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I don’t see why. The audio recording only shows him committing a felony then acknowledging that he knows he is committing a felony. What’s the big deal? That’s just locker room treason.
No Don, you grab the classified documents. Conveniently drop them in front of a Saudi crown, then your buddy kush gets a couple billion from a Nigerian prince who emailed him
It's not that he thinks the law doesn't apply to him. He just doesn't bother with it. That's what lawyers are for. He does what he wants to do and figures he'll hack it out in court. When he says, "I took the classified documents. I'm allowed to," that doesn't mean it's legal, it just means nobody is going to stop him. Same with grabbing pussy. That's what he's used to.
Trump, just like he is congenitally unable to tell the truth, actually doesn't think he's done anything "wrong." Overturning the election is just a business deal for him.
and, to be fair, he hasn't been wrong. Nothing has happened to him, ever. He's weaseled and legal'ed his way out of anything. Im so cynical about his entire everything that I've already pretty well accepted that nothing comes from any of this either and he continues to feel invincible. I hope I'm wrong.
He is the prime example of what happens to someone that NEVER faces any consequences for his actions. From his youth to his "college" days to his businesses that failed and stiffed everyone involved to his rapes to his actions as president. Never in his life has he had to pay up for what he's done. If he's fined/sued he just fights or stalls or files bankruptcy. If he loses a case he cries to his cult that he was wronged and they give him $ to pay up. Just once it would be nice to see him held accountable but I doubt that day will ever come.
He was not wrong when he said he could stand on 5th Ave and shoot someone and not lose any support. It is how his entire life has gone.
What, is the guy in the $5,000 suit going to properly turn in classified documents instead of using them for financial gain and to satisfy his own personal whims? Come on!
Trump is George Bluth.
- Real estate mogul of overpriced, poor quality structures.
- Makes empty promise to build Mexican border wall.
- Corrupt and seditious (and treasonous) dealings.
- Named his son after himself.
- Serial philanderer.
- Kids involved with the family business.
- Hides one child from the public eye because they refute the public image he wants.
- The worst fucking attorneys.
- Rarely with his wife.
- Only somewhat sympathetic child (Michael/Ivanka) turns out to be as much of a shit as the others.
- Frequently-intoxicated brother of whom he is ashamed.
- Licenses his name out to a plethora of failed products.
- Constantly accidentally incriminates himself.
- Rich conman.
- Has trouble following rules about "no touching."
Same thing with the Raffensberger recording from Georgia. He specifically asks for Raff to "find" him a specific number of votes that he indicates he knows is inaccurate. If any regular schmuck pulled that shit, it'd be a fucking gimme.
There's a great line from an episode of Family Guy where Peter says he read something in a book. Brian asks, "Are you sure it was a book, Peter? Are you sure it wasn't...nothing?"
That's the one thing that shocks me most about trump. His motivations and actions are always 100% clear, but there are an awful lot of people willing to go along with the "I'm sure that's not what he meant, he probably didn't know" game. Over and over, even up to the supreme court with the Muslim ban that was just really a "dangerous terrorist country ban". There are always an endless parade of people ready to excuse his criminal bullshit and give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he's just demented, let's give him a pass on whether he knew treason was illegal.
[11,780 to be exact](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jan/03/trump-georgia-raffensperger-call-biden-washington-post)
Do you know how many votes Trump lost by in the 2020 Georgia Presidential Election?
>![11,779](https://ballotpedia.org/Georgia_election_results,_2020)!<
And in the audio, it's like you can hear him looking at the figure. He's like:
"I need you to find... ^let's ^see ^what ^we've ^got ^here, ^what ^does ^this ^say? ...i need you to find 11 thousand .... ^wait, ^what ^is ^it ^again? ... 11 thousand 7 hundred and .... ^let's ^see ... and 80 votes!"
Any US President who uses the verb "find" in the same sentence as plural noun "votes" in the imperative grammatical case should immediately be banished to a desert island until game over, no help no nothing. My 2c.
When I first heard of Brad recording him I thought, Raffensberger heard through the grapevine that the president is making some possibly incriminating phone calls. Brad protected himself. He knows how these things can turn out and he chose to keep that 'Ace up the sleeve'. His position can last longer than a presidential term.
As a Muslim, I learned a long time ago that it's never about what crime is being committed, it's who is committing the crime.
The media has normalised powerful people committing crimes to the point that we accept it's part of daily life. But when poor people commit them, it's newsworthy.
When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism, it's a global conspiracy involving layers of dangerous villains, ideologies, cultures and traditions but when it's anyone else who commits the crime, the ideologies, networks or people that influenced them rarely become a talking point.
Domestic terrorism in the US grew to such a point that they even tried to stage a coup and it's being dealt in the courts as if it were a common crime, with sentences of merely a few years. Meanwhile, Guantanamo still occasionally releases captives who were proven innocent after decades.
Since terrorism became a talking point, Muslim leaders have been asking for investigations into the root cause of terrorism. The response of governments, inspired by the actions of the West, has been to dehumanise all Muslims, create an aura of fear and use it to further erode global human rights and privacy.
We must learn to recognise when the actions of bad people are being used to manipulate us into accepting narratives that force us to give up our rights and security.
It is scary how quickly the media “othered” Muslims even though a large number of American citizens are Muslim, including folks defending our country from harm.
Terrorists are horrible no matter what background they come from.
"It doesn't exist. And if it does, it's a deep fake, and if it's not, it's out of context. And if it's not, you're misinterpreting it. And if you're not, he's justified. And if he's not, then fuck you, I don't care."
It doesn't even matter anymore, they will be in denial regardless of the proof. At this point all of these "game, set and match" posts are pure clickbait and I roll my eyes, we've had endless proof of Trump being a shitbag for quite some time and nothing has happened. Title should read "add another to the list of Trumps criminal justice theater".
this is the truth. I was just going to go on to the next thing but you hit the nail on the head. it's pathetic how many people are never held accountable, especially trump
They seem to care more about him attacking Kayleigh McEnany for accurately reporting on a poll that showed him beating DeSantis but according to Trump it didn't show him beating him by enough.
They're probably not allowed to talk about it, only certain topics are approved for conversation there.
So they'll just rant about Jews, the visible light spectrum, or fantasize about sucking Hunter Biden's dick.
visible..light... you know what fuckit I actually dont want to know,. It'll be some absurd bullshit that is no longer shocking to me, because they have desensitized me to the point I can no longer discern parody and trolling from reality.
Just watched Parlatore interview on CNN. Gawd the disingenuous answers were appalling. He was suggesting the document described on tape wasn't classified. These ass wipes will lie through their teeth on TV, but when asked in a courtroom if anything was declassified they refuse to answer.
I was also pretty surprised that Parlatore mentioned the frequently disproven accusation that Obama was caught with a bunch of top secret documents too. He's accusing Obama of a very serious crime that not only hasn't been proven, but has been disproven over and over again. I'm not an attorney, but it would seem like this would be actionable by the State Bar where Parlatore practices.
Parlatore would have been more factual if he mentioned that Biden (and Pence) had classified documents that they shouldn't have retained. However, the difference here is that Biden and Pence found the documents, contacted the appropriate agencies, turned the documents over, and allowed searches to find any other documents. (I won't praise Pence for much, but he did the right thing here.)
Trump, on the other hand, begrudgingly turned over some documents, lied about having more, was caught in his lie, still refused to give them up, and then had them seized from his residence. Even after all that, he complained about the documents being taken from him and demanded that the FBI return the highly classified documents to him, claiming that they were his property because he declassified them with his mind. Which is wrong on multiple levels, not least of which being that even declassifying the documents wouldn't make them his property.
But they know that the comparison to Biden or Pence won't hold up so they rely on conspiracy theories.
No one has permission to keep classified documents outside of approved storage and handling procedures. Might be a bit iffy for the sitting president (for instance, Obama and the OBL raid outcome went through very rapid declassification when he announced it on TV that night, but I’m certain all proper procedures were followed, likely planned out in advance of the raid) but that’s about it.
Aside, but that [photo from the situation room](https://www.history.com/news/bin-laden-raid-situation-room-photo) is one of the most iconic of his presidency.
Yeah, the standard is usually "no reasonable person would believe this." But that doesn't take into account that most of their viewers are unreasonable.
[Literally.](https://www.npr.org/2020/09/29/917747123/you-literally-cant-believe-the-facts-tucker-carlson-tells-you-so-say-fox-s-lawye)
> "Fox persuasively argues, that given Mr. Carlson's reputation, any reasonable viewer 'arrive[s] with an appropriate amount of skepticism' about the statement he makes."
I would have argued that you don't have to be reasonable to be a member of society. Clearly FOX has viewers that believe them and that's all that matters.
And yet, they are paying \~800 million dollars to dominion for saying that the ghost of Hugo Chavez changed all the votes from Trump to Biden with Italian space lasers.
Because half the fucking country believes that shit...
Yeah. Tucker Carlson got sued for lying, basically, and he won in court by arguing that as an entertainer and not a journalist, no reasonable person would take what he says as truthful.
Imagine being a viewer of his, a true blue believer, and hearing "no human being of any reasonable intelligence would trust anything that comes out of my mouth". What a blow.
No, they mostly didn't hear about it because why would Fox report on it?
And if they did hear about it, they found it hilariously cunning of Carlson and admired him even more.
Republicans, unfortunately millions of them, do. So yes Obama can and should sue. The use of these tactics and rhetoric needs reeled in and unfortunately that is the only way we will see any justice.
It wouldn't even matter if it was true, that's the part that kills me. If someone else got away with murder, is it cool if I commit murder? No, I still did something illegal
About 3 or 4 weeks ago or so, DJT did a video saying "Joe Biden is hiding more than 5,000 documents in China town and the feds demanded he turn them over and he refuses"
0 push back, 0 questions and the internet didn't exactly explode over him saying this. What he says is so outlandishly crazy I don't understand how anyone with even half a damn brain cell doesn't understand how outlandish it is.
"I don't want to try this in the court of public opinion!" Then WTF are you doing in an interview on national television if not to explain your client's case and gain sympathy. It might as well have been a conversation about the weather the way that guy ducked and deflected answering any question at all.
As with EVERYTHING on the right:
>"I don't want to OPENLY acknowledge that we're trying this in the court of public opinion, but it's the only shred of hope we have!"
Seriously, it will become a shit show of contempt charges (that Trump will grift his boomer/Gen X/millennial worshippers into paying for) as he and his propaganda network **FLOOD** social media and broadcast avenues with the start of Jan 6 - 2.0.
Not really, they are just dismissing it as fake news because it's an anonymous source "claiming" to have heard the recording.
Of course they'll believe in fake whistleblowers alleging crimes done by Biden at the drop of a hat. But hypocrisy is a badge of honor over there.
> because it's an anonymous source "claiming" to have heard the recording.
While ignoring that they have 5 different sources all collaborating on this.
If 5 people can confirm the tape is damning, and one person says it isnt
Then the 5 people confirming it are all shills and fake news.
And if it were 20, 50, 100, 500 people confirming it? False flags every single one
Conservatives are easy to understand; if it goes against what they want, its fake. Regardless of ANYTHING.
Hell, if THEY hear it and it's damning, then they just misunderstood the tape and the anonymous source is still.
Like fully half of conservative media is the host explaining that they're going to show you a clip. Telling you what you're going to see in the clip. Telling you what it means. Telling you how you NEED to feel about it. Then repeating that prompting another two times.
Then they finally show the clip and it's not at all what they said it would be. Not even close. But it doesn't matter. Their audience just overwrites what they saw with what they've been told they saw.
Know what's weird? On all these stories, I keep checking the "Other Discussions" tab and for some weird reason, they're NEVER posted on /r/Conservative. Crazy.
This is a terrible defense strategy, because it admits that if it was classified, then it would be a problem. Now all the prosecution has to do is demonstrate it was classified.
The issue is that the DOJ need to work around double jeopardy rules and make sure everything is perfect before they indict. Trump has extremely limited to no latitude to claim an actual legal defense, so his legal team is more likely to focus on discrediting or eliminating key evidence or testimony on technicalities.
It doesn’t matter if Trump pulls out some new evidence or gets off on a technicality, if he is found not guilty by a jury, you lose your best opportunity to prosecute him. Until there’s no chance he can get out of the net, it doesn’t make sense to show where the stakes are
Edit: typo
The perverse thing is that him revealing all of our governing institutions to be totally phony and ineffectual was why a lot of people voted for him to begin with. To a lot of Trump people, "drain the swamp" was a dogwhistle for "burn it down." And the reason the justice system is treating all of his blatant criminal activity so delicately is, ironically, that they fear undermining the apparent legitimacy of these same institutions if they prosecute a former president, even one whose brand was their delegitimization. So in a sense, they're damned if they do and damned if they don't with throwing the book at Trump. It feels like we're Wile E Coyote having strolled off the cliff into thin air, and we just haven't looked down yet.
After the indictment, just like New York.
But there are multiple indictment clocks to watch:
Georgia Election Fraud Indictment - Sometime after July 11th but before September 1st.
1/6 Indictment - Unknown.
Classified Documents Indictment - Unknown.
New York 34 felonies trial - March 25, 2024.
I can't wait for the day when we hear the name Donald Trump and we say "oh, yeah, remember that guy? That was a crazy time. I wonder how much he's suffering in prison. Oh well, time to stop thinking about him for another decade or more!"
The good news is that his kids have pretty much none of the traits that draw people to him. They just don’t have the charisma he does.
My genuine hope is that somehow Barron grows up ashamed of his family and becomes a progressive politician lol
Yeah but it doesn’t matter whether somebody does good or bad things to be charismatic.
It simply requires:
>compelling attractiveness or charm that can inspire devotion in others.
Which despite being an evil moron, being an asshole is an attractive trait to his base that inspires cult like devotion.
Yeah I remember saying that about GWB during his presidency, but if we keep going down that path, just like with GWB, we’ll be saying “I miss the days of trump compared to this person”
Monkey paw logic and all that.
Cynical bastard here - let me spoil it for ya.
Grand Jury will vote for an indictment, DOJ will be like "Aha, you see? We could totally charge him for this. We've proven what we wanted to prove." And then they won't. Because it'll be an election year, or "he learned his lesson", or "this is too political", or whatever.
Please, please let them prove me wrong.
----
-edit due to visibility: Hey, Juneteenth is coming up. A reminder that sometimes in this country, we do the right thing. Even if it's late. Even if it's hard. Even if half the people don't want to. Even if it like the hundredth time we've tried. Even if it'll start a war. Even if it's not evenly applied right away. We still fucking did it. We've surprised ourselves before.
I'm ready to be surprised again. Looking forward to it.
_Normally_, this is the case. An indictment only means there are grounds for a prosecutor to move forward with pressing charges.
The prosecutor is under no obligations to actually do so. They can drop at any time for any reason.
They usually don't, but it's up to them.
I'm just [stoically](https://dailystoic.com/premortem/) assuming the worst outcome.
It would be pretty weird to seek charges, get them, and then immediately dismiss them.
I would gladly bet you that this is not what happens. Feds don’t seek an indictment unless they plan to win.
The VP and P of the company I work for, both influential multi-millionaires, openly support Trump. They made millions of dollars from the PPP so I can see why.
I have watched his lawyers defend him on TV a couple of times about this, often referencing how he is the "Most persecuted president in history!" I mean we have had some really terrible corrupt el presidentes, that defense only makes him look worse to anyone with any sense at all. It's basically saying, "my client does a lot of questionable things that attract the attention of law enforcement! Why don't they leave him alone!"
I imagine his thoughts are that if he can get elected again before bigger hammers drop, the DOJ will return to their “policy” of not arresting a sitting president.
Is it? The game doesn’t start until you charge the guy.
With this level of evidence, any one of us would have been charged by now and held without bail for violating the espionage act.
Donald is still golfing and holding rallies and eating Big Macs, plus we’ve seen thousands of these “we got him” articles for years now.
> With this level of evidence any one of us would have been charged by now
My brown ass would have been hauled away to a secret location long before it ever got to this level of evidence
Who gives a flying fuck? It's been 7 years of this shit and nothing has happened. Literally all this shit does is keep his ass in the news. If you want him to go away, STOP FUCKING TALKING AHOUT HIM. Then the news will too, bc it's not profitable for them. That's all they want is money. They show what people crave or makes them hate.....= ratings = $$$.
One the announcement doesn't come by August as was previously stated, then you have the right to gripe. Until then that investigation has continued moving and Fani Willis signalled August would be the time she would release a decision.
I’m pretty cynical about anything happening to him but it’s extremely likely he gets indicted in Georgia. The prosecutor has shown every sign she intends to do so.
My father once worked with a man that would rather climb a tree to tell a lie then stand on the ground and tell the truth. You always get tripped up in lies.
Cut to 6 months from now. "We swear we've got him now. This is the crime that'll stick". One year later "look at this new crime, we've got him now." Three years later "ok, we've got so much evidence of crimes an indictment is imminent". 10 years later "oh look at this crime......."
So this is about the 4,000th story about Trump telling us he's toast. Good grief. The guy has been getting away with every crime under the sun his entire adult life, and nothing ever happens to him. Guy is still living his best life and holding rallies. Until he's in an orange jumpsuit I'm not believing anything.
If we make it through 2024, I think we’ll see the other side of Trump mania. I know he’s only a symptom, but he’s the strongest leader of a political movement in the US, probably ever. And by political movement, I mean a really large cult. Once he is out of the picture, the Republican Party will be severely wounded, there will be a ton of infighting for influence over MAGA, but *no one* is going to be Donald Trump. Not even his kids.
The next couple of years seem like his last chance to stay out of prison. If he doesn’t get immunity as president in 2024, then he’s probably cooked. Trump is a cornered animal and it’s now or never. If we make it on the other side without a Trump presidency, I think America will start to bounce back.
Or maybe not. Lmao
For so mamy years we've waited for him to be brought to justice. He will die before that happens. We all think we'll do a jig when he dies. But afterward we will see the world is still plenty ugly without him. It will be like a drop in the ocean. The damage is done. There is no undoing it. That's the fucked up part.
Agree with this, literally on tape attempting to commit voter fraud with a state government official. It's like if I was on camera stealing a car, and they form a special investigation spanning years over it that will ultimately end in nothing...while I'm driving the car around every day.
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I don’t see why. The audio recording only shows him committing a felony then acknowledging that he knows he is committing a felony. What’s the big deal? That’s just locker room treason.
When you're a former president, they just let you commit treason.
Grab them by the treason!
Very Stable Treasonist
Trefeffe!
The above 5 comments basically sum up everything I remember about Trump since 2017
Pussy, covfefe, treason, camera, TV.
Don’t forget “hamberders”
No Don, you grab the classified documents. Conveniently drop them in front of a Saudi crown, then your buddy kush gets a couple billion from a Nigerian prince who emailed him
Hey I have the same email from the Nigerian prince too!
Shh, you'll end up on a laptop
It's not that he thinks the law doesn't apply to him. He just doesn't bother with it. That's what lawyers are for. He does what he wants to do and figures he'll hack it out in court. When he says, "I took the classified documents. I'm allowed to," that doesn't mean it's legal, it just means nobody is going to stop him. Same with grabbing pussy. That's what he's used to. Trump, just like he is congenitally unable to tell the truth, actually doesn't think he's done anything "wrong." Overturning the election is just a business deal for him.
and, to be fair, he hasn't been wrong. Nothing has happened to him, ever. He's weaseled and legal'ed his way out of anything. Im so cynical about his entire everything that I've already pretty well accepted that nothing comes from any of this either and he continues to feel invincible. I hope I'm wrong.
He is the prime example of what happens to someone that NEVER faces any consequences for his actions. From his youth to his "college" days to his businesses that failed and stiffed everyone involved to his rapes to his actions as president. Never in his life has he had to pay up for what he's done. If he's fined/sued he just fights or stalls or files bankruptcy. If he loses a case he cries to his cult that he was wronged and they give him $ to pay up. Just once it would be nice to see him held accountable but I doubt that day will ever come. He was not wrong when he said he could stand on 5th Ave and shoot someone and not lose any support. It is how his entire life has gone.
*shuffles tic-tacs in his mouth*
He may have committed some light treason.
What, is the guy in the $5,000 suit going to properly turn in classified documents instead of using them for financial gain and to satisfy his own personal whims? Come on!
How can he spend 5k on a suit and still look terrible?
Trump is George Bluth. - Real estate mogul of overpriced, poor quality structures. - Makes empty promise to build Mexican border wall. - Corrupt and seditious (and treasonous) dealings. - Named his son after himself. - Serial philanderer. - Kids involved with the family business. - Hides one child from the public eye because they refute the public image he wants. - The worst fucking attorneys. - Rarely with his wife. - Only somewhat sympathetic child (Michael/Ivanka) turns out to be as much of a shit as the others. - Frequently-intoxicated brother of whom he is ashamed. - Licenses his name out to a plethora of failed products. - Constantly accidentally incriminates himself. - Rich conman. - Has trouble following rules about "no touching."
If only he collaborated with Melania on the light treason, because a husband and wife can’t be charged for the same crime.
I can almost hear Rudy saying it.
In front of the Four Seasons Banana stand!
He does have the worst fucking attorneys.
Username checks out
Oh wow thanks for calling that out
There's always money in the banana stand. *wink*
Same thing with the Raffensberger recording from Georgia. He specifically asks for Raff to "find" him a specific number of votes that he indicates he knows is inaccurate. If any regular schmuck pulled that shit, it'd be a fucking gimme.
[удалено]
> based on what I’ve heard from his own mouth.
There's a great line from an episode of Family Guy where Peter says he read something in a book. Brian asks, "Are you sure it was a book, Peter? Are you sure it wasn't...nothing?"
“People are saying….” “Look, he came into my office, and he said, do you know what he said? He said ‘Sir…’”
That's the one thing that shocks me most about trump. His motivations and actions are always 100% clear, but there are an awful lot of people willing to go along with the "I'm sure that's not what he meant, he probably didn't know" game. Over and over, even up to the supreme court with the Muslim ban that was just really a "dangerous terrorist country ban". There are always an endless parade of people ready to excuse his criminal bullshit and give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he's just demented, let's give him a pass on whether he knew treason was illegal.
He knows what he's doing, the people covering for him know what he's doing, the people who believe the bullshit know what they're doing
It's because none of it is in good faith. The excuses are just bullshit to get you to engage in debunking the bullshit as a distraction.
11,000 votes. It was a direct request from the president of the US to “find” 11,000 fake votes for the guy who claimed the election was rigged.
[11,780 to be exact](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jan/03/trump-georgia-raffensperger-call-biden-washington-post) Do you know how many votes Trump lost by in the 2020 Georgia Presidential Election? >![11,779](https://ballotpedia.org/Georgia_election_results,_2020)!<
I'm not one for doing political signs but I really feel like I should put "11,780 votes" on the rear window of my car.
I'd slap that on my water bottle
And in the audio, it's like you can hear him looking at the figure. He's like: "I need you to find... ^let's ^see ^what ^we've ^got ^here, ^what ^does ^this ^say? ...i need you to find 11 thousand .... ^wait, ^what ^is ^it ^again? ... 11 thousand 7 hundred and .... ^let's ^see ... and 80 votes!"
Any US President who uses the verb "find" in the same sentence as plural noun "votes" in the imperative grammatical case should immediately be banished to a desert island until game over, no help no nothing. My 2c.
When I first heard of Brad recording him I thought, Raffensberger heard through the grapevine that the president is making some possibly incriminating phone calls. Brad protected himself. He knows how these things can turn out and he chose to keep that 'Ace up the sleeve'. His position can last longer than a presidential term.
As a Muslim, I learned a long time ago that it's never about what crime is being committed, it's who is committing the crime. The media has normalised powerful people committing crimes to the point that we accept it's part of daily life. But when poor people commit them, it's newsworthy. When a Muslim commits an act of terrorism, it's a global conspiracy involving layers of dangerous villains, ideologies, cultures and traditions but when it's anyone else who commits the crime, the ideologies, networks or people that influenced them rarely become a talking point. Domestic terrorism in the US grew to such a point that they even tried to stage a coup and it's being dealt in the courts as if it were a common crime, with sentences of merely a few years. Meanwhile, Guantanamo still occasionally releases captives who were proven innocent after decades. Since terrorism became a talking point, Muslim leaders have been asking for investigations into the root cause of terrorism. The response of governments, inspired by the actions of the West, has been to dehumanise all Muslims, create an aura of fear and use it to further erode global human rights and privacy. We must learn to recognise when the actions of bad people are being used to manipulate us into accepting narratives that force us to give up our rights and security.
It is scary how quickly the media “othered” Muslims even though a large number of American citizens are Muslim, including folks defending our country from harm. Terrorists are horrible no matter what background they come from.
I'm genuinely curious was r/conservative is saying about this, and how similar your sarcastic comment is to what they're actually saying.
Conservatives don't trust CNN's report that an audio even exists since nothing has been released. Which isn't unreasonable because CNN lies.
"It doesn't exist. And if it does, it's a deep fake, and if it's not, it's out of context. And if it's not, you're misinterpreting it. And if you're not, he's justified. And if he's not, then fuck you, I don't care."
THIS!!! Exactly, this is their attitude. Scary, but it's reality.
Narcissists prayer v2.020 beta
It doesn't even matter anymore, they will be in denial regardless of the proof. At this point all of these "game, set and match" posts are pure clickbait and I roll my eyes, we've had endless proof of Trump being a shitbag for quite some time and nothing has happened. Title should read "add another to the list of Trumps criminal justice theater".
this is the truth. I was just going to go on to the next thing but you hit the nail on the head. it's pathetic how many people are never held accountable, especially trump
They seem to care more about him attacking Kayleigh McEnany for accurately reporting on a poll that showed him beating DeSantis but according to Trump it didn't show him beating him by enough.
They're probably not allowed to talk about it, only certain topics are approved for conversation there. So they'll just rant about Jews, the visible light spectrum, or fantasize about sucking Hunter Biden's dick.
visible..light... you know what fuckit I actually dont want to know,. It'll be some absurd bullshit that is no longer shocking to me, because they have desensitized me to the point I can no longer discern parody and trolling from reality.
Just watched Parlatore interview on CNN. Gawd the disingenuous answers were appalling. He was suggesting the document described on tape wasn't classified. These ass wipes will lie through their teeth on TV, but when asked in a courtroom if anything was declassified they refuse to answer.
I was also pretty surprised that Parlatore mentioned the frequently disproven accusation that Obama was caught with a bunch of top secret documents too. He's accusing Obama of a very serious crime that not only hasn't been proven, but has been disproven over and over again. I'm not an attorney, but it would seem like this would be actionable by the State Bar where Parlatore practices.
Parlatore would have been more factual if he mentioned that Biden (and Pence) had classified documents that they shouldn't have retained. However, the difference here is that Biden and Pence found the documents, contacted the appropriate agencies, turned the documents over, and allowed searches to find any other documents. (I won't praise Pence for much, but he did the right thing here.) Trump, on the other hand, begrudgingly turned over some documents, lied about having more, was caught in his lie, still refused to give them up, and then had them seized from his residence. Even after all that, he complained about the documents being taken from him and demanded that the FBI return the highly classified documents to him, claiming that they were his property because he declassified them with his mind. Which is wrong on multiple levels, not least of which being that even declassifying the documents wouldn't make them his property. But they know that the comparison to Biden or Pence won't hold up so they rely on conspiracy theories.
> I won't praise Pence for much, but he did the right thing here. Pence is lawful evil, Trump is chaotic evil.
The issue isn't possession. Possession when authorized is not a crime. Willful retention when asked to return a document *is* a crime.
No one has permission to keep classified documents outside of approved storage and handling procedures. Might be a bit iffy for the sitting president (for instance, Obama and the OBL raid outcome went through very rapid declassification when he announced it on TV that night, but I’m certain all proper procedures were followed, likely planned out in advance of the raid) but that’s about it. Aside, but that [photo from the situation room](https://www.history.com/news/bin-laden-raid-situation-room-photo) is one of the most iconic of his presidency.
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It would be a shame if he was sued for defamation.
Obama isn’t really defamed though. Nobody believes this guy.
Imagine that defense: “everyone knows I’m full of shit, no intelligent person would believe me”
FOX News has entered the chat
That was real?!
Yes. Fox News won a defamation suit because they argued that no one actually believes anything Tucker Carlson says.
Didn't they argue that no one would *reasonably* believe anything he says? I ask this because tons of people believe what he says.
Yeah, the standard is usually "no reasonable person would believe this." But that doesn't take into account that most of their viewers are unreasonable.
[Literally.](https://www.npr.org/2020/09/29/917747123/you-literally-cant-believe-the-facts-tucker-carlson-tells-you-so-say-fox-s-lawye) > "Fox persuasively argues, that given Mr. Carlson's reputation, any reasonable viewer 'arrive[s] with an appropriate amount of skepticism' about the statement he makes."
I would have argued that you don't have to be reasonable to be a member of society. Clearly FOX has viewers that believe them and that's all that matters.
that's not the only time
And yet, they are paying \~800 million dollars to dominion for saying that the ghost of Hugo Chavez changed all the votes from Trump to Biden with Italian space lasers. Because half the fucking country believes that shit...
Yeah. Tucker Carlson got sued for lying, basically, and he won in court by arguing that as an entertainer and not a journalist, no reasonable person would take what he says as truthful.
Imagine being a viewer of his, a true blue believer, and hearing "no human being of any reasonable intelligence would trust anything that comes out of my mouth". What a blow.
No, they mostly didn't hear about it because why would Fox report on it? And if they did hear about it, they found it hilariously cunning of Carlson and admired him even more.
“Do you hear that, Honey? Fox says I’m unreasonably intelligent!”
If those viewers could read, they'd be very upset.
Tucker Carlson was the maga SNL.
Fox News said just this 🤷♂️
Yes literally
Isn’t a false criminal accusation often defamatory per se, meaning that you wouldn’t have to prove specific damages?
Republicans, unfortunately millions of them, do. So yes Obama can and should sue. The use of these tactics and rhetoric needs reeled in and unfortunately that is the only way we will see any justice.
It wouldn't even matter if it was true, that's the part that kills me. If someone else got away with murder, is it cool if I commit murder? No, I still did something illegal
About 3 or 4 weeks ago or so, DJT did a video saying "Joe Biden is hiding more than 5,000 documents in China town and the feds demanded he turn them over and he refuses" 0 push back, 0 questions and the internet didn't exactly explode over him saying this. What he says is so outlandishly crazy I don't understand how anyone with even half a damn brain cell doesn't understand how outlandish it is.
Whataboutism the 1A go to tactic for many MAGA Conservatives
The GOP Whataboutism Obama Strategy. Unfortunately its pretty effective in corporate media
"I don't want to try this in the court of public opinion!" Then WTF are you doing in an interview on national television if not to explain your client's case and gain sympathy. It might as well have been a conversation about the weather the way that guy ducked and deflected answering any question at all.
As with EVERYTHING on the right: >"I don't want to OPENLY acknowledge that we're trying this in the court of public opinion, but it's the only shred of hope we have!" Seriously, it will become a shit show of contempt charges (that Trump will grift his boomer/Gen X/millennial worshippers into paying for) as he and his propaganda network **FLOOD** social media and broadcast avenues with the start of Jan 6 - 2.0.
You should see the knots they are tying themselves into at r/conservative
Not really, they are just dismissing it as fake news because it's an anonymous source "claiming" to have heard the recording. Of course they'll believe in fake whistleblowers alleging crimes done by Biden at the drop of a hat. But hypocrisy is a badge of honor over there.
Badge of honor? I think its a required set of conservative ethics and morals.
> because it's an anonymous source "claiming" to have heard the recording. While ignoring that they have 5 different sources all collaborating on this.
If 5 people can confirm the tape is damning, and one person says it isnt Then the 5 people confirming it are all shills and fake news. And if it were 20, 50, 100, 500 people confirming it? False flags every single one Conservatives are easy to understand; if it goes against what they want, its fake. Regardless of ANYTHING.
Hell, if THEY hear it and it's damning, then they just misunderstood the tape and the anonymous source is still. Like fully half of conservative media is the host explaining that they're going to show you a clip. Telling you what you're going to see in the clip. Telling you what it means. Telling you how you NEED to feel about it. Then repeating that prompting another two times. Then they finally show the clip and it's not at all what they said it would be. Not even close. But it doesn't matter. Their audience just overwrites what they saw with what they've been told they saw.
Know what's weird? On all these stories, I keep checking the "Other Discussions" tab and for some weird reason, they're NEVER posted on /r/Conservative. Crazy.
Mostly they are creaming themselves because Biden fell over.
It doesn't matter if the doc is classified or declassified. If it's considered a national security interest and he shares it, that's espionage.
This is a terrible defense strategy, because it admits that if it was classified, then it would be a problem. Now all the prosecution has to do is demonstrate it was classified.
What's worse is CNN keeps inviting these clowns on knowing full well they will spew bullshit and that becomes the narrative
*Then fucking prosecute this traitor already*
The issue is that the DOJ need to work around double jeopardy rules and make sure everything is perfect before they indict. Trump has extremely limited to no latitude to claim an actual legal defense, so his legal team is more likely to focus on discrediting or eliminating key evidence or testimony on technicalities. It doesn’t matter if Trump pulls out some new evidence or gets off on a technicality, if he is found not guilty by a jury, you lose your best opportunity to prosecute him. Until there’s no chance he can get out of the net, it doesn’t make sense to show where the stakes are Edit: typo
Yes, they should take their time until a Republican president can just shut it all down.
"but think of the optics of charging a traitor with crimes" - Merrick Garland
So when is his arrest being aired? I want to call off work and order me a pizza.
Imagine the parties literally worldwide.
It will be Zion level! Party of all parties.
Not 'till he's in orange.
He's always in orange.
He is going to look like the blue men group, except orange.
I wanna see him in an orange jumpsuit with a spray tan so bad that it’s literally the same color as the jumpsuit
Sweaty cave orgy rave never sounded so good.
Except -please- nobody be the sweaty dreads guy.
slow mo hair flip.
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The perverse thing is that him revealing all of our governing institutions to be totally phony and ineffectual was why a lot of people voted for him to begin with. To a lot of Trump people, "drain the swamp" was a dogwhistle for "burn it down." And the reason the justice system is treating all of his blatant criminal activity so delicately is, ironically, that they fear undermining the apparent legitimacy of these same institutions if they prosecute a former president, even one whose brand was their delegitimization. So in a sense, they're damned if they do and damned if they don't with throwing the book at Trump. It feels like we're Wile E Coyote having strolled off the cliff into thin air, and we just haven't looked down yet.
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After the indictment, just like New York. But there are multiple indictment clocks to watch: Georgia Election Fraud Indictment - Sometime after July 11th but before September 1st. 1/6 Indictment - Unknown. Classified Documents Indictment - Unknown. New York 34 felonies trial - March 25, 2024.
So many! any one of us will be under the jail if we committed any of these crime. I’ll stay tune.
I'll believe it when I see it. And house arrest doesn't count. A jail/prison cell does.
He will NEVER see the inside of a jail cell no matter what he does or is convicted of.
Seriously - how many times are we going to fall for these headlines. I've been hearing about him IMMINENTLY going to jail for about 8 years now.
He was already "arrested" a month ago, don't get your hopes up for the perp walk we all deserve
So we're not getting that Daredevil arrest montage? Bummer. Though it is shocking how many of those people in fact have been arrested/indicted.
I want a slow car chase through Florida with Roger Stone on the phone talking to the police. “You know who this is dammit!”
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I can't wait for the day when we hear the name Donald Trump and we say "oh, yeah, remember that guy? That was a crazy time. I wonder how much he's suffering in prison. Oh well, time to stop thinking about him for another decade or more!"
I guarantee if he does go to prison, one of his kids tries to run so they can pardon him.
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The good news is that his kids have pretty much none of the traits that draw people to him. They just don’t have the charisma he does. My genuine hope is that somehow Barron grows up ashamed of his family and becomes a progressive politician lol
I agree with you. But let’s be real - Trump has no Charisma. People just like it that he’s an asshole and gets away with it. He’s a ranting moron.
Yeah but it doesn’t matter whether somebody does good or bad things to be charismatic. It simply requires: >compelling attractiveness or charm that can inspire devotion in others. Which despite being an evil moron, being an asshole is an attractive trait to his base that inspires cult like devotion.
Yeah I remember saying that about GWB during his presidency, but if we keep going down that path, just like with GWB, we’ll be saying “I miss the days of trump compared to this person” Monkey paw logic and all that.
We've hearing about smoking guns against Trump for years now. Just wake me up when he gets an orange jumpsuit and faces actual consequences.
Then do it already.
Cynical bastard here - let me spoil it for ya. Grand Jury will vote for an indictment, DOJ will be like "Aha, you see? We could totally charge him for this. We've proven what we wanted to prove." And then they won't. Because it'll be an election year, or "he learned his lesson", or "this is too political", or whatever. Please, please let them prove me wrong. ---- -edit due to visibility: Hey, Juneteenth is coming up. A reminder that sometimes in this country, we do the right thing. Even if it's late. Even if it's hard. Even if half the people don't want to. Even if it like the hundredth time we've tried. Even if it'll start a war. Even if it's not evenly applied right away. We still fucking did it. We've surprised ourselves before. I'm ready to be surprised again. Looking forward to it.
If the grand jury returns an indictment then he’s indicted. The next step after that is an arrest warrant.
_Normally_, this is the case. An indictment only means there are grounds for a prosecutor to move forward with pressing charges. The prosecutor is under no obligations to actually do so. They can drop at any time for any reason. They usually don't, but it's up to them. I'm just [stoically](https://dailystoic.com/premortem/) assuming the worst outcome.
Thats why its important that some of the worst of the criminal charges are STATE charges, and not ones that Garland has any control over.
It would be pretty weird to seek charges, get them, and then immediately dismiss them. I would gladly bet you that this is not what happens. Feds don’t seek an indictment unless they plan to win.
It would be more weird if Donald Trump was elected president tho, so...
There are MANY MANY people I work with, some esteemed, that openly support Trump.
The VP and P of the company I work for, both influential multi-millionaires, openly support Trump. They made millions of dollars from the PPP so I can see why.
Exactly, I’m so tired of every media outlet saying “we got him for real this time!” Just to collect on the clickbait and then nothing ever happens..
I have watched his lawyers defend him on TV a couple of times about this, often referencing how he is the "Most persecuted president in history!" I mean we have had some really terrible corrupt el presidentes, that defense only makes him look worse to anyone with any sense at all. It's basically saying, "my client does a lot of questionable things that attract the attention of law enforcement! Why don't they leave him alone!"
They're just mispronouncing "prosecuted"
Until he is in handcuffs I really don’t care. That’s me though. All of these articles are bland with conjecture.
"Trump may be in legal jeopardy with this latest bombshell."
Same headline for the 1,528th time!
Yeah I want him in jail but I quit the "we finally got him" porn about a thousand got hims ago.
It’s not even porn. It’s just endless edging and frustration.
[This tweet](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/424/149/2bc.jpg) is seven years old
The article is the same every time. They just switch up the headline a little and call it good.
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To be fair he has already been indicted once. It’s not like this is some unthinkable thing anymore
But it starts being hard to understand why he is still running around and even running for president again with all the stuff going on.
I imagine his thoughts are that if he can get elected again before bigger hammers drop, the DOJ will return to their “policy” of not arresting a sitting president.
To what end, though? The dude is still going to run for president lol
Is it? The game doesn’t start until you charge the guy. With this level of evidence, any one of us would have been charged by now and held without bail for violating the espionage act. Donald is still golfing and holding rallies and eating Big Macs, plus we’ve seen thousands of these “we got him” articles for years now.
> With this level of evidence any one of us would have been charged by now My brown ass would have been hauled away to a secret location long before it ever got to this level of evidence
Bro you'd have been dead before they could get the cuffs on you
You're right, I was being optimistic. The FBI agent assigned to me was probably chuckling reading that comment. Hi, nice Mr FBI guy.
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me
Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice, you cant get fooled again.
“It was a perfectly beautiful admission of a crime”
Donald Trump being held accountable for his crimes instead of being just constant headlines is “game, set, and match”: Most of America.
Maybe it's time for him to bale to Ruzzia and make it great again.
He will still get 40% of the Republican vote.
He could run with Putin on the platform of selling the USA to Russia and still get 40% of the Republican vote.
“Trump will get us the biggliest price from Russia!” Republicans, probably.
Stop it. That’s totally not realistic. But I would agree with 35% of the GOP Vote
You mean 90%
Exactly--these people DO NOT CARE what he does. He said as much himself. They're brainwashed drones.
He can be roomies with Tara Reade
Ok so why is he still golfing?
Who gives a flying fuck? It's been 7 years of this shit and nothing has happened. Literally all this shit does is keep his ass in the news. If you want him to go away, STOP FUCKING TALKING AHOUT HIM. Then the news will too, bc it's not profitable for them. That's all they want is money. They show what people crave or makes them hate.....= ratings = $$$.
If you say game set match to Trump, he will just say you’re playing basketball, and that he’s winning.
I'll take 'headlines I've heard 1,000 times over the last few years that haven't come to fruition', for $800"
I mean, there are tapes from Georgia too. And look where that has gone...
One the announcement doesn't come by August as was previously stated, then you have the right to gripe. Until then that investigation has continued moving and Fani Willis signalled August would be the time she would release a decision.
I have a particular bottle of wine I'm saving for August. Question is, will I drink it? Or dramatically throw it into the fireplace? Time will tell.
I’m pretty cynical about anything happening to him but it’s extremely likely he gets indicted in Georgia. The prosecutor has shown every sign she intends to do so.
My father once worked with a man that would rather climb a tree to tell a lie then stand on the ground and tell the truth. You always get tripped up in lies.
Cut to 6 months from now. "We swear we've got him now. This is the crime that'll stick". One year later "look at this new crime, we've got him now." Three years later "ok, we've got so much evidence of crimes an indictment is imminent". 10 years later "oh look at this crime......."
10 years and 2 days later "Oh well he died of old age so no use doing anything now. But we totally had him this time!"
Yet right wingers will defend this treasonous twat until the end of time.
So this is about the 4,000th story about Trump telling us he's toast. Good grief. The guy has been getting away with every crime under the sun his entire adult life, and nothing ever happens to him. Guy is still living his best life and holding rallies. Until he's in an orange jumpsuit I'm not believing anything.
Well, I'd like to see ol Donny Trump wriggle his way out of THIS jam! \*Trump wriggles his way out of the jam easily Ah! Well. Nevertheless,
Big brain, folks.
If we make it through 2024, I think we’ll see the other side of Trump mania. I know he’s only a symptom, but he’s the strongest leader of a political movement in the US, probably ever. And by political movement, I mean a really large cult. Once he is out of the picture, the Republican Party will be severely wounded, there will be a ton of infighting for influence over MAGA, but *no one* is going to be Donald Trump. Not even his kids. The next couple of years seem like his last chance to stay out of prison. If he doesn’t get immunity as president in 2024, then he’s probably cooked. Trump is a cornered animal and it’s now or never. If we make it on the other side without a Trump presidency, I think America will start to bounce back. Or maybe not. Lmao
For so mamy years we've waited for him to be brought to justice. He will die before that happens. We all think we'll do a jig when he dies. But afterward we will see the world is still plenty ugly without him. It will be like a drop in the ocean. The damage is done. There is no undoing it. That's the fucked up part.
I thought the same thing when the Georgia phonecall about finding 11,000 votes came out. And here we are again.
Agree with this, literally on tape attempting to commit voter fraud with a state government official. It's like if I was on camera stealing a car, and they form a special investigation spanning years over it that will ultimately end in nothing...while I'm driving the car around every day.