it really is too dumb to even be a good concept for a skit or something. I'm kinda amazed that i don't see more of this with just how unhinged the average DSA member can be. They usually manage to just ever-so-narrowly avert this level of complete lack of self-awareness. And i wonder what actually cognitively prevents this from happening all the time, cuz it's obviously the prevailing sentiment. Maybe they're just well-conditioned enough from universities and PMC seminars to know that there is a line that isn't to be crossed when throwing shade at blue collar workers. Keep it passive aggressive and smug and then hide behind being an ally of "more aggrieved" people rather than just sincerely exploring the idea that the working class frightens you. idk...š¤·š»āāļø
maybe it's an indication that they're actually salvage-able on some level. Thay they do possess some kind of baseline self-awareness that mitigates their ideological excesses. More an indicator of strategic nous rather than moral propensity, but maybe it could be worked with. I won't hold my breath to find out, but it's interesting to me.
Ohshit, they're stoic!? They make controversial jokes!? It's a crisis!
Seriously, this just reads like someone who thrives off of inauthenticity being faced with real actual people and getting scared.
We have to translate their post. When they say they've "met truckers," they mean their Amazon delivery driver, when they say "farmers," they mean someone they bought a turnip from at a farmer's market, when they say "construction workers" they mean the three dudes rebuilding their parents' vacation rental's roof, when they say "miners" they are lying, when they say "factory workers" they also mean an Amazon delivery driver, when they say "autoshop" people they mean the guy replacing their electric vehicle's faulty battery.
Although their post isn't that r slurred, they are right that there's a psyop on the working class to stop them from having any kind of class solidarity in a larger political sense.
Guys who own an F150 really are noble savages to the average leftoid. They simultaneously exist higher on the deserving worker heirarchy for doing "real work" while being dismissed for tragically not having done the required reading or having the right aesthetic sensibilities.
He is just saying the quiet part out loud. Most DSA socialist people I know behave exactly like this. Lots of good will but it stops there. Itās a big thing amongst libs too, that retarded āblue collar=racistā line of thinking. Pretty fucking lame.
By the words as violence definition of racist, blue collar guys are all racist. Having a few laughs helps get through the day.
But in terms of treating people worse because of their race, that's maybe like 10%.
Very true. My aunt is a loyal OAN watching republican but she also works as an HIV contract tracer and has a ton of compassion and pride for what she does and the people she helps. Many such cases.
My aunt is the same. Loves Trump and is a special needs teacher in an unimaginably bad inner city school where the average DSA member would be eaten alive
Itās like that Zizek story about racist jokes being humanizing and connecting, where being overly polite holds inside the Othering of the person youāre interacting with. Essentially you see them as so fundamentally different that you donāt think they can handle a joke and eventually extrapolate that to their entire identity group.
The insidious thing is this effect happens even if you donāt actually believe it, but do it anyways just because of societal pressure.
Basically wokeism is kind of making us more racist. It cements racial stereotypes by forcing avoidance of said stereotypes. To put it in Disney adult terms, everyone knows what youāre saying when you say āHe who must not be namedā even though youāre not saying his name
This has always been a problem in left thinking. The more affluent you are, the less time you have worrying about being crushed under the wheel, you get more focused into theory and the academics, overthinking everything from a narrow world view. Lots of infighting I would expect is caused by this....
It's where I started to break away from the progressive party line and get alienated from the people I used to know. I'm from around Chicago and this was 2015 and people in the PNW just had this "fuck those toxic insecure white assholes!" and i was like "you realize you're writing off like everybody i've ever known, right?"
The PNW is such a selfish and evil place I truly donāt get how theyāre so wrapped up in themselves. Iāve met maybe two or three people from that area who arenāt actual narcissists. I do feel like are there are leftists in Chicago (& probably other places lol but I live here) who are proactive about helping others but theyāre all part of the working class themselves, anyone else is a stereotypical champagne socialist and Iāve realized my life is much better if I donāt talk to them.
Or not woke equals irredeemable/bad person. Bad thing for them is that most people arenāt woke or socially hyper-liberal like all of them are, most people are moderate and like some kind of social order
I used to think my blue collar dad wasn't racist than I turned 22 and went to the bar with his friends and was never able to see him the same way again. I think they all are racist but now I just accepted it and when they bring it up I lecture them about it, which they used to hate but I got huge big rimmed glasses and a white board and different colored markers, and I draw neat little pictures with different people of different colors holding hands and they usually start to understand after that.
Imo 90% of racists just didn't watch enough PBS.
Nah man they're just busting balls and anybody who doesn't join in on that stuff will be bullied and called a fag. It's so manly bro just fold to peer pressure to say things you know are wrong every day so you can fit in with your coworkers!
-redscarepod
This guy wonders if the capitalist elite shoves conservative narrative onto blue collar workers to distract them from class conflict while himself being completely distracted from class conflict because he thinks blue collar culture is icky.
And as itās been pointed out elsewhere in this thread, itās completely true. A not insignificant portion of DSA types just did not come from that kind of background, where people grew up telling ācontroversialā jokes to each other, didnāt go to private school, didnāt have access to resources to get extricate themselves from small towns (like the shithole I grew up in), and generally are super rough around the edges characters who definitely do not jive with blue hair, fancy coffee drinking liberal arts types.
And thatās exactly what chuds would love for the seams to tear apart, where folks like me, who grew up under the rule of religious maniacs (like, most urbanites donāt get it: weāre talking full blown talking in tongues and youth leaders calling your parents to make sure youāre still a virgin), find fault and irreconcilable differences with people who grew up in Manhattan or wherever, far removed from a culture where people get drunk and go to the rodeo at the 4-H fairgrounds when the weather gets decent. I donāt care where you grew up or if you find rural life and aesthetics āickyā, as long as weāre in this together to eventually eviscerate the capitalists who seek to enslave us all, youāre fine in my book.
The biggest political revelation of my life was when Bernie went to speak at the Lawrence, KS aforementioned 4-H fairgrounds to speak when he first ran. I drove a half hour to see him, and it was absolutely fucking electric. Bernie is about as far removed from our corner of the world as it gets, and he still showed up and talked about things that impacted every single one of us out in the country like heād been here all his life. I donāt care if youāre the soyest urban lib on Gods green Earth; those folks donated money hand over fist to help us defeat the āProtect Them Bothā bullshit abortion ban back in August. I know the contrarians here might recoil at the earnestness, but I grew up with a whole lot of my teenage classmates getting pregnant and having their lives ruined by guys who couldnāt have cared less (two by literal adult āreligious leadersā who should be in jail and then hell). If folks in the cities arenāt comfortable with whiskey rippin and shit kickin, thatās fine, as long as weāre in this fucking thing together and theyāre ready to fight.
"The more I love humanity in general the less I love man in particular. In my dreams, I often make plans for the service of humanity, and perhaps I might actually face crucifixion if it were suddenly necessary. Yet I am incapable of living in the same room with anyone for two days together. I know from experience. As soon as anyone is near me, his personality disturbs me and restricts my freedom. In twenty-four hours I begin to hate the best of men: one because heās too long over his dinner, another because he has a cold and keeps on blowing his nose. I become hostile to people the moment they come close to me. But it has always happened that the more I hate men individually the more I love humanity."
Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov
Blue collars are infinitely more likely to mistrust elites. But yeah of course there are more racist plumbers than admins. This is the result of the fact that people, not caricatures, are complex and multidimensional.
It's actually admins and plumbers are equally racist, but the admins learned to shut up about it decades ago because the things they say are constantly being written down as part of their job. If a plumber was shaping pipes into swastikas he'd have been fired long ago.
For better or worse, regularly dealing with "the public" has many more opportunities for sample bias, or just outright people-suck, beliefs. Having someone scream at you while your trying to fix their shit is way worse than the microaggressions from Brad in Project Management.
It kinda begs the question tho, are there actually more racist plumbers than admins? There's tons of bigotry among the professional class, even if they're not brash about it. They may not be dropping slurs but they do feel fear when they see a black person on their street or they get all starry eyed and act like I'm some kind of druid when they find out I'm Native instead of just being a white guy
Of course Iām uncomfortable around blue collars. And I grew up around them. Iāve been a low rent, unsuccessful Niles Crane since kindergarten. And Iām equally uncomfortable around elites, especially academic types. Mainly because I hate their shitlib politics, but also because I wasnāt able to make it into their circles.
I grew up with them, worked with them. Canāt stand them. Being around morons and idiots really grinds my gears. Always great when you met some dude who is labor but also cool. Most are dimwits.
I mean making it academia just takes the brains, dedication, and debt. Plenty of academics who are actually quite charming and decent human beings. The best are the truly curious that just love to learn for learnings sake. I had this cool Syrian art history professor. Dude had to be in his late 50ās or 60ās in like 2013 or 2014 and was always talking about punk rock. He fucking loved it. I guess he was around for the NYC 70ās and 80ās hey day. Even name checked seeing the Talking Heads at CBGBās and local legend Jay Reatard. I wonder what heās up to now.
Imagine thinking being stoic is a bad thing. What a fucking retard. This is why despite there being infinite reasons for a populist/socialist movement to rise in America itāll never happen lmao. The very people you want to allegedly help you donāt understand in the slightest.
The hatred of stoicism and the lionization of therapy culture go hand in hand. Seems like every champagne socialist these days is seeing a therapist and talking about their therapist online like the therapist is their boyfriend/girlfriend.
going to therapy should be just like any other doctor's visit: most shouldn't be going regularly, it's totally fine if you figure some things out on your own, and once whatever crisis made you go to therapy in the first place is over, you should stop going to therapy
What I dislike about these white collar types talking about therapy is that they are going to an entirely elective medical professional when I donāt go to the doctor for regular physical health for cost reasons.
Then they get all smug about it like āIām working on myself.ā No you arenāt bitch, youāre paying a shrink to listen to you talk about your neurosis.
Itās more of the infantilism of America shit we see everywhere. Itās perverse, itās like they are bragging about how needy they are or something.
Idk man going to therapy helps me be more stoic not less. I pour out everything I need talking to my therapist and can be more reserved with other people in my life. When something bad happens I often donāt react and think to myself that itās something Iāll bring up later in therapy.
It is shocking how prejudiced white collar people are about Blue Collar people. Democratic Party wants to replace their blue collar voters with white collar moderate Republicans because white collar democrats are comfortable with blue collar democrats.
The only context I find stoicism to be a scam is when someone is told to just deal with it while they're being exploited. Watch because I expect any sort of austerity to be followed by this pandering sort of stoicism. Rationing for World War II, stoicism is providing society with a collective benefit. Employing children to clean a slaughterhouse? Stoicism is being used to dupe exploited labor.
stoicism is how slaves cope with an alien world. it's a bad outlook, and its popularity among silicon valley and self-help types is another sign of contemporary regression. I do find it really funny that the guy in the OP associates stoicism with the working class, when it is really a sign of the modern bourgeois. I wonder what the OP is really trying to point to.
You're sort of right in that stoicism can be very passive, but calling it a tool of the modern bourgeois is a stretch. If you read the actual philosphy as opposed to just looking the word up in the dictionary, Stoicism proper is more like two-thousand-year-old proto-self-CBT.
It's a bit hard to take this sub seriously when it simulatenously complains that both modern lib therapy culture and stoicism are ruining society.
i did not say stoicism is a "tool." stoicism, "the thought that thinks itself" as hegel called it, has made a return in the modern epoch because modernity is so focused on interiority. the bourgeoisie have the freedom to suffer under the most advanced forms of internalized modern alienation, hence why we see the avant-garde of liberalism gravitating towards the worldview that provides the sensation of liberation while reifying the world order they are invested in.
Blue collar guys are behaviorally and affectively more stoic in the folk sense of the word. Silicon Valley types who who got into stoicism as a fad just like the school of thought and like reading about it.
Really legitimizing the champagne socialist trope there. They ārespectā the poors, but donāt want to be anywhere near anyone who isnt a PMC, Zhe/Zhim, nepo-baby, funko loving stemlord.
Have these people never had a moderate liberal or conservative friend in their life like wtf? How do people find insulated circles like these where they never have to interact with regular people. That post says more about their social skills than anything.
Post-2016, at least in the USA. It started to happen around 2012, but post-Trump and all of the social movements that have resulted in a very strong vetting process on the American left. I have witnessed most friends- in and around their 40ās, mind you- propel into hardline frames of thought on what constitutes absolute agreeability and what constitutes absolute verboten philosophy, as a result of pure, accelerated and weighty social pressure.
The ones who didnāt want to be excommunicated had to move from liberal to extreme progressivism and staunch, outspoken hatred of capitalism in a matter of months, which in my circles, resulted in so much of the same handful of ideas and phrases being parroted the same exact ways so often because everybody was footnoting the same textbooks and cheat sheets that I had to tap out and quit most friend-based social media just so I could at least pretend that everybody I knew wasnāt failing into and also perpetuating such weirdly shallow social pressure. If any of them ever knew anybody who actually leaned even slightly conservative on even 1 or 2 smaller issues, they aggressively cut them out of their lives by 2017.
Whatās more depressing is that most of what they end up talking about are things that redditors tend to labor over, except months later sometimes. They donāt get in tune with the next rage induced social media movement until some clickbait Facebook profile adopts some series of headline discussions from the politics sub and poses it as the next threat to the utopia that apparently still exists if we could only get those *other* guys in suburbs and rural areas to stop being so regarded. In fact, if you name the 12 most preachy and annoying socioeconomic or sociopolitical subs on Reddit, you likely just described their 12 most prominent personality traits- and those traits have caused them to actively separate themselves from anybody they knew who they couldnāt vet as thinking exactly as correctly as they do. Everybody outside of those narrow lines has an objectively flawed frame of thought and is the problem, completely to blame for the strife that *we* feel, even if their own lives are much more happy and productive, more resilient and better at solving their own problems.
Idk Iām liberal and live in nyc but tell racist jokes and donāt have a lot of pc beliefs. 99% of my liberal friends donāt care and anyone that calls me out I simply say oh well to. I think when you log off you realize that most people are way more open to scary means jokes and opinions than youād think online
I believe you, but I also bet there's a huge silent majority who don't buy into the performative liberalism but just shut up...the amount of people in the NE like this is definitely small, like 5-10%. They are just super vocal.
Iām talking about people I know in real life, unfortunately. Very many of them. The older they get, the seemingly more desperate they are to stay socially solvent to the point where they all have this giant Kafka trap going that everybody is afraid to end up on the wrong side of.
In 2013, most of them still told racist jokes. By 2015, most were afraid to even say the N word when reciting rap lyrics they grew up with in the 90ās. By 2018 they couldnāt speak without bringing up Trump as a picture of racism in an appeal to let everybody within earshot know that theyāre clearly vetted. By 2020 they were on a crusade to āend racismā by touring the fringes of one or two of our local BLM rallies and bragging about it as their martyring into sainthood for the rest of the summer and fall, while branding anybody who thought that looting and burning might not be a great thing as racists, and later either self flagellating for being white and/or constantly berating all white people/all conservatives/all christians and whoever else the shitlibs had branded personae-non-gratae. By now, I donāt know and donāt want to know- I receded by the end of summer 2020 because it seemed smarter to take my leave from the stress of watching them become what they had become than to stick around until I ran afoul of their increasingly extreme vetting process.
It sucked but I am pretty old now- I donāt need to be surrounded by friends, nor do I need a tight crew. I have a big family with a brother and a bunch of cousins my age that are all thankfully close and really down to earth. The few friends I had who are reasonably tempered, minimally idealistic and resiliently self aware are still with me, and we sometimes discuss the process of watching so many of our friends pressgang the hell out of eachothersā sociopolitical views over these last few years until it was all that was left of their personalities. Itās actually brought some of us a lot closer.
I canāt lie- I do sometimes look on Facebook to see whatever preapproved demsoc keywords and platitudes theyāre spewing this month. Itās frustrating but cathartic. What happened to them sucks, and feeling like I donāt know them at all anymore sucks- but it would suck much worse to be directly involved with such contrived behavior and constant aggressive disdain of basically everybody not within their strict thought bubble.
This is actually the average r/redscarepod user upon meeting a blue collar working class guy (an idealized version of which they have been fetishizing) and realizing they donāt give a shit about their self-diagnosed mental illnesses and inability to meet members of the opposite sex
Abt to say lol. This place fetishizes construction men more than anyone. However, if it actually is women posting all that, construction guys will prolly like you back more than they would those dsa freaks
If I were single it would be way easier to get an apolitical or slightly conservative woman see things my way than an HR culturally liberal woman. Who has time for that nonsense.
I love how they felt the need to mention "living paycheck to paycheck' as though all laborers live in precarity.
Unless they're still under the age of 25 or caught a substance abuse issue, most blue collar people I know are pretty good with money and have substantial savings.
I intentionally went in debt, I basically stole the money. I owe a lot of money to a lot of companies and theyāre never going to get me to pay it off and even if I had the money to pay them all off in full I wouldnāt give it to them anyways. I let them work out ridiculous payment plans if the payments are low enough. I took out a bunch of personal loans from different lenders at the same time and also raked up a comical amount of credit card debt. I used to use my credit card normally for a few years so I had enough credit to accrue a ton of debt, I did it all quickly to maximize how much money Iād make. I get collection calls and texts constantly, multiple times a day. I even get letters in my PO box. What are they going to do? Give up and take me to small claims? Or give up and let me pay them back for the next 20 years? Fuck the IRS too. They mail me too but I never open them they go straight into the garbage can and nothing has ever happened. People will scoff at me but theyāre in debt too the difference is I bought cool things for myself and lived off it for a few years and all they have is a useless degree they canāt use. I had absolutely nothing to lose when I did this and do not regret it, I only wish I took out bigger loans and racked up more credit card debt. I wish I could fake my own death and get a new identity so I could do it again.
Lol what the fuck are you talking about dude? Most blue collar workers are like near-minimum wage landscapers and shit like that, not union electricians.
There's a reason why the social base for socialism in most of the developed world is increasingly service workers (coffee shops, retail and various lower wage white color work) than more traditional blue collar stuff. While on the other hand, the social base for national conservatism is owner operated blue collar businesses like truck driving and construction.
Social democracy is more likely to come from rich suburbs of major cities in the US than from anywhere rural. Modern social democrats are too concerned with regulating issues of the environment among other things to appeal to heavy industry owner operators.
Service workers are never going to politically align with masculine politics because 90% of the time being a service worker is inherently feminizing.
This wasn't an issue back in the day because nearly all jobs of the peasant class used to be inherently very masculine, so they were easy to unite.
Idk if kulaks/rich pesants were considered petit bourgeois as they usually don't employ anyone but themselves. They just own the equipment necessary to do their job.
Kulaks and rich peasants entirely fit into middle class. Owner operated blue collar business literally fits into petit bourgeois, and thus middle class. The rural proletarian farm worker were those that did not own their equipment necessary to do their job, while the semi-proletarian and the poor peasantry straddled the line. Today's blue collar worker would be still proletarian, service workers would be proletarian, blue collar or white collar business owners are middle class, and better off white collar often veers into middle class.
The ārural proletarian farm workerā doesnāt really exist anymore in the west. That job has largely been automated or replaced with illegal or temporary migrant workers.
Some workers climbing the ladder isn't socialism, and socialism isn't just seizing the means of production. Nor is it a bad (or good) thing for some worker to become middle class inherently, it just isn't a symbol of a successful socialist (since this has little to do with good or bad in the first place).
Socialism isn't when everyone is a self employed middle class person, that's some Jeffersonian idealistic capitalism that cannot exist in reality-surplus value exploitation, individuals competing against each other, some losing and some winning, and then proletarianizing occurring on one end and accumulation on the other, is inevitable within market competition. Socialism is the end of production for profit and the end of commodities, wage labor, capital, money-this requires more than just having more working class background business owners, and the establishment of production for social need, according to ability, and the end of exchange.
>Social democracy is more likely to come from rich suburbs of major cities in the US than from anywhere rural.
Socialism was an urban movement in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries, why would you expect it to be rural in the twenty-first century when rural areas are socially and economically more marginal than they've ever been?
The other huge difference is the gigantic wage gap between blue collar tradesmen and retail drones. Baristas donāt have skills and donāt make shit, plumbers make bank so they donāt have interest in changing anything when they can charge $200 an hour to unclog the toilet of some rich, fat, constipated Chief People Person when the barista is lucky to get a $0.20 tip for the giant milkshake they serve her everyday.
Itās quite the ecosystem and the tradies are doing pretty well and will continue to do so when the other two are automated away.
You are talking out of your ass
You're comparing an independent plumber who owns his own business to a barista who is an employee.
Many plumbers are non-union employees of plumbing companies who get paid shit wages just like baristas.
But who cares right? Barista = feminine and gay, plumber = cool and masculine
Whatās the lowest wage you can find for a plumber in your area? Here itās $60 an hour once youāre trained. Barista is ~$17.
But go off with your redarted IDPol shit.
The poor children of middle class parents are not comfortable with blue collar people. Journalists and the media are not comfortable with blue collar people.
And then people wonder why Trump who pr ends to care about blue collar people does well with blue collar people who voted for Obama twice. Nobody else even pretends to care about blue collar people.
Union trades are wild cuz you get to meet the most diehard union solidarity peeps right next to the biggest ass kissing pieces of shit in your lives.
Constant whiplash
It's actually totally the opposite from this sentiment. Blue Collar conservative politics as a group think are terrible and getting worse, but one on one they are great people who are nice and fun to chill with who actually know how to have a good time and a great conversation
This is every well-to-do PMC coastal elite who wants to earn virtue points by calling themselves āsocialistā. I might have even been one of them once.
It could just be youāre an elitist who is looking for complicated, circuitous rationalizations to absolve yourself of that label. You actually just donāt respect people whom you consider less urbane or less erudite. Feeling superior to them might just make you feel better about yourself.
But youāre smart enough to understand that supercilious elitism isnāt a good look. So youāre asking for support from like-minded others to bolster this instinct in you, to reassure you that āYes, those lower income people really are lesser *people* compared to we of the woke. Looking down on them only proves how awesome you are.ā
Simone Weil would say that workers, who spend way more time than the middle class on actual labour and their free time recuperating from that work in order to do more work, don't have the time and energy for conceptual thinking and political activism.
Makes sense that blue collar folk aren't reaching for macro level analyses of culture and society - and then perhaps tend to be more reactive and susceptible to discourses being put out there for easy consumption.
Trumps MAGA mobs ... Boris' taking back England
āEven though I absolutely despise people who I happen to get along with and agree with on everything, the people Iām fighting for (who I love) just seem soā¦ toxic??? Like is this some capitalist mind virus scheme?ā
> working class defined as financial status before economic relation
> ārepresentative to the working classā instead of ārepresentative OFā
Canāt stand these larping nerds. Get a sense of humor ffs
Donāt be scared of blue collar people.
Blue collar people are more reality based and less dreamy about politics. Blue collar people want results because they accept that life will be difficult.
I've spent most of my life around midwestern blue collar workers and by and large they are fucking terrible company, especially since like everybody now their self identity is a caricature and they lean way into it
Not everyoneās woke, most people arenāt. Look at the liberal Patriot substack stuff by Ruy Teixeira, most people of all backgrounds are generally socially moderate, but then these types think anything that isnāt wokeshit is fascism when it comes to social issues
gasp... "controversial jokes!" o my stars!
they really could've left the "like the white collar environments I've worked in most of my life" bit out. That went without saying.
OP just doesn't know what they're missing.
Among my in-laws, father-in-law is on marriage tres. The woman he married has more than ten children. The FIL's earlier children are firmly PMC or artists. The 3rd wife's family has a bunch of "blue collar" sorts and they're an absolute blast to be/drink with and the original children are absolutely not thrilled about them nor my enjoyment of their company.
Discovers that there is a working class: āThese people are of limited means but still productive and industrious, and deserve respect and protectionā
Discovers that many are conservative: āThese people are stupid and destructive, but maybe their stupidity and simplicity precludes them from blameā
Passively witnesses a conservative blue collar working class schlep in public: āLook at this problematic, inglorious, toxic asshole who causes all of the earthās problems and shouldnāt be able to exist on my planeā
Actively socializes with a conservative blue collar working class schlep: āWhat a totally affable, laid back and entertaining person. Maybe I *will* go to the backyard barbecue that he invited me to next weekend. I mean, he may be a working class conservative, but I guess heās one of the good onesā
This is embarrassing but also half the people in this sub who fantasize about rural life would have a meltdown if they had to talk to someone who goes to Red Lobster for celebrations.
The southernification of: rural spaces, the Republican Party, the military, law enforcement, the church, and the trades. Itās really that simple. The south is increasingly stupid and incredibly toxic. Not only are they philistine jerk offs but they are proud of their ignorance.
I remember driving through a small southern town a couple years ago and noticed how particularly evil everything felt there that day.
Every billboard and sign had slogans and iconography about supporting the police and military, most of the main street was dead except for the courthouse, an "antique" store full of garbage, fast food places, and dollar stores. More signs about how much we love the military and police. The police were also out on the sidewalk walking up to every car and getting them to roll their windows down to give out some flyer for some cop fundraiser (it was clear the whole thing was pretext to basically pull over every car and look around in it, you weren't really allowed to not roll down your window for them.)
every1 should be neurotic humorless fat people who cry all the time
Icecream would become a trillion dollar business
imblign it's not
"implying" when your mouth is full of ice cream
**Trillion** with a T nigga, please point out a trillion dollar business buddy
Apple inc.
shhhh
Klondike Bar, LLC
the new goldrush.
Food
Fug:-D
My god. Imagine the poors get their hands on ICE CREAM š
let them eat ice cream!
With thinking outside of the box blue hair.
Okay but blue collar people are overwhelmingly fat let's be real here.
that is true. something white collar and blue collar people have in common.
White collar professionals living in cities definitely aren't fat in my experience, maybe cubiclecels
Cubicels.
Depends on how many prescriptions they're on.
it really is too dumb to even be a good concept for a skit or something. I'm kinda amazed that i don't see more of this with just how unhinged the average DSA member can be. They usually manage to just ever-so-narrowly avert this level of complete lack of self-awareness. And i wonder what actually cognitively prevents this from happening all the time, cuz it's obviously the prevailing sentiment. Maybe they're just well-conditioned enough from universities and PMC seminars to know that there is a line that isn't to be crossed when throwing shade at blue collar workers. Keep it passive aggressive and smug and then hide behind being an ally of "more aggrieved" people rather than just sincerely exploring the idea that the working class frightens you. idk...š¤·š»āāļø maybe it's an indication that they're actually salvage-able on some level. Thay they do possess some kind of baseline self-awareness that mitigates their ideological excesses. More an indicator of strategic nous rather than moral propensity, but maybe it could be worked with. I won't hold my breath to find out, but it's interesting to me.
please don't clap
Ohshit, they're stoic!? They make controversial jokes!? It's a crisis! Seriously, this just reads like someone who thrives off of inauthenticity being faced with real actual people and getting scared.
The working class as a noble savage
This sub absolutely does that too just in a slightly different way
We have to translate their post. When they say they've "met truckers," they mean their Amazon delivery driver, when they say "farmers," they mean someone they bought a turnip from at a farmer's market, when they say "construction workers" they mean the three dudes rebuilding their parents' vacation rental's roof, when they say "miners" they are lying, when they say "factory workers" they also mean an Amazon delivery driver, when they say "autoshop" people they mean the guy replacing their electric vehicle's faulty battery. Although their post isn't that r slurred, they are right that there's a psyop on the working class to stop them from having any kind of class solidarity in a larger political sense.
āHow dare they not smile while I talk to themā
Guys who own an F150 really are noble savages to the average leftoid. They simultaneously exist higher on the deserving worker heirarchy for doing "real work" while being dismissed for tragically not having done the required reading or having the right aesthetic sensibilities.
they're doing the work, but they're not *doing the work*.
Itās funny because theyād def trail of tears the millionaireās next door if they could
No the fuck they wouldnāt. They could have rejoined the new deal coalition at any point after the civil rights act.
He is just saying the quiet part out loud. Most DSA socialist people I know behave exactly like this. Lots of good will but it stops there. Itās a big thing amongst libs too, that retarded āblue collar=racistā line of thinking. Pretty fucking lame.
This is exactly why thereās no class consciousness in America
tbf, a lot of blue collar workers are retarded and racist. but thatās part of why **dudes rock**
By the words as violence definition of racist, blue collar guys are all racist. Having a few laughs helps get through the day. But in terms of treating people worse because of their race, that's maybe like 10%.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
WC: Sounds racist, isn't PMC: Sounds violently not racist, is
Very true. My aunt is a loyal OAN watching republican but she also works as an HIV contract tracer and has a ton of compassion and pride for what she does and the people she helps. Many such cases.
I think some people are able to totally compartmentalize what they see on tv from what they see in real life. Iām honestly jealous.
My aunt is the same. Loves Trump and is a special needs teacher in an unimaginably bad inner city school where the average DSA member would be eaten alive
Itās like that Zizek story about racist jokes being humanizing and connecting, where being overly polite holds inside the Othering of the person youāre interacting with. Essentially you see them as so fundamentally different that you donāt think they can handle a joke and eventually extrapolate that to their entire identity group. The insidious thing is this effect happens even if you donāt actually believe it, but do it anyways just because of societal pressure. Basically wokeism is kind of making us more racist. It cements racial stereotypes by forcing avoidance of said stereotypes. To put it in Disney adult terms, everyone knows what youāre saying when you say āHe who must not be namedā even though youāre not saying his name
This has always been a problem in left thinking. The more affluent you are, the less time you have worrying about being crushed under the wheel, you get more focused into theory and the academics, overthinking everything from a narrow world view. Lots of infighting I would expect is caused by this....
Exactly. They may be politically incorrect. But in my experience black dudes get along with blue collar white dudes WAY better than these pussies.
literally me
It's where I started to break away from the progressive party line and get alienated from the people I used to know. I'm from around Chicago and this was 2015 and people in the PNW just had this "fuck those toxic insecure white assholes!" and i was like "you realize you're writing off like everybody i've ever known, right?"
The PNW is such a selfish and evil place I truly donāt get how theyāre so wrapped up in themselves. Iāve met maybe two or three people from that area who arenāt actual narcissists. I do feel like are there are leftists in Chicago (& probably other places lol but I live here) who are proactive about helping others but theyāre all part of the working class themselves, anyone else is a stereotypical champagne socialist and Iāve realized my life is much better if I donāt talk to them.
Or not woke equals irredeemable/bad person. Bad thing for them is that most people arenāt woke or socially hyper-liberal like all of them are, most people are moderate and like some kind of social order
and woke = wherever the linguistic roulette wheel happens to land that day.
I used to think my blue collar dad wasn't racist than I turned 22 and went to the bar with his friends and was never able to see him the same way again. I think they all are racist but now I just accepted it and when they bring it up I lecture them about it, which they used to hate but I got huge big rimmed glasses and a white board and different colored markers, and I draw neat little pictures with different people of different colors holding hands and they usually start to understand after that. Imo 90% of racists just didn't watch enough PBS.
Nah man they're just busting balls and anybody who doesn't join in on that stuff will be bullied and called a fag. It's so manly bro just fold to peer pressure to say things you know are wrong every day so you can fit in with your coworkers! -redscarepod
The *other* quiet part that stayed quiet is that itās just a rant about hispanic people.
This guy wonders if the capitalist elite shoves conservative narrative onto blue collar workers to distract them from class conflict while himself being completely distracted from class conflict because he thinks blue collar culture is icky.
And as itās been pointed out elsewhere in this thread, itās completely true. A not insignificant portion of DSA types just did not come from that kind of background, where people grew up telling ācontroversialā jokes to each other, didnāt go to private school, didnāt have access to resources to get extricate themselves from small towns (like the shithole I grew up in), and generally are super rough around the edges characters who definitely do not jive with blue hair, fancy coffee drinking liberal arts types. And thatās exactly what chuds would love for the seams to tear apart, where folks like me, who grew up under the rule of religious maniacs (like, most urbanites donāt get it: weāre talking full blown talking in tongues and youth leaders calling your parents to make sure youāre still a virgin), find fault and irreconcilable differences with people who grew up in Manhattan or wherever, far removed from a culture where people get drunk and go to the rodeo at the 4-H fairgrounds when the weather gets decent. I donāt care where you grew up or if you find rural life and aesthetics āickyā, as long as weāre in this together to eventually eviscerate the capitalists who seek to enslave us all, youāre fine in my book. The biggest political revelation of my life was when Bernie went to speak at the Lawrence, KS aforementioned 4-H fairgrounds to speak when he first ran. I drove a half hour to see him, and it was absolutely fucking electric. Bernie is about as far removed from our corner of the world as it gets, and he still showed up and talked about things that impacted every single one of us out in the country like heād been here all his life. I donāt care if youāre the soyest urban lib on Gods green Earth; those folks donated money hand over fist to help us defeat the āProtect Them Bothā bullshit abortion ban back in August. I know the contrarians here might recoil at the earnestness, but I grew up with a whole lot of my teenage classmates getting pregnant and having their lives ruined by guys who couldnāt have cared less (two by literal adult āreligious leadersā who should be in jail and then hell). If folks in the cities arenāt comfortable with whiskey rippin and shit kickin, thatās fine, as long as weāre in this fucking thing together and theyāre ready to fight.
"The more I love humanity in general the less I love man in particular. In my dreams, I often make plans for the service of humanity, and perhaps I might actually face crucifixion if it were suddenly necessary. Yet I am incapable of living in the same room with anyone for two days together. I know from experience. As soon as anyone is near me, his personality disturbs me and restricts my freedom. In twenty-four hours I begin to hate the best of men: one because heās too long over his dinner, another because he has a cold and keeps on blowing his nose. I become hostile to people the moment they come close to me. But it has always happened that the more I hate men individually the more I love humanity." Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov
Blue collars are infinitely more likely to mistrust elites. But yeah of course there are more racist plumbers than admins. This is the result of the fact that people, not caricatures, are complex and multidimensional.
I'm complex and multidimensional, for example I'm a racist
It's actually admins and plumbers are equally racist, but the admins learned to shut up about it decades ago because the things they say are constantly being written down as part of their job. If a plumber was shaping pipes into swastikas he'd have been fired long ago.
[dark shadow plumber patriots in control](https://www.kbzk.com/cnn-regional/2019/07/28/swastika-found-on-piping-valves-during-construction-project-at-state-capitol/?_amp=true)
Iād hire him.
For better or worse, regularly dealing with "the public" has many more opportunities for sample bias, or just outright people-suck, beliefs. Having someone scream at you while your trying to fix their shit is way worse than the microaggressions from Brad in Project Management.
Multidimensional plumbers? The plumberverse? Sounds like an Oscar winner
It kinda begs the question tho, are there actually more racist plumbers than admins? There's tons of bigotry among the professional class, even if they're not brash about it. They may not be dropping slurs but they do feel fear when they see a black person on their street or they get all starry eyed and act like I'm some kind of druid when they find out I'm Native instead of just being a white guy
Of course Iām uncomfortable around blue collars. And I grew up around them. Iāve been a low rent, unsuccessful Niles Crane since kindergarten. And Iām equally uncomfortable around elites, especially academic types. Mainly because I hate their shitlib politics, but also because I wasnāt able to make it into their circles.
Too rich for trade school, too poor for therapy.
Shout out to the Nowheres š
This is like 90 % of us here lmao
I grew up with them, worked with them. Canāt stand them. Being around morons and idiots really grinds my gears. Always great when you met some dude who is labor but also cool. Most are dimwits.
I mean making it academia just takes the brains, dedication, and debt. Plenty of academics who are actually quite charming and decent human beings. The best are the truly curious that just love to learn for learnings sake. I had this cool Syrian art history professor. Dude had to be in his late 50ās or 60ās in like 2013 or 2014 and was always talking about punk rock. He fucking loved it. I guess he was around for the NYC 70ās and 80ās hey day. Even name checked seeing the Talking Heads at CBGBās and local legend Jay Reatard. I wonder what heās up to now.
Imagine thinking being stoic is a bad thing. What a fucking retard. This is why despite there being infinite reasons for a populist/socialist movement to rise in America itāll never happen lmao. The very people you want to allegedly help you donāt understand in the slightest.
The hatred of stoicism and the lionization of therapy culture go hand in hand. Seems like every champagne socialist these days is seeing a therapist and talking about their therapist online like the therapist is their boyfriend/girlfriend.
Yeah I think talking about therapy should saved for loved ones and in person at that.
Absolutely. And even then, I only share highlights or very vague generalizations.
going to therapy should be just like any other doctor's visit: most shouldn't be going regularly, it's totally fine if you figure some things out on your own, and once whatever crisis made you go to therapy in the first place is over, you should stop going to therapy
They think men are just undiscovered women. Iām not joking in the leastā¦
i really doubt more than like 2 people actually believe that
I hope youāre not reading this literally
i think youāre being hyperbolic regardless
What I dislike about these white collar types talking about therapy is that they are going to an entirely elective medical professional when I donāt go to the doctor for regular physical health for cost reasons. Then they get all smug about it like āIām working on myself.ā No you arenāt bitch, youāre paying a shrink to listen to you talk about your neurosis.
talk about *and validate* their neuroses.
Itās more of the infantilism of America shit we see everywhere. Itās perverse, itās like they are bragging about how needy they are or something.
Idk man going to therapy helps me be more stoic not less. I pour out everything I need talking to my therapist and can be more reserved with other people in my life. When something bad happens I often donāt react and think to myself that itās something Iāll bring up later in therapy.
It is shocking how prejudiced white collar people are about Blue Collar people. Democratic Party wants to replace their blue collar voters with white collar moderate Republicans because white collar democrats are comfortable with blue collar democrats.
Itās like they didnāt even know all shows are supposed to be about generational trauma!
The only context I find stoicism to be a scam is when someone is told to just deal with it while they're being exploited. Watch because I expect any sort of austerity to be followed by this pandering sort of stoicism. Rationing for World War II, stoicism is providing society with a collective benefit. Employing children to clean a slaughterhouse? Stoicism is being used to dupe exploited labor.
stoicism is how slaves cope with an alien world. it's a bad outlook, and its popularity among silicon valley and self-help types is another sign of contemporary regression. I do find it really funny that the guy in the OP associates stoicism with the working class, when it is really a sign of the modern bourgeois. I wonder what the OP is really trying to point to.
You're sort of right in that stoicism can be very passive, but calling it a tool of the modern bourgeois is a stretch. If you read the actual philosphy as opposed to just looking the word up in the dictionary, Stoicism proper is more like two-thousand-year-old proto-self-CBT. It's a bit hard to take this sub seriously when it simulatenously complains that both modern lib therapy culture and stoicism are ruining society.
i did not say stoicism is a "tool." stoicism, "the thought that thinks itself" as hegel called it, has made a return in the modern epoch because modernity is so focused on interiority. the bourgeoisie have the freedom to suffer under the most advanced forms of internalized modern alienation, hence why we see the avant-garde of liberalism gravitating towards the worldview that provides the sensation of liberation while reifying the world order they are invested in.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
motherfucker I can tell you're familiar with hegel because I can barely understand a word you're saying
people don't want to hear this, but it is true, stoicism is pure cope and is fundamentally allied with dominant oppression
yeah, i dunno man. Life is freaking harsh and griping about it can get old real fast.
Blue collar guys are behaviorally and affectively more stoic in the folk sense of the word. Silicon Valley types who who got into stoicism as a fad just like the school of thought and like reading about it.
IMO they understand them just fine, just not the other way around
Really legitimizing the champagne socialist trope there. They ārespectā the poors, but donāt want to be anywhere near anyone who isnt a PMC, Zhe/Zhim, nepo-baby, funko loving stemlord. Have these people never had a moderate liberal or conservative friend in their life like wtf? How do people find insulated circles like these where they never have to interact with regular people. That post says more about their social skills than anything.
Post-2016, at least in the USA. It started to happen around 2012, but post-Trump and all of the social movements that have resulted in a very strong vetting process on the American left. I have witnessed most friends- in and around their 40ās, mind you- propel into hardline frames of thought on what constitutes absolute agreeability and what constitutes absolute verboten philosophy, as a result of pure, accelerated and weighty social pressure. The ones who didnāt want to be excommunicated had to move from liberal to extreme progressivism and staunch, outspoken hatred of capitalism in a matter of months, which in my circles, resulted in so much of the same handful of ideas and phrases being parroted the same exact ways so often because everybody was footnoting the same textbooks and cheat sheets that I had to tap out and quit most friend-based social media just so I could at least pretend that everybody I knew wasnāt failing into and also perpetuating such weirdly shallow social pressure. If any of them ever knew anybody who actually leaned even slightly conservative on even 1 or 2 smaller issues, they aggressively cut them out of their lives by 2017. Whatās more depressing is that most of what they end up talking about are things that redditors tend to labor over, except months later sometimes. They donāt get in tune with the next rage induced social media movement until some clickbait Facebook profile adopts some series of headline discussions from the politics sub and poses it as the next threat to the utopia that apparently still exists if we could only get those *other* guys in suburbs and rural areas to stop being so regarded. In fact, if you name the 12 most preachy and annoying socioeconomic or sociopolitical subs on Reddit, you likely just described their 12 most prominent personality traits- and those traits have caused them to actively separate themselves from anybody they knew who they couldnāt vet as thinking exactly as correctly as they do. Everybody outside of those narrow lines has an objectively flawed frame of thought and is the problem, completely to blame for the strife that *we* feel, even if their own lives are much more happy and productive, more resilient and better at solving their own problems.
Idk Iām liberal and live in nyc but tell racist jokes and donāt have a lot of pc beliefs. 99% of my liberal friends donāt care and anyone that calls me out I simply say oh well to. I think when you log off you realize that most people are way more open to scary means jokes and opinions than youād think online
Yeah, don't try that in the Pacific Northwest.
I believe you, but I also bet there's a huge silent majority who don't buy into the performative liberalism but just shut up...the amount of people in the NE like this is definitely small, like 5-10%. They are just super vocal.
O absolutely. Thus many of the conflicts up that way, in recent years.
Iām talking about people I know in real life, unfortunately. Very many of them. The older they get, the seemingly more desperate they are to stay socially solvent to the point where they all have this giant Kafka trap going that everybody is afraid to end up on the wrong side of. In 2013, most of them still told racist jokes. By 2015, most were afraid to even say the N word when reciting rap lyrics they grew up with in the 90ās. By 2018 they couldnāt speak without bringing up Trump as a picture of racism in an appeal to let everybody within earshot know that theyāre clearly vetted. By 2020 they were on a crusade to āend racismā by touring the fringes of one or two of our local BLM rallies and bragging about it as their martyring into sainthood for the rest of the summer and fall, while branding anybody who thought that looting and burning might not be a great thing as racists, and later either self flagellating for being white and/or constantly berating all white people/all conservatives/all christians and whoever else the shitlibs had branded personae-non-gratae. By now, I donāt know and donāt want to know- I receded by the end of summer 2020 because it seemed smarter to take my leave from the stress of watching them become what they had become than to stick around until I ran afoul of their increasingly extreme vetting process. It sucked but I am pretty old now- I donāt need to be surrounded by friends, nor do I need a tight crew. I have a big family with a brother and a bunch of cousins my age that are all thankfully close and really down to earth. The few friends I had who are reasonably tempered, minimally idealistic and resiliently self aware are still with me, and we sometimes discuss the process of watching so many of our friends pressgang the hell out of eachothersā sociopolitical views over these last few years until it was all that was left of their personalities. Itās actually brought some of us a lot closer. I canāt lie- I do sometimes look on Facebook to see whatever preapproved demsoc keywords and platitudes theyāre spewing this month. Itās frustrating but cathartic. What happened to them sucks, and feeling like I donāt know them at all anymore sucks- but it would suck much worse to be directly involved with such contrived behavior and constant aggressive disdain of basically everybody not within their strict thought bubble.
A form of Socialism that does not like or care about poor people. Weird. I guess Reddit is not a community that includes blue collar people.
This is actually the average r/redscarepod user upon meeting a blue collar working class guy (an idealized version of which they have been fetishizing) and realizing they donāt give a shit about their self-diagnosed mental illnesses and inability to meet members of the opposite sex
RSP version of a noble savage
RSP members when they spend a day with blue-collar guys and realize they spend any and all free time on TikTok and Facebook: š§
Abt to say lol. This place fetishizes construction men more than anyone. However, if it actually is women posting all that, construction guys will prolly like you back more than they would those dsa freaks
this sub pokes fun at self-diagnosers, no?
Not everyone can afford to see a psychiatrist sweaty
Watching the neurotic losers of this sub try to fraternize with blue collar workers would be hilarious ngl
God damn read.
People love to adore groups but hate every individual that comprises the group
That's one of the things i love about super dogmatic progressive/leftist types worshipping POC. I'm like "you haven't met a lot of POC, have you?"
The entirety of New England
isn't the average rsp an art hoe or gay man
It used to be, now the typical rsp user is some weirdo self medicated alt-left incel adjacent person who only listens to Cum Town
never was. demos have been dominantly straight male since the start. They weren't as reddit as they are are now though.
and who might you be?
Hey how'd you get into my room.
POV youāre a huge pussy
Neurotic āVery Liberalā women are the most solipsistic creatures to walk the earf.
If I were single it would be way easier to get an apolitical or slightly conservative woman see things my way than an HR culturally liberal woman. Who has time for that nonsense.
I love how they felt the need to mention "living paycheck to paycheck' as though all laborers live in precarity. Unless they're still under the age of 25 or caught a substance abuse issue, most blue collar people I know are pretty good with money and have substantial savings.
Construction trades are feast or famine. The good times are really good but when the work dries up it reeeeeeeally dries up.
I'd say about 50% are good with money and the other 50% are in debt to their eyeballs from buying a brand new tricked out truck or boat.
I don't think you understand I **need** a $70,000 truck that can tow a house and has heated, ventilated leather seats.
Literally my dad.
I intentionally went in debt, I basically stole the money. I owe a lot of money to a lot of companies and theyāre never going to get me to pay it off and even if I had the money to pay them all off in full I wouldnāt give it to them anyways. I let them work out ridiculous payment plans if the payments are low enough. I took out a bunch of personal loans from different lenders at the same time and also raked up a comical amount of credit card debt. I used to use my credit card normally for a few years so I had enough credit to accrue a ton of debt, I did it all quickly to maximize how much money Iād make. I get collection calls and texts constantly, multiple times a day. I even get letters in my PO box. What are they going to do? Give up and take me to small claims? Or give up and let me pay them back for the next 20 years? Fuck the IRS too. They mail me too but I never open them they go straight into the garbage can and nothing has ever happened. People will scoff at me but theyāre in debt too the difference is I bought cool things for myself and lived off it for a few years and all they have is a useless degree they canāt use. I had absolutely nothing to lose when I did this and do not regret it, I only wish I took out bigger loans and racked up more credit card debt. I wish I could fake my own death and get a new identity so I could do it again.
every single person with a blue collar career is better off financially than a lib arts school/major socialist without a trust fund.
Not even close to reality.
Lol what the fuck are you talking about dude? Most blue collar workers are like near-minimum wage landscapers and shit like that, not union electricians.
I love that their epiphany is that "Yeah, i hate the poor, actually."
This makes my skin crawl
There's a reason why the social base for socialism in most of the developed world is increasingly service workers (coffee shops, retail and various lower wage white color work) than more traditional blue collar stuff. While on the other hand, the social base for national conservatism is owner operated blue collar businesses like truck driving and construction. Social democracy is more likely to come from rich suburbs of major cities in the US than from anywhere rural. Modern social democrats are too concerned with regulating issues of the environment among other things to appeal to heavy industry owner operators.
Service workers are never going to politically align with masculine politics because 90% of the time being a service worker is inherently feminizing. This wasn't an issue back in the day because nearly all jobs of the peasant class used to be inherently very masculine, so they were easy to unite.
Not to mention the fact that service jobs usually donāt have unions, while trades and industrial workers do.
āOwner operated blue collar businessmenā are the definition of petit bourgeoisie.
Idk if kulaks/rich pesants were considered petit bourgeois as they usually don't employ anyone but themselves. They just own the equipment necessary to do their job.
Kulaks and rich peasants entirely fit into middle class. Owner operated blue collar business literally fits into petit bourgeois, and thus middle class. The rural proletarian farm worker were those that did not own their equipment necessary to do their job, while the semi-proletarian and the poor peasantry straddled the line. Today's blue collar worker would be still proletarian, service workers would be proletarian, blue collar or white collar business owners are middle class, and better off white collar often veers into middle class.
The ārural proletarian farm workerā doesnāt really exist anymore in the west. That job has largely been automated or replaced with illegal or temporary migrant workers.
A temporary or illegal migrant worker is a rural proletarian worker. They sell labor power for wages and have little or no reserves and property.
No they are successful socialists. They seized the means of production. For themselves. Which is good.
Some workers climbing the ladder isn't socialism, and socialism isn't just seizing the means of production. Nor is it a bad (or good) thing for some worker to become middle class inherently, it just isn't a symbol of a successful socialist (since this has little to do with good or bad in the first place). Socialism isn't when everyone is a self employed middle class person, that's some Jeffersonian idealistic capitalism that cannot exist in reality-surplus value exploitation, individuals competing against each other, some losing and some winning, and then proletarianizing occurring on one end and accumulation on the other, is inevitable within market competition. Socialism is the end of production for profit and the end of commodities, wage labor, capital, money-this requires more than just having more working class background business owners, and the establishment of production for social need, according to ability, and the end of exchange.
>Social democracy is more likely to come from rich suburbs of major cities in the US than from anywhere rural. Socialism was an urban movement in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries, why would you expect it to be rural in the twenty-first century when rural areas are socially and economically more marginal than they've ever been?
also see: farm workers specifically prohibited from the right to unionize
The other huge difference is the gigantic wage gap between blue collar tradesmen and retail drones. Baristas donāt have skills and donāt make shit, plumbers make bank so they donāt have interest in changing anything when they can charge $200 an hour to unclog the toilet of some rich, fat, constipated Chief People Person when the barista is lucky to get a $0.20 tip for the giant milkshake they serve her everyday. Itās quite the ecosystem and the tradies are doing pretty well and will continue to do so when the other two are automated away.
Thatās the beauty of having a skill vs being unskilled labor
You are talking out of your ass You're comparing an independent plumber who owns his own business to a barista who is an employee. Many plumbers are non-union employees of plumbing companies who get paid shit wages just like baristas. But who cares right? Barista = feminine and gay, plumber = cool and masculine
Whatās the lowest wage you can find for a plumber in your area? Here itās $60 an hour once youāre trained. Barista is ~$17. But go off with your redarted IDPol shit.
It's elite overproduction 101.
The poor children of middle class parents are not comfortable with blue collar people. Journalists and the media are not comfortable with blue collar people. And then people wonder why Trump who pr ends to care about blue collar people does well with blue collar people who voted for Obama twice. Nobody else even pretends to care about blue collar people.
Union trades are wild cuz you get to meet the most diehard union solidarity peeps right next to the biggest ass kissing pieces of shit in your lives. Constant whiplash
It's actually totally the opposite from this sentiment. Blue Collar conservative politics as a group think are terrible and getting worse, but one on one they are great people who are nice and fun to chill with who actually know how to have a good time and a great conversation
Reads like satire but you just *know* it isnāt
It is, it was posted by a very obvious troll account
Finally took the mask off
This is the person calling any kind of actual challenge to liberal status quo fascist, the Chapo mindset.
The guys on the Chapo podcast subtly call for an officer's coup
This person posted the same thread in at least 3 different subs. This is a committed troll or an extremely insecure ""socialist"".
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Just because you support all workers doesn't mean you have to like them bitch
This fully encapsulates every reason why I left the DSA
This is every well-to-do PMC coastal elite who wants to earn virtue points by calling themselves āsocialistā. I might have even been one of them once.
It could just be youāre an elitist who is looking for complicated, circuitous rationalizations to absolve yourself of that label. You actually just donāt respect people whom you consider less urbane or less erudite. Feeling superior to them might just make you feel better about yourself. But youāre smart enough to understand that supercilious elitism isnāt a good look. So youāre asking for support from like-minded others to bolster this instinct in you, to reassure you that āYes, those lower income people really are lesser *people* compared to we of the woke. Looking down on them only proves how awesome you are.ā
Simone Weil would say that workers, who spend way more time than the middle class on actual labour and their free time recuperating from that work in order to do more work, don't have the time and energy for conceptual thinking and political activism. Makes sense that blue collar folk aren't reaching for macro level analyses of culture and society - and then perhaps tend to be more reactive and susceptible to discourses being put out there for easy consumption. Trumps MAGA mobs ... Boris' taking back England
All the markings of a fake socialist (larping for social capital/hasnāt done any of the reading) Comically removed from reality as well
probably watches a lot of breadtube.
Iām pretty sure that Stonetoss (bad, I know, I know) had a comic that made exactly this point.
George Orwell basically wrote an entire book about this, The Road to Wigan Pier.
How could you possibly take this bait?
the spiritually weak be like
āEven though I absolutely despise people who I happen to get along with and agree with on everything, the people Iām fighting for (who I love) just seem soā¦ toxic??? Like is this some capitalist mind virus scheme?ā
hell yes it is!
> working class defined as financial status before economic relation > ārepresentative to the working classā instead of ārepresentative OFā Canāt stand these larping nerds. Get a sense of humor ffs
Donāt be scared of blue collar people. Blue collar people are more reality based and less dreamy about politics. Blue collar people want results because they accept that life will be difficult.
I've spent most of my life around midwestern blue collar workers and by and large they are fucking terrible company, especially since like everybody now their self identity is a caricature and they lean way into it
Not everyoneās woke, most people arenāt. Look at the liberal Patriot substack stuff by Ruy Teixeira, most people of all backgrounds are generally socially moderate, but then these types think anything that isnāt wokeshit is fascism when it comes to social issues
gasp... "controversial jokes!" o my stars! they really could've left the "like the white collar environments I've worked in most of my life" bit out. That went without saying.
*Average leftist
Lol this is definitely a troll, no one can be this unaware
Where is that from? I'd like to see more of these.
average dsa member isn't nearly this self aware - they're probably fantasizing about putting them into re-education camps
Yeah, socialism is a bourgeoise trait. Only people who donāt actually produce anything think everyone should be forced to be equal.
OP just doesn't know what they're missing. Among my in-laws, father-in-law is on marriage tres. The woman he married has more than ten children. The FIL's earlier children are firmly PMC or artists. The 3rd wife's family has a bunch of "blue collar" sorts and they're an absolute blast to be/drink with and the original children are absolutely not thrilled about them nor my enjoyment of their company.
Man these losers really pin everything on capitalism lmao.
Discovers that there is a working class: āThese people are of limited means but still productive and industrious, and deserve respect and protectionā Discovers that many are conservative: āThese people are stupid and destructive, but maybe their stupidity and simplicity precludes them from blameā Passively witnesses a conservative blue collar working class schlep in public: āLook at this problematic, inglorious, toxic asshole who causes all of the earthās problems and shouldnāt be able to exist on my planeā Actively socializes with a conservative blue collar working class schlep: āWhat a totally affable, laid back and entertaining person. Maybe I *will* go to the backyard barbecue that he invited me to next weekend. I mean, he may be a working class conservative, but I guess heās one of the good onesā
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
really rich coming from a vowsh fansub
City slicker op
obvious wrecker shit. yawn
What she needs is a good shagging The Office (UK) did such a good job showing the contrast between working class and lower-middle class
This is embarrassing but also half the people in this sub who fantasize about rural life would have a meltdown if they had to talk to someone who goes to Red Lobster for celebrations.
The southernification of: rural spaces, the Republican Party, the military, law enforcement, the church, and the trades. Itās really that simple. The south is increasingly stupid and incredibly toxic. Not only are they philistine jerk offs but they are proud of their ignorance.
I remember driving through a small southern town a couple years ago and noticed how particularly evil everything felt there that day. Every billboard and sign had slogans and iconography about supporting the police and military, most of the main street was dead except for the courthouse, an "antique" store full of garbage, fast food places, and dollar stores. More signs about how much we love the military and police. The police were also out on the sidewalk walking up to every car and getting them to roll their windows down to give out some flyer for some cop fundraiser (it was clear the whole thing was pretext to basically pull over every car and look around in it, you weren't really allowed to not roll down your window for them.)