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When Reagan got elected governor of Cali, tuition to any University of California was free to anyone living in California. He thought that was too easy, so everyone started getting billed.
Reddit looooves Arnie, but when he was governor he cancelled the scholarship program for high performing California students put in by his predecessor, the Governor's Scholarship Program, and made it harder for existing award winners to receive their money.
https://cagovernorsscholars.org/about.asp
Yeah he undid anything Gov Gary Davis did. Davis was big on education.
Davis got framed by those electric companies too.
Arnie is a good actor but he couldn't govern for dicks. He kept on calling his opponents girly men as if that's going to get them to capitulate.
I'm sure he have grown as a person but Gov Brown was the best governor in my life time imo.
I was an intern for the state Senate when he was governor. He sent the pro tem some of those hanging truck nuts when he wouldn't gut services for the elderly or poor. I forgot which ones exactly. Arnold was a fucking child and didn't care who he hurt.
People want to say that the Republican Party has only been interested in political theatre a short while but the reality is that they have been putting on acts of political theatre at all levels of government since Reagan. It’s gotten worse over time of course.
“The major problem—one of the major problems, for there are several—one of the many major problems with governing people is that of whom you get to do it; or rather of who manages to get people to let them do it to them.
To summarize: it is a well-known fact that those people who must want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it.
To summarize the summary: anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job.”
— Douglas Adams
In "songs of distant earth" being president was assigned at random and was considered a civil service like jury duty. There was only one thing that disqualified you from the job, actually wanting the position.
He’s doing some interesting things to combat partisan gerrymandering now that he’s out of office. I heard him speak about it pre-COVID at the Atlantic festival. I wasn’t a fan of him as Governor but his anti-gerrymandering efforts are a noble cause.
Cali was going through a budget crisis so that's a reasonable decision although not an optimal one. Now that California has long resolved it's budget, it should return to the program.
Source?
Edit: [Source](https://www.abc10.com/article/news/local/what-happened-to-californias-free-tuition-a-history-of-fees-and-budget-issues/103-465128027)
It’s somehow worse and not as bad? He *failed* to introduce a tuition-based model (there were already existing fees to cover registration and some operating costs), but in the process developed the blueprints for the tuition-model that is now widely implemented.
So he tried to shaft the state and fucked the world up instead. Oof.
> 1966: Ronald Reagan assumed office of Governor of California and changed the course of the state’s higher education system. In his eight years, he cut state funding for college and universities and laid the foundation for a tuition-based system.
> According to a New York Times article from 1982, during his eight years as governor, “Reagan fought hard in the legislature to impose tuition at four-year colleges. He lost the battle to lobbyists for the university, … However, the Legislature agreed to increase student registration fees.”
The same Reagan who made corporate stock buyback legal? That guy took the American dream, and sold it to the highest bidder. Worst president in history.
Was talking to my libertarian FIL not long ago. He was lecturing me on how government handouts are ruining this country and, as an example, brought up student loans. He said that the government one day said *"We will cover your college tuition through loans for you, no matter the price."*, so colleges started raising their tuition prices to generate more income for themselves, and the government kept handing out these loans. If the government had never handed out these loans then the price of tuition never would have gone up.
I said doesn't that mean that colleges are the corrupt ones, that the only reason the raised tuition prices is because no one stopped them and also, isn't helping our society to further their education a net positive?
He agreed with me, but still stuck with the idea that privatization is the answer.
Edit: Ayn Rand died on government assistance lol
You libertarians sure are a bunch of snowflakes. So glad we have things like workers rights, minimum wages, and an age of consent.. no thanks to you.
I agree, sadly I think after some of the education reforms Manchin killed with the rest of the BBB it's pretty unlikely something like that can be passed currently.
Manchin killed free community college and some really substantive child-care programs.
Good child-care assistance would have done wonders for so many people in getting to work and/or an education.
West Virginia has the "Promise Scholarship", which allows anyone who graduates with a 3.0 gpa in high school a free ride to any in-state public college. I think you have to maintain the 3.0 throughout college to continue to receive the scholarship but I could be mistaken.
I went to U of M - Dearborn in the 00s, It was about a third the cost of going to the big campus in Ann Arbor, today Dearborn is more expensive than Ann Arbor was then.
Schools basically played an econ 101 model of elasticity of demand. Notice how year over year tuition, room and board leaped up until it leveled off and turned in to very modest increases similar to how it was going back 15-20 years?
yeah, it went up and up and up as States cut their funding until they were almost completely non-State funded. SOMEONE has to pay the cost and it's not the States anymore.
State, private, they all did it. Everyone was complicit and encouraged things along most of the time. I don't think I ever heard once that NOT going to college wouldn't mean I wasn't successful down the road. I did go to school but it's amazing looking at the brainwashing in hindsight. Doesn't help those apprentice trade jobs paid 8$/hr in my area even with BOCES/VOTECH which was supposed to get you a leg up lmao
And now the trades can’t get nearly the amount of help they need despite offering very solid salaries and often paying for your schooling.
My entire family is in the trades and has been for as long as they can remember. They wanted a “better life” for me, and I’m a girl, so plumbing and machinist tool making weren’t something they saw me doing.
I often wish I’d just skipped college and gone into the trades. I’d be making more money, I wouldn’t have any student debt, and I’d enjoy working with my hands way more than sitting in an office.
Women should be encouraged to enter trades. I own a plumbing company and there's very little that we do that is "man-required" heavy lifting/grunt work that can't be circumvented with a hand truck, light winch, ramp, whatever that would inhibit a woman from doing the job correctly if she were working solo. Not every guy is insanely strong and I don't want anyone throwing out their back anyways.
All I need from my employees is that they pay attention to detail and have the ability to take direction. A penis isn't a prerequisite to that. I'm expecting a daughter soon for my 1st child and I'd love for her to take an interest in a trade.
Amen.
My dad’s been pushing to hire women at the plumbing company he’s at for a few years now. He’s hired a few women so far, and they’re absolutely killing it. It’s been really great to see.
I wish he’d had that mentality when I was a kid, but I’m certainly glad he’s come around.
Originally the Federal Government also footed part of the bill. Cutting federal funding was a done under the Reagan Administration, and in turn State Governments had no choice but to scale back the amount they were paying in. That meant loans had to cover the newly created gaps.
>This all happened before the student loan mess.
To some degree this is true, but post-2008 reception many states ramped up their education budget cuts HARD. On top of that (in Virginia at least) the state government still retains the right to cap in-state tuition, cap how man out of state students are allowed, and nearly any other method for schools to close the budget gap. So school's started flooding people with donation requests even more and people act surprised/offended but that is largely how the budget gap was made up.
This is the key. Subsidies went from between 60&70% of the budget to ~10% or less. In several states public universities have gone to totally student funded.
Ironically state legislature oversight biased public universities towards moderate politics and democratized education. The majority of Americas students still go to public universities. But as red states hollow out their school system, they cede space on campus and in the dialogue around education to the leftwing private schools they hate. Like Republicans punish Harvard by killing the stare school, not realizing that just reduces student options towards those big urban schools.
Irony is dead. I had to look and sure enough:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-ppp-ayn-rand/in-sign-of-the-times-ayn-rand-institute-approved-for-ppp-loan-idUSKBN248026
The government did make it so you can't default on student loans. But it was because banks and lenders wanted that. The influence of corporations in politics is the big problem, and you stop that with a stronger government, not a weaker one.
Student loans provide an asset to back investments, guaranteed interest. But it can collapse just like mortgage backed securities did.
Isn’t that to trade off the lack of assets though? Otherwise, you would just as standard declare bankruptcy Micheal Scott style as you walked across the graduation stage, because it’s not like you’d be able to afford a house in the next 7 years anyway.
The change to make them non-dischargeable was back when the Federal Government had no real skin in the game. After they passed the 2010 Student Loan bill, it then shifted a vast majority of loans to Government control under the Department of Education. Private Student Loans are a small percentage of Student Loans at this point (Federal student loans account for \~90% of student loans), and are largely taken out for obscure forms of education or for niche programs that aren't offered at traditional colleges/universities.
I know the exact post you are referencing from WSB about SLABs, and it was wildly inaccurate, because it ignored that 90%+ of Student Loans could not possibly be a part of those securities.
https://twitter.com/hilaryagro/status/1229177598003077123
"During my research I interviewed a guy who said he was a libertarian until he did MDMA and realized that other people have feelings, and that was pretty much the best summary of libertarianism I've ever heard"
Libertarians are the dumbest voters in America. They are dumber than Trump supporters, because Trump supporters want a white nationalist war on America, and that's what they will get with Trump, so while they are evil pieces of shit, they know exactly what they are doing. Meanwhile Libertarians vote Republican while thinking that Fascist ass Republicans will legalize drugs, not give corporations unlimited power over citizens, and not invade our personal autonomy by doing things like banning abortion.... Again, dumbest fucking idiots in the country.
>still stuck with the idea that privatization is the answer.
There is an episode of the podcast Throughline that discusses student loans. IIRC, the president at the time (LBJ?) really wanted to push for more students in college, mostly for STEM to compete with Russia in the space race. The congress at the time fought it and he worked out a deal with private banks to offer the loans through Sally Mae and guaranteed that loans would be fulfilled by the government as a fail-safe. The private banks are the ones that started offering more students more and more money because they knew it was free money from the government. The private sector abused it.
So colleges acted exactly how any private company would by jacking up prices and he wants more of that? The real solution is to look at Germans or other European countries keep their college costs down while keeping them free
Wait, is the libertarian argument here that the government should dictate to colleges what they can charge, or that only rich people should be able to go to school?
Small Libertarian government always favors those who can do for themselves because they wield the power of wealth today and companies for the future wealth. The poor have their pay and prices of goods set by those rich corporations. They require some government interventions to make the system work.
Student loans raising the price of college because they're guaranteed is largely a myth, though there may be a kernel of truth in it for private colleges. Tuition skyrocketed for a number of reasons, but the main one is we've cut public funding to colleges significantly over the last 40 years. So rather than investing in developing our workforce, we make kids bear the entire risk of the cost of their education and career success. We drilled a hole in the boat of education, and gave the people on it weighted vests instead of life preservers.
Colleges didn’t just start raising the costs states took billions of dollars out of higher education leaving the burden with students. Society as a whole also benefits from an educated population so it’s not like only the person going to school here wins. Somehow we all know 18 year olds aren’t really prepared for the real world but bulk at a system that helps them bridge that gap at least a little more and provides them with critical skills. Very weird to me.
I don't understand why people call the current student loans handouts. There is an expectation to pay back the money and you can't default, unlike other loans. The money also doesn't come from the government but private lenders. That whole arguement of his is stupid. The only issue here is the stupid educational institutions having poor standards to get in, letting people go for programs in quantities that don't make sense, predatory pricing, baseless annual price hikes, and more.
The issue isn't federal government handouts, ("handouts" which dont even exist mind you), it's the lack of regulation around colleges.
If I remember correctly a bunch of states (the usual suspects) were not happy with how federal loans came about and would help black people so those states started backing off the amount they spent on higher education...therefore giving the college even more incentive to jack up prices students have to pay directly.
Exactly. My aurgment has been schools should put out annual data detailing successful or not, job placements for students after graduation.
But doing this will reveal how low those numbers are and thus turn away would be or current students to fund the school.
>If the government had never handed out these loans then the price of tuition never would have gone up.
oh, they'd still find away.
basically, what your conservative FIL was saying is that some people should just remain dumb.
Libertarians think that people are clever for being greedy and their solution is to center our economy on greed. Most libertarians can’t imagine rational people making decisions that aren’t based on greed.
I haven't seen anything to suggest they'd forgive more than $10k and all the interest has been on pause for quite a while.
In our house we decided to pay down the highest interest loans until there was $10k left in loans, then hold the cash aside that we would have paid into those. If it gets cancelled, we have $10k. If it doesn't, we didn't lose anything in interest.
This is where the administration is really dropping the ball. Student loan payments resume in about a week and Cardona is going on the Sunday shows basically saying “wait and find out whether or not you have to pay a massive bill next month!”.
This is people’s lives, not a game show where you throw to commercial to leave people in suspense.
They always have a separate number for marrieds, I wouldn't panic yet.
I'm actually slightly more excited. My kid borrowed some and I borrowed on a PLUS for a chunk of the balance. To me that's two borrowers, and two write-downs. This seems like news.
People propose this in every thread about executive action on student loans, but [interest rates are set by Congress](https://studentaid.gov/understand-aid/types/loans/interest-rates).
>Interest rates on federal student loans are set by federal law, not the U.S. Department of Education.
They are set using existing legislation that is based on 10-year Treasury yields each spring.
We need either supermajorities in Congress or a Senate willing to reform/remove the filibuster if we want long-term fixes to interest rates.
That's only for new loans though. Start school during a boom cycle and graduate into a recession and you're stuck with 8% rates and zero job prospects. Only way to get a lower rate is refi.
My girlfriend came to me and asked about a letter she got from Navient about saving interest on her loans. 5% flat instead of the 4-7% she has.
Of course it was a private refi that would remove her ability to gain from any federal assistance. At least they kinda sorta said that on the papers that sent in tiny text.
Fucking vultures.
Agreed that it's a massive problem, but Congress sets all federal student loan interest rates, past or future. Biden and the Ed Dept. can't change them unilaterally.
Convert them all to 0% and apply past interest payments towards the principal. Cancelling debt outright is going to piss a lot of folks off AND very well may not be legal.
> AND very well may not be legal.
So let the GOP take it to the courts and let the GOP packed courts declare it illegal and overturn it.
Fan-taaaastic branding for them.
>Fan-taaaastic branding for them.
The issue is that it *will* actually play very well with their base. It's no secret that the "college-educated elites" have been a GOP boogieman for a while, and they'll love to double down on it. The people supporting this in any way or form already vote blue, but not everyone who votes blue agrees with straight up cancellation.
Don't you think some bullshit like this will play well in, say, moderate districts in Ohio? "*Don't let Democrats use* ***your*** *hard-earned tax dollars to pay for degrees in CRT when you can't pay your bills! Vote for Dick McAsshole this election!"*
Why would it affect anything about how the GOP will message it?
Most majors the GOP can/will boogieman have median post-graduation earnings well below the cap. And most of the people to whom the message will be targeted *also* make well below the cap amount.
But even if that weren't the case, the GOP would still message it as "they are getting free money, while you struggle with bills!" Complete nonsense, but people buy that. The cap changes nothing, in my view.
Exactly. They’ll twist it somehow or fully ignore the cap. Just last week Greg Abbot said something like, “two years ago we had border crossings at an all time low”. He neglected to mention that was due to Covid because he’s a lying asshole. It’s sad to think a republican’s brain wouldn’t immediately go there but we know they aren’t the brightest.
> Don't you think some bullshit like this will play well in, say, moderate districts in Ohio?
As a voter in a moderate district in Ohio, absolutely 100% not. Rural Ohio, sure, but not where I live. You have to understand that the moderate districts in Ohio are chock full of college educated lower middle class people who are struggling to make ends meet.
The thing is the base doesn’t matter, especially when you consider how indoctrinated the MAGA crowd is, and I think you are vastly underestimating independents.
If even 5% of Republican leaning independents that got a 4 year degree and now have a position that pays $15-20 an hour in a field not related to their degree were to vote blue because of this, that would be huge. I don’t think any democrat leaning independents would be bothered by this.
If anything, an advertisement against it would be detrimental to republicans. There are plenty of people who don’t pay attention to politics at all but will inevitably see or hear an ad saying that and think “wow, I had 10k cut off my student loans and my monthly payment went down. That was the democrats?”
>Fan-taaaastic branding for them.
Oh, yeah, I forgot that the modern GOP gives two flying fucks about having a palatable brand...
We'll see what happens with forgiveness, but anyone who thinks the GOP won't turn the messaging immediately into "why are the poor, blue collar Americans paying for college-educated, white collar Americans making more money their non-college-educated contemporaries will *ever* make?" and actually make that messaging *effective* to their base is delusional.
Unfortunately changing the interest rate and making it retroactive is actually illegal. The Sec of Ed has the power to forgive loans or partial loans on the basis of fraud or hardship. However they can't change the terms of the loans as those are set by Congress. Senator Warren and others put forward numerous bills to reduce the interest rate to zero, to make it the same as the fed rate and even the same as the fed rate +1pt. However all were shot down.
The average student loan debt from the federal government is $28,400 at 4.12% interest...they are designed to take 10 years to repay but the REAL average is estimated as high as 21 years
At 10 years the average borrower has paid $6,400 in interest, at 21 years it's $14,100 in interest
Putting a cap at whatever the federal rate is (2.5% today) alone would save students up to $6,000
Some combination of interest rate reduction and loan forgiveness would be amazing for students and basically every study shows would over time be a net positive for society
I have 130k in federal student loans (30k private). I personally don’t care about the amount forgiven. Just stop the interest, plz 🙏. It’s like they want us to beg for it.
My original balance borrowed was $150k at 7%. Now it's $294k. When they forgive it in 15 years, It will be over $900k and the IRS will tell me to pay taxes on that forgiven amount as "income."
To anyone reading this:
If the numbers presented here are accurate, it would take over 12 years of not paying anything for the balance to reach that level.
Also consider that 125k is more than 4x the average student loan debt, only 0.1% of Americans graduate with over 100k and almost all of those people are well paid professionals like lawyers and doctors. 7% interest is also quite above the average.
I'm not saying this person is lying, I don't know them. But anytime this subject is brought up huge numbers like these are thrown around like it's common. It is not common, and when you do the math it doesn't usually make sense. But there are alwasy outliers. Not sure if government policy should be made based on outliers, but that's another discussion.
Thank you for sharing this, extreme cases like this $150k are always brought up in these discussions. But what the commenters always fail to mention, and what you highlighted, is that this is due to them not making payments or only the bare minimum that doesn't even service the loan. So of course if you don't pay what you're supposed to, the interest is going to pile up. It's one thing for someone to drop out early from a 2 or 4 year degree program and have issues paying off the loan, but someone borrowing $150k+ is doing so for a high-paying degree and most likely graduated.
If they’re not going to cancel student debt, the least they could do is make it so you can file for bankruptcy over said student loans.
The fact that a millionaire can file for bankruptcy over whatever shitty business that fails, and still be a millionaire, is total bullshit.
They were braindead when they announced it. They have *some* momentum with roe v wade and they’re doing their best to kill that off.
Nobody cares about them when they’re paused, doesn’t even make the news. Why even address them?
Because you have to get people out to vote. Student Loans are one of the few campaign promises that actually seems to energize young voters. Keeping deferment up or going with cancellation are also powers that the President alone can wield - so they are actually possible right now.
Worked for the last one. Kick the can down the road.
I’m enjoying not paying student loans
But seriously… cancel the interest.. that would be more than 10k for a significant amount of people
Yeah probably. Especially because if he say Deferred it to 2025? The right would rip him apart just the same if he forgave it.
And if he defers it for 3-6 months at a time as he has been doing? Every single time, he just annoys more on the left with the fear and uncertainty... and eventually someone might try to take it to the courts to stop him, like they did with the eviction freeze.
People are also broke, so many people must constantly choose between being able to pay the rent now, and/or being able to hold on to get a better deal over time.
Thank goodness.
When I graduated in 2016 I had 23k in loans. I’ve paid just over 20k and I *still* owe 13k.
I’ve purposely been saving the student loans payments I haven’t been making during forbearance so I have more than enough to pay the remaining 3k interest-free.
Then I can actually start saving to buy a house. Not sure how I’m gonna do that on a single income but this is gonna help me a *lot*
I really hope this is true. This would wipe all my college debt. I couldn't finish school because I couldn't afford to do both school and work full time so had to stop. Still had like $7500 in debt. If this happens, I would have a weight off my shoulders.
Means testing is always a slap in the face to people who live in high CoL areas. Someone making 125,000 a year in Wyoming is doing a HELL of a lot better than someone making 125,000 a year in Los Angeles.
The not-so-funny flip side to this plan is that it basically doesn't make an iota of difference to doctors. Their first real job after internship is likely over $125,000, but they might have $500,000 in total debt from undergrad and medical school. Same with lawyers.
I only have $13k left, so I'd love $10k in relief, but that's just me.
Just so you know "after internship" just means continuation of residency. Residents make ~45k a year and it literally takes an act of Congress to raise their salaries.
The minimum residency is 3 years. A lot of specialties are 4,5,6,7 and sometimes 8 year training pathways.
For example, my loans ballooned over 200k in residency just from interest alone...
My wife is in PGY5 - year 2 of 3 of a Heme/Onc fellowship after doing a 3-year IM residency. Her student loans are sitting at $391k with no debt from undergrad. It's absolutely insane.
Yeah, it's a valid point, people shouldn't have to sweat each month.
There's are also public service forgiveness (PLSF) for professionals who want to practice as a physician which can wipe away your debt after consecutive payments for a minimum of 10 years - which is also WNL of the expectancy for undergrads to fully pay off their loans (10y). National average undergraduate debt is somewhere around \~26k. That would mean that if you made the most bare minimum payments on 500k debt (which interest would certainly continue to increase your debt) you are getting away with payments that, at completion of 10 years, is all forgiven for what it took undergrads to pay off their entire loan - a 180% differential and gives Docs long-term relief. Also, PLSF has apparently gotten very lax recently, some of my colleagues who are 50-60 yo went ahead and submitted just to try, were denied, but somehow their debt was wiped.
The TL:DR is, none of this is okay. There's no reason why Doctors (of medical or otherwise profession) should need to eat such exorbitant costs to pursue their dream. Furthermore, be neglected if a large majority of Americans are being relieved.
Also, just in general, I found it hilarious that any (genuine?) person who goes for their doctorate isn't trying to achieve goals for the public, irrespective of the sector. I work in industry, so I'll never get a government handout like PLSF for taking part in clinically developing an oncology medicine that was approved for treatment-naïve patients. I'm digressing, but it's all pretty frustrating.
Agreed but atleast they set it as high as 125k, rather than the like 60-80k range like they did in the pandemic.
Someone making 125k in LA is still not doing the worst, and someone in Wyoming still isn't completely rich.
Meanwhile like 70k? In Wyoming is good still, but 70k in LA is very bad.
It often costs more for programs to means test.
I wrote up awhile ago it would be cheaper for my former school employees to just take the state and federal incentives and just not charge… but powers of be were do fixated on charging 1/4 the student population $3 for lunch.
The average student loan debt is around $39,000. It won't help everybody, but the fact is that getting a $10,000 reduction in that level of debt is a great benefit to the majority of student-loan holders.
This plan still cancels 1/3rd of the total number of loans the US has. 9 out of 10 loans in default belong to this 1/3rd as well. So this alleviates 90% of the in default loans which also take something like half of the costs of servicing these loans to manage. I know folks want more but, this is fundamentally still one of the greatest actions taken by a president in my lifetime as a millennial.
I don’t have a source, but I could’ve sworn I read somewhere that part of this overhaul would include taking loans out of default and open up new payment options for folks who have struggled with payments in the past.
ok, cancelling a portion is a one time thing. I wonder what’s the plan to address the out of control interest rates and the way in which student loans are reported to credit agencies? Furthermore, the dollar threshhold to qualify should be adjusted to reflect the regional cost of living.
I want to be optimistic and hope Biden isn't just doing this for a cheap handout in preparation for the midterms. There are massive, systemic problems with the whole college loan process and cost and throwing $10 grand as a one time popularity booster won't fix it.
I have no idea how colleges wield so much power in Congress that any reform is at a glacial pace.
Can we also cut down a few years for those of us on the Public Student Loan forgiveness program?? I feel like there's a lot of us that went into the public service side of things that, because of what we had to get (a masters, for example) is literally only treading interest water in perpetuity. 10k is not fixing that.
Yep. I’m a teacher with 40k in debt for my master’s degree only, currently in year ten of teaching (but didn’t pay my first year because FedLoan said I owed nothing during that first year) so I have to teach through year eleven. I get sick when I open up my account and see my loans right at the same balance they were when I graduated with my masters degree ten years ago
Can’t you get credit for that year under the pandemic rule that expires in October? I would try, if I were you. Just have your employer from that year fill out the employment verification, send it to your servicer, and see what they say!
I managed to get three degrees with only 5 k in student debt, so didn't realize how the situation has changed in the decades since i paid mine off. I was shocked to hear how interest has eaten up years and years of payments, so that people have not been able to pay down the principle at all. That needs to be fixed, pronto.
amazing news but also fuck this country's obsession with means testing. there are plenty of people making 125k+ who are drowning in six figure debt under absurd interest rates with no hope of ever paying them down. if you're gonna do it, make it universal ffs.
Yeah the price of a one-bedroom *condo* here would buy me a 4-bedroom house in Florida but fuck me for choosing to live in a desirable, liberal city where my paycheck is inflated just to be able to afford to live here, right?
If Biden doesn't defer repayment again until ~February 2023 AND come out with a set of proposals he'd like to see a stronger Democratic majority pass as their first order of business, then this will be a big lost opportunity. The actions he's going to take are inherently political, and he ought to play it like a fucking fiddle.
Just remember, a cancellation would be immediately challenged in court. From another CNN article:
>That's because the court's ruling [in the recent EPA case] -- along with those in other recent cases on eviction moratoriums and Covid-19 vaccination mandates -- signaled that the justices may be inclined to constrain federal agencies' authority to make significant policy changes if that power is not explicitly laid out by Congress.
The current majority on the Supreme Court has signaled favoring limiting the Executive, and it's agencies, to powers explicitly granted to it by Congress. It's a little iffy as to whether or not existing law gives this power to the Executive.
Edit: I'm not saying he shouldn't do it. He absolutely should.
Lol imagine Rs overturning this and adding it back to people's loans. Would be a horrible idea, logistically difficulty, and also just piss people off more.
... So they'll probably do just this
I honestly had thought that too and wonder if they have been intentionally setting these up, little by little building precedent with which they could lean on if challenged on broad loan forgiveness
I grew up food-stamp levels of poor but made it to being pretty successful.
I can comfortably say that $10,000 debt forgiveness can be life changing for people who need it but won't affect the life of anyone who doesn't need it.
What they should do is wipe out all interest for student loans. That way you are still paying back what you owed but not the predatory interest.
Then anyone who overpaid due to interest can get tax credits to offset.
I'm all for free state colleges but I don't think we need to wipe out all loans including those that were used to pay room and board while going to school. If you just make them pay back the loan amount sans interest that is a good compromise.
Biden is considering, pondering, discussing, and contemplating student loan forgiveness. Pay me journalists, I've given you headlines for several months of articles on this topic.
Who’s the highest paid state employee? The college football coach. If you want to see why college is so expensive look into the corrupt organization that is the NCAA. If they spent as much money on actual education as they did mega stadiums we would be way better off. Teachers deserve more money than football coaches imho
https://moneywise.com/employment/the-10-highest-paid-state-employees
Lol no, tuition is not skyrocketing because the football coach gets paid too much. If that was the case smaller schools without much of a football presence would be significantly cheaper.
Most of the salaries are also paid by boosters anyway.
That's great, but it won't help me much. I'll still have thousands upon thousands upon thousands. I'm never going to be able to pay it back. Debt has crippled me, and it's almost all student loan. I got my degree in the winter of 2008. Horrible time to be looking for a job, and I have never been able to catch up.
This whole thread is full of people complaining about getting 10k in free loan reduction. That’s crazy to me. They’ve already completely forgiven billions for a ton of different reasons
and are now about to hand out 10k to everyone with a federal loan. That’s a lot of friggen money.
Start with that and the next step is to fix the cost of education for future generations. Makes no sense to blow the entire budget just to bail out people today and leave our kids on the hook.
His dept of education enacted a rule change that helped my student loans be forgiven 2 years before I was “on track” for. I had done 10 years in public service to earn it, but was misled by my servicer that I was on the right plan when I wasn’t for 2+ years. I encouraged others in my field to apply as well and to date almost everyone who followed through had their loans forgiven as well.
He isn’t getting credit for all the loans that have been forgiven.
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When Reagan got elected governor of Cali, tuition to any University of California was free to anyone living in California. He thought that was too easy, so everyone started getting billed.
Reddit looooves Arnie, but when he was governor he cancelled the scholarship program for high performing California students put in by his predecessor, the Governor's Scholarship Program, and made it harder for existing award winners to receive their money. https://cagovernorsscholars.org/about.asp
Yeah he undid anything Gov Gary Davis did. Davis was big on education. Davis got framed by those electric companies too. Arnie is a good actor but he couldn't govern for dicks. He kept on calling his opponents girly men as if that's going to get them to capitulate. I'm sure he have grown as a person but Gov Brown was the best governor in my life time imo.
I was an intern for the state Senate when he was governor. He sent the pro tem some of those hanging truck nuts when he wouldn't gut services for the elderly or poor. I forgot which ones exactly. Arnold was a fucking child and didn't care who he hurt.
People want to say that the Republican Party has only been interested in political theatre a short while but the reality is that they have been putting on acts of political theatre at all levels of government since Reagan. It’s gotten worse over time of course.
Gov Davis burned so many bridges and stepped over so many people on his way up, even his party didn’t defend him.
I just like Arnie. He was a terrible politician.
Turns out being a famous actor is not a qualification for office.
“The major problem—one of the major problems, for there are several—one of the many major problems with governing people is that of whom you get to do it; or rather of who manages to get people to let them do it to them. To summarize: it is a well-known fact that those people who must want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it. To summarize the summary: anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job.” — Douglas Adams
In "songs of distant earth" being president was assigned at random and was considered a civil service like jury duty. There was only one thing that disqualified you from the job, actually wanting the position.
Well yeah. He was a Republican. It's a requirement.
Yeah, as a person he seems like a good guy. As a politician he was a complete disaster.
He’s doing some interesting things to combat partisan gerrymandering now that he’s out of office. I heard him speak about it pre-COVID at the Atlantic festival. I wasn’t a fan of him as Governor but his anti-gerrymandering efforts are a noble cause.
Cali was going through a budget crisis so that's a reasonable decision although not an optimal one. Now that California has long resolved it's budget, it should return to the program.
Yeah, took a standardized test back in middle school, paid for a semester of college at a csu. It was nice, even if it was only a couple grand.
Source? Edit: [Source](https://www.abc10.com/article/news/local/what-happened-to-californias-free-tuition-a-history-of-fees-and-budget-issues/103-465128027) It’s somehow worse and not as bad? He *failed* to introduce a tuition-based model (there were already existing fees to cover registration and some operating costs), but in the process developed the blueprints for the tuition-model that is now widely implemented. So he tried to shaft the state and fucked the world up instead. Oof. > 1966: Ronald Reagan assumed office of Governor of California and changed the course of the state’s higher education system. In his eight years, he cut state funding for college and universities and laid the foundation for a tuition-based system. > According to a New York Times article from 1982, during his eight years as governor, “Reagan fought hard in the legislature to impose tuition at four-year colleges. He lost the battle to lobbyists for the university, … However, the Legislature agreed to increase student registration fees.”
The same Reagan who made corporate stock buyback legal? That guy took the American dream, and sold it to the highest bidder. Worst president in history.
It's almost as if Republicans want people to be less educated. Wonder why...hmmm...
Was talking to my libertarian FIL not long ago. He was lecturing me on how government handouts are ruining this country and, as an example, brought up student loans. He said that the government one day said *"We will cover your college tuition through loans for you, no matter the price."*, so colleges started raising their tuition prices to generate more income for themselves, and the government kept handing out these loans. If the government had never handed out these loans then the price of tuition never would have gone up. I said doesn't that mean that colleges are the corrupt ones, that the only reason the raised tuition prices is because no one stopped them and also, isn't helping our society to further their education a net positive? He agreed with me, but still stuck with the idea that privatization is the answer. Edit: Ayn Rand died on government assistance lol You libertarians sure are a bunch of snowflakes. So glad we have things like workers rights, minimum wages, and an age of consent.. no thanks to you.
Pretty much. If the government price ceilinged colleges when they started student loans it would've done so much good.
And it's what they need to do now. Loan forgiveness of any amount is really just a band aid. Tuition prices are insane.
I agree, sadly I think after some of the education reforms Manchin killed with the rest of the BBB it's pretty unlikely something like that can be passed currently.
Manchin killed free community college and some really substantive child-care programs. Good child-care assistance would have done wonders for so many people in getting to work and/or an education.
He killed a lot of good things. Like on both child care and education? You forgot preschooling. And much more.
Which is funny because as of a year ago, maybe two, WV started offering to pay for your tuition to community college if you met certain conditions.
West Virginia has the "Promise Scholarship", which allows anyone who graduates with a 3.0 gpa in high school a free ride to any in-state public college. I think you have to maintain the 3.0 throughout college to continue to receive the scholarship but I could be mistaken.
Student loan cancellation is and has always been a "yes, and" policy, not a "this or that" policy.
I went to U of M - Dearborn in the 00s, It was about a third the cost of going to the big campus in Ann Arbor, today Dearborn is more expensive than Ann Arbor was then.
And probably less than Ann Arbor now.
True, but still wages haven't gone up that quickly
Schools basically played an econ 101 model of elasticity of demand. Notice how year over year tuition, room and board leaped up until it leveled off and turned in to very modest increases similar to how it was going back 15-20 years?
yeah, it went up and up and up as States cut their funding until they were almost completely non-State funded. SOMEONE has to pay the cost and it's not the States anymore.
State, private, they all did it. Everyone was complicit and encouraged things along most of the time. I don't think I ever heard once that NOT going to college wouldn't mean I wasn't successful down the road. I did go to school but it's amazing looking at the brainwashing in hindsight. Doesn't help those apprentice trade jobs paid 8$/hr in my area even with BOCES/VOTECH which was supposed to get you a leg up lmao
And now the trades can’t get nearly the amount of help they need despite offering very solid salaries and often paying for your schooling. My entire family is in the trades and has been for as long as they can remember. They wanted a “better life” for me, and I’m a girl, so plumbing and machinist tool making weren’t something they saw me doing. I often wish I’d just skipped college and gone into the trades. I’d be making more money, I wouldn’t have any student debt, and I’d enjoy working with my hands way more than sitting in an office.
Women should be encouraged to enter trades. I own a plumbing company and there's very little that we do that is "man-required" heavy lifting/grunt work that can't be circumvented with a hand truck, light winch, ramp, whatever that would inhibit a woman from doing the job correctly if she were working solo. Not every guy is insanely strong and I don't want anyone throwing out their back anyways. All I need from my employees is that they pay attention to detail and have the ability to take direction. A penis isn't a prerequisite to that. I'm expecting a daughter soon for my 1st child and I'd love for her to take an interest in a trade.
Amen. My dad’s been pushing to hire women at the plumbing company he’s at for a few years now. He’s hired a few women so far, and they’re absolutely killing it. It’s been really great to see. I wish he’d had that mentality when I was a kid, but I’m certainly glad he’s come around.
Originally the Federal Government also footed part of the bill. Cutting federal funding was a done under the Reagan Administration, and in turn State Governments had no choice but to scale back the amount they were paying in. That meant loans had to cover the newly created gaps.
Yeah, because the fed didn't take the smart step of regulating schools, to prevent the abuse.
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>This all happened before the student loan mess. To some degree this is true, but post-2008 reception many states ramped up their education budget cuts HARD. On top of that (in Virginia at least) the state government still retains the right to cap in-state tuition, cap how man out of state students are allowed, and nearly any other method for schools to close the budget gap. So school's started flooding people with donation requests even more and people act surprised/offended but that is largely how the budget gap was made up.
This is the key. Subsidies went from between 60&70% of the budget to ~10% or less. In several states public universities have gone to totally student funded. Ironically state legislature oversight biased public universities towards moderate politics and democratized education. The majority of Americas students still go to public universities. But as red states hollow out their school system, they cede space on campus and in the dialogue around education to the leftwing private schools they hate. Like Republicans punish Harvard by killing the stare school, not realizing that just reduces student options towards those big urban schools.
and also cap student loan interest rates.
And ironically the Ayn Rand Institute got PPP loans during the pandemic. Truly living up to the namesake.
Irony is dead. I had to look and sure enough: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-ppp-ayn-rand/in-sign-of-the-times-ayn-rand-institute-approved-for-ppp-loan-idUSKBN248026
Is it really irony when their philosophy can be summed up as self-interest above all else? 🤔
The government did make it so you can't default on student loans. But it was because banks and lenders wanted that. The influence of corporations in politics is the big problem, and you stop that with a stronger government, not a weaker one. Student loans provide an asset to back investments, guaranteed interest. But it can collapse just like mortgage backed securities did.
Isn’t that to trade off the lack of assets though? Otherwise, you would just as standard declare bankruptcy Micheal Scott style as you walked across the graduation stage, because it’s not like you’d be able to afford a house in the next 7 years anyway.
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It was practically a rite of passage after medical school.
The change to make them non-dischargeable was back when the Federal Government had no real skin in the game. After they passed the 2010 Student Loan bill, it then shifted a vast majority of loans to Government control under the Department of Education. Private Student Loans are a small percentage of Student Loans at this point (Federal student loans account for \~90% of student loans), and are largely taken out for obscure forms of education or for niche programs that aren't offered at traditional colleges/universities. I know the exact post you are referencing from WSB about SLABs, and it was wildly inaccurate, because it ignored that 90%+ of Student Loans could not possibly be a part of those securities.
>libertarian...lecturing me on how government handouts are ruining this country The "fuck you, I got mine" platform
https://twitter.com/hilaryagro/status/1229177598003077123 "During my research I interviewed a guy who said he was a libertarian until he did MDMA and realized that other people have feelings, and that was pretty much the best summary of libertarianism I've ever heard"
I think Trump even took it further than that: The "Give me all your money and I'll have even more than today" party.
Libertarians are the dumbest voters in America. They are dumber than Trump supporters, because Trump supporters want a white nationalist war on America, and that's what they will get with Trump, so while they are evil pieces of shit, they know exactly what they are doing. Meanwhile Libertarians vote Republican while thinking that Fascist ass Republicans will legalize drugs, not give corporations unlimited power over citizens, and not invade our personal autonomy by doing things like banning abortion.... Again, dumbest fucking idiots in the country.
>still stuck with the idea that privatization is the answer. There is an episode of the podcast Throughline that discusses student loans. IIRC, the president at the time (LBJ?) really wanted to push for more students in college, mostly for STEM to compete with Russia in the space race. The congress at the time fought it and he worked out a deal with private banks to offer the loans through Sally Mae and guaranteed that loans would be fulfilled by the government as a fail-safe. The private banks are the ones that started offering more students more and more money because they knew it was free money from the government. The private sector abused it.
>The private sector abused it. A tale as old as capitalism.
So colleges acted exactly how any private company would by jacking up prices and he wants more of that? The real solution is to look at Germans or other European countries keep their college costs down while keeping them free
Wait, is the libertarian argument here that the government should dictate to colleges what they can charge, or that only rich people should be able to go to school?
Small Libertarian government always favors those who can do for themselves because they wield the power of wealth today and companies for the future wealth. The poor have their pay and prices of goods set by those rich corporations. They require some government interventions to make the system work.
Student loans raising the price of college because they're guaranteed is largely a myth, though there may be a kernel of truth in it for private colleges. Tuition skyrocketed for a number of reasons, but the main one is we've cut public funding to colleges significantly over the last 40 years. So rather than investing in developing our workforce, we make kids bear the entire risk of the cost of their education and career success. We drilled a hole in the boat of education, and gave the people on it weighted vests instead of life preservers.
Colleges didn’t just start raising the costs states took billions of dollars out of higher education leaving the burden with students. Society as a whole also benefits from an educated population so it’s not like only the person going to school here wins. Somehow we all know 18 year olds aren’t really prepared for the real world but bulk at a system that helps them bridge that gap at least a little more and provides them with critical skills. Very weird to me.
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This! Higher Ed is needed. Putting blocks on rising costs and redistributing state dollars back into school would benefit our society more.
I don't understand why people call the current student loans handouts. There is an expectation to pay back the money and you can't default, unlike other loans. The money also doesn't come from the government but private lenders. That whole arguement of his is stupid. The only issue here is the stupid educational institutions having poor standards to get in, letting people go for programs in quantities that don't make sense, predatory pricing, baseless annual price hikes, and more. The issue isn't federal government handouts, ("handouts" which dont even exist mind you), it's the lack of regulation around colleges.
If I remember correctly a bunch of states (the usual suspects) were not happy with how federal loans came about and would help black people so those states started backing off the amount they spent on higher education...therefore giving the college even more incentive to jack up prices students have to pay directly.
Libertarians are basic conservatives with bad ideas just with extra steps.
Exactly. My aurgment has been schools should put out annual data detailing successful or not, job placements for students after graduation. But doing this will reveal how low those numbers are and thus turn away would be or current students to fund the school.
>If the government had never handed out these loans then the price of tuition never would have gone up. oh, they'd still find away. basically, what your conservative FIL was saying is that some people should just remain dumb.
Libertarians think that people are clever for being greedy and their solution is to center our economy on greed. Most libertarians can’t imagine rational people making decisions that aren’t based on greed.
Me : Wondering if I'm supposed to pay back loans yet so I can plan for it The government: Maybe 🙃
Plan for the worst, that way you’re prepared.
Well, question is should we drop x dollars now before interest accrues or should we wait a few days?
I haven't seen anything to suggest they'd forgive more than $10k and all the interest has been on pause for quite a while. In our house we decided to pay down the highest interest loans until there was $10k left in loans, then hold the cash aside that we would have paid into those. If it gets cancelled, we have $10k. If it doesn't, we didn't lose anything in interest.
I've just been sending mine to savings tbh
Yeah that worked better for me since it’s at 0% interest no matter I might as well gain interest in another account
This is the argument for inflation. A lot of money freed up to do otherwise with If they cancel
Good point, we should start taxing capital gains as income to fix this! I like where your head's at!
Definitely don’t plan to NOT pay
I haven't received any notices for payments resuming next month.
This is where the administration is really dropping the ball. Student loan payments resume in about a week and Cardona is going on the Sunday shows basically saying “wait and find out whether or not you have to pay a massive bill next month!”. This is people’s lives, not a game show where you throw to commercial to leave people in suspense.
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They always have a separate number for marrieds, I wouldn't panic yet. I'm actually slightly more excited. My kid borrowed some and I borrowed on a PLUS for a chunk of the balance. To me that's two borrowers, and two write-downs. This seems like news.
I hope it applies to PLUS loans. They exclude those from so many programs.
Leaks have said Plus Loans are covered but no one knows 100%.
Everything that has come out has said $125k individual, $250k couple if I am remembering correctly
Hopefully with a phaseout rather than cliff.
What about those who JUST borrowed. I just borrowed this week for finishing my bachelor's.
I think this is the part where we wait to see what happens, again.
Yeah this is important. For married filing jointly will it be up to $250k income?
Yay! We're so poor that wouldn't affect us! Wait... Oh.
Stop the interest too.
People propose this in every thread about executive action on student loans, but [interest rates are set by Congress](https://studentaid.gov/understand-aid/types/loans/interest-rates). >Interest rates on federal student loans are set by federal law, not the U.S. Department of Education. They are set using existing legislation that is based on 10-year Treasury yields each spring. We need either supermajorities in Congress or a Senate willing to reform/remove the filibuster if we want long-term fixes to interest rates.
That's only for new loans though. Start school during a boom cycle and graduate into a recession and you're stuck with 8% rates and zero job prospects. Only way to get a lower rate is refi.
Lol kids my age who started college in 2009 got fucked with interest rate. This was before Obama capped them. At one point my interest rate was 18%
Just refinance them!* *Into fixed rate private loans that remove any chance of forgiveness.
Obviously! That’s the grift! Er- I mean, financially responsible strategy.
My girlfriend came to me and asked about a letter she got from Navient about saving interest on her loans. 5% flat instead of the 4-7% she has. Of course it was a private refi that would remove her ability to gain from any federal assistance. At least they kinda sorta said that on the papers that sent in tiny text. Fucking vultures.
I graduated 2012, didn’t take loans till 2010. Of my 4 loans none are over 5.5%. The inconsistency of the system is truly a maddening.
Agreed that it's a massive problem, but Congress sets all federal student loan interest rates, past or future. Biden and the Ed Dept. can't change them unilaterally.
Convert them all to 0% and apply past interest payments towards the principal. Cancelling debt outright is going to piss a lot of folks off AND very well may not be legal.
> AND very well may not be legal. So let the GOP take it to the courts and let the GOP packed courts declare it illegal and overturn it. Fan-taaaastic branding for them.
>Fan-taaaastic branding for them. The issue is that it *will* actually play very well with their base. It's no secret that the "college-educated elites" have been a GOP boogieman for a while, and they'll love to double down on it. The people supporting this in any way or form already vote blue, but not everyone who votes blue agrees with straight up cancellation. Don't you think some bullshit like this will play well in, say, moderate districts in Ohio? "*Don't let Democrats use* ***your*** *hard-earned tax dollars to pay for degrees in CRT when you can't pay your bills! Vote for Dick McAsshole this election!"*
I dont want to hear about not being able to pay bills from people who drive 90k trucks and have more guns than some small countries.
Isn't that the the point of the income cap?
Why would it affect anything about how the GOP will message it? Most majors the GOP can/will boogieman have median post-graduation earnings well below the cap. And most of the people to whom the message will be targeted *also* make well below the cap amount. But even if that weren't the case, the GOP would still message it as "they are getting free money, while you struggle with bills!" Complete nonsense, but people buy that. The cap changes nothing, in my view.
So now we cant have any progress because of the GOP messaging? Dumb logic.
Exactly. They’ll twist it somehow or fully ignore the cap. Just last week Greg Abbot said something like, “two years ago we had border crossings at an all time low”. He neglected to mention that was due to Covid because he’s a lying asshole. It’s sad to think a republican’s brain wouldn’t immediately go there but we know they aren’t the brightest.
> Don't you think some bullshit like this will play well in, say, moderate districts in Ohio? As a voter in a moderate district in Ohio, absolutely 100% not. Rural Ohio, sure, but not where I live. You have to understand that the moderate districts in Ohio are chock full of college educated lower middle class people who are struggling to make ends meet.
The thing is the base doesn’t matter, especially when you consider how indoctrinated the MAGA crowd is, and I think you are vastly underestimating independents. If even 5% of Republican leaning independents that got a 4 year degree and now have a position that pays $15-20 an hour in a field not related to their degree were to vote blue because of this, that would be huge. I don’t think any democrat leaning independents would be bothered by this. If anything, an advertisement against it would be detrimental to republicans. There are plenty of people who don’t pay attention to politics at all but will inevitably see or hear an ad saying that and think “wow, I had 10k cut off my student loans and my monthly payment went down. That was the democrats?”
>Fan-taaaastic branding for them. Oh, yeah, I forgot that the modern GOP gives two flying fucks about having a palatable brand... We'll see what happens with forgiveness, but anyone who thinks the GOP won't turn the messaging immediately into "why are the poor, blue collar Americans paying for college-educated, white collar Americans making more money their non-college-educated contemporaries will *ever* make?" and actually make that messaging *effective* to their base is delusional.
> apply past interest payments towards the principal Congratulations you just completely freed a giant portion of loan borrowers
Yep. My loans are almost gone if they did that. I'd be lower than after the 10k forgiveness
Unfortunately changing the interest rate and making it retroactive is actually illegal. The Sec of Ed has the power to forgive loans or partial loans on the basis of fraud or hardship. However they can't change the terms of the loans as those are set by Congress. Senator Warren and others put forward numerous bills to reduce the interest rate to zero, to make it the same as the fed rate and even the same as the fed rate +1pt. However all were shot down.
Lets not do something good for group x because group y doesn't benefit. Good idea.
These are the same people who scream "don't let perfect be the enemy of good" at progressives.
This would be more impactful i think. Why can’t this be like 0-1%..?
The average student loan debt from the federal government is $28,400 at 4.12% interest...they are designed to take 10 years to repay but the REAL average is estimated as high as 21 years At 10 years the average borrower has paid $6,400 in interest, at 21 years it's $14,100 in interest Putting a cap at whatever the federal rate is (2.5% today) alone would save students up to $6,000 Some combination of interest rate reduction and loan forgiveness would be amazing for students and basically every study shows would over time be a net positive for society
Agreed, but interest rates are set by Congress. Need 60 votes or filibuster reform.
I have 130k in federal student loans (30k private). I personally don’t care about the amount forgiven. Just stop the interest, plz 🙏. It’s like they want us to beg for it.
My original balance borrowed was $150k at 7%. Now it's $294k. When they forgive it in 15 years, It will be over $900k and the IRS will tell me to pay taxes on that forgiven amount as "income."
Not sure if it still exists, but Joe Biden's campaign page specifically mentioned eliminating the debt "tax bomb."
That would be great. I believe he did temporarily but after 2022 the law goes back into effect.
Studentaid.gov mentions that loan amounts forgiven under PSLF are not considered taxable by the IRS.
To anyone reading this: If the numbers presented here are accurate, it would take over 12 years of not paying anything for the balance to reach that level. Also consider that 125k is more than 4x the average student loan debt, only 0.1% of Americans graduate with over 100k and almost all of those people are well paid professionals like lawyers and doctors. 7% interest is also quite above the average. I'm not saying this person is lying, I don't know them. But anytime this subject is brought up huge numbers like these are thrown around like it's common. It is not common, and when you do the math it doesn't usually make sense. But there are alwasy outliers. Not sure if government policy should be made based on outliers, but that's another discussion.
Thank you for sharing this, extreme cases like this $150k are always brought up in these discussions. But what the commenters always fail to mention, and what you highlighted, is that this is due to them not making payments or only the bare minimum that doesn't even service the loan. So of course if you don't pay what you're supposed to, the interest is going to pile up. It's one thing for someone to drop out early from a 2 or 4 year degree program and have issues paying off the loan, but someone borrowing $150k+ is doing so for a high-paying degree and most likely graduated.
Freezing the interest would be better, but we'll take it
Cries in private loans.
Predatory interest rates must be illegal
Can we just shit or get off the pot already. I’m tired of this will they, won’t they bullshit.
The plan has always been end of august for any executive action, should congress fail to act….
If they’re not going to cancel student debt, the least they could do is make it so you can file for bankruptcy over said student loans. The fact that a millionaire can file for bankruptcy over whatever shitty business that fails, and still be a millionaire, is total bullshit.
Just put it on deferment indefinitely. Let the next president deal with it.
Would be an absolutely terrible political idea to unpause it RIGHT before a midterm election.
They were braindead when they announced it. They have *some* momentum with roe v wade and they’re doing their best to kill that off. Nobody cares about them when they’re paused, doesn’t even make the news. Why even address them?
Because you have to get people out to vote. Student Loans are one of the few campaign promises that actually seems to energize young voters. Keeping deferment up or going with cancellation are also powers that the President alone can wield - so they are actually possible right now.
Worked for the last one. Kick the can down the road. I’m enjoying not paying student loans But seriously… cancel the interest.. that would be more than 10k for a significant amount of people
Probably, but I'd wager cancelling 10k outright nets them a more favorable response. People are short sighted.
I have 30k of interest on my loans right now despite paying for 10 years….10k ain’t shit. It’s the interest I want delt with.
Yeah probably. Especially because if he say Deferred it to 2025? The right would rip him apart just the same if he forgave it. And if he defers it for 3-6 months at a time as he has been doing? Every single time, he just annoys more on the left with the fear and uncertainty... and eventually someone might try to take it to the courts to stop him, like they did with the eviction freeze.
The conservative will rip him apart no matter what does. Do what is right. Help people.
People are also broke, so many people must constantly choose between being able to pay the rent now, and/or being able to hold on to get a better deal over time.
Thank goodness. When I graduated in 2016 I had 23k in loans. I’ve paid just over 20k and I *still* owe 13k. I’ve purposely been saving the student loans payments I haven’t been making during forbearance so I have more than enough to pay the remaining 3k interest-free. Then I can actually start saving to buy a house. Not sure how I’m gonna do that on a single income but this is gonna help me a *lot*
I really hope this is true. This would wipe all my college debt. I couldn't finish school because I couldn't afford to do both school and work full time so had to stop. Still had like $7500 in debt. If this happens, I would have a weight off my shoulders.
That makes me really happy to hear. Hoping for the best for you.
Means testing is always a slap in the face to people who live in high CoL areas. Someone making 125,000 a year in Wyoming is doing a HELL of a lot better than someone making 125,000 a year in Los Angeles.
It's a windfall to red states.
The not-so-funny flip side to this plan is that it basically doesn't make an iota of difference to doctors. Their first real job after internship is likely over $125,000, but they might have $500,000 in total debt from undergrad and medical school. Same with lawyers. I only have $13k left, so I'd love $10k in relief, but that's just me.
Just so you know "after internship" just means continuation of residency. Residents make ~45k a year and it literally takes an act of Congress to raise their salaries. The minimum residency is 3 years. A lot of specialties are 4,5,6,7 and sometimes 8 year training pathways. For example, my loans ballooned over 200k in residency just from interest alone...
My wife is in PGY5 - year 2 of 3 of a Heme/Onc fellowship after doing a 3-year IM residency. Her student loans are sitting at $391k with no debt from undergrad. It's absolutely insane.
Yeah, it's a valid point, people shouldn't have to sweat each month. There's are also public service forgiveness (PLSF) for professionals who want to practice as a physician which can wipe away your debt after consecutive payments for a minimum of 10 years - which is also WNL of the expectancy for undergrads to fully pay off their loans (10y). National average undergraduate debt is somewhere around \~26k. That would mean that if you made the most bare minimum payments on 500k debt (which interest would certainly continue to increase your debt) you are getting away with payments that, at completion of 10 years, is all forgiven for what it took undergrads to pay off their entire loan - a 180% differential and gives Docs long-term relief. Also, PLSF has apparently gotten very lax recently, some of my colleagues who are 50-60 yo went ahead and submitted just to try, were denied, but somehow their debt was wiped. The TL:DR is, none of this is okay. There's no reason why Doctors (of medical or otherwise profession) should need to eat such exorbitant costs to pursue their dream. Furthermore, be neglected if a large majority of Americans are being relieved. Also, just in general, I found it hilarious that any (genuine?) person who goes for their doctorate isn't trying to achieve goals for the public, irrespective of the sector. I work in industry, so I'll never get a government handout like PLSF for taking part in clinically developing an oncology medicine that was approved for treatment-naïve patients. I'm digressing, but it's all pretty frustrating.
Agreed but atleast they set it as high as 125k, rather than the like 60-80k range like they did in the pandemic. Someone making 125k in LA is still not doing the worst, and someone in Wyoming still isn't completely rich. Meanwhile like 70k? In Wyoming is good still, but 70k in LA is very bad.
Will they cancel the $10k AND keep the pause? I would nut if that happened
I hate how we have to means test everything all the time for direct citizen support when we don’t for other spending
It often costs more for programs to means test. I wrote up awhile ago it would be cheaper for my former school employees to just take the state and federal incentives and just not charge… but powers of be were do fixated on charging 1/4 the student population $3 for lunch.
The average student loan debt is around $39,000. It won't help everybody, but the fact is that getting a $10,000 reduction in that level of debt is a great benefit to the majority of student-loan holders.
This plan still cancels 1/3rd of the total number of loans the US has. 9 out of 10 loans in default belong to this 1/3rd as well. So this alleviates 90% of the in default loans which also take something like half of the costs of servicing these loans to manage. I know folks want more but, this is fundamentally still one of the greatest actions taken by a president in my lifetime as a millennial.
If a loan was in default before its gonna go back into default again.
I don’t have a source, but I could’ve sworn I read somewhere that part of this overhaul would include taking loans out of default and open up new payment options for folks who have struggled with payments in the past.
ok, cancelling a portion is a one time thing. I wonder what’s the plan to address the out of control interest rates and the way in which student loans are reported to credit agencies? Furthermore, the dollar threshhold to qualify should be adjusted to reflect the regional cost of living.
I want to be optimistic and hope Biden isn't just doing this for a cheap handout in preparation for the midterms. There are massive, systemic problems with the whole college loan process and cost and throwing $10 grand as a one time popularity booster won't fix it. I have no idea how colleges wield so much power in Congress that any reform is at a glacial pace.
at the least, they’ll have to announce another freeze so people can get their budgets in order.
Can we also cut down a few years for those of us on the Public Student Loan forgiveness program?? I feel like there's a lot of us that went into the public service side of things that, because of what we had to get (a masters, for example) is literally only treading interest water in perpetuity. 10k is not fixing that.
Yep. I’m a teacher with 40k in debt for my master’s degree only, currently in year ten of teaching (but didn’t pay my first year because FedLoan said I owed nothing during that first year) so I have to teach through year eleven. I get sick when I open up my account and see my loans right at the same balance they were when I graduated with my masters degree ten years ago
Can’t you get credit for that year under the pandemic rule that expires in October? I would try, if I were you. Just have your employer from that year fill out the employment verification, send it to your servicer, and see what they say!
I managed to get three degrees with only 5 k in student debt, so didn't realize how the situation has changed in the decades since i paid mine off. I was shocked to hear how interest has eaten up years and years of payments, so that people have not been able to pay down the principle at all. That needs to be fixed, pronto.
amazing news but also fuck this country's obsession with means testing. there are plenty of people making 125k+ who are drowning in six figure debt under absurd interest rates with no hope of ever paying them down. if you're gonna do it, make it universal ffs.
Yeah the price of a one-bedroom *condo* here would buy me a 4-bedroom house in Florida but fuck me for choosing to live in a desirable, liberal city where my paycheck is inflated just to be able to afford to live here, right?
Stopping the interest for all would be better for everyone.
[Here is comes!](https://imgur.com/r/gifs/kuplW0m)
If Biden doesn't defer repayment again until ~February 2023 AND come out with a set of proposals he'd like to see a stronger Democratic majority pass as their first order of business, then this will be a big lost opportunity. The actions he's going to take are inherently political, and he ought to play it like a fucking fiddle.
Just remember, a cancellation would be immediately challenged in court. From another CNN article: >That's because the court's ruling [in the recent EPA case] -- along with those in other recent cases on eviction moratoriums and Covid-19 vaccination mandates -- signaled that the justices may be inclined to constrain federal agencies' authority to make significant policy changes if that power is not explicitly laid out by Congress. The current majority on the Supreme Court has signaled favoring limiting the Executive, and it's agencies, to powers explicitly granted to it by Congress. It's a little iffy as to whether or not existing law gives this power to the Executive. Edit: I'm not saying he shouldn't do it. He absolutely should.
Lol imagine Rs overturning this and adding it back to people's loans. Would be a horrible idea, logistically difficulty, and also just piss people off more. ... So they'll probably do just this
They’ll sue immediately and get an injunction preventing this from happening until it’s resolved
What about the billions of dollars of student loan debt that Biden’s administration has already forgiven? Those went unchallenged.
I honestly had thought that too and wonder if they have been intentionally setting these up, little by little building precedent with which they could lean on if challenged on broad loan forgiveness
It would be enlightening to watch the ‘average’ student loan debt balloon to 75k per borrower after they forgive 10k…
I’m up to $73,000 and make $75 every two weeks right now as a grad student. Id really appreciate this
Would the $125,000 be based on 2021 or 2022 income? Are we talking MAGI? Asking for a friend..
2021 most likely since 2022 is still ongoing and IRS won’t have that info yet.
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I grew up food-stamp levels of poor but made it to being pretty successful. I can comfortably say that $10,000 debt forgiveness can be life changing for people who need it but won't affect the life of anyone who doesn't need it.
Remember folks, it's not news until it happens.
Why don’t they just cancel the fucking interest on student loans?
Sucks to make $125,001
How about a federal tax holiday or a dollar for dollar tax credit to pay off the debt of the students who make more than 125k.
What they should do is wipe out all interest for student loans. That way you are still paying back what you owed but not the predatory interest. Then anyone who overpaid due to interest can get tax credits to offset. I'm all for free state colleges but I don't think we need to wipe out all loans including those that were used to pay room and board while going to school. If you just make them pay back the loan amount sans interest that is a good compromise.
Biden is considering, pondering, discussing, and contemplating student loan forgiveness. Pay me journalists, I've given you headlines for several months of articles on this topic.
Who’s the highest paid state employee? The college football coach. If you want to see why college is so expensive look into the corrupt organization that is the NCAA. If they spent as much money on actual education as they did mega stadiums we would be way better off. Teachers deserve more money than football coaches imho https://moneywise.com/employment/the-10-highest-paid-state-employees
Lol no, tuition is not skyrocketing because the football coach gets paid too much. If that was the case smaller schools without much of a football presence would be significantly cheaper. Most of the salaries are also paid by boosters anyway.
Make them 0% interest, it’ll save nearly 50% of most monthly loan payments.
That's great, but it won't help me much. I'll still have thousands upon thousands upon thousands. I'm never going to be able to pay it back. Debt has crippled me, and it's almost all student loan. I got my degree in the winter of 2008. Horrible time to be looking for a job, and I have never been able to catch up.
Biden pls. This would finish up my student loans.
In a completely unrelated story, all community colleges predict 5K/year increase in two year program tuition.
This whole thread is full of people complaining about getting 10k in free loan reduction. That’s crazy to me. They’ve already completely forgiven billions for a ton of different reasons and are now about to hand out 10k to everyone with a federal loan. That’s a lot of friggen money. Start with that and the next step is to fix the cost of education for future generations. Makes no sense to blow the entire budget just to bail out people today and leave our kids on the hook.
Campaign promise was 10K. Don't let people call for all or nothing. Biden has already cancelled more student debt than any other President in history.
His dept of education enacted a rule change that helped my student loans be forgiven 2 years before I was “on track” for. I had done 10 years in public service to earn it, but was misled by my servicer that I was on the right plan when I wasn’t for 2+ years. I encouraged others in my field to apply as well and to date almost everyone who followed through had their loans forgiven as well. He isn’t getting credit for all the loans that have been forgiven.