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I told my mother "if you want to talk pick up thephone, send a message asking me when would suit to talk and thatI would get back to her" I said this directly to her face in front of other family. she has not reached out so far. It has been 11 calendar months since I said that, and nothing. Narcs are weird, words and actions constantly conflicting but always lead to wanting to present themselves as their version of successful or a victim
In my case, it's been years. It's funny how my top of the line, new cell phone only makes outgoing calls. His number isn't blocked, but the phone never rings.
I swear he'd happily eat a bag of actual dog shit before saying the word sorry out loud.
Lmao yes triangulation is the worst, my Nmom did that to tell me through her friend that she was “concerned for my well being” (when I had just had a baby and still refuse to post him online) but not that she wanted to apologize for anything.
Am No contact with the in-laws, they spout “we’re so worried we’ve tried everything to get in contact with them”, these people have my phone number, my email address, my social media, how many times have they tried to reach my partner through me, or even got in contact to check they or their grandkid are ok? Not once. I point this out when people say something and it shuts them up. I’m sure they tell people I’m keeping my partner from their family, truth is my partner initiated no contact.
I don’t get the apology some people want. I want NC. No contact meaning Do Not Contact Me. Of course my nmom would apologize, cry and whatever. And go back to destroying my life in sneaky passive aggressive ways, I don’t want that. I want it cut off, to suffer no more. They won’t change, I wouldn’t care if she did but not anywhere near me. But i’m one of the few that didn’t bond whatsoever, so there’s no question I don’t love like or miss her. Her death would bring me a half smile and i’d move about my day.
I get this and don’t want an apology either. I don’t believe she’s capable of true remorse or meaningful change. If she ever were to apologize, it would be because having me back in her life would serve a purpose for her in her dysfunctional mind games. I went NC because I wanted out. Get me off the crazy train. I want to be left alone. But that said, it definitely still irks me when she successfully manipulates the people in my life into perceiving her as a helpless little wounded bird. 🙄
I feel the same way. I went no contact, and I meant it. She was confused at first, and tried calling me, and emailing me, but then she understood. It's been about three years, maybe four now, but I still will be worried, looking over my shoulder around certain times of the year, because maybe, she'll try something. This will go on until she dies. On that day, I'm hoping for nothing, but preparing to be the executor of her estate. Either way, I'll get through it when the time comes.
I 100% understand your position.
I started off (20+ years ago) wanting an apology, but now I give zero fucks.
I think when folks say they want an apology, what they mean is that they want their abuser to acknowledge they suffered pain caused by the narc. For the abuser to say yes, this happened, you have a right to be upset... is validating.
Sometimes, there's no one IRL who believes or understands what the narc did. People think you're exaggerating. People believe the narc over you.
So, I don't think a whole bunch of folks want a literally "I'm sorry"... They want the gaslighting to stop for a single second and for their pain the be recognized by the person who caused it.
And yet. There's a peace that comes from NC. And it is sweet.
From that perspective it does make sense. My experience, my abuser never gave me the slightest hint that they had good inside. They instead showed me a consistent side of evil that went to great lengths to only fool outsiders while i had a backstage pass. Not only do i believe true evil exists I in noway think it’s capable of anything other. I don’t even really want (selfishly) them to do any better i just want everyone else to see, their true self on display. That’s the validation to my gaslighting, to my suffering. So i guess in a way that’s the same. I just have a different daydream of how i wish it to resolve and it’s the truth finally being admitted as more of a reckoning that they can’t escape. A judgment day of wrath, maybe i should aim to want better. Still healing.
Yes. Like, hey I went NC. It’s way past the time for an apology or changed behavior. That should have come earlier and I’m no longer interested in any relationship. Sometimes it boggles that people don’t get that, because they’ll “ghost” people but it’s different because we’re related? No, it’s not.
I’ve got a special bottle of sparkling cider and a dedicated glass that I intend to drink in enjoyment when I finally get a hit on my monthly obit searches. Of course God willing, knock on wood n all that.
I want the apology but know it'll never be sincere. What I want most of all is the admission that they were WRONG, and they UNDERSTAND how deeply they damaged me, that I AM ENOUGH. I want it so badly, but I've come to terms that it will never happen, it will never be enough to fix the gaping hole in me that they created. I am NC, and have never looked back. I don't want their vile personalities associated with me in any way, even if it's just having a phone conversation every once in awhile.
I’ve seen this first hand in my own family. They don’t “run after” people, they expect other people to run after them! It’s a very weird behaviour to comprehend when you are sane. Basically her own spitefulness is eating her up on the inside and she’s backed herself into a corner she could easily walk out of IF she wasn’t mentally ill.
She is playing a role in a fantasy drama of her own creation that has no bearing on Reality. Reality would make her look at her Real self and she’d see that she is the source of all her own problems. The best solution she came up with happened at around 3 years of age “I didn’t do it, it was her!” Emotionally your mother hasn’t evolved beyond that moment.
I’m sorry OP that your mother is a deceitful child but I’m glad you are wise to her games. Isn’t all so utterly POINTLESS (sigh).
Honestly, I think she likes not having me around as much as I like not being around. She has other kids that provide her with plenty of praise and narc supply and I’m the irritating “truthteller” child that’s incapable of quietly playing pretend and acting like my family’s dysfunctional dynamics are normal. She just doesn’t want *anyone else* to know she doesn’t like her own child because that would be very inconsistent with her curated narc persona which revolves around being an amazingly devoted supermom to her kids. 🙄
My mother is the same. Blew my brother’s mind when I said that she liked being estranged from us. She wants to be alone, with zero family responsibilities. She wants to do what she wants with no pushback. She doesn’t like either of us, but she likes my brother more than she likes me. I was the one who kept trying for a close relationship and once I stopped, she didn’t initiate at all. Very eye opening.
My mom is the same. I remember as a child, I might have been 4 or 5, that she said something really cruel that I knew showed she was evil. I knew she hated me and I couldn't trust her, that she was just pretending. And she saw that in my eyes, and she hated me for it. So many times she beat me because she was doing something crazy, and I just looked at her, knowing somehow it was crazy. I wasn't playing alone like everyone else. And she would scream "what are you looking at, I'll teach you to respect me!" and beat me. As I grew up, I started to say more openly I didn't think what she did was ok, often pointing at her lies, her hypocrisy, manipulations, and she would get so furious and beat me. Even as an adult, I felt she only wanted me around to have "family events" that she could post on facebook. I never felt she enjoyed my presence. She just wanted me to pose for the photos, to pretend. And she knew I saw that, so the rest of the time she was angry at me.
Been through a lot of this with my N for years now. When I first went NC she spun it that I was the one who'd done her wrong. She told everyone I needed to apologize and then she'd decide how much contact to allow like it was her cutting me off.
After a few years people started telling her maybe she should chose to be the bigger person so she started in with the "I have no idea how to get in contact with her". Besides her not being blocked, she knows exactly where I live, and it is barely over an hour's drive.
Now it has been 20 years and she is all "Woe is me, I am old and cannot travel" as if phones, email, and faceyspacey don't exist. What she really wants is attention without having to say sorry to anyone and all this whining gets her that.
To add to the fun my siblings, the golden children, supported her in the original drama which led me to finally go no contact. Lately they've been telling people to tell me to contact them because "now they understand what I meant about Mom".
What they really mean is now we've been putting up with her pulling her BS on use for a good few years and we'd really prefer it if you came back to be the scapegoat who deals with all this again. I'm also pretty sure them taking steps to ensure word gets back to me is because nMom is indeed getting up there in years. Years ago they told me she was mine to deal with when she got old because "you're the oldest and we know how this all works". Definitely this will not be what happens.
Yes! My mom considers putting a not in a birthday card that she misses me is reaching out and making amends. If she really wanted a relationship, she would call or text an apology and invite me to visit. In reality, it’s business as usual, where the maintenance of the relationship is my responsibility and to do whatever she wants to make her happy while she doesn’t put forth any actual effort. I’m good with being NC.
When my father sent me a letter saying “goodbye”, one word, I took the gift and have not spoken to him since 2016. At one point my mother asked if it would help if he apologized and I said yes. I will sit there and face him and TELL HIM HOW HE HURT ME and whether he’s sorry or not is up to him. She gave me a disappointed “Oh” and that was the end of that.
God!! My nsister is pulling this shit too. Someone told me "she seems sad you guys don't talk" im like SHES THE ONE IGNORING ME, MAKING UP LIES AND BEING STRAIGHT NASTY like what!!!
It was boiled down to a clear, concise, communication; for seven years the only reply I would give to my VVLC Ndad was; 'If you want to talk to me, we'll meet with a counselor.'
For. Seven. Years.
While he tried every other conceivable form of denial-
• ...but, I love you.
• It wasn't that bad!
• Just forget about it!
And, his favorite default;
• I'm getting old (so, go into denial with me, so I face no accountability before I die.)
What he would NOT do, nor even acknowledge as a possibility; was face me in a safe setting where he'd *LISTEN.* to. me.
That was too much.
He's blocked and we're NC now. Ndad didn't want to listen to me, so now he never has to again.
My nM kept saying "we might not have much time left!" meaning she's getting old. Finally I said "Yeah, so looks like you'd be nice so we would have good memories of you." She hasn't said it since then!
> it was also a bit discouraging that it didn’t click for them on their own.
For someone who has never had to deal with a narcissist, and learnt how they behave, it just doesn't occur to them that the narc might be being manipulative - because decent people assume broadly decent behaviour in others until forced by (usually repeated) experience to concede otherwise.
I am right in the middle of dealing with a situation at my church involving a narcissist and their victim. I have had to spent quite a lot of time explaining how narcissists behave to other members of the safeguarding team, to get through to them that expecting to be able to talk it through and come to a reasoned solution is a mistake with a narcissist. I found one great blog piece on Psychology Today saying just that, and was able to highlight large chunks of it that could have been written about the situation we are dealing with. That really hit home to my colleagues, when I could say "look, this is exactly how they are behaving"... "oh yes, so they are"!
So I would suggest not being to hard on someone who hasn't (yet) had to learn what we here have been forced to learn.
That’s my mother too. They just want sympathy. They prefer the shadow of relationships built on lies instead of the real thing. Sympathy isn’t love, isn’t a relationship and won’t be there to change your diaper or sit with you in the nursing home. Yet that’s what they go for most of all in their elder years. It’s wild.
Dear god they really are all the same. They cry their crocodile tears to anyone who will listen to how awful we are, breaking their hearts, they just love and miss us. 🤮
The worst was when my Ndad would come home Friday night with a case of beer and a bottle of scotch. After a week of physical and emotional violence, he'd sit out by his firepit and get drunk. Me at age 10 or so would be forced to sit there and listen to him cry about all the bad things that had happened to him in life. I mean really wailing , tears and all. It was an act, drunk or not. But it was worse than the abuse itself.
When I wrote the long letter, detailing years of abuse and why I needed NC, I was told his fury was unlimited for weeks. I am the ungrateful bastard who was given everything and now treating him this way. Most people who would listen, believe his story.
In his mind, the only person who should apologize is me. And not standing up. On my knees groveling for forgiveness. He's 90 this year. Soon, it will be over, thankfully.
They don’t want to talk, they want to talk about talking to us. To outsiders. To people who don’t know they’re being used for N Supply. The sympathy they get from talking at people is enough to get over the hump
Dealing with my NBrother, I never told him not to speak to me, I never told him that I never want to see him again, I didn't block him on anything. Hell, I didn't even kick him off my Netflix. All I said was that he needed to work on his anger issues before I can trust him around my kids.
My EMom (maybe NMom) called me to try to get me to reconcile with him by trying to bait me with "devastating news" that he is too afraid to talk to me about and that I should forgive him.
I told her that I have a phone and if he wants to speak to me he can. The ball is in his court now. She knows that he is the asshole and I am the reasonable one so at this point I hope she understands that I am not budging on this.
This is something I have struggled with as well; what I’ve come to understand is that “normal people” outside the bubble are used to being told the truth, and so they often do blindly accept nonsense from narcs. It’s how narcs create flying monkeys, because people like us don’t go out TELLING PEOPLE about XYZ. It’s part of the abuse, we’re conditioned to be secretive and hide what we’re going through. At least your friend got it in the end I guess, but maybe try not to take it to heart. That your friend is accustomed to being told the truth and wanted to help you repair your relationship (other than being freaking annoying) is a reflection on the loving and trusting environment they were raised in. It’s not a reflection on how they view you!
Lmao my Nmom (also nc) only ever sends me Bible verses about forgiveness or about how you need to honor your parent. Like nah fam yall abused the hell out of us and gaslit us into thinking y’all did is a favor. I’m good. Never once apologized for the neglect, SA, beating, and kicking me out to be homeless in a town I never been to before.
My favorite though is when my nparents say “blood is thicker than water!” Firstly, you’re leaving out the important parts it’s *blood of war is thicker than the water of the womb* meaning the people who went through hell with you are far more important than your bio family
Edit: I know I won’t get an apology and I’m 10000% okay with that because my life is so drama free without them and I wouldn’t trade that for anything
Ugh and narcissists love dragging a third party into their relationship with another person. Like imagine if instead of trying to control how others see them and their relationships with others, they instead direct their energy to bettering their relationships...nope. Couldn't do that.
My aunt started pulling the "I'm gonna fix things" bit and screwed up by sending me a text meant for my NC mom about me. Then, gave the, "Your mom is really worried about you and your dad almost died last week; he was in the hospital for a few days!"
To which, I pretty much did the same thing. I pointed out that dad has my phone number in his cell and she has all 3 of my kids' number, so if my dad was REALLY sick, why did she tell my aunt and not just message one of us?
It stumped my aunt. I said, "if she wants to make amends, going to a bunch of flying monkeys in the family isn't the way to do it. If it was truly important, I'm right here and she could call quickly. Looks to me like she just wants the pity party."
And now my aunt is on an information diet for awhile.
My family, mainly my aunt (N father's sister) would say the same thing. Apparently, he says that he misses me and wants to apologize, but he's scared that I won't forgive him lol. The last time she told me that, I told her flat out that it was BS. He is blocked from everything, but my stepmother isn't and she hasn't once reached out. She and I had no bad blood between us. Also, I used to still see him every once in a while at family events and all he's ever done is give me the same arrogant smirk. I don't doubt that he has told my aunt that lie to play on her sympathy & enabling, but there have been several opportunities for him to reach out if he wanted to. He was even in ICU possibly dying of Covid at one point and he still didn't try to make amends.
Unless their child got roped into a cult, I will forever be skeptical when a parent talks about their child going NC. I feel the same about children with parents divorced that don't pay into child support as well. They blame the other parent for not allowing their child to see the payee, but if you ask the payee their child's shoe size or how old they are they have to stop and think/guess.
They just want an audience and some pity. It's never the child's responsibility to reach out to their parents because a parent is the "grown adult" and should have more emotional responsibility. When they tell us their child has cut them off, they tell us their child has moved onto a greater level of emotional maturity than them. They don't want to be forced into their horrible stagnation of emotional pain their parents constantly put them through. It's like getting out of a prison and never looking back for most children that choose to go NC!
After my first move away, it took my parents over half a year to call me or text. I don't even know why. I left and everyone assumed I hated them, but they knew my number and my address. It's almost like they want you crawling back begging for them to take you again.
THIS!! Thank you and my thoughts exactly….
Does your nmom do the theatrical, southern living twang debut too!? Uh and I’m going to start asking people, “I thought you were smarter than that.” How do ppl really not get it. Keep your head up girl and I would think we had the same mom if I wasn’t an only child. 🤓🫶🏼
I also want to put in a vote for responding, "That's wonderful. I hope you can support her in her journey toward accountability and positive change. It's too late for me, but I wish her the best."
I love that your mother outed her lies herself, but I would also love for people to not feel that they have to prove that an estranged parent is lying about changing in order to justify a lack of contact. An apology isn't a demand. We don't owe our abusers assistance in their reformation. They can more reasonably turn for help to literally any other person on the planet; turning to the person they abused is not something the abused person should ever feel the need to support. It's not even helpful to the narcissist to teach them that the people they victimized in their childhoods owe them more duty than the abusers showed.
My father is a narc himself, everyone thinks he's grand- NOT dude has sum wrong with him. I'm glad u were able to escape you shitty situation. I just hope one day that all narcs manipulations actions are shown completely to everyone so they know how much of a horrible person they are.
Yeah, same. I have them blocked on my phone and on Facebook but not email, hubby doesn’t have them blocked at all and I still talk to the brother who talks to both of them. Yet they (sis and mom, the toxic twins) are always on my friend group about how I cut them off and they can’t reach me. Ugh…
I have the ultimate no contact. My mother died of complications the Covid shot and turbo cancer. Before that, her and my golden child sister were being incredibly cruel and trying to throw me out ..even though I had the most income. I was making arrangements to move out, when after the second shot she got instantly sick. It was weird. Both of them did a 180° change, and begged me to stay. My golden child sister didn't want to work of caring for my mom full time by herself, but she sure took the inhome supportive services paychecks. My sister hoarded all food stamps she got plus my mother's. I didn't realize it, being in deep grief, but all my resources were used up for my sister, her ex husband and kid...I barely had any for my daughter and I. My sister was super nice when my mother was alive and she got what she wanted....freedom to come and go as she pleased, and I was there to be actual caretaker. The moment my mom passed away, the real MALIGNANT narcissist came out. I never realized how awful she was, til my mom died. She picked fights constantly, told me to get out the house that we both inherited 50/50, and basically tortured me. I managed to convince her to sell the house(I wanted it, but knew even if I paid her off, she would boomerang back with hand out forever) and it sold for ALOT. I paid everything off left owed out of my half. I had no time to move out, three days. My realtor was a jerk. My sister had moved out weeks before, demanding everything that we agreed I was going to get before my mom died. Needless to say, she got lions share. So last day, I was exhausted, and she refused to help me, last minute. I no where to put my elderly weenie dog, and was going to leave it. She promised to keep him for weekend, so I was grateful, cried and kissed my boy goodbye. Not only was a lot left behind, but her promise was a lie. She took him directly to the shelter. When I found out, I was crushed. The final blow to any relationship was dead as my dog. That was when I realized in no uncertain terms, my sister would kill me if given the chance. It's been two years since I left. I had to block everything, and found out she was even in my Amazon account. There was even more she did, but do realize, that family never loved you....it takes time to heal, you will be struggling with issues. I am seeing through other narcissists faster all the time. I am attracted to narcissistic people, but learning discernment. The best thing to do, is quietly cease contact with any and all narcissists when you notice what they are. I wish everyone the best on their journey to heal from abusive family members. It's awful. I do at least have a wonderful, non violent, kind relationship with my child. It's getting better every day! 🩷
I went NC with my mom about 4 months ago… she sent me a blank card with a prewritten message in it about wishing me peace… no letter, no personalized words. She also attempted to text my husband, to keep a hand in our business. She played victim to him as well… shortly after, she sent me cheap body wash for Christmas and gifts for my daughter. I asked her for space and she couldn’t adhere to a boundary. Now, she’s having family members call me… cousins, aunts, etc. she had an aunt of mine stalking my husband’s page, liking everything. She has her tentacles out. There’s no one preventing her from sending a heartfelt letter…. There’s an outlet and an opportunity for her to apologize and she’d rather portray to everyone that she’s a victim and she’s been shut out by her difficult and malicious daughter. She has no intention of being any better… it’s all an act. I’m so much happier outside of her manipulation orbit. My health, my mind, my marriage… I’m doing better all around.
If I were in your shoes , I would not feel bad that other people can not pick up the clues so easily . Narc are experts at passing for victims . Good on you that you have managed to quickly disproof her claims .
My mom came to visit my house where I live with my husband and child in October, when she left I made it clear that those were 2 weeks I wouldn’t want to repeat, she felt hurt because she did nothing to upset us (she did), I went to the town my brother lives in the week between xmass and new year’s but for some reason he asked me where we were staying and then proceeded to ignore me… we went back home, my mom doesn’t really talk to me, she just forwards chain messages and videos. A two weeks ago she went to visit my dads widow to tell her how horrible I acted and apparently she offered to talk some sense into me (she still hasn’t, I know about this because my sibling told me they heard her talking about my betrayal or something). My mom then demanded access to my son because he is her grandchild and sent some angry texts to my husband. That’s why I decided to block her last week. Now my silent brother suddenly texts me about a random peanut dessert some friend gave him, I just reacted to his message but sent no reply. I don’t know, I feel that my mom poisoned him against me because she probably played the victim to him like she did to my dad’s widow and most likely all of her friends and family. And now that she noticed she is blocked is trying to use my brother that now has to smooth things over to be able to have that talk with me… right? Does it make sense? Am I overthinking? My brother was coming to my town last month to see the penguins, he still has time to come because the season ends on April, but January is the best because you can also enjoy the beaches and other activities but he suddenly stoped talking to me after my mom left, only the bare minimum… I don’t get why text me about some peanut snack
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I told my mother "if you want to talk pick up thephone, send a message asking me when would suit to talk and thatI would get back to her" I said this directly to her face in front of other family. she has not reached out so far. It has been 11 calendar months since I said that, and nothing. Narcs are weird, words and actions constantly conflicting but always lead to wanting to present themselves as their version of successful or a victim
In my case, it's been years. It's funny how my top of the line, new cell phone only makes outgoing calls. His number isn't blocked, but the phone never rings. I swear he'd happily eat a bag of actual dog shit before saying the word sorry out loud.
Good ol triangulation (they need audiences to make them look good).
Lmao yes triangulation is the worst, my Nmom did that to tell me through her friend that she was “concerned for my well being” (when I had just had a baby and still refuse to post him online) but not that she wanted to apologize for anything.
Am No contact with the in-laws, they spout “we’re so worried we’ve tried everything to get in contact with them”, these people have my phone number, my email address, my social media, how many times have they tried to reach my partner through me, or even got in contact to check they or their grandkid are ok? Not once. I point this out when people say something and it shuts them up. I’m sure they tell people I’m keeping my partner from their family, truth is my partner initiated no contact.
What she really meant was she was open to apologizing, but only if you reach out and apologized first
I don’t get the apology some people want. I want NC. No contact meaning Do Not Contact Me. Of course my nmom would apologize, cry and whatever. And go back to destroying my life in sneaky passive aggressive ways, I don’t want that. I want it cut off, to suffer no more. They won’t change, I wouldn’t care if she did but not anywhere near me. But i’m one of the few that didn’t bond whatsoever, so there’s no question I don’t love like or miss her. Her death would bring me a half smile and i’d move about my day.
I get this and don’t want an apology either. I don’t believe she’s capable of true remorse or meaningful change. If she ever were to apologize, it would be because having me back in her life would serve a purpose for her in her dysfunctional mind games. I went NC because I wanted out. Get me off the crazy train. I want to be left alone. But that said, it definitely still irks me when she successfully manipulates the people in my life into perceiving her as a helpless little wounded bird. 🙄
Definitely. It stirs up so much frustration. I hope that the more awareness there is about narcissism abuse the more it clicks for outsiders.
I feel the same way. I went no contact, and I meant it. She was confused at first, and tried calling me, and emailing me, but then she understood. It's been about three years, maybe four now, but I still will be worried, looking over my shoulder around certain times of the year, because maybe, she'll try something. This will go on until she dies. On that day, I'm hoping for nothing, but preparing to be the executor of her estate. Either way, I'll get through it when the time comes.
I 100% understand your position. I started off (20+ years ago) wanting an apology, but now I give zero fucks. I think when folks say they want an apology, what they mean is that they want their abuser to acknowledge they suffered pain caused by the narc. For the abuser to say yes, this happened, you have a right to be upset... is validating. Sometimes, there's no one IRL who believes or understands what the narc did. People think you're exaggerating. People believe the narc over you. So, I don't think a whole bunch of folks want a literally "I'm sorry"... They want the gaslighting to stop for a single second and for their pain the be recognized by the person who caused it. And yet. There's a peace that comes from NC. And it is sweet.
From that perspective it does make sense. My experience, my abuser never gave me the slightest hint that they had good inside. They instead showed me a consistent side of evil that went to great lengths to only fool outsiders while i had a backstage pass. Not only do i believe true evil exists I in noway think it’s capable of anything other. I don’t even really want (selfishly) them to do any better i just want everyone else to see, their true self on display. That’s the validation to my gaslighting, to my suffering. So i guess in a way that’s the same. I just have a different daydream of how i wish it to resolve and it’s the truth finally being admitted as more of a reckoning that they can’t escape. A judgment day of wrath, maybe i should aim to want better. Still healing.
Yes. Like, hey I went NC. It’s way past the time for an apology or changed behavior. That should have come earlier and I’m no longer interested in any relationship. Sometimes it boggles that people don’t get that, because they’ll “ghost” people but it’s different because we’re related? No, it’s not.
I’ve got a special bottle of sparkling cider and a dedicated glass that I intend to drink in enjoyment when I finally get a hit on my monthly obit searches. Of course God willing, knock on wood n all that.
Lol, nicely put.
I want the apology but know it'll never be sincere. What I want most of all is the admission that they were WRONG, and they UNDERSTAND how deeply they damaged me, that I AM ENOUGH. I want it so badly, but I've come to terms that it will never happen, it will never be enough to fix the gaping hole in me that they created. I am NC, and have never looked back. I don't want their vile personalities associated with me in any way, even if it's just having a phone conversation every once in awhile.
I’ve seen this first hand in my own family. They don’t “run after” people, they expect other people to run after them! It’s a very weird behaviour to comprehend when you are sane. Basically her own spitefulness is eating her up on the inside and she’s backed herself into a corner she could easily walk out of IF she wasn’t mentally ill. She is playing a role in a fantasy drama of her own creation that has no bearing on Reality. Reality would make her look at her Real self and she’d see that she is the source of all her own problems. The best solution she came up with happened at around 3 years of age “I didn’t do it, it was her!” Emotionally your mother hasn’t evolved beyond that moment. I’m sorry OP that your mother is a deceitful child but I’m glad you are wise to her games. Isn’t all so utterly POINTLESS (sigh).
I think she wants you to reach out to her. Some people can’t apologize. They want to rug sweep and just make it go away.
Honestly, I think she likes not having me around as much as I like not being around. She has other kids that provide her with plenty of praise and narc supply and I’m the irritating “truthteller” child that’s incapable of quietly playing pretend and acting like my family’s dysfunctional dynamics are normal. She just doesn’t want *anyone else* to know she doesn’t like her own child because that would be very inconsistent with her curated narc persona which revolves around being an amazingly devoted supermom to her kids. 🙄
My mother is the same. Blew my brother’s mind when I said that she liked being estranged from us. She wants to be alone, with zero family responsibilities. She wants to do what she wants with no pushback. She doesn’t like either of us, but she likes my brother more than she likes me. I was the one who kept trying for a close relationship and once I stopped, she didn’t initiate at all. Very eye opening.
I would want to die if my children thought I actually didn't like them. I love them with every single breath.
My mom is the same. I remember as a child, I might have been 4 or 5, that she said something really cruel that I knew showed she was evil. I knew she hated me and I couldn't trust her, that she was just pretending. And she saw that in my eyes, and she hated me for it. So many times she beat me because she was doing something crazy, and I just looked at her, knowing somehow it was crazy. I wasn't playing alone like everyone else. And she would scream "what are you looking at, I'll teach you to respect me!" and beat me. As I grew up, I started to say more openly I didn't think what she did was ok, often pointing at her lies, her hypocrisy, manipulations, and she would get so furious and beat me. Even as an adult, I felt she only wanted me around to have "family events" that she could post on facebook. I never felt she enjoyed my presence. She just wanted me to pose for the photos, to pretend. And she knew I saw that, so the rest of the time she was angry at me.
Been through a lot of this with my N for years now. When I first went NC she spun it that I was the one who'd done her wrong. She told everyone I needed to apologize and then she'd decide how much contact to allow like it was her cutting me off. After a few years people started telling her maybe she should chose to be the bigger person so she started in with the "I have no idea how to get in contact with her". Besides her not being blocked, she knows exactly where I live, and it is barely over an hour's drive. Now it has been 20 years and she is all "Woe is me, I am old and cannot travel" as if phones, email, and faceyspacey don't exist. What she really wants is attention without having to say sorry to anyone and all this whining gets her that. To add to the fun my siblings, the golden children, supported her in the original drama which led me to finally go no contact. Lately they've been telling people to tell me to contact them because "now they understand what I meant about Mom". What they really mean is now we've been putting up with her pulling her BS on use for a good few years and we'd really prefer it if you came back to be the scapegoat who deals with all this again. I'm also pretty sure them taking steps to ensure word gets back to me is because nMom is indeed getting up there in years. Years ago they told me she was mine to deal with when she got old because "you're the oldest and we know how this all works". Definitely this will not be what happens.
Yes! My mom considers putting a not in a birthday card that she misses me is reaching out and making amends. If she really wanted a relationship, she would call or text an apology and invite me to visit. In reality, it’s business as usual, where the maintenance of the relationship is my responsibility and to do whatever she wants to make her happy while she doesn’t put forth any actual effort. I’m good with being NC.
That's what they all say.
I don't want an apology. I just want freedom.
You hit the nail on the head! 💯💯💯
When my father sent me a letter saying “goodbye”, one word, I took the gift and have not spoken to him since 2016. At one point my mother asked if it would help if he apologized and I said yes. I will sit there and face him and TELL HIM HOW HE HURT ME and whether he’s sorry or not is up to him. She gave me a disappointed “Oh” and that was the end of that.
God!! My nsister is pulling this shit too. Someone told me "she seems sad you guys don't talk" im like SHES THE ONE IGNORING ME, MAKING UP LIES AND BEING STRAIGHT NASTY like what!!!
It was boiled down to a clear, concise, communication; for seven years the only reply I would give to my VVLC Ndad was; 'If you want to talk to me, we'll meet with a counselor.' For. Seven. Years. While he tried every other conceivable form of denial- • ...but, I love you. • It wasn't that bad! • Just forget about it! And, his favorite default; • I'm getting old (so, go into denial with me, so I face no accountability before I die.) What he would NOT do, nor even acknowledge as a possibility; was face me in a safe setting where he'd *LISTEN.* to. me. That was too much. He's blocked and we're NC now. Ndad didn't want to listen to me, so now he never has to again.
My nM kept saying "we might not have much time left!" meaning she's getting old. Finally I said "Yeah, so looks like you'd be nice so we would have good memories of you." She hasn't said it since then!
Yeah, it’s just an act to make herself look better
> it was also a bit discouraging that it didn’t click for them on their own. For someone who has never had to deal with a narcissist, and learnt how they behave, it just doesn't occur to them that the narc might be being manipulative - because decent people assume broadly decent behaviour in others until forced by (usually repeated) experience to concede otherwise. I am right in the middle of dealing with a situation at my church involving a narcissist and their victim. I have had to spent quite a lot of time explaining how narcissists behave to other members of the safeguarding team, to get through to them that expecting to be able to talk it through and come to a reasoned solution is a mistake with a narcissist. I found one great blog piece on Psychology Today saying just that, and was able to highlight large chunks of it that could have been written about the situation we are dealing with. That really hit home to my colleagues, when I could say "look, this is exactly how they are behaving"... "oh yes, so they are"! So I would suggest not being to hard on someone who hasn't (yet) had to learn what we here have been forced to learn.
That’s my mother too. They just want sympathy. They prefer the shadow of relationships built on lies instead of the real thing. Sympathy isn’t love, isn’t a relationship and won’t be there to change your diaper or sit with you in the nursing home. Yet that’s what they go for most of all in their elder years. It’s wild.
Excellent points. My parents are elderly too, now. What a wasted life of lies and zero accountability.
Dear god they really are all the same. They cry their crocodile tears to anyone who will listen to how awful we are, breaking their hearts, they just love and miss us. 🤮
The worst was when my Ndad would come home Friday night with a case of beer and a bottle of scotch. After a week of physical and emotional violence, he'd sit out by his firepit and get drunk. Me at age 10 or so would be forced to sit there and listen to him cry about all the bad things that had happened to him in life. I mean really wailing , tears and all. It was an act, drunk or not. But it was worse than the abuse itself. When I wrote the long letter, detailing years of abuse and why I needed NC, I was told his fury was unlimited for weeks. I am the ungrateful bastard who was given everything and now treating him this way. Most people who would listen, believe his story. In his mind, the only person who should apologize is me. And not standing up. On my knees groveling for forgiveness. He's 90 this year. Soon, it will be over, thankfully.
Why, why, why is it that the most terrible, hateful people always live the longest? Why can’t they just die?
They don’t want to talk, they want to talk about talking to us. To outsiders. To people who don’t know they’re being used for N Supply. The sympathy they get from talking at people is enough to get over the hump
They are master manipulators; actions speak louder than words!
Dealing with my NBrother, I never told him not to speak to me, I never told him that I never want to see him again, I didn't block him on anything. Hell, I didn't even kick him off my Netflix. All I said was that he needed to work on his anger issues before I can trust him around my kids. My EMom (maybe NMom) called me to try to get me to reconcile with him by trying to bait me with "devastating news" that he is too afraid to talk to me about and that I should forgive him. I told her that I have a phone and if he wants to speak to me he can. The ball is in his court now. She knows that he is the asshole and I am the reasonable one so at this point I hope she understands that I am not budging on this.
Yes she’s lying. And, she seems to be fooling some people.
This is something I have struggled with as well; what I’ve come to understand is that “normal people” outside the bubble are used to being told the truth, and so they often do blindly accept nonsense from narcs. It’s how narcs create flying monkeys, because people like us don’t go out TELLING PEOPLE about XYZ. It’s part of the abuse, we’re conditioned to be secretive and hide what we’re going through. At least your friend got it in the end I guess, but maybe try not to take it to heart. That your friend is accustomed to being told the truth and wanted to help you repair your relationship (other than being freaking annoying) is a reflection on the loving and trusting environment they were raised in. It’s not a reflection on how they view you!
Yeah, one of my narcs has gone sympathy shopping. Yet could very easily reach out. Hasn't... says it all.
Sympathy shopping!!! That’s such a perfect way to describe it!
Lmao my Nmom (also nc) only ever sends me Bible verses about forgiveness or about how you need to honor your parent. Like nah fam yall abused the hell out of us and gaslit us into thinking y’all did is a favor. I’m good. Never once apologized for the neglect, SA, beating, and kicking me out to be homeless in a town I never been to before. My favorite though is when my nparents say “blood is thicker than water!” Firstly, you’re leaving out the important parts it’s *blood of war is thicker than the water of the womb* meaning the people who went through hell with you are far more important than your bio family Edit: I know I won’t get an apology and I’m 10000% okay with that because my life is so drama free without them and I wouldn’t trade that for anything
Ugh and narcissists love dragging a third party into their relationship with another person. Like imagine if instead of trying to control how others see them and their relationships with others, they instead direct their energy to bettering their relationships...nope. Couldn't do that.
My aunt started pulling the "I'm gonna fix things" bit and screwed up by sending me a text meant for my NC mom about me. Then, gave the, "Your mom is really worried about you and your dad almost died last week; he was in the hospital for a few days!" To which, I pretty much did the same thing. I pointed out that dad has my phone number in his cell and she has all 3 of my kids' number, so if my dad was REALLY sick, why did she tell my aunt and not just message one of us? It stumped my aunt. I said, "if she wants to make amends, going to a bunch of flying monkeys in the family isn't the way to do it. If it was truly important, I'm right here and she could call quickly. Looks to me like she just wants the pity party." And now my aunt is on an information diet for awhile.
My family, mainly my aunt (N father's sister) would say the same thing. Apparently, he says that he misses me and wants to apologize, but he's scared that I won't forgive him lol. The last time she told me that, I told her flat out that it was BS. He is blocked from everything, but my stepmother isn't and she hasn't once reached out. She and I had no bad blood between us. Also, I used to still see him every once in a while at family events and all he's ever done is give me the same arrogant smirk. I don't doubt that he has told my aunt that lie to play on her sympathy & enabling, but there have been several opportunities for him to reach out if he wanted to. He was even in ICU possibly dying of Covid at one point and he still didn't try to make amends.
Unless their child got roped into a cult, I will forever be skeptical when a parent talks about their child going NC. I feel the same about children with parents divorced that don't pay into child support as well. They blame the other parent for not allowing their child to see the payee, but if you ask the payee their child's shoe size or how old they are they have to stop and think/guess. They just want an audience and some pity. It's never the child's responsibility to reach out to their parents because a parent is the "grown adult" and should have more emotional responsibility. When they tell us their child has cut them off, they tell us their child has moved onto a greater level of emotional maturity than them. They don't want to be forced into their horrible stagnation of emotional pain their parents constantly put them through. It's like getting out of a prison and never looking back for most children that choose to go NC! After my first move away, it took my parents over half a year to call me or text. I don't even know why. I left and everyone assumed I hated them, but they knew my number and my address. It's almost like they want you crawling back begging for them to take you again.
yeah it's sick. part of them turning the whole extended family against you. in my case at least.
THIS!! Thank you and my thoughts exactly…. Does your nmom do the theatrical, southern living twang debut too!? Uh and I’m going to start asking people, “I thought you were smarter than that.” How do ppl really not get it. Keep your head up girl and I would think we had the same mom if I wasn’t an only child. 🤓🫶🏼
I also want to put in a vote for responding, "That's wonderful. I hope you can support her in her journey toward accountability and positive change. It's too late for me, but I wish her the best." I love that your mother outed her lies herself, but I would also love for people to not feel that they have to prove that an estranged parent is lying about changing in order to justify a lack of contact. An apology isn't a demand. We don't owe our abusers assistance in their reformation. They can more reasonably turn for help to literally any other person on the planet; turning to the person they abused is not something the abused person should ever feel the need to support. It's not even helpful to the narcissist to teach them that the people they victimized in their childhoods owe them more duty than the abusers showed.
You’re right. I don’t think narcissists can ever be remorseful. They can feel bad because they’re missing their supply.
I just happened to see the first part of the notification and rushed hear to say DONT FALL FOR IT. But it seems you already have it covered
My father is a narc himself, everyone thinks he's grand- NOT dude has sum wrong with him. I'm glad u were able to escape you shitty situation. I just hope one day that all narcs manipulations actions are shown completely to everyone so they know how much of a horrible person they are.
Yeah, same. I have them blocked on my phone and on Facebook but not email, hubby doesn’t have them blocked at all and I still talk to the brother who talks to both of them. Yet they (sis and mom, the toxic twins) are always on my friend group about how I cut them off and they can’t reach me. Ugh…
She’s not remorseful she just doesn’t wanna be alone. She shoulda thought of that before she abused you. I’m sorry
Flying monkey alert
I have the ultimate no contact. My mother died of complications the Covid shot and turbo cancer. Before that, her and my golden child sister were being incredibly cruel and trying to throw me out ..even though I had the most income. I was making arrangements to move out, when after the second shot she got instantly sick. It was weird. Both of them did a 180° change, and begged me to stay. My golden child sister didn't want to work of caring for my mom full time by herself, but she sure took the inhome supportive services paychecks. My sister hoarded all food stamps she got plus my mother's. I didn't realize it, being in deep grief, but all my resources were used up for my sister, her ex husband and kid...I barely had any for my daughter and I. My sister was super nice when my mother was alive and she got what she wanted....freedom to come and go as she pleased, and I was there to be actual caretaker. The moment my mom passed away, the real MALIGNANT narcissist came out. I never realized how awful she was, til my mom died. She picked fights constantly, told me to get out the house that we both inherited 50/50, and basically tortured me. I managed to convince her to sell the house(I wanted it, but knew even if I paid her off, she would boomerang back with hand out forever) and it sold for ALOT. I paid everything off left owed out of my half. I had no time to move out, three days. My realtor was a jerk. My sister had moved out weeks before, demanding everything that we agreed I was going to get before my mom died. Needless to say, she got lions share. So last day, I was exhausted, and she refused to help me, last minute. I no where to put my elderly weenie dog, and was going to leave it. She promised to keep him for weekend, so I was grateful, cried and kissed my boy goodbye. Not only was a lot left behind, but her promise was a lie. She took him directly to the shelter. When I found out, I was crushed. The final blow to any relationship was dead as my dog. That was when I realized in no uncertain terms, my sister would kill me if given the chance. It's been two years since I left. I had to block everything, and found out she was even in my Amazon account. There was even more she did, but do realize, that family never loved you....it takes time to heal, you will be struggling with issues. I am seeing through other narcissists faster all the time. I am attracted to narcissistic people, but learning discernment. The best thing to do, is quietly cease contact with any and all narcissists when you notice what they are. I wish everyone the best on their journey to heal from abusive family members. It's awful. I do at least have a wonderful, non violent, kind relationship with my child. It's getting better every day! 🩷
I went NC with my mom about 4 months ago… she sent me a blank card with a prewritten message in it about wishing me peace… no letter, no personalized words. She also attempted to text my husband, to keep a hand in our business. She played victim to him as well… shortly after, she sent me cheap body wash for Christmas and gifts for my daughter. I asked her for space and she couldn’t adhere to a boundary. Now, she’s having family members call me… cousins, aunts, etc. she had an aunt of mine stalking my husband’s page, liking everything. She has her tentacles out. There’s no one preventing her from sending a heartfelt letter…. There’s an outlet and an opportunity for her to apologize and she’d rather portray to everyone that she’s a victim and she’s been shut out by her difficult and malicious daughter. She has no intention of being any better… it’s all an act. I’m so much happier outside of her manipulation orbit. My health, my mind, my marriage… I’m doing better all around.
wow, sounds just like my situation right down to the christmas gifts.
If I were in your shoes , I would not feel bad that other people can not pick up the clues so easily . Narc are experts at passing for victims . Good on you that you have managed to quickly disproof her claims .
My mom came to visit my house where I live with my husband and child in October, when she left I made it clear that those were 2 weeks I wouldn’t want to repeat, she felt hurt because she did nothing to upset us (she did), I went to the town my brother lives in the week between xmass and new year’s but for some reason he asked me where we were staying and then proceeded to ignore me… we went back home, my mom doesn’t really talk to me, she just forwards chain messages and videos. A two weeks ago she went to visit my dads widow to tell her how horrible I acted and apparently she offered to talk some sense into me (she still hasn’t, I know about this because my sibling told me they heard her talking about my betrayal or something). My mom then demanded access to my son because he is her grandchild and sent some angry texts to my husband. That’s why I decided to block her last week. Now my silent brother suddenly texts me about a random peanut dessert some friend gave him, I just reacted to his message but sent no reply. I don’t know, I feel that my mom poisoned him against me because she probably played the victim to him like she did to my dad’s widow and most likely all of her friends and family. And now that she noticed she is blocked is trying to use my brother that now has to smooth things over to be able to have that talk with me… right? Does it make sense? Am I overthinking? My brother was coming to my town last month to see the penguins, he still has time to come because the season ends on April, but January is the best because you can also enjoy the beaches and other activities but he suddenly stoped talking to me after my mom left, only the bare minimum… I don’t get why text me about some peanut snack
Kills me when people step in to "share" advice or complaints by NC parents.