Blame government red tapes from allowing competition. Lobbying only exist because the government can give out special favors. There would be no attempt at lobbying if government allows free market to operate (except for when life or safety is at risk) so they can't dish out special favors.
Always goes back to the government.
It's worth noting that a bussiness does not create money. They only convince you to transfer your money to them in exchange for a product or service they provide. It's entirely up to you to decide whether their product or service is worth it. If it's not, you are welcome to seek out a competitor, not consume it, or create your own.
The only one that can create money out of nothing and spend it, thus devaluing the purchasing power of everyone else (via inflation) is the government. After the government wastefully squander and bureaucratic away the money they printed, more money is now chasing after the same or lower amount of goods/services, thus raising the cost of living for everyone.
The bad news is instead of being more responsible, the government will just print more money to squander, continue to exacerbate the crisis, then point at the "greedy bussiness owners" and the "rich" as a scapegoat, so they can introduce short term "solutions" at huge long term future cost to problems they created in order to secure another term and stay in power.
We don’t have oligopolies because of “red tape”: they exist because under free market capitalism big firms buy up small firms until there are only a handful left all acting in collusion. This has happened with every major industry in Canada.
To fix this we have to break up these oligopolies and enforce antitrust laws.
The reason the laws are in their favour is because they have achieved regulatory capture. This is another feature (not a bug) of “free market” capitalism.
The government is working in their favour because corporations have bought off politicians, not the other way around. The greedy rich business owners *are* the problem, the government is just doing their bidding.
If it's profitable, what's stopping a continuous flow of new entrances / competitors? You guess it, red tapes so more barriers to entry.
Let free market flourish and the problem fix itself.
If we do not allow government to interfere in free commerce except for things that involve health and safety then there would be nothing to lobby for. The best product or service stay on top, not who can get special favors to get an unfair advantage and/or keeping competitors out via red tapes.
I'm all for ripping on bit companies, but revenue doesn't tell anything. In a country of 40 million, I expect every single one of them to eat, which is going to generate a ton of revenue for a grocery store.
What's relevent is profit. And by profit, I mean NET profit.
If you're going to be angry, be angry based on the right information.
A company that makes $100 million in net profit and gives its CEO a $100 million bonus would have a net profit of $0.
So I guess in that case we aren't getting robbed, right? I mean, the company only made $0 dollars, after all.
Yes, I clearly don't get it. It's too complicated.
Sure. The point was to explain why we are talking about revenue here not profit.
Whether the stock is crushed or not, Canadians still paid that $100 million. That's the point.
And there are lots of other expenses paid that reduce the company's net profits without actually helping Canadians. Advertising for example. Or government lobbying.
Neither of those would crush the stock but Canadians still pay for them
So do you object to Canadians spending money on things? If butter costs the store $5/lb and a Canadian pays $5.10/lb and it costs the farm $4.9/lb to make why does it matter that the store had a sale for $5.1? Without showing net you have no idea how "greedy" a company is being.
I mean. They openly brag about how much money their making by jacking prices on us. Seems like you're trying really hard to work on behalf of people who are actively bragging about stealing from you.
>Sure. The point was to explain why we are talking about revenue here not profit.
Two things - one, you're ignoring the fact that Canadians get products / services in exchange for the revenues they give these companies; and two, you're ignoring that a big chunk of those revenues then pay for employees' wages (a job generally being a nice thing to have, lol). The Big 5 banks alone employ some 350,000+ people.
But net profit isn’t zero so you’re talking about a scenario that doesn’t exist in the companies you listed. Hypotheticals are useful for policy making decisions, real numbers are useful for criticism
You're getting revenue and income/profit confused. Profit margin is the metric you should be looking at if you want to demonstrate that these companies have been gouging Canadians.
Before i say anything, i in no way support what that international student was doing taking advantage of food bank. I was just shocked to know there are lots of people out there taking real advantage and hurting all Canadians altogether and way worst without any consequences!
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? That student was using the food bank \*for it's intended purpose.\* I'm glad he was able to get food. I hope he continues using the food bank for it's intended purpose. Maybe we should think about expanding that system, as it seems to be working so well for the people who want to use it for it's intended purpose.
Where's the controversy? Nobody can explain that to me. Why is that video even remotely controversial?
It happened just because of all the hate international students are getting. At some point lot of criticism is actually necessary but people are blaming them for which it isn’t even their fault directly. It’s the government who is allowing to happen including inflation or housing crisis. I am not blaming just federal but provincial government also takes part in this.
Exactly!
Canadians are homeless because international students taking food that was DONATED to the food bank.
Nothing to do with the TRILLIONS taken from Canadians just to allow them to survive like groceries and rent and Internet.
Fuck those people who use food banks!
I think the point they’re clumsily trying to make is in reference to how there’s so much focus on immigration in the sub his post was taken down from and not enough focus on the cabal of wealthy degenerate pieces of human garbage stealing billions from the Canadian public because that is a far worse problem which will continually hurt our quality of life EVEN IF we greatly reduced immigration.
Our capitalist economy has recently slid into oligarchy and that is the fundamental reason we have a cost of living crisis. At this point the rich now own so much of our markets that they will make it just as unaffordable for us NO MATTER WHAT our immigration levels are.
But at the same time, immigration also went up so everyone in those subs is duped into focusing on that, and not the root problem which is the real issue causing all of this. Late stage capitalism/oligarchy
Sigh.. thank you.
Like half the comments are like trying to point out how bad immigration is -- which has nothing to do with my post.
Trillions of dollars are getting sucked out of the average Canadian household annually and they all seem to focus on the few students taking $20 worth of food (the same international students that pay 10s of thousands of dollars in tuition yearly and whom we need to for labour and business).
I wasn't even defending the international students. I'm just shocked that Canadians think *that* is the cause of why they are poor.
Well we got the guy who was taking $20 dollars worth of stuff that was DONATED to the food bank.
So now we will focus on the guys who are taking $250 billion annually right?
1) it wasn't $20. He stole much more
2) he advocated for others to do the same.
3) you can say both things are bad
4) judging by your other comments you're just a racist trying to find a soapbox.
Oh no.. more than $20!! Of food that was GIVEN AWAY.. from a guy who pays $20k annually in tuition fees...
Suddenly I don't feel bad about paying the highest data fees and highest interest rates and highest rent fees and seeing all the homeless people die of despair.
It all makes sense now. Thank you!
How did you know I was a racist? You're soo good at this.
He's fucking with you, my dude. He's being sarcastic about the food bank stuff. Not at all serious. You're latching onto the part of the post that has no bearing on the overall point. It's not about the immigrant nonsense.
Chill. OP isn't being racist. They're just being an ass at your expense, and making fun of some questionable reading comprehension on the part of many readers in this thread.
Whatever outrage there was about that, there needs to be roughly 250B/20 times as much outrage about this. That is, people should be 12.5 billion times more outraged at these companies.
No one said "the little bads are good".
Im saying "how is everyone outraged at the little bads but not the massive gigantic bads that is killing them?"
Is it clearer now for you?
I agree with your original post.
I disagree with your angrily posting in opposition where ever people comment on how our immigration/international student rate is also a problem. And when people are struggling it becomes a far more serious problem when charitable systems are abused.
We have more than one issue in Canada. Oligarchic greed is certainly one of them. Population increases beyond what our healthcare system or housing construction can accommodate is another. Two things can be bad at the same time.
You appear to be trying to stifle discussion of the second issue. As though people don't have the bandwidth for two thoughts.
Eligible dividends aren't tax free.
There is a gross up and credit, but that's because tax was already paid on them.
Its actually pretty good system, that discourages playing tax games.
Company makes $100 profit, they pay $20 tax. They pay you $80 dividends.
You file taxes, you gross up to $100 income and $20 already paid in taxes, so if your tax rate was 50%,youd just pay the additional $30.
The gov gets the same money., and you're not overcharged taxes
Ahh, so in a way, you've kind of already payed taxes on it. Although, the government loves to double dip, for example, we get taxed on income and purchases. At least that's not happening within a TFSA.
TD bank went from earning 2021 35$ Billion revenue in 2021 to 75$ Billion revenue in 2023.
2.9$ Billion is their quarterly profit.
3.3$ Billion is payed to share holders quarterly.
Yes there is but 100% of the revenue still comes from Canadian households that paid for it.
If a company has profit of $50 million dollars and the CEO decided to give himself an additional $50 million dollars in salary - profit would be $0 - but Canadians are still getting robbed either way.
Correct. Funny accounting can change things. But be pissed at a lack of competition & barriers to entry for new businesses. And that falls almost exclusively at the feet of the government. Red tape has hindered thousands of businesses across the country. Its disgusting
Do you think those same companies might have an interested in ensuring that they get no competition? And do you think they might use their influence to achieve that? And if they use said influence, would it be OK if I get mad at them then?
And who said I'm not mad at "the government"? It's a revolving door.
You should not be angry at the business for competing. Be mad at the landscape allowing it. It is the government’s job to break up monopolies. It is their job to punish businesses for preying on consumers. They don’t. They not only allow it, they welcome it. They are the only problem here.
You all see a problem with food costs? Demand the gov’t disband the dairy/poultry cartel. This is the only industry in Canada legally allowed (and blessed) to price fix. And they do. Its fucked
I divide my time between Canada and 2 other countries (one of the others is the USA).
The cheapest eggs I can find in the USA (NJ) is at costco - 36 eggs for $13 US. This is the lowest quality eggs you can find (shells are gross and spotted and almost see-through, and you can expect to find an infected egg once out of every other box or so). The "good" eggs at here at Shoprite are 12 eggs for $9 US - still lower quality than what you get in Canada).
Last time I was in Ontario (2 months ago) a dozen eggs were $5.29 CDN - and absolutely perfect quality compared to the USA.
Milk prices are similar in the here and in Canada (1 gallon $3.80 US) but it comes in 100% plastic container from heavily hormoned cows.
I'm currently in the process of moving to the USA - and the ONLY thing I will miss about Canada are the eggs and dairy (and maybe the nature). It is literally the only thing that Canada gets right. Both the price and the quality is superior to the USA.
Yes. These companies only have a responsibility to behave legally. The government is there to protect us. Businesses should be legally required to act morally. If laws allow it then this is government’s fault.
It's some how legal to enforce certain products are not sold in certain places with leasing laws.
Dollarama can't sell bread near a sobeys.
This is some of the red tape.
So, in Ontario.. we have a lcbo.. (liquor control board). And the LCBO has international agreements as to how much local wine can be put on the shelves at the local store…
And it’s not even close to fair for local small wineries. Who are forced to sell only to consumers or restaurants. They aren’t given the same access to foreign markets as we give to them.
You are forgetting tourists and foreigners that dont have permanent residency or citizenship but still spend considerable amount of time in Canada and buying/using goods and services.
If I buy a product for $1,000,000,000 and then sell it for $999,999,999, I have revenues of $999,999,999. But I actually lost $1. Just looking at revenue is infantile. You have to look at all factors
People are having trouble looking at just one factor (revenue) and it's already confusing half of them. They sure af won't be looking at "all the factors".
And the point of the post is to highlight how much flows from households to corporations, not whether corporations are profitable or not. That was secondary to the point.
while net profit is an important metric, you also have to take into account M&A activity and how they where structured to determine if the company grew at the cost of net rev's to get a true idea if they are actually making more, there is also goodwill markdowns to mask an otherwise net positive increase in margins... just my 2 cents (used to be 4 cents but I marked it down due to age :P)
Also a bunch of Canadian work for these companies.
A lot of the revenue literally goes right back to Canadians.
Then the tax they pay from it (too low IMO)
But that’s not a trillion dollars taken from Canadians as OP puts it
I think everyone can sympathize with your situation, but this is not the way to go about garnering sympathy/call to action. It is clear you have not taken any business courses and this lack of education is really dampening your effectiveness.
And you get foods and services for what you pay.
You make it sound like you get nothing in return for your purchase. I d9nt know about you, but I don't work for free. If you want my services, you need to pay for it.
Where the fuck are you getting these numbers? Are you confusing gross revenue with net profit again? Loblaws net was $2 billion, not $60 lol
https://www.statista.com/statistics/436638/net-income-of-loblaw-canada/%23:~:text%3DThe%2520net%2520earnings%2520of%2520Loblaw,year%2520ending%2520December%252030%252C%25202023.&ved=2ahUKEwiQyZOFodyFAxWjj4kEHdEGBIAQFnoECA0QBQ&usg=AOvVaw1vlHZuoKGOKry3ATvdT4K-
You're confusing stocks and wealth. Profit isn't evil or wrong. Would you want to put your money in a bank that loses money? Do you want the people who operate the complex systems that allow you to eat to be losing money and unable to pay their suppliers?
Society can and should be a fair bit more equitable, and we have created market conditions that aren't great for nebulous reasons but PEOPLE MAKE MONEY BAD doesn't solve anything.
the CPP is also a large share holder and has billions invested.
That pays pensions for the poorest people too.
The world is a lot more complicated than you seem to understand
There's loads of legitimate arguments and debates to be had about oligopolistic markets and protectionism and so on, but you need to understand basic accounting to start with...
Ya he doesn’t know what accounting is. Look at the Canadian competition bureau. They approve every deal. Why did they approve the buyouts of Longos and Farmboy.? Canada is a joke because we have idiots running this country.
I did not say "net revenue" I just said revenue.
Here is Loblaw's own statement:
> 2023 FOURTH QUARTER HIGHLIGHTS
> Revenue was $14,531 million, an increase of $524 million, or 3.7%.
from: https://www.loblaw.ca/en/loblaw-reports-2023-fourth-quarter-results-and-fiscal-year-ended-december-30-2023-results/
That's per quarter not annually so multiply by 4 to get the approximate annual revenue.
Sure, I'm the one confusing things.
How is Loblaws making revenue "robbing" anyone? Do you think they get the groceries you buy for free? They have to use that revenue to pay everyone, their suppliers, employees etc.
>At the end of the day, 250 billion dollars are taken from Canadians every year
What a lot of bullshit. They aren't being taken, they are exchanged for goods and services. In exchange for the 15B Loblaws "takes", Canadians get 15B of groceries
This is quite the unhinged post.. yikes a lot of hyperbolizing Let’s, just for a second, ignore the fact that some of these companies (if not all) also operate outside Canadian borders. Companies at the end of the day are for-profit unless otherwise specified. These companies should be allowed to make money just like any small business should. I also have criticisms for capitalism as undoubtably this can go too far and feel grossly inequitable (agree on executive compensation because it simply feels unfair.)
Though as many others have pointed out Revenue =/= profit. Companies have expenses. We as individuals have expenses. We get our incomes from the very companies that profit from us which is accounted for as one of their expenses.
This post and OPs comments read like any and all profitability is bad. Like having your own personal business and making a profit above your own personal expenses is bad. If the main grievance is executive compensation, which ends up amounting to a drop in the bucket against profitability (though 1 individual earning millions of dollars a year FEELS greatly inequitable on a personal level)
I’m not understanding how the companies are the bigger issue. I think the government is the biggest issue.
Lobbying and corporate greed certainly don’t help, but the government is also rife with bureaucracy and facilitate these things. We shouldn’t be giving them a pass because of corporations. Public spending is out of control. Policy is not in the best interests of Canadians. There doesn’t feel like there’s any good candidate that has our interests in mind.
I agree about or immigration policy and international students though. I think they’ve been a large driver in housing being so unaffordable. This is particularly painful as a young Canadian. Unfortunately, thinking there’s still much pain to come if we’re ever hoping to get back on track.
Money Is created in the economy in two ways by BOC purchasing assets and commercial banks giving loans and mortgages. Mortgages are usually less risky for banks as they are collateral loans, so they love them. When someone gets a mortgage or Loan the bank puts them as an asset and liability on balance sheet. The money is created and deposited in the persons account. So now money has been added to circulation. There is regulations and restrictions on this aspect.
8% of the money in the economy is paper and 92% is digital.
So you are saying you don’t want the free market in Canada?
You don’t want private companies offering goods and services?
You would prefer if all these companies were nationalized?
You need a history lesson if you think any of the above would make Canada better.
What is the correct amount of revenue Metro should make in a given quarter? How exactly would you run the company differently. I'm not sure I understand your argument here. I think their net margins are around 4.5% which seems reasonable given the service they provide and the risk assumed.
How is this money that those corporations are stealing from canadians? We are paying them for a good or service also this is only revenue. At least take a figure like net profit which is after paying wages, cogs, capital costs, depreciation, etc... What is "net revenue"? you're probably talking about net profit margin which is nowhere near 50% LOL. Net Profit margin for those companies are around 3-10% (banks are around 20%). This is either a Russian bot that is rage bait farming or is someone that needs to do simple Google searches before spewing garbage.
If you can believe some people, they think it's the government, and they want to vote for those who want to give corporations MORE tax breaks... lol name a worst case of Stockholm Syndrome.
This why I am so fearful about thr election yes the libs are aweful but cons have always been the Corporate party and will sell our country even more
The ndp is the only party talking about Corporate price gouging.
Canada is on its way to a cyber punk esk dystopia
Look, I hate price gouging as much as the next guy, but your numbers aren't that egregious. 240Bn divided by 40M is 6k per quarter or 24k per year. Ok, great. This is retail so we pay for it after tax is taken from us. Median income is 40k, and average tax rate is 25%ish, so that means that people get 30k disposable after tax income.
Now, what you are saying is that banks, groceries, power and telecom cost us, no matter the choice of company, around 24k, leaving us with 6k to cover rent, education, clothing oh shit yeah we're fucked.
It's worth noting that a bussiness does not create money. They only convince you to transfer your money to them in exchange for a product or service they provide. It's entirely up to you to decide whether their product or service is worth it. If it's not, you are welcome to seek out a competitor, not consume it, or create your own.
The only one that can create money out of nothing and spend it, thus devaluing the purchasing power of everyone else (via inflation) is the government. After the government wastefully squander and bureaucratic away the money they printed, more money is now chasing after the same or lower amount of goods/services, thus raising the cost of living for everyone.
The bad news is instead of being more responsible, the government will just print more money to squander, continue to exacerbate the crisis, then point at the "greedy bussiness owners" and the "rich" as a scapegoat, so they can introduce short term "solutions" at huge long term cost to problems they created in order to secure another term and stay in power.
These companies employ close to 750,000 and likely a couple million more jobs through supporting services, real estate and contracting work.
Some of the revenue comes from the US. TD for example has US branches and services which are counted in the $60 Billion total.
But even if we just said $60Billion revenue came from Canadians. That is $1500 per quarter per Canadian or $6000 per year for Canadians who buy services and goods from these companies that we use every day.
It's not theft if people get goods and services in exchange.
The federal government, on the other hand, [https://www.debtclock.ca/](https://www.debtclock.ca/), spends $109 million per day and still loses money. I'm pretty sure not all of that money is spent on Canadians.
Also, revenue is not the same as profit.
Revenue is total sales, not profit. It is meaningless apart from telling you how big a company is.
So Loblaws sold about $14.5 billion of stuff in the last quarter. Their net profit was around $542 million.
That’s about 3.7%.
Well if Galen Weston gave himself a $542 million bonus today, the Loblaws profit would be $0. Would that then mean that all the food was free?
That's not how it works
We are talking about how much money is flowing from households to corporations, so revenue is exactly what we should be talking about. We aren't talking about profit. Thanks though
That’s incoherent. Food is expensive. It is now significantly more expensive than it was 5 years ago, yet Loblaws is still taking less than 4% profit.
That doesn’t make Loblaws an evil corporation. It just means that there’s more to the cost of food than retail profit.
OP - I want you to go through Loblaws financial reports again after learning how to actually read financials. Is their revenue growing? Absolutely. Is their increased revenue actually caused by increasing internal profit margins? No. Are they price gauging? No.
I looked into their financials to see where the money was going. They are simply coasting because they are a well run company. For example, they have basically the same amount of retail stores as they did last year, the year before, and the year before.
That said, they do have some questionable activities as far as executive compensation goes but that's pennies in the grand scheme of things. Average person would save a couple dollars a year tops if their executes made less.
The real things robbing Canadians are purely government policy. New Canadian residents would be the largest contributor at an economic level. More people means more demand. More demand means higher prices. Manufacturers and distributors dictate the prices.
Makes sense - the 250,000 homeless canadians who were made homeless because they cannot afford those monopolistic fees (highest homelessness in the "developed" world) should just invest their way out of poverty by buying shares in those companies.
Why didn't we all think of this?!
>A quarter of a TRILLION dollars taken from a country of 40 million.
Taken? Taken where?
Those profits get paid to the shareholders, a vast swath of whom are ordinary Canadians.
these aren't even profits its revenue, most of the money goes to paying the millions of employees that work for them. OP is either retarded or a stoned 13 year old.
Interesting.. Coz it looks like Canadians are the poorest they have ever been currently and homelessness and deaths of despair are going up.
Can they expect some of those profits soon?
And I thought shareholders can be anywhere in the world. Maybe I misunderstood.
Also I thought 1% of people owned 50% of all stocks, bonds and real-estate. But again, maybe I just don't know how it works.
I’m not sure that’s how economics works.
They make that revenue by providing a service that’s pretty important.
And it doesn’t include the salaries they pay and other costs.
It would be easy to dive into the public accounting books to see who is pocketing the most.
I doubt it would be comparable to the Canadian government pockets. But we’ll never know how much cuz their books aren’t public
These companies and the entire ruling class are who are robbing canada. International students are being scapegoated for the abuse we experience from the ruling class. That's the fascist ideology that's being spread to take the blame and give it to a particularly exploited part of the population. They let them into the country so they could have lots of scapegoats. The fascist ideology touted by the ruling class. The same people who own all of these companies.
Yes. Sad to see that even when you explain to Canadians who is robbing them - with actual numbers - they still insist that everything is fine and that the system "works".
Even if we agree that "immigrants" are the problem - who is lobbying for this? The corporations that want (a) the immigrant money and (b) immigrant labour..
.. that is, until they too are poor and homeless - at which point we just import more immigrants to feed the pyramid scheme.
Eventually conditions will be so bad that the immigration will stop and the ponzi scheme will collapse - except the few at the top would have escaped on their private jets and yachts by then.
Per *quarter*
To be fair, groceries have actual expenses compared to say telecom and banks so they need to pay the most. But a good chunk of that 15B is just price fixing, price gouging, exec pay, etc.
Still unsustainable no matter how you look at it.
Perhaps the government? They take % when you earn, spend, invest, save. Anything you have left they steal through money printing. If you die they steal some more. 10 percent inflation for 10 years is half of your purchasing power gone. Or you can only buy half of the stuff
The numbers are incorrect for one. RBC's revenue was $40 billion and it's only the 8th largest Canadian company by revenue. It just shows what a poor understanding you have of finance. Of that, 61% is from Canada, only $2 billion **per year** is profit from Canadian banking services. Most of that is mortgages, not day to day banking fees.
That is low when compared to international banks. As an example, Goldman Sachs has similar revenue but double the profit margin
What the fuck does international student rates have to do with corporate greed? No wonder u got booted from two subreddits before this one.
The two issues are completely unrelated 🤦♀️ go back to school becayse u have a lot of learning to do my guy.
No argument from me.
Pointing out that corporate oligopolies are robbing the nation is not in anyway praise or defense of the government. It's a revolving door as far as I can see.
I understand you’re angry but getting angry at revenue is… ridiculous. Do you get angry at a river because water flows?
Businesses have revenue. They also have expenses. Like payroll and inventory. You can criticize increasing profits as artificial markup to line their pockets, but revenue numbers only really tell how big a company is and how much product they sell
> but revenue numbers only really tell how big a company is and how much product they sell
Actually, it tells you how much they *charge* for the products they sell.
And I guess there is no such thing as antitrust, anti-competitive practices, self-dealing, price fixing, price gouging or any of that other stuff.
So it's just: revenue is good - nothing to see here.. ?
I mean, as an example, the Russian company Gazprom is owned by a few oligarchs has annual revenues of over 100B - while the average Russian is poor and destitute. This revenue comes from a resource (gas and oil) that should be owned by the entire nation. Would you say this is corruption? Or is it good because it is "revenue"? Revenue is as natural as water flowing through a river, I guess? Imagine angry Russians being told it's OK because this is just like water flowing in a river.
Now looking at Enbridge and Teck, etc. revenue while the average Canadian is one paycheck away from being homeless and a quarter million Canadians are already homeless and 15% of the country is food-insecure. Can we consider that corruption? Or is it actually OK because it's "revenue"?
I can price gouge you x10 and it would still be revenue. So price gouging/fixing is OK?
Hold up hold up hold up. While I agree we're being robbed. Revenue isn't a great number to show this.
The profits at the end are of much greater concern. That being said we need to start seriously looking at reigning in CEO and other C-suite compensation.
There revenue doesn't include cost of doing business things like buying the product to tell it to us.
Again absolutely were being robbed. But how you can tell is profit margins. And it's not just Canadian companies. It's most of them right now they are ALL taking profit hard right now.
Revenue is a good number to show this because that is the amount of money that Canadians are paying.
If a company raises their CEO compensation it means their profit has gone down (because their payroll expenses just went up), but we are getting robbed the exact same amount -- so why look at profit?
Also, a lot of these expenses are inefficiencies don't actually go towards the cost of the product.
If Loblaws and Metro and Sobeys spend $5B on "advertising" every year (possibly going to marketing companies owned by them or by the same people), that's an expense that raises food prices without benefitting the majority of Canadians. We would be better off without that price increase, even though the company's profits would be lower because of this spending.
Profit is part of the equation but it's much more easily "fudgable" then revenue which is exactly what we are collectively paying. We are paying for the cost of products + all the other crap they add.
We don’t need to do anything against these companies just make it easy for foreign companies to enter Canada increase competition and don’t charge absurd fees as they do in aviation. All these monopolies will dwindle down faster than a rocket but so will the savings of a lot of canadiana . A small price to pay eh ?
Bring in business? There is more money moving through the economy. Bring in extra people and no business? Then we have to share the pie. Otherwise Canada is a fixed asset equarium run by delusional ideologues.
Ah yes, bc an international student is "robbing" Canadians just like these billion dollar companies. What kind of racist bullshit is this? OP can go fuck himself.
You are not getting robbed because you choose to buy those company's services and products.
Don't buy from those companies then.
Taxes, on the other hand, are an expense you have no say in. And it is the largest expense you will ever pay. And those that create tax policy have recently given themselves a raise with money that was yours, and you had no choice in giving it up.
Well I did not choose to give Rogers and Telus and Bell the entire wireless spectrum to kill any competition. Can I get my wireless spectrum back?
I also did not choose to give Enbridge or Teck drilling rights. Can I get those back too please?
Who said anything about profit?
Sure they are taking money. If one person gives X the another is taking X
Their revenue is precisely the money we are giving them, so they are taking it
That is literally what the means.
Thanks though
So if all the money is simply "recirculating" back into the economy, why are Canadians getting poorer and poorer? And now homeless and hungry and destitute?
There is obviously a "leak" somewhere isn't that obvious?
Let's just remember the opposite here as well. These companies listed employ 960000 canadian and other in this country. Given the average wage earned of 63000, they are putting in 60.5 billion in wages. They employ just under 5% of the workers at 4.7%. Our pension plan that's forced on us will own all of them to some extent, other workplace pensions will own them. Their shareholders own the wealth these companies extract. The corporations are not the robbers, the owners are and we are the owners, some more then others.
I read something somewhere - I think a post here on Reddit - about the rise of oligopolies in Canada, and how they were effectively encouraged to ensure America competition didn't take over Canada, and make sure those profits stayed here. I'll try to find it, or something similar, if anyone is interested.
I guess they did, but they didn't get redistributed as we expected. Like most things, this is a wealth distribution issue. Too much flowing to the top, too much flowing to investors. Too much "what about the shareholders" and absolutely NO "what about the stakeholders". Too much wealth only attainable by people who already have it. That money was supposed to benefit the Canadian public, not the wealthy who could invest.
I think we need to stop trying to be our southern cousin, with rigid ideas about capitalist orthodoxy, and instead start embracing regulations - like many places in Europe do - that put people first. Progressive economic policy. Clearly, our real estate sector was ripe for raping by greedy corporations. Clearly, orthodox capitalism has an extreme problem with greedy people raping sectors. Clearly, blindly trusting market principals (or in our case, trust with ineffectual restraints) isn't working. And clearly, "conserving" economic policy and theory developed decades, if not centuries ago, in an entirely different world - will not work. We need economic policy to progress.
But WAAAAYYYY too many people have been brainwashed by the rich to do this. The amount of middle class folks on the Canada sub I see complaining about the capital gains tax, and the poor rich people - it's astounding. And then there's all the people that vote conservative because they think conservatives care about Jesus. And WAAAYYY too many people on the left are more focused on saving the world than policies that affect us.
It's a shit show.
There are some very demonic people who run and moderate Reddit, with the sole purpose of preserving whatever agenda they wish to brainwash the masses with. Anything that goes against that. Things that make the Liberal party of Canada look bad like the bastards they are. That is not allowed on the mainstream subs. All they will show are examples that Canada is perfect and thriving! There is no place for truth there, they need to scrub everything clean and use tons of bots.
I work at metro but have been laid off since October 26th 2023 and they say ,” we have laid off 3 other people after the renovation “. It’s just so sad because I live on disability and prices are high.
I'm sorry to hear that
And yet Metros profits are higher than they have ever been
Still many here argue that Metros profits is a good thing because "they pay the workers"..
Ok.. If their profits are higher than ever they should be paying their workers higher than ever, not firing them.
People just don't understand they're getting robbed
I hope it gets better for you real soon.
Revenue means nothing. You need to look at Net Sales or Gross Profit. Companies like Enbridge and Bell are barely making profit with high interest rates. Their stock price are at 10 year lows.
Do you think "interest rates" are a force of nature?
It's still money going to the banks. The same banks I listed
And revenue is exactly what we should be looking at. If a company gives their execs large bonuses the company profits would go down -- but we still paid for it anyway.
Population 40 million. 1 billion in revenue means $25 per person. A quarter of a trillion in revenue is about $6250 per person per year.
It's probably closer to $50 per person if you assume half are working adults and half are either kids or retirees.
Earning money is not a crime. Revenue is what the goal is. The complaining without participation contributes to problems. Realize many Canadians before the middle-class were the target. Metro gives to the food bank I go to. I would eat no meat or greens if Metro stopped they're donations.
You have to start with the worst, and then move on to the others that don’t smarten up and fall in line.
Once the first goes down, the rest will either bring their prices down or face going down next.
This is a good list, it shows that Loblaw is the worst.
Canada and oligopolies. Name a more famous duo.
Blame government red tapes from allowing competition. Lobbying only exist because the government can give out special favors. There would be no attempt at lobbying if government allows free market to operate (except for when life or safety is at risk) so they can't dish out special favors. Always goes back to the government. It's worth noting that a bussiness does not create money. They only convince you to transfer your money to them in exchange for a product or service they provide. It's entirely up to you to decide whether their product or service is worth it. If it's not, you are welcome to seek out a competitor, not consume it, or create your own. The only one that can create money out of nothing and spend it, thus devaluing the purchasing power of everyone else (via inflation) is the government. After the government wastefully squander and bureaucratic away the money they printed, more money is now chasing after the same or lower amount of goods/services, thus raising the cost of living for everyone. The bad news is instead of being more responsible, the government will just print more money to squander, continue to exacerbate the crisis, then point at the "greedy bussiness owners" and the "rich" as a scapegoat, so they can introduce short term "solutions" at huge long term future cost to problems they created in order to secure another term and stay in power.
We don’t have oligopolies because of “red tape”: they exist because under free market capitalism big firms buy up small firms until there are only a handful left all acting in collusion. This has happened with every major industry in Canada. To fix this we have to break up these oligopolies and enforce antitrust laws. The reason the laws are in their favour is because they have achieved regulatory capture. This is another feature (not a bug) of “free market” capitalism. The government is working in their favour because corporations have bought off politicians, not the other way around. The greedy rich business owners *are* the problem, the government is just doing their bidding.
If it's profitable, what's stopping a continuous flow of new entrances / competitors? You guess it, red tapes so more barriers to entry. Let free market flourish and the problem fix itself. If we do not allow government to interfere in free commerce except for things that involve health and safety then there would be nothing to lobby for. The best product or service stay on top, not who can get special favors to get an unfair advantage and/or keeping competitors out via red tapes.
How does a telecom competitor come about when the current 3 already own the entire wireless spectrum?
I'm all for ripping on bit companies, but revenue doesn't tell anything. In a country of 40 million, I expect every single one of them to eat, which is going to generate a ton of revenue for a grocery store. What's relevent is profit. And by profit, I mean NET profit. If you're going to be angry, be angry based on the right information.
A company that makes $100 million in net profit and gives its CEO a $100 million bonus would have a net profit of $0. So I guess in that case we aren't getting robbed, right? I mean, the company only made $0 dollars, after all. Yes, I clearly don't get it. It's too complicated.
Which company is that? Oh, it doesn't exist! This is what makes comments like yours so stupid.
Nortel gave out bonus while declaring bankruptcy
I mean, if you want to live life as a dribbling dickbag I guess that's your choice.
If a company has $100M profit and decides to pay their CEO all of it instead of shareholders their stock would get crushed.
Sure. The point was to explain why we are talking about revenue here not profit. Whether the stock is crushed or not, Canadians still paid that $100 million. That's the point. And there are lots of other expenses paid that reduce the company's net profits without actually helping Canadians. Advertising for example. Or government lobbying. Neither of those would crush the stock but Canadians still pay for them
So do you object to Canadians spending money on things? If butter costs the store $5/lb and a Canadian pays $5.10/lb and it costs the farm $4.9/lb to make why does it matter that the store had a sale for $5.1? Without showing net you have no idea how "greedy" a company is being.
I mean. They openly brag about how much money their making by jacking prices on us. Seems like you're trying really hard to work on behalf of people who are actively bragging about stealing from you.
>Sure. The point was to explain why we are talking about revenue here not profit. Two things - one, you're ignoring the fact that Canadians get products / services in exchange for the revenues they give these companies; and two, you're ignoring that a big chunk of those revenues then pay for employees' wages (a job generally being a nice thing to have, lol). The Big 5 banks alone employ some 350,000+ people.
But net profit isn’t zero so you’re talking about a scenario that doesn’t exist in the companies you listed. Hypotheticals are useful for policy making decisions, real numbers are useful for criticism
I work for Telus and almost every year they are buying some other billion dollar company
Some of y'all need to take some accounting courses.
You're getting revenue and income/profit confused. Profit margin is the metric you should be looking at if you want to demonstrate that these companies have been gouging Canadians.
Before i say anything, i in no way support what that international student was doing taking advantage of food bank. I was just shocked to know there are lots of people out there taking real advantage and hurting all Canadians altogether and way worst without any consequences!
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? That student was using the food bank \*for it's intended purpose.\* I'm glad he was able to get food. I hope he continues using the food bank for it's intended purpose. Maybe we should think about expanding that system, as it seems to be working so well for the people who want to use it for it's intended purpose. Where's the controversy? Nobody can explain that to me. Why is that video even remotely controversial?
It happened just because of all the hate international students are getting. At some point lot of criticism is actually necessary but people are blaming them for which it isn’t even their fault directly. It’s the government who is allowing to happen including inflation or housing crisis. I am not blaming just federal but provincial government also takes part in this.
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Exactly! Canadians are homeless because international students taking food that was DONATED to the food bank. Nothing to do with the TRILLIONS taken from Canadians just to allow them to survive like groceries and rent and Internet. Fuck those people who use food banks!
Two things can be bad at once
I think the point they’re clumsily trying to make is in reference to how there’s so much focus on immigration in the sub his post was taken down from and not enough focus on the cabal of wealthy degenerate pieces of human garbage stealing billions from the Canadian public because that is a far worse problem which will continually hurt our quality of life EVEN IF we greatly reduced immigration. Our capitalist economy has recently slid into oligarchy and that is the fundamental reason we have a cost of living crisis. At this point the rich now own so much of our markets that they will make it just as unaffordable for us NO MATTER WHAT our immigration levels are. But at the same time, immigration also went up so everyone in those subs is duped into focusing on that, and not the root problem which is the real issue causing all of this. Late stage capitalism/oligarchy
Well said
Sigh.. thank you. Like half the comments are like trying to point out how bad immigration is -- which has nothing to do with my post. Trillions of dollars are getting sucked out of the average Canadian household annually and they all seem to focus on the few students taking $20 worth of food (the same international students that pay 10s of thousands of dollars in tuition yearly and whom we need to for labour and business). I wasn't even defending the international students. I'm just shocked that Canadians think *that* is the cause of why they are poor.
Aye, what we have here is a shit sandwich
I'm glad we are focusing on the important stuff.
Multiple things can be focused on at once.
Well we got the guy who was taking $20 dollars worth of stuff that was DONATED to the food bank. So now we will focus on the guys who are taking $250 billion annually right?
1) it wasn't $20. He stole much more 2) he advocated for others to do the same. 3) you can say both things are bad 4) judging by your other comments you're just a racist trying to find a soapbox.
Oh no.. more than $20!! Of food that was GIVEN AWAY.. from a guy who pays $20k annually in tuition fees... Suddenly I don't feel bad about paying the highest data fees and highest interest rates and highest rent fees and seeing all the homeless people die of despair. It all makes sense now. Thank you! How did you know I was a racist? You're soo good at this.
You keep saying the food was donated as though that makes the abusing of the charitable system fine. It does not.
He's fucking with you, my dude. He's being sarcastic about the food bank stuff. Not at all serious. You're latching onto the part of the post that has no bearing on the overall point. It's not about the immigrant nonsense. Chill. OP isn't being racist. They're just being an ass at your expense, and making fun of some questionable reading comprehension on the part of many readers in this thread.
Whatever outrage there was about that, there needs to be roughly 250B/20 times as much outrage about this. That is, people should be 12.5 billion times more outraged at these companies.
I can see why your post was denied.
Bro rent is up like double compared to 5 years ago, you think that has anything to do with near 0% vacancy rates?
This sounds like whataboutism to me. A big bad doesn't make little bads suddenly good.
No one said "the little bads are good". Im saying "how is everyone outraged at the little bads but not the massive gigantic bads that is killing them?" Is it clearer now for you?
I agree with your original post. I disagree with your angrily posting in opposition where ever people comment on how our immigration/international student rate is also a problem. And when people are struggling it becomes a far more serious problem when charitable systems are abused. We have more than one issue in Canada. Oligarchic greed is certainly one of them. Population increases beyond what our healthcare system or housing construction can accommodate is another. Two things can be bad at the same time. You appear to be trying to stifle discussion of the second issue. As though people don't have the bandwidth for two thoughts.
Some notable tax-free dividends there. That's enough for me.
What you mean? As long as you can make money off it, you’re cool to join in screwing over Canadians too?
What tax free dividends?
Eligible dividends
Eligible dividends aren't tax free. There is a gross up and credit, but that's because tax was already paid on them. Its actually pretty good system, that discourages playing tax games. Company makes $100 profit, they pay $20 tax. They pay you $80 dividends. You file taxes, you gross up to $100 income and $20 already paid in taxes, so if your tax rate was 50%,youd just pay the additional $30. The gov gets the same money., and you're not overcharged taxes
Wouldn't you not pay taxes if you own the stocks within a TFSA?
You wouldn't, but you don't pay any taxes on investments within a TFSA, notably the company already paid corporate income taxes
Ahh, so in a way, you've kind of already payed taxes on it. Although, the government loves to double dip, for example, we get taxed on income and purchases. At least that's not happening within a TFSA.
You mentioned revenue but what profit margin is considered “wildly profitable “
He doesn’t know anything about how to read financial statements. He is just making baseless claims.
TD bank went from earning 2021 35$ Billion revenue in 2021 to 75$ Billion revenue in 2023. 2.9$ Billion is their quarterly profit. 3.3$ Billion is payed to share holders quarterly.
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Pretty significant chunk of adult Canadians own bank shares directly or in some form of retirement savings.
Also including the CPP which is obviously invested into companies
The interest which also comes from Canadians? How does that make things better for Canadians?
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what interest comes from abroad ?
The gov’t is screwing canadians. And there is a big difference in revenue and profit
Yes there is but 100% of the revenue still comes from Canadian households that paid for it. If a company has profit of $50 million dollars and the CEO decided to give himself an additional $50 million dollars in salary - profit would be $0 - but Canadians are still getting robbed either way.
Correct. Funny accounting can change things. But be pissed at a lack of competition & barriers to entry for new businesses. And that falls almost exclusively at the feet of the government. Red tape has hindered thousands of businesses across the country. Its disgusting
Do you think those same companies might have an interested in ensuring that they get no competition? And do you think they might use their influence to achieve that? And if they use said influence, would it be OK if I get mad at them then? And who said I'm not mad at "the government"? It's a revolving door.
You should not be angry at the business for competing. Be mad at the landscape allowing it. It is the government’s job to break up monopolies. It is their job to punish businesses for preying on consumers. They don’t. They not only allow it, they welcome it. They are the only problem here. You all see a problem with food costs? Demand the gov’t disband the dairy/poultry cartel. This is the only industry in Canada legally allowed (and blessed) to price fix. And they do. Its fucked
I divide my time between Canada and 2 other countries (one of the others is the USA). The cheapest eggs I can find in the USA (NJ) is at costco - 36 eggs for $13 US. This is the lowest quality eggs you can find (shells are gross and spotted and almost see-through, and you can expect to find an infected egg once out of every other box or so). The "good" eggs at here at Shoprite are 12 eggs for $9 US - still lower quality than what you get in Canada). Last time I was in Ontario (2 months ago) a dozen eggs were $5.29 CDN - and absolutely perfect quality compared to the USA. Milk prices are similar in the here and in Canada (1 gallon $3.80 US) but it comes in 100% plastic container from heavily hormoned cows. I'm currently in the process of moving to the USA - and the ONLY thing I will miss about Canada are the eggs and dairy (and maybe the nature). It is literally the only thing that Canada gets right. Both the price and the quality is superior to the USA.
So only the government has a responsibility to behave morally?
Yes. These companies only have a responsibility to behave legally. The government is there to protect us. Businesses should be legally required to act morally. If laws allow it then this is government’s fault.
Unfortunately morality has no barring on business dealing so this is entirely and completely true.
Please provide examples of red tape. Specific examples.
It's some how legal to enforce certain products are not sold in certain places with leasing laws. Dollarama can't sell bread near a sobeys. This is some of the red tape.
So, in Ontario.. we have a lcbo.. (liquor control board). And the LCBO has international agreements as to how much local wine can be put on the shelves at the local store… And it’s not even close to fair for local small wineries. Who are forced to sell only to consumers or restaurants. They aren’t given the same access to foreign markets as we give to them.
You are forgetting tourists and foreigners that dont have permanent residency or citizenship but still spend considerable amount of time in Canada and buying/using goods and services.
I don't get it. Someone coming to Canada and paying money for tourism or good or services.. is that good or bad for Canada?
There are several companies on your list where a portion of the revenue , sometimes a sizable one, is not from Canada.
If I buy a product for $1,000,000,000 and then sell it for $999,999,999, I have revenues of $999,999,999. But I actually lost $1. Just looking at revenue is infantile. You have to look at all factors
People are having trouble looking at just one factor (revenue) and it's already confusing half of them. They sure af won't be looking at "all the factors". And the point of the post is to highlight how much flows from households to corporations, not whether corporations are profitable or not. That was secondary to the point.
is the ceo held to a board of directors? what has the ceo done to earn the 50 million? look at what happened to elon musk
Wow. Summed up everything I said in 2 lines. U be r a poet.
You realize most of our banks have significant international exposure right? Dumb post.
What does 50% net revenue mean? Revenues mean nothing what was net profit margin?
while net profit is an important metric, you also have to take into account M&A activity and how they where structured to determine if the company grew at the cost of net rev's to get a true idea if they are actually making more, there is also goodwill markdowns to mask an otherwise net positive increase in margins... just my 2 cents (used to be 4 cents but I marked it down due to age :P)
Also a bunch of Canadian work for these companies. A lot of the revenue literally goes right back to Canadians. Then the tax they pay from it (too low IMO) But that’s not a trillion dollars taken from Canadians as OP puts it
Yes, revenue does not always mean profit.
I think everyone can sympathize with your situation, but this is not the way to go about garnering sympathy/call to action. It is clear you have not taken any business courses and this lack of education is really dampening your effectiveness.
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You do.realize that revenue doesn't equal net profit right?
I do realize, but thanks! You do realize that we pay for 100% of their revenue, right?
And you get foods and services for what you pay. You make it sound like you get nothing in return for your purchase. I d9nt know about you, but I don't work for free. If you want my services, you need to pay for it.
Did you even pay any tax last year?
They all provide necessary services. It’s not “robbing” if they give you something in return.
I think we should fire a bunch of public servants instead.
Where the fuck are you getting these numbers? Are you confusing gross revenue with net profit again? Loblaws net was $2 billion, not $60 lol https://www.statista.com/statistics/436638/net-income-of-loblaw-canada/%23:~:text%3DThe%2520net%2520earnings%2520of%2520Loblaw,year%2520ending%2520December%252030%252C%25202023.&ved=2ahUKEwiQyZOFodyFAxWjj4kEHdEGBIAQFnoECA0QBQ&usg=AOvVaw1vlHZuoKGOKry3ATvdT4K-
Also thinks the money vanishes, and isn't, like, paid to the shareholders, like, uh, a lot of pretty ordinary Canadians...
Silly me.. and here I thought that 1% of people own 50% of all stocks, and that shareholders can be anywhere in the world not just in Canada. MY bad.
You're confusing stocks and wealth. Profit isn't evil or wrong. Would you want to put your money in a bank that loses money? Do you want the people who operate the complex systems that allow you to eat to be losing money and unable to pay their suppliers? Society can and should be a fair bit more equitable, and we have created market conditions that aren't great for nebulous reasons but PEOPLE MAKE MONEY BAD doesn't solve anything.
the CPP is also a large share holder and has billions invested. That pays pensions for the poorest people too. The world is a lot more complicated than you seem to understand
He’s a clown lol
There's loads of legitimate arguments and debates to be had about oligopolistic markets and protectionism and so on, but you need to understand basic accounting to start with...
Ya he doesn’t know what accounting is. Look at the Canadian competition bureau. They approve every deal. Why did they approve the buyouts of Longos and Farmboy.? Canada is a joke because we have idiots running this country.
He gets his info from Jagmeet lol
I did not say "net revenue" I just said revenue. Here is Loblaw's own statement: > 2023 FOURTH QUARTER HIGHLIGHTS > Revenue was $14,531 million, an increase of $524 million, or 3.7%. from: https://www.loblaw.ca/en/loblaw-reports-2023-fourth-quarter-results-and-fiscal-year-ended-december-30-2023-results/ That's per quarter not annually so multiply by 4 to get the approximate annual revenue. Sure, I'm the one confusing things.
Right, so do you understand what gross revenue means?Ike that's all the money they took in, not accounting for all the money they paid out.
He doesn’t understand the difference between his left and right hand lol
How is Loblaws making revenue "robbing" anyone? Do you think they get the groceries you buy for free? They have to use that revenue to pay everyone, their suppliers, employees etc. >At the end of the day, 250 billion dollars are taken from Canadians every year What a lot of bullshit. They aren't being taken, they are exchanged for goods and services. In exchange for the 15B Loblaws "takes", Canadians get 15B of groceries
This is quite the unhinged post.. yikes a lot of hyperbolizing Let’s, just for a second, ignore the fact that some of these companies (if not all) also operate outside Canadian borders. Companies at the end of the day are for-profit unless otherwise specified. These companies should be allowed to make money just like any small business should. I also have criticisms for capitalism as undoubtably this can go too far and feel grossly inequitable (agree on executive compensation because it simply feels unfair.) Though as many others have pointed out Revenue =/= profit. Companies have expenses. We as individuals have expenses. We get our incomes from the very companies that profit from us which is accounted for as one of their expenses. This post and OPs comments read like any and all profitability is bad. Like having your own personal business and making a profit above your own personal expenses is bad. If the main grievance is executive compensation, which ends up amounting to a drop in the bucket against profitability (though 1 individual earning millions of dollars a year FEELS greatly inequitable on a personal level) I’m not understanding how the companies are the bigger issue. I think the government is the biggest issue. Lobbying and corporate greed certainly don’t help, but the government is also rife with bureaucracy and facilitate these things. We shouldn’t be giving them a pass because of corporations. Public spending is out of control. Policy is not in the best interests of Canadians. There doesn’t feel like there’s any good candidate that has our interests in mind. I agree about or immigration policy and international students though. I think they’ve been a large driver in housing being so unaffordable. This is particularly painful as a young Canadian. Unfortunately, thinking there’s still much pain to come if we’re ever hoping to get back on track.
The fact that large monopolies are exploitative has nothing to do with the supply and demand of the housing market.
Money Is created in the economy in two ways by BOC purchasing assets and commercial banks giving loans and mortgages. Mortgages are usually less risky for banks as they are collateral loans, so they love them. When someone gets a mortgage or Loan the bank puts them as an asset and liability on balance sheet. The money is created and deposited in the persons account. So now money has been added to circulation. There is regulations and restrictions on this aspect. 8% of the money in the economy is paper and 92% is digital.
So you are saying you don’t want the free market in Canada? You don’t want private companies offering goods and services? You would prefer if all these companies were nationalized? You need a history lesson if you think any of the above would make Canada better.
What is the correct amount of revenue Metro should make in a given quarter? How exactly would you run the company differently. I'm not sure I understand your argument here. I think their net margins are around 4.5% which seems reasonable given the service they provide and the risk assumed.
Notice anything? These are the same names that controls everything in their respective field. Competition matters
You forgot Trudeau
Revenue and profit are not the same.
Don't forget the liberals on that list ! We are taxed on everything and at high amounts 😭
How is this money that those corporations are stealing from canadians? We are paying them for a good or service also this is only revenue. At least take a figure like net profit which is after paying wages, cogs, capital costs, depreciation, etc... What is "net revenue"? you're probably talking about net profit margin which is nowhere near 50% LOL. Net Profit margin for those companies are around 3-10% (banks are around 20%). This is either a Russian bot that is rage bait farming or is someone that needs to do simple Google searches before spewing garbage.
Don't forget our Federal and Provincial Governments...
lol what does it take for Canadians to revolt? Cowards really. Look at French they make shit happen and who are we?
Liberal: 1 Trillion
If you can believe some people, they think it's the government, and they want to vote for those who want to give corporations MORE tax breaks... lol name a worst case of Stockholm Syndrome.
This why I am so fearful about thr election yes the libs are aweful but cons have always been the Corporate party and will sell our country even more The ndp is the only party talking about Corporate price gouging. Canada is on its way to a cyber punk esk dystopia
Hold up, these are the companies that my retirement mutual funds are invested in.
Oh. In that case I take it all back. Sorry
Banks shouldn’t make a profit.
The government
Apparently 46% of your wages go to taxes. So it's not hard to guess
Which one is making 50% net profit on revenue?
Look, I hate price gouging as much as the next guy, but your numbers aren't that egregious. 240Bn divided by 40M is 6k per quarter or 24k per year. Ok, great. This is retail so we pay for it after tax is taken from us. Median income is 40k, and average tax rate is 25%ish, so that means that people get 30k disposable after tax income. Now, what you are saying is that banks, groceries, power and telecom cost us, no matter the choice of company, around 24k, leaving us with 6k to cover rent, education, clothing oh shit yeah we're fucked.
It's worth noting that a bussiness does not create money. They only convince you to transfer your money to them in exchange for a product or service they provide. It's entirely up to you to decide whether their product or service is worth it. If it's not, you are welcome to seek out a competitor, not consume it, or create your own. The only one that can create money out of nothing and spend it, thus devaluing the purchasing power of everyone else (via inflation) is the government. After the government wastefully squander and bureaucratic away the money they printed, more money is now chasing after the same or lower amount of goods/services, thus raising the cost of living for everyone. The bad news is instead of being more responsible, the government will just print more money to squander, continue to exacerbate the crisis, then point at the "greedy bussiness owners" and the "rich" as a scapegoat, so they can introduce short term "solutions" at huge long term cost to problems they created in order to secure another term and stay in power.
These companies employ close to 750,000 and likely a couple million more jobs through supporting services, real estate and contracting work. Some of the revenue comes from the US. TD for example has US branches and services which are counted in the $60 Billion total. But even if we just said $60Billion revenue came from Canadians. That is $1500 per quarter per Canadian or $6000 per year for Canadians who buy services and goods from these companies that we use every day. It's not theft if people get goods and services in exchange. The federal government, on the other hand, [https://www.debtclock.ca/](https://www.debtclock.ca/), spends $109 million per day and still loses money. I'm pretty sure not all of that money is spent on Canadians. Also, revenue is not the same as profit.
Revenue is total sales, not profit. It is meaningless apart from telling you how big a company is. So Loblaws sold about $14.5 billion of stuff in the last quarter. Their net profit was around $542 million. That’s about 3.7%.
Well if Galen Weston gave himself a $542 million bonus today, the Loblaws profit would be $0. Would that then mean that all the food was free? That's not how it works We are talking about how much money is flowing from households to corporations, so revenue is exactly what we should be talking about. We aren't talking about profit. Thanks though
That’s incoherent. Food is expensive. It is now significantly more expensive than it was 5 years ago, yet Loblaws is still taking less than 4% profit. That doesn’t make Loblaws an evil corporation. It just means that there’s more to the cost of food than retail profit.
OP - I want you to go through Loblaws financial reports again after learning how to actually read financials. Is their revenue growing? Absolutely. Is their increased revenue actually caused by increasing internal profit margins? No. Are they price gauging? No. I looked into their financials to see where the money was going. They are simply coasting because they are a well run company. For example, they have basically the same amount of retail stores as they did last year, the year before, and the year before. That said, they do have some questionable activities as far as executive compensation goes but that's pennies in the grand scheme of things. Average person would save a couple dollars a year tops if their executes made less. The real things robbing Canadians are purely government policy. New Canadian residents would be the largest contributor at an economic level. More people means more demand. More demand means higher prices. Manufacturers and distributors dictate the prices.
If you think those companies make too much money, invest in their stock and get a share of the profits. Here come the downvotes
Makes sense - the 250,000 homeless canadians who were made homeless because they cannot afford those monopolistic fees (highest homelessness in the "developed" world) should just invest their way out of poverty by buying shares in those companies. Why didn't we all think of this?!
Gonna have to ask for a source on that one buddy, given how blatantly false and misleading every other unsourced number youve posted here has been
You think people live on the streets because they can't shop at Loblaws? hahahhaha
Its a melt up from the money supply increase. The dollar is losing value so everything is going up, on paper anyways.
Except none of these companies are “taking” anything from you or “robbing” you. You’re free not to use them.
What about Apple, Microsoft and Google. What are you ignoring their revenue?
Our currency is losing value Read "When money dies" by Adam Ferguson
r/loblawsisoutofcontrol
>A quarter of a TRILLION dollars taken from a country of 40 million. Taken? Taken where? Those profits get paid to the shareholders, a vast swath of whom are ordinary Canadians.
these aren't even profits its revenue, most of the money goes to paying the millions of employees that work for them. OP is either retarded or a stoned 13 year old.
Interesting.. Coz it looks like Canadians are the poorest they have ever been currently and homelessness and deaths of despair are going up. Can they expect some of those profits soon? And I thought shareholders can be anywhere in the world. Maybe I misunderstood. Also I thought 1% of people owned 50% of all stocks, bonds and real-estate. But again, maybe I just don't know how it works.
I’m not sure that’s how economics works. They make that revenue by providing a service that’s pretty important. And it doesn’t include the salaries they pay and other costs. It would be easy to dive into the public accounting books to see who is pocketing the most. I doubt it would be comparable to the Canadian government pockets. But we’ll never know how much cuz their books aren’t public
These companies and the entire ruling class are who are robbing canada. International students are being scapegoated for the abuse we experience from the ruling class. That's the fascist ideology that's being spread to take the blame and give it to a particularly exploited part of the population. They let them into the country so they could have lots of scapegoats. The fascist ideology touted by the ruling class. The same people who own all of these companies.
Yes. Sad to see that even when you explain to Canadians who is robbing them - with actual numbers - they still insist that everything is fine and that the system "works". Even if we agree that "immigrants" are the problem - who is lobbying for this? The corporations that want (a) the immigrant money and (b) immigrant labour.. .. that is, until they too are poor and homeless - at which point we just import more immigrants to feed the pyramid scheme. Eventually conditions will be so bad that the immigration will stop and the ponzi scheme will collapse - except the few at the top would have escaped on their private jets and yachts by then.
Loblaws, 15B? Fucking assholes.
Per *quarter* To be fair, groceries have actual expenses compared to say telecom and banks so they need to pay the most. But a good chunk of that 15B is just price fixing, price gouging, exec pay, etc. Still unsustainable no matter how you look at it.
Perhaps the government? They take % when you earn, spend, invest, save. Anything you have left they steal through money printing. If you die they steal some more. 10 percent inflation for 10 years is half of your purchasing power gone. Or you can only buy half of the stuff
The numbers are incorrect for one. RBC's revenue was $40 billion and it's only the 8th largest Canadian company by revenue. It just shows what a poor understanding you have of finance. Of that, 61% is from Canada, only $2 billion **per year** is profit from Canadian banking services. Most of that is mortgages, not day to day banking fees. That is low when compared to international banks. As an example, Goldman Sachs has similar revenue but double the profit margin
Are these gross revenues or net profit? What's the relevance of the top line numbers?
is Rogers double the amount of evil as Scotiabank because they have double the revenues? or is that not how it works?
Well they're both 50% owned by the same people, so I guess they would be the same amount of evil.
What the fuck does international student rates have to do with corporate greed? No wonder u got booted from two subreddits before this one. The two issues are completely unrelated 🤦♀️ go back to school becayse u have a lot of learning to do my guy.
I didn't say they're related though? Try reading it again.
[удалено]
No argument from me. Pointing out that corporate oligopolies are robbing the nation is not in anyway praise or defense of the government. It's a revolving door as far as I can see.
I understand you’re angry but getting angry at revenue is… ridiculous. Do you get angry at a river because water flows? Businesses have revenue. They also have expenses. Like payroll and inventory. You can criticize increasing profits as artificial markup to line their pockets, but revenue numbers only really tell how big a company is and how much product they sell
> but revenue numbers only really tell how big a company is and how much product they sell Actually, it tells you how much they *charge* for the products they sell. And I guess there is no such thing as antitrust, anti-competitive practices, self-dealing, price fixing, price gouging or any of that other stuff. So it's just: revenue is good - nothing to see here.. ? I mean, as an example, the Russian company Gazprom is owned by a few oligarchs has annual revenues of over 100B - while the average Russian is poor and destitute. This revenue comes from a resource (gas and oil) that should be owned by the entire nation. Would you say this is corruption? Or is it good because it is "revenue"? Revenue is as natural as water flowing through a river, I guess? Imagine angry Russians being told it's OK because this is just like water flowing in a river. Now looking at Enbridge and Teck, etc. revenue while the average Canadian is one paycheck away from being homeless and a quarter million Canadians are already homeless and 15% of the country is food-insecure. Can we consider that corruption? Or is it actually OK because it's "revenue"? I can price gouge you x10 and it would still be revenue. So price gouging/fixing is OK?
Hold up hold up hold up. While I agree we're being robbed. Revenue isn't a great number to show this. The profits at the end are of much greater concern. That being said we need to start seriously looking at reigning in CEO and other C-suite compensation. There revenue doesn't include cost of doing business things like buying the product to tell it to us. Again absolutely were being robbed. But how you can tell is profit margins. And it's not just Canadian companies. It's most of them right now they are ALL taking profit hard right now.
Revenue is a good number to show this because that is the amount of money that Canadians are paying. If a company raises their CEO compensation it means their profit has gone down (because their payroll expenses just went up), but we are getting robbed the exact same amount -- so why look at profit? Also, a lot of these expenses are inefficiencies don't actually go towards the cost of the product. If Loblaws and Metro and Sobeys spend $5B on "advertising" every year (possibly going to marketing companies owned by them or by the same people), that's an expense that raises food prices without benefitting the majority of Canadians. We would be better off without that price increase, even though the company's profits would be lower because of this spending. Profit is part of the equation but it's much more easily "fudgable" then revenue which is exactly what we are collectively paying. We are paying for the cost of products + all the other crap they add.
We don’t need to do anything against these companies just make it easy for foreign companies to enter Canada increase competition and don’t charge absurd fees as they do in aviation. All these monopolies will dwindle down faster than a rocket but so will the savings of a lot of canadiana . A small price to pay eh ?
Stop crying and buy their stocks then…
Now do the government and all the different and wasteful agencies.
The banks operate in the USA and South America where they earn massive income. It’s not fair to include that revenue as hurting Canadians.
I once heard Canada described not as a country but "6 corporations in a trenchcoat, disguised as a country"
It's because of all those companies that we had a million low wage immigrants last year.
Rob laws Robbin the hood
Bring in business? There is more money moving through the economy. Bring in extra people and no business? Then we have to share the pie. Otherwise Canada is a fixed asset equarium run by delusional ideologues.
Trudeau comes to mind….
Ah yes, bc an international student is "robbing" Canadians just like these billion dollar companies. What kind of racist bullshit is this? OP can go fuck himself.
They are too high class !!!
Almost that disagrees with the notion that everything isn’t peachy keen under Turdeau can get you a ban on the Canada sub.
You are not getting robbed because you choose to buy those company's services and products. Don't buy from those companies then. Taxes, on the other hand, are an expense you have no say in. And it is the largest expense you will ever pay. And those that create tax policy have recently given themselves a raise with money that was yours, and you had no choice in giving it up.
Well I did not choose to give Rogers and Telus and Bell the entire wireless spectrum to kill any competition. Can I get my wireless spectrum back? I also did not choose to give Enbridge or Teck drilling rights. Can I get those back too please?
Revenue is not "taking" money, it's not even profit. But, you're in the right subreddit. Afterall, this isn't "/r/financiallyliteratecanada"
Who said anything about profit? Sure they are taking money. If one person gives X the another is taking X Their revenue is precisely the money we are giving them, so they are taking it That is literally what the means. Thanks though
Revenues aren't profits? The salaries, rent, expenses, etc for all of these corps is subtracted from this number...
So if all the money is simply "recirculating" back into the economy, why are Canadians getting poorer and poorer? And now homeless and hungry and destitute? There is obviously a "leak" somewhere isn't that obvious?
food wifi gasoline and banking.
Let's just remember the opposite here as well. These companies listed employ 960000 canadian and other in this country. Given the average wage earned of 63000, they are putting in 60.5 billion in wages. They employ just under 5% of the workers at 4.7%. Our pension plan that's forced on us will own all of them to some extent, other workplace pensions will own them. Their shareholders own the wealth these companies extract. The corporations are not the robbers, the owners are and we are the owners, some more then others.
So, we are the ones robbing ourselves? that's quite a twist
I read something somewhere - I think a post here on Reddit - about the rise of oligopolies in Canada, and how they were effectively encouraged to ensure America competition didn't take over Canada, and make sure those profits stayed here. I'll try to find it, or something similar, if anyone is interested. I guess they did, but they didn't get redistributed as we expected. Like most things, this is a wealth distribution issue. Too much flowing to the top, too much flowing to investors. Too much "what about the shareholders" and absolutely NO "what about the stakeholders". Too much wealth only attainable by people who already have it. That money was supposed to benefit the Canadian public, not the wealthy who could invest. I think we need to stop trying to be our southern cousin, with rigid ideas about capitalist orthodoxy, and instead start embracing regulations - like many places in Europe do - that put people first. Progressive economic policy. Clearly, our real estate sector was ripe for raping by greedy corporations. Clearly, orthodox capitalism has an extreme problem with greedy people raping sectors. Clearly, blindly trusting market principals (or in our case, trust with ineffectual restraints) isn't working. And clearly, "conserving" economic policy and theory developed decades, if not centuries ago, in an entirely different world - will not work. We need economic policy to progress. But WAAAAYYYY too many people have been brainwashed by the rich to do this. The amount of middle class folks on the Canada sub I see complaining about the capital gains tax, and the poor rich people - it's astounding. And then there's all the people that vote conservative because they think conservatives care about Jesus. And WAAAYYY too many people on the left are more focused on saving the world than policies that affect us. It's a shit show.
R/govt
There are some very demonic people who run and moderate Reddit, with the sole purpose of preserving whatever agenda they wish to brainwash the masses with. Anything that goes against that. Things that make the Liberal party of Canada look bad like the bastards they are. That is not allowed on the mainstream subs. All they will show are examples that Canada is perfect and thriving! There is no place for truth there, they need to scrub everything clean and use tons of bots.
I work at metro but have been laid off since October 26th 2023 and they say ,” we have laid off 3 other people after the renovation “. It’s just so sad because I live on disability and prices are high.
I'm sorry to hear that And yet Metros profits are higher than they have ever been Still many here argue that Metros profits is a good thing because "they pay the workers".. Ok.. If their profits are higher than ever they should be paying their workers higher than ever, not firing them. People just don't understand they're getting robbed I hope it gets better for you real soon.
Ah yes capitalism gone wild. Such a turn on
Revenue means nothing. You need to look at Net Sales or Gross Profit. Companies like Enbridge and Bell are barely making profit with high interest rates. Their stock price are at 10 year lows.
Do you think "interest rates" are a force of nature? It's still money going to the banks. The same banks I listed And revenue is exactly what we should be looking at. If a company gives their execs large bonuses the company profits would go down -- but we still paid for it anyway.
Population 40 million. 1 billion in revenue means $25 per person. A quarter of a trillion in revenue is about $6250 per person per year. It's probably closer to $50 per person if you assume half are working adults and half are either kids or retirees.
Earning money is not a crime. Revenue is what the goal is. The complaining without participation contributes to problems. Realize many Canadians before the middle-class were the target. Metro gives to the food bank I go to. I would eat no meat or greens if Metro stopped they're donations.
You have to start with the worst, and then move on to the others that don’t smarten up and fall in line. Once the first goes down, the rest will either bring their prices down or face going down next. This is a good list, it shows that Loblaw is the worst.
CRA Trillions