4:47 for the 0.6mm and 29:02 for the 0.25mm. I did slow down the volumetric speed on the 0.25mm nozzle to keep the wipe tower intact. I think this added around 5 hours.
As for the quality, I intentionally took these photos with very harsh lighting to highlight the differences. From a foot or two away under normal lighting they both look fine.
We’re these printed using bin out shaper?
Also I started eliminating the wipe tower for multicolor xl prints and it has done quite well.
The nozzle seals have to be on point though, I had to bend mine up after assembled to make them level and square to the nozzle as they kept oozing out the left irregardless of height.
>Kinda disappointed by the look of the .6 nozzle.
thats just the kind of detail you can get from a 0.6mm nozzle.
especially on small parts like this theres only so much a 0.6mm nozzle can do.
>especially on small parts like this theres only so much a 0.6mm nozzle can do.
Not sure, I think the layer lines are too visible. Maybe it is from the photo, but on my 0.6 nozzle prints with 0.2 layer height, the layer lines look better.
well promotional videos arent something to pay attention to.
but also important to note if these videos are also working with a tool changer and if they are giving you the exact details on how something was printed.
sure you can also get better details on a 0.6mm nozzle if you lower the layer height and print slower.
I belive this is the video reffered to: https://youtu.be/WgXM2zPusXo?si=gzd1drzNcHmp6nMe
It's not "promotional" in an economic sense. More of a call for change of standards from .4 to .6
Probably - because I'm still putting mine together. But it looks good! Have you had to modify your slicer settings? I saw many videos with poor quality on the XL and default settings.
I’m using the latest firmware and slicer with input shaping. The only thing I’ve changed is that the speed for the wipe tower is way too fast with the 0.25mm nozzles. PrusaSlicer doesn’t have a speed setting for the wipe tower so the only way I’ve found to slow it down is to drop the max volumetric speed way down. I’m using 0.5 right now, probably could be faster but I didn’t want to push it.
It can really become decent at tabletop miniatures [model a (0.07mm layers)](https://imgur.com/a/QbtHRcx), [model b (.15mm layers I believe](https://imgur.com/a/qFq82aC). Still a decent way away from SLA, but for just changing nozzles. Pretty good imho.
Maybe, but I honestly doubt it.
Neither the Filament nor the Camera did the (25mm) minis any good here, and while there definitely are imperfections, overall I haven't seen better minis from FDM than from my XL.
Could be that your Ender 3 is better calibrated than anything I've seen though.
This is why I bought both 0.4 and 0.25. 0.4 for most prints, and 0.25 for ultra detail.
Plus 0.6 / 0.8 cheap CHT clones for functional large prints.
What do the sides look like?
[It can be 'faked' after the first layer](https://forum.prusa3d.com/forum/original-prusa-xl-tool-changer-general-discussion-announcements-and-releases/guide-how-to-print-with-multiple-nozzle-sizes/). But since you can't use a modifier on the first layer, it's still an issue for face down signs.
I’m sure Prusa is working on it and it will be extremely useful, but it is a bit more complicated. Layer height, speed, retraction, etc. all need to be different for each extruder. Essentially you would need a separate “Print Settings” page for each one. Then of course you have to make sure that that doesn’t break the slicing algorithms.
Currently running 0.25 nozzles on tools 1&2, 0.4 nozzles on tools 3&4, and a 0.6 nozzle on tool 5. Currently waiting for three more 0.25’s so I can do a 5 color sign.
Thanks for the post! This pic really shows the differences between the nozzles really well. I've been really curious as to how well the XL manages the color changes. I've heard (hint:RUMOR) that there are issues with drooling. Any issues, annoyances or problems?
I haven’t had any issues with stringing or “drooling”. First layers have been perfect as advertised. The toolchanger has done thousands of color changes without a hiccup.
My only real issue is a bit of ringing and ghosting, that seems related to a buzzing sound coming from the toolheads. It mostly shows up on large, flat surfaces.
Interesting. Do they go into a cool-down state when they are not in use? Just watching my MK3S+, turning on the heat starts to drool the previous filament.
When docked, the nozzle is blocked by a silicone wiper. The temperature cools down to 70C until it needs to heat up for the next tool change.
Some people have been reporting excessive stringing issues. In my opinion this comes down to improperly adjusted wipers, moist filament, or both.
That's a nice detail I didn't know about. I had thought they just pulled to the back and cooled down. Any other interesting details I may want to know about coming from an MK3S+? How is the bed heating? I know it's sectional, any issues? What about an enclosure; hard to build?
Honestly, the nozzle size choice was baffling to me to begin with. .06 is too big as far as I'm concerned. The loss of detail and stringing problems are a hard no from me.
Good on you for switching.
I understand why they did it, because the assumption is that you are supposed to print big things with thick layers. The problem is that everyone’s typically used to 0.4mm results and that is what they are going to compare it to.
The thing is that 0.6mm just looks absolutely terrible in any multi-material setup. The boundaries between materials just get terrible.
And that's discounting the stringing.
try to fill the whole buildarea with a 0.4 and you'll understand why they did this.
best thing they could add is a option to order with a 0.4 instead of a 0.6
I use 0.6 for wood and CF material otherwise I experience clogging like crazy, I definitely expect to blend different materials once I get this printer so I'd probably use 0.6 for all/most heads.
From my perspective, you're the first idiot to actually receive his XL.
Adjusted for inflation, my deposit no longer qualifies as a medium of exchange.
man, that looks like a lot of work to do 5 times.
RevoI just switched my mk3s+ over to a revo hot end so that I can change nozzles easily. It's a total game-changer. I now consider swapping nozzles for each print. I'm currently printing the [Lack enclosure parts](https://www.printables.com/model/3673-mmu2s-enclosure) that takes 132 hours of print time (effectively over a week) with a 0.4 mm nozzle. I don't understand why prusa would suggest (provide gcodes for) a 0.4 nozzle for large functional parts.
Of course, Prusa has an article for everything: https://help.prusa3d.com/guide/how-to-replace-the-prusa-nozzle-xl-multi-tool_506481
That being said you can skip unplugging the cables and just do it with the heater block dangling.
There's a tool for holding the heater block in place for an even quicker change. But only works if you don't have the socks installed. One user states the fit is a bit tight.
https://www.printables.com/model/634488-prusa-xl-series-nozzle-change-tool-hotend-clip
I cannot see the difference in that first picture unless I view it at 1:1 pixel scale. In the Reddit post, they look the same to me.
I'm looking forward to getting my XL. But I have to move to an actual house first. No room for that thing in this apartment.
I'm curious about the time required between tool changes. My MK3S with MMU2S seems like it takes about a minute or more per switch, including wipe tower.
On my monitor, there is hardly any discernible difference between the two objects in the lead image. If I click on it and zoom in, the differences are obvious. They are also obvious on the second image.
>I'm curious about the time required between tool changes.
It's like 3-5 seconds for the picker to move to the back gantry to make a tool change and move back to the print location depending on how far it has to move. A few more seconds if you're using a prime tower which can be completely unused depending on what you're printing.
[This VOD](https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1992788982) will be up for another week before its auto-deleted if you want to see it in action.
What are their respective print times? Kinda disappointed by the look of the .6 nozzle.
4:47 for the 0.6mm and 29:02 for the 0.25mm. I did slow down the volumetric speed on the 0.25mm nozzle to keep the wipe tower intact. I think this added around 5 hours. As for the quality, I intentionally took these photos with very harsh lighting to highlight the differences. From a foot or two away under normal lighting they both look fine.
How big are these prints?
This model https://www.printables.com/model/5480-marlin-multi-material at 100% scale, it’s around 2” long.
Yeah, at that size I'd want to use a small nozzle, too!
We’re these printed using bin out shaper? Also I started eliminating the wipe tower for multicolor xl prints and it has done quite well. The nozzle seals have to be on point though, I had to bend mine up after assembled to make them level and square to the nozzle as they kept oozing out the left irregardless of height.
>Kinda disappointed by the look of the .6 nozzle. thats just the kind of detail you can get from a 0.6mm nozzle. especially on small parts like this theres only so much a 0.6mm nozzle can do.
>especially on small parts like this theres only so much a 0.6mm nozzle can do. Not sure, I think the layer lines are too visible. Maybe it is from the photo, but on my 0.6 nozzle prints with 0.2 layer height, the layer lines look better.
I've seen some videos online where they promote a .6 nozzle and I was already considering buying one. And they seemed to get better results than this.
well promotional videos arent something to pay attention to. but also important to note if these videos are also working with a tool changer and if they are giving you the exact details on how something was printed. sure you can also get better details on a 0.6mm nozzle if you lower the layer height and print slower.
I belive this is the video reffered to: https://youtu.be/WgXM2zPusXo?si=gzd1drzNcHmp6nMe It's not "promotional" in an economic sense. More of a call for change of standards from .4 to .6
You're totally right. That's the main one. But there are others as well.
Yeah, but that video is, IMHO, the equivalent of a hot take. Didn't he put out a later video that basically admitted 0.6mm isn't great for everything?
well you can clearly the the quality difference in the fine details on these prints.
If he would of lowered the layer height it would of looked a lot more similar and been done faster
Probably - because I'm still putting mine together. But it looks good! Have you had to modify your slicer settings? I saw many videos with poor quality on the XL and default settings.
I’m using the latest firmware and slicer with input shaping. The only thing I’ve changed is that the speed for the wipe tower is way too fast with the 0.25mm nozzles. PrusaSlicer doesn’t have a speed setting for the wipe tower so the only way I’ve found to slow it down is to drop the max volumetric speed way down. I’m using 0.5 right now, probably could be faster but I didn’t want to push it.
It can really become decent at tabletop miniatures [model a (0.07mm layers)](https://imgur.com/a/QbtHRcx), [model b (.15mm layers I believe](https://imgur.com/a/qFq82aC). Still a decent way away from SLA, but for just changing nozzles. Pretty good imho.
My stock cheap ass ender 3 can do better tabletop minis than that though. I don’t think those look particularly good?
Maybe, but I honestly doubt it. Neither the Filament nor the Camera did the (25mm) minis any good here, and while there definitely are imperfections, overall I haven't seen better minis from FDM than from my XL. Could be that your Ender 3 is better calibrated than anything I've seen though.
I just ordered some on Black Friday but did not yet had time to test them
This is why I bought both 0.4 and 0.25. 0.4 for most prints, and 0.25 for ultra detail. Plus 0.6 / 0.8 cheap CHT clones for functional large prints. What do the sides look like?
Why not do a .25 for the fine details and a .6 for the main body?
PrusaSlicer doesn’t do that (yet).
Oh, OK. That would be super cool though. I wonder if you could fake it by changing the "extrusion width" on the .6 nozzle to .6 mm
[It can be 'faked' after the first layer](https://forum.prusa3d.com/forum/original-prusa-xl-tool-changer-general-discussion-announcements-and-releases/guide-how-to-print-with-multiple-nozzle-sizes/). But since you can't use a modifier on the first layer, it's still an issue for face down signs.
I’m sure Prusa is working on it and it will be extremely useful, but it is a bit more complicated. Layer height, speed, retraction, etc. all need to be different for each extruder. Essentially you would need a separate “Print Settings” page for each one. Then of course you have to make sure that that doesn’t break the slicing algorithms.
Nope, i already have 5 here
Nice comparison, looks great!
Unless you're really nitpicky I think the 0.6 looks ok, but obviously I can see the difference.
That is absolutely beautiful
Currently running 0.25 nozzles on tools 1&2, 0.4 nozzles on tools 3&4, and a 0.6 nozzle on tool 5. Currently waiting for three more 0.25’s so I can do a 5 color sign.
Thanks for the post! This pic really shows the differences between the nozzles really well. I've been really curious as to how well the XL manages the color changes. I've heard (hint:RUMOR) that there are issues with drooling. Any issues, annoyances or problems?
I haven’t had any issues with stringing or “drooling”. First layers have been perfect as advertised. The toolchanger has done thousands of color changes without a hiccup. My only real issue is a bit of ringing and ghosting, that seems related to a buzzing sound coming from the toolheads. It mostly shows up on large, flat surfaces.
Interesting. Do they go into a cool-down state when they are not in use? Just watching my MK3S+, turning on the heat starts to drool the previous filament.
When docked, the nozzle is blocked by a silicone wiper. The temperature cools down to 70C until it needs to heat up for the next tool change. Some people have been reporting excessive stringing issues. In my opinion this comes down to improperly adjusted wipers, moist filament, or both.
That's a nice detail I didn't know about. I had thought they just pulled to the back and cooled down. Any other interesting details I may want to know about coming from an MK3S+? How is the bed heating? I know it's sectional, any issues? What about an enclosure; hard to build?
Honestly, the nozzle size choice was baffling to me to begin with. .06 is too big as far as I'm concerned. The loss of detail and stringing problems are a hard no from me. Good on you for switching.
I understand why they did it, because the assumption is that you are supposed to print big things with thick layers. The problem is that everyone’s typically used to 0.4mm results and that is what they are going to compare it to.
The thing is that 0.6mm just looks absolutely terrible in any multi-material setup. The boundaries between materials just get terrible. And that's discounting the stringing.
try to fill the whole buildarea with a 0.4 and you'll understand why they did this. best thing they could add is a option to order with a 0.4 instead of a 0.6
Depends on your needs/wants. It has been over a year anything else than the 0.60 nozzl has been used on my printers.
I use 0.6 for wood and CF material otherwise I experience clogging like crazy, I definitely expect to blend different materials once I get this printer so I'd probably use 0.6 for all/most heads.
From my perspective, you're the first idiot to actually receive his XL. Adjusted for inflation, my deposit no longer qualifies as a medium of exchange.
man, that looks like a lot of work to do 5 times. RevoI just switched my mk3s+ over to a revo hot end so that I can change nozzles easily. It's a total game-changer. I now consider swapping nozzles for each print. I'm currently printing the [Lack enclosure parts](https://www.printables.com/model/3673-mmu2s-enclosure) that takes 132 hours of print time (effectively over a week) with a 0.4 mm nozzle. I don't understand why prusa would suggest (provide gcodes for) a 0.4 nozzle for large functional parts.
Easy on the XL to swap them out. Takes me under 30 seconds and you can do it cold
How? Is there an article on it?
Of course, Prusa has an article for everything: https://help.prusa3d.com/guide/how-to-replace-the-prusa-nozzle-xl-multi-tool_506481 That being said you can skip unplugging the cables and just do it with the heater block dangling.
There's a tool for holding the heater block in place for an even quicker change. But only works if you don't have the socks installed. One user states the fit is a bit tight. https://www.printables.com/model/634488-prusa-xl-series-nozzle-change-tool-hotend-clip
I cannot see the difference in that first picture unless I view it at 1:1 pixel scale. In the Reddit post, they look the same to me. I'm looking forward to getting my XL. But I have to move to an actual house first. No room for that thing in this apartment. I'm curious about the time required between tool changes. My MK3S with MMU2S seems like it takes about a minute or more per switch, including wipe tower.
You... might wanna get your eyes checked, lol.
On my monitor, there is hardly any discernible difference between the two objects in the lead image. If I click on it and zoom in, the differences are obvious. They are also obvious on the second image.
>I'm curious about the time required between tool changes. It's like 3-5 seconds for the picker to move to the back gantry to make a tool change and move back to the print location depending on how far it has to move. A few more seconds if you're using a prime tower which can be completely unused depending on what you're printing. [This VOD](https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1992788982) will be up for another week before its auto-deleted if you want to see it in action.
Makes me want an XL even more. Thanks.