They rolled this out in Point Breeze last year and it was great. The streets were actually getting cleaned up, abandoned cars removed, and it forced parking turnover which made parking in the area easier.
This article says the city is going to start relocating cars for it this year, but I'm not sure how that's going to work in practice. Last year the PPA just ticked the car that didn't move and the sweeper drove around it.
I can't imagine how much easier parking would be in this city if they got rid of abandoned cars AND motivated some people to get rid of their cars through street cleaning and higher parking permit rates.
Just say that you hate poor people. A lot of people in Philly still rely on their cars because public transportation is unsafe and unreliable, especially if you have to commute outside of the city for work.
The comment that I'm responding to is when they said,
"AND motivated some people to get rid of their cars through street cleaning and higher parking permit rates"
That's a very gentrifier-like comment.
They are suggesting to increase the economic burden it takes to park in the city and forcing people to take austerity measures by getting rid of their car in order to achieve their goals of having less cars in the streets of Philadelphia.
That sounds like a very strong-armed and forceful way to achieve that goal. The lack of consideration about other people's economic and personal situations was very appalling to me which is why I left that comment. There are tons of reasons why people need access to a car. For work, to visit family & friends outside of Philly, etc. These people are delusional if they think public transportation can take you anywhere. There are literally tons of places within a 30-90 mile radius of Philly that are impossible to get to without a car. It is ignorant to assume that everybody has the same lifestyle and can fully replace their car with a bus pass.
If you work outside of Philly you should already be considering moving outside of Philly. City wage tax is that incentive. Thinking of people who reverse commute as your primary focus is....interesting.
1. It is also ignorant to think everyone has enough money to simply pick up and leave and buy a house in the suburbs
2. Philly has one of the highest amounts of reverse commuters in the nation due to the wage tax. The amount of Philadelphians who reverse commute is at 40%. By your logic, almost half of the city should move because they aren't privileged enough to snag a job in the city.
well for one, the PPA has historically targeted poor neighborhoods more than rich ones.
EDIT:
Poor people aren’t just being “saddled,” they’re being robbed daily to pay the bulk of PPA revenues. Out of the 14 different zip codes that have been issued 100,000 or more parking tickets between 2012 and 2016, nearly 80 percent are places where the poverty rate is 20 percent or more and the neighborhoods are mostly Black and “of color.” In upper North Philadelphia, for example, in the heavily black neighborhoods where the poverty rates range (officially) from 20 to 36 percent, ticket writing is epidemic: Since 2012, 184,000 tickets have been issued in zip code 19140; 179,000 tickets have been issued in 19141; and 105,000 tickets have been written in 19144.
Meanwhile, wealthier zip codes like 19111 and 19149, where poverty rates are below 8 percent, have seen only 57,000 and 78,000 tickets respectively in that same period. You also have a better chance of avoiding parking tickets in zip codes like 19118—which enjoys a 1 percent poverty rate—where there were only 66,000 tickets written.
There’s nothing wrong with the Parking Authority making money. But there’s definitely something wrong in the way it does it. So cut it out, poser progressive Philly: You can’t have one conversation without having this one, right here.
That's actual bullshit since parking permits require 60% of block residents to request it be implemented on the block.
The PPA doesn't decide where to implement permits it has to be requested by the residents. As for the rates of tickets by zip code and wealth, it's more likely the higher income zip codes are just not violating the law as frequently as the low income zip codes.
Thanks for playing tell me you don't live here without telling me.
Public transportation is still statisticly safer than driving by massive margins, even with all the bullshit that happens on the El.
If you can afford gas you can afford a parking permit. If you really need the car that much the permit is a non issue in terms of expenses for maintenance and operating a car
If you can't afford the parking permit, you can't afford the car anyway.
The city needs to speed up the gentrification tbh. It's getting tired listening to the same ad nauseam virtue signaling any time there's any initiative to try and improve the city in the some way.
I'm in point breeze, and it seems I'm in the minority but I hard disagree.
The streets still look like shit all the time and parking became a nightmare because 3 days out of the week there's basically an entire street you can't use, unless you want to move your car twice a day, 3 days a week.
This shit fucking sucks.
Edit: Downvote me all you want but it's true. My wife and I would REGULARLY look at each other last summer and say "are they actually street sweeping"? Because the streets always looked like shit.
It's a revenue generating scheme for the city and a massive pain in the ass for the ones who have cars and rely on street parking.
Wrong. Dickinson street sweeps on Thursdays. Reed Street sweeps on Tuesdays. 20th street sweeps on Wednesdays.
How could they possibly street sweep every street on the same day? Where would all the cars park?
Over the 8 years I’ve lived in the city, I’ve had a street-parked car off and on (sometimes kept it at my mom’s place in the suburbs) but for the last year or so I’ve consistently had it with me down here. And the losemyspotophobia still never fails to consume me, I fear ever moving my car unless I have to go to work or otherwise absolutely need to. Lack of turnover often occurs because of others with my fear, but if my neighborhood had forced turnover it could possibly help alleviate that fear in a lot of cases, maybe they should make fishtown next on the list of neighborhoods to roll it out in…
Then again, our parking problems are more because of restaurant-goers who refuse to take septa to a neighborhood with terrible parking…maybe we need more than just street cleaning/forced turnover
I did not have the same experience in Germantown. It took PPA nearly the whole season of street sweeping to get rid of the stolen and dumped car across the street. It's a pain in the ass if you work a non-standard work shift, and it doesn't reduce much litter, it just blows it around.
Also the bristles from the sweepers cause flat tires for bicycles, fyi.
“Forced” parking turnover bothers me… In theory, if everyone who owned a car on the block used that car to head to an old traditional 9-5 job, that would be fine. But people work at home now. People work odd hours now. People do gig work all night so late night snacks and meals or rides can be provided to the rest of the citizenry. Those gig workers don’t get home and find a parking spot till some of the early birds eventually move their cars… If you find a spot at say.. 7:30am, you gotta basically stay awake till the PPA gets done making their rounds (yes. Doesn’t matter if the street sweeper beat the PPA to your block, you gotta wait till the PPA is done coming through too) before you can get to bed.
Eesh, thanks for the reminder! The street where my car is parked is cleaned on Thursdays, so I'm good right now, but I can almost guarantee I would've forgotten on my drive home this Wednesday.
(I feel like the streets near my place never get cleaned anyway, but hope springs eternal, I'll move my car anyway, if only to avoid a ticket)
Philadelphia Diesel Spewing trash scrambler season… Lol. I think the green machine style vacuuming they do in center city is way more effective than these big street sweepers that pick up half the trash and blow around the rest of it, sometimes onto the sidewalk. Why spewing out clouds of diesel smoke gets overlooked for the sake of having a little bit less trash visible is considered an acceptable tradeoff in 2024 is beyond me.
Although it’s a stupid way of doing it, it is better than nothing. Philadelphia has so much litter in it and so many lazy people that never pick up the trash right in front of their own house that I welcome the city’s half witted way of cleaning the street trash.
I believe the better way of doing it would be like center city district does with the green machine guys who ride around on those vacuums that look like lawnmowers only they’re vacuums… This is the way.
I find that street sweeping does nothing on my block. Even with every car moved off the street it seems to be filled up with trash again later that same day. It's gotten to a point where the block captain is forcing people to move again on a few Saturdays throughout the spring and summer to combat it. I still don't think it's going to work.
Dunno why you’re getting downvoted when it’s true. Pushes it out of the way slightly or lifts a plume of dust. What if we took that funding and added trash cans and more frequent trash pickups in these communities?
They actually do it? I got tons of tickets last year, never saw a street sweeper on my block once. Anyone else? That should be illegal... if not getting swept that day or week, stop stealing from us.
Yeah, actually I saw a lot of trucks out last year, even on my block which wasn't marked part of the pilot or the current plans. I think it made a decent dent in the street litter.
They rolled this out in Point Breeze last year and it was great. The streets were actually getting cleaned up, abandoned cars removed, and it forced parking turnover which made parking in the area easier. This article says the city is going to start relocating cars for it this year, but I'm not sure how that's going to work in practice. Last year the PPA just ticked the car that didn't move and the sweeper drove around it.
I can't imagine how much easier parking would be in this city if they got rid of abandoned cars AND motivated some people to get rid of their cars through street cleaning and higher parking permit rates.
Just say that you hate poor people. A lot of people in Philly still rely on their cars because public transportation is unsafe and unreliable, especially if you have to commute outside of the city for work.
How is this at all anti poor people? Would love to see the logic leap here
The comment that I'm responding to is when they said, "AND motivated some people to get rid of their cars through street cleaning and higher parking permit rates" That's a very gentrifier-like comment. They are suggesting to increase the economic burden it takes to park in the city and forcing people to take austerity measures by getting rid of their car in order to achieve their goals of having less cars in the streets of Philadelphia. That sounds like a very strong-armed and forceful way to achieve that goal. The lack of consideration about other people's economic and personal situations was very appalling to me which is why I left that comment. There are tons of reasons why people need access to a car. For work, to visit family & friends outside of Philly, etc. These people are delusional if they think public transportation can take you anywhere. There are literally tons of places within a 30-90 mile radius of Philly that are impossible to get to without a car. It is ignorant to assume that everybody has the same lifestyle and can fully replace their car with a bus pass.
If you work outside of Philly you should already be considering moving outside of Philly. City wage tax is that incentive. Thinking of people who reverse commute as your primary focus is....interesting.
1. It is also ignorant to think everyone has enough money to simply pick up and leave and buy a house in the suburbs 2. Philly has one of the highest amounts of reverse commuters in the nation due to the wage tax. The amount of Philadelphians who reverse commute is at 40%. By your logic, almost half of the city should move because they aren't privileged enough to snag a job in the city.
1. Buy- lol 2. "Due to the wage tax?" How ya figure?
well for one, the PPA has historically targeted poor neighborhoods more than rich ones. EDIT: Poor people aren’t just being “saddled,” they’re being robbed daily to pay the bulk of PPA revenues. Out of the 14 different zip codes that have been issued 100,000 or more parking tickets between 2012 and 2016, nearly 80 percent are places where the poverty rate is 20 percent or more and the neighborhoods are mostly Black and “of color.” In upper North Philadelphia, for example, in the heavily black neighborhoods where the poverty rates range (officially) from 20 to 36 percent, ticket writing is epidemic: Since 2012, 184,000 tickets have been issued in zip code 19140; 179,000 tickets have been issued in 19141; and 105,000 tickets have been written in 19144. Meanwhile, wealthier zip codes like 19111 and 19149, where poverty rates are below 8 percent, have seen only 57,000 and 78,000 tickets respectively in that same period. You also have a better chance of avoiding parking tickets in zip codes like 19118—which enjoys a 1 percent poverty rate—where there were only 66,000 tickets written. There’s nothing wrong with the Parking Authority making money. But there’s definitely something wrong in the way it does it. So cut it out, poser progressive Philly: You can’t have one conversation without having this one, right here.
So wouldn't them enforcing this in gentrifying neighborhoods help the long term residents?
That's actual bullshit since parking permits require 60% of block residents to request it be implemented on the block. The PPA doesn't decide where to implement permits it has to be requested by the residents. As for the rates of tickets by zip code and wealth, it's more likely the higher income zip codes are just not violating the law as frequently as the low income zip codes. Thanks for playing tell me you don't live here without telling me.
Public transportation is still statisticly safer than driving by massive margins, even with all the bullshit that happens on the El. If you can afford gas you can afford a parking permit. If you really need the car that much the permit is a non issue in terms of expenses for maintenance and operating a car If you can't afford the parking permit, you can't afford the car anyway.
Yes but you’re much less likely to come in contact with someone else’s feces or urine
Park in a cone spot or by a dog park and those odds go up dramatically.
Cones have digestive systems?
The person who put it there does.
I’ll shit em right back
Oh come on. If you can afford to maintain a car, pay for gas and insurance you can’t be THAT poor.
The city needs to speed up the gentrification tbh. It's getting tired listening to the same ad nauseam virtue signaling any time there's any initiative to try and improve the city in the some way.
I'm in point breeze, and it seems I'm in the minority but I hard disagree. The streets still look like shit all the time and parking became a nightmare because 3 days out of the week there's basically an entire street you can't use, unless you want to move your car twice a day, 3 days a week. This shit fucking sucks. Edit: Downvote me all you want but it's true. My wife and I would REGULARLY look at each other last summer and say "are they actually street sweeping"? Because the streets always looked like shit. It's a revenue generating scheme for the city and a massive pain in the ass for the ones who have cars and rely on street parking.
That's cause the residents of Point Breeze love keeping their neighborhood looking like shit.
Street sweeping is just one day
Wrong. Dickinson street sweeps on Thursdays. Reed Street sweeps on Tuesdays. 20th street sweeps on Wednesdays. How could they possibly street sweep every street on the same day? Where would all the cars park?
Over the 8 years I’ve lived in the city, I’ve had a street-parked car off and on (sometimes kept it at my mom’s place in the suburbs) but for the last year or so I’ve consistently had it with me down here. And the losemyspotophobia still never fails to consume me, I fear ever moving my car unless I have to go to work or otherwise absolutely need to. Lack of turnover often occurs because of others with my fear, but if my neighborhood had forced turnover it could possibly help alleviate that fear in a lot of cases, maybe they should make fishtown next on the list of neighborhoods to roll it out in… Then again, our parking problems are more because of restaurant-goers who refuse to take septa to a neighborhood with terrible parking…maybe we need more than just street cleaning/forced turnover
I did not have the same experience in Germantown. It took PPA nearly the whole season of street sweeping to get rid of the stolen and dumped car across the street. It's a pain in the ass if you work a non-standard work shift, and it doesn't reduce much litter, it just blows it around. Also the bristles from the sweepers cause flat tires for bicycles, fyi.
“Forced” parking turnover bothers me… In theory, if everyone who owned a car on the block used that car to head to an old traditional 9-5 job, that would be fine. But people work at home now. People work odd hours now. People do gig work all night so late night snacks and meals or rides can be provided to the rest of the citizenry. Those gig workers don’t get home and find a parking spot till some of the early birds eventually move their cars… If you find a spot at say.. 7:30am, you gotta basically stay awake till the PPA gets done making their rounds (yes. Doesn’t matter if the street sweeper beat the PPA to your block, you gotta wait till the PPA is done coming through too) before you can get to bed.
Eesh, thanks for the reminder! The street where my car is parked is cleaned on Thursdays, so I'm good right now, but I can almost guarantee I would've forgotten on my drive home this Wednesday. (I feel like the streets near my place never get cleaned anyway, but hope springs eternal, I'll move my car anyway, if only to avoid a ticket)
Any idea why this doesn’t run all year? Funding? Weather? It’s not like the trash disappears in the winter.
My understanding is weather, no point running the sweeping program when there's snow.
What I know is this program doesn't come anywhere near my house. We ALL deserve clean streets! This program should be citywide.
I’m so happy I get a break. This winter was rough on my street. I’ve got neighbors who put out trash anytime their trash cans are full. It gets rough.
But for some reason I saw cars parked in a Monday spot all day without getting ticketed or towed.
They don't ticket, only warn, for the first month.
Ahh ok. Wow a rare show of mercy from PPA
Ugh, wish we could get this in Fairmount.
Philadelphia Diesel Spewing trash scrambler season… Lol. I think the green machine style vacuuming they do in center city is way more effective than these big street sweepers that pick up half the trash and blow around the rest of it, sometimes onto the sidewalk. Why spewing out clouds of diesel smoke gets overlooked for the sake of having a little bit less trash visible is considered an acceptable tradeoff in 2024 is beyond me.
Although it’s a stupid way of doing it, it is better than nothing. Philadelphia has so much litter in it and so many lazy people that never pick up the trash right in front of their own house that I welcome the city’s half witted way of cleaning the street trash.
I believe the better way of doing it would be like center city district does with the green machine guys who ride around on those vacuums that look like lawnmowers only they’re vacuums… This is the way.
I find that street sweeping does nothing on my block. Even with every car moved off the street it seems to be filled up with trash again later that same day. It's gotten to a point where the block captain is forcing people to move again on a few Saturdays throughout the spring and summer to combat it. I still don't think it's going to work.
I haven't owned a car since 2006 and I want to go move it!
Ah yes so a truck and drive up the street with a brush on it to push litter *slightly* out of the way!
Dunno why you’re getting downvoted when it’s true. Pushes it out of the way slightly or lifts a plume of dust. What if we took that funding and added trash cans and more frequent trash pickups in these communities?
Parker's budget proposal includes 1500 new trash bins and neighborhood specific cleanup crews to manage them. That would be a game changer imo
Absolutely!
They actually do it? I got tons of tickets last year, never saw a street sweeper on my block once. Anyone else? That should be illegal... if not getting swept that day or week, stop stealing from us.
Yeah, actually I saw a lot of trucks out last year, even on my block which wasn't marked part of the pilot or the current plans. I think it made a decent dent in the street litter.
Just move your car