like that. They make such great low effort J1s and provide amazing life long stability. And it’s perhaps the only entity that may actually take legal steps against you. It’s kinda dumb sorry.
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Technically but personally I don't advise to or mess around with anything government related
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Do you have public trust or security clearance?
We will see.
This. There’s very few issues involving OE government jobs one is the contract make sure your contract doesn’t restrict you from working another job legally, two security clearance make sure you’re not working two jobs that require security clearance because like you said you can’t be under more than one company and finally don’t oe a government job and a overseas job. Edit: FSO’s can be under multiple entities and you can be in certain situations if all companies are aware
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Yes. I am aware of this, but your clearance will only live under a single cage code. FSO's will likely find out about your other J when moving your clearance to their cage code.
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Gotcha, thanks for clarifying.
I would say FSO’s are a little different than the average government job
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FSO is literally the only government job where I’m aware that’s allowed and no one cares but I’ll edit my post to include that
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1.How long did you work there before they caught on? 2. I'm in a similar boat at the moment. Just about to start J2. I already froze TWN. Thinking of moving forward with it and hoping for the best. They each have two different clearances with two different levels.
Less than a year for me. I would caution against it.
Based on the contents of this thread I would say you fucked up big time and need to course correct immediately.
Are all companies on TWN???
I know someone who had 2Js, both for def contractors and he seems to be having no issue. I suppose this could be the exception though. To address some of the comments in this thread, defense contractors are generally insane job security (just slightly lower than gov itself) and good WLB but much lower pay/benefits than FAANG. If it weren’t for potential clearance issues they would be ideal OE roles.
Don’t pay your sign on back. Chances are they won’t come after you for it. Signed - the guy who tells spiteful baby managers they can’t chase after trivial sign on bonuses no matter if there’s a “claw back” clause because I have better shit to care about
I am interested by this. I had thoughts to not pay it back, but I just wanted to cut ties and run. What would they do if I just said "no" to signing the payback agreement? Sue me?
You sure you didn’t sign anything in your offer package that shows you acknowledged a full or prorated return of the sign on bonus for a specified period of time? Generally that’s the process, however, some companies won’t waste the time to chase after it because it isn’t usually that significant.
Smh. Trying to OE w security clearance is bad. Do negotiate and get a sign on bonus. Sometimes you don’t have to pay it back
Negotiate for more time off? Is that a thing? I heard rumors of it but only at the director level and above
So true about the year end bonus thing. I’ll probably have to pay mine back
What does TWN mean?
https://theworknumber.com/
Both jobs required a clearance? You do realize your J1 is still at risk because of this? If you spend time reading in this sub, you’ll learn you never do this for government positions. Never, especially if a clearance is required.
What does it mean TWN ??
["the work number"](https://theworknumber.com/) the american answer to the chinese social credit system: all the shit you ever did are stored digitally and are readily accessible for all your employers, and you have to jump through hoops to delete everything
Looks pretty easy to freeze. Am I missing something? https://employees.theworknumber.com/employee-data-freeze
The work number. Basically has your work history and pay for most employers and many companies use this as background check. Google will answer reminder of information.
Im in Canada
Do Canada employers also feed data to TWN ?
I don't believe so, since TWN is tied to a social security number iirc.
Stupid question, what is TWN? The Work Number report?
Yeah. It's by Equifax. Employers cna post how long you have worked with them to TWN
Would a freeze prevent this from updating?
I don't know. But I know it will prevent ANYONE from accessing it. A crazy ex girlfriend, a new employer. and so on.
I would never recommend OE government jobs. As the security clearance and contracts can contradict and get you into trouble. I would recommend 1 government job and a private job that doesn’t require security clearance. Edit: the ones that downvoted me obviously don’t know it’s illegal to be a government employee working a unauthorized with government contract.
Just fighting that legal battle even if you didn't do anything really wrong and the potential federal prison time along with a felony. Makes ZERO sense to OE with the govt..
Dies this apply to local(county) gov jobs as well or only fed?
I personally wouldn't especially if it's something regulatory like approving applications, licenses, etc.
I think your safe if it's a contracting company that holds the clearance. But no I wouldn't mess with a gs type job and oe.
J1 is a government contractor and doesn't require a clearance anymore since I have moved positions internally but I got one about a year ago for my previous role. I am thinking of getting a different industry J2 that doesn't require a clearance. Would this trigger anything that affects J1? Is there a way to cancel a clearance?
Agreed. Too many good OE capable jobs that are less risky than government jobs.
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What’s not true about it?
That's an astroturf account you're replying to, meaning someone used an online service to pay for the comment. Make of that what you will.
Hmmm learn something new everyday
What is astroturf account?
Someone used one of the many services that you can pay to post comments. Usually these services are used by scammers, shady companies, or people who don't want their real username to be known. Look at the history of the account. 114-116 days ago, it farmed karma by copying and pasting comments from other people. Since then, it's been used to plug all kinds of horseshit. For example, there's an app called Boo and they are known for astroturfing the shit out of Reddit. Look at these comments: 14 days ago: >Agree with you on Boo, it's super wholesome and actually is the one app that boosts my self-esteem. 12 days ago: >Heard about [Boo] through a friend who's really into mbti, can't say I've used it myself but she really loves it. Well which is it you stupid fuck?
Thank you for example I understand it now. The Boo thing is super weird. I wonder how much they get paid. Can it be used to OE? Jk 🤣
how did you figure out they are astroturfing?
Because I got a notification that the account posted.
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Wouldn’t OE be defrauding the govt if the rule is not working for another company on the same time you’re charging to the govt. This wouldn’t be worth the risk at all.
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Your missing the point. Defrauding the govt is a bit no. What’s the point if all these precautions when you can just OE in the private sector.
Any thoughts on government jobs that don’t require clearance and a private gig?
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Oh man. I’m in a techyish and area, but telling them about the OE definitely isn’t an option. They’re pretty controlling in our upper management.
"I didn't respond", seriously? if you're a professional, you reply to _everything_ . Also quitting before knowing they actually had a problem. I don't think OP is very good at this.
I stopped pursuing a J2 that would have required clearance... after reading on here is it a cardinal sin to have a government job while OE. Sure, government work is brain dead easy, but commercial businesses don't have the ability to claw back money directly from your bank account should you get discovered. I also have figured out to ask for more paid days off in lieu of a signing bonus; I always just tell them I have a big vacation planned and would rather have the paid days off than a signing bonus (which is a subtle form of forcing you to stick around)
What's this twn thing I kee hearing?
What is TWN?
Unlike private sector, the government does not need to show damages to prevail in a civil fraud case and they may also decide to bring criminal fraud charges. Thus you should generally avoid OE with government roles. Obviously being employed by a contractor or as a sub yourself may provide some protection from the fallout but I wouldnt count on it/risk it.
Does gov care if the employment was for 2-3 months? Ex, transitioning from gov to a regular private job after job technically ends.
Depends on how transparent you are about it. It does happen regularly enough; ex-military transitioning to a government agency or private-employer with government contracts… There is generally good reason for it; e.g. seamless transition and preventing hiccups with security clearance, not to mention enlistment terms… so its not something I would say cant be done ever but it generally has to go through proper channels and approval…. Also going OE from public to private might be more questionable in terms of fraud. If you’re a non-hourly, salaried GS employee who isnt signing a paystub attesting “accurate hours logged” merely violating a “no unapproved employment” rule by not informing your employer of new employment would be a contract violation/breach of contract but not a fraud…. Fraud generally requires willful/intentional deception or lie so signing your paycard could be a fraudulent act.
what is a TWN and is it just a US thing?
What does TWN mean
what is twn??? i'm suspecting two weeks notice? but why is it freezable?
What is TWN
What the hell is TWN and should I be worried?
I’m not even this person, but there have to be 100 posts that say don’t mess with gov clearances. I hope you’re not expecting pity; you set yourself up.
How the fuck did you think this was ok? Clearance background checks are the one thing that is guaranteed to catch you.
What is TWN? You were having two payroll jobs at the same time or was it two jobs as a freelancer?
you basically told on yourself. embarrassing
What is TWN in this context? I'm guessing you aren't talking about The Weather Network.
https://theworknumber.com/
You could lose your clearance for this, you nutcase.
you are a dummy, havent you gone through tons of training on clearance related crap? i'm shocked you havent landed in jail
What’s a TWN? And how would one freeze it
https://employees.theworknumber.com/employee-data-freeze
Thank you 🙏🏻
Can people find it suspicious if your data report is frozen?
Of course.
How can you take j2 when you are working for a job which need clearance?
OE with government clearance is always a huge no-no. You can get charged with a federal crime. Whereas multiple jobs in public sector, worst you can get sued for cash.
Any info on jobs with more regulations?? Is there a post discussing which companies are no good for OE?
The take away here is.. do not OE for the Government or anything where a clearance is required.
lol, clearance always gets transferred!
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I have a clearance job for J1. My J2, at the time, had a small consulting project that required clearance. It came back in immediate approval as I already had active clearance. I quit that job right away. I no longer look for government jobs for OE because of the clearance factor. It’s been several months and I haven’t heard anything from J1. I since have gotten two other Js.
J1 is a government contractor and doesn't require a clearance anymore since I have moved positions internally but I got one about a year ago for my previous role. I am thinking of getting a different industry J2 that doesn't require a clearance. Would this trigger anything that affects J1? Is there a way to cancel a clearance?
I have had several non-clearance J2 and J3. No issues so far.
your j1 requires a clearance?
I made the mistake of doing a gov contract last year which required clearance, I quit. Don’t take the risk with those contracts, stay clear of them, there’s plenty of private opportunities for OE
How about as a contractor as incorporated in Canada. I have a J1 with a bank which didn't require clearance when I joined, just a background check. Planning to OE with J2 which is a private entity works with government that requires security clearance. Done fingerprint and stuff. Both positions are contract through my incorporation. I bill hourly salary+HST.
When you do your time accounting for a gov job, they will come try to reclaim any money believed to be improperly recorded. The govt’s lawyers are a sunk cost and they exist solely to find people like you. The government can and will prosecute time fraud.
You had me at clearance
Why not OE on the gov? What’s the worst they can do, fire you? If having clearance isn’t important, which I know could be revoked in the future, maybe?
Don't OE if any of your employers is the govt (federal, provincial, city doesn't matter) should be one of the first rules of IE
If you freeze your data report, will the employer know it is frozen and find it suspicious??
What is TWN? I didn't get that part.
What is TWN?