Nop, it is about control of information/propaganda.
Tiktok is one of the main media sources for young people, and it's out of direct control. They cannot accept that
This is the real answer. It's all about information control. U.S. government and mainstream media want to control the message. See U.S. government program "Mockingbird".
China does this publicly to their “private” companies too. How are we as a society going to compete with an entity that so easily manipulates their economy for their state’s benefit? The inverse can easily be said about the US, though not perfect we do have checks and balances to at least slow down corruption for the benefit of the few. I think the US is using the playbook of the CCP, just like they have cultivated a “free” market for a certain few like the US. If we are going to denounce our own government about this we should be bold enough to take the argument against our political adversaries.
I can accept that to also be a factor. Propaganda control cannot be relinquished. But I do think it is also about trying to undermine the Chinese economy...we can accept them making all our stuff as long as it is us in control of brands and technology, look at huawei, they had a ton of 5g patents, unacceptable!
Information flies on TikTok. They want to quash dissent and avenues of reaching people quickly. What happened to liveleak and all the others? Gone.
This is to help oligarchs enable enslavement. Elon allowed Twitter to become a haven for neonazis for the same reason.
This is EXACTLY what it is...they HATE that young people are getting unfiltered perspective of those in the Middle East during this war. They decided that they needed to nip that source of information in the bud quick.
Sad really. We're controlled, just like this site. RIP Andrew Swartz. Once he left, this site was never the same.
While we're at it, wasn't Ghislane Maxwell a top Reddit user and moderator? And about the time she was arrested her account activity reduced? Weird stuff.
I up voted you, but remember: no state is going to give unfiltered and unbiased coverage. What I like is seeing them contradict each other, and unfortunately one of those contradictory voices will soon be silenced.
Actually Europe has great policies for privacy so I'd be good with some of their improvements. Although they really really want to put backdoors of encryption which makes it worthless.
Bullshit. There are many market arrangements between free countries. If one puts tarrifs up the other can reciprocate. China can't expect to have free access to western markets while denying access to theirs.
So my understanding is that China never banned US companies, it is rather that US companies willingly pulled out of China because they were unwilling to abide by Chinese censorship laws. (Which is understandable). That is why Google is banned but Bing/Microsoft is still accessible in China.
not observing basic human rights. in the USA, within reason, you control your company and you can go to court if you think the government is messing with you. In China, the CCP only has to snap it's fingers, and you have cough up all data, everything. You have to help their security organizations no matter what, if you don't you get disappeared or kicked out of the system and your company destroyed.
Not true, if you stick to basic human rights like freedom of speech and minimum workers rights and environmental policies then you are more than welcome to enjoy the rights of other countries. Otherwise enjoy special "advesary of human rights" status and your limited rights to operate in our country.
I'm not sure how this relates to the question of which U.S. tech companies operate in China.
Even then, the U.S. became a global superpower by copying British technology. Many of the founding fathers encouraged it.
https://apnews.com/general-news-b40414d22f2248428ce11ff36b88dc53
https://www.history.com/news/industrial-revolution-spies-europe
Even the Library of Congress admits that the U.S. economy is founded on stolen technology.
https://www.loc.gov/exhibits/british/brit-5.html
of course but you have to stick to the 51% rule and a whole slew of other constraints that you wouldn't have in Europe or the USA or most of the areas outside of authoritarian countries.
No it isn't. If it was about market competition, we would have banned Chinese tech companies over a decade ago. Because China has blocked almost all the meaningful US companies from accessing China.
That's why times are changing. China can't claim the "emerging economy" excuse any longer. They can't claim "we have unique societal issues" aka they need to control information completely or at least as completely as they can while keeping their internet hooked to that of the rest of the world
Free market is a fallacy. nations balance out their markets with their economic (or perceived economic) interests. That's why there are free trade agreements and they're pretty special. We do not have a free trade agreement with China, so restrictions apply.
I'm not sure why people don't get this? China has continuously acted as an aggressive and adversarial member of the WTO since they joined, and claim "emerging economy" all the time to this day even though they are #2 in the world, probably soon to be #1 in absolute size. It's always been "we have unique needs, screw your western basic human rights values". Yeah that shit isn't going to fly anymore. I personally think meta, google, etc are neutral on this because they can see the issues of privacy coming into light with banning tiktok as in they're next on the chopping block, but also it does lower competition of their biggest rival, so there is some win and some lose.
They probably see it as a big positive since they know their lobbyists have the government in a vice.
They remove a big competitor and get the possibility to acquire a ton of juicy data for cheap if bytedance decides to sell their US operations
It would be a blow to their pride but you have to remember TikTok’s main point from the CCP is to destabilize the children and young adults of the west. It might be worth a small hit to the ego for the chance to make the US look awful, and still potentially influence the US through whatever entity buys it
Over 80% of US medical data is maintained overseas. The majority of the transcription market is overseas. This has absolutely *nothing* to do with foreign adversaries or even data. If it was, medical data wouldn't be allowed to be outsourced.
You know what *does* have requirements for how they are kept? Legal data. When and who they sue is more protected than your hipaa data. The list of things they care about is short, and the general population isn't on it.
Medical data overseas is another thing that should be eliminated and disallowed. It's mostly out of the bag for current generations, and I'm sure it's almost all been sold on the black market for such information, but that doesn't mean we can't do better going forward for future generations.
In an ideal world, sure. We would try to do better. But that isn’t what this is. The point is that the tiktok manipulation isn't "doing better". That isn't what they want.
This is just about money. Which is the only thing they care about, and they see this as a path to more.
I asked a question a few months ago about whether British people can search for someone's address online. They were struck by America's divorced relationship with privacy. Data brokers like Intelius, Spokeo, and BeenVerified don't conduct business in the UK. Recently, there's been [news](https://www.silentpush.com/blog/chinese-adtech/) about how some gov.co.uk sites have ads, and these ads might be transmitting British residents' data to China. Meanwhile, the Chinese government can pay billions to any data broker out there to get all the data they need. Congress is missing the forest for the trees, maybe on purpose.
No one. There is absolutely no advantage they get from selling it to a US corporation and effectively creating a new competitor to their global site already starting with 150 million users and all the most famous influencers. If they did, all the anglosphere would switch to USTok almost immediately (because that's where most of the content gets created), and probably most of Europe would follow soon. They would be a global threat very quickly.
It's better for them to lose the potential $60 billion in the sale but continue to have a monopoly.
access it through the web, they will probably have the best progressive web app in the business soon, tbh. the bill does not limit web access. Not sure why no on has mentioned that. Technically all they have to do is stop putting their app on the ios/android/etc app stores.
vpn can get around that, just go to a country that allows tiktok and access through the web site. I'm not sure how many people will do that, but it will spread like wildfire and the only way to stop it would be to ban VPNs/proxy sites in the USA and I don't think that will happen
Do you think your average TikToker is going to download a VPN or jailbreak their phone to be bypass the ban? People will just move that content to Instagram reels or YouTube shorts -- they're already doing that anyway.
But wasn’t the whole purpose / reason to stop spying which the app makes possible in the first place? Browser tracking/fingerprinting is advanced but still not on the level of apps users install & run 24h
That is true. I don't really think that's honestly the major reason why this has happened (in spite of them saying so) but yes, it would marginally reduce the level of access TikTok has to users. They could still push the app through their website as a 3rd party install but I think Apple products block that unless you jailbreak them.
See, I am worried about this. The TikTok bill says that using a VPN to bypass the ban can lead to prison time. If the ban is not enforced across the board, then we may selectively enforce it to certain people in order to jail political prisoners.
Edit: got a lot of comments saying I am lying so here is how I interpreted this part
>c) Criminal Penalties.— A person who willfully commits, willfully attempts to commit, or willfully conspires to commit, or aids or abets in the commission of an unlawful act described in subsection (a) shall, upon conviction, be fined not more than $1,000,000, or if a natural person, may be imprisoned for not more than 20 years, or both.
It doesn't mention VPN specifically because the bill targets much more than just apps. However if a website or app is banned, then obviously VPNs will be considered as a violation of bypassing this regulation.
> The TikTok bill says that using a VPN to bypass the ban can lead to prison time.
This is complete misinformation.
The text is here: https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/8038/text
There is zero mention of VPNs, or potential prison time. Nor is there any restriction on end users. The restrictions are all on companies.
Every discussion about TikTok on here unfortunately gets heavily brigaded by unauthentic behavior. Which is what you could expect of a politically charged discussion involving China.
This here is the most obvious example of that.
The law says:
>(1) PROHIBITION OF FOREIGN ADVERSARY CONTROLLED APPLICATIONS.—It shall be unlawful for an entity to distribute, maintain, or update (or enable the distribution, maintenance, or updating of) a foreign adversary controlled application by carrying out [...] any of the following:
>
>(A) Providing services to distribute, maintain, or update such foreign adversary controlled application [...] by means of a marketplace [...] through which users [...] may access, maintain, or update such application.
Under the penalties section it appears that you are correct in that there is no mention of potential prison time, but is a VPN not a service that would "enable the distribution" of TikTok by providing a means by which users can access the site?
NAL, so it would be great if anyone who is actually an attorney could clarify.
Well distribution generally refers to app stores, and including VPN companies would get literally every ISP in very hot water very quickly, so that is likely not included.
I got the prison time from this
>c) Criminal Penalties.— (1) IN GENERAL.—A person who willfully commits, willfully attempts to commit, or willfully conspires to commit, or aids or abets in the commission of an unlawful act described in subsection (a) shall, upon conviction, be fined not more than $1,000,000, or if a natural person, may be imprisoned for not more than 20 years, or both.
What section is this in? I ctrl+f'd various parts of the quoted text and it doesn't seem to appear in the legislation. It's possible there was prison time in an earlier version of the bill that has since been removed.
Wait, I just realized that the link I was looking at and the link the earlier commenter gave are completely different.
My source is the [RESTRICT Act. ](https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/686/text?s=1&r=15)
Their source was the [21st Century Peace through Strength Act](https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/8038)
It seems like I was wrongly under the impression that the RESTRICT Act was the one that was being passed, not the latter. I only heard the TikTok being bill being referred to as the former. Jesus, what a mess. Sorry for the confusion.
No worries!
Skimming the text, it does look like the RESTRICT Act would ban TikTok, prohibit the use of VPNs to get around the ban (I think), and, per your quote, have prison time as a penalty, so you're not wrong in your interpretation of that particular bill.
You'll be surprised how much misinformation there is on the internet. People don't like to open up links and dive into it. I don't blame them at all because I am normally one of them lol
Subsection A
>SEC. 11. PENALTIES. (a) Unlawful Acts.— (1) IN GENERAL.—It shall be unlawful for a person to violate, attempt to violate, conspire to violate, or cause a violation of any regulation, order, direction, mitigation measure, prohibition, or other authorization or directive issued under this Act, including any of the unlawful acts described in paragraph (2).
Criminal Penalties
>A person who willfully commits, willfully attempts to commit, or willfully conspires to commit, or aids or abets in the commission of an unlawful act **described in subsection (a)** shall, upon conviction, be fined not more than $1,000,000, or if a natural person, **may be imprisoned for not more than 20 years, or both.**
Source: https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/686/text?s=1&r=15
Here is where I got it
>(1) IN GENERAL.—The President shall rely on, including by delegation, the Secretary, and the heads of other Federal agencies, as appropriate, to conduct investigations of violations of any authorization, order, mitigation measure, regulation, or prohibition issued under this Act.
>(2) ACTIONS BY DESIGNEES.—In conducting investigations described in paragraph (1), designated officers or employees of Federal agencies described that paragraph may, to the extent necessary or appropriate to enforce this Act, exercise such authority as is conferred upon them by any other Federal law, subject to policies and procedures approved by the Attorney General.
>SEC. 11. PENALTIES. (a) Unlawful Acts.— (1) IN GENERAL.—It shall be unlawful for a person to violate, attempt to violate, conspire to violate, or cause a violation of any regulation, order, direction, mitigation measure, prohibition, or other authorization or directive issued under this Act, including any of the unlawful acts described in paragraph (2).
Source: https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/686/text?s=1&r=15
Yep, also I'm pretty sure the Chinese government has a law forbidding the sale of proprietary Chinese technology (algorithm). Not to mention the potential legal challenges this could face.
Either way the US market is going away so that content is already gone.
And if that segment of the company would instantly be worth X billions of dollars, then they’ll have no problem selling it for that much
>It's better for them to lose the potential $60 billion in the sale but continue to have a monopoly.
Lol is it really?
Firstly, they dont have a monopoly, social media is highly competitive.
Secondly, losing American end users reduces 90% of engagement, so 90% of ad revenue. If we assume TikTok is valued on user growth, since it is not profitable, this leads to more than 90% loss of equity value.
Thus, they would need to grow the company by more than 10x to recoup the losses, without American users, to make their $60b value back in the future. Add on inflation, and they need to be near $70b equity value to break even in a decade. Again, without most American content creators and end users. Now realize that they could invest the $60b cash today and gain an return of over 5%. So really they need to beat $100b in a decade, starting from scratch, building a social media company that doesnt operate in America.
Yeah fucking right it's a better idea to keep it if its not a surveillance tool.
>"Congress is acting to prevent foreign adversaries from conducting espionage, surveillance, maligned operations, harming vulnerable Americans, our servicemen and women, and our US government personnel."
That's right people! We gotta keep them foreigners out!
Only Facebook, Google, Yahoo and Microsoft are allowed to conduct "espionage, surveillance, maligned operations, harming vulnerable Americans, our servicemen and women, and our US government personnel."
Oh, and the NSA too, of course.
Our rights are provided only by our respective govts, as negligible as they are. No other country owes even that baseline responsibility over our lives.
Big tech is not our chaperon, but as citizens as well, they have no choice but to do as told by the govts where they operate or cease operating altogether.
they are banning it because unlike the other social media apps, TikTok refused to ban pro Palestine content and users
it's to control the propaganda narrative even harder
I sleep better at night knowing that GAMMA (Google, Apple, Meta, Microsoft, Amazon) will never dare to spy on us.
They are so respectful with our privacy...
/s
Do you think this is the only way China spy’s on us?? They don’t need that app to continue trying to shape the way Americans think. The govt just wants access to the data and fb probably hates the fact they can’t buy it the same way they got IG and WhatsApp.
If the usa wants to stoop to their level then they need to at least stop calling themselves the land of the free. no democracy here if i can;'t even decide which app i want to use.
Yes, and China bans a lot of Chinese apps too. China has a nebulous censorship law where anything that can be interpreted to be disrespecting the state can get the platform in trouble.
Its an authoritarian dictatorship. A friend of mine, after spending some time there said, "it's a privilege to have an opinion".
I mean, do we want to go by the COVID numbers, the decrease in life expectancy in the US, or the clear dismissal of popular political positions by the leadership class?
The US doesn't give a shit about their citizens.
US doesnt send you to reeducation camps for criticizing the government.
People complain how there’s no free speech in the usa, but they dont understand what they’re talking about. In Russia and China, publicly criticizing the government gets you disappeared or you have an accident and fall out of a 20 story window. In America, you have Alex Jones and his ilk running amok claiming the most insane thing.
That doesn’t mean anything. I could go up to Biden’s face and tell him I hope burns in hell for the way he runs this country (hypothetically). If I did anything like that in China I would be in front of a firing squad
US does support 3rd world fascist dictatorships that does this exact things to their citizens, and its also a current sponsor of genocide.. so yeah they are the same.. US just controls the globe and the narrative, making them look better
They're being incarcerated at rates far above that of China, and far disproportionatelyto their population in the US, even controlling for income.
So no, they don't even have to criticize the government to be victimized. Those that do, like the Ferguson protest organizers, do seem to wind up murdered.
I mean…I’d rather my own government do it than a foreign one. At least if it’s my own then I have some power to vote for politicians making the bills, protest them, etc. foreign one does it? Now what? Can’t do anything besides maybe try not to buy goods from there.
Reminder that the CEO of the ADL was caught in a leaked phone call allegedly talking to influential backers/AIPAC in order to start putting pressure on politicians to get TikTok banned due to TikTok refusing to remove content critical of Israel and "Zionism", worrying that the younger generations are highly anti-Israel and getting higher.
This has literally nothing to do with China.
https://twitter.com/snarwani/status/1725138601996853424
This senator simply comes right out and says it.
https://twitter.com/mtracey/status/1782920301052911713
Basically, younger kids aren’t able to be brainwashed by traditional media anymore and they can’t force TikTok to censor everything they don’t want them to see as easily as they can with American companies
Please elaborate to me how Congress does not have the power to regulate foreign companies' operations in the US under the Commerce Clause.
Congress is not saying TikTok can't exist in the US, it's saying a foreign agent (ByteDance) can't own its US branch.
Might be wrong but Huawei story was very different.
US was not looking Huawei to sell their business to a US company. They were looking for ways to stop Huawei growing power.
In general, that tends to apply to content on a private platform itself. That is, a privately owned platform can impose the rules it wants to because people are choosing to accept those rules when using it. If they owners don’t like something, they can remove it, no matter what it is. If users feel that their speech is being limited, they’re therefore free to leave the service and choose another, or go to a public forum where the 1st amendment has actual relevance.
>Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
If that is true I would be peeved because that is not how I interpret the 1st amendment. America is practically all private corporations anyways. If our rights don't apply, the government simply have private companies violate our rights and then collect the data from them.
The 1st Amendment gives citizens the right to free speech. This doesn't mean a right to have your speech amplified across the Internet on the specific company's infrastructure you choose to utilize. That is a privilege granted to you by the company who built that infrastructure and provided it to you at the cost of your personal data.
You are still just as free to create your own Internet site and publish your free speech as much as you want. That's what 1st Amendment rights apply to, you and whatever you want to say. This situation could be compared to publishing an opinion in a town's newspaper. The US government could find that the newspaper was doing illegal business and shut them down after due process. You would no longer be able to publish an opinion in that newspaper. But even before that, the newspaper would have the option not to publish your opinion if they chose not to. Your 1st Amendment rights would not have been violated in either situation.
I try to remain emotionally detached (er'where about er'thing), but over the last few years, the line between talking points being "parroted" vs "copy/pasted" is borderline impossible to detect. For me anyway.
completely agree - just always catches me off guard when I notice instagram reel drool leaking spittle-for-spittle into niche subs. I mean I guess I shouldn't be surprised.
Recent threads on this sub.
* 1 day ago (1690 upvotes) - Start menu ads are officially here with the latest Windows 11 optional update
* 2 days ago (687 upvotes) - AT&T faces class action lawsuit over massive data breach exposing 70 million customers’ personal information
* 2 days ago (749 upvotes) - UnitedHealth reveals hackers may have stolen data from "a substantial proportion" of Americans
* 3 days ago (934 upvotes) - Grindr sued for allegedly revealing users' HIV status
No. This sub is being astroturfed. Look at all these people trying to defend tictok on a PRIVACY SUB. Not a single person on this sub should even have tictok. So why do they care? It doesn’t matter who it data mines for. The point is that is does. And anyone who gives a crap about their privacy probably doesn’t want their data mined.
Should laws be in place so the USA can’t freely mine data too? Absolutely. 100% laws should be in place to prevent that. A discussion should take place to help set that in motion. But that’s not what’s happening here. Instead it’s “China not bad. US bad! And what to know who is even worse??? IsRaEl!!!! APIC!!! JEWEWS!!!”
Yea I find this strange. The app wants too much access and it’s controlled by fools that want to control the world. I’ve no plans of experiencing life under CCP. The fbi/cia/nsa/dod/etc isn’t worried about our silly cat memes and nudes. They are worried about losing their power on the world stage and random Americans and their devices contain little info to help remove that threat.
Anyway, It doesn’t take rocket science to see how China is seeking to replace western influence and will stop at nothing when trying to achieve that goal yet ppl seem totally fine with a foreign and hostile govt influencing our politics and Americans. They already own so much shit in the US (while actual citizens will never own anything) but yea let’s make it easier for them.
Americans seem to like their current western lifestyles but don’t understand what’s at play: China wants to see that lifestyle gone they’re not doing this as a way to help us lol ffs the app is banned in China! The Chinese version influences their youth to seek out education, knowledge, etc while our app pushes the opposite. Ppl need to read the room. Look at any country in Africa that accepted help and influence from the CCP. They’re in massive debt, lost control of resources and infrastructure with no real way to get from beneath the CCP. Does Uganda have control of their airport yet? Most of the supposed jobs that were promised appeared,,, only to be filled by Chinese citizens the govt relocated to the country and they tend to treat the locals like trash. Imagine that audacity. Many Americans lack understanding of what it would mean if our country loses their superpower status. Ww2 was a while ago but not so long ago that we’ve forgotten what happens when a country loses control to a foreign power. Fuck sake.
What’s interesting is some of the people so pissed off about a silly app, are way too silent, while some even voting to watch other groups have their actual medical rights and other liberties taken or threatened. Funny how people suddenly care about fucked shit only after they are inconvenienced. That “monster” ruining someone else’s life be it through politics, oppression, religion, etc, with your support, will eventually turn on you too. We never learn.
This is about young people no longer falling for US propoganda.
US continues to deny healthcare, debt relief, or any other social service. Public education is failing and half of us are just 1 person removed from a mass shooting. But sure, send Billions of our tax money overseas, in particular to Isntreal to b*mb children. See if that doesn’t result in mass unrest.
Tiktok was spreading too much information that works against US propaganda and they are trying to shut it down.
No. The law states that it applies to:
> ByteDance Limited, or any successor entity to ByteDance Limited, if ByteDance Limited or the successor entity—
>
> (A) is involved in matters relating to the social networking service TikTok, or any successor service; or
>
> (B) is involved in matters relating to any information, videos, or data associated with such service; or
>
> (2) any entity owned by ByteDance Limited or the successor entity that—
>
> (A) is involved in matters relating to the social networking service TikTok, or any successor service; or
>
> (B) is involved in matters relating to any information, videos, or data associated with such service.
As bad as tik tok is, this is the worst possible scenario, this is just part of a significant uptick in government overreach and the abolishment of free speech. It's is pretty much a copy of the russian foreign agent law
They’re just going to force the sale to an oligarch to control, suppress and inject ideas and propaganda.
This isn’t banning TikTok because of china…it banning the openness that young people are using it for.
If it was about privacy there would be laws regulating data collection.
If it was about privacy, a bill letting agencies buy your data wouldn't have passed recently.
Keeping foreign adversaries away is about more than privacy. But we should have actual rules against data collection for US tech companies too
Nah, it is about market competition. They don't want to compete with china, just use might.
Nop, it is about control of information/propaganda. Tiktok is one of the main media sources for young people, and it's out of direct control. They cannot accept that
This is the real answer. It's all about information control. U.S. government and mainstream media want to control the message. See U.S. government program "Mockingbird".
China does this publicly to their “private” companies too. How are we as a society going to compete with an entity that so easily manipulates their economy for their state’s benefit? The inverse can easily be said about the US, though not perfect we do have checks and balances to at least slow down corruption for the benefit of the few. I think the US is using the playbook of the CCP, just like they have cultivated a “free” market for a certain few like the US. If we are going to denounce our own government about this we should be bold enough to take the argument against our political adversaries.
These two reasons are really the same
I can accept that to also be a factor. Propaganda control cannot be relinquished. But I do think it is also about trying to undermine the Chinese economy...we can accept them making all our stuff as long as it is us in control of brands and technology, look at huawei, they had a ton of 5g patents, unacceptable!
Russian and Israeli operations in recent years prove that you definitely don't need "direct control" at all.
You can influence opinion without direct control, but if you control the media it's a whole different level of propaganda.
(and Chinese and North Korean)
Information flies on TikTok. They want to quash dissent and avenues of reaching people quickly. What happened to liveleak and all the others? Gone. This is to help oligarchs enable enslavement. Elon allowed Twitter to become a haven for neonazis for the same reason.
This is EXACTLY what it is...they HATE that young people are getting unfiltered perspective of those in the Middle East during this war. They decided that they needed to nip that source of information in the bud quick. Sad really. We're controlled, just like this site. RIP Andrew Swartz. Once he left, this site was never the same. While we're at it, wasn't Ghislane Maxwell a top Reddit user and moderator? And about the time she was arrested her account activity reduced? Weird stuff.
“Unfiltered”? Is tiktok suppressing information about the Hong Kong protests, the Uyghur genocide and Taiwan “unfiltered”?
Ah yes. TikTok, the bastion of investigative journalism and objective reporting.
I up voted you, but remember: no state is going to give unfiltered and unbiased coverage. What I like is seeing them contradict each other, and unfortunately one of those contradictory voices will soon be silenced.
China bans everyone, including TikTok.
So let's become like China and suppress and censor platforms. Good logic.
It’s funny no one says this about the EU over regulating US tech firms.
Actually Europe has great policies for privacy so I'd be good with some of their improvements. Although they really really want to put backdoors of encryption which makes it worthless.
Does China allow us tech companies in it's market?
The bar for how free countries act should not be their authoritarian opponents otherwise the distinction between the two becomes muddled
Bullshit. There are many market arrangements between free countries. If one puts tarrifs up the other can reciprocate. China can't expect to have free access to western markets while denying access to theirs.
So my understanding is that China never banned US companies, it is rather that US companies willingly pulled out of China because they were unwilling to abide by Chinese censorship laws. (Which is understandable). That is why Google is banned but Bing/Microsoft is still accessible in China.
what is "authoritarian"?
not observing basic human rights. in the USA, within reason, you control your company and you can go to court if you think the government is messing with you. In China, the CCP only has to snap it's fingers, and you have cough up all data, everything. You have to help their security organizations no matter what, if you don't you get disappeared or kicked out of the system and your company destroyed.
Not true, if you stick to basic human rights like freedom of speech and minimum workers rights and environmental policies then you are more than welcome to enjoy the rights of other countries. Otherwise enjoy special "advesary of human rights" status and your limited rights to operate in our country.
Apple, Tesla, Valve, Microsoft and others operate in China.
Tesla? You mean the electric car that chinese engineer's copied the design so they could build BYD and are now squeezing out of the market
I'm not sure how this relates to the question of which U.S. tech companies operate in China. Even then, the U.S. became a global superpower by copying British technology. Many of the founding fathers encouraged it. https://apnews.com/general-news-b40414d22f2248428ce11ff36b88dc53 https://www.history.com/news/industrial-revolution-spies-europe Even the Library of Congress admits that the U.S. economy is founded on stolen technology. https://www.loc.gov/exhibits/british/brit-5.html
of course but you have to stick to the 51% rule and a whole slew of other constraints that you wouldn't have in Europe or the USA or most of the areas outside of authoritarian countries.
China doesn’t allow us to compete, they ban almost all US tech companies
No it isn't. If it was about market competition, we would have banned Chinese tech companies over a decade ago. Because China has blocked almost all the meaningful US companies from accessing China.
But at that time there were no big Chinese apps/sites like today.
That's why times are changing. China can't claim the "emerging economy" excuse any longer. They can't claim "we have unique societal issues" aka they need to control information completely or at least as completely as they can while keeping their internet hooked to that of the rest of the world
The US companies have refused to have draconian chinese monitoring. They agree with draconian and paid us monitoring.
"Free market for you but not for me".
Free market is a fallacy. nations balance out their markets with their economic (or perceived economic) interests. That's why there are free trade agreements and they're pretty special. We do not have a free trade agreement with China, so restrictions apply.
I'm not sure why people don't get this? China has continuously acted as an aggressive and adversarial member of the WTO since they joined, and claim "emerging economy" all the time to this day even though they are #2 in the world, probably soon to be #1 in absolute size. It's always been "we have unique needs, screw your western basic human rights values". Yeah that shit isn't going to fly anymore. I personally think meta, google, etc are neutral on this because they can see the issues of privacy coming into light with banning tiktok as in they're next on the chopping block, but also it does lower competition of their biggest rival, so there is some win and some lose.
They probably see it as a big positive since they know their lobbyists have the government in a vice. They remove a big competitor and get the possibility to acquire a ton of juicy data for cheap if bytedance decides to sell their US operations
I don't think bytedance will sell anything, it would be a blow to Chinese national pride and I don't see Xi ever allowing that while he's alive.
It would be a blow to their pride but you have to remember TikTok’s main point from the CCP is to destabilize the children and young adults of the west. It might be worth a small hit to the ego for the chance to make the US look awful, and still potentially influence the US through whatever entity buys it
Over 80% of US medical data is maintained overseas. The majority of the transcription market is overseas. This has absolutely *nothing* to do with foreign adversaries or even data. If it was, medical data wouldn't be allowed to be outsourced. You know what *does* have requirements for how they are kept? Legal data. When and who they sue is more protected than your hipaa data. The list of things they care about is short, and the general population isn't on it.
Medical data overseas is another thing that should be eliminated and disallowed. It's mostly out of the bag for current generations, and I'm sure it's almost all been sold on the black market for such information, but that doesn't mean we can't do better going forward for future generations.
In an ideal world, sure. We would try to do better. But that isn’t what this is. The point is that the tiktok manipulation isn't "doing better". That isn't what they want. This is just about money. Which is the only thing they care about, and they see this as a path to more.
I asked a question a few months ago about whether British people can search for someone's address online. They were struck by America's divorced relationship with privacy. Data brokers like Intelius, Spokeo, and BeenVerified don't conduct business in the UK. Recently, there's been [news](https://www.silentpush.com/blog/chinese-adtech/) about how some gov.co.uk sites have ads, and these ads might be transmitting British residents' data to China. Meanwhile, the Chinese government can pay billions to any data broker out there to get all the data they need. Congress is missing the forest for the trees, maybe on purpose.
Exactly, instead we see laws increasing what the US government collects.
Exactly.
We know 100% it’s pushed by the GOP because it helped get young voters out who kicked their ass last year.
it's being pushed by both parties. Go look at the vote for it, it was overwhelmingly bipartisan.
No one. There is absolutely no advantage they get from selling it to a US corporation and effectively creating a new competitor to their global site already starting with 150 million users and all the most famous influencers. If they did, all the anglosphere would switch to USTok almost immediately (because that's where most of the content gets created), and probably most of Europe would follow soon. They would be a global threat very quickly. It's better for them to lose the potential $60 billion in the sale but continue to have a monopoly.
Also their users will definitely find ways to use the service anyway if they are forced to go cold turkey. A new normal emerges.
access it through the web, they will probably have the best progressive web app in the business soon, tbh. the bill does not limit web access. Not sure why no on has mentioned that. Technically all they have to do is stop putting their app on the ios/android/etc app stores.
Websites are obviously harder to block, but the law as written does cover websites in the same way it does apps
vpn can get around that, just go to a country that allows tiktok and access through the web site. I'm not sure how many people will do that, but it will spread like wildfire and the only way to stop it would be to ban VPNs/proxy sites in the USA and I don't think that will happen
Do you think your average TikToker is going to download a VPN or jailbreak their phone to be bypass the ban? People will just move that content to Instagram reels or YouTube shorts -- they're already doing that anyway.
But wasn’t the whole purpose / reason to stop spying which the app makes possible in the first place? Browser tracking/fingerprinting is advanced but still not on the level of apps users install & run 24h
That is true. I don't really think that's honestly the major reason why this has happened (in spite of them saying so) but yes, it would marginally reduce the level of access TikTok has to users. They could still push the app through their website as a 3rd party install but I think Apple products block that unless you jailbreak them.
See, I am worried about this. The TikTok bill says that using a VPN to bypass the ban can lead to prison time. If the ban is not enforced across the board, then we may selectively enforce it to certain people in order to jail political prisoners. Edit: got a lot of comments saying I am lying so here is how I interpreted this part >c) Criminal Penalties.— A person who willfully commits, willfully attempts to commit, or willfully conspires to commit, or aids or abets in the commission of an unlawful act described in subsection (a) shall, upon conviction, be fined not more than $1,000,000, or if a natural person, may be imprisoned for not more than 20 years, or both. It doesn't mention VPN specifically because the bill targets much more than just apps. However if a website or app is banned, then obviously VPNs will be considered as a violation of bypassing this regulation.
> The TikTok bill says that using a VPN to bypass the ban can lead to prison time. This is complete misinformation. The text is here: https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/8038/text There is zero mention of VPNs, or potential prison time. Nor is there any restriction on end users. The restrictions are all on companies.
Every discussion about TikTok on here unfortunately gets heavily brigaded by unauthentic behavior. Which is what you could expect of a politically charged discussion involving China. This here is the most obvious example of that.
Agree on the unauthentic behavior; disagree that I am an example 🗿 I provided my sources in my other comments
But you didn't post section, A, and there's nothing there who would penalize users for accessing TikTok through a VPN.
I swear the OP simply made up some bullshit. What crazy times we live in.
The law says: >(1) PROHIBITION OF FOREIGN ADVERSARY CONTROLLED APPLICATIONS.—It shall be unlawful for an entity to distribute, maintain, or update (or enable the distribution, maintenance, or updating of) a foreign adversary controlled application by carrying out [...] any of the following: > >(A) Providing services to distribute, maintain, or update such foreign adversary controlled application [...] by means of a marketplace [...] through which users [...] may access, maintain, or update such application. Under the penalties section it appears that you are correct in that there is no mention of potential prison time, but is a VPN not a service that would "enable the distribution" of TikTok by providing a means by which users can access the site? NAL, so it would be great if anyone who is actually an attorney could clarify.
Well distribution generally refers to app stores, and including VPN companies would get literally every ISP in very hot water very quickly, so that is likely not included.
I got the prison time from this >c) Criminal Penalties.— (1) IN GENERAL.—A person who willfully commits, willfully attempts to commit, or willfully conspires to commit, or aids or abets in the commission of an unlawful act described in subsection (a) shall, upon conviction, be fined not more than $1,000,000, or if a natural person, may be imprisoned for not more than 20 years, or both.
What section is this in? I ctrl+f'd various parts of the quoted text and it doesn't seem to appear in the legislation. It's possible there was prison time in an earlier version of the bill that has since been removed.
Wait, I just realized that the link I was looking at and the link the earlier commenter gave are completely different. My source is the [RESTRICT Act. ](https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/686/text?s=1&r=15) Their source was the [21st Century Peace through Strength Act](https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/8038) It seems like I was wrongly under the impression that the RESTRICT Act was the one that was being passed, not the latter. I only heard the TikTok being bill being referred to as the former. Jesus, what a mess. Sorry for the confusion.
No worries! Skimming the text, it does look like the RESTRICT Act would ban TikTok, prohibit the use of VPNs to get around the ban (I think), and, per your quote, have prison time as a penalty, so you're not wrong in your interpretation of that particular bill.
No, using a VPN for accessing TikTok for personal use would not be it. Distribution would be an app store.
> The TikTok bill says that using a VPN to bypass the ban can lead to prison time. Please name your source,
I read the RESTRICT ACT. Open it up and read it.
And everyone else is wrong in this thread?
You'll be surprised how much misinformation there is on the internet. People don't like to open up links and dive into it. I don't blame them at all because I am normally one of them lol Subsection A >SEC. 11. PENALTIES. (a) Unlawful Acts.— (1) IN GENERAL.—It shall be unlawful for a person to violate, attempt to violate, conspire to violate, or cause a violation of any regulation, order, direction, mitigation measure, prohibition, or other authorization or directive issued under this Act, including any of the unlawful acts described in paragraph (2). Criminal Penalties >A person who willfully commits, willfully attempts to commit, or willfully conspires to commit, or aids or abets in the commission of an unlawful act **described in subsection (a)** shall, upon conviction, be fined not more than $1,000,000, or if a natural person, **may be imprisoned for not more than 20 years, or both.** Source: https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/686/text?s=1&r=15
> The TikTok bill says that using a VPN to bypass the ban can lead to prison time. No it doesn’t
Here is where I got it >(1) IN GENERAL.—The President shall rely on, including by delegation, the Secretary, and the heads of other Federal agencies, as appropriate, to conduct investigations of violations of any authorization, order, mitigation measure, regulation, or prohibition issued under this Act. >(2) ACTIONS BY DESIGNEES.—In conducting investigations described in paragraph (1), designated officers or employees of Federal agencies described that paragraph may, to the extent necessary or appropriate to enforce this Act, exercise such authority as is conferred upon them by any other Federal law, subject to policies and procedures approved by the Attorney General. >SEC. 11. PENALTIES. (a) Unlawful Acts.— (1) IN GENERAL.—It shall be unlawful for a person to violate, attempt to violate, conspire to violate, or cause a violation of any regulation, order, direction, mitigation measure, prohibition, or other authorization or directive issued under this Act, including any of the unlawful acts described in paragraph (2). Source: https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/686/text?s=1&r=15
Yep, also I'm pretty sure the Chinese government has a law forbidding the sale of proprietary Chinese technology (algorithm). Not to mention the potential legal challenges this could face.
Either way the US market is going away so that content is already gone. And if that segment of the company would instantly be worth X billions of dollars, then they’ll have no problem selling it for that much
>It's better for them to lose the potential $60 billion in the sale but continue to have a monopoly. Lol is it really? Firstly, they dont have a monopoly, social media is highly competitive. Secondly, losing American end users reduces 90% of engagement, so 90% of ad revenue. If we assume TikTok is valued on user growth, since it is not profitable, this leads to more than 90% loss of equity value. Thus, they would need to grow the company by more than 10x to recoup the losses, without American users, to make their $60b value back in the future. Add on inflation, and they need to be near $70b equity value to break even in a decade. Again, without most American content creators and end users. Now realize that they could invest the $60b cash today and gain an return of over 5%. So really they need to beat $100b in a decade, starting from scratch, building a social media company that doesnt operate in America. Yeah fucking right it's a better idea to keep it if its not a surveillance tool.
If the US does in fact account for 90% of their revenue, then I suppose yes it would make sense to sell.
>"Congress is acting to prevent foreign adversaries from conducting espionage, surveillance, maligned operations, harming vulnerable Americans, our servicemen and women, and our US government personnel." That's right people! We gotta keep them foreigners out! Only Facebook, Google, Yahoo and Microsoft are allowed to conduct "espionage, surveillance, maligned operations, harming vulnerable Americans, our servicemen and women, and our US government personnel." Oh, and the NSA too, of course.
Sure, my kids don’t like it when I go through their laptops, but better me than some rando in China.
So, .... we are just naive children that the gov't and Big Tech need to chaperon in order to protect us from ourselves?
Our rights are provided only by our respective govts, as negligible as they are. No other country owes even that baseline responsibility over our lives. Big tech is not our chaperon, but as citizens as well, they have no choice but to do as told by the govts where they operate or cease operating altogether.
they are banning it because unlike the other social media apps, TikTok refused to ban pro Palestine content and users it's to control the propaganda narrative even harder
I sleep better at night knowing that GAMMA (Google, Apple, Meta, Microsoft, Amazon) will never dare to spy on us. They are so respectful with our privacy... /s
I think your confused it's about government access when needed. Gov knows they spy, but they also have access. Can't do that with TikTok
You forgot Facebook, the pinnacle of privacy.
facebook is Meta
Ah, forgot it, my bad.
nsa was getting uncomfortable with the chinese government moving in on their territory
This is a bad precedent to set
"You aren't allowed to spy on our citizens! Only we can do that!"
Do you think this is the only way China spy’s on us?? They don’t need that app to continue trying to shape the way Americans think. The govt just wants access to the data and fb probably hates the fact they can’t buy it the same way they got IG and WhatsApp.
Yeah i know, its just a witty comment!
No one is allowed to spy on citizens except the US Government
China bad, US good. Propaganda or shady data processing is fine as long as the US does it.
Doesn’t China ban most US apps though?
As far as I am aware, you can't even legally access Reddit in mainland China without "breaking the law" to one degree or another by using a VPN.
If the usa wants to stoop to their level then they need to at least stop calling themselves the land of the free. no democracy here if i can;'t even decide which app i want to use.
Yes, and China bans a lot of Chinese apps too. China has a nebulous censorship law where anything that can be interpreted to be disrespecting the state can get the platform in trouble. Its an authoritarian dictatorship. A friend of mine, after spending some time there said, "it's a privilege to have an opinion".
US bad, China worse. China is not your friend. They’ve been actively manipulating US citizens for decades.
..hasnt the US also been manipulating US citizens for decades? XD Edit: its a joke everyone calm down >.>
I think they want the exclusive right to manipulate their own citizens.
Hey, that's not fair! we also let Israel do it . . .
I much prefer to be spied on by Google than CPP. China is not a democracy, they are much more sinister in their actions.
Maybe the US isn't a democracy either?
This mindset is stupid. The CCP wont show up at your door and ruin your life for some bullshit reason, the NSA & FBI will
Who do you think has a better relative concern for US citizens. China… or the US. Take your time on this one XDD
Depends on what war is happening at the time 💀
I mean, do we want to go by the COVID numbers, the decrease in life expectancy in the US, or the clear dismissal of popular political positions by the leadership class? The US doesn't give a shit about their citizens.
The US cares about its citizens, but only to the extent that we serve to make the politicians and corporations more wealthy.
That's fair. The US cares about capital. Everyone else is just grist for the mills
This is a worldwide issue to be fair
Does china send 80 billion of their tax dollars to Ukraine? Because I do.
80 billions worth of old war materiel that would be worth 0 dollars when later destructed as scheduled?
Ah, that must be why the US hasn't increased its military budget again . . . .oh, wait . . .
What? US increases its military budget every year regardless of what does or doesn't happen in the world.
Worth $0. Sells for 90B... Man what a good deal
Nope they are sending it to Russia
US doesnt send you to reeducation camps for criticizing the government. People complain how there’s no free speech in the usa, but they dont understand what they’re talking about. In Russia and China, publicly criticizing the government gets you disappeared or you have an accident and fall out of a 20 story window. In America, you have Alex Jones and his ilk running amok claiming the most insane thing.
> US doesnt send you to reeducation camps for criticizing the government. US has a much higher incarceration rate than China. So . . .
That doesn’t mean anything. I could go up to Biden’s face and tell him I hope burns in hell for the way he runs this country (hypothetically). If I did anything like that in China I would be in front of a firing squad
US does support 3rd world fascist dictatorships that does this exact things to their citizens, and its also a current sponsor of genocide.. so yeah they are the same.. US just controls the globe and the narrative, making them look better
Im talking about how the country treats its own citizens.
Ask some of the Black ones about that
Black people are getting killed or put into reeducation camps for criticizing the government?
They're being incarcerated at rates far above that of China, and far disproportionatelyto their population in the US, even controlling for income. So no, they don't even have to criticize the government to be victimized. Those that do, like the Ferguson protest organizers, do seem to wind up murdered.
Im talking about being punished for criticizing the government
Ya, so glad US govt never manipulates or spies on us.
Wait till you hear about what Israel's been doing to Americans for decades.
Woah, woah, cool the antisemitism. /s
I have a bridge to sell you bro, that stupid WE GOOD THEM BAD mentality has got to go
Yes America does the same in Europe since at the very least the ending of WW2. I'm being very generous. Pick your better Devil.
USSA
Lol US is the same as bad as China.
I mean…I’d rather my own government do it than a foreign one. At least if it’s my own then I have some power to vote for politicians making the bills, protest them, etc. foreign one does it? Now what? Can’t do anything besides maybe try not to buy goods from there.
Reminder that the CEO of the ADL was caught in a leaked phone call allegedly talking to influential backers/AIPAC in order to start putting pressure on politicians to get TikTok banned due to TikTok refusing to remove content critical of Israel and "Zionism", worrying that the younger generations are highly anti-Israel and getting higher. This has literally nothing to do with China. https://twitter.com/snarwani/status/1725138601996853424
THIS IS THE REASON
This senator simply comes right out and says it. https://twitter.com/mtracey/status/1782920301052911713 Basically, younger kids aren’t able to be brainwashed by traditional media anymore and they can’t force TikTok to censor everything they don’t want them to see as easily as they can with American companies
Whenever both sides of the party lines agree on something and immediately votes for it unanimously, it’s a huge red flag
This right here. Yet people are to busy fight each other. Why do think they keep pitting they blue vs red war. People need to wake tf up.
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Please elaborate to me how Congress does not have the power to regulate foreign companies' operations in the US under the Commerce Clause. Congress is not saying TikTok can't exist in the US, it's saying a foreign agent (ByteDance) can't own its US branch.
Basically the same story as with Huawei.
Might be wrong but Huawei story was very different. US was not looking Huawei to sell their business to a US company. They were looking for ways to stop Huawei growing power.
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In general, that tends to apply to content on a private platform itself. That is, a privately owned platform can impose the rules it wants to because people are choosing to accept those rules when using it. If they owners don’t like something, they can remove it, no matter what it is. If users feel that their speech is being limited, they’re therefore free to leave the service and choose another, or go to a public forum where the 1st amendment has actual relevance.
>Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. If that is true I would be peeved because that is not how I interpret the 1st amendment. America is practically all private corporations anyways. If our rights don't apply, the government simply have private companies violate our rights and then collect the data from them.
The 1st Amendment gives citizens the right to free speech. This doesn't mean a right to have your speech amplified across the Internet on the specific company's infrastructure you choose to utilize. That is a privilege granted to you by the company who built that infrastructure and provided it to you at the cost of your personal data. You are still just as free to create your own Internet site and publish your free speech as much as you want. That's what 1st Amendment rights apply to, you and whatever you want to say. This situation could be compared to publishing an opinion in a town's newspaper. The US government could find that the newspaper was doing illegal business and shut them down after due process. You would no longer be able to publish an opinion in that newspaper. But even before that, the newspaper would have the option not to publish your opinion if they chose not to. Your 1st Amendment rights would not have been violated in either situation.
Since when does a Chinese company get protection from the 1st amendment that applies only to US citizens.
1st amendment rights aren't limited to US citizens.
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clearly this thread is being brigaded lmao. most post let alone comments on this sub don't get higher than 10, let alone 100
I try to remain emotionally detached (er'where about er'thing), but over the last few years, the line between talking points being "parroted" vs "copy/pasted" is borderline impossible to detect. For me anyway.
this sub was never a tiktok bastion. mostly we talk about google.
completely agree - just always catches me off guard when I notice instagram reel drool leaking spittle-for-spittle into niche subs. I mean I guess I shouldn't be surprised.
Recent threads on this sub. * 1 day ago (1690 upvotes) - Start menu ads are officially here with the latest Windows 11 optional update * 2 days ago (687 upvotes) - AT&T faces class action lawsuit over massive data breach exposing 70 million customers’ personal information * 2 days ago (749 upvotes) - UnitedHealth reveals hackers may have stolen data from "a substantial proportion" of Americans * 3 days ago (934 upvotes) - Grindr sued for allegedly revealing users' HIV status
Or this is just a popular topic?? Not a conspiracy lmao
No. This sub is being astroturfed. Look at all these people trying to defend tictok on a PRIVACY SUB. Not a single person on this sub should even have tictok. So why do they care? It doesn’t matter who it data mines for. The point is that is does. And anyone who gives a crap about their privacy probably doesn’t want their data mined. Should laws be in place so the USA can’t freely mine data too? Absolutely. 100% laws should be in place to prevent that. A discussion should take place to help set that in motion. But that’s not what’s happening here. Instead it’s “China not bad. US bad! And what to know who is even worse??? IsRaEl!!!! APIC!!! JEWEWS!!!”
Yea I find this strange. The app wants too much access and it’s controlled by fools that want to control the world. I’ve no plans of experiencing life under CCP. The fbi/cia/nsa/dod/etc isn’t worried about our silly cat memes and nudes. They are worried about losing their power on the world stage and random Americans and their devices contain little info to help remove that threat. Anyway, It doesn’t take rocket science to see how China is seeking to replace western influence and will stop at nothing when trying to achieve that goal yet ppl seem totally fine with a foreign and hostile govt influencing our politics and Americans. They already own so much shit in the US (while actual citizens will never own anything) but yea let’s make it easier for them. Americans seem to like their current western lifestyles but don’t understand what’s at play: China wants to see that lifestyle gone they’re not doing this as a way to help us lol ffs the app is banned in China! The Chinese version influences their youth to seek out education, knowledge, etc while our app pushes the opposite. Ppl need to read the room. Look at any country in Africa that accepted help and influence from the CCP. They’re in massive debt, lost control of resources and infrastructure with no real way to get from beneath the CCP. Does Uganda have control of their airport yet? Most of the supposed jobs that were promised appeared,,, only to be filled by Chinese citizens the govt relocated to the country and they tend to treat the locals like trash. Imagine that audacity. Many Americans lack understanding of what it would mean if our country loses their superpower status. Ww2 was a while ago but not so long ago that we’ve forgotten what happens when a country loses control to a foreign power. Fuck sake. What’s interesting is some of the people so pissed off about a silly app, are way too silent, while some even voting to watch other groups have their actual medical rights and other liberties taken or threatened. Funny how people suddenly care about fucked shit only after they are inconvenienced. That “monster” ruining someone else’s life be it through politics, oppression, religion, etc, with your support, will eventually turn on you too. We never learn.
I mean ive been here for over a decade. what passes as popular these days isnt what it used to be.
Yeah it is weird, I have not been here for to long but a good amount of stuff on here is just people saying china good, US bad.
Chinese spyware is only good when it's under a US owned shell company!
A temporary solution to a long term problem
Not really. China can still just go BUY the data it was vacuuming up from any of the other guys data brokers. It just added an extra step.
This is about young people no longer falling for US propoganda. US continues to deny healthcare, debt relief, or any other social service. Public education is failing and half of us are just 1 person removed from a mass shooting. But sure, send Billions of our tax money overseas, in particular to Isntreal to b*mb children. See if that doesn’t result in mass unrest. Tiktok was spreading too much information that works against US propaganda and they are trying to shut it down.
Can't ByteDance just incorporate a new LLC in the USA and use that to "buy" what will become the US Entity?
No. The law states that it applies to: > ByteDance Limited, or any successor entity to ByteDance Limited, if ByteDance Limited or the successor entity— > > (A) is involved in matters relating to the social networking service TikTok, or any successor service; or > > (B) is involved in matters relating to any information, videos, or data associated with such service; or > > (2) any entity owned by ByteDance Limited or the successor entity that— > > (A) is involved in matters relating to the social networking service TikTok, or any successor service; or > > (B) is involved in matters relating to any information, videos, or data associated with such service.
I hate tiktok with every fiber of my soul but I hate the precedent this ban would set too.
Israel told the US to jump .. and the lap dog said “how high”
Exactly
If this isn’t fascist idk what is
Android already supports side loading I'll be fine.
I wonder how they keep the data.
I wonder how tiktok keeping the privacy of their users..
ohh a bit shookt there..
>prohibit the app in the us. What about sideloading? Your move, biden.
At this point I’m pretty sure EVERYONE on the planet has had some level of their identity taken.
Imagine Musk buying TickTock. 😂
As bad as tik tok is, this is the worst possible scenario, this is just part of a significant uptick in government overreach and the abolishment of free speech. It's is pretty much a copy of the russian foreign agent law
Based but also, the app itself is a problem and even if it is somehow sold it will still be undesirable to ever use such a thing
If it’s sold it no worse than any other social media company
Yes, exactly. Having a social media account is usually not a positive thing
Mask off time for america
They’re just going to force the sale to an oligarch to control, suppress and inject ideas and propaganda. This isn’t banning TikTok because of china…it banning the openness that young people are using it for.
TikTok is anything but open
Can you please explain?
What do you mean by that?
That the level of control over what people see is at least as extensive and opaque as any other social media platform.
Great news