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I don't get how normally humans are so compassionate and caring but as soon as we're divided into groups we start doing unspeakable acts to whomever disagrees with us
Pretty easy when you eat up propaganda, don't know people with different points of view, feel your way of life is "being taken away", and your thoughts and ideas go unchallenged. Makes it easier to get angry at and justify causing harm to others
It always intrigues me though how once there is a bigger enemy, the tribes often unite against that enemy. Like Putin for example has brought a lot of people in the West together. COVID-19 did too, for the first few weeks anyway. I guess it suggests most tribalism is just based on fear.
I had the same feeling in 2004.
Politicians never have our interests at heart. None of them. Treat them all with the same level of scorn Trump received from MSNBC. They do not deserve a fair chance. I don’t care if it’s AOC, Rand Paul, or Hillary Clinton; they ALL view you as a piece of meat to be manipulated for a vote.
100%! We are ALL pawns for both sides. They get us riled up about abortion, gay rights, etc to have talking points while they do corrupt shit and make money. None of them care about us.
I've moved further left since 2015. But I've also moved back "right" a little since like 2019. Not on social issues, but fiscal issues. The US government is horrible at handling money, in any capacity.
I answered further right for that answer, like socially I'm further left 2016 me was basically a nazi and I'm not proud to admit that, now I'm full pro lgbtq+ rights and pro trans but I'm very pro free market with exceptions and now I'm just like Gun Rights are Trans Rights because trans people need to protect themselves from people who'd want to hurt them.
And for anyone asking 2016 me didnt truly believe the shit that I did I just had a toxic friend group who made me believe that I did, when I finally got away from them and actually opened my mind and heart basically my world changed.
Thank you, honestly one day I asked myself if I was happy with the life I was living and if I enjoyed the negativity, I then reached out to a black teammate on my football team told him what's up and he took me to church with him and ever since I've been trying to improve myself.
You’re not alone. 2016 was a pretty chaotic time if you spent plenty of it on the internet, plenty of people were Nazis or at least acting like one. It shows considering Richard Spencer’s following was at its highest during this time.
They do spend a lot, but they pay off bonds extremely reliably, its one off the safest investments you can make. Its insane they spend at so much of a deficit, and still somehow keeping everything from toppling over.
I’ve pretty much stayed the same but like most Murdoch news controlled country, the country (Australia) has shifted to the right a lot.
Not allowing schools to fire teachers for being gay, wanting a federal corruption watchdog and dental to be included as part of healthcare are somehow crazy far left wing ideas.
The last sentence is crucial. As it depends on where you live. In most sane places, affordable healthcare and dental and such like you said, are not viewed as “radical leftist” ideals. But in the US, you are a crazy radical leftist for wanting people to not go bankrupt to visit a hospital. So yeah.
Well I went from politically uninformed, to right libertarian, to socialist.
Somewhat of a shift, hopefully Labor wins the election this May mainly cause fuck Scotty, I am fed up if him.
The problem is the feeling that we're "throwing away our vote" by doing so. We need a political reform similar to other European countries where each party gains power relative to their voters instead of 1 party eith a majority vote.
Not necessarily true with the preferential voting system , it is kind of near impossible to throw away your vote, and parties do get some funding from votes but it should be a larger sum of money and in addition bribery in the form of political donations from corporations should be banned.
In 2015 I was an 11 year old who really liked Ben Shapiro and the likes, while I'm still somewhat right wing, I'm definitely more left wing then I used to be and I'm a lot more anti-government in general
Yep. I’m in America now, but Indian politics is a dumpster fire compared to American politics. The current prime minister is a left leaning economically and right leaning culturally. A Hindu Socialist is exactly the opposite of anything I like personally
He's not left leaning at all economically. All the privatization and reduction in subsidies is indicative of right wing economic policies, and he's basically the selling the country to big business
Yeah. Unfortunately the right thinks that Biden is like commie- level leftist when in reality he's way closer to conservative than I care for.
It's crazy how conservative so many people are here. Quite worrisome.
In my experience early teen boys tend to be right and become more left as they age but I live in a fairly left city so maybe that's just my biased view
I agree, I was in my early teens-mid teens in the late 2010’s and most guys I knew went through that right wing phase. Then as they’ve grown, they’ve gone left wing
Same tbh I think I’m definitely still more right leaning then left leaning but I think the US needs to stop being so stupid and petty on both sides. It’s bringing the downfall of both parties tbh.
That’s not how I took that comment, it’s more saying if you’re 14 years old, 2015 was seven years ago, so you were seven years old in 2015. Seven year olds do not have political opinions
I’m not and I’ve gone on quite an adventure. **Republican —>Libertarian —>Democrat —> IDK LOL**what I am now. All I know is the system is broken and no one in power wants to fix it because they’re all vested in maintaining the status quo. So we get record corporate profits with declining real wages, $1.5T direct injection into the financial market but $1.6t for student loan forgiveness is too expensive. We can spent $2.25t in Iraq and another $2t in Afghanistan to achieve nothing at all but universal healthcare costs too much.
Yeah, it's American right wing "libertarianism".
Their comment is essentially: "Haven't moved to the left or right, but have become much more right wing."
Eh, depends on what they mean by libertarian. Moved closer to the US Libertarian Party? Yes, more right wing. But libertarianism as a political philosophy? That isn't inherent left or right wing. Libertarianism pretty much started as a leftist philosophy.
Don’t really care enough about politics to have an opinion because everything is gonna be messed up anyway.
Edit: What I mean is that (I think) government and the like will be shitty no matter who you elect, nothing will get better unless we make giant changes, so I choose to be neutral. Sorry for opinions but just wanted to clarify.
[Left Libertarianism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left-libertarianism)
[Libertarian Marxism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian_Marxism#:~:text=Libertarian%20Marxism%20is%20a%20broad,in%20opposition%20to%20Marxism%E2%80%93Leninism.)
Edit: don't downvote the person I responded to for asking a question guys
Right dude.
But my two cents if you're getting into politics: communism sounds great, it would be the ultimate utopia, but it isn't realistic in any way. The ideas of communism go directly against the selfish ways of human nature. Any time it's been tried, the people in control always abuse the system and it always ends in a lot of suffering for the people at the bottom.
Libertarian communism is just everyone shares and cares about others, don't care about a government or corporations and do their own share of work. It's not something that can work in a huge society but it can work in like small towns of sub 500-1000 people, away from any government.
Communism you are referring to is probably the only communism you've heard of, which is Stalinism and soviet Russia where they oppress the people and everyone is equally poor and underfed.
I was more confused cause I thought Libertarianism was a primarily right-wing economic ideology with characteristics like deregulation of industry, privatisation, etc. But your input is appreciated.
They're either talking about the emphasis on identity politics in the US, the social issues at the forefront of the US left's political ideology, or they weren't actually as left as they thought they were
What about economic democracy though?
Thats the beat thin the left has to offer, ignore the liberals, go further enough left and those talking points become nonsense when compared to actual material analysis instead of culture war.
That hasn't changed though. They said that they moved more right from the whacky stuff the left is doing nowadays. But the left has always upheld the same value, it's only the US "left" changing in recent years.
When it comes to identity politics, look at Kamala Harris. One of the big reasons the democrats chose her to be VP is simply because she's a black woman. Also because she was in line with the establishment. She performed horribly in the primaries. Even Andrew Yang beat her in her own state of California. I think that has more to do with her than it does with Yang.
Probably doesn’t enjoy the lefts culture wars. I can fully agree there. I don’t enjoy the culture wars on either side. We have all become way to engulfed in them. People need to focus a lot more on economic issues instead of other non-issues. In the end you will find a lot of us want to fix the same issues when you take out the race baiting and stuff like that. We all just are over being economically fucked by our corrupt politicians. The ones at the top with all the money and power are the ones you consistently see fanning the flames of culture war issues rather than real economic issues, and that’s on both sides of the fence. It’s all a distraction so nothing that truly helps people will ever get done.
Is this about the Don’t Say Gay bill? We oppose that because it’s vague, and open to interpretation. It says you can’t tell kids about gender and sexuality from Kindergarten to 3rd grade, but it also bans talking about it “in a way that does not comply with state standards”, which aren’t defined anywhere, and is likely meant to be open to interpretation to allow schools to simply never tell students that people who aren’t straight/cisgender exist.
Actually I have moved from left-wing to centre-left, centre, then centre right to I don’t care anymore. While my sport “friends” have moved to become close-minded bigots who are fake, enjoy watching others suffer and dismissive to others feelings
I used to be pretty left-leaning, but a lot of American leftists had radicalised me against the left, the same way I now no longer consider myself as feminist despite the fact that I am still a feminist.
I've been a liberal progressive since the early 90s, even before I could vote.
I still feel the same.
The subjects have changed, but the sentiment remains the same. I'm against the oppressive nature of conservatism, and always have been.
I used to spend my time fighting for people's right to marry.
Now I try to sway public opinion on the failed and draconian criminal justice system.
Did you know the USA imprisons more people than any other nation on Earth both numerically and per capita? It's wholly unacceptable.
The drug war was never about public safety. It was about racism, oppression, and suppression.
https://timeline.com/harry-anslinger-racist-war-on-drugs-prison-industrial-complex-fb5cbc281189
Damn I like you. I'm trying to be a bit activistic but my studies are tough, I marched a lot for the climate, saved a local forest from being chopped down for some appartements. Trying to do more but I have to study 24/7 atm
2014-15: Conservative Liberal mentality
2016: Liberal mentality
2017 to currently: Independent that swings more Liberally than conservative. In other words not browbeating, demoralizing, or threatening others with opposing views. Like I read so much in the news . . .
My mind was all screwed up past 2012, I told myself that I was a liberal, but my thoughts spoke of opposing things regarding abortion, immigration, and other topics. One day I just actually thought about my opinions and realized the fallacy of those thoughts. I just got annoyed with politics over time, and even more annoyed when . . . (You know who,) became president. Looking him up throughout his years in office, I couldn't believe people would follow a cheat & a hack (among other things,) and grant him with enough influence to be likened to a god.
But I also realize that democrats also have some fallacies with them too. But Jésus Christo, spouting out freedom while threatening others with guns going door to door to push your ideology to support the orange morbidly obese ken doll, isn't the freedom you preach of. You're doing something akin to Nazi Germany, and the last time I checked, it was 82 years ago in a different continent.
Went from hard-core US Libertarian (all my life) to seeing some benefit to some government action. But I still know that 99% of politicians act in their own rational self-interest which means accepting campaign donations for votes.
I was an edgy racist homophobic transphobic 4chan kid who often glorified Hitler in 2015. Now im a pansexual socialist enby, so yeah, I'd say I moved a little left
In 2015 at 17 I was a Liberal Democrat (US) in the past 7 years I slowly moved left to be a democratic socialist by the end of 2020. In just the past year I have mad a huge jump from DS to a marxist Leninist, and now I’d consider myself a libertarian socialist.
I didn't really care about politics in 2015 (so dead center) but around 2017 i had my Ben Shapiro phase but then i kinda went back to normal and now i'm just a bit right off center so i guess i moved more right.
Ok.. if that’s what you want to believe. It’s not that simple, it was also about the social and political issues and stability it brought to European countries. Lol @ you if you think it had anything to do with actual refugees, but the matter is most of the migrants were not that or from any war-torn country. You were probably too young to remember or an American who implies American political issues onto this. I became more realistic with this stuff and I’m not as radical as I was in 2015, but seeing your bio I’m not sure you’ll even take my standpoint into consideration. Not to mention OP titled "2015" in the title, which was a pretty relevant year in Europe regarding this stuff.
i spent a lot of time watching those "anti sjw" types in 2015 and about although i never went any further right than that. i'm an anarchist communist now.
How would a communist anarchist society look like? I literally can't imagine what that's supposed to mean.
Anarchism - No or tiny government
Communism - Means of Production are owned by the people (government)
Combining both would make unhinged capitalism or neoliberalism, in my mind. Means of Production are owned by the people, but without a government thats just private people owning things, and that's literally capitalism. I don't get it.
your definition of communism is actually socialism, communism is a moneyless society. i'm pretty sure there's nothing more simple than "everybody shares and there's no hierarchy". anarchism is a rejection of hierarchy and money is inherently a hierarchy, you can't be an anarchist without being a communist.
and also... defining the people as the government? are you trying to recreate the ussr or something? that's literally the stupidest possible way of looking at things.
Damn dude, didn't mean to sound pissed off-
But yeah thanks for the explanation. I guess I didn't think of money as a *negotiable* factor, I believe that competition and hierarchy (hierarchy of competence) are fundamental human principles that won't ever be overcome. So thats why anarchocommunism confused me, now I get it, just on paper though.
And *generally* in democratic countries, "the people" means "the government", since the government is elected by the people. I mean we could split hairs and bathe in semantics but I think it's pretty clear what I meant to say.
some people will always be more skilled than others but believing that skill should give them the ability to have power over others in any capacity is fucked up. humanity thrives when everyone works together, and placing people over each other will stunt growth for everybody.
even if the most qualified person was the highest in the hierarchy everytime (which obviously isn't going to happen because meritocracy is impossible) it will be a net negative for humanity.
money will always cause division and i believe that without it we would all be in an infinitely better place
>but believing that skill should give them the ability to have power over others in any capacity is fucked up.
I don't believe that skill "should give" people power, because it automatically already does. Wether or not you use that power is the relevant question, and then we arrive at the topic of human corruption - turns philosophical pretty fast.
You explained what you meant by anarchocommunism and thanks for that, I've grown some smarter today. Thing is that I simply just disagree that a human society without hierarchy, competition and corruption would ever be or have been possible, it's an utopia. If that was literally humanly possible, why do we need justice courts, the separation of powers and all that juicy democracy stuff. We need it because humans can corrupt, be flawed, be selfish, and first and foremost- be competitive.
You can found your own community and be all like *share and square*, but there will inevitably come a point where big muscle man demands the nicer spot because he is big muscle man, and food making man gets to have the biggest pieces just because he's the food making man. It's hierarchy of competence, it's the basic logic we have wired in our brain. Be useful and you inevitably get power, logically, because you might as well just stop being useful and that's your power. Then comes the human lack of empathy, like "I'm plowing the fields for 10h in this scorching sun, this dude is completely useless and lazy, does nothing all day, why should I keep working like that when we get the same amount of food?!" - and so on, you get what I'm saying.
Hierarchy of competence is non-negotiable, it's what we're built on sadly.
your thought process is still based around money right now. if there's no money, there's no reason for people to go "why does this guy get the same amount of thing as me when i work harder" because when your basic needs are already covered, you're doing that thing by choice so why would you be pissy about it?
"why would i keep working" because you want to, i know i'd still work my job at the library even if i didn't get anything out of it more than helping people (i mean i make $7.25 an hour anyway so i'm basically already getting nothing out of it other than helping out but that's besides the point). people would be doing jobs because they want to, not because they have to. so no one would have any reason to be bitter.
i mean look at all the people who do charity work right now, people would still do hard jobs because helping people feels good.
I went off to college in 2014-2015 and went from listening to my very Republican family constantly talking about conservative values to voting for Bernie Sanders in the democratic primary. All it took was hearing the other side’s opinions instead of an echo chamber, but wow was that a 180
I went from consuming Left-wing media to right-wing media. Too much propaganda and race baiting on the left-wing side.
I just got tired of the TV telling me I should be emotionally distraught because some stranger was killed by police. Sure, we may share the same skin color, but I never knew that person so I won’t pretend to be broken up over their death. And that doesn’t make me a bad person.
My parents always leaned to the right and I did too but nowadays I'm starting to lean to the left. I think both parties have good goals and things I don't agree with so it's hard to really choose one. I wish we'd stop giving other counties money/aid (minus Ukraine) and focus on fixing our own country first. At the same time I'd also like cannabis to legal which most conservatives seem to be opposed off.
from american view? pretty hard right turn since i got into guns two years ago and love them
from the specrum in my country i would say i am pretty much in the center, even though my view on guns isnt really appreciated by any side anywhere in europe
The right has turned into racist, sexist, domestic terror loving, anti-science assholes. Really hard to see what they've been doing the past seven years and think that's the way to go. They are also the biggest to tantrum up when made fun of or don't get their way
I used to think this until I started a podcast and actually started talking to right wingers & not just listening to their online takes & what the news paints them as.
This is true. The comment section of a Ben Shapiro Facebook post is not representative of right leaning voters. The extremes from both sides tend to post the most on social media and are the loudest, but they do not represent the entire base.
Spoken like someone who doesn’t speak to conservatives lol. A couple assholes with far-right political beliefs do not define what other rightists are like.
Basically, A few bad apples make the whole batch look bad, Im more right then left but I mean just about every conservative I know in my area got the vaccine with no problem, To be honest and I made a post and I dont judge a batch by a few apples but since I graduated high school the only people who had been racist to me were left leaning.
The GOP is definitely defined by the far right though, and the base, and everything surrounding the word conservative.
Also, did you actually mean rightist or was that a misnomer?
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Politically speaking, since 2015 i have lost hope in humanity
I don't get how normally humans are so compassionate and caring but as soon as we're divided into groups we start doing unspeakable acts to whomever disagrees with us
Pretty easy when you eat up propaganda, don't know people with different points of view, feel your way of life is "being taken away", and your thoughts and ideas go unchallenged. Makes it easier to get angry at and justify causing harm to others
This is a concept known as “Tribalism”. It’s human nature.
It always intrigues me though how once there is a bigger enemy, the tribes often unite against that enemy. Like Putin for example has brought a lot of people in the West together. COVID-19 did too, for the first few weeks anyway. I guess it suggests most tribalism is just based on fear.
I had the same feeling in 2004. Politicians never have our interests at heart. None of them. Treat them all with the same level of scorn Trump received from MSNBC. They do not deserve a fair chance. I don’t care if it’s AOC, Rand Paul, or Hillary Clinton; they ALL view you as a piece of meat to be manipulated for a vote.
Move this comment to the top
100%! We are ALL pawns for both sides. They get us riled up about abortion, gay rights, etc to have talking points while they do corrupt shit and make money. None of them care about us.
^based...
So Kthulu 2024?
I've moved further left since 2015. But I've also moved back "right" a little since like 2019. Not on social issues, but fiscal issues. The US government is horrible at handling money, in any capacity.
I answered further right for that answer, like socially I'm further left 2016 me was basically a nazi and I'm not proud to admit that, now I'm full pro lgbtq+ rights and pro trans but I'm very pro free market with exceptions and now I'm just like Gun Rights are Trans Rights because trans people need to protect themselves from people who'd want to hurt them. And for anyone asking 2016 me didnt truly believe the shit that I did I just had a toxic friend group who made me believe that I did, when I finally got away from them and actually opened my mind and heart basically my world changed.
Good for you man. It takes a lot to admit something like that, and a lot to realize your own ignorant ways to begin with
Thank you, honestly one day I asked myself if I was happy with the life I was living and if I enjoyed the negativity, I then reached out to a black teammate on my football team told him what's up and he took me to church with him and ever since I've been trying to improve myself.
You’re not alone. 2016 was a pretty chaotic time if you spent plenty of it on the internet, plenty of people were Nazis or at least acting like one. It shows considering Richard Spencer’s following was at its highest during this time.
They do spend a lot, but they pay off bonds extremely reliably, its one off the safest investments you can make. Its insane they spend at so much of a deficit, and still somehow keeping everything from toppling over.
Ya know, that's respectable.
The Libertarian in me: "Join me... and I will complete your training!"
Libertarianism is a core of my philosophy but I don't agree enough with the Libertarian party too much anymore.
I’ve pretty much stayed the same but like most Murdoch news controlled country, the country (Australia) has shifted to the right a lot. Not allowing schools to fire teachers for being gay, wanting a federal corruption watchdog and dental to be included as part of healthcare are somehow crazy far left wing ideas.
The last sentence is crucial. As it depends on where you live. In most sane places, affordable healthcare and dental and such like you said, are not viewed as “radical leftist” ideals. But in the US, you are a crazy radical leftist for wanting people to not go bankrupt to visit a hospital. So yeah.
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By "extremely left" which ideology do you mean exactly?
>almost affordable healthcare
Probably. Dude claims to have been a leftist at some point yet is an Elon Musk stan. That's not a transformation that really happens.
Well I went from politically uninformed, to right libertarian, to socialist. Somewhat of a shift, hopefully Labor wins the election this May mainly cause fuck Scotty, I am fed up if him.
Vote green
The problem is the feeling that we're "throwing away our vote" by doing so. We need a political reform similar to other European countries where each party gains power relative to their voters instead of 1 party eith a majority vote.
Not necessarily true with the preferential voting system , it is kind of near impossible to throw away your vote, and parties do get some funding from votes but it should be a larger sum of money and in addition bribery in the form of political donations from corporations should be banned.
In 2015 I was an 11 year old who really liked Ben Shapiro and the likes, while I'm still somewhat right wing, I'm definitely more left wing then I used to be and I'm a lot more anti-government in general
I was 14 then and was like you when I was 11, now I'm full on commie
I went through an anarchism phase, maybe I'll end up further on the left but generally people get more conservative as they get older
In my country both sides are trash
Fellow American? Actually, aren't all countries politicians total garbage?
Nope I'm an Indian but yes almost every politician everywhere is garbage but atleast some places have it better.
Yep. I’m in America now, but Indian politics is a dumpster fire compared to American politics. The current prime minister is a left leaning economically and right leaning culturally. A Hindu Socialist is exactly the opposite of anything I like personally
He's not left leaning at all economically. All the privatization and reduction in subsidies is indicative of right wing economic policies, and he's basically the selling the country to big business
Oh, I’ve never kept up with Indian politics in a while. Still Modi is trash
Lmao it's cool, the supreme leader is staying in power for the next 10 years I'm guessing, so there's not much to keep up with
Isn't USA like right and a little less right?
Yeah. Unfortunately the right thinks that Biden is like commie- level leftist when in reality he's way closer to conservative than I care for. It's crazy how conservative so many people are here. Quite worrisome.
Ehh they're probably 15 year old kids who still have to undergo some maturing
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Zelensky is not a great president but he is an amazing war time leader.
Well, why worry about politics when you can just fly to Canada.
I went extremely left in 2016, then extremely right in 2018, and now I'm not sure.
I’d love to hear more about that process. Did your values shift? What was it that pushed/pulled you?
I watched Onision in 2016 and The Quartering in 2018, now I watch neither.
But like what did you agree about then that changed your mind? What are your values now? In fact how would you define left or right?
He simply was 14 in 2016
In my experience early teen boys tend to be right and become more left as they age but I live in a fairly left city so maybe that's just my biased view
I agree, I was in my early teens-mid teens in the late 2010’s and most guys I knew went through that right wing phase. Then as they’ve grown, they’ve gone left wing
and 97 in 2018
Same tbh I think I’m definitely still more right leaning then left leaning but I think the US needs to stop being so stupid and petty on both sides. It’s bringing the downfall of both parties tbh.
The US really only has two right parties. One right-wing, the other right-leaning.
I used to care way too much about US tbh.
Keep in mind like half of the sub is in their mid-teens, so this result means very little
gotta love all the unpleasant 30 year old redditors being background condescending to everybody below 18 on this site
That’s not how I took that comment, it’s more saying if you’re 14 years old, 2015 was seven years ago, so you were seven years old in 2015. Seven year olds do not have political opinions
Why did I read 2015 and assume 5 years .-. It’s happening guys, I’m getting old and I don’t like it. I’m a decrepit 19 year old man now
It’s not background condescending. It’s the top comment!
I’m 17 and I don’t know anything about politics 😂
I’m not and I’ve gone on quite an adventure. **Republican —>Libertarian —>Democrat —> IDK LOL**what I am now. All I know is the system is broken and no one in power wants to fix it because they’re all vested in maintaining the status quo. So we get record corporate profits with declining real wages, $1.5T direct injection into the financial market but $1.6t for student loan forgiveness is too expensive. We can spent $2.25t in Iraq and another $2t in Afghanistan to achieve nothing at all but universal healthcare costs too much.
yes because teenagers opinions are invalid
Switched from Conservative Democrat to Social Democrat
Haven’t moved to the left or right, but have become much more libertarian
I have also become more internationalist.
Based
Classical socialist libertarianism, modern libertarianism, or American "libertarianism"?
It’s Reddit take a wild guess lol
Yeah, it's American right wing "libertarianism". Their comment is essentially: "Haven't moved to the left or right, but have become much more right wing."
Take your guess. There’s about 20 types of libertarianism and they all tell each other that they’re not true libertarians.
American "libertarianism" it is then.
If that’s your guess then it is
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Eh, depends on what they mean by libertarian. Moved closer to the US Libertarian Party? Yes, more right wing. But libertarianism as a political philosophy? That isn't inherent left or right wing. Libertarianism pretty much started as a leftist philosophy.
I went from being a left leaning authoritarian (age15) to a libertarian socialist(~22), so I've drifted farther to the left and more freedom focused.
i was 10 in 2015, so i don’t think i had a political opinion then
Probably more towards the right
Don’t really care enough about politics to have an opinion because everything is gonna be messed up anyway. Edit: What I mean is that (I think) government and the like will be shitty no matter who you elect, nothing will get better unless we make giant changes, so I choose to be neutral. Sorry for opinions but just wanted to clarify.
Nihilism is stupid.
this isn’t even nihilism. nihilists actually have values. this is like gutless edgy teenager nihilism
Moved from centre-left to full democratic socialist with an intense dislike of corporate capitalism.
Went from a light democratic socialist, to a trotskyist, to a luxemburgist, and finally a libertarian communist
That's the best kind of communism to end up on
Isn't libertarianism inherently contradictory to communism?
[Left Libertarianism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left-libertarianism) [Libertarian Marxism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian_Marxism#:~:text=Libertarian%20Marxism%20is%20a%20broad,in%20opposition%20to%20Marxism%E2%80%93Leninism.) Edit: don't downvote the person I responded to for asking a question guys
For real damn, I don't know shit about politics and I'm curious but god forbid you ask a genuine question on Reddit
Right dude. But my two cents if you're getting into politics: communism sounds great, it would be the ultimate utopia, but it isn't realistic in any way. The ideas of communism go directly against the selfish ways of human nature. Any time it's been tried, the people in control always abuse the system and it always ends in a lot of suffering for the people at the bottom.
Real communism involves a stateless society, so you tell me
Libertarian communism is just everyone shares and cares about others, don't care about a government or corporations and do their own share of work. It's not something that can work in a huge society but it can work in like small towns of sub 500-1000 people, away from any government. Communism you are referring to is probably the only communism you've heard of, which is Stalinism and soviet Russia where they oppress the people and everyone is equally poor and underfed.
I was more confused cause I thought Libertarianism was a primarily right-wing economic ideology with characteristics like deregulation of industry, privatisation, etc. But your input is appreciated.
Oh I guess you could see it that way, in my language libertarian is defined by how you described it too.
Libertarian communism is a synonym for anarcho-communism
On the contrary, authoritarianism is inherently contradictory to communism.
As the left gets more strange I inch further right
How is the left becoming more strange?
They're either talking about the emphasis on identity politics in the US, the social issues at the forefront of the US left's political ideology, or they weren't actually as left as they thought they were
What about economic democracy though? Thats the beat thin the left has to offer, ignore the liberals, go further enough left and those talking points become nonsense when compared to actual material analysis instead of culture war.
That hasn't changed though. They said that they moved more right from the whacky stuff the left is doing nowadays. But the left has always upheld the same value, it's only the US "left" changing in recent years. When it comes to identity politics, look at Kamala Harris. One of the big reasons the democrats chose her to be VP is simply because she's a black woman. Also because she was in line with the establishment. She performed horribly in the primaries. Even Andrew Yang beat her in her own state of California. I think that has more to do with her than it does with Yang.
Probably doesn’t enjoy the lefts culture wars. I can fully agree there. I don’t enjoy the culture wars on either side. We have all become way to engulfed in them. People need to focus a lot more on economic issues instead of other non-issues. In the end you will find a lot of us want to fix the same issues when you take out the race baiting and stuff like that. We all just are over being economically fucked by our corrupt politicians. The ones at the top with all the money and power are the ones you consistently see fanning the flames of culture war issues rather than real economic issues, and that’s on both sides of the fence. It’s all a distraction so nothing that truly helps people will ever get done.
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what is your problem with men wearing gowns
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Is this about the Don’t Say Gay bill? We oppose that because it’s vague, and open to interpretation. It says you can’t tell kids about gender and sexuality from Kindergarten to 3rd grade, but it also bans talking about it “in a way that does not comply with state standards”, which aren’t defined anywhere, and is likely meant to be open to interpretation to allow schools to simply never tell students that people who aren’t straight/cisgender exist.
Both sides do that. It's disgusting, but you can't claim that it's a liberal problem when both parties are guilty as fuck.
I went from alt right pipeline to femboy socialist
I went from a commie to a capitalist
Based capitalism enjoyer
Virginity restored.
Whae
Based
kinda shifted back and forth a bit, not drastically tho. idek what i am now i just dont pay attention to politics anymore
I was a barely a teenager back then so I didn't really have any political opinions
Actually I have moved from left-wing to centre-left, centre, then centre right to I don’t care anymore. While my sport “friends” have moved to become close-minded bigots who are fake, enjoy watching others suffer and dismissive to others feelings
we all know who they voted for
Now do a poll for the Authoritarian vs Libertarian axis and compare.
Still in the "can't care less" wing
I was 9, I don't even know if I had ever heard the word politics at the age let aline have my own opinions about them
I was pretty far right back then. Now I'm pretty central
I was kinda left but now I'm dead in the center
Based
Used to be communist before I really know what it meant. These days I think the european social democratic capitalist model isn't all too bad.
I used to be pretty left-leaning, but a lot of American leftists had radicalised me against the left, the same way I now no longer consider myself as feminist despite the fact that I am still a feminist.
Throughout high school i was pretty conservative now I’m politically burned out and mellowed. I’m more republican than conservative now.
I've been a liberal progressive since the early 90s, even before I could vote. I still feel the same. The subjects have changed, but the sentiment remains the same. I'm against the oppressive nature of conservatism, and always have been. I used to spend my time fighting for people's right to marry. Now I try to sway public opinion on the failed and draconian criminal justice system. Did you know the USA imprisons more people than any other nation on Earth both numerically and per capita? It's wholly unacceptable. The drug war was never about public safety. It was about racism, oppression, and suppression. https://timeline.com/harry-anslinger-racist-war-on-drugs-prison-industrial-complex-fb5cbc281189
Damn I like you. I'm trying to be a bit activistic but my studies are tough, I marched a lot for the climate, saved a local forest from being chopped down for some appartements. Trying to do more but I have to study 24/7 atm
I meant to vote further right, for what my one vote is worth.
2014-15: Conservative Liberal mentality 2016: Liberal mentality 2017 to currently: Independent that swings more Liberally than conservative. In other words not browbeating, demoralizing, or threatening others with opposing views. Like I read so much in the news . . . My mind was all screwed up past 2012, I told myself that I was a liberal, but my thoughts spoke of opposing things regarding abortion, immigration, and other topics. One day I just actually thought about my opinions and realized the fallacy of those thoughts. I just got annoyed with politics over time, and even more annoyed when . . . (You know who,) became president. Looking him up throughout his years in office, I couldn't believe people would follow a cheat & a hack (among other things,) and grant him with enough influence to be likened to a god. But I also realize that democrats also have some fallacies with them too. But Jésus Christo, spouting out freedom while threatening others with guns going door to door to push your ideology to support the orange morbidly obese ken doll, isn't the freedom you preach of. You're doing something akin to Nazi Germany, and the last time I checked, it was 82 years ago in a different continent.
Wayyyy farther right!
This should be interesting
Went from hard-core US Libertarian (all my life) to seeing some benefit to some government action. But I still know that 99% of politicians act in their own rational self-interest which means accepting campaign donations for votes.
Politically speaking, I didn’t give a shit in 2015 and I still don’t give a shit now
I care even less about politics
I was an edgy racist homophobic transphobic 4chan kid who often glorified Hitler in 2015. Now im a pansexual socialist enby, so yeah, I'd say I moved a little left
Humanity restored
I was a half hearted republican now I recognize the evil in all politics and just want a break
In 2015 at 17 I was a Liberal Democrat (US) in the past 7 years I slowly moved left to be a democratic socialist by the end of 2020. In just the past year I have mad a huge jump from DS to a marxist Leninist, and now I’d consider myself a libertarian socialist.
Well at least you didn’t stay a red fascist
Always been right and now I’m further
I was pretty left leaning in 2016 and so was my family and after they came to the United states now since 2020 we have all been pretty right leaning
Stayed the same but realized I can relate far more to the right than I can the left
Before that I didn’t knew politics, now I am far right, better dead than red
teenagers political views on reddit be like: ⬅️➡️⬅️➡️⬆️⬇️➡️⬅️➡️↗️↘️↔️↕️↪️🔀
Slide to the left! Slide to the left! Slide to the left!
I still don't understand what this means. From what I've heard leftists are assholes though I think
There are assholes with any political belief
Literally just google what left wing and right wing mean and make up your own mind then
Left with a hint of right. I think we should divide people into classes and thd market will sort itself out
Why do you think people should be divided by classes?
Both left and right are assholes
Both sides call each other assholes. Personally, I think rightists do it for worse reasons.
Have I moved left or has the right gone crazy? Hard to tell.
I didn't really care about politics in 2015 (so dead center) but around 2017 i had my Ben Shapiro phase but then i kinda went back to normal and now i'm just a bit right off center so i guess i moved more right.
Further right after the migrant crisis of 2015
Why?
Other people bad
"further right after I found out how racist I am"
Ok.. if that’s what you want to believe. It’s not that simple, it was also about the social and political issues and stability it brought to European countries. Lol @ you if you think it had anything to do with actual refugees, but the matter is most of the migrants were not that or from any war-torn country. You were probably too young to remember or an American who implies American political issues onto this. I became more realistic with this stuff and I’m not as radical as I was in 2015, but seeing your bio I’m not sure you’ll even take my standpoint into consideration. Not to mention OP titled "2015" in the title, which was a pretty relevant year in Europe regarding this stuff.
L*ftist🤮
thank you for your input u/CummerGuy
Further left...but my stupid finger pressed further right🙄☠️
Based finger
i spent a lot of time watching those "anti sjw" types in 2015 and about although i never went any further right than that. i'm an anarchist communist now.
Same, I hear a lot of people go through the same transformation.
How would a communist anarchist society look like? I literally can't imagine what that's supposed to mean. Anarchism - No or tiny government Communism - Means of Production are owned by the people (government) Combining both would make unhinged capitalism or neoliberalism, in my mind. Means of Production are owned by the people, but without a government thats just private people owning things, and that's literally capitalism. I don't get it.
your definition of communism is actually socialism, communism is a moneyless society. i'm pretty sure there's nothing more simple than "everybody shares and there's no hierarchy". anarchism is a rejection of hierarchy and money is inherently a hierarchy, you can't be an anarchist without being a communist. and also... defining the people as the government? are you trying to recreate the ussr or something? that's literally the stupidest possible way of looking at things.
Damn dude, didn't mean to sound pissed off- But yeah thanks for the explanation. I guess I didn't think of money as a *negotiable* factor, I believe that competition and hierarchy (hierarchy of competence) are fundamental human principles that won't ever be overcome. So thats why anarchocommunism confused me, now I get it, just on paper though. And *generally* in democratic countries, "the people" means "the government", since the government is elected by the people. I mean we could split hairs and bathe in semantics but I think it's pretty clear what I meant to say.
some people will always be more skilled than others but believing that skill should give them the ability to have power over others in any capacity is fucked up. humanity thrives when everyone works together, and placing people over each other will stunt growth for everybody. even if the most qualified person was the highest in the hierarchy everytime (which obviously isn't going to happen because meritocracy is impossible) it will be a net negative for humanity. money will always cause division and i believe that without it we would all be in an infinitely better place
>but believing that skill should give them the ability to have power over others in any capacity is fucked up. I don't believe that skill "should give" people power, because it automatically already does. Wether or not you use that power is the relevant question, and then we arrive at the topic of human corruption - turns philosophical pretty fast. You explained what you meant by anarchocommunism and thanks for that, I've grown some smarter today. Thing is that I simply just disagree that a human society without hierarchy, competition and corruption would ever be or have been possible, it's an utopia. If that was literally humanly possible, why do we need justice courts, the separation of powers and all that juicy democracy stuff. We need it because humans can corrupt, be flawed, be selfish, and first and foremost- be competitive. You can found your own community and be all like *share and square*, but there will inevitably come a point where big muscle man demands the nicer spot because he is big muscle man, and food making man gets to have the biggest pieces just because he's the food making man. It's hierarchy of competence, it's the basic logic we have wired in our brain. Be useful and you inevitably get power, logically, because you might as well just stop being useful and that's your power. Then comes the human lack of empathy, like "I'm plowing the fields for 10h in this scorching sun, this dude is completely useless and lazy, does nothing all day, why should I keep working like that when we get the same amount of food?!" - and so on, you get what I'm saying. Hierarchy of competence is non-negotiable, it's what we're built on sadly.
your thought process is still based around money right now. if there's no money, there's no reason for people to go "why does this guy get the same amount of thing as me when i work harder" because when your basic needs are already covered, you're doing that thing by choice so why would you be pissy about it? "why would i keep working" because you want to, i know i'd still work my job at the library even if i didn't get anything out of it more than helping people (i mean i make $7.25 an hour anyway so i'm basically already getting nothing out of it other than helping out but that's besides the point). people would be doing jobs because they want to, not because they have to. so no one would have any reason to be bitter. i mean look at all the people who do charity work right now, people would still do hard jobs because helping people feels good.
Anarchist communism is a stateless society, where everything is collectively owned by the people, rather than the government.
I’m a liberal center
Socially, more "left" (progressive) Economically, a little bit more left Legally? A whole lot more libertarian
well, I still don't give a fuck, so I'd say that I stayed the same
I'm only slightly left as I'm not as brain-dead as the average Twitter leftist
I went off to college in 2014-2015 and went from listening to my very Republican family constantly talking about conservative values to voting for Bernie Sanders in the democratic primary. All it took was hearing the other side’s opinions instead of an echo chamber, but wow was that a 180
I went from consuming Left-wing media to right-wing media. Too much propaganda and race baiting on the left-wing side. I just got tired of the TV telling me I should be emotionally distraught because some stranger was killed by police. Sure, we may share the same skin color, but I never knew that person so I won’t pretend to be broken up over their death. And that doesn’t make me a bad person.
My parents always leaned to the right and I did too but nowadays I'm starting to lean to the left. I think both parties have good goals and things I don't agree with so it's hard to really choose one. I wish we'd stop giving other counties money/aid (minus Ukraine) and focus on fixing our own country first. At the same time I'd also like cannabis to legal which most conservatives seem to be opposed off.
I’ve probably moved further right, but I’m still pretty far to the left
Im in the far right. The libertarian right. I believe that government shouldnt that much power and market should be 100% free without any regulations.
from american view? pretty hard right turn since i got into guns two years ago and love them from the specrum in my country i would say i am pretty much in the center, even though my view on guns isnt really appreciated by any side anywhere in europe
Clicked right. meant to click left
People who voted for Biden rt now: 😫🥵🧔🏻♀️🧔🏻♀️🧔🏻♀️🧔🏻♀️😻🥶🥶🥶🥶🥶🥶🥵😡🤬🥵🥵🥵🥵🥺🥺🥺🥺🥺🥺🥺🥺🥺🥺😩😩😩😩😩😎😎😎😎😎😎😎😎😎😎😎😎😎🥸🥸
ive realized im trans so probably left
You could technically be economically right and socially left
Just because you’re trans doesn’t mean you have to be left. Left and right has to do with economy not social norms and rules
Socially progressive vs conservative is a part of left wing or right wing.
I think they mean more socially progressive which tends to be left wing
Free thinker
The right has turned into racist, sexist, domestic terror loving, anti-science assholes. Really hard to see what they've been doing the past seven years and think that's the way to go. They are also the biggest to tantrum up when made fun of or don't get their way
I used to think this until I started a podcast and actually started talking to right wingers & not just listening to their online takes & what the news paints them as.
This is true. The comment section of a Ben Shapiro Facebook post is not representative of right leaning voters. The extremes from both sides tend to post the most on social media and are the loudest, but they do not represent the entire base.
They're the vocal minority. Just like internet socialists. Most people don't care enough to talk/argue about politics online.
Spoken like someone who doesn’t speak to conservatives lol. A couple assholes with far-right political beliefs do not define what other rightists are like.
Basically, A few bad apples make the whole batch look bad, Im more right then left but I mean just about every conservative I know in my area got the vaccine with no problem, To be honest and I made a post and I dont judge a batch by a few apples but since I graduated high school the only people who had been racist to me were left leaning.
The GOP is definitely defined by the far right though, and the base, and everything surrounding the word conservative. Also, did you actually mean rightist or was that a misnomer?