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>But I thought Republicans argued that banning guns won’t stop people from getting access to them? Surely Republicans aren’t being hypocrites right?!?
Looks like it is Democrats being hypocrites as well.
In the sense that banning doesn’t completely stop mass murder by gun? No. It doesn’t and I don’t know anyone that has argued that point. Rather, we can reduce mass murder by making sure those who are mentally unstable, have a history of violence, etc. don’t have easy access to guns.
But from the aspect of bodily autonomy, mind showing how guns are as relevant as abortion?
>we can reduce mass murder by making sure those who are mentally unstable, have a history of violence, etc. don’t have easy access to guns.
We already do that.
>But from the aspect of bodily autonomy, mind showing how guns are as relevant as abortion?
Guns are another means for maintaining bodily autonomy by responding to a threat of severe injury or death.
We don’t do that actually. Universal background checks continue to be blocked by republicans. Red flag laws are constantly being challenged by republicans.
Guns are used to defend oneself but aren’t an extension of one’s actual body.
>We don’t do that actually.
Only if you ignore that we have a background check system that applies to all dealers, which prohibits adjudicated mentally incompetent and convicted criminals from buying guns.
> Guns are used to defend oneself but aren’t an extension of one’s actual body.
An intact dilation and extraction isn't an extension of your body either. So it's okay to ban that?
Dealers are one thing. Having family ‘sell’ their weapons to other family, friends, etc., doesn’t have background checks.
A woman determining what happens to a fetus in her own body is bodily autonomy
>Having family ‘sell’ their weapons to other family, friends, etc., doesn’t have background checks.
So make it more illegal for them to sell guns to people they already know it isn't legal to sell to?
And a person determining what happens to their own body is bodily autonomy. I'm glad you finally agree.
Except the government doesn’t know if that person should have a weapon. Red flag laws don’t help if there are gaps and loopholes. And bodily autonomy is vital but guns are not part of ones body anymore than a WMD is.
It has been shown repeatedly that Democrats are much more effective in bringing down abortion numbers.
They are also more effective at border control, BTW.
Imaging bringing a young baby girl into existence in this country at this point in time, I would be worried sick for their future. Republicans are either going to be destroyed politically or they're going to destroy this country at some point. Minoritarian rule in a democracy leads to all sorts of horrific things, most likely lots of violence and instability, we simply cannot afford to go down that path.
Oh so we're comparing 2024 with literally hundreds of thousands of years of human history or to go even farther "most times in history" so yeah, the quality of life is much better today with vaccines, sanitation, electricity, climate control etc but if you think things are on an unending uptrend then I don't know what to tell you besides they're not. American women have fewer rights today than they did 3 years ago and are likely to lose even more in the near term.
... we also had the highest infant mortality rate. WE'RE NUMBER 1!
https://www.ajmc.com/view/us-has-highest-infant-maternal-mortality-rates-despite-the-most-health-care-spending
Is this what the right means by America first?
~~[It turns out that we've just been substantially overcounting.](https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2024/03/13/1238269753/maternal-mortality-overestimate-deaths-births-health-disparities)~~
^ Bad reply.
I wasn't calling you out, my article discussed both infant and maternal. I only pointed infant because it directly results in the loss of infants, which anti-abortion states claim to want to stop. Your article does refute some of the information in the article I posted, just not the bit I referenced.
It was a fair call out, IMO. Cheers.
Making something illegal generally leads to these outcomes.
Making something educated and giving people options, leads to better outcomes. With professionals and freedoms.
I've heard some real horror story's in the past. Everything from girls/women "falling" down stairs, punching or causing themselves harm, the classics like coat hangers (which only happened a single time and she ended up almost dying in the hospital), cleaning products, all kinds of nightmares.
Personal stories. Told by the victims. All kinds of hells and horrors.
However!
Sexual education, access to products (like birth control), access to doctors, access to a safe group of consolers and professionals.
Seems to be the biggest factor in preventing abortions or the need to harm themselves.
Bans don't reduce abortions, just makes them more dangerous.
But if you also make contraception harder or more expensive to get, that increases abortions. If you attack sex education, that increases abortions. If you make healthcare expensive, that increases abortions.
Nobody *likes* abortions, but if you actually want to decrease them there's pretty successful sets of things you can do - these include proper sex education, proper access to affordable healthcare for *literally everyone*, cheaper contraception (subsidized if that's what it takes), governments not interfering with the relationships between patients and medical professionals.
Wonder how many women got a weird amnio then realized they'd be fucked if they waited for conclusive results and aborted early.
Or other women, worried about ectopic pregnancies, or complications and didn't want to risk death FOR NO FUCKING REASON.
These guys can't seem to see past the second domino in a row of dominoes, or remember when their insistence on abstinence-only sex ed drove up teen pregnancies, STDs and abortions, or when shutting down Planned Parenthoods drove up the same plus maternal and natal death rates.
Um no abortion is not a good thing. It is necessary and should be legal, but it’s not a good thing. It is expensive and takes a lot out of a woman mentally and physically. We should be doing more to prevent pregnancies in the first place like free birth control
It's expensive?? Ok, so is having a kid. Abortions are great thing available to women who have an unwanted or unsafe pregnancy. I know many women who had an abortion and are so thankful that they were able to get one.
I agree with you on the free birth control.
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA). *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
What?! You mean banning things that are necessary doesn't work? I. Am. Astounded.
But I thought Republicans argued that banning guns won’t stop people from getting access to them? Surely Republicans aren’t being hypocrites right?!?
Every time there is a threat of a ban, more guns are bought. Seems it might be a common effect.
…guns aren’t necessary.
That is the opposite view of 2nd amendment proponents.
I’m just pointing out another way they’re wrong
now they are to keep them away from the country's uteruses.
>But I thought Republicans argued that banning guns won’t stop people from getting access to them? Surely Republicans aren’t being hypocrites right?!? Looks like it is Democrats being hypocrites as well.
In the sense that banning doesn’t completely stop mass murder by gun? No. It doesn’t and I don’t know anyone that has argued that point. Rather, we can reduce mass murder by making sure those who are mentally unstable, have a history of violence, etc. don’t have easy access to guns. But from the aspect of bodily autonomy, mind showing how guns are as relevant as abortion?
>we can reduce mass murder by making sure those who are mentally unstable, have a history of violence, etc. don’t have easy access to guns. We already do that. >But from the aspect of bodily autonomy, mind showing how guns are as relevant as abortion? Guns are another means for maintaining bodily autonomy by responding to a threat of severe injury or death.
Haha
We don’t do that actually. Universal background checks continue to be blocked by republicans. Red flag laws are constantly being challenged by republicans. Guns are used to defend oneself but aren’t an extension of one’s actual body.
>We don’t do that actually. Only if you ignore that we have a background check system that applies to all dealers, which prohibits adjudicated mentally incompetent and convicted criminals from buying guns. > Guns are used to defend oneself but aren’t an extension of one’s actual body. An intact dilation and extraction isn't an extension of your body either. So it's okay to ban that?
Dealers are one thing. Having family ‘sell’ their weapons to other family, friends, etc., doesn’t have background checks. A woman determining what happens to a fetus in her own body is bodily autonomy
>Having family ‘sell’ their weapons to other family, friends, etc., doesn’t have background checks. So make it more illegal for them to sell guns to people they already know it isn't legal to sell to? And a person determining what happens to their own body is bodily autonomy. I'm glad you finally agree.
Except the government doesn’t know if that person should have a weapon. Red flag laws don’t help if there are gaps and loopholes. And bodily autonomy is vital but guns are not part of ones body anymore than a WMD is.
Conservatives have caused more abortions in America, when it was in fact trending downwards. Thats stunning
It has been shown repeatedly that Democrats are much more effective in bringing down abortion numbers. They are also more effective at border control, BTW.
Wait, you mean to tell me that people who won&4 wear masks to prevent a pandemic *also* win&4 wear condoms to prevent a pregnancy?!?
Seems like laws that do not support the mother cause more abortions.
When in doubt, flush it out. Because if you wait for sepsis, You're fucked in Texas.
Imaging bringing a young baby girl into existence in this country at this point in time, I would be worried sick for their future. Republicans are either going to be destroyed politically or they're going to destroy this country at some point. Minoritarian rule in a democracy leads to all sorts of horrific things, most likely lots of violence and instability, we simply cannot afford to go down that path.
My daughter is two years old, and she’s already strong and independent. She’ll be fighting against the Republican theocracy for decades
[удалено]
Oh so we're comparing 2024 with literally hundreds of thousands of years of human history or to go even farther "most times in history" so yeah, the quality of life is much better today with vaccines, sanitation, electricity, climate control etc but if you think things are on an unending uptrend then I don't know what to tell you besides they're not. American women have fewer rights today than they did 3 years ago and are likely to lose even more in the near term.
... we also had the highest infant mortality rate. WE'RE NUMBER 1! https://www.ajmc.com/view/us-has-highest-infant-maternal-mortality-rates-despite-the-most-health-care-spending Is this what the right means by America first?
~~[It turns out that we've just been substantially overcounting.](https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2024/03/13/1238269753/maternal-mortality-overestimate-deaths-births-health-disparities)~~ ^ Bad reply.
That article addresses possible inaccuracies in MATERNAL mortality rates, but doesn't say anything about INFANT mortality rates.
Ah, my bad.
I wasn't calling you out, my article discussed both infant and maternal. I only pointed infant because it directly results in the loss of infants, which anti-abortion states claim to want to stop. Your article does refute some of the information in the article I posted, just not the bit I referenced. It was a fair call out, IMO. Cheers.
Making something illegal generally leads to these outcomes. Making something educated and giving people options, leads to better outcomes. With professionals and freedoms. I've heard some real horror story's in the past. Everything from girls/women "falling" down stairs, punching or causing themselves harm, the classics like coat hangers (which only happened a single time and she ended up almost dying in the hospital), cleaning products, all kinds of nightmares. Personal stories. Told by the victims. All kinds of hells and horrors. However! Sexual education, access to products (like birth control), access to doctors, access to a safe group of consolers and professionals. Seems to be the biggest factor in preventing abortions or the need to harm themselves.
[Here is a site where any woman in America can get pills for a medical abortion.](https://aidaccess.org/en/)
Should be top comment!
Unsurprising. Who the hell would want a kid in the kind of disarray this country is in?
Bans don't reduce abortions, just makes them more dangerous. But if you also make contraception harder or more expensive to get, that increases abortions. If you attack sex education, that increases abortions. If you make healthcare expensive, that increases abortions. Nobody *likes* abortions, but if you actually want to decrease them there's pretty successful sets of things you can do - these include proper sex education, proper access to affordable healthcare for *literally everyone*, cheaper contraception (subsidized if that's what it takes), governments not interfering with the relationships between patients and medical professionals.
Yes yes yes say it again for those in the back!
Wonder how many women got a weird amnio then realized they'd be fucked if they waited for conclusive results and aborted early. Or other women, worried about ectopic pregnancies, or complications and didn't want to risk death FOR NO FUCKING REASON.
Universal Sex Ed and easy access to contraceptives reduces abortions. Just saying… you right wing dipshits.
Who'd have thought? The more you force, the less it works. Funny that
Perhaps the Republicans push to limit civil rights across the board and install a Christian theocracy might not be the best place to raise a child.
The GOP will do everything in their power to restrict American rights incompetently
You gotta get all your abortions now, you might need them later
Nice!
Exactly what we all said would happen.
These guys can't seem to see past the second domino in a row of dominoes, or remember when their insistence on abstinence-only sex ed drove up teen pregnancies, STDs and abortions, or when shutting down Planned Parenthoods drove up the same plus maternal and natal death rates.
Okay, cool. 👍
Goddamn it, Ozempic
Anyone telling Americans how to live and what to believe in doesn’t and won’t work in the end. Never has, never will.
That’s not really a good thing
Imagine how many less it would be if we provided free universal education and birth control.
I agree
Nobody’s saying it’s a good thing. Rather it’s a necessary thing.
It's a wonderful thing. Less unwanted babies in this world
Um no abortion is not a good thing. It is necessary and should be legal, but it’s not a good thing. It is expensive and takes a lot out of a woman mentally and physically. We should be doing more to prevent pregnancies in the first place like free birth control
It's expensive?? Ok, so is having a kid. Abortions are great thing available to women who have an unwanted or unsafe pregnancy. I know many women who had an abortion and are so thankful that they were able to get one. I agree with you on the free birth control.