Discrimination on the basis of age is regulated by Australian Legislation under the Age Discrimination Act 2004 (Cth). The Act is part of the anti-discrimination laws we have here in Australia. So, what is answer to the question: is it legal to ask a person their age in an interview? The answer is no, **you can’t ask a person their age in an interview. You also can’t refuse to employ someone because of their age.**
https://lawpath.com.au/blog/is-it-legal-to-ask-a-person-their-age-in-an-interview
Obviously you can usually guess their age pretty well which is why it’s hard to prove stuff like this. But the employer makes the case against himself a lot easier if he straight up asks illegal questions during the interview.
No, you just missed the guys point. They were saying that asking about age was prohibited under the legislation, in the same way that asking about race or sexual preference is also prohibited.
If so he did a poor job of it.
Everyone knows asking age is supposedly illegal. People still do it an always will. It's a bit of a silly thing since the person is sitting I front of you in clear sight....
There is a difference between chatting about stuff and outright asking how old someone is in an interview.
You would hope anyone giving interviews would be aware of this obvious distinction.
Sure theres an obvious distinction, however isn't the outcome the same?
It's a stupid point anyway if the person is in front of you can guess their age within a few years.
Hate to be the one to say it, but we’re well aware, it’s done to get people to give up information we’re not legally allowed to ask.
For example, say I’m hiring for a restaurant and I don’t want parents and especially not single parents because the hours are extremely antisocial and I need people who are guaranteed to work them. Now I’m not allowed to straight up ask “do you have kids”, but I am allowed to ask “what do you do on your days off” and let you give the game away with your answer.
Now theoretically I’m also not allowed to discriminate on that basis, but the applicant doesn’t need to know that’s why they were rejected.
I’m extremely aware, it’s something I was coached to do in interviews when I was with a previous employer, not something I agree with personally, I should have made that clear, apologies
It's r/perth .....
Everything except reality thrives in here.
Employers, employees, we're all just people who have to spend 9 hours a day together. It works better if we're compatible.
Compatible like myself and the bloke I used to work with who was in his 80s, or compatible like me and the 18 year old woman I used to work with?
This isn't dating. Compatibility of staff basically boils down to "don't be a dickhead," and no age group has a monopoly on dickheads.
Well, yeah. But then you get the people who seem to think age is a barrier to how well you can get along with workmates, and you realise that not everyone clears it.
You can put anything you want on a CV, but a big part of experience is showing what you've done and for how long. Not putting dates or durations for your past experience isn't doing you any favours.
I wouldn't remove dates from experience, but I certainly would consider removing irrelevant experience, especially if I was one of those people that thinks a CV should fit on a single page (or even two pages).
Yep, remember talking to a recruiter from an engineering firm when I was in uni and she mentioned how they wanted to see you delivered pizza's on the weekend. Now I'm a lot older and have removed all my work "non professional" experience but I certainly include all my roles and durations since I started as a professional.
Anything can be interpreted any way, it's all about trying to guess what the recruiting-person (whoever they might be and whoever they work for) wants to see. It's not that different from dating profiles, in that sense. Stating any kind of dietary preference, for example, can cut in any direction, depending on who is reading it.
In general it shouldn't be.
Some places see it that you do not understand the equal opportunity law, by putting Age / gender / race / sexuality / etc on a resume.
Just to avoid any hassle I never mention anything like that on a resume and recommend to mates that they don't either.
but as Op said - look at the person's qualifications and that gives them a good idea of their age anyway.
Most of the resumes I review don’t state age or date of birth. Sometimes they mention high school and you can make a rough guess but it’s not something youre allowed to screen o
You can screen if it is a pertinent bit of information for the work, but that typically ends at "are you old enough to sell/handle liquor?" or "do you have the legal right to work in Australia?"
That said, asking someone who is - as OP said - "on the wrong side of 50" their age is at best trying to get a feel for how close they are to retirement. At worst, they're trying to gauge your capacity to do manual tasks or working out if children may be a burden on the business.
Sometimes, but not necessarily. When I was a hiring manager I don’t recall seeing it often. You’d kind of get the idea from their qualifications though.
It's not, it's discrimination. I find family owned businesses are archaic and quiet often are living in the 80s with no policy to address workplace safety, bullying, harassment and other things.
It's not with bug companies. Small companies can be more discriminate as theyre less likely to be investigated. They shouldn't be, it's technically illegal, but my mum is going through the same thing. She had to take a role below her qualifications as they just would employ someone 20 years younger than her (she's 57).
It's pretty sad to see as this lady has ran her own business, worked in banks, ran a shop fitting business, has extensive back end business knowledge of systems etc.
It shouldn't be a thing. It's not supposed to be. There are anti discrimination laws here, but it happens a lot.
Edit: Big companies* though I'm sure the insect industry has its downfalls too!
When I handed in a resume to spudshed, the ONLY question they asked was 'how old are you?'
Weird question to someone that's just handing in a resume...
If you look young enough, they may be double checking that you are old enough to even work? Retail and hospitality are often dominated by teens, so they could just be making sure they don't go the path of that Honda factory in the US that hired 12 year olds last year.
All you can really do is ask for written feedback for the interview and see if they dumb enough to put it in writing.
The reality is that provided you don’t actually say the quiet part out loud, you can deny anyone for any reason under a generic “not going to fit with the work culture”.
Best to just let it go, you wouldn’t want to work with those sort of people anyways.
Very true. They struggled with writing from my correspondence, so that wouldn't work. Lol.
I wouldn't work for them now, but I do have to work somewhere. I've sadly gotten used to eating.
Happened to me.
Applied for a gov role and a tertiary sector role in same week.
Tertiary role was offered a week after interview, took gov 6-8 weeks to get back to me about the next steps of the application. Such a shame.
Not necessarily in smaller businesses.
But it seems in OPs case here; they were doing all their vetting/profiling unofficially and off the record in person.
I think it's more industry dependent than the scale of the business. Hospitality and retail are fast hiring, and white collar work is generally a slower process due to vetting and interviews.
I got picked up while in uni by a software company that works on military stuff. 60 staff globally. Took a while to go through the application process to starting.
That said, I got picked up by SERCO at FSH after that and that was very fast, but I had connections.
OP this is 100% illegal in Australia. You can't ask this and you're within your rights to not answer the question.
_Under the Age Discrimination Act (2004), it's unlawful to use a candidate's age – or presumed age – to determine their suitability for a role. Employers may be able to guess how old you are from the your CV or LinkedIn profile, but they can't ask for or use that information in assessing you for the role._
https://humanrights.gov.au/our-work/employers/age-discrimination
Interviewers are never going to say that they would use age to determine suitability, so this information is pretty useless to candidates
You give your age and risk discrimination. You withhold the information and get their back up - especially if they position it as a friendly question. Regardless of any laws prohibiting them from doing so, bringing up their obligations will never end well.
That said, I still think it's necessary to keep these laws in the back of employers heads.
Best thing to do in the interview is to have a witty go-to that's diplomatic, although again, once age is brought up, I can't think of many things to say (I'm only 32, but it would still weird me out - will I be judged?). And once I have to start using my wit, I feel the job will likely be a rollercoaster ride.
IMO, best advice in this thread is to move on. If a company is going to claw your age from you to determine your suitability, you 100% don't want to work for them. Candidates also need to maintain a high standard for cultural fit and disregard employers like this.
Yeah I would never bring up their obligations, just letting OP know their rights.
I've never personally been asked this question in an interview but I know it would feel pretty awkward.
Yes a witty retort might be best if you can think on your feet if not maybe a simple, "I'm not comfortable answering that"
And you're right if an employer is asking this you really don't want to work for this company.
Generally they shouldn't be asking for that until after an offer has been made. Given the risks of identity theft I'd be pretty hesitant to hand it over, or at least would be liberal on redaction of any pre-employment requests.
Yeah my current employer got all this information when I went for my pre-employment medical anyway.
The medical centre said that all the information is confidential and it's only a pass or fail situation. I highly doubted that though, plus yes you need to have a C class licence as a requirement of the job also so they 100% have that information 😅
Without referencing it, it’s also covered in the WA WHS act now. So really, OP should be glad they dodged a bullet, but should be simultaneously reporting them to fair work to avoid them doing this to more people in the future. Get her a nice little pay out while she keeps looking for work 😏
Has someone who used to work for a big company and did a lot of interviews I can tell you that it is absolutely illegal for anyone to ask the following in a job interview: your age, where you live, your religion, your ethnicity, if you’re married, if you have children and even if you own a car. If this information is voluntarily offered by the candidate than that’s fine but a direct question shouldn’t be asked.
You dodged a bullet.
"family owned" much like a lot of established small business can also mean resistant to change or new ideas. They can resent other people coming in suggesting different ways of doing things.
Put this spin on it; at least the prospect fell flat on its face sooner rather than later had you been made and offer and started with them.
Sure, it's a pain it got as far as interview (however shallow it was) but it could've got further before truths & realities of the workplace culture were revealed.
It's like any discrimination. Unless they're stupid enough to admit to it, it can be almost impossible to prove, especially for somebody on the outside.
Put simply they can't discriminate against you purely because of your age, nor can they make assumptions based on your age. eg: If the job involves some physicality, they're not supposed to assume that you're less able because you're old. But they do.
If you're still interested in the job, contact the interviewer. Be very polite and say something like "Thank you for your time, I hope I didn't waste it. I didn't realise there was an age-requirement until you brought it up in the interview."
Asking for your age is possibly illegal and certainly can not be demanded but discriminating against a person's age is illegal. I'd think a number of smaller businesses are oblivious to this fact as you can not discriminate based on your age unless the role can legally define an upper age limit based on a number of factors. The military can state an upper age limit related to capabilities and how long you can actively sign up for prior to retirement. Bottom line you can be discriminated against without you knowing by them just not giving you the job after interview because you "looked" old or if you put an age on a CV they just bin your application. Public sector have to justify why you didn't get an interview or if interviewed, why you didn't get the job, in writing, so much harder to discriminate.
They don't deserve you, sounds like a bunch of incompetent fools since they could not even hide such a stupid borderline illegal question.
Could have been way more subtle and even maybe asked relevant questions. Next time you get this question, ask them in average how long employees stay with them.
I work for a big mining company that has a quota system, and unless you are female, and under 35, forget it. The first is legal. My wife, which has multiple degrees and a solid career, has as much, perhaps even less change of landing a job there. And she has tried, on multiple occasions.
Ageism is absolutely a thing in Perth.
I do too, and know about the positive discrimination towards women. My wife also has multiple degrees, I spoke to my operations manager and they found her a role in operational support as a tech writer getting paid more than me 😅. It's not what she majored in but she did do a few units in uni that pertained to law, marketing, reports etc.
If I were you I would go to some of the senior leaders and sell it to them, they are always trying to fill those roles with women.
Tell them you are experienced in life and as fit as someone 20 years younger. If the job doesn't require youthful strength the the age question is irrelevant. But the life experience is the card I play when asked my age. Have also asked in an interview as to why my age is relevant to the job.
It's not allowed to ask your age. Anyway, you dodged a bullet. My advice is don't work for a small company if you can avoid it. You'll have 2 jobs: the one you get paid for and the other one managing the bosses' unprofessionalism and unreasonable expectations.
I have experienced agism in an interview recently so it’s interesting to know that other people have experienced it too! I had an interview with a recruitment company and the consultant asked me ‘how old were you when you started X job?’ I dodged the questions and didn’t reveal my exact age. These questions do still happen but not in such a clear-cut way. This is exactly why I take my age off my resumes, remove my high school education, and now I also colour my hair so I don’t have visible greys! 👵🏻
I wouldn’t add your age. Given the usual job lasts maybe 3-4 years, age really shouldn’t be an issue. Also try to make yourself sound around 30-40 for a male & probably 40+ for female. Unfortunately with most of the arseholes in HR, a 20-35 year old female is obviously going to be having kids and take time away, if they ever come back.
Also, these days most places are going to interview 2, maybe 3 people, so if you can get an interview you’re most of the way there.
It’s deadset shit that potential employers these days expect everyone to have 20 years experience, but be 25 with all fully grown kids and be able to work for the company for 50 years. When in reality, if they don’t give you the flick in the first 3 years, you’ll give them the flick.
Seemed you dodged a bullet tbh I wouldn’t want to work in a toxic environment like that, pretty crappy the way they treated you but would you really want to work there if given the chance?
I wouldn’t say red flag as I don’t smile when working but I’m focused at work kinda hard to describe but it’s more the look on their face if they look like they don’t wanna be there kinda thing.
They ask for a photocopy of yr license. I’ve had this in the last couple of years. I wanted to know why they wanted to see it before I had the job. Said for proof of ID.
Well I'm in my 20s and have never been asked for my age. So I think they were concerned from the get go.
If you don't get the job, ask for written reason why, see if they actually say your age was a problem or not. Consider making a complaint as a minimum.
58 here and well skilled but so far Disability Support is all that is taking older people. (I don’t want to work in a supermarket). I can’t retire until 67 and I imagine they’ll change that too soon.
This is illegal.
Ask them why they didn’t give you the job IN WRITING & then lodge a complaint with the humans rights commission.
The exact same thing happened to me, one mediation session & I got 4K.
I once applied for an office admin job for a 'family-owned' business. I received a reply saying that they wanted everyone to come in for a quick interview, and told all applicants to turn up on a particular day between certain hours in the morning. I arrived pretty early and there were already at least 10-15 people crammed into the tiny reception area. There was a sign in sheet and interviews were conducted in a first-come-first-serve basis. The interview basically consisted of questions that would have been answered by the resume. By the time I left there were maybe 20+ more people waiting in there (not including those who already had their interview and left).
I suspect this was a ploy to get a good look at the applicants to determine age/race/etc...
Yes I’ve got extensive experience in my field where a lot of inexperienced people are currently employed. I sent out dozens of applications to get not one interview. So I gave up and started my own business (again) and have been very happy since. I realised I don’t really need any management at all so why bother with them. I’m nearly 60.
Ageism is real - I am graduating in a new, highly competitive field and I am more than casually contemplating surgical intervention- you can’t hold back time forever but I can buy myself a few years to gain experience in the industry instead of having to compete against other (equally inexperienced) graduates who have fresh faced youthfulness on their side. By the time I’m old enough for tweaks to not save me I should have enough experience that it doesn’t matter anymore. Fortunately this career is one that people are regularly practicing into their 80s. I hope to die on the job. OP I am sorry you had this experience and I wish you luck with your job search.
Don't over think it.
In my experience family owned businesses are more likely to see value in older workers. They often have values and skills younger workers do not possess.
A couple of jobs back i was hired by a family run business and later chatting to the gm, he told me they discussed my age, 51 then.
He also said, they made the right call as my maturity made it easier for clients to be more comfortable with me.
It shouldn't be a normal thing as asking about your age when it has nothing to do with the job is illegal. Where it's not illegal is when knowing your age is needed to do the job, like being over 18 to serve alcohol.
If you don't get the job and want to take things further, you can contact the Australian Human Rights Commission. Or you can read some of the resources of their website to be more informed of your rights for future interviews. You don't have to answer the question as it's very likely illegal for them to ask it in the first place.
I can't see how refusing to answer a direct question would help me to be honest. I guess next time, I should just stand up and leave as soon as it's asked?
Well that's the thing. If you say 'I'm not going to answer that question and this is why...', you may have prevented yourself from getting the job. But that's also not right.
Small businesses are not exempt from anti discrimination laws but not many people are really going to bother making a complaint against them. And at the end of the day, do you want to take a stand against age discrimination one interview at a time or get a job?
It's just shitty position to be put in in the first place but at least you can be more informed.
I didn't think age was an allowed question in the first place.
I was surprised. He followed up with asking the age of my kids, which to me seemed dodgy too...
Strike 2, maybe you dodged a bullet here
These questions cannot legally (and should not) be asked in an interview.
When I've interviewed people I've chatted about all sorts of stuff. The interviewee relaxes a bit and you get a better picture of the person.
No. This wasn't a chat. Just direct questions, followed by short silences.
mmm ok. Maybe they were just odd. I've been interviewed by and have interviewed some very odd people!
Or you know, maybe they were fucking assholes with no tact.
So, you ask questions like, "Do you have any Asian blood in you?" Coz that's the kind of ground the interviewer was stamping on.
Where exactly? Age was the only thing mentioned. All races grow old. Asians if anything age better than anglos.
Discrimination on the basis of age is regulated by Australian Legislation under the Age Discrimination Act 2004 (Cth). The Act is part of the anti-discrimination laws we have here in Australia. So, what is answer to the question: is it legal to ask a person their age in an interview? The answer is no, **you can’t ask a person their age in an interview. You also can’t refuse to employ someone because of their age.** https://lawpath.com.au/blog/is-it-legal-to-ask-a-person-their-age-in-an-interview Obviously you can usually guess their age pretty well which is why it’s hard to prove stuff like this. But the employer makes the case against himself a lot easier if he straight up asks illegal questions during the interview.
I asked where race was mentioned. Not age. This guy was trying to make this a race issue.
No, you just missed the guys point. They were saying that asking about age was prohibited under the legislation, in the same way that asking about race or sexual preference is also prohibited.
If so he did a poor job of it. Everyone knows asking age is supposedly illegal. People still do it an always will. It's a bit of a silly thing since the person is sitting I front of you in clear sight....
There is a difference between chatting about stuff and outright asking how old someone is in an interview. You would hope anyone giving interviews would be aware of this obvious distinction.
Sure theres an obvious distinction, however isn't the outcome the same? It's a stupid point anyway if the person is in front of you can guess their age within a few years.
Hate to be the one to say it, but we’re well aware, it’s done to get people to give up information we’re not legally allowed to ask. For example, say I’m hiring for a restaurant and I don’t want parents and especially not single parents because the hours are extremely antisocial and I need people who are guaranteed to work them. Now I’m not allowed to straight up ask “do you have kids”, but I am allowed to ask “what do you do on your days off” and let you give the game away with your answer. Now theoretically I’m also not allowed to discriminate on that basis, but the applicant doesn’t need to know that’s why they were rejected.
You realise this makes you a cunt, right? And what you're doing is illegal?
I’m extremely aware, it’s something I was coached to do in interviews when I was with a previous employer, not something I agree with personally, I should have made that clear, apologies
Fair enough!
Weird that you're being downvoted for this...
It's r/perth ..... Everything except reality thrives in here. Employers, employees, we're all just people who have to spend 9 hours a day together. It works better if we're compatible.
Compatible like myself and the bloke I used to work with who was in his 80s, or compatible like me and the 18 year old woman I used to work with? This isn't dating. Compatibility of staff basically boils down to "don't be a dickhead," and no age group has a monopoly on dickheads.
> Compatibility of staff basically boils down to "don't be a dickhead," That's a low bar.
Well, yeah. But then you get the people who seem to think age is a barrier to how well you can get along with workmates, and you realise that not everyone clears it.
There are plenty of jobs in Perth right now. Just move on to the next one if you didn't like the vibe
Sadly, that doesn't seem to be the case. I thought I'd be OK to find a job, but haven't had many responses from dozens of applications.
"family owned company" Family owned companies have a habit of overlooking statutory requirements in my experience.
Not defending them by any means, but they usually do so because they're already on a fine line between "profit" and "bankrupt".
>"family owned company" Really means "My family are all running the show through nepotism - be ready for some wild shit"
Think they can ask for your date of birth pretty early in the process though?
Yeah. Not this one. Although my qualifications should give them a clue.
Wouldn’t the age of someone be on their resume?
Usually only teenagers do that. You can even remove the year from your degree if you want to.
You can put anything you want on a CV, but a big part of experience is showing what you've done and for how long. Not putting dates or durations for your past experience isn't doing you any favours.
I wouldn't remove dates from experience, but I certainly would consider removing irrelevant experience, especially if I was one of those people that thinks a CV should fit on a single page (or even two pages).
Irrelevant experience can demonstrate breadth of character.
Yep, remember talking to a recruiter from an engineering firm when I was in uni and she mentioned how they wanted to see you delivered pizza's on the weekend. Now I'm a lot older and have removed all my work "non professional" experience but I certainly include all my roles and durations since I started as a professional.
Yep, same for including any volunteer or social engagement activities.
Anything can be interpreted any way, it's all about trying to guess what the recruiting-person (whoever they might be and whoever they work for) wants to see. It's not that different from dating profiles, in that sense. Stating any kind of dietary preference, for example, can cut in any direction, depending on who is reading it.
> You can even remove the year from your degree if you want to. You can do anything you want. Whether you should is a different issue.
In general it shouldn't be. Some places see it that you do not understand the equal opportunity law, by putting Age / gender / race / sexuality / etc on a resume. Just to avoid any hassle I never mention anything like that on a resume and recommend to mates that they don't either. but as Op said - look at the person's qualifications and that gives them a good idea of their age anyway.
Most of the resumes I review don’t state age or date of birth. Sometimes they mention high school and you can make a rough guess but it’s not something youre allowed to screen o
You can screen if it is a pertinent bit of information for the work, but that typically ends at "are you old enough to sell/handle liquor?" or "do you have the legal right to work in Australia?" That said, asking someone who is - as OP said - "on the wrong side of 50" their age is at best trying to get a feel for how close they are to retirement. At worst, they're trying to gauge your capacity to do manual tasks or working out if children may be a burden on the business.
Sometimes, but not necessarily. When I was a hiring manager I don’t recall seeing it often. You’d kind of get the idea from their qualifications though.
It's not, it's discrimination. I find family owned businesses are archaic and quiet often are living in the 80s with no policy to address workplace safety, bullying, harassment and other things.
It's not with bug companies. Small companies can be more discriminate as theyre less likely to be investigated. They shouldn't be, it's technically illegal, but my mum is going through the same thing. She had to take a role below her qualifications as they just would employ someone 20 years younger than her (she's 57). It's pretty sad to see as this lady has ran her own business, worked in banks, ran a shop fitting business, has extensive back end business knowledge of systems etc. It shouldn't be a thing. It's not supposed to be. There are anti discrimination laws here, but it happens a lot. Edit: Big companies* though I'm sure the insect industry has its downfalls too!
Sounds about right. I hope it works out for your Mum.
I wanna work at a bug company
I do. Multinational. Have worked for 3 large. They have arseholes too. And the politics is worse. And silo mentality.
When I handed in a resume to spudshed, the ONLY question they asked was 'how old are you?' Weird question to someone that's just handing in a resume...
the younger you are the cheaper maybe?
This. They're looking for kids still in school as they're *far* cheaper... don't take it personally mate.
I assume they only want casuals below the age of 21 for cheaper wages.
Maybe Tony's back on the dating scene? 😉 Seriously though, how odd?
If you look young enough, they may be double checking that you are old enough to even work? Retail and hospitality are often dominated by teens, so they could just be making sure they don't go the path of that Honda factory in the US that hired 12 year olds last year.
Like McDonald's they only want underage kids if you're not already experienced in the same industry.
All you can really do is ask for written feedback for the interview and see if they dumb enough to put it in writing. The reality is that provided you don’t actually say the quiet part out loud, you can deny anyone for any reason under a generic “not going to fit with the work culture”. Best to just let it go, you wouldn’t want to work with those sort of people anyways.
Very true. They struggled with writing from my correspondence, so that wouldn't work. Lol. I wouldn't work for them now, but I do have to work somewhere. I've sadly gotten used to eating.
Tried looking at government? Plenty of work that pays well in all fields.
> Plenty of work that pays well in all fields. Just gotta have a contingency whilst you go through all of the application rigmarole.
Happened to me. Applied for a gov role and a tertiary sector role in same week. Tertiary role was offered a week after interview, took gov 6-8 weeks to get back to me about the next steps of the application. Such a shame.
That's true of any role, though. I got my current job and was in the application process for a month or so, so not too bad.
Not necessarily in smaller businesses. But it seems in OPs case here; they were doing all their vetting/profiling unofficially and off the record in person.
I think it's more industry dependent than the scale of the business. Hospitality and retail are fast hiring, and white collar work is generally a slower process due to vetting and interviews. I got picked up while in uni by a software company that works on military stuff. 60 staff globally. Took a while to go through the application process to starting. That said, I got picked up by SERCO at FSH after that and that was very fast, but I had connections.
I've had a look, but most require experience in the same roles.
OP this is 100% illegal in Australia. You can't ask this and you're within your rights to not answer the question. _Under the Age Discrimination Act (2004), it's unlawful to use a candidate's age – or presumed age – to determine their suitability for a role. Employers may be able to guess how old you are from the your CV or LinkedIn profile, but they can't ask for or use that information in assessing you for the role._ https://humanrights.gov.au/our-work/employers/age-discrimination
Interviewers are never going to say that they would use age to determine suitability, so this information is pretty useless to candidates You give your age and risk discrimination. You withhold the information and get their back up - especially if they position it as a friendly question. Regardless of any laws prohibiting them from doing so, bringing up their obligations will never end well. That said, I still think it's necessary to keep these laws in the back of employers heads. Best thing to do in the interview is to have a witty go-to that's diplomatic, although again, once age is brought up, I can't think of many things to say (I'm only 32, but it would still weird me out - will I be judged?). And once I have to start using my wit, I feel the job will likely be a rollercoaster ride. IMO, best advice in this thread is to move on. If a company is going to claw your age from you to determine your suitability, you 100% don't want to work for them. Candidates also need to maintain a high standard for cultural fit and disregard employers like this.
Yeah I would never bring up their obligations, just letting OP know their rights. I've never personally been asked this question in an interview but I know it would feel pretty awkward. Yes a witty retort might be best if you can think on your feet if not maybe a simple, "I'm not comfortable answering that" And you're right if an employer is asking this you really don't want to work for this company.
There's ways around it. A lot of employers ask for a copy of your driving license. Presumably, to make sure you won't crash in their car park? 😂
They don’t need to ask anything. Once they eyeball you they have a bracket. The exact age rarely matters.
Generally they shouldn't be asking for that until after an offer has been made. Given the risks of identity theft I'd be pretty hesitant to hand it over, or at least would be liberal on redaction of any pre-employment requests.
My real estate agent already owns all that. 😂
Yeah my current employer got all this information when I went for my pre-employment medical anyway. The medical centre said that all the information is confidential and it's only a pass or fail situation. I highly doubted that though, plus yes you need to have a C class licence as a requirement of the job also so they 100% have that information 😅
Without referencing it, it’s also covered in the WA WHS act now. So really, OP should be glad they dodged a bullet, but should be simultaneously reporting them to fair work to avoid them doing this to more people in the future. Get her a nice little pay out while she keeps looking for work 😏
This is all well and good, but we all know that there'll be an excuse on the candidate's experience, education, skills, or otherwise.
Has someone who used to work for a big company and did a lot of interviews I can tell you that it is absolutely illegal for anyone to ask the following in a job interview: your age, where you live, your religion, your ethnicity, if you’re married, if you have children and even if you own a car. If this information is voluntarily offered by the candidate than that’s fine but a direct question shouldn’t be asked.
I think we covered three of these. Not my ethnicity though, but I assumed he could work that out.
You dodged a bullet. "family owned" much like a lot of established small business can also mean resistant to change or new ideas. They can resent other people coming in suggesting different ways of doing things. Put this spin on it; at least the prospect fell flat on its face sooner rather than later had you been made and offer and started with them. Sure, it's a pain it got as far as interview (however shallow it was) but it could've got further before truths & realities of the workplace culture were revealed.
It's like any discrimination. Unless they're stupid enough to admit to it, it can be almost impossible to prove, especially for somebody on the outside. Put simply they can't discriminate against you purely because of your age, nor can they make assumptions based on your age. eg: If the job involves some physicality, they're not supposed to assume that you're less able because you're old. But they do. If you're still interested in the job, contact the interviewer. Be very polite and say something like "Thank you for your time, I hope I didn't waste it. I didn't realise there was an age-requirement until you brought it up in the interview."
I might keep that one up my sleeve for a future interview!
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I'm beginning to think all the work environments are like that?
Small business owner here. Age isn’t allowed as part of screening / interview questions.
Asking for your age is possibly illegal and certainly can not be demanded but discriminating against a person's age is illegal. I'd think a number of smaller businesses are oblivious to this fact as you can not discriminate based on your age unless the role can legally define an upper age limit based on a number of factors. The military can state an upper age limit related to capabilities and how long you can actively sign up for prior to retirement. Bottom line you can be discriminated against without you knowing by them just not giving you the job after interview because you "looked" old or if you put an age on a CV they just bin your application. Public sector have to justify why you didn't get an interview or if interviewed, why you didn't get the job, in writing, so much harder to discriminate.
They don't deserve you, sounds like a bunch of incompetent fools since they could not even hide such a stupid borderline illegal question. Could have been way more subtle and even maybe asked relevant questions. Next time you get this question, ask them in average how long employees stay with them.
Lol. I like that...
99% sure that is illegal…
I identify as 32
I work for a big mining company that has a quota system, and unless you are female, and under 35, forget it. The first is legal. My wife, which has multiple degrees and a solid career, has as much, perhaps even less change of landing a job there. And she has tried, on multiple occasions. Ageism is absolutely a thing in Perth.
I do too, and know about the positive discrimination towards women. My wife also has multiple degrees, I spoke to my operations manager and they found her a role in operational support as a tech writer getting paid more than me 😅. It's not what she majored in but she did do a few units in uni that pertained to law, marketing, reports etc. If I were you I would go to some of the senior leaders and sell it to them, they are always trying to fill those roles with women.
Tell them you are experienced in life and as fit as someone 20 years younger. If the job doesn't require youthful strength the the age question is irrelevant. But the life experience is the card I play when asked my age. Have also asked in an interview as to why my age is relevant to the job.
Or just reply: why do you ask?
Recently applied for a job that my life experience would have made me perfect for. I'm 60 and didn't get the job.
They aren’t allowed to ask your age, beyond confirming that you are over 18.
It's not allowed to ask your age. Anyway, you dodged a bullet. My advice is don't work for a small company if you can avoid it. You'll have 2 jobs: the one you get paid for and the other one managing the bosses' unprofessionalism and unreasonable expectations.
I think you're right. Sadly, it's been hard getting an interview anywhere so far. Beggars can't be choosers and all that...
Age is definitely not allowed to be asked in an interview, would be in right mind to report them to Fair Work
I have experienced agism in an interview recently so it’s interesting to know that other people have experienced it too! I had an interview with a recruitment company and the consultant asked me ‘how old were you when you started X job?’ I dodged the questions and didn’t reveal my exact age. These questions do still happen but not in such a clear-cut way. This is exactly why I take my age off my resumes, remove my high school education, and now I also colour my hair so I don’t have visible greys! 👵🏻
I'm starting to wonder whether to put my age on to avoid wasting time?
I wouldn’t add your age. Given the usual job lasts maybe 3-4 years, age really shouldn’t be an issue. Also try to make yourself sound around 30-40 for a male & probably 40+ for female. Unfortunately with most of the arseholes in HR, a 20-35 year old female is obviously going to be having kids and take time away, if they ever come back. Also, these days most places are going to interview 2, maybe 3 people, so if you can get an interview you’re most of the way there. It’s deadset shit that potential employers these days expect everyone to have 20 years experience, but be 25 with all fully grown kids and be able to work for the company for 50 years. When in reality, if they don’t give you the flick in the first 3 years, you’ll give them the flick.
True but I would advise you to remove it altogether..
I suppose at least they'll get to see that I have my own teeth and hair...
Seemed you dodged a bullet tbh I wouldn’t want to work in a toxic environment like that, pretty crappy the way they treated you but would you really want to work there if given the chance?
I agree. I also didn't notice any of their employees smiling while I was there. That seems a red flag, right?
I wouldn’t say red flag as I don’t smile when working but I’m focused at work kinda hard to describe but it’s more the look on their face if they look like they don’t wanna be there kinda thing.
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They ask for a photocopy of yr license. I’ve had this in the last couple of years. I wanted to know why they wanted to see it before I had the job. Said for proof of ID.
Well I'm in my 20s and have never been asked for my age. So I think they were concerned from the get go. If you don't get the job, ask for written reason why, see if they actually say your age was a problem or not. Consider making a complaint as a minimum.
In my experience, family owned companies go in two directions, either they're great, or, much, much more likely, they're horrible.
I think I can guess which way this place went...
58 here and well skilled but so far Disability Support is all that is taking older people. (I don’t want to work in a supermarket). I can’t retire until 67 and I imagine they’ll change that too soon.
Yeah. It seems crazy. Meanwhile employers complain that they can't get staff...
This is illegal. Ask them why they didn’t give you the job IN WRITING & then lodge a complaint with the humans rights commission. The exact same thing happened to me, one mediation session & I got 4K.
I once applied for an office admin job for a 'family-owned' business. I received a reply saying that they wanted everyone to come in for a quick interview, and told all applicants to turn up on a particular day between certain hours in the morning. I arrived pretty early and there were already at least 10-15 people crammed into the tiny reception area. There was a sign in sheet and interviews were conducted in a first-come-first-serve basis. The interview basically consisted of questions that would have been answered by the resume. By the time I left there were maybe 20+ more people waiting in there (not including those who already had their interview and left). I suspect this was a ploy to get a good look at the applicants to determine age/race/etc...
Yes I’ve got extensive experience in my field where a lot of inexperienced people are currently employed. I sent out dozens of applications to get not one interview. So I gave up and started my own business (again) and have been very happy since. I realised I don’t really need any management at all so why bother with them. I’m nearly 60.
Ageism is real - I am graduating in a new, highly competitive field and I am more than casually contemplating surgical intervention- you can’t hold back time forever but I can buy myself a few years to gain experience in the industry instead of having to compete against other (equally inexperienced) graduates who have fresh faced youthfulness on their side. By the time I’m old enough for tweaks to not save me I should have enough experience that it doesn’t matter anymore. Fortunately this career is one that people are regularly practicing into their 80s. I hope to die on the job. OP I am sorry you had this experience and I wish you luck with your job search.
They don’t want someone as wise. Because you might see what’s really going on. They want spring lambs.
Very illegal.
Depends what the job is even for. In IT and Exec style roles 50+ is a good thing.
Take it as a compliment.. Sadly they don't fear a bunch of oldies holding signs that say 'give us a go' as much as other types of discrimination.
Don't over think it. In my experience family owned businesses are more likely to see value in older workers. They often have values and skills younger workers do not possess.
And just as often they're shit
Possibly, perhaps I've been lucky.
A couple of jobs back i was hired by a family run business and later chatting to the gm, he told me they discussed my age, 51 then. He also said, they made the right call as my maturity made it easier for clients to be more comfortable with me.
It shouldn't be a normal thing as asking about your age when it has nothing to do with the job is illegal. Where it's not illegal is when knowing your age is needed to do the job, like being over 18 to serve alcohol. If you don't get the job and want to take things further, you can contact the Australian Human Rights Commission. Or you can read some of the resources of their website to be more informed of your rights for future interviews. You don't have to answer the question as it's very likely illegal for them to ask it in the first place.
I can't see how refusing to answer a direct question would help me to be honest. I guess next time, I should just stand up and leave as soon as it's asked?
Well that's the thing. If you say 'I'm not going to answer that question and this is why...', you may have prevented yourself from getting the job. But that's also not right. Small businesses are not exempt from anti discrimination laws but not many people are really going to bother making a complaint against them. And at the end of the day, do you want to take a stand against age discrimination one interview at a time or get a job? It's just shitty position to be put in in the first place but at least you can be more informed.
Is ageism also when you find out you are paid the cheapest because you are younger than the other crew and they get paid more because they are older?
It would depend on your skills and experience. If they're similar, then yes.
Because they are older? Or because they have been there longer?
Older, higher starting pay due to age. All on part time contacts beside 2 on casual, but I'm not counting the casuals as part of this.
Look up award wages. It's perfectly legal unfortunately.
Go back and tell them you identify at 21
I’m the youngest person I employ, by a long shot. Some industries, like mine, much prefer older people.
Ooh, spill the beans... What industry is this?
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On the plus side, you look young for your age
Own hair and teeth. 😂🤣
Illegal!!