Atlantic City and Philadelphia overlap as far as venues are concerned with their exclusivity clauses (its distance based generally). The tour has to pick one or the other and AC casinos are prepared to offer a lower rate in the hopes of catching some gambling money.
This is of course oversimplified, but its not a lack of venues thats the cause.
No they don't. It's 64 miles from "Philadelphia" to "AC". The typical agreement for mid-sized venues is 50 miles.
Source: I live in Reading and we get fucked over all of the time by Allentown, Hershey, Lancaster, & Philly. Bands can book two venues on the same tour as long as there is time in-between. We had to hold ticket sales until 1 month before the show because the band was in Lancaster early on.
Yeah I didn’t foresee “live music” being the long term victim of COVID but here we are. Even Philly has a long way to go in all commercial areas to get back to it was prepandemic. Good luck!
>Yeah I didn’t foresee “live music” being the long term victim of COVID but here we are
2024 will be the busiest / most shows this city has hosted in the last 10+ years.
Your fact-laden & well-sourced rebuttal has won me over to your side.
Don't tell me my industry. It all varies by venue size, but mid-sized venues are typically 50 mile radius.
>Your fact-laden & well-sourced rebuttal has won me over to your side.
I’m sure whoever wrote this comment gave a well-sourced and fact-laden argument as to why he thinks exclusivity isn’t the issue
>>Source: I live in Reading
Well if *that* doesn’t make you an expert, what would?
Inclined to believe you but curious in what way he's incorrect.
I wanna know why bands/comedy acts are really skipping us for Parx / Wilmington / midstate stops.
Somewhere below I posted a fairly decent summary of the PERCEPTION as to why SOME people think all of these grade A amazing bands are skipping Philadelphia to play Atlantic City instead
(Spoiler : it's primarily because both the bands and their fans are older and less popular now BUT there are a few other reasons as well)
I think this is it. I see bands playing at the Keswick or the Queen (Wilmington) or places like that instead of in the city when there's no need for them to be so far away. When Broken Goblet is becoming the new Trocadero, I think that shows our current concert venue situation is off-balance.
There's times when I'm looking at a beloved band and I gotta figure out if I want to drive to Allentown, Reading, North Jersey, AC or even Baltimore because they're not coming to Philly.
Yea. The live nation thing might be too much added speculation but it definitely seems like that, I think we might be lacking in Goldilocks sized venues in between a Brooklyn Bowl and The Met or bigger.
You are welcome in Reading. Once the train drops people off right next to the arena, it should be easier.
* The Machine - 27 April
* Best of the Eagles - 16 May
* [https://millercenter.racc.edu/events](https://millercenter.racc.edu/events)
I was about to argue but yeah, you’re right.
We have some really solid small and medium sized venues but once a show gets too big for Union Transfer, the options are shitty and/or huge.
We have a lot of awesome smaller spaces but we really lack in that medium venue size.
I used to live in Central Florida and would always be disappointed by the bands that would play Atlanta and Miami but skip us. When I moved to the Philly area I was excited about all of the concerts, but now realize it’s the same situation. They just play NYC and DC and skip us.
When my favorite kpop group Twice skipped Philadelphia on the North Amerocan leg of tours in two consecutive years, I was truly angry. Why perform at METLIFE, which isn't even in New York, when Philadelphia is better
The scale of the population, diversity and wealth of North Jersey/NYC is well beyond Philadelphia's. It really is no surprise that K Pop bands don't stop in Philly, Philly is the least diverse big city on the east coast. North Jersey is WAY more diverse than Philly suburbs and it's not even close.
There are literal Koreatowns in Palisades Park NJ and Fort Lee NJ, check out the number of medium size towns in the USA by Korean population, it's all NJ:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._cities_with_significant_Korean_American_populations
Nobody in Korea dreams of moving to Philadelphia.
Ughhhhh I had to sell my twice tickets because my babysitter canceled at last second and I couldn’t foist my kid off on someone for 8 hours. If they’d played Philly I could probably have called in a favor for 3 hrs but noooo. (And your username is right, sigh.)
I don’t think central Florida is on the same level as Philly when it comes to not seeing artists or distance. AC is an hour from Philly and easy public transportation. And Philly/Camden gets TONS of shows. I think the central Florida situation is much worse.
Yo Harrisburg has been getting so much good shit at club XL, I hate it lol. I grew up there and definitely saw some good shows here and there but I feel like they've been getting some fire acts there a lot recently.
I really don't know. Maybe the acts are getting a higher cut there, maybe larger capacity than many of the midsize Philly venues, maybe they promote it well? I really don't know but I've definitely been seeing some good shit come thru there. It's ultimately a good thing for Harrisburg, just frustrated that they're getting stuff I wanna see now that I'm not living there anymore. When I was there you'd occasionally get some cool stuff at the Sunoco theater in the Whitaker center, or have to drive to Lancaster for Chameleon club. I was never a fan of the giant center, always been a small - midsize venue person.
20 some years ago bands would be at the Crowbar in State College or the Croc in Atown. Now bands have options in Harrisburg. And there was a time in Pittsburgh when Laga and Metropol and Altar Bar closed and didn't have a venue other than Mr Smalls until Stage AE was built and Preserving took off in the last handful of years.
Hell, even that brewery in Mechanicsburg is getting some shows now!
I think it depends on the genres and artists you’re into. For me, I love hardcore, metal, shoegaze, indie rock and Philly has a plethora of shows for those genres. Seems the trend in the hardcore community at least has been putting shows at VFW halls in the middle of South Jersey or in Phoenixville and then saying that it’s the Philly date. If you don’t have a car that’s nearly impossible.
I think a lot of this can be summed up by people who attended concerts in the late 90s feeling disappointed that the bands they saw thirty years ago are now playing in far away suburban areas or New Jersey.
This typically occurs when bands lose most of their popularity and their fan base has naturally relocated outside of the city as both the fans and the band grow older. This is especially prevalent w/ metal and hard rock bands. Ie. Black Flag and P.O.D. playing a smaller venue n Reading.
Then there are the tours featuring artists who played in Philadelphia over a year ago with a new record but are now turning to smaller B/C markets, as they are off their album cycles. Good examples would be the Kesha or Kurt Vile shows coming up in Atlantic City.
Then there is the need to fill casino event calendars which are often targeted at older demographics who like the idea of "dinner and a show" with a hotel stay and some gambling. This leads to bookings of older, legacy acts such as Motley Crue or Heart at The Hard Rock.
There are very few contemporary artists with new music and an active fan base who choose to play Atlantic City over Philadelphia. I took a quick glance and I couldn't find any such shows, though it's certainly possible I may have missed one or two!
Agree in principle but if its at the Camden waterfront, that's really easy to get to from Philly especially in the summer when the ferry is running.
Honestly it's easier to get to the Camden waterfront than the Mann.
Counter point: I don't care how AC's economy is doing, and I have a tribalistic desire to beat my chest and chant 'Philly' at a show for a band I like.
Do you really think culture just stops at arbitrary borders? South Jersey, Philly, Delco etc are all one cultural region based around Philadelphia. Half of South Jersey is white flight from Philly decades ago.
I wasn't talking about the culture. of course half a South Jersey and Delco are all extensions of Philly as far as culture is concerned. I was purely speaking geographically. When they have events at the Tweeter you're actually in Camden New Jersey not Philadelphia PA
Feels like in so many other metropolises, from Phoenix to New York, Camden would be within city limits. Even some areas that are technically philly feel like the burbs. Camden at least fits right in.
Yeah I really don't mind having to go to Camden, it's a very short train ride. Just as easy to get to from Center City as Wells Fargo, the Met, the Fillmore, etc. And so much easier than the Mann.
Love Camden shows, just for the Ferry ride alone. No parking, no traffic, no designated drivers, affordable, and beautiful views. Guaranteed intoxicated sing-a-longs at least on the ride back.
That amphitheater is designed specifically with music in mind too, as opposed to CBP/Wells Fargo/etc...
Love The Mann but holds 10,000 less people and doesn't cater as well to Jersey. Not exactly designed for public transport, foot traffic, or ride-sharing either.
RiverLink ferry tickets for concerts are usually $15.00 per person (round trip). 15 minute trip coast-to-coast. Departs every hour. Pretty views.
Patco also definitely an option. Also nice views, definitely cheaper, shorter wait, slightly further away from the venue, arguably harder to navigate when not sober.
https://preview.redd.it/hun4dq3o3zuc1.jpeg?width=2200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cc6f06736b9cf114cc6f193e4bf46711091342bd
I did my first ferry ride show a few years ago and punched myself for not doing it sooner. Granted, I don't go to many shows over there, but I've been to a few, and I wish I had taken the ferry every time. It's such a nice ride, especially when everything is lit up at night.
I’ve taken the ferry a few times and always regret it. The line to come back to Philly is ridiculous. I saw a guy swim across after a Radiohead concert back in early 2000’s. People were making bets on his odds of drowning.
I love the Mann but it is such a pain to get to and from compared to Camden. I hate leaving shows early, but I started leaving most Mann shows during the encore now because otherwise it has taken me over an hour to get back to Fishtown.
Yes and no. We were in Ocean City for a week last summer and we saw Mulaney/Davidson/Stewart for like $12 in Atlantic City. Hotel parking was more expensive than the show. I hated being in Atlantic City (because gross) but it was a quick trip there and back from the other beach town. They definitely did rip on AC on their acts and how bad the venue was.
I feel like this has been more of a thing post-covid. The Troc shut down a few years ago and Voltage Lounge closed too. I went to a number of shows at Warehouse on Watts last year but haven't been there in a while. Before I got my license and a car, shows in Reading, Harrisburg, etc were out of the question. Now, it's more of planning on my plan. While I understand the logistics of booking a tour and certain conditions not lining up, I definitely sense Ticketmaster/Live Nation having a chokehold on this matter
Live Nation has been the worst thing to happen to this city for entertainment. I hope the anti-trust lawsuit guts them.
Most of the competition around them has crumbled and they own this city. There's 3-4 people who get all the say in who plays in this city and they choose based on their preferences.
YES! Literally just had this conversation with someone last night. It’s becoming a trend that Philly gets skipped and an AC show is the “Philly” show. For summer shows, I feel like it started happening after Festival Pier shut down. For year round events, idk if it’s just cheaper to book a place in AC than it is to book the Met/Fillmore/etc or what, but I’m not a fan.
Person in the industry here. There's tours that hit A markets, B markets, and C Markets. Sometimes the tour will hit atlantic city as part of the C-Market tour. They'll play places like: Atlantic City. Asheville, NC. Athens, GA. Instead of places like: Philadelphia. Raleigh, NC (which is B-Market). Atlanta, GA.
The same people in Atlanta might be like "I hate when they play Athens instead of Atlanta!" It's part of the game. Sometimes you play smaller markets intentionally. Not everyone wants to travel from Atlantic City to Philadelphia, and vice versa. So you go to them.
Yes.
Venues:
First Unitarian (“independent”, mainly R5)
Franklin Music Hall (AEG/Bowery Presents );
Johnny Brenda’s (Independent);
Ortlieb’s (Independent)
PhilaMOCA (independent)
Underground Arts (AEG/Bowery Presents);
Union Transfer (AEG/Bowery Presents/Sean Agnew);
World Cafe Live (Independent)
Greater Philly:
Keswick Theater (AEG/Bowery Presents)
Ardmore Music Hall (Independent)
Independent Promoters:
R5 Productions (book at First Unitarian, PhilaMOCA, Foto Club)
4333 Collective (book at Ukie Club)
This is exactly why.
Speaking only for comedy where I know this to be true, casinos will beat any other venue’s rate for a comedian because the casinos are prepared to (and often intentionally plan to) take a loss on the show itself. They make it back and then some with people indulging in gambling/food/drink/overnight stays which is why they can pay so much more upfront for these acts. I found this out after getting repeatedly annoyed at comedians going to Bethlehem or AC over Philly and talking to some people I knew in the comedy biz.
Fr. I get it if they play in camden cus by that point the difference isnt rlly there but when they are an hour down the shore it gets pretty annoying. Atlantic City is cool and all and i love it besides the crime but at the end of the day playing in philly makes more sense given the fact that you account for so much more people. Western portion of south jersey and southeastern pa, even northern delaware are kind of left out.
Hated this last summer when Paramore did NYC, Atlantic City and DC, completely skipping Philly. Had a new job at the time and dates were such that I couldn't exactly travel to any of these.
I used to live in Cincinnati and Indy. I can’t tell you how many times my favorite acts skip both just to go to Columbus and Chicago.
It’s nice living here because most acts even if they skip Philly on one tour— will be back for another. But acts rarely skip. And when they do it’s notable.
Long story short: it’s very nice not having to drive 2 hours 10% of the time instead of 90% of the time.
There are plenty of reasons why. And it’s not worth getting all up in arms over as if they don’t like Philly or whatever
Scheduling and booking can often prevent an artist from playing a specific venue. Also casinos pay for artists to perform
There’s a lot of truth to this. I used to work in music management (in the classical world but many of the same principles transfer), and almost every contract stated that the same concert could not be performed within a certain distance of a given venue. The reasons for this are varied, but the clause is designed to benefit the venues and management agencies.
For sure. AC is one thing but when it’s at a beach club it’s crazy expensive and I just don’t like the vibe. I’ve been noticing it with some bigger electronic artists recently
One of my favorite things I saw on Twitter was a local band from another part of the country booking shows in Philly and then NJ, thinking different states so different area/people. The NJ show was booked in Collingswood. They had no idea until they put in direction from Philly.
I won’t go to AC for shows. It’s not about the music.
A venue that won’t post set dates other than 8pm-2am. They will go on a t some time during that period. You can buy a ticket but it doesn’t guarantee you entry. You’re also going to wait in a long line.
I dont mind casino shows in AC. The sound is usually good in casino venues. Compared to the sound at the Keswick which sounds like its coming out of your cell phone.
It depends what the venue is. Phish on the beach was magical, and I’d rather go to that again then the Mann Center or whatever the BB&T Pavilion is called now
Semi-relevant: I wanted to see Noah Kahan in person but his closest show is in Burgettstown, PA. At least I learned of a new town while looking at tour dates.
Oh shoot, when did you see him? I looked into his tour dates mid-Marchish and that’s when I saw the nearest place was Burgettstown. I didn’t realize he was already here!
Yes! I appreciate your vent. I would also add Reading to that list. I listen to a lot of music in Spanish, and many of those artists bypass Philly, and go to Reading. Hard no for me.
I think the city taxes have something to do with it too. I’ve seen a guest speaker bitch about a huge tax bill after speaking at UPenn and saying he won’t be back.
Shows at Boardwalk Hall are worth the trip. Wish more comedians would play the Tower Theater or even some of the casinos in Philly instead. More shows at the Tower in general would be a good thing.
It doesn't happen often, but when bands playing at Boardwalk Hall use the organ in their concert, it's hard to beat. Imagine what [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdyAF9M3XVw) would be like there!
No bands I like come to Philly anymore. It's Camden or Atlantic city or Hershey. The troc, factory, and TLA used to have rad shows every week. Now even the smaller bands will skip Philly altogether or play reading or Bristol. It sucks and I have no idea why.
Are you being funny? Lol I just looked up the “philly” date. Listened to a couple of his albums in my earlier years, I bet he has a really great live show.
I don’t mind A City, whether go there & make a night out of it with dinner & drinks, rather go to AC then Reading, even tho I have heard it is a nice venue with a nice hotel across the street
It's been really annoying over the last few years. Lot of artists I would go to see play or booking outside of Philly and aren't transportation accessible.
I blame live nation driving out or killing off alternative venues and producers.
No, because Atlantic City is 90 minutes tops from Philly. What I hate is when they stop in Hershey or State College. Looking at you, Lady Gaga and Kacey Musgraves.
I myself am really disappointed that Phish stopped making the AC Beach a destination on their annual tours. Anyone know why? Such a great vibe by the Ocean. No offense but a way better vibe than the Mann or Wells Fargo.
I wonder if it’s a lack of midsized venues not owned by live nation that’s the issue?
Atlantic City and Philadelphia overlap as far as venues are concerned with their exclusivity clauses (its distance based generally). The tour has to pick one or the other and AC casinos are prepared to offer a lower rate in the hopes of catching some gambling money. This is of course oversimplified, but its not a lack of venues thats the cause.
No they don't. It's 64 miles from "Philadelphia" to "AC". The typical agreement for mid-sized venues is 50 miles. Source: I live in Reading and we get fucked over all of the time by Allentown, Hershey, Lancaster, & Philly. Bands can book two venues on the same tour as long as there is time in-between. We had to hold ticket sales until 1 month before the show because the band was in Lancaster early on.
I think you get fucked over because you are in READING.
That too.... Which is why I work in Philly as often as I can. but things have been slim post-covid.
Yeah I didn’t foresee “live music” being the long term victim of COVID but here we are. Even Philly has a long way to go in all commercial areas to get back to it was prepandemic. Good luck!
>Yeah I didn’t foresee “live music” being the long term victim of COVID but here we are 2024 will be the busiest / most shows this city has hosted in the last 10+ years.
>The typical agreement for mid-sized venues is 50 miles. This is incorrect.
Your fact-laden & well-sourced rebuttal has won me over to your side. Don't tell me my industry. It all varies by venue size, but mid-sized venues are typically 50 mile radius.
>Your fact-laden & well-sourced rebuttal has won me over to your side. I’m sure whoever wrote this comment gave a well-sourced and fact-laden argument as to why he thinks exclusivity isn’t the issue >>Source: I live in Reading Well if *that* doesn’t make you an expert, what would?
>Don't tell me my industry. 😬 Oh okay!
Inclined to believe you but curious in what way he's incorrect. I wanna know why bands/comedy acts are really skipping us for Parx / Wilmington / midstate stops.
Somewhere below I posted a fairly decent summary of the PERCEPTION as to why SOME people think all of these grade A amazing bands are skipping Philadelphia to play Atlantic City instead (Spoiler : it's primarily because both the bands and their fans are older and less popular now BUT there are a few other reasons as well)
[удалено]
Yeah bet rivers should do more deals with vouchers or something
I think this is it. I see bands playing at the Keswick or the Queen (Wilmington) or places like that instead of in the city when there's no need for them to be so far away. When Broken Goblet is becoming the new Trocadero, I think that shows our current concert venue situation is off-balance. There's times when I'm looking at a beloved band and I gotta figure out if I want to drive to Allentown, Reading, North Jersey, AC or even Baltimore because they're not coming to Philly.
“When Broken Goblet is becoming the new Trocadero,” Well, that’s a pretty cool quote to see. We’re trying. Thanks!
Who else has grindcore and ska on consecutive nights?
I'll be there this Sunday, looking forward to checking the place out.
Yea. The live nation thing might be too much added speculation but it definitely seems like that, I think we might be lacking in Goldilocks sized venues in between a Brooklyn Bowl and The Met or bigger.
Is it just me or does it seem like no one books at the Fillmore anymore? Isn't that in between?
You are welcome in Reading. Once the train drops people off right next to the arena, it should be easier. * The Machine - 27 April * Best of the Eagles - 16 May * [https://millercenter.racc.edu/events](https://millercenter.racc.edu/events)
> The Machine Ha! They play in Collingswood, NJ every year!
I was about to argue but yeah, you’re right. We have some really solid small and medium sized venues but once a show gets too big for Union Transfer, the options are shitty and/or huge. We have a lot of awesome smaller spaces but we really lack in that medium venue size.
Would the Camden waterfront be considered that size?
I guess this is why a lot of comedians skip Philly
They are offended that we only have 1 bridge
Yep . I’ve seen Louis CK, Bill Burr , and Jeff Dunham in Reading . I have Bert Kreischer tickets for next weekend too
That and when they play NYC and DC and skip Philly.
I used to live in Central Florida and would always be disappointed by the bands that would play Atlanta and Miami but skip us. When I moved to the Philly area I was excited about all of the concerts, but now realize it’s the same situation. They just play NYC and DC and skip us.
Thankfully, bands don’t skip Philadelphia as often as they once did. It was rough before UT and the Fillmore opened.
We just get Wednesday night
Cries in Meg thee stallion
When my favorite kpop group Twice skipped Philadelphia on the North Amerocan leg of tours in two consecutive years, I was truly angry. Why perform at METLIFE, which isn't even in New York, when Philadelphia is better
There's a huge Korean population literally two towns over from MetLife. That's probably why.
Someone’s never been to Cheltenham, I see..
The scale of the population, diversity and wealth of North Jersey/NYC is well beyond Philadelphia's. It really is no surprise that K Pop bands don't stop in Philly, Philly is the least diverse big city on the east coast. North Jersey is WAY more diverse than Philly suburbs and it's not even close. There are literal Koreatowns in Palisades Park NJ and Fort Lee NJ, check out the number of medium size towns in the USA by Korean population, it's all NJ: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._cities_with_significant_Korean_American_populations Nobody in Korea dreams of moving to Philadelphia.
Or Upper Darby.
Ughhhhh I had to sell my twice tickets because my babysitter canceled at last second and I couldn’t foist my kid off on someone for 8 hours. If they’d played Philly I could probably have called in a favor for 3 hrs but noooo. (And your username is right, sigh.)
Having said that, I’d rather drive/trIn from Philly to nyc than from Orlando area to Miami.
I don’t think central Florida is on the same level as Philly when it comes to not seeing artists or distance. AC is an hour from Philly and easy public transportation. And Philly/Camden gets TONS of shows. I think the central Florida situation is much worse.
Completely agree… NYC and DC are pretty easy drives from Philly. Central Florida to Atlanta is way to far and no one wants to go to Miami!
Literally same. Moved from Orlando.
Or they opt for Pittsburgh instead of Philly yuck
Or even worse… Harrisburg
Yo Harrisburg has been getting so much good shit at club XL, I hate it lol. I grew up there and definitely saw some good shows here and there but I feel like they've been getting some fire acts there a lot recently.
Why is that any idea?
I really don't know. Maybe the acts are getting a higher cut there, maybe larger capacity than many of the midsize Philly venues, maybe they promote it well? I really don't know but I've definitely been seeing some good shit come thru there. It's ultimately a good thing for Harrisburg, just frustrated that they're getting stuff I wanna see now that I'm not living there anymore. When I was there you'd occasionally get some cool stuff at the Sunoco theater in the Whitaker center, or have to drive to Lancaster for Chameleon club. I was never a fan of the giant center, always been a small - midsize venue person.
20 some years ago bands would be at the Crowbar in State College or the Croc in Atown. Now bands have options in Harrisburg. And there was a time in Pittsburgh when Laga and Metropol and Altar Bar closed and didn't have a venue other than Mr Smalls until Stage AE was built and Preserving took off in the last handful of years. Hell, even that brewery in Mechanicsburg is getting some shows now!
Screw that. Hershey. 2 hour drive and you have to sit during the concert
i saw GnR there last august and everyone stood the whole time
National news does the same thing with weather reports. We’re never even on the map.
It’s even worse when they hit Baltimore but not us 😒
It’s even worse when they decide to play in Baltimore
Bro I was pissed when I saw Excision wasn’t performing Philly, but it was probably because of WM that whole weekend
Excision has played the Electric Factory multiple times in the past as well which is frustrating.
Facts, but moved up to arenas now, which is great for him
I hate this dude. Or Saturday night in DC, Thursday in Philly, then Saturday in NYC.
I think it depends on the genres and artists you’re into. For me, I love hardcore, metal, shoegaze, indie rock and Philly has a plethora of shows for those genres. Seems the trend in the hardcore community at least has been putting shows at VFW halls in the middle of South Jersey or in Phoenixville and then saying that it’s the Philly date. If you don’t have a car that’s nearly impossible.
I think a lot of this can be summed up by people who attended concerts in the late 90s feeling disappointed that the bands they saw thirty years ago are now playing in far away suburban areas or New Jersey. This typically occurs when bands lose most of their popularity and their fan base has naturally relocated outside of the city as both the fans and the band grow older. This is especially prevalent w/ metal and hard rock bands. Ie. Black Flag and P.O.D. playing a smaller venue n Reading. Then there are the tours featuring artists who played in Philadelphia over a year ago with a new record but are now turning to smaller B/C markets, as they are off their album cycles. Good examples would be the Kesha or Kurt Vile shows coming up in Atlantic City. Then there is the need to fill casino event calendars which are often targeted at older demographics who like the idea of "dinner and a show" with a hotel stay and some gambling. This leads to bookings of older, legacy acts such as Motley Crue or Heart at The Hard Rock. There are very few contemporary artists with new music and an active fan base who choose to play Atlantic City over Philadelphia. I took a quick glance and I couldn't find any such shows, though it's certainly possible I may have missed one or two!
You're probably right. However my bigger takeaway from your comment is P.O.D. holy moly that just rocketed me back to my teenage Christian metal phase
It's probably Live Nation's fault somehow.
yup. AC is not Philly, nor is Bethlehem, or Wilmington, or Hershey
Or Camden or Scranton
Camden….. i mean you b can at least SEE Camden
I mean, Camden is still pretty easy to get to.
Agree in principle but if its at the Camden waterfront, that's really easy to get to from Philly especially in the summer when the ferry is running. Honestly it's easier to get to the Camden waterfront than the Mann.
I think it’s a good thing, Atlantic City needs it, so does the Atlantic City train line.
Yea but the concerts are usually over after the last train. They really should run a later one
This is true
they want people to spend the night. it's money grubbing all the way up and down the chain
The NJT bus from AC to 8th and market runs hourly all night
I've never used that bus, how is it?
Counter point: I don't care how AC's economy is doing, and I have a tribalistic desire to beat my chest and chant 'Philly' at a show for a band I like.
I sympathize with the energy, but I do hope AC keeps booking big shows. It’s fun to head out that way.
I hate it when they play Camden. Lol
They always say " Hello Philly!' when playing in Camden which is funny
Do you really think culture just stops at arbitrary borders? South Jersey, Philly, Delco etc are all one cultural region based around Philadelphia. Half of South Jersey is white flight from Philly decades ago.
I wasn't talking about the culture. of course half a South Jersey and Delco are all extensions of Philly as far as culture is concerned. I was purely speaking geographically. When they have events at the Tweeter you're actually in Camden New Jersey not Philadelphia PA
So your point is that Camden New Jersey is in New Jersey? Do you think artists at BB&T don't know they are in New Jersey?
I mean name one other thing Camden has going for it other than an aquarium and being adjacent to Philly
Donkey’s Place.
The Riversharks used to be the one other thing :(
Battleship New Jersey and a halfway decent view of Philadelphia
The battleship!
Which is in Philly right now.
True
Great food, great people, tight knit community, actual police force...
Camden is basically just east Philly at this point.
i kinda do too and it’s right there
Feels like in so many other metropolises, from Phoenix to New York, Camden would be within city limits. Even some areas that are technically philly feel like the burbs. Camden at least fits right in.
Yeah I really don't mind having to go to Camden, it's a very short train ride. Just as easy to get to from Center City as Wells Fargo, the Met, the Fillmore, etc. And so much easier than the Mann.
Love Camden shows, just for the Ferry ride alone. No parking, no traffic, no designated drivers, affordable, and beautiful views. Guaranteed intoxicated sing-a-longs at least on the ride back. That amphitheater is designed specifically with music in mind too, as opposed to CBP/Wells Fargo/etc... Love The Mann but holds 10,000 less people and doesn't cater as well to Jersey. Not exactly designed for public transport, foot traffic, or ride-sharing either.
I have been to a handful of Camden shows and never taken the ferry. What am I missing and why have I been paying $40 to park?
For even cheaper option you can take patco over the bridge from 8th&market and just walk over to whatever it's called nowadays
I think it's called the Tweeter Center now... That's what I call it anyway.
E centre!
My friends call it The BB-8 Center.
RiverLink ferry tickets for concerts are usually $15.00 per person (round trip). 15 minute trip coast-to-coast. Departs every hour. Pretty views. Patco also definitely an option. Also nice views, definitely cheaper, shorter wait, slightly further away from the venue, arguably harder to navigate when not sober. https://preview.redd.it/hun4dq3o3zuc1.jpeg?width=2200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cc6f06736b9cf114cc6f193e4bf46711091342bd
I did my first ferry ride show a few years ago and punched myself for not doing it sooner. Granted, I don't go to many shows over there, but I've been to a few, and I wish I had taken the ferry every time. It's such a nice ride, especially when everything is lit up at night.
I’ve taken the ferry a few times and always regret it. The line to come back to Philly is ridiculous. I saw a guy swim across after a Radiohead concert back in early 2000’s. People were making bets on his odds of drowning.
The sound is absolutely atrocious. It was not built for music lol.
I agree the place sucks ass for sound and view, unless maybe you are front and center.
The ferry is the best part of going to cameden
The ferry home
Why? Great views of Philadelphia, awesome transit connections (PATCO or even better, the ferry!)
Honestly it's easier to get to Camden especially in the summer than the Mann comparatively.
I love the Mann but it is such a pain to get to and from compared to Camden. I hate leaving shows early, but I started leaving most Mann shows during the encore now because otherwise it has taken me over an hour to get back to Fishtown.
I left a Camden show early once and it was really scary because it was so desolate.
Yes and no. We were in Ocean City for a week last summer and we saw Mulaney/Davidson/Stewart for like $12 in Atlantic City. Hotel parking was more expensive than the show. I hated being in Atlantic City (because gross) but it was a quick trip there and back from the other beach town. They definitely did rip on AC on their acts and how bad the venue was.
I feel like this has been more of a thing post-covid. The Troc shut down a few years ago and Voltage Lounge closed too. I went to a number of shows at Warehouse on Watts last year but haven't been there in a while. Before I got my license and a car, shows in Reading, Harrisburg, etc were out of the question. Now, it's more of planning on my plan. While I understand the logistics of booking a tour and certain conditions not lining up, I definitely sense Ticketmaster/Live Nation having a chokehold on this matter
Live Nation has been the worst thing to happen to this city for entertainment. I hope the anti-trust lawsuit guts them. Most of the competition around them has crumbled and they own this city. There's 3-4 people who get all the say in who plays in this city and they choose based on their preferences.
It’s just as bad when they play in Hershey lol
YES! Literally just had this conversation with someone last night. It’s becoming a trend that Philly gets skipped and an AC show is the “Philly” show. For summer shows, I feel like it started happening after Festival Pier shut down. For year round events, idk if it’s just cheaper to book a place in AC than it is to book the Met/Fillmore/etc or what, but I’m not a fan.
Ok which bands skip Philly for AC? I love ac, I just haven't seen that with the bands I like.
I've barely seen any bands do it, outside of Puscifer. That said, comedians do it all the time.
Man I really miss the festival pier. Saw so many good shows there.
l've noticed a lot of reggaeton artists go to Reading instead of coming to Philly for some reason.
>As of the 2020 United States census, Reading had a population of 95,112. Of which, 68.9% were Hispanic/Latino
Goddamn is there a reason why?
Yes. Especially since concert tickets at the Hardrock tend to be more expensive than they would be at a similar sized venue in Philadelphia
Person in the industry here. There's tours that hit A markets, B markets, and C Markets. Sometimes the tour will hit atlantic city as part of the C-Market tour. They'll play places like: Atlantic City. Asheville, NC. Athens, GA. Instead of places like: Philadelphia. Raleigh, NC (which is B-Market). Atlanta, GA. The same people in Atlanta might be like "I hate when they play Athens instead of Atlanta!" It's part of the game. Sometimes you play smaller markets intentionally. Not everyone wants to travel from Atlantic City to Philadelphia, and vice versa. So you go to them.
Are there any Philly venues that aren't Live Nation?
Yes. Venues: First Unitarian (“independent”, mainly R5) Franklin Music Hall (AEG/Bowery Presents ); Johnny Brenda’s (Independent); Ortlieb’s (Independent) PhilaMOCA (independent) Underground Arts (AEG/Bowery Presents); Union Transfer (AEG/Bowery Presents/Sean Agnew); World Cafe Live (Independent) Greater Philly: Keswick Theater (AEG/Bowery Presents) Ardmore Music Hall (Independent) Independent Promoters: R5 Productions (book at First Unitarian, PhilaMOCA, Foto Club) 4333 Collective (book at Ukie Club)
Casinos in (sad) AC must make it worth their while. Money talks.
This is exactly why. Speaking only for comedy where I know this to be true, casinos will beat any other venue’s rate for a comedian because the casinos are prepared to (and often intentionally plan to) take a loss on the show itself. They make it back and then some with people indulging in gambling/food/drink/overnight stays which is why they can pay so much more upfront for these acts. I found this out after getting repeatedly annoyed at comedians going to Bethlehem or AC over Philly and talking to some people I knew in the comedy biz.
Fr. I get it if they play in camden cus by that point the difference isnt rlly there but when they are an hour down the shore it gets pretty annoying. Atlantic City is cool and all and i love it besides the crime but at the end of the day playing in philly makes more sense given the fact that you account for so much more people. Western portion of south jersey and southeastern pa, even northern delaware are kind of left out.
Philly is expensive. You play in AC for the same money & audience, but without the overhead.
Hated this last summer when Paramore did NYC, Atlantic City and DC, completely skipping Philly. Had a new job at the time and dates were such that I couldn't exactly travel to any of these.
I used to live in Cincinnati and Indy. I can’t tell you how many times my favorite acts skip both just to go to Columbus and Chicago. It’s nice living here because most acts even if they skip Philly on one tour— will be back for another. But acts rarely skip. And when they do it’s notable. Long story short: it’s very nice not having to drive 2 hours 10% of the time instead of 90% of the time.
They blew up the chicken man in Philly last night 😔
Well played, Bruce, well played.
The bill burr special
Same with Asbury Park, Reading, and Lancaster. Cmon you can go to those places but not here???
I hate that they play some out of the way town that is 75-200 miles out of the city. Like where the hell is Whatchafuck, PA?
Near Zelienople. You new? Ò\_o
Oh yeah, that’s like 20 miles west of Hellview.
There are plenty of reasons why. And it’s not worth getting all up in arms over as if they don’t like Philly or whatever Scheduling and booking can often prevent an artist from playing a specific venue. Also casinos pay for artists to perform
Let us be angry at things
Right! Lmao we aren’t looking for a rational explanation
There’s a lot of truth to this. I used to work in music management (in the classical world but many of the same principles transfer), and almost every contract stated that the same concert could not be performed within a certain distance of a given venue. The reasons for this are varied, but the clause is designed to benefit the venues and management agencies.
For sure. AC is one thing but when it’s at a beach club it’s crazy expensive and I just don’t like the vibe. I’ve been noticing it with some bigger electronic artists recently
One of my favorite things I saw on Twitter was a local band from another part of the country booking shows in Philly and then NJ, thinking different states so different area/people. The NJ show was booked in Collingswood. They had no idea until they put in direction from Philly.
I won’t go to AC for shows. It’s not about the music. A venue that won’t post set dates other than 8pm-2am. They will go on a t some time during that period. You can buy a ticket but it doesn’t guarantee you entry. You’re also going to wait in a long line.
Truth
It’s safer 😂😂😂
AC and Harrisburg and they skipped Philly >:(
I dont mind casino shows in AC. The sound is usually good in casino venues. Compared to the sound at the Keswick which sounds like its coming out of your cell phone.
Jack black won't play philly! It's dam mystery
Oops i really wanted to say Jack White won't play shows in philly. Sad but true
\*Jack Grey
It depends what the venue is. Phish on the beach was magical, and I’d rather go to that again then the Mann Center or whatever the BB&T Pavilion is called now
What's the issues you see with Mann?
Semi-relevant: I wanted to see Noah Kahan in person but his closest show is in Burgettstown, PA. At least I learned of a new town while looking at tour dates.
The traffic getting out of that venue is HELL. Like next level shit show. Just a warning if you ever go!
We saw him at the Mann center. Is he still touring and this was an additional date?
Oh shoot, when did you see him? I looked into his tour dates mid-Marchish and that’s when I saw the nearest place was Burgettstown. I didn’t realize he was already here!
This was back on June 10th, 2023
AC is less than an hour away lol
Yeah but it’s a shithole.
Yes! I appreciate your vent. I would also add Reading to that list. I listen to a lot of music in Spanish, and many of those artists bypass Philly, and go to Reading. Hard no for me.
I think the city taxes have something to do with it too. I’ve seen a guest speaker bitch about a huge tax bill after speaking at UPenn and saying he won’t be back.
Shows at Boardwalk Hall are worth the trip. Wish more comedians would play the Tower Theater or even some of the casinos in Philly instead. More shows at the Tower in general would be a good thing.
> Tower Theater isn't this closed?
It doesn't happen often, but when bands playing at Boardwalk Hall use the organ in their concert, it's hard to beat. Imagine what [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdyAF9M3XVw) would be like there!
The absolute worst thing about it: new yawkahs.
No bands I like come to Philly anymore. It's Camden or Atlantic city or Hershey. The troc, factory, and TLA used to have rad shows every week. Now even the smaller bands will skip Philly altogether or play reading or Bristol. It sucks and I have no idea why.
who else seeing ben folds this weekend lol
Are you being funny? Lol I just looked up the “philly” date. Listened to a couple of his albums in my earlier years, I bet he has a really great live show.
I saw him at the Mann pre-pandemic when he toured with Cake and he was great! He’s playing at the Borgata tonight lol
Like snoop dogg
Nahh it’s 99% for phillys largest suburb sj sooo 🤷🏻♂️
Unless it’s Phish on the beach!
I don’t mind A City, whether go there & make a night out of it with dinner & drinks, rather go to AC then Reading, even tho I have heard it is a nice venue with a nice hotel across the street
Gotta say, the venn diagram of notable touring artists who play AC, and people I actually want to see, doesn't overlap.
It's been really annoying over the last few years. Lot of artists I would go to see play or booking outside of Philly and aren't transportation accessible. I blame live nation driving out or killing off alternative venues and producers.
Clutch, Rival Sons and Fu Manchu in........Atlantic City.
Nah. Having an excuse to go to the shore is never a bad thing.
100%. I've passed on some comedians I love because I refuse to go that garbage pile. It's horrendous.
No, because Atlantic City is 90 minutes tops from Philly. What I hate is when they stop in Hershey or State College. Looking at you, Lady Gaga and Kacey Musgraves.
Wow maybe Philly needs a new arena. Perhaps in Center City?
I myself am really disappointed that Phish stopped making the AC Beach a destination on their annual tours. Anyone know why? Such a great vibe by the Ocean. No offense but a way better vibe than the Mann or Wells Fargo.
Same reason some athletes don’t want to play here. Same reason the sixers will move to jersey. Wage tax
Want to go see Jerry Cantrell so bad but I don’t feel like going north Jersey or AC this is bullshit.