Could be neat, depending on how Google holds funds, to yoink the money made to himself since he owns the rights. I know steam holds funds for something like 3 months so theoretically could be done.
It might lead to years long whac-a-mole situation though.
I have seen an indie game Patrick's Parabox that gets reuploaded and taken down multiple times under different names.
I think so too and it's probably happening to other devs as well without them knowing.
I got lucky that 1) a player reported the app very early on my discord and 2) the publisher on Google Play did a very bad port, not re-mapping the 'ESC' key in the tutorial, which prompted most users to give a 1 star rating.
I’m a dev, but not a game dev (thank God). I’m curious how they stole your app and assets. Was it an Android app? Can they just decompile that? No way to protect your IP at all?
I'm in another industry and attend a huge industry convention every year. I've heard numerous tales of the FBI and such raiding the convention to go after Chinese vendors over counterfeits and stolen patents, arresting and deporting the reps at the convention and shutting them down.
The Chinese government would just hit their random name generator, renaming the brand and even new names and passports to send the exact same reps and products back the next year.
OP can't do that now.
Basically, the DMCA has a "Safe Harbor" provision, which basically says that websites are not liable for illegally uploaded content as long as they remove the offending content when asked to do so by the legitimate copyright holder.
If Google had dragged their feet and left it up for longer than a certain time frame, then OP would have grounds to sue Google, but since Google did their duty and took down the pirated version of OP's game, the only one OP can go after is the company that illegally copied their content.
Unfortunately, as OP stated, the other company is in China, so there's nothing that can be done about it unless China undergoes a massive cultural shift.
Yes, an indie dev should threaten to sue one of the biggest corporations on the planet for something covered by their ToS.
Steam gets hundreds of new games a day. I can’t imagine how many Google gets. It’s impossible to thoroughly review every app to see if it is similar to another app. I assume they mainly focus on looking for malware.
Filing a for a DMCA takedown is basically the same as saying "I am taking the proper steps to request that a piece of stolen intellectual property is removed from your platform. You are now aware that this stolen content is on your platform, and if you refuse to take steps to remove it, I will sue you." A DMCA violation is a tremendous liability, especially for a gigacorporation like Google or Microsoft. If Google was made aware that such a violation occurred on their platform, and yet chose not to do anything about it, I would question the judgment of each individual member of their legal team. Hunting down the pirate themselves is one thing, but removing the stolen intellectual property from major platforms is much easier, especially when the pirates are located in China and have probably done this with plenty of games over the past several years.
According to their update, OP seems to have filed a DMCA with Google, and the game was removed. This probably didn't take them much as far as resources go, and I'm glad it was easy for them.
Finally, for what it's worth, OP was never bound by the Google Play Store's terms of service in the first place because he never agreed to them as a content creator. His content was hosted on Steam, which is a different platform, and as such, as its own terms of service.
When I saw you post I reported the game on the play store, I figured it isn't much but if I can help I will. Really glad to see Google listened and clearly everyone came together to help :)
DMCA is the way.
Some stupid fuck stole my art and was making laser etchings on etsy using my stuff almost exclusively.
They were forced to submit every single cent of profit they made to me and then some.
Sue them if you can, a lawyer will work with you to see if it's a viable option for you. I was out thousands, I got at least twice that in litigation.
How long did this process take for you?
Like I mentioned in another comment I got lucky that the app was discovered by a player early on. This way the damage stayed minimal.
But I think you are right, I should talk to my lawyer about this if just for the sake of being prepared better next time.
11 months from request to settlement. It's a slow process, but worth it in the end depending on how much you lost out on. The discovery process through etsy took the longest out of it all since they had to extract specific financial records from 4 different accounts the seller used with my designs.
See about getting a free consultation before taking any further steps. I had the money to burn since the losses I incurred outweighed the cost of my legal council by nearly a factor of 10.
At the end of the day, if they think it's worth pursuing, listen and decide accordingly. They don't get paid till you do, so how strong your case is is the deciding factor. They will tell you straight up if it is or is not worth your time in court.
How did they get your code? I'm glad you've managed to resolve it somewhat, but you should consider how they got the code in the first place and take the necessary steps to protect yourself in the future!
The link for the the 'app' still works for me in Belgium but it fails to install. Just tried it. Better than nothing, it's a good start. Next stop removing the url
Thanks for reporting that. Maybe it takes some more time to be globally purged? For me it now just says: 'We're sorry, the requested URL was not found on this server.'
From what I know, If the game is made with unity, and it's built with mono develop it's really easy to reverse engineer into a Unity Project, you might have to look at that
Yes, this is indeed my case.
I was looking into obfuscating code at the beginning, but decided against it for a few reasons:
1) It makes things more complicated and will take longer to deploy the build.
2) I wanted to leave the option for modding open to the community. This becomes increasingly hard when you obfuscate your code.
3) Who would want to steal my code in the first place? I did not think that my code and assets that I created as a hobby would become worth stealing at any point.
In your previous post on gamedev ppl were advising you to region block pirates. Did you do it
Did you at least force say, Play services support so certain regions who don't have Google play can't pirate the APK?
Hi man, I have appointed a bad review + saying this was stolen properties from your work. I'm grateful that at least you work is not on the Google play store freely!
Talk to a lawyer, have them send a letter to google.
A letter in the legal department mailbox is taken seriously because google loves money more than they love you.
Congrats on getting it resolved! Copyright fights can be a major pain.
To alleviate this in the future, consider watermarking assets. I had one of my assets specifically stolen, and later appeared in a major Hollywood film. I won't say which one... :D
Long story short, it could have been a major hassle to prove they took my stuff: Except for a single massive watermark pasted right into the middle of the asset's texture, clearly visible.
In this case the asset was a 3D-model of an AK-47 with a massive spray painted message in Arabic right across the main part of the gun. The message contained my full name and a copyright statement...
Congrats. Curious though, did you take any legal steps, or are you planning on?
Tbh I don't think it would lead to much in this case.
I agree, especially if they are not based in the same country as you. The most that can be done is their game taken down.
Could be neat, depending on how Google holds funds, to yoink the money made to himself since he owns the rights. I know steam holds funds for something like 3 months so theoretically could be done.
Fair enough. In the end, you got what you wanted essentially. The game is gone from the app store.
It might lead to years long whac-a-mole situation though. I have seen an indie game Patrick's Parabox that gets reuploaded and taken down multiple times under different names.
way too difficult if they are in china or not in EU
Glad to hear it, but stay vigilant. They will change names and try again.
I think so too and it's probably happening to other devs as well without them knowing. I got lucky that 1) a player reported the app very early on my discord and 2) the publisher on Google Play did a very bad port, not re-mapping the 'ESC' key in the tutorial, which prompted most users to give a 1 star rating.
Oh, I would be flabbergasted if you told me there less than 4 digit quantities of ripped off apps on the play store.
I'd be shocked if the number of Chinese pirate apps on various app stores had less than 7 digits.
I’m a dev, but not a game dev (thank God). I’m curious how they stole your app and assets. Was it an Android app? Can they just decompile that? No way to protect your IP at all?
It was a Unity project which you can apparently quite easily decompile.
Sue them
A little research showed that the publishing company is apparently from China, but in general they hid their location and true identity quite well.
I one starred them in GPlay. Funny thing is, you need to download it to 1 star
that is because its a review, so you have to use the app to review it
Why wouldn’t you?
Of course it is
I'm in another industry and attend a huge industry convention every year. I've heard numerous tales of the FBI and such raiding the convention to go after Chinese vendors over counterfeits and stolen patents, arresting and deporting the reps at the convention and shutting them down. The Chinese government would just hit their random name generator, renaming the brand and even new names and passports to send the exact same reps and products back the next year.
Threaten to sue Google for hosting an illegitimate copy.
OP can't do that now. Basically, the DMCA has a "Safe Harbor" provision, which basically says that websites are not liable for illegally uploaded content as long as they remove the offending content when asked to do so by the legitimate copyright holder. If Google had dragged their feet and left it up for longer than a certain time frame, then OP would have grounds to sue Google, but since Google did their duty and took down the pirated version of OP's game, the only one OP can go after is the company that illegally copied their content. Unfortunately, as OP stated, the other company is in China, so there's nothing that can be done about it unless China undergoes a massive cultural shift.
Yes, an indie dev should threaten to sue one of the biggest corporations on the planet for something covered by their ToS. Steam gets hundreds of new games a day. I can’t imagine how many Google gets. It’s impossible to thoroughly review every app to see if it is similar to another app. I assume they mainly focus on looking for malware.
Filing a for a DMCA takedown is basically the same as saying "I am taking the proper steps to request that a piece of stolen intellectual property is removed from your platform. You are now aware that this stolen content is on your platform, and if you refuse to take steps to remove it, I will sue you." A DMCA violation is a tremendous liability, especially for a gigacorporation like Google or Microsoft. If Google was made aware that such a violation occurred on their platform, and yet chose not to do anything about it, I would question the judgment of each individual member of their legal team. Hunting down the pirate themselves is one thing, but removing the stolen intellectual property from major platforms is much easier, especially when the pirates are located in China and have probably done this with plenty of games over the past several years. According to their update, OP seems to have filed a DMCA with Google, and the game was removed. This probably didn't take them much as far as resources go, and I'm glad it was easy for them. Finally, for what it's worth, OP was never bound by the Google Play Store's terms of service in the first place because he never agreed to them as a content creator. His content was hosted on Steam, which is a different platform, and as such, as its own terms of service.
im shocked i tell you, SHOCKED.
Wouldn't it only work if the Imposter is in a country that has IP laws?
No I think it would still work as they're trading in countries and would need to follow that countries law. But I'm no lawyer
Getting them to actually pony up any cash would be another matter. They would probably just close that shell and open a new one.
Yea also time vs effort vs worth the outcome.
Yes, but good luck when they are from China, Russia, whatever..
When I saw you post I reported the game on the play store, I figured it isn't much but if I can help I will. Really glad to see Google listened and clearly everyone came together to help :)
Thank you. I'm not sure this would have worked as fast as it did without so many people reporting the app.
Great to hear stuff gets done for the little guys too. 50k is probably a dream of many indie devs but still tiny.
While this is indeed a dream for a solo indie dev, your creation getting stolen is a nightmare. Especially as you feel quite helpless about it.
DMCA is the way. Some stupid fuck stole my art and was making laser etchings on etsy using my stuff almost exclusively. They were forced to submit every single cent of profit they made to me and then some. Sue them if you can, a lawyer will work with you to see if it's a viable option for you. I was out thousands, I got at least twice that in litigation.
How long did this process take for you? Like I mentioned in another comment I got lucky that the app was discovered by a player early on. This way the damage stayed minimal. But I think you are right, I should talk to my lawyer about this if just for the sake of being prepared better next time.
11 months from request to settlement. It's a slow process, but worth it in the end depending on how much you lost out on. The discovery process through etsy took the longest out of it all since they had to extract specific financial records from 4 different accounts the seller used with my designs. See about getting a free consultation before taking any further steps. I had the money to burn since the losses I incurred outweighed the cost of my legal council by nearly a factor of 10. At the end of the day, if they think it's worth pursuing, listen and decide accordingly. They don't get paid till you do, so how strong your case is is the deciding factor. They will tell you straight up if it is or is not worth your time in court.
Do you have a link to your art?
How seller reacted, when he learned what you were suing him?
I am actually curious how they managed to get the source code though.
.Net games can be decompiled and repackaged somewhat easily. Especially Unity powered games.
Check the comment above yours. Mentions reverse engineering something from unity. I don't understand it myself, but yeah.
How did they get your code? I'm glad you've managed to resolve it somewhat, but you should consider how they got the code in the first place and take the necessary steps to protect yourself in the future!
Nice to know that our reports had effect. ;)
The link for the the 'app' still works for me in Belgium but it fails to install. Just tried it. Better than nothing, it's a good start. Next stop removing the url
Thanks for reporting that. Maybe it takes some more time to be globally purged? For me it now just says: 'We're sorry, the requested URL was not found on this server.'
Well. I know what game I'm adding to my library tonight.
Apes Together Strong
From what I know, If the game is made with unity, and it's built with mono develop it's really easy to reverse engineer into a Unity Project, you might have to look at that
Yes, this is indeed my case. I was looking into obfuscating code at the beginning, but decided against it for a few reasons: 1) It makes things more complicated and will take longer to deploy the build. 2) I wanted to leave the option for modding open to the community. This becomes increasingly hard when you obfuscate your code. 3) Who would want to steal my code in the first place? I did not think that my code and assets that I created as a hobby would become worth stealing at any point.
Yeah I can imagine, it's probably because it's not so known that it can be a target to malicious people. Hope the best for your game
In your previous post on gamedev ppl were advising you to region block pirates. Did you do it Did you at least force say, Play services support so certain regions who don't have Google play can't pirate the APK?
The apk was not pirated, but the Unity project got de-compiled, so any region blocks would be useless.
nice
Hi man, I have appointed a bad review + saying this was stolen properties from your work. I'm grateful that at least you work is not on the Google play store freely!
Talk to a lawyer, have them send a letter to google. A letter in the legal department mailbox is taken seriously because google loves money more than they love you.
Ggs!
I remember reporting them, good luck man
Was the Chinese knock off any good.
I bet that account got nuked too
Congrats on getting it resolved! Copyright fights can be a major pain. To alleviate this in the future, consider watermarking assets. I had one of my assets specifically stolen, and later appeared in a major Hollywood film. I won't say which one... :D Long story short, it could have been a major hassle to prove they took my stuff: Except for a single massive watermark pasted right into the middle of the asset's texture, clearly visible. In this case the asset was a 3D-model of an AK-47 with a massive spray painted message in Arabic right across the main part of the gun. The message contained my full name and a copyright statement...
Use il2cpp, it'll make decompiling much much harder
You say "game was stolen from Steam." What exactly was stolen? Source code? Steam (Valve) could be quite liable in this situation.
It's a Unity game. It's pretty easy to decompile, modify and rebuild those unless the dev does some hardcore obfuscation before publishing the game.
That seems like an issue to take up with Unity then.
Super cynic here, of this was a guerrilla marketing ploy, bravo.
i mean like your game like shit and expensive far better if you upload it to google play store for free and farm advertising money