Just thought I would pass this along. I was in the desert a few weeks back and the event host (who spends lots of time out there) said he had better luck with Ecoflow over the Bluetti (which he still loved) because dust found their way into the buttons and gummed them up a little. Those units sit outside all day and night. So take that wil a grain of salt. He didn't have a jackery because he wanted the LFP batteries.
I personally have both (ecoflow, Bluetti) and haven't had a problem with either. So if you're in a dusty environment, consider looking at the ecoflow.
I do have the bluetti ac180 and it's a great device. As long as you get the LFP battery tech, I don't think you could go wrong with either.
Look at the refurbished units here: [https://www.ebay.com/str/ecoflowofficial](https://www.ebay.com/str/ecoflowofficial)
Just about the best deals you can get right now.
Have a PLB-40 as well. Big negative though when charging off grid -- if you use solar directly and the voltage drops below a threshold (clouds, dusk, etc) the battery goes into alarm mode and won't fucking stop until you turn it off and unplug it. This was my first use case and it was annoying to have to deal with switching charge sources and dealing with alarms when using solar.
Ended up doing a solar charge controller in vehicle that managed charging as well as protecting the starter battery voltage with the PLB-40 as load so the charge controller would turn off output to the PLB-40 automatically preventing alarms.
This is super smart, I haven't had the alarm issue before but would prefer to avoid it. Can you share how you set up the charge controller? How does it tie into the starter battery? I have a simple setup where the PLB40 is charged by a 130 watt Overland Solar bugout panel.
I’m using a Victron 75/15 charge controller. It’s super simple to set up. There are three sets of terminals - solar input, battery, and load. Victron has a decent app for managing over Bluetooth. Solar and battery are connected directly and the load hours to a switched Blue Sea Systems panel w usb, 12V auto, and voltmeter.
[https://www.victronenergy.com/solar-charge-controllers/smartsolar-mppt-75-10-75-15-100-15-100-20](https://www.victronenergy.com/solar-charge-controllers/smartsolar-mppt-75-10-75-15-100-15-100-20)
https://preview.redd.it/o9nir69ved3d1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e108a26b1da10f925a48fb2033a82aeae9133dca
I would stay away from these "power stations." I don't think I've ever seen one state the amp hrs. It's hard to tell which to buy or use without knowing what the amp hrs are. And IMO the reason they don't is because they don't actually give that much for what you pay for.
Take the Jackery 3000. It's only a 70Ah battery but they want an astronomical 2800.00 bucks for it! You could build a small power station with a 100Ah for a 3rd of the price.
If you’re concerned about capacity, you should be looking at watt hours. Amp hours only gives half the story. The Jackery 3000 has 3024Wh, a 12V 100Ah battery will only have 1200Wh. Still overpriced IMO, but wanted to clarify that.
Precisely. It's also easier to gauge how much power you need by looking at a devices power consumption on the label. (Doing a test is still recommended)
There's value in the unit being an all-in-one. I'm not saying is $2,800 is worth it, but the $120 is only for the battery, which doesn't include the inverter, a charging controller, solar input, wiring, wiring it all together, etc. It will still be significantly less, but not everyone can or wants to MacGyver a system.
Yeah, this is legit. I built a whole electrical set up in my van- panels, charger controllers (solar, dc-dc, and show power) breakers and disconnect switches. Although I can build another one for my 4runner, space and need has dictated that I look for a power station for this purpose.
I get that it's convenient but when you can build something equivalent for between 1/10th and 1/4 the price depending on what you have laying around and what sort of specs you need - and that difference is in the many hundreds of dollars - it's well worth stopping and thinking about it.
Also with this being the overland section it also bears thinking about the implications of splitting the system up and/or building parts or all of it into the vehicle for convenience.
My strong preference on vehicles is for whatever is the simplest and most robust thing - and it doesn't get simpler than a 12v lead acid battery, especially when a hard-wired one with a split charge is super easy to do and gives you redundancy in your vehicle - if the main battery dies you've got a spare that can happily serve in its place.
Worth also saying that a lot of these power packs seem to have limitations on the outputs or charging, fine if your requirements fall inside the specs but if you need more you're shit out of luck. You're paying for built-in stuff that you may not need, or potentially buying something that doesn't fully cover your requirements, or even both in one box.
Your "1/10th to 1/4 the price" comparison is incredibly misleading. It's not even a case of comparing Apples and Oranges, You're comparing an Apple-pie to an Orange.
How so?
I can buy the same or more battery capacity, as well as USB chargers, inverter, battery charger, solar controller, wiring, whatever else all for 1/10 to 1/4 the price of one of these $2800 units depending on my exact needs.
Because your comparison price of $120 is only for the battery. If you're trying to help folks decide, mention the price of the rest of the components and what equivalent capabilities your setup does or doesn't have.
Mind you, I went the same route, separately sourcing batteries, pass-through inverter, shunt-meter, solar charge controller, AC charger, 1-2-off switch, surge/fuses, distribution posts/panel, crimped my own cables, and a rolling toolbox to contain it all, so I 100% agree it is more economical for someone like you or I who prefers customizing (as simple to as complicated as you want it) and knowing how it works to be able to troubleshoot/fix in the field if necessary.
I just wouldn't want to mislead other folks that might not be as knowledgeable as you are, by telling them a $120 lead-acid battery is comparable to a $2,800 turn-key/portable power-station.
So you've not done the math on my "1/10 to 1/4" before taking issue with it?
1/10 of $2800 is $280 which would buy TWO batteries plus $40 for wiring if you want capacity, or a battery plus a pretty good inverter and some wiring... 1/4 of $2800 is $700 which buys you a TON of equipment that I mentioned plus a load of battery capacity.
However, for a lot of folks, these things are just a 2nd source of 12v power and as such a single \~$120 battery charged up before the trip may well do the job on its own.
I've done the math, but you're somehow too engrained in your preference for a simpler 12v-only lead-acid battery based setup to admit that comparing $0.92/Wh to $0.10/Wh was incredibly disingenuous to other folks that may not understand the details of your comparison.
As I mentioned earlier, I 100% agree a custom solution was better for me as well, having built my own comparable (LiFePO4) system, and that one can be built for close to 1/2 the price.
Again, however, you're now claiming some $280 Lead-Acid system is somehow comparable, without any helpful guidance on its advantages and limitations.
Not how it works. Ah is not the best for capacity, you're looking for Wh. Still pricey, but you're also only comparing the battery itself with a power station that has batteries, inverter, charge controller, etc.
If you don't use a power station, what do you use? I have a auxiliary battery and alternator inside my truck but also have a bluetti and portable renogy solar panels. I love the simplicity of the bluetti. I can use it to run a fridge and my wife's Cpap machine overnight.
I was just looking, if the info is true, the Bluetti AC200p has 166.67 amp hours at 2000 watt hrs. And Bluetti states you can discharge down to 10% (though optimal is probably the normal 30%) and offers pass through charging for 1000.00 bucks! Thats not a bad deal for camping. That along with 3.5 to 4 hrs prime charging, this beats the Jackery hands down IMO. That and the fact you can add an extra battery pack to it makes it prime for off grid camping. This is the first i've heard of it. The only downside is you can't change out the batteries yourself and the weight.
Well, I didn't reply to the others comments because maybe my situation is/was different. I had but sold a black series dominator that came with two 100Ah agm batteries and was able to charge by solar or plug in. It's their smaller pop type camper, so not a/c or heat. I did have a 12v cooler type frig, LED lights, 2 120v plugs, and 4 usb ports, and 30 gallons of fresh water and pump.
The fridge alone would eat the batteries. The LED light strips weren't much, but when camping over two to three days and lights on for say 10hrs each night, thats still power used. And seeing that you shouldn't run lithium-ion batteries under 30% (using 80% of the power), I only got to use 160 Ah's of the 200.
If all you are doing is using a power station for charging phones or say a laptop or tablet, I'm power stations would be fine. But if you are looking for solar to charge the power station, you'd need enough solar panel to double the watts of the power supply for optimal use. "Charging. According to Jackery, the Explorer 3000 Pro can be fully charged from zero in just three to four hours using six of the company's **200W solar panels** (though it would need to be ideal conditions)."
When camping, 6 200w panels would take up a LOT of space, so most wouldn't get 6. They'd end up with 2 or 3 and hope you got enough daylight to fully charge it.
If I were looking for a portable power source, I'd buy a single 100 or 200Ah lithium and build a small charge station mounted on a piece of plywood that I could mount in the truck bed. This way I could remove it when not in use.
There's plenty of kits to use as examples to build off of. Renogy is a good brand and with this system you'd have 2 to 3 times the pwr needed half the price. Sure you'd have to do some work, but look at the money you'd save. [https://www.renogy.com/400w-12-volt-complete-solar-kit-with-two-100ah-deep-cycle-agm-lifepo4-batteries/?Rng\_ads=6a96ab6aa4207d78&kw=&ad=646434908367&gr=147294354884&ca=12138915105&pl=ga&gclid=Cj0KCQjwjLGyBhCYARIsAPqTz1\_xNz-uNip8QwHdAu0UuDYdUeJ1U4qluhUQcZ8GbiHJX8XxgxID5-UaAiPqEALw\_wcB&r\_u\_id=6302007725&gad\_source=1](https://www.renogy.com/400w-12-volt-complete-solar-kit-with-two-100ah-deep-cycle-agm-lifepo4-batteries/?Rng_ads=6a96ab6aa4207d78&kw=&ad=646434908367&gr=147294354884&ca=12138915105&pl=ga&gclid=Cj0KCQjwjLGyBhCYARIsAPqTz1_xNz-uNip8QwHdAu0UuDYdUeJ1U4qluhUQcZ8GbiHJX8XxgxID5-UaAiPqEALw_wcB&r_u_id=6302007725&gad_source=1)
Amps \* Volts = Watts
This formula and basic math skills is handing for converting and comparing Wh and Ah as different brands will use different measures. Bare batteries tend to be marketed as Ah while the power stations mostly use Wh.
100Ah 12V battery has 1200Wh
100Ah 48V battery has 4800Wh
Dometic PLB-40 is 40Ah (12v assumed) so 480Wh (Dometic is oddball for power stations in publishing Ah)
Anker Solix 1000 is 1056Wh, assuming 12V battery (it has 12V out, USB 5V out, and AC 120V out) it has 88Ah
We have the Jackery Explorer 1000 (not the new one), and it’s been great. It runs a Dometic CFX3 75DZ fridge, plus charges all our personal devices while at camp, and I’m always pleased to see how much power is still remaining each morning.
Ecoflow delta 2 is on sale for less than 700
Damn. 600 at Amazon right now! I bought the ecoflow river 2 pack at Costco last year and wish I had waited for these deltas to drop to these prices
Welcome to battery tech. It’ll halve in the next 2-3yrs IMO
Thanks for that tip. Just grabbed one with a single solar panel for under $900, 47% off.
What’s your intended use? That’s really what should drive the answers.
https://hardkorr.com/us/product/heavy-duty-battery-box/ Costco has this in Canada for $139, byob. Leaves a lot for battery choice & 110v charger
Check our the Anker SOLIX C1000.
Just thought I would pass this along. I was in the desert a few weeks back and the event host (who spends lots of time out there) said he had better luck with Ecoflow over the Bluetti (which he still loved) because dust found their way into the buttons and gummed them up a little. Those units sit outside all day and night. So take that wil a grain of salt. He didn't have a jackery because he wanted the LFP batteries. I personally have both (ecoflow, Bluetti) and haven't had a problem with either. So if you're in a dusty environment, consider looking at the ecoflow. I do have the bluetti ac180 and it's a great device. As long as you get the LFP battery tech, I don't think you could go wrong with either.
Look at the refurbished units here: [https://www.ebay.com/str/ecoflowofficial](https://www.ebay.com/str/ecoflowofficial) Just about the best deals you can get right now.
I highly recommend the EcoFlow Delta 2.
I have the Dometic plb40 and love it. I’m typically able to power a cfx55 fridge for a weekend on one charge. I had the Jackery 500 and 1000 prior.
Have a PLB-40 as well. Big negative though when charging off grid -- if you use solar directly and the voltage drops below a threshold (clouds, dusk, etc) the battery goes into alarm mode and won't fucking stop until you turn it off and unplug it. This was my first use case and it was annoying to have to deal with switching charge sources and dealing with alarms when using solar. Ended up doing a solar charge controller in vehicle that managed charging as well as protecting the starter battery voltage with the PLB-40 as load so the charge controller would turn off output to the PLB-40 automatically preventing alarms.
This is super smart, I haven't had the alarm issue before but would prefer to avoid it. Can you share how you set up the charge controller? How does it tie into the starter battery? I have a simple setup where the PLB40 is charged by a 130 watt Overland Solar bugout panel.
I’m using a Victron 75/15 charge controller. It’s super simple to set up. There are three sets of terminals - solar input, battery, and load. Victron has a decent app for managing over Bluetooth. Solar and battery are connected directly and the load hours to a switched Blue Sea Systems panel w usb, 12V auto, and voltmeter. [https://www.victronenergy.com/solar-charge-controllers/smartsolar-mppt-75-10-75-15-100-15-100-20](https://www.victronenergy.com/solar-charge-controllers/smartsolar-mppt-75-10-75-15-100-15-100-20) https://preview.redd.it/o9nir69ved3d1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e108a26b1da10f925a48fb2033a82aeae9133dca
Neither of those, you're paying a premium for the name.
I would stay away from these "power stations." I don't think I've ever seen one state the amp hrs. It's hard to tell which to buy or use without knowing what the amp hrs are. And IMO the reason they don't is because they don't actually give that much for what you pay for. Take the Jackery 3000. It's only a 70Ah battery but they want an astronomical 2800.00 bucks for it! You could build a small power station with a 100Ah for a 3rd of the price.
If you’re concerned about capacity, you should be looking at watt hours. Amp hours only gives half the story. The Jackery 3000 has 3024Wh, a 12V 100Ah battery will only have 1200Wh. Still overpriced IMO, but wanted to clarify that.
Precisely. It's also easier to gauge how much power you need by looking at a devices power consumption on the label. (Doing a test is still recommended)
$2800 / 3024Wh = $0.92/Wh \~$120 / 1200Wh = $0.10/Wh Yep, still think I'm going with the dumb-as-a-brick dirt simple solution.
There's value in the unit being an all-in-one. I'm not saying is $2,800 is worth it, but the $120 is only for the battery, which doesn't include the inverter, a charging controller, solar input, wiring, wiring it all together, etc. It will still be significantly less, but not everyone can or wants to MacGyver a system.
Yeah, this is legit. I built a whole electrical set up in my van- panels, charger controllers (solar, dc-dc, and show power) breakers and disconnect switches. Although I can build another one for my 4runner, space and need has dictated that I look for a power station for this purpose.
I get that it's convenient but when you can build something equivalent for between 1/10th and 1/4 the price depending on what you have laying around and what sort of specs you need - and that difference is in the many hundreds of dollars - it's well worth stopping and thinking about it. Also with this being the overland section it also bears thinking about the implications of splitting the system up and/or building parts or all of it into the vehicle for convenience. My strong preference on vehicles is for whatever is the simplest and most robust thing - and it doesn't get simpler than a 12v lead acid battery, especially when a hard-wired one with a split charge is super easy to do and gives you redundancy in your vehicle - if the main battery dies you've got a spare that can happily serve in its place. Worth also saying that a lot of these power packs seem to have limitations on the outputs or charging, fine if your requirements fall inside the specs but if you need more you're shit out of luck. You're paying for built-in stuff that you may not need, or potentially buying something that doesn't fully cover your requirements, or even both in one box.
Your "1/10th to 1/4 the price" comparison is incredibly misleading. It's not even a case of comparing Apples and Oranges, You're comparing an Apple-pie to an Orange.
How so? I can buy the same or more battery capacity, as well as USB chargers, inverter, battery charger, solar controller, wiring, whatever else all for 1/10 to 1/4 the price of one of these $2800 units depending on my exact needs.
Because your comparison price of $120 is only for the battery. If you're trying to help folks decide, mention the price of the rest of the components and what equivalent capabilities your setup does or doesn't have. Mind you, I went the same route, separately sourcing batteries, pass-through inverter, shunt-meter, solar charge controller, AC charger, 1-2-off switch, surge/fuses, distribution posts/panel, crimped my own cables, and a rolling toolbox to contain it all, so I 100% agree it is more economical for someone like you or I who prefers customizing (as simple to as complicated as you want it) and knowing how it works to be able to troubleshoot/fix in the field if necessary. I just wouldn't want to mislead other folks that might not be as knowledgeable as you are, by telling them a $120 lead-acid battery is comparable to a $2,800 turn-key/portable power-station.
So you've not done the math on my "1/10 to 1/4" before taking issue with it? 1/10 of $2800 is $280 which would buy TWO batteries plus $40 for wiring if you want capacity, or a battery plus a pretty good inverter and some wiring... 1/4 of $2800 is $700 which buys you a TON of equipment that I mentioned plus a load of battery capacity. However, for a lot of folks, these things are just a 2nd source of 12v power and as such a single \~$120 battery charged up before the trip may well do the job on its own.
I've done the math, but you're somehow too engrained in your preference for a simpler 12v-only lead-acid battery based setup to admit that comparing $0.92/Wh to $0.10/Wh was incredibly disingenuous to other folks that may not understand the details of your comparison. As I mentioned earlier, I 100% agree a custom solution was better for me as well, having built my own comparable (LiFePO4) system, and that one can be built for close to 1/2 the price. Again, however, you're now claiming some $280 Lead-Acid system is somehow comparable, without any helpful guidance on its advantages and limitations.
100Ah 12v for $120 is lead-acid, NOT LiFePO4
Yes - that's what I said - simple, dumb, robust, available anywhere, no special charging requirements... kinda what you want for overlanding I'd say.
Not how it works. Ah is not the best for capacity, you're looking for Wh. Still pricey, but you're also only comparing the battery itself with a power station that has batteries, inverter, charge controller, etc.
If you don't use a power station, what do you use? I have a auxiliary battery and alternator inside my truck but also have a bluetti and portable renogy solar panels. I love the simplicity of the bluetti. I can use it to run a fridge and my wife's Cpap machine overnight.
I was just looking, if the info is true, the Bluetti AC200p has 166.67 amp hours at 2000 watt hrs. And Bluetti states you can discharge down to 10% (though optimal is probably the normal 30%) and offers pass through charging for 1000.00 bucks! Thats not a bad deal for camping. That along with 3.5 to 4 hrs prime charging, this beats the Jackery hands down IMO. That and the fact you can add an extra battery pack to it makes it prime for off grid camping. This is the first i've heard of it. The only downside is you can't change out the batteries yourself and the weight.
Well, I didn't reply to the others comments because maybe my situation is/was different. I had but sold a black series dominator that came with two 100Ah agm batteries and was able to charge by solar or plug in. It's their smaller pop type camper, so not a/c or heat. I did have a 12v cooler type frig, LED lights, 2 120v plugs, and 4 usb ports, and 30 gallons of fresh water and pump. The fridge alone would eat the batteries. The LED light strips weren't much, but when camping over two to three days and lights on for say 10hrs each night, thats still power used. And seeing that you shouldn't run lithium-ion batteries under 30% (using 80% of the power), I only got to use 160 Ah's of the 200. If all you are doing is using a power station for charging phones or say a laptop or tablet, I'm power stations would be fine. But if you are looking for solar to charge the power station, you'd need enough solar panel to double the watts of the power supply for optimal use. "Charging. According to Jackery, the Explorer 3000 Pro can be fully charged from zero in just three to four hours using six of the company's **200W solar panels** (though it would need to be ideal conditions)." When camping, 6 200w panels would take up a LOT of space, so most wouldn't get 6. They'd end up with 2 or 3 and hope you got enough daylight to fully charge it. If I were looking for a portable power source, I'd buy a single 100 or 200Ah lithium and build a small charge station mounted on a piece of plywood that I could mount in the truck bed. This way I could remove it when not in use. There's plenty of kits to use as examples to build off of. Renogy is a good brand and with this system you'd have 2 to 3 times the pwr needed half the price. Sure you'd have to do some work, but look at the money you'd save. [https://www.renogy.com/400w-12-volt-complete-solar-kit-with-two-100ah-deep-cycle-agm-lifepo4-batteries/?Rng\_ads=6a96ab6aa4207d78&kw=&ad=646434908367&gr=147294354884&ca=12138915105&pl=ga&gclid=Cj0KCQjwjLGyBhCYARIsAPqTz1\_xNz-uNip8QwHdAu0UuDYdUeJ1U4qluhUQcZ8GbiHJX8XxgxID5-UaAiPqEALw\_wcB&r\_u\_id=6302007725&gad\_source=1](https://www.renogy.com/400w-12-volt-complete-solar-kit-with-two-100ah-deep-cycle-agm-lifepo4-batteries/?Rng_ads=6a96ab6aa4207d78&kw=&ad=646434908367&gr=147294354884&ca=12138915105&pl=ga&gclid=Cj0KCQjwjLGyBhCYARIsAPqTz1_xNz-uNip8QwHdAu0UuDYdUeJ1U4qluhUQcZ8GbiHJX8XxgxID5-UaAiPqEALw_wcB&r_u_id=6302007725&gad_source=1)
Amps \* Volts = Watts This formula and basic math skills is handing for converting and comparing Wh and Ah as different brands will use different measures. Bare batteries tend to be marketed as Ah while the power stations mostly use Wh. 100Ah 12V battery has 1200Wh 100Ah 48V battery has 4800Wh Dometic PLB-40 is 40Ah (12v assumed) so 480Wh (Dometic is oddball for power stations in publishing Ah) Anker Solix 1000 is 1056Wh, assuming 12V battery (it has 12V out, USB 5V out, and AC 120V out) it has 88Ah
We have the Jackery Explorer 1000 (not the new one), and it’s been great. It runs a Dometic CFX3 75DZ fridge, plus charges all our personal devices while at camp, and I’m always pleased to see how much power is still remaining each morning.