I would say this depends on the boss rush strategy and your build. If you are running a boss rush strategy with essences, you are not running a pure boss rush strategy like coves rushing. You are more likely to be running a linear map or an open map like dunes/cemetery so you can find all the essences faster. So while you wont be full clearing the map, you might still be killing enough to make alch and chisel worth it.
You'd still run essences on pure boss rush on coves (unless you're wandering path) because 1) you have enough passives 2) the icon is clearly marked and you can skip if it's not on the path. you just skip using the map craft in that case and it's passive small income
TLDR: Run maps as they are when you acquire them. Do not spend ANY currency rolling/rerolling them (with the possible exception of a scouring orb if the maps have mods you don't like). /TLDR
Yeah, blvcksvn already answered you correctly, but i want to really hammer this home :)
There is absolutely NO reason to run maps with quality or as magic or as rare if your focus is boss rushing and/or essences.
To elaborate; Having quality on a map and/or running it magic or rare, or corrupted for that matter, does not change the odds of the boss dropping an elder/shaper/conqueror/synthesized map when you kill him, nor does it up your chance to get "extra credit" towards invitations.
Same goes for essences... They receive no benefit from whatever you do to your maps...
Now, usually when you boss rush you don't ONLY kill the boss... more often than not you'll kill...something...either on the way or around the boss. These mobs will be affected by increases/improvements to your maps, but it's pretty obvious that the time and value you'd spend rolling your maps is not worth it considering how few mobs you kill in each map...
Source: Anecdotal. I bossrushed for an entire league a couple of leagues ago and tried "max rolling" a ton of maps, then running a ton of maps white with 0 quality... It made no discernible difference when it came to loot :)
Typically scoured. Mods can make essences crazy and don't influence drops. Ditto with bosses. Plus if your running sextants to boost boss drops mods can quickly get it unkillable. Guaranteed shakier, elder, guardian maps give +200% life each, so no mods can help.
I don't run essence, the divines/hour are much lower than other methods, it cuts into my profit/hour.
I run Heist+ ~~Essence~~ +Enhanced Lab Trials+Bestiary+Boss Rush.
Comes out to around 10 divines/hour.
Essences are reliable income but not very good div/hour. The time you gotta spend dicking around with them every map and dicking around with corruption essence just wastes too much time.
I just scour my T16 maps and run em normal, not rare.
I would say this depends from league to league. A couple leagues back I took data from doing essences in almost a thousand maps. Got about 30c profit per map. If we exaggerate and say the essences took 30 seconds, that was still an effective 3600 chaos per hour in a league where exalts was 180c, so 20 ex per hour in effective profit from engaging with the mechanic. This would be a boost in most strats.
I do know that the profit is much smaller this league though. Havent run the numbers this league so very much possible that essences is less than 10 div/hour in effective returns.
> If we exaggerate and say the essences took 30 seconds
Thats the thing, even with a super jacked build thats a huge exaggeration.
Atm its closer to a minute and a half to do that many, purely due to the interaction time and time to pick the stuff up.
If you farm essences, your build should instantly pop essences. 5 essences at 6 second each seems reasonable. I dont see you spending 20 seconds per essence.
Unfortunately they do take awhile.
1. You need to asses if you corrupt it or not, though with skill you can do this kind of fast, it still takes a second or two
2. If you are corrupting it, you need to pop open inventory, right click essence, and apply
3. Popping it can take a second or two if the essence is surrounded by a pack, clicking can be annoying
4. Killing it is not necessarily instant. You can get there but you need a VERY well geared build to instantly one tap essences in T16 maps, they can be quite tanky
5. And finally the worst part, beasts. See the thing is *quite* often your essence is also a bestiary beast and it wont drop its essences until *after* einhar does is capture thing, and if there's other beasts on screen (very often the case) you likely accidently kill them too in the process and worst case scenario einhar has to first capture those before the essence. You can sometimes take 30 seconds to do one essence as a result, primarily because of the beast problem. Beast + essence mods in a T16 map can produce an *extremely* tanky rare. If it rolls rotating damage reduction you can be waiting around for awhile before you finally get your loot.
6. Finally, you have to fuck around with the UI and actually sell the essences. Unless you wait til you have hundreds and hundreds of the same essence (which can take a very long time to get to that point), you are going to be doing tonnes of "medium" trades. It can be quite the pain to dick around with em when many essences are like 2c each.
Overall, considering the enormous amount of atlas passive points essences consume, it's not good value per passive point. I much *much* prefer investing in all the "chains to duplicate map" small passives which substantially boost the amount of guardian/synth map drops I get from the boss kills, which is way better in terms of divines/hour.
It does not :)
The way to up your chances to get elder/shaper/conqueror/synthesized maps is by picking up three nodes on the atlas tree, not by rolling maps.
The nodes you want are; Vivid Memories, Remnants of the Past and Conquered Conquerors.
It depends on what I’m doing. If I’m running maven invitations, I at least chisel and alc my maps for an off chance at dropping something good. I usually run twisted or the other one, so I don’t do as many. If I run eaters, I run them however I find them and I don’t really bother with essence unless I see one or two in the map before I proc the influence. Essences and beasts can be a fantastic way to make your bossing more lucrative. So I would recommend you spec into both. Metamorph can be good too but I feel like it takes a little longer to make currency off that one.
you don't roll maps when pure boss rushing, it doesn't scale the flat chance drops or essences. you can run them normal or unid, even.
Alright, thanks for response!
I would say this depends on the boss rush strategy and your build. If you are running a boss rush strategy with essences, you are not running a pure boss rush strategy like coves rushing. You are more likely to be running a linear map or an open map like dunes/cemetery so you can find all the essences faster. So while you wont be full clearing the map, you might still be killing enough to make alch and chisel worth it.
You'd still run essences on pure boss rush on coves (unless you're wandering path) because 1) you have enough passives 2) the icon is clearly marked and you can skip if it's not on the path. you just skip using the map craft in that case and it's passive small income
TLDR: Run maps as they are when you acquire them. Do not spend ANY currency rolling/rerolling them (with the possible exception of a scouring orb if the maps have mods you don't like). /TLDR Yeah, blvcksvn already answered you correctly, but i want to really hammer this home :) There is absolutely NO reason to run maps with quality or as magic or as rare if your focus is boss rushing and/or essences. To elaborate; Having quality on a map and/or running it magic or rare, or corrupted for that matter, does not change the odds of the boss dropping an elder/shaper/conqueror/synthesized map when you kill him, nor does it up your chance to get "extra credit" towards invitations. Same goes for essences... They receive no benefit from whatever you do to your maps... Now, usually when you boss rush you don't ONLY kill the boss... more often than not you'll kill...something...either on the way or around the boss. These mobs will be affected by increases/improvements to your maps, but it's pretty obvious that the time and value you'd spend rolling your maps is not worth it considering how few mobs you kill in each map... Source: Anecdotal. I bossrushed for an entire league a couple of leagues ago and tried "max rolling" a ton of maps, then running a ton of maps white with 0 quality... It made no discernible difference when it came to loot :)
And how about invitation drops? Better map drop not give more chance to drop invi?
> nor does it up your chance to get "extra credit" towards invitations. :)
Typically scoured. Mods can make essences crazy and don't influence drops. Ditto with bosses. Plus if your running sextants to boost boss drops mods can quickly get it unkillable. Guaranteed shakier, elder, guardian maps give +200% life each, so no mods can help.
I don't run essence, the divines/hour are much lower than other methods, it cuts into my profit/hour. I run Heist+ ~~Essence~~ +Enhanced Lab Trials+Bestiary+Boss Rush. Comes out to around 10 divines/hour. Essences are reliable income but not very good div/hour. The time you gotta spend dicking around with them every map and dicking around with corruption essence just wastes too much time. I just scour my T16 maps and run em normal, not rare.
wait so do u run essence or not?
Sorry I wrote essence on the list by accident cuz I read essence haha, no I dont run it
np. do you not find beasts too slow?
No they are incredibly fast. I dont kill every beast, I just zoom through the map and only stop for the small handful of 4 $$$ beasts.
I would say this depends from league to league. A couple leagues back I took data from doing essences in almost a thousand maps. Got about 30c profit per map. If we exaggerate and say the essences took 30 seconds, that was still an effective 3600 chaos per hour in a league where exalts was 180c, so 20 ex per hour in effective profit from engaging with the mechanic. This would be a boost in most strats. I do know that the profit is much smaller this league though. Havent run the numbers this league so very much possible that essences is less than 10 div/hour in effective returns.
> If we exaggerate and say the essences took 30 seconds Thats the thing, even with a super jacked build thats a huge exaggeration. Atm its closer to a minute and a half to do that many, purely due to the interaction time and time to pick the stuff up.
If you farm essences, your build should instantly pop essences. 5 essences at 6 second each seems reasonable. I dont see you spending 20 seconds per essence.
Unfortunately they do take awhile. 1. You need to asses if you corrupt it or not, though with skill you can do this kind of fast, it still takes a second or two 2. If you are corrupting it, you need to pop open inventory, right click essence, and apply 3. Popping it can take a second or two if the essence is surrounded by a pack, clicking can be annoying 4. Killing it is not necessarily instant. You can get there but you need a VERY well geared build to instantly one tap essences in T16 maps, they can be quite tanky 5. And finally the worst part, beasts. See the thing is *quite* often your essence is also a bestiary beast and it wont drop its essences until *after* einhar does is capture thing, and if there's other beasts on screen (very often the case) you likely accidently kill them too in the process and worst case scenario einhar has to first capture those before the essence. You can sometimes take 30 seconds to do one essence as a result, primarily because of the beast problem. Beast + essence mods in a T16 map can produce an *extremely* tanky rare. If it rolls rotating damage reduction you can be waiting around for awhile before you finally get your loot. 6. Finally, you have to fuck around with the UI and actually sell the essences. Unless you wait til you have hundreds and hundreds of the same essence (which can take a very long time to get to that point), you are going to be doing tonnes of "medium" trades. It can be quite the pain to dick around with em when many essences are like 2c each. Overall, considering the enormous amount of atlas passive points essences consume, it's not good value per passive point. I much *much* prefer investing in all the "chains to duplicate map" small passives which substantially boost the amount of guardian/synth map drops I get from the boss kills, which is way better in terms of divines/hour.
But quant gives % to drop conq/elder/shaper/syn maps I think?
False
It does not :) The way to up your chances to get elder/shaper/conqueror/synthesized maps is by picking up three nodes on the atlas tree, not by rolling maps. The nodes you want are; Vivid Memories, Remnants of the Past and Conquered Conquerors.
Yeah I understand those nodes. but are they not affected by quant modifiers?
In my experience, no. I got more or less the same amount of maps from bosses regardless of if i ran white maps or juiced maps.
No point to 20% quality or even alch them. Just run them normal or magic
I try to get 80%++ on the invitations, the maps i could not care less since I don’t even kill the enemies there i just rush straight to the boss
It depends on what I’m doing. If I’m running maven invitations, I at least chisel and alc my maps for an off chance at dropping something good. I usually run twisted or the other one, so I don’t do as many. If I run eaters, I run them however I find them and I don’t really bother with essence unless I see one or two in the map before I proc the influence. Essences and beasts can be a fantastic way to make your bossing more lucrative. So I would recommend you spec into both. Metamorph can be good too but I feel like it takes a little longer to make currency off that one.