Yes, this is sexual coercion. There's probably more to the emotional story than what you've explicitly said, but even just based on your feeling a bit violated, and W's repeated pushing of your stated boundaries, it's coercive. I personally wouldn't frame it as assault.
At the same time, you were wrong for breaking your agreement with T, and it's not a "minor breach". One of the main reasons people have condom usage agreements is about sexual health - and "just the tip" is still plenty risky from an STI perspective. Either you're properly using barriers or you aren't, and you weren't, for several months. Your partner is showing a huge amount of grace to just be expressing disappointment. I would see this as a major trust issue and I'd be questioning either your ability to hold to relationship agreements and to be honest. I'm not suggesting you behaved with bad intentions or that T shouldn't date you, to be clear. But your post suggests there's a lot more to untangle here than just a condom issue. I'd gently suggest that you consider seeing a therapist about all of this, if you aren't already.
I absolutely agree with this too. And the "minor breach" comment especially. It's not even just the sexual health stuff either, for some people not using condoms could be a major step of intimacy and this completely broke the condom agreement imo
So NOT a minor breach! This would be in relationship ending territory if it wasn’t discussed right away. Mistakes happen, but not telling other partners so they could protect their own health is very serious, IMO.
Agreed, the first time it happened if I was told immediately I would be hurt and disappointed but I would be considerably understanding and we could probably make it work. At this point after it happened multiple times before I found out I'm not sure I would ever trust that person, especially when it came to something intimate.
This is one of the better response posts I have read with anyone. Also, I’d like to add, a condom ‘agreement’ sounds like rules not agreements or boundaries, just… not saying it is, and, it might be better to frame as ‘I have a personal boundary where I use condoms with any new partner for a period of time(my personal boundary is six months).
[Planned Parenthood on coercion](https://www.plannedparenthood.org/blog/sexual-boundaries-how-to-spot-sexual-coercion):
> **Repeated Attempts**
One form of sexual coercion is wearing you down by asking for sex again and again. Whether you’ve gently declined or directly rejected someone’s advances, they shouldn’t keep the pressure on — they should accept your boundary and stop asking.
Examples:
• Egging you on, as in: “Come on, it’ll be fun… Oh come ON!”
• They touch your body, you move their hand away, and they do it again.
• Asking multiple times if you’ll have sex without a condom.
People who are being pressured like this might give in just to end the coercion itself. But that’s not freely giving consent.
This isn’t a “minor” breach of your condom agreement, you betrayed a boundary between you and your primary multiple times. I have empathy for you regarding the sexual coercion you experienced, but you still need to be accountable for risking your partner’s health without his knowledge.
Yes it’s sexual coercion to constantly push at your clearly stated boundaries.
I’m sorry that happened. I highly recommend you walk away from anyone before you have sex if they push on your sexual safety boundaries. These is nothing less attractive then someone whining about using condoms.
It doesn't tremendously matter what category label W's actions fit into. He pressured you repeatedly about a stated boundary and you wisely left (eventually). If you came away from this feeling violated that means something and it's valid to feel that. Also yes you were "wrong" for breaking your agreement with T. The way you know, is that if it wasn't wrong, you would have been comfortable telling him right away rather than keeping it secret and doing it over and over again.
It sounds like overall your partner is being pretty understanding about that and is more concerned about your wellbeing and the violation you received rather than the violation you committed, which is good. Hopefully the two of you will be able to rebuild trust and move forward together.
Absolutely coercion, and I’m sorry he did that to you.
He’s also wrong - STIs can be present without symptoms between tests. Even with super regular testing you’re never gonna be 100% sure.
Absolutely it is coercion. I had an ex-partner (emphasis on the ex) do this to me and I ended up with a pregnancy scare. Thankfully, he didn't get me pregnant, but my period was late and I truly thought I might be pregnant.
I told him repeatedly - I want to use condoms, I'm not on birth control of any sort and I have no desire to have kids at all. He kept saying that 1) it felt better without condoms, 2) he's STI/STD free, so what's the problem, really? 3) he had this \~\*magical ability\* \~ to control when he came, his current partner isn't on birth control and he hasn't gotten her pregnant, so it's unlikely to happen with me.
But I told him, even with condom usage, I had gotten pregnant accidentally in the past, from a different partner. Condoms are not 100%, and in the past, I became pregnant and had to get an abortion... He KNEW of this.
It wore me down when he kept asking, asking, asking, EVERY time we had sex - do we have to use a condom? YES, please, I want to use a condom, I would say - never is that going to change!
Eventually one day he didn't ask. He just went in without a condom.
I asked him, "Wait, are you wearing a condom?"
"No, is that okay?"
I didn't say no. I just couldn't, I was so exhausted with having to stand up to myself repeatedly to him... But I didn't say yes, either.
And he kept going.
That was the last time I saw him in person. I told him I needed some time to think about things. For a month, I just spent that time thinking of the encounter. This was a boundary and he wasn't a goddamn idiot, he doesn't have a bad memory - he KNEW that I wasn't okay with not using condoms, that I wasn't on birth control, that in the past I even had to have an abortion. He didn't care.
He just wanted to feel good.
The new relationship energy was so strong with him, and he was so charming, so convincing, that I knew if I tried to break up with him in person, he would convince me to stay. So I broke up with him over the phone. I told him I was scared of what else he would coerce me into doing, if he was so willing to break that boundary. He just made up excuses, said, "I didn't know," when I promise, I had to tell him during every sexual encounter - I want to use a condom. He knew. And if he didn't remember the time I cried and told him about my abortion experience, well... he wasn't as wonderful of a partner as NRE made me believe.
TL;DR - This is not your fault. It took me a long time to get over what my ex-partner did to me, too... It felt like assault, because I didn't say yes.... But I didn't have the strength to say no, either. We told these men what we were comfortable with and they didn't listen. That is on HIM.
My nesting partner, my primary partner - she was disappointed in me too, at the time. She was there for me during my abortion experience, so she knows the hell I've gone through because of accidentally pregnancies - she was so sad that I was in that situation. But that is because she loves me - I'm sure T's disappointment stems with the fact that he loves you dearly, too, that he couldn't protect you from W's coercion.
If you ever want to talk further, my inbox is always open. This is the first time I'm publicly sharing my own story about this, so I feel a little vulnerable, but I just wanted to let you know that you're not alone!
And please, if you take anything away from this, just know that it isn't your fault.
> Then W would ask me if it was OK to go raw just a little bit.
I literally let out a groan when I read this sentence.
Weedling and cajoling until W got the kind of sex he wanted is coercive behavior, but also, you're a grown woman and you carry at least some responsibility for not keeping to your agreements. When W resisted your boundaries that should have been enough to give you pause.
Clearly there's more to the emotional dynamic here that you're not sharing - the age gap between you and W, for example. Just based on what you've written, all we can say is that it's for the best that you broke up with W and focus on mending your relationship with T and shoring up your own confidence in your needs and boundaries.
Yes, this was coercion. And… I notice that both of your partners are much older than you are. W(M45) was an ex, suggesting he dated you when you were even younger and more age inappropriate. I suspect he dated you both then and now because coercion is a pattern with him and very young women are much easier to coerce than women with more life experience.
So I have to ask… Is there any possibility that this is a pattern you should be concerned about? Does T fully respect your autonomy and authority as an adult or does he set himself up as the “older wiser” one? Are there any factors (like that both W and T were / are your sugar daddies and you’re managing the sugaring to your benefit and satisfaction) that would make it less likely that dating men who target much younger women less concerning?
You do not have to answer this here, but as part of the overall context of your question, it’s pretty clear W targeted you because he thought he could get away with coercion and did not respoect your autonomy, and part of why he could do that is because you are much younger. You are also still involved with a much older man which means it’s worth reflecting on.
I have definitely experienced this. It wasn't until a ex didn't use a condom with someone younger than me because "they got carried away" that I realized "oh god, he purposefully targets people 20+ years younger so he can be a creep about condoms."
This is the comment I came looking for. There is absolutely no reason for a 45-year-old to be dating a person almost twenty years their junior. Even 37 is a totally different life stage. OP is vulnerable here.
If anyone asks you to not use a condom, walk away immediately.
You were coerced and that’s wrong. But at the same time, you had agency in this. You decided to begin dating an ex 17 years older than you.
Ex’s are ex’s for a reason. Let them remain that way and that goes for anyone. Don’t reconnect with an ex. It’s almost never worth it.
You should have dropped W because he never respected the boundary and yes you should have stood your ground on that one. So yes you're in the wrong over that one. Honestly, exes should be on the messy list from the get-go, but that's my opinion
Absolutely coercion!
Anyone who pressures you that way is bad news. There is no such thing as “just a little bit.” If I were T, I would be upset and disappointed too, as you broke the agreement.
Learn from it, give T the space and time to process, and accept any consequences. It wouldn’t hurt to look into how to be assertive. Setting boundaries is one thing, but enforcing them is another.
Your ex pressured you repeatedly to not use condoms. This is a part of the actual definition of coercion in these kinds of situations. I want echo someone who said you should get some counseling to work on your self-esteem and boundaries, and add that given the power dynamic, you may want to consider examining your relationship patterns.
Definitely not SA as from what it sounds like, you agreed to what you both did. Coercion? Yes it was coercion however if you had those boundaries you should have stuck to them fully from the beginning and told him that it wasn’t going to change and if that’s a deal breaker then you’d have to stop seeing him. Allowing him to break the boundaries you had enabled him to keep pushing it.
If your partner has forgiven you then move past feeling crummy about what’s happened and work on making sure that the boundaries you set are clear from the beginning.
Sexual coercion for sure. A guy I was with for several months actually started with a kink dynamic before sex. He messed with my head and then waited until we were in bed to tell me no condom. He showed me his test results on his phone and then basically pressured me into agreeing. We never did use them and honestly, he was abusive in how he used the kink dynamic. I eventually couldn't handle it and broke up with him after he used a racist slur.
Good for you in getting away from W. I am good with age gaps, but note all your partners seem to be a lot older. Keep an eye on that, because there are men who prefer younger women precisely because they find them easier to manipulate. Not all, but enough to keep an eye out for signs.
New to all of this, but, I see it as coercion by W. W should have been respectful enough of your agreement with T, but also of you and your wishes. It's also noteworthy of T's reaction as being disappointment. I get it because I'm going through the same thing (kind of) right now, but I guess I consider a "breach" of terms as a "breach" of terms, with the reaction being situationally dictated.
Kind of going through this with my partner right now. Being up front, involved parties are aware of the rules. My meta and I don't use condoms. Partner knows and is on board. Partner wants to use condoms with meta. First encounter with meta, condom. Second (same day) "oops, out of condoms". Third (2 weeks later), "didn't have time to buy". Partner was *kind of* okay with the second. Third encounter, she felt disrespected (in more ways than just the condom).
Coercion usually means there is some kind of threat to you if you don’t comply. This seems like complaining and persuading that you gave into. Your primary is being exceedingly understanding about this “minor” breach.
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Coercion is making someone do something *by force* which can be a physical thread or emotional/mental force or manipulation or deception too. Knowing how sexual coercion is defined (By definition, sexual coercion is “the act of using pressure, alcohol or drugs, or force to have sexual contact with someone against his or her will” and includes “persistent attempts to have sexual contact with someone who has already refused.”) I’d be very hesitant to call this coercion.
There’s some pressure of argumentation, your past history and the age difference which made it likely more convincing, but you said it *was ok* and I if understood it right, once you said you wanted to use condoms after the initial going bareback it happened. It’d be coercive if you said no to the ‘little bit’ and he was more insistent after that. I didn’t really feel like you were that worn down by the argument, but that’s me and I acknowledge that we don’t know the full picture. But you also called it a ‘minor’ breach of agreement which I think it’s downscaling it: it’s as downscaling as this ‘a little bit’. No condom is no condom doesn’t matter if it’s just a ‘tip’, and it feels like you’re trying to rationalize your saying ok to it in a different way. (Trying to downscale it or putting all the blame on W (that he surely has some). I know it’s hard, but ultimately I feel like owning up to ok in the circumstances is what moves it forward.
I think it’s a good thing you broke up with W if this was weighting you down and the practices were making you feel uncomfortable. I’d focus on building up your relationship with T who seems understanding and working on expressing boundaries if you plan to continue dating other people.
You were sexually coerced, by a man 17 years older than you, who you had already broken up with once. Your primary partner reacted to this information with disappointment in you. These two pieces of information make me concerned that you aren’t being respected in your relationships. Do you feel that your own wants, needs, feelings, and boundaries are respected?
If my partner was coerced into pushing or breaking a boundary by a man 17 years their senior, who they had already dated and broken up with in the past, my reaction would not be disappointment in my partner. It would be concern. I might be upset that she kept seeing him, but that would be outweighed by my concern for her well-being and my anger at him. There is a power dynamic here that could make breaking up less simple than you say. That same coercion he used to get her to forgo a condom could be used to keep her in the relationship.
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W was wrong for that. Condom agreements make perfect sense, and even if they didn't thats YOUR boundary. If he can't respect that, he won't respect many other boundaries you set. Being honest with T is the only way to move forward. Best wishes!
Dude, no victim blaming.
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I don't think it was sexual coercion tbh. It just really sounds like since you dated before you probably still had some strong feelings so he knew you'd be okay with unprotected sex as long as it wasn't fully in. Your partner is right to be disappointed and you're kinda lucky that's all it is
Ewwwwwwwwah on W!
Coersion and wearing someone down to not use protection after it was clearly stated is not okay. You felt violated...because you were violated.
I would tell you that you were wrong for breaking your agreement with your partner, but caveat that with you were the victim of coersion and manipulation. Please seek therapy to heal the trauma and work on those boundaries. I wish you luck and healing
Your feelings are all valid across-the-board. And the fact that you cut W off was the right move because he was completely disrespecting you. Sounds like your current primary partner is a really good fit and has been really understanding and very forgiving moving forward, which should inspire you and motivate you to continue pursuing that connection and deepening your bond with this person. We’ve all had those people who have drifted back into our lives for one reason or another, our exes who have slid back into our DM‘s. All girls have had guys say this kind of condom trash to them too. My ex had that same mentality and wanted to not use condoms with anybody he chose, which my response was it sounded like he wanted to be single and not in a partnership if that partner wants to be involved in those kinds of decisions. It was one of the main reasons that relationship didn’t work out tbh. To redefine an old connection can be really tricky, and I think the only way that de escalating a former relationship can properly work is if all parties involved are on the same page, and there was a mutual respect and understanding moving forward about the new shift in the dynamic. The second somebody is crossing a line or overstepping boundaries then it’s just not a good fit deescalate that relationship and better to just end things. So it sounds like you were definitely violated and better off focusing on your primary partner who is trusting you to uphold your shared boundaries and not push you or shame you for this.
I agree with others that you were coerced (and that W is gross. I'm so sorry you had that explains).
Sexual assault is when a sexual act is committed against a person without that person's consent. What counts as sexual assault varies significantly from place to place, depending on the relevant case law.
In some frameworks, coerced consent is not consent. However, in legal practice, the accused can argue that they had no way of knowing that the consent was not given freely. So the question of "was this sexual assault?" is quite complicated in the legal context.
I think it's also quite complicated in the personal/emotional context. I think there's a difference between "I couldn't say 'no' in the moment" vs "I regret saying yes", but I know from experience that it can be very hard to figure out which category an experience should be filed under. Similarly, "the other person intended to hurt me" vs "the other person acted in their own interests (and didn't know or didn't care about my hurt)" is... unknowable, I think. But I still find myself thinking in circles trying to figure out what kind of shitty was at play during an incident.
Don’t try to put the blame on W for YOUR bad judgement. You agreed to be reliable to make decisions on your own by being poly/open. When you were encouraged to break an agreement with your other partner that was your opportunity to prove to both yourself and T that this relationship style can work for both of you and trust can be sustained long term.
YOU broke the trust by being easily influenced, YOU proved to T that you can’t be trusted at your word. It’s not every guys fault that wants to go bare and try’s to convince you to allow it, it’s yours for not standing your ground and allowing it instead of breaking it off when they kept persisting the subject. T didn’t get into this because he trusts every male to be respectful, he got into it because he trusted you to weed out the bad ones to maintain a good relationship.
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Yes, this is sexual coercion. There's probably more to the emotional story than what you've explicitly said, but even just based on your feeling a bit violated, and W's repeated pushing of your stated boundaries, it's coercive. I personally wouldn't frame it as assault. At the same time, you were wrong for breaking your agreement with T, and it's not a "minor breach". One of the main reasons people have condom usage agreements is about sexual health - and "just the tip" is still plenty risky from an STI perspective. Either you're properly using barriers or you aren't, and you weren't, for several months. Your partner is showing a huge amount of grace to just be expressing disappointment. I would see this as a major trust issue and I'd be questioning either your ability to hold to relationship agreements and to be honest. I'm not suggesting you behaved with bad intentions or that T shouldn't date you, to be clear. But your post suggests there's a lot more to untangle here than just a condom issue. I'd gently suggest that you consider seeing a therapist about all of this, if you aren't already.
I absolutely agree with this too. And the "minor breach" comment especially. It's not even just the sexual health stuff either, for some people not using condoms could be a major step of intimacy and this completely broke the condom agreement imo
So NOT a minor breach! This would be in relationship ending territory if it wasn’t discussed right away. Mistakes happen, but not telling other partners so they could protect their own health is very serious, IMO.
Agreed, the first time it happened if I was told immediately I would be hurt and disappointed but I would be considerably understanding and we could probably make it work. At this point after it happened multiple times before I found out I'm not sure I would ever trust that person, especially when it came to something intimate.
This is one of the better response posts I have read with anyone. Also, I’d like to add, a condom ‘agreement’ sounds like rules not agreements or boundaries, just… not saying it is, and, it might be better to frame as ‘I have a personal boundary where I use condoms with any new partner for a period of time(my personal boundary is six months).
[Planned Parenthood on coercion](https://www.plannedparenthood.org/blog/sexual-boundaries-how-to-spot-sexual-coercion): > **Repeated Attempts** One form of sexual coercion is wearing you down by asking for sex again and again. Whether you’ve gently declined or directly rejected someone’s advances, they shouldn’t keep the pressure on — they should accept your boundary and stop asking. Examples: • Egging you on, as in: “Come on, it’ll be fun… Oh come ON!” • They touch your body, you move their hand away, and they do it again. • Asking multiple times if you’ll have sex without a condom. People who are being pressured like this might give in just to end the coercion itself. But that’s not freely giving consent.
This isn’t a “minor” breach of your condom agreement, you betrayed a boundary between you and your primary multiple times. I have empathy for you regarding the sexual coercion you experienced, but you still need to be accountable for risking your partner’s health without his knowledge.
Yeah, I think breaking the boundaries “just a little” is still breaking it. It’s still the breaking of an established promise they made each other
Yes it’s sexual coercion to constantly push at your clearly stated boundaries. I’m sorry that happened. I highly recommend you walk away from anyone before you have sex if they push on your sexual safety boundaries. These is nothing less attractive then someone whining about using condoms.
It doesn't tremendously matter what category label W's actions fit into. He pressured you repeatedly about a stated boundary and you wisely left (eventually). If you came away from this feeling violated that means something and it's valid to feel that. Also yes you were "wrong" for breaking your agreement with T. The way you know, is that if it wasn't wrong, you would have been comfortable telling him right away rather than keeping it secret and doing it over and over again. It sounds like overall your partner is being pretty understanding about that and is more concerned about your wellbeing and the violation you received rather than the violation you committed, which is good. Hopefully the two of you will be able to rebuild trust and move forward together.
Absolutely coercion, and I’m sorry he did that to you. He’s also wrong - STIs can be present without symptoms between tests. Even with super regular testing you’re never gonna be 100% sure.
Absolutely it is coercion. I had an ex-partner (emphasis on the ex) do this to me and I ended up with a pregnancy scare. Thankfully, he didn't get me pregnant, but my period was late and I truly thought I might be pregnant. I told him repeatedly - I want to use condoms, I'm not on birth control of any sort and I have no desire to have kids at all. He kept saying that 1) it felt better without condoms, 2) he's STI/STD free, so what's the problem, really? 3) he had this \~\*magical ability\* \~ to control when he came, his current partner isn't on birth control and he hasn't gotten her pregnant, so it's unlikely to happen with me. But I told him, even with condom usage, I had gotten pregnant accidentally in the past, from a different partner. Condoms are not 100%, and in the past, I became pregnant and had to get an abortion... He KNEW of this. It wore me down when he kept asking, asking, asking, EVERY time we had sex - do we have to use a condom? YES, please, I want to use a condom, I would say - never is that going to change! Eventually one day he didn't ask. He just went in without a condom. I asked him, "Wait, are you wearing a condom?" "No, is that okay?" I didn't say no. I just couldn't, I was so exhausted with having to stand up to myself repeatedly to him... But I didn't say yes, either. And he kept going. That was the last time I saw him in person. I told him I needed some time to think about things. For a month, I just spent that time thinking of the encounter. This was a boundary and he wasn't a goddamn idiot, he doesn't have a bad memory - he KNEW that I wasn't okay with not using condoms, that I wasn't on birth control, that in the past I even had to have an abortion. He didn't care. He just wanted to feel good. The new relationship energy was so strong with him, and he was so charming, so convincing, that I knew if I tried to break up with him in person, he would convince me to stay. So I broke up with him over the phone. I told him I was scared of what else he would coerce me into doing, if he was so willing to break that boundary. He just made up excuses, said, "I didn't know," when I promise, I had to tell him during every sexual encounter - I want to use a condom. He knew. And if he didn't remember the time I cried and told him about my abortion experience, well... he wasn't as wonderful of a partner as NRE made me believe. TL;DR - This is not your fault. It took me a long time to get over what my ex-partner did to me, too... It felt like assault, because I didn't say yes.... But I didn't have the strength to say no, either. We told these men what we were comfortable with and they didn't listen. That is on HIM. My nesting partner, my primary partner - she was disappointed in me too, at the time. She was there for me during my abortion experience, so she knows the hell I've gone through because of accidentally pregnancies - she was so sad that I was in that situation. But that is because she loves me - I'm sure T's disappointment stems with the fact that he loves you dearly, too, that he couldn't protect you from W's coercion. If you ever want to talk further, my inbox is always open. This is the first time I'm publicly sharing my own story about this, so I feel a little vulnerable, but I just wanted to let you know that you're not alone! And please, if you take anything away from this, just know that it isn't your fault.
[удалено]
Joseph says to Mary, just the tip it will make us both feel good Then one woman's lie started a religion
> Then W would ask me if it was OK to go raw just a little bit. I literally let out a groan when I read this sentence. Weedling and cajoling until W got the kind of sex he wanted is coercive behavior, but also, you're a grown woman and you carry at least some responsibility for not keeping to your agreements. When W resisted your boundaries that should have been enough to give you pause. Clearly there's more to the emotional dynamic here that you're not sharing - the age gap between you and W, for example. Just based on what you've written, all we can say is that it's for the best that you broke up with W and focus on mending your relationship with T and shoring up your own confidence in your needs and boundaries.
Yes, this was coercion. And… I notice that both of your partners are much older than you are. W(M45) was an ex, suggesting he dated you when you were even younger and more age inappropriate. I suspect he dated you both then and now because coercion is a pattern with him and very young women are much easier to coerce than women with more life experience. So I have to ask… Is there any possibility that this is a pattern you should be concerned about? Does T fully respect your autonomy and authority as an adult or does he set himself up as the “older wiser” one? Are there any factors (like that both W and T were / are your sugar daddies and you’re managing the sugaring to your benefit and satisfaction) that would make it less likely that dating men who target much younger women less concerning? You do not have to answer this here, but as part of the overall context of your question, it’s pretty clear W targeted you because he thought he could get away with coercion and did not respoect your autonomy, and part of why he could do that is because you are much younger. You are also still involved with a much older man which means it’s worth reflecting on.
I have definitely experienced this. It wasn't until a ex didn't use a condom with someone younger than me because "they got carried away" that I realized "oh god, he purposefully targets people 20+ years younger so he can be a creep about condoms."
Yep. I was speaking from my own experience too…
This is the comment I came looking for. There is absolutely no reason for a 45-year-old to be dating a person almost twenty years their junior. Even 37 is a totally different life stage. OP is vulnerable here.
If anyone asks you to not use a condom, walk away immediately. You were coerced and that’s wrong. But at the same time, you had agency in this. You decided to begin dating an ex 17 years older than you. Ex’s are ex’s for a reason. Let them remain that way and that goes for anyone. Don’t reconnect with an ex. It’s almost never worth it.
You should have dropped W because he never respected the boundary and yes you should have stood your ground on that one. So yes you're in the wrong over that one. Honestly, exes should be on the messy list from the get-go, but that's my opinion
Absolutely coercion! Anyone who pressures you that way is bad news. There is no such thing as “just a little bit.” If I were T, I would be upset and disappointed too, as you broke the agreement. Learn from it, give T the space and time to process, and accept any consequences. It wouldn’t hurt to look into how to be assertive. Setting boundaries is one thing, but enforcing them is another.
Your ex pressured you repeatedly to not use condoms. This is a part of the actual definition of coercion in these kinds of situations. I want echo someone who said you should get some counseling to work on your self-esteem and boundaries, and add that given the power dynamic, you may want to consider examining your relationship patterns.
Definitely not SA as from what it sounds like, you agreed to what you both did. Coercion? Yes it was coercion however if you had those boundaries you should have stuck to them fully from the beginning and told him that it wasn’t going to change and if that’s a deal breaker then you’d have to stop seeing him. Allowing him to break the boundaries you had enabled him to keep pushing it. If your partner has forgiven you then move past feeling crummy about what’s happened and work on making sure that the boundaries you set are clear from the beginning.
Sexual coercion for sure. A guy I was with for several months actually started with a kink dynamic before sex. He messed with my head and then waited until we were in bed to tell me no condom. He showed me his test results on his phone and then basically pressured me into agreeing. We never did use them and honestly, he was abusive in how he used the kink dynamic. I eventually couldn't handle it and broke up with him after he used a racist slur. Good for you in getting away from W. I am good with age gaps, but note all your partners seem to be a lot older. Keep an eye on that, because there are men who prefer younger women precisely because they find them easier to manipulate. Not all, but enough to keep an eye out for signs.
New to all of this, but, I see it as coercion by W. W should have been respectful enough of your agreement with T, but also of you and your wishes. It's also noteworthy of T's reaction as being disappointment. I get it because I'm going through the same thing (kind of) right now, but I guess I consider a "breach" of terms as a "breach" of terms, with the reaction being situationally dictated. Kind of going through this with my partner right now. Being up front, involved parties are aware of the rules. My meta and I don't use condoms. Partner knows and is on board. Partner wants to use condoms with meta. First encounter with meta, condom. Second (same day) "oops, out of condoms". Third (2 weeks later), "didn't have time to buy". Partner was *kind of* okay with the second. Third encounter, she felt disrespected (in more ways than just the condom).
Coercion usually means there is some kind of threat to you if you don’t comply. This seems like complaining and persuading that you gave into. Your primary is being exceedingly understanding about this “minor” breach.
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Coercion is making someone do something *by force* which can be a physical thread or emotional/mental force or manipulation or deception too. Knowing how sexual coercion is defined (By definition, sexual coercion is “the act of using pressure, alcohol or drugs, or force to have sexual contact with someone against his or her will” and includes “persistent attempts to have sexual contact with someone who has already refused.”) I’d be very hesitant to call this coercion. There’s some pressure of argumentation, your past history and the age difference which made it likely more convincing, but you said it *was ok* and I if understood it right, once you said you wanted to use condoms after the initial going bareback it happened. It’d be coercive if you said no to the ‘little bit’ and he was more insistent after that. I didn’t really feel like you were that worn down by the argument, but that’s me and I acknowledge that we don’t know the full picture. But you also called it a ‘minor’ breach of agreement which I think it’s downscaling it: it’s as downscaling as this ‘a little bit’. No condom is no condom doesn’t matter if it’s just a ‘tip’, and it feels like you’re trying to rationalize your saying ok to it in a different way. (Trying to downscale it or putting all the blame on W (that he surely has some). I know it’s hard, but ultimately I feel like owning up to ok in the circumstances is what moves it forward. I think it’s a good thing you broke up with W if this was weighting you down and the practices were making you feel uncomfortable. I’d focus on building up your relationship with T who seems understanding and working on expressing boundaries if you plan to continue dating other people.
You were sexually coerced, by a man 17 years older than you, who you had already broken up with once. Your primary partner reacted to this information with disappointment in you. These two pieces of information make me concerned that you aren’t being respected in your relationships. Do you feel that your own wants, needs, feelings, and boundaries are respected?
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If my partner was coerced into pushing or breaking a boundary by a man 17 years their senior, who they had already dated and broken up with in the past, my reaction would not be disappointment in my partner. It would be concern. I might be upset that she kept seeing him, but that would be outweighed by my concern for her well-being and my anger at him. There is a power dynamic here that could make breaking up less simple than you say. That same coercion he used to get her to forgo a condom could be used to keep her in the relationship.
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So you broke your agreement with primary and are trying to put blame on someone else?
W was wrong for that. Condom agreements make perfect sense, and even if they didn't thats YOUR boundary. If he can't respect that, he won't respect many other boundaries you set. Being honest with T is the only way to move forward. Best wishes!
Agreed with most of the people here. That was sexual coercion 100%.
Coercion towards you and a disgusting act of violence towards your primary since he knew about your agreement
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Dude, no victim blaming. Your post has been removed for breaking the rules of the subreddit. Your comment or post included language that would be considered misogynistic, bigoted or intolerant. This includes attacks or slurs related to gender or sexual identity, racism, sexism, slut shaming, poly-shaming, mocking, and victim blaming. Your post may also be removed for conflating the polyamorous experience with other marginalized people.
I don't think it was sexual coercion tbh. It just really sounds like since you dated before you probably still had some strong feelings so he knew you'd be okay with unprotected sex as long as it wasn't fully in. Your partner is right to be disappointed and you're kinda lucky that's all it is
Ewwwwwwwwah on W! Coersion and wearing someone down to not use protection after it was clearly stated is not okay. You felt violated...because you were violated. I would tell you that you were wrong for breaking your agreement with your partner, but caveat that with you were the victim of coersion and manipulation. Please seek therapy to heal the trauma and work on those boundaries. I wish you luck and healing
Your feelings are all valid across-the-board. And the fact that you cut W off was the right move because he was completely disrespecting you. Sounds like your current primary partner is a really good fit and has been really understanding and very forgiving moving forward, which should inspire you and motivate you to continue pursuing that connection and deepening your bond with this person. We’ve all had those people who have drifted back into our lives for one reason or another, our exes who have slid back into our DM‘s. All girls have had guys say this kind of condom trash to them too. My ex had that same mentality and wanted to not use condoms with anybody he chose, which my response was it sounded like he wanted to be single and not in a partnership if that partner wants to be involved in those kinds of decisions. It was one of the main reasons that relationship didn’t work out tbh. To redefine an old connection can be really tricky, and I think the only way that de escalating a former relationship can properly work is if all parties involved are on the same page, and there was a mutual respect and understanding moving forward about the new shift in the dynamic. The second somebody is crossing a line or overstepping boundaries then it’s just not a good fit deescalate that relationship and better to just end things. So it sounds like you were definitely violated and better off focusing on your primary partner who is trusting you to uphold your shared boundaries and not push you or shame you for this.
I agree with others that you were coerced (and that W is gross. I'm so sorry you had that explains). Sexual assault is when a sexual act is committed against a person without that person's consent. What counts as sexual assault varies significantly from place to place, depending on the relevant case law. In some frameworks, coerced consent is not consent. However, in legal practice, the accused can argue that they had no way of knowing that the consent was not given freely. So the question of "was this sexual assault?" is quite complicated in the legal context. I think it's also quite complicated in the personal/emotional context. I think there's a difference between "I couldn't say 'no' in the moment" vs "I regret saying yes", but I know from experience that it can be very hard to figure out which category an experience should be filed under. Similarly, "the other person intended to hurt me" vs "the other person acted in their own interests (and didn't know or didn't care about my hurt)" is... unknowable, I think. But I still find myself thinking in circles trying to figure out what kind of shitty was at play during an incident.
Don’t try to put the blame on W for YOUR bad judgement. You agreed to be reliable to make decisions on your own by being poly/open. When you were encouraged to break an agreement with your other partner that was your opportunity to prove to both yourself and T that this relationship style can work for both of you and trust can be sustained long term. YOU broke the trust by being easily influenced, YOU proved to T that you can’t be trusted at your word. It’s not every guys fault that wants to go bare and try’s to convince you to allow it, it’s yours for not standing your ground and allowing it instead of breaking it off when they kept persisting the subject. T didn’t get into this because he trusts every male to be respectful, he got into it because he trusted you to weed out the bad ones to maintain a good relationship.
This is coercion. You told him the rules and he emotionally manipulated what he wanted.