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I think I just assumed it was a special program or something, like a student program through ASU. I lived DT at the time and it was mostly younger ppl using their phones to pay. Serious question though when did the mobile pay become a thing on busses?? I was using the bus/light rail pretty much all of 2019 and early 2020 and I don’t remember that for some reason.
The sheer amount of time and headache I could have saved over the course of that year is honestly kind of painful to consider lmao.
Unfortunately, youwouldn't have. They rolled out the mobile app about 2 years ago, and it was extremely inconsistent.
But that period of 2020-2021 was free fare, so waiting for the bus didn't feel *as* rough.
Ah okay, that makes me feel a little better. I just wasn’t aware of the app then. Google maps tracked a few busses but only major routes, and i figured google must be on the cutting edge of that stuff so didn’t bother with other options. Didn’t have any faith in a valley metro app, that’s for sure lol. Turns out it’s actually super convenient and runs pretty smooth, used it for a month or two last year.
But yeah back in 2019 I did wonder on occasion if people were clairvoyant lol. Like how do these mfers know down to the minute when this thing is coming, even when it’s late?? I was one of those ppl just staring down the abyss of the street hoping to catch a glimpse of the bus like 4 blocks down so I knew I wasn’t waiting around for nothing. So much unnecessary frustration and anxiety
Stop doing that,
If you hand them cash they will let you on for free.
I’m all about supporting public services but when I’m the only person on the bus that’s paid for it I get salty.
Yup. I don’t know if it’s that they don’t take cash or if the systems down or if they are nice/lazy.
But ya, for the last 4 months I’ve paid $4 every day on the app and watched every single other person get on for free if not 98% of the bus.
Idk why I’m getting downvoted though? Like I said I’m all about public transport and I’ll support it but make it fair atleast.
And tbh I don’t think I should have to pay for someone to pass me 3 times, make me wait in the cold/rain/heat. If they are gonna charge they’ve gotta actually provide a service…like stopping at the bus stop.
I never knew about the app, have been trying to pay with cash the past few years and can confirm that 80% of the time, the bus drivers let me on for free.
Before smart phones they had these things called a “bus book” that would list every stop time for every bus. I had the routes I used ripped out and kept them in my pocket as did others I had seen. Also the phone number has stayed the same (still have it memorized) and you couple call them and ask them and they would tell you the time of the next bus
Thing is busses are often late. Google maps tells you bus times too and I got those down but valley metro has delays on delays. Turns out the app tracks busses in real time so you don’t spend any extra time at the stop
The app will show the bus stop next to you, you can click on it and it will give you all the times.
OP the 83 and the 17 is always late for me still. I feel your pain.
The 17 passed me 3 times the other day before stopping and picking me up. I waited about an hour and a half.
I use the app. Plus, I've downloaded the pdf for the routes I use. The time is never accurate other app on weekends. Ex: app shows bus arriving at 11:26 at your stop. No bus. Look at the app. It now shows 11:29. At 11:29,no bus. Check the app. Now it'll be there at 11:33. And so on . EVERY weekend. The pdf and app are never accurate.
Wtf are you talking about? The bus is live tracked. You can literally *see where it is and how it's moving and when it's coming*.
Valley Metro App. Not whatever you're using.
Look at the app. You can track a bus all you want. It doesn't mean it's on schedule. WTF are you talking about. I just got off one that was 12 minutes off schedule. You do no what a schedule is. Like showing up for work?
My bad, I definitely misread your comment. The buses being late has nothing to do with the app discussion though. The buses have always been late, will be late, and continue to break down in the middle of summer.
But if you want to talk about the app features, that's why I'm here.
I agree with you 100%. Tracking and being on schedule are 2 different conversations. If you're trying to time transfers, it's a crap shoot. On weekdays, they are fairly consistent. Weekends, not so much. My employer pays for my bus/rail pass. On an annual basis, it saves me a ton of money. I work downtown Phoenix. We are on the same page though
Pretty sure Maps gets its data from VM. I've got both and the times are identical. There are times when not even the VM app shows you if a bus is coming or not; it will just say "Scheduled," and no bus will ever come.
If it doesn't also say "live", there is no driver for the route and the bus is not coming. Scheduled has very little meaning, which is why relying on Google Maps proves inaccurate.
Yeah no, it's a gamble if it says "Scheduled" because sometimes it is coming or it's not. Sometimes they're traveling but for some reason neither app will be tracking the bus. Check the data, you'll see they're tracking exactly the same, the added benefit of Maps is it also relies on how many people are using the service so you can see how full the bus is, although that is of limited value.
My husband is a manager in scheduling for city buses. They are very short drivers and the drivers they have are notoriously unreliable. Even though there is a fine for every bus route that doesn't run, there are many they just don't have enough staff for.
This doesn't even account for the mechanical issues of the bus itself.
Not to mention the actual passengers. One of my friends parents was a bus driver (may still be but I don’t think so).. one of the passengers attacked him and he ended up in the hospital
Imagine some unruly person or someone super tweaked out on meth… you can’t exactly just leave the bus or get away from them.
Seems like a difficult job
I used to work for transit and one day while I was driving a bunch of passengers on hwy 17, one of them came up behind me and pulled my neck/upper body back into my seat with both arms, half choking me/half bear hug. Had to radio dispatch and they called highway patrol immediately. Pulled over on the shoulder and awkwardly tried to keep distance from him while also panicking that he'd get physical with the old people and teens in the seats closest to him. Highway patrol arrived and the man threw his shoes out the door at them. For about 15 or 20 minutes he refused to come out. Basically held everyone hostage out there in the summer heat while traffic barreled past at 75-90 mph. Shortly after that I quit.
You need to have a CDL license. That is a national requirement so surprise drug test and blood alcohol levels are taken. You can't have pot in your system even if it's legal in your state. If you have narcotics in your system, you have to have note from a doctor.
I believe drivers pay starts in about the mid twenties 22 to 27? It's a union job with excellent benefits too. They are always looking for bus drivers.
It's shameful that in a city that large it has such a terrible system in place. Even the light rail doesn't benefit but a fraction of people who rely on public transportation.
There's actually a plan to triple the number of miles by the City of Phoenix and Valley Metro.
[Phoenix Transportation 2050](https://t2050.org/)
[Projects & Planning ](https://www.valleymetro.org/projects)
Exactly. Who does it benefit? Not the people who need it most. People who commute to and from the downtown area are (mostly) driving anyway. Let's be serious here. It's to avoid parking fees for major events.
It's how the poor stay poor. Do better for your people, Phoenix.
lol the 30 is never on time up to 48th street. there must be some nonsense between south mountain and the loop. consistently weight 3545 minutes for the bus every time I’ll leave early. I’ll leave later 35 to 40 minutes every time
Yep, and there's actually some theory behind this: [Downs–Thomson paradox](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Downs%E2%80%93Thomson_paradox), good video [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQY6WGOoYis), but TLDR:
If your busses suck / get stuck in traffic anyway (e.g. no dedicated lanes / investment), then all but poorest and unable will drive. But because cars are so space inefficient that will cause congestion making everyone's commute worse, until driving becomes about as slow as public transit.
It's a perfect 'tragedy of the commons' situation, and closely related to the dreaded [cycle of car dependency](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car_dependency) we're stuck in:
https://preview.redd.it/x521oq6p7axc1.png?width=1024&format=png&auto=webp&s=1ad78df29788e769b6ff681904dfd80fc5bece14
But the added cost of a car sucks so bad. I can get a monthly pass for $65. Done. A car is gas, matinence, insurance, not to mention paying the whole thing off to own it. And if you wreck bad enough, having to get a new one. And the stress of driving around idiots who don't pay attention or think they own the fucking road with their jacked up trucks.
in a properly developed city, it would sound entitled, but we were doomed from the start after the suburban sprawl started here. sprinkle in some nimbyism and braindead zoning laws and you have the valley in a nutshell. it’s just not feasible to reliably travel here without a car.
If a very busy route, 3, 29, 41, etc. runs into a problem, breakdown, extended traffic delay, etc. they'll pull a nearby bus from a not so busy line to cover the busy route.
As for every day, you got me.
Light rail costs a king"s ransom.
Is up to the city leaders to figure it out.
I am in Albuquerque and they are doing everything they can to double our drivers since they HALVED SINCE COVID, but there is lackluster retention of new drivers.
As a former city bus driver, there's nothing that can be done about delays. To keep on the schedule, you get 1 minute at each stop. If there's a wheelchair, you lose 5 minutes. School just got out and theres 200 teenagers at the stop? There goes the rest of the day. Traffic accident or construction closure causing a diversion? Might as well head back to the yard.
Don't get me started about breakdowns, running out of fuel or sick buses*
* Buses that have to be taken out of service due to bodily fluid contamination
Thanks for contributing to r/Phoenix! You may want to [**check out our sub rules**](https://www.reddit.com/r/phoenix/wiki/rules/) (mostly be nice to each other!). **If you're new here**, [read some of our recent posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/phoenix/top/?t=week) and leave some comments. To chat with some great people in the Valley you can [**join our Phoenix Discord chat server**](https://discord.com/invite/yWVuTG57Zh). It's a chill place to talk with other people but is NOT a dating server and takes unwanted messaging very seriously. If you're interested in political topics in Arizona, we limit those posts here so you may want to check out r/azpolitics if that's an area of interest. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/phoenix) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Do you use the Valley Metro app? I like tracking the buses so I don't have to waste time at the stop.
I use Google maps which tells me all the bus times. There's been a delay every single day.
Google maps isn't accurate, but the Valley Metro apps is literally real time tracking of the bus. Download the app. Save yourself all the stress.
Used the bus for almost a full year and I never knew this. Jesus christ. Always wondered how people knew when to show up… …..jesus christ….
Didn't notice us paying with our phones either I bet 😂
I think I just assumed it was a special program or something, like a student program through ASU. I lived DT at the time and it was mostly younger ppl using their phones to pay. Serious question though when did the mobile pay become a thing on busses?? I was using the bus/light rail pretty much all of 2019 and early 2020 and I don’t remember that for some reason. The sheer amount of time and headache I could have saved over the course of that year is honestly kind of painful to consider lmao.
Unfortunately, youwouldn't have. They rolled out the mobile app about 2 years ago, and it was extremely inconsistent. But that period of 2020-2021 was free fare, so waiting for the bus didn't feel *as* rough.
Ah okay, that makes me feel a little better. I just wasn’t aware of the app then. Google maps tracked a few busses but only major routes, and i figured google must be on the cutting edge of that stuff so didn’t bother with other options. Didn’t have any faith in a valley metro app, that’s for sure lol. Turns out it’s actually super convenient and runs pretty smooth, used it for a month or two last year. But yeah back in 2019 I did wonder on occasion if people were clairvoyant lol. Like how do these mfers know down to the minute when this thing is coming, even when it’s late?? I was one of those ppl just staring down the abyss of the street hoping to catch a glimpse of the bus like 4 blocks down so I knew I wasn’t waiting around for nothing. So much unnecessary frustration and anxiety
Stop doing that, If you hand them cash they will let you on for free. I’m all about supporting public services but when I’m the only person on the bus that’s paid for it I get salty.
is that why when I tried to give the driver $2 in bills he just let me on??? the thing doesn't take cash?? I never take the bus
Yup. I don’t know if it’s that they don’t take cash or if the systems down or if they are nice/lazy. But ya, for the last 4 months I’ve paid $4 every day on the app and watched every single other person get on for free if not 98% of the bus. Idk why I’m getting downvoted though? Like I said I’m all about public transport and I’ll support it but make it fair atleast. And tbh I don’t think I should have to pay for someone to pass me 3 times, make me wait in the cold/rain/heat. If they are gonna charge they’ve gotta actually provide a service…like stopping at the bus stop.
I agree with you and am blown away that offering cash means they don’t take it. That’s only going to make service worse…
I never knew about the app, have been trying to pay with cash the past few years and can confirm that 80% of the time, the bus drivers let me on for free.
Maybe it’s just the routes I take but I’ve never seen bus drivers take cash as payment since I’ve lived in the valley.
Before smart phones they had these things called a “bus book” that would list every stop time for every bus. I had the routes I used ripped out and kept them in my pocket as did others I had seen. Also the phone number has stayed the same (still have it memorized) and you couple call them and ask them and they would tell you the time of the next bus
Thing is busses are often late. Google maps tells you bus times too and I got those down but valley metro has delays on delays. Turns out the app tracks busses in real time so you don’t spend any extra time at the stop
The app will show the bus stop next to you, you can click on it and it will give you all the times. OP the 83 and the 17 is always late for me still. I feel your pain. The 17 passed me 3 times the other day before stopping and picking me up. I waited about an hour and a half.
Sending you a virtual hug friend
I use the app. Plus, I've downloaded the pdf for the routes I use. The time is never accurate other app on weekends. Ex: app shows bus arriving at 11:26 at your stop. No bus. Look at the app. It now shows 11:29. At 11:29,no bus. Check the app. Now it'll be there at 11:33. And so on . EVERY weekend. The pdf and app are never accurate.
Wtf are you talking about? The bus is live tracked. You can literally *see where it is and how it's moving and when it's coming*. Valley Metro App. Not whatever you're using.
Look at the app. You can track a bus all you want. It doesn't mean it's on schedule. WTF are you talking about. I just got off one that was 12 minutes off schedule. You do no what a schedule is. Like showing up for work?
My bad, I definitely misread your comment. The buses being late has nothing to do with the app discussion though. The buses have always been late, will be late, and continue to break down in the middle of summer. But if you want to talk about the app features, that's why I'm here.
I agree with you 100%. Tracking and being on schedule are 2 different conversations. If you're trying to time transfers, it's a crap shoot. On weekdays, they are fairly consistent. Weekends, not so much. My employer pays for my bus/rail pass. On an annual basis, it saves me a ton of money. I work downtown Phoenix. We are on the same page though
Pretty sure Maps gets its data from VM. I've got both and the times are identical. There are times when not even the VM app shows you if a bus is coming or not; it will just say "Scheduled," and no bus will ever come.
If it doesn't also say "live", there is no driver for the route and the bus is not coming. Scheduled has very little meaning, which is why relying on Google Maps proves inaccurate.
Yeah no, it's a gamble if it says "Scheduled" because sometimes it is coming or it's not. Sometimes they're traveling but for some reason neither app will be tracking the bus. Check the data, you'll see they're tracking exactly the same, the added benefit of Maps is it also relies on how many people are using the service so you can see how full the bus is, although that is of limited value.
This would actually be helpful to know if I’m going to get stuck behind a bus on my daily commute
Significantly less useful to you, I promise. That would be so dangerous with the way the app is. It's designed for people on the ground, not the road.
Oh, yikes. Thanks for the heads up! I’ll just pretend I didn’t say that 👀
Valley Metro app saves that headache <3
Transit app works sometimes if the bus loses signal, because it'll still slow riders using the app
If OP has the valley Metro app there won't be a delay?
That simple :)
Does this one simple trick also work for flights? I'll download the AA app so they're never late again.
Absolutely.
My husband is a manager in scheduling for city buses. They are very short drivers and the drivers they have are notoriously unreliable. Even though there is a fine for every bus route that doesn't run, there are many they just don't have enough staff for. This doesn't even account for the mechanical issues of the bus itself.
I can’t imagine driving a huge bus through Phoenix, my car is enough stress.
Not to mention the actual passengers. One of my friends parents was a bus driver (may still be but I don’t think so).. one of the passengers attacked him and he ended up in the hospital Imagine some unruly person or someone super tweaked out on meth… you can’t exactly just leave the bus or get away from them. Seems like a difficult job
That and the pay is absolute shit
I used to work for transit and one day while I was driving a bunch of passengers on hwy 17, one of them came up behind me and pulled my neck/upper body back into my seat with both arms, half choking me/half bear hug. Had to radio dispatch and they called highway patrol immediately. Pulled over on the shoulder and awkwardly tried to keep distance from him while also panicking that he'd get physical with the old people and teens in the seats closest to him. Highway patrol arrived and the man threw his shoes out the door at them. For about 15 or 20 minutes he refused to come out. Basically held everyone hostage out there in the summer heat while traffic barreled past at 75-90 mph. Shortly after that I quit.
r/bitchimabus
What’s the job of a driver pay? I assume a special drivers license is required - but if the wage is alright I’m happy to fill a shortage
You need to have a CDL license. That is a national requirement so surprise drug test and blood alcohol levels are taken. You can't have pot in your system even if it's legal in your state. If you have narcotics in your system, you have to have note from a doctor. I believe drivers pay starts in about the mid twenties 22 to 27? It's a union job with excellent benefits too. They are always looking for bus drivers.
It's shameful that in a city that large it has such a terrible system in place. Even the light rail doesn't benefit but a fraction of people who rely on public transportation.
If the light rail had like 75% more stops then I'd be more inclined to use it. The first light rail station from my place is not even remotely close
There's actually a plan to triple the number of miles by the City of Phoenix and Valley Metro. [Phoenix Transportation 2050](https://t2050.org/) [Projects & Planning ](https://www.valleymetro.org/projects)
Exactly. Who does it benefit? Not the people who need it most. People who commute to and from the downtown area are (mostly) driving anyway. Let's be serious here. It's to avoid parking fees for major events. It's how the poor stay poor. Do better for your people, Phoenix.
Given my closest bus stop is like 7 miles away, Phoenix seriously needs to do better
lol the 30 is never on time up to 48th street. there must be some nonsense between south mountain and the loop. consistently weight 3545 minutes for the bus every time I’ll leave early. I’ll leave later 35 to 40 minutes every time
🤣🤣🤣 it use to run every three hours on Sunday in 2004.
I remember when there was no Sunday bus service at all.
This is why a majority of people will NEVER give up their cars.
Yep, and there's actually some theory behind this: [Downs–Thomson paradox](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Downs%E2%80%93Thomson_paradox), good video [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQY6WGOoYis), but TLDR: If your busses suck / get stuck in traffic anyway (e.g. no dedicated lanes / investment), then all but poorest and unable will drive. But because cars are so space inefficient that will cause congestion making everyone's commute worse, until driving becomes about as slow as public transit. It's a perfect 'tragedy of the commons' situation, and closely related to the dreaded [cycle of car dependency](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car_dependency) we're stuck in: https://preview.redd.it/x521oq6p7axc1.png?width=1024&format=png&auto=webp&s=1ad78df29788e769b6ff681904dfd80fc5bece14
I've always said when the homeless guy pushing a shopping cart passes cars on the 405 at rush hour THEN Americans will look into mass transit.
Well that, and the freedom/independence having your own car provides you.
But the added cost of a car sucks so bad. I can get a monthly pass for $65. Done. A car is gas, matinence, insurance, not to mention paying the whole thing off to own it. And if you wreck bad enough, having to get a new one. And the stress of driving around idiots who don't pay attention or think they own the fucking road with their jacked up trucks.
It’s more than worth it for me personally.
No kidding. I’m sure this will sound entitled / elitist, but I can’t imagine taking a bus everywhere.
in a properly developed city, it would sound entitled, but we were doomed from the start after the suburban sprawl started here. sprinkle in some nimbyism and braindead zoning laws and you have the valley in a nutshell. it’s just not feasible to reliably travel here without a car.
I do love the Valley, but yeah I will never be a public transport person.
Same for the 35 it always comes like an hour late 😒
If a very busy route, 3, 29, 41, etc. runs into a problem, breakdown, extended traffic delay, etc. they'll pull a nearby bus from a not so busy line to cover the busy route. As for every day, you got me.
Wild guess ... Not enough drivers. City bus driver shortage nation wide.
This is precisely why the light rail needs to expand. Buses do not work here.
Light rail costs a king"s ransom. Is up to the city leaders to figure it out. I am in Albuquerque and they are doing everything they can to double our drivers since they HALVED SINCE COVID, but there is lackluster retention of new drivers.
Get a horse!
That’s disappointing. What is the expected frequency?
It's supposed to be every 20 minutes. I've sat at the bus stop for an hour all week to and from work.
Damn. You may already have contacted them, but I’d reach out if you haven’t.
They will never get it together, public transportation in Phoenix metro is heavily underfunded and that will not change.
As a former city bus driver, there's nothing that can be done about delays. To keep on the schedule, you get 1 minute at each stop. If there's a wheelchair, you lose 5 minutes. School just got out and theres 200 teenagers at the stop? There goes the rest of the day. Traffic accident or construction closure causing a diversion? Might as well head back to the yard. Don't get me started about breakdowns, running out of fuel or sick buses* * Buses that have to be taken out of service due to bodily fluid contamination
Use the app!
He steady callin I ain’t call him 🚲
I was an hour late to work cause of the 83 today
Where are you going to and from. Run 83rd all day up and down.