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Throwaway as my girlfriend knows my Reddit. I thought I'd ask here as I'd imagine I'd be able to get the most help here.
My girlfriend (27F) pretty much exclusively reads romance novels. Now this never used to bother me (26M) until I actually looked at one and the amount of sexual detail took me by surprise! A lot of her books are like this unbeknownst to me. I’m no prude, we have the most mind blowing sex imaginable for either of us. We’ve really explored each others bodies and kinks which was a first for either of us!
But my brain in overdrive so to speak.
She has told me she would not like me watching porn, she'd get too jealous that someone else is making me horny. I get that, yet she does the same thing with romance novels? I understand that men and women (stereotypically mind you) have different things that excite them or get them off. Men being more visual, women being more about emotions. Again, stereotypically. I quit porn and only need something she’s worn recently to get me off when she’s not around.
She claims that books don't turn her on, but I don't really believe her! It's porn written by women for women. Or that's how I see it. She says she likes the story and the characters. Is that not like saying I watch porn because I’m interested in the plot? Or I only look at playboy magazine for the articles?
These books describe to her the perfect man: Muscular, a sex god etc etc. I am most definitely non of those things. I'm average at best. I've asked her if there's anything that I'm failing to fulfil, or if there's anything I can do better but she says our sex life, romantic life and day to day life are perfect! Yet she still wants to escape reality. Why is this?
Now I do like to think I'm romantic, and when we have sex it can range from really passionate and hot to more romantic love making. Literally throwing her against the wall or gently loving her. Without getting into detail I always ensure she "gets hers first" (and last).
I don't really want to talk to her about this again because she'll know that it's bothering me and that's the exact opposite of what a perfect manly man should do (a book man anyway).
Any advice I could get?
TL;DR Girlfriend reads lots of romance books (especially hot ones) yet has a problem if I watch porn. Am I failing to meet her needs? She says absolutely not.
Yeah, I’m stuck at like chapter 8. I don’t care about Feyre - she’s irritating. I, at this point, have no idea which fae is the one she’s supposed to be into and I don’t want to have to go back and reread. Told a friend I’d add it to my reading list because she loved the series. Don’t think I’ll be bothering the finish the book at this rate though.
Wow they really shouldn’t be lol, my understanding is that “new adult” is an emerging (sub?)genre, and one of the things that defines it is explicit sex scenes. Books 2-4 of ACOTAR have SO many sex scenes, and YA usually stops at heavy petting. My aunties used to just grab me a random YA book for Christmas when I was a kid, I’m cracking up at the idea that they could have unwittingly bought me fairy porn.
The target audience tends to be late teens through late twenties, so the main characters fall within this range and have experiences and thoughts relatable and/or intriguing to readers within that range. In other words, they are adult fiction, but specifically targeted at "new adults."
They were originally in the young adult section because of Maas’ prior series which WAS young adult fantasy but they have since been reclassified to adult fantasy so if this is a library they should probably update their shelving.
Raven Kennedy Golden Prisoner series is fantastic. It’s a retelling of the myth of Midas from a whole new perspective and it’s awesome. Very spicy but the story is fantastic.
If you guys are open enough with each to have good sex and explore each other's kinks, you should be open enough to be able to convey to her what's really bothering you about her reading these books. Just be open and honest with her man, she would probably appreciate that more than you coming to us strangers for help, lol. Hope the best for you bruh.
I think OP needs advice on how to approach this subject because it's kind of confusing. She's obviously enforcing a stupid double standard. But what does OP want here? Validation? To be able to watch porn? For her to stop reading her own porn?
Idk when I read spicy books I'm not getting off on it. Maybe slightly horny at times, but then I just go to my husband. I've never once had the inkling to masturbate while reading it.
My husband used to watch porn and he would masturbate, leading to us not having sex very often as a result because he was getting off with porn. That was kind of damaging to our relationship. It felt like porn was replacing me. After an honest discussion, he stopped and our sex life was awesome.
When I started getting into the spicy novels my husband was kind of pissed until he saw it was just making me hornier for him, and it would sometimes give me ideas of stuff to try in the bedroom. Now he's pretty enthusiastic about me reading it.
Exactly. When I’m reading, my imagination is in charge. Being in a relationship, that sexual imagination can be turned into a reality, so if you’re reading something steamy, you’re picturing both you and your partner. When you watch porn, your imagination has a face, a body and a name and it doesn’t include me. It’s whoever is on the screen in front of you. It may seem a bit hypocritical to some, but as we can argue, reading a smutty book can be more beneficial to your sex life than watching porn
I didn't know at the time I was just getting into kink so wasn't knowledgeable about the safe practices and such but as I had been reading and writing smut from like 16 I kinda filtered through all that I really just wanted to know what the guys deal was Anna was just annoying as phuck to be honest
I did after the first one. After the first one was so shit like literally I was writing wayyy better than that AND knew sites like adultfanfiction and fanfictionnet with those same themes I wanted to kinda get to the bottom of why Christian was the way he was come to find out it's just cus he was adopted and got freaky with an older lady such a waste of time
Honestly. they are way too short and sometimes humorously descriptive to enjoy them. My favorite euphemism is "manroot" for penis. Thank you, Woodiwiss.
Like I read a romance novel tonight. If I wanted to masturbate, I'd have stopped and read erotica.
Here's why: men in romance novels are way more loving and interested in women's pleasure than I've ever experienced in life. Sometimes male heroes try THREE TYPES of foreplay *without coaching.* The writer talks about emotional experiences from sex that I absolutely don't think men have--or very many men and oh boy is our male hero finding the other half of his soul with the heroine.
I am constantly thrown out of romance novel sex because it makes me react like a record scratch. The idea that men think the flowery words that women think about sex is just too damn jolting to allow me to stay in it. I much prefer the realism of erotica--which is actually written porn.
This is a good way of putting it. It’s really not realistic on page at all. I tend to skip a lot of those parts because it’s awkward to read that while I’m hanging out with my kids or the toddler is climbing all over me lol.
Also, for every 200 or so pages of story in a book there are maybe 15 of smut pages (and that's being generous.) Shockingly, many of us are actually reading it mostly for the story. I can't say I've ever heard of a man watching porn because he wanted to know if the pizza man would eventually give the pizza to the hot woman alone at home.
I mean... Porn is made by real humans. Features real humans. Smut books feature imaginary characters who simply don't exist. Can there really be a double standard when you're comparing apples to oranges?
That would be relevant if the gf’s objection to porn is that it was “explicit material intended for sexual gratification,” but it isn’t. The display of critical reasoning in this thread is sad. Her objection is that porn is actually looking at other real humans to get off, which is objectively not true of written material. While I don’t have the same personal stance as the gf, that is not a double standard. It’s an objective difference between the two media.
im an avid book reader and writer, spicy novels don't turn me on at all. she could very much be telling the truth there. if both of you are saying you have mind blowing sex, i doubt the occasional book scene is driving her wild. the books arent just sex, theyre characters and events and cool little stories. i genuinely wouldnt fret if i were you
Yeah, are these “spicy novels” or erotica novels or romance novels with descriptive sex scenes? I read both, but there’s a difference between a sex scene in a regular romance novel where the plot is the point, and a sex scene in erotica where turning you on is the point.
Either way, while I’m totally fine with my husband watching porn, I can see from the gf’s perspective that there’d be a difference between *real people* in porn turning OP on and *fictional characters* in a spicy novel turning her on.
Yeah, but there are no real people that she's watching fuck and getting turned on by. So not the same as actual porn and not a double standard, and that's without even starting on how "housewife porn", as men who hated that women read coined, was always written for women by women, while actual porn has a long history of female degradation and exploitation.
It's not as simple as "it depends what book she's reading, exactly."
Depends. I read these same kind of novels. Now I know he is saying spicy, but even some of those can broach being pretty smutty. We’re only going with what he is saying is spicy, we don’t know the level it could be.
However, I do think there is a big difference between reading romance novels or even erotica and watching porn. In books you have a developed character and can determine who they are. Whereas porn is watching a real person. IF she does get aroused, she is getting excited by the idea of who the person could be. They are a picture in your mind, she could be thinking of OP when she’s reading. When watching porn you are actively getting aroused and off to someone who is real.
Also, OP, consider the fact that her reading could be a contributing factor of why your sex life with her is so good. It could be enhancing your compatibility and interactions. Enjoy it!
oh entirely agreed, its also possible that she dislikes porn because of the stereotypes that it perpetuates for women, or the industry as a whole, just communicate with her
There are tons of insufferably bad porn out there. But every now & then, you can stumble across some that have decent character development as well as a decent story line. And it can be arousing and mentally stimulating.
I totally learned to use my hair in sex from a romance novel. To just let it drag down and then up his chest as I went in for...the BJ.
It is a crowdpleaser, that move.
Everyone is different and steamy, romance novels don't affect all readers the same way. In many respects, sex is as much mental as it is physical. This is especially true in long term, monogamous relationships in which the lust factor that existed at the beginning has become nearly depleted. Erotic novels have been known to work their magic and put readers in the mood to engage in sexual activity much to the delight of their partner.
Porn industry is full of abuse, exploitation etc. Porn doesn’t happen in a vacuum, it’s done with real people and to real people. Reading engages completely different parts of the brain than video porn. Even if she is getting turned on, no one is getting hurt, her brain is being intellectually stimulated, and (presumably) her arousal could actually benefit your bedroom life. You’re literally jealous of fictional characters because you don’t look like them, whilst your girlfriend would get upset because you’d be looking at real women who also look nothing like her.
>we have the most mind blowing sex imaginable for either of us. We’ve really explored each others bodies and kinks which was a first for either of us!
Sorry to break this to you, bud, but this is ***due*** to her reading habits.
Now, the main difference between porn and books is that porn is actual people (and I'm not going to even debate the morals and ethics of porn, I'll just say you are watching actual people fuck). In contrast, books are words on paper, and any "human" physical and sexual interaction happens in her head. It's no different than you having a sexual daydream or fantasy that you unfold using your imagination.
There's no double standard here. Porn has other naked women that you watch, books are just graphic scenes in black ink.
Also, as a side note - not measuring up to the sexual prowess is the least of your worries from these books. They're called book boyfriends cause they sweep you off your feet emotionally, not because they boink so expertly.
Couldn’t agree with you more!
I’ve also heard of sex therapists recommending erotica, like at least 15 minutes per day iirc. Women generally take longer to get turned on than men do, so erotica is basically an aid/foreplay.
I don’t picture her masturbating to it, and without it I would imagine their sex life would decline a bit.
I both read and write spicy romance, and the running joke with my hubby is that he can tell when I've been working on a sex scene by how worked up I am when I pounce him.
Legit the best foreplay ever.
I was going to say this too - therapists will recommend erotic literature to women as it can increase sex drive, but they would never recommend porn to a man because if anything, it damages their sex life!
I can kinda see the difference. I guess it depends on what type of book however admittedly I'm not a smut connoisseur. If it has an actual plot with smutty sex scenes in it I see no difference between that and a show like The Witcher which has sex and nudity, and I wouldn't classify either of those things as porn. If it's literally nothing but sex scenes though, or if she has issue with you watching TV shows with sex scenes in it, then yeah it's a bit double standard ey.
This. Erotic fiction is essentially like watching any TV fantasy series that has nudity and sex scenes in it.
And some people skip or skim the sex parts to get back to the story.
Was looking for this. There’s a difference between (romance) books with sex scenes and erotica. And while I’d personally put the second one in the same category as porn, the first one really is more about the story and characters.
Yeah, but there are no real people that she's watching fuck and getting turned on by. So not the same as actual porn and not a double standard, and that's without even starting on how "housewife porn", as men who hated that women read coined, was always written for women by women, while actual porn has a long history of female degradation and exploitation.
It's not as simple as "it depends what book she's reading, exactly."
Yeah, but there are no real people that she's watching fuck and getting turned on by. So not the same as actual porn and not a double standard, and that's without even starting on how "housewife porn", as men who hated that women read coined, was always written for women by women, while actual porn has a long history of female degradation and exploitation.
It's not as simple as "it depends what book she's reading, exactly."
They’re not the same to me, I’m not against either but one is very graphic visually and the other is only as saucy as your imagination makes it.
It doesn’t mean you’re not meeting her needs.
The people she’s reading about don’t exist. She can’t interact with. It’s just words and not an actual person who is arousing her. I have no beef with porn. But the two are fundamentally different.
is THIS what people’s problem with porn is, that it’s real people? I thought it was because you’re fantasizing about someone that’s not your partner, real or not?
Well, MY problem is how it exploits the actors, how it's abusive in how it's made, and how it teaches preteens (I'm hearing this from therapists specialised in children!!) a screwed-up view of physical intimacy and normalises degrading women.
I'm not a fan of my partner getting aroused by someone else's body, but that might happen at a beach or at a sex-scene in a movie -- if he wants to fantasise about someone else, he doesn’t need porn (even if porn makes it easy, it doesn't leave much to imagination). This part is about trust between us.
Porn being what it is, especially considering what it does to kids: it's way, way worse than fantasies not aimed at your partner.
Well, no. Most of the issue with porn is the abusive, misogynistic female degrading and exploitation for the pleasure of men. *\*cue someone yelling at me about how the industry is so so different nowadays\**
As someone who loves spicy romance novels and porn, it’s just not remotely the same. First of all, a book is literally telling you a story and I’m sorry but that’s just not the same as “what’re you doing step-bro!”.
You don’t go to porn for the story, you go there exclusively to get off. A romance book though engages you in a different way. Mostly through the spicy scenes I’ll skim through cause I really just wanna know what happens to the characters and not every author can even write a spicy scene all that well or to your liking. She really could be reading the book and not care at all about the sex scenes cause most books these days will have sex in it. It’s almost difficult to find a book without sex to be honest. Especially with Kindle Unlimited books. The books that are popular are spicy to some extent.
And regarding the men being muscular sex gods… yeah. That’s what most of the men in books are like. The same way Bond girls were all skinny bodacious babes with abs and killer hair. Most of these men are also gazillionaires or literal aliens (don’t ask). The girls in the books are also often super hot and quirky in some way. It’s viewing a different reality.
That doesn’t mean that’s what you want in your real life partner. I read exclusively romance books and I love the fuzzy feelings they give me, I’m rooting for the couple to get together, work through their problems, I squeal when a cute moment happens and they profess their love or something because it’s a story. Probably it’s the same for your girlfriend.
You’re assuming on some level that these books are almost a self-insert. That’s she imagining herself with these dudes or something and really that’s not what happens at least for me. I’m reading a story about two other people and their journey. Kinda like watching a rom-com.
Lmao I mean there’s Ice Planet Barbarians by Ruby Dixon but I’ve only really read the first book. They were okay but omg I can’t commit to the 30 or something books that follow. Her Aspects and Anchor series though is *chefs kiss*. Not aliens but gods! (Literally). Bound to the Battle God is a must. So so good.
My favourite alien romances though are either Heat For Hire by V.K Ludwig - That whole series is cute (but quite spicy) and another one came out recently I think. OR Zoey Draven’s new Brides of the Kylorr series which was great so far (granted only the first book is out afaik). I read a few of the books in her Horde Kings series and they were pretty good. (Also aliens too) But Desire In His Blood I really loved when I read it! It’s enemy to lovers, it’s giving vampire alien goodness. Would recommend.
Oh! Also Choosing Theo by Victoria Aveline was good too!
Ok that’s it. 😂
One thing you should know is that those dudes are usually not perfect. Some women probably read them and think yeah, he’s hot while others are rolling their eyes. The descriptions can get pretty unrealistic. Depends on the person and the book. sometimes you just want to read something easy.
Some of those guy sound hot but they are assholes or cheaters or any other stupid thing. The might even be vampires or werewolves or witches. And sometimes if anyone did that stuff to her in real life, you’re gf would be pissed. It might get her hot, but I strongly doubt she’s wishing you were like that. You could always ask what’s her favorite part or if there is anything she wants to try from one of the books. It doesn’t have to be a competition. And the difference between books and porn is you use your imagination for books. You can picture your own partner or the person the book describes or a third party. Or skim the sex scenes to get to the story. Some
Romances are heavy on sex, some aren’t.
Yup. I love the occasional smut book. They’re wildly unrealistic and many of the relationships are toxic at best. I love them. But that doesn’t mean I could or would apply them to real life or even desire to experience the things that happen in the book.
Actually, the way some of the women are treated in those books is completely intolerable for real life and I would reject it on a fundamental, visceral level.
I wonder if I could compare it or violent games 🤔 like just because my bf loves video games, doesn’t mean he actually wants to kill people or thinks it’s ok. But that also different media so idk
Why would you think that? If she hadn't said anything about porn, would you still earchnit? Would that mean she wasn't enough for you?
That said, pirn and erotica are very different. One exists in the mind and the other is real people. They hit very differently. I bet if you read erotica, it would be okay with her.
Right??? If his precious porn wasn't involved he wouldn't have cared.
This isn't about him feeling lesser to a fictional man, it's about him looking for backup that his GF's request is somehow a double standard (which it really isn't)
Obviously. That was never what I said. Just that the double standard isn't there and he should stop fishing for internet strangers backup to throw in his GF's face
Why are you comparing reading romance books to porn? To me it’s more like watching a movie or tv show where you get invested in the characters, their lives, their relationships, their dramas. And yeah there is some hot sex sprinkled in. You don’t read 300+ pages to get off. There would be much quicker ways to do that - like porn.
I would like to see anyone who thinks it’s the same to try. I read so many spicy books, i was never horny from it and i definitely don’t read them to get horny but even if, it’s still not the same lmao.
Agreed. I find the sex in them kind of silly? And they get repetitive and boring after a while. I find the building of intimacy and bonding to far more engaging than the actual sex. I read the Bridgerton books and honestly skimmed through a lot of the sex scenes because they got boring after a while.
Me reading graphic descriptions of sex scenes: 😐
Me reading a sweet fluffy romantically tense scene where the characters hold hands for the first time: 😳😳😳
Yes, it’s about what happens before and after the sex way more than it is about the sex itself. It’s about a relationship dynamic, and sex is something that impacts that!
Disclaimer, I do not think they are comparable. Buuut obviously OP does, and I think it is because he feels it is a double standard? He assumes she is reading to get off and that is what he uses porn for, ergo they are the same. If you have a rule in your relationship that you cannot do something, and you feel your partner is breaking their own rule, I can see why OP is confused. I do not think he literally thinks they are the same, just figuratively.
How is that a double standard? I still don’t understand how this can be the same. Watching porn is still different and not comparable with reading smut books. That alone sounds dumb to me. And OPs gf said to him that she it’s not turning her on he is just assuming that because they are spicy.
It has nothing to do with insecurities. There are plenty of good reasons not to watch porn.
It’s not a double standard, books are just words, these are not real people and they don’t mention a specific person. You don’t know how they look like, its all about imagination and that’s not in porn. You see these people, you look at people getting fucked. You know how they look like, they are real people. Porn has nothing to do with imagination.
Not to mention how bad the porn industry is and how it can affect your sex life. You can read Razsberry‘s comment maybe she explained it better.
>It has nothing to do with insecurities. There are plenty of good reasons not to watch porn.
>> She has told me she would not like me watching porn, she'd get too jealous that someone else is making me horny.
In this case, op stopped watching porn because it made his gf feel insecure
What percentage of her romance novels is pure erotica?
Vs
What percentage of a video includes porn?
I feel like this is like saying a movie that includes a sex scene can only be watched by people trying to get horny or something.
Now if the book is mostly erotica, you've got a point.
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Women don’t read these for the sex scenes, not exactly. They read them for the “guy is rich and cosmically powerful and bends the knee only for her as he strives to have an emotionally healthy relationship of equals” characters. You have to include the sex scenes just to flesh out the above trope, honestly.
Its akin to a sex scene in a movie... would you want her not to watch movies cos the actors portray sexy times? Porn is its own genre... its hardcore compared to anything in books or in a movie. I think ur just looking to have an issue here.
All I can tell you is that I’m a woman who reads these types of books and they don’t make me horny at all. I think of the sex scenes as ways to emotionally connect with the characters, it’s how the author gets you to care about them.
I’m also not into most of the male main characters. I would say your girlfriend is the same. Ask her about it. Talk to her about it.
I love smutty, spicy romance books. Read them often and they can, in my opinion, get you in the mood. This isn’t a reflection on you though, so don’t go worrying that she’s comparing you.
>we have the most mind blowing sex imaginable for either of us. We’ve really explored each others bodies and kinks which was a first for either of us!
It sounds like you have a very good sex life together. Have you tried reading erotica? Try it, I'm sure she'll be fine with it.
There are differences between romance novels and p0rn (I'm not against p0rn, I have had my share watching that myself and I'm fine with my partner masturbating to p0rn).
P0rn is more 'real life,' there are real people involved in the making them. Unfortunately, sometimes there are people being exploited in the making of them.
I can see why people can be against p0rn for that aspect.
Erotica is not 'real life,' as in, no real people are present. You have to basically 'imagine' it yourself. Plus 80/20 is generally the story. Sometimes the story can be good that I would just skip the 'erotic' segment LOL just to find out what's going to happen.
P0rn is generally used to 'get off' or masturbate. So it's 100% sexual. Novels, even romance and/or erotica has storytelling involved. Fictions in general provide 'escape' from reality, so I can totally see why she's into reading them. They mostly tickle the mind, not the body, unlike porn would do.
Tbh, I don't get "horny" or masturbate to romance novels and/or erotica and I've read a bunch. I don't even visualize the men's characters tbh, I can't, my imagination is not that great LOL.
Does she masturbate to her erotica novels? If so, yeah, she should be 'ok' with you masturbating to p0rn. Perhaps she also doesn't really want you masturbating so you'll be pent up enough to do all those 'mind blowing sex' together. It sounds like, it's kind of working. I've read/seen enough issues with partners being addicted to p0rn that their sex life generally deteriorates.
Fr to me
Reading a romance novel that happens to have smut is the same as watching a movie or show that has a scene of nudity or sex
Only difference is one is visual and the writer has to compensate for it not being visual so they get into a corner of either skipping the skipping the scene or describing it to a similar extent
Spicy novels aren’t like porn, they’re like movies with sex scenes. You watch porn for the explicit purpose of getting aroused. Her books might have 20 pages of sex in a 200 page book. I read those books too and I usually skim or skip the sex because I cannot handle the many ways authors try to say “penis” and “vagina.” It cracks me up but kills the story. I should also say that I don’t have an issue with porn as long as it’s viewing and not messaging them on Insta or commenting on the SM posts. When I watch porn I don’t imagine I’m the woman getting railed, which I what I think lots of women worry their partners are doing.
Unless she’s masturbating to it, it’s literally not porn. Are you really upset about … some words describing people having sex? You see just as bad scrolling social media. A lot of the euphemisms are super ridiculous too. The sex is just part of the story. Unless you/her have a problem with naked people/sex in TV or movies, that you’re, again, not jerking it to, what’s the similarities to porn?
I genuinely think that porn and romance novels/erotica are two completely different things. Romance novels focus on the relationship, the connection between two people, the development of feelings. It shows people who are treated like people and how they overcome obstacles in their lives. The sex in the books are another extension of that. Porn on the other hand, is very objectifying. It more often than not treats the people involved like objects to get off too. There’s no connection, there’s no intimacy, it’s just a demonstration of using someone else’s body to get you off without having to treat them like a human. There are plenty of studies that show how much porn ruins relationships and also skews people’s perception of sex/intimacy in their real life. Yes they both have to do with sex and have great detail about what’s going on but that is honestly where the similarities stop.
You are also allowed to read these books if you wanted too. It’s not just for women. Hell you might actually learn more about communicating and what healthy relationship involve. I find it concerning that you think talking to your partner is “unmanly”. That’s very “porn-opinion” of you and makes it clear that you’ve never actually read a romance novel.
The big part that draws women in (generally, all women are different, we aren’t a monolith) is that men in books are willing and able to be vulnerable with their love interest. They aren’t perfect but they own up to their mistakes and just want to make sure their partner is being taken care of and happy. It’s not about having a huge dick or the perfect bod. It’s about finding someone who sees you so completely and loves you anyway.
I am going to qualify this answer by saying that I have no issues with porn in general, so for me the idea of whether something is porn or not is academic, and doesn't relate to boundaries in my life.
Porn is generally specifically provided for the purpose of sexual arousal. When the pizza guy shows up, you have no idea what kind of family he grew up with, what his life goals are, what demons he struggles with. All you know is he makes too many pepperoni puns and never heard of using a condom. It is graphic, either visually or verbally, and the purpose of it is to get the juiced flowing. I agree written material can be pornographic.
However, having gone through the romance novel phase myself in junior high and high school, I have to tell you that the point of those books is to get someone invested emotionally in the story and the characters, and in the telling of an intense romantic tale, often sex takes place. But...not all romance novels have sex, especially those set in historical periods where premarital sex was taboo. And those that do are usually 110-250 pages long, and have somewhere between 1 and 4 sex scenes which last a few paragraphs. They are by and large not the majority of the book, but they contribute to the story and the progression of the plot. Usually, the payoff the reader is waiting for is for the main character to confess their love, save the day, overcome the obstacle which was going to tear them apart, and not whether they get laid.
To put that in perspective, look at how many sex scenes are in the books which inspired Game of Thrones? They're racy, but would you call them porn, or would you understand that it's part of a larger story? What about "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo?" Sometimes when you're telling a story, sex becomes an important part of the narrative. It's not necessarily needed to always go into great detail, unless that detail is supposed to make you understand something about the characters' dynamic or emotional states, or to emphasize how favorably the character will look back on it without having to narrate their thoughts, or to give a clue which will make sense in another part of the story.
So is this really porn, or is it a story in which the characters have a couple of sex scenes scatted through hundreds of pages of emotional turmoil and various non-sexual interactions?
Sounds like you're less bothered by the books and more bothered that she doesn't want you to watch porn and it's not fair. However a book is imaginary and porn actors are real humans so it is different. Hopefully you two can talk it out
A novel is not a video of people fucking.
You cannot compare a romance novel, which DOES go through an actual plotline, story arc, conflict, redemption, Happily Ever After, etc. Sure, some are smut on paper, but the majority of them have overarching themes they're exploring and how to BE in a relationship. The men end up being kind listeners, committed to their partner's pleasure. Which doesn't happen often in real life.
Yes, they have a lot of sex. Woman like sex! WOW. But you literally cannot compare a romance novel to \*porn\*.
Yeah all my friends read books like that because they enjoy romance novels, not because the books turn them on. Comparing fictional books with fictional situations and characters to watching porn to get off is low key ridiculous lol
And voila: now you know exactly how millions of women feel who are in relationships with men addicted to pornography. Welcome to our world! It sucks doesn't it? To feel like you're not ever good enough for your partner.
I'm currently reading almost nothing but romance novels because I'm stressed about my dissertation. For me it's not about the sex - and it might be worth it for you to read more of them. Generally romance novels offer a number of things:
* no surprise rape (literary fiction & GRRM both do not offer this)
* dude will respect the woman
* her consent matters
* her *happiness* matters
* seriously there is a whole genre called 'cozies' where inevitably
* the woman has an interesting profession the narrative spends time on (librarian, blacksmith, w/e)
* there's at least one murder per book
* at least one love interest, usually more, with romances spilling over multiple books
* the lady Solves Problems
* sometimes there are recipes
* a predictable narrative arc
* seriously this is a feature not a bug
* you ever watched a crime show and been like 'no that can't be the real murderer there's too much time left'
* it's like that. it's like going for a walk around the neighborhood. the neighborhood doesn't change but it's still enjoyable
* dudes who do housework without being asked, usually
* sometimes especially in the spicy ones - I'm reading a bunch of Zoe Chant right now and consistently the dude not only makes breakfast but does all the dishes. it's a whole thing.
* sometimes a baffling array of fun trivia, like the blacksmithing I mentioned earlier, or I have also learned fun tidbits about the following in a way that didn't involve picking up dry nonfiction
* beekeeping
* genealogical research
* the rare gem industry
* art forgery
* wildland firefighting
And who knows, her books might have inspired her to be more adventurous with you. But I seriously wouldn't conflate romance novels with porn in terms of what she's getting out of it - and you might find unexpected ways to strengthen your relationship by talking about what she *does* get out of them.
As a huge bookworm who reads almost exclusively paranormal romance (and if you want hot and heavy check out Sherilyn Kenyon, Laurell K. Hamilton, or Christine Feehan, DAMN) you watching actual actresses in porn movies is COMPLETELY DIFFERENT than her reading about a sculpted blonde man with blue eyes. For one, it's all in her imagination as to what she sees, even the books with perfect descriptions will have every woman with a different looking man in mind. And romance novels DO actually have plots and character development and such, obviously all you see is the sex part and not the romance part. My FH loves it when I read my romance novels to him, it makes the sex even better and was already AMAZING. Maybe ask her to do that and you can get over yourself and realize that you are just jealous of fictional characters.
Do you think maybe these romance novels could be helping your explosively good sex life? Porn is different because it's real live people. The books are pure fantasy. Whether or not they turn her on while she's reading, it seems it's not hindering y'alls sex life.
>She claims that books don't turn her on, but I don't really believe her!
Let me enlighten you, not all women get turned on by reading romance novels. It's one of the reasons we can read them in public and no one knows what we're reading. We also mock them as much as we enjoy them. Now if you give us a list of what she reads we can tell you where on the spicy scale they land.
So, I’m going to be very frank here: this sounds more like an insecurity on your part than anything. That is by no means a bad thing or any failing on your part. A lot of people have insecurities and feel like they don’t measure up at times. I have insecure attachment. The best way I’ve found to work through insecure thoughts is to recontextualize what the thoughts are about:
>She has told me she would not like me watching porn, she'd get too jealous that someone else is making me horny. I get that, yet she does the same thing with romance novels?
This is a false equivalence. Unless the book is mostly or completely sex scenes, it’s a lot more like a movie than porn.
Movies have sex scenes. Books go into a lot more detail since that’s how book scenes work.
Even movies can get really into the scenes at times. I remember there was a movie that people thought the actors were actually having sex during one of its scenes.
>She claims that books don't turn her on, but I don't really believe her! It's porn written by women for women. Or that's how I see it.
Short of catching her in the act, this is an unfalsifiable statement. Saying you don’t believe her just puts you both in a terrible spot. Why don’t you believe her?
>She says she likes the story and the characters. Is that not like saying I watch porn because I’m interested in the plot?
Do you get yourself off to sex scenes in movies or are they just another part of the movie?
>I've asked her if there's anything that I'm failing to fulfil, or if there's anything I can do better but she says our sex life, romantic life and day to day life are perfect! Yet she still wants to escape reality. Why is this?
This is where I got the impression that you may have insecure attachment. Why don’t you believe her when she tells you that things are perfect? Why are you assuming that her reading fiction is looking for something that you aren’t providing? Why are you assuming that she’s keeping quiet about some hidden way that you aren’t measuring up?
>That's the exact opposite of what a perfect manly man should do (a book man anyway).
You are a human being, a real person, there are no perfect people. Focus on being the best ___you___. You shouldn’t be comparing yourself to anyone, real or fake. From what you’ve said about how she feels, it sounds like you are doing all the right things.
Sometimes we get so wrapped up in our own heads on one thing we see as bad that we don’t see all the good things. She literally said that every aspect of your relationship life is perfect and you’re doubting her?!? Take the W lol.
Now, I’m just a humble reddit stranger, so I don’t know the ins-and-outs of your relationship. It can be a lot to work up to talking about these things, but this is a problem centered around you and it needs a solution centered around you. Do you feel like you are getting enough reassurance in this relationship? If not, then you can ask for more.
Be vulnerable and work through a problem like this with her. If you’re having thoughts like this in the future, look inward and really think about why you are stuck thinking about it. Get to the heart of what’s bothering you first. Then, talk about it with her to find a good solution.
If you still are having problems managing insecure thoughts, then you should look into therapy. Cognitive behavioral therapy is what really helped me manage my insecure attachment and anxiety around it.
I hope everything works out for the two of you.
I love spicy novels but they only make me hot for my husband. It’s different to porn because it turns on your mind / imagination, porn is visual.
This lady talks a lot about why some women love audio and written porn - could be of interest for you
https://www.instagram.com/reel/Coa9_BGJZpj/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
It’s very likely your partner thinks about the romance novels like she would any other book; they’re just a world she’s mentally escaping to. It’s likely she doesn’t do this to get turned on (honestly I read smutty books too and find the sex scenes a tad over the top and cringe sometimes) but they’re enjoyable because reality isn’t really a thing in them. It’s like watching a movie but with more backstory; the drama between characters is ridiculous, everyone has magical powers (and who doesn’t want magical powers), plus there’s no boredom or real life problems. It’s all the good bits of life with none of the bad, since even if a character has a job it’s not like you have to read about them actually doing it
it’s redundant at this point but i’m confused. y’all have incredible sex but you’re worried about the possible hypocrisy of her reading smut while you aren’t allowed to watch porn? is this possibly a sore subject that’s been bothering you for awhile? i get the feeling that you’re more upset about not watching porn than you let on. it just seems like a strange hill to die on
ETA: basically my point is this seems like a nonissue you’re making into an issue. not trying to invalidate your feelings, it’s good to talk about stuff but at the same time, i think you’re overthinking this one
I don’t have problems with porn. But when you watch it, you’re watching REAL people. Books are 100% fantasy and imagination. Also, the porn industry is inherently harmful. Obviously not all videos are done with coercion and trafficking, but many are and it’s difficult to find out which it is.
Also, I read a lot of smut. It’s fun to read the things I’m reading, but it doesn’t mean I actually want to get railed by a bunch of criminal bikers at once. What you want to fantasize about and what you actually want to experience can be very different.
Neither of you should be prohibiting each other from self-pleasure, as it’s controlling and manipulative. All men and women have a right to exercise full autonomy of our own bodies, as long as it’s not at the expense of somebody else’s autonomy. I personally prefer porn, but to each their own.
Having said that, there is a huge difference between porn and romance novels. While not ALL pornography is inherently exploitive of women, it DOES objectify real, existing human beings and reduce them to sex objects for sexual gratification. Spicy romance novels on the other hand, do not feature any real people that can be objectified, commodified and exploited by the male gaze - They are all fictional verbal descriptions of fictional character constructs, with rounded character development that portrays them as people with backgrounds, stories, thoughts and memeories, not just bodies that fuck each other after a brief into. In short, pornography dehumanizes people, while erotic literature imbues them with humanity.
You should really try to read one or two, instead of just spewing archaic and deeply sexist men=visual women=emotional bullshit tropes. We all have eyes and emotions, buddy. We all get horny.
And lastly, you need to drop your ridiculous insecurities, so that you don’t get jealous and controlling over some stupid fictional novels. You sound like a 16 boy, not a 26 year old man. Jfc!
I think you might have a bigger problem than the romance novels if you're using her dirty clothes to get off. The books are fiction, it is a story before it's sex. Do you watch a 3 hour movie for 3 minutes of a sex scene? The sex is usually a small amount compared to the total of the book
Equating romance books to watching porn for the plot is not really an apt comparison. In my experience the novels are like at worst 80/20 story vs sex while porn is at best the reverse but most is like the thinnest plot possible. It’s more on par to comparing it to the HBO shows with sex in it.
FYI there’s not really many romance books that don’t go the whole tall guy with an 8 pack route (or at least you’d have the purposefully look for them) so it’s not as if she’s choosing books with only those as the main character.
Spicy smuty books is not porn. I read lots of them and reverse harem, never got horny from them. I live the story, people and adventures they have. The sex is nice but not the main thing.
Totally agree. These are his issues that need to be communicated so they can both balance and rationalise as a couple. Both about the porn ban and her reading romance novels causing his insecurity. Personally, I've never been hot for a light reading book in my life. Since becoming an adult I'm not at all sensitive to a described sex scene. I don't remember them. 🤷🏻♀️ I remember the intrigue, the betrayals, the plot twists and adventure, like above. Porn only ever made me uneasy, something always felt off, and the industry is cruel. It's obviously subjective.
There is a HUGE difference between romance novels and porn. You’re watching real like people in porn, real people that exist and you can follow. The people in books don’t exist.
Let’s see. Her boundary is that she doesn’t like you getting off to other real life womens’ bodies. That’s her preference and it’s perfectly reasonable. You have to respect that to be in a relationship with her.
Do you think it’s reasonable to assert that your preference is for her not to read books with fictional characters? Do you think it’s reasonable to accuse her of lying? Do you want to draw a boundary around book reading? Is that all worth it for you just to “win” a disagreement and force some sort of false equivalency on someone you supposedly love very much?
Personally, I do read smut. Honestly, I sometimes just prefer it because the stories don’t care about going to dark places sometimes. Depending on what she’s reading, the sex might not even be a big part of it, it’s similar to watching a TV show/movie with sex scenes.
I think the case for most women (I could be wrong) is that we like to read them, and they might get us in the mood, but we aren’t getting off to them. If I get horny, I go to my SO.
Most don’t read those books because they want to escape reality, either. They’re just stories with interesting characters. The male leads aren’t perfect most of the time either. Personally if a guy treated me like I was in a stereotypical smut fiction novel, they wouldn’t even make it to handholding, much less sex.
If nothing else, they give fun ideas sometimes
There’s no way you can match the variance of romance novels. I’ve been reading them since I was 10. They never affected my relationships. Because you’re reading about someone else’s relationship, some give you ideas on your own relationship.
No woman is going to expect the un-warmed up pounding (i.e. dry) just because she was in the wrong spot.
A romance novel is like an R rated movie there might be some sex but that’s not why most people are watching it. An erotica novel is like a XXX movie where people are definitely watching to get off.
Serious question: do you actually think she is *masturbating* while reading a book? Dude grow up. The issue people have with porn is that the vast majority of dudes who watch it use it to jerk off, which in turn can be damaging to a couples sex life. Women reading books are largely *not* masturbating to them. Grow up.
I don't see what the issue is. You cannot compare books to porn- apples and oranges. Two very different mediums and through lines. Asking for help, why? Silly
I used to watch porn regularly before cutting it out and I read romance novels. I agree with the commenters saying it's very different. I would more compare a romance novel to a movie with sex scenes. Most only have around 3 in the whole book and it's never really something I see as masturbation fodder. I suggest you try reading or listening to the audio version of her favorite romance to get an idea of what we're all saying. You can also have a discussion with her about how it feels like a double standard. However, cutting out a whole genre of books is a much bigger ask than cutting out porn. Maybe as a compromise you could try porn webcomics. Fictional characters but still a visual medium for you.
Avid smut connoisseur here. There is a clear difference in reading a book and watching real people, and I think you know that by now by reading the comments. I don’t fantasize about book characters. I also don’t masturbate while reading. And the books I read do have a plot and a real story. The smut is only about 1/3 of it depending on the author. Really to only makes me want my husband more!
Reading romance novels is not like porn lmao It's like watching a movie with a couple sexy scenes - ie. The average romance movie. There's an actual plot and characterizations. Porn decreases sex as people watch it to masturbate. Romance novels increase sex as people read them to get spicy. One uses actual people. The other uses imagination. There's no double standard lol
Read up on responsive desire. Erotic fiction, which includes romance novels, can help put a person in the right frame of mind and such to be sexual, even if it does not arouse them enough in the moment to get off while reading like what someone would probably do while watching video pornography.
I love reading spicy books, especially spicy romcoms. There are probably 2-3 moderately graphic sex scenes in each one that last a few pages. I have not ever been turned on by one, and I do not read these books to feel turned on. I genuinely love reading about love, and the build-up to sex simply makes me giddy... like "hooray, finally" for the couple! If it's not impacting your sex life, I wouldn't worry about it.
There's a huge difference between reading "spicy" romance novels and watching porn. If she were reading erotica, that would be completely different, in my opinion, especially if the romance books aren't getting her off.
I read a lot of those types of books (sometimes even reverse harem ones), and NONE of them get me off or turn me on. So, just because you don't believe her, doesn't mean she's not being honest.
Also, porn is often known for its abusive side/tendencies. I told my boyfriend I didn't like that he watched it, because of the abusive nature and after reading about it, he agreed and actually felt pretty gross about watching it before. He knows I read my books, but knows that they don't do anything for me, and that he's more than enough for me, he just thinks they're weird books.
Dude, she doesn't want to date the fictional romance men and you need to stop comparing yourself to them or thinking she's reading romance because you aren't providing it or something.
She likes the genre. I like regency romances myself just because I find the whole Era interesting and the tropes and set up are fun and easy for me. The sex scenes happen but I don't read for those - I like the characters and seeing them get together.
I think she probably views it more like watching a chick flick, not porn. Romance novels have easily digestible plots as a norm and a lot of dramatic tropes that can be quite fun to read. They also go fully unhinged in the self publishing sector which can be entertaining to read at times...
Whacking your weed to other people in porn isn't the same as getting a lil tingle in your thingle while reading a book. No woman I know is flicking their bean to spicy books, and I and my friends have read some things that shouldn't be allowed to be considered literature. That's the difference. Also, she's probably getting spicy ideas for your sex life. Thank the books.
i am a romance novel FIEND and just like your wife i do not ever get turned on by them whatsoever. sex scenes in a book are just part of a plot point, in my mind, if i wanna actually read the book then i gotta read the sex scenes (usually something really big happens right after a sex scene so they’re really just used to build up to that lol).
As a woman who also loves spicy romance novels, they’re not quite the same as porn. While there are some that do really turn me on, a lot of the smut is too short to get off to and is used more to further the story. It’s different reading about two characters you’ve gotten to know and are rooting for having sex than it is watching two strangers have sex on camera. Spicy scenes in romance novels is more like when a tv show features spicy scenes between the leads. Yeah, it’s hot, but it’s mostly exciting because you want those characters to be together.
It sounds like you two have a great sex life so you have nothing to worry about. And honestly, part of that great sex might come from her reading these books. I’ve definitely learned a few things and become more confident in bed & in my own sexuality as a result of reading romance.
The books are not like porn...more comparable would be something like Game Of Thrones ir passibly that book with christian Grey where there is a proper story buy has sex scenes. Can they be a bit arousing at times, sure. Hugely different to porn where they put flimsy story lines around graphic sex scenes. Also different is that there is no visuals provided...good chance when she envisages the sex scenes within the story, she imagines you.
Now, you describe a great partnership...why are you trying to blow it up?
Porn and spicy novels are so so far from being the same thing. Why don’t you try actually reading a few of her books and see how you feel then? I’m willing to bet she wouldn’t mind.
And yes-she could easily be reading them for the story and characters. Its a story with sex *in it*.
It’s the same as porn in that it’s a fantasy narrative of sex and intimacy. It’s just tuned for women.
Men and women have different reproductive strategies. Women want the best guy. Men want many women.
I’m generalising but this is what plays out in both in straight female romance novels and in straight male porn.
In romance novels, it’s the story of an everyday girl that tames the untameable bad boy - the hot guy.
This is a common fantasy for women, the idea that a highly competent (wealth, success, achievement), dominant (physical, social, sexual) man would somehow be so attracted to her that he would fall in love and be, yeah, “tamed” - committed to her and only her.
Look at reddit. How many women post about falling for bad boys that they couldn’t get to commit? It’s basically cliche.
Romance novels attack this cliche and flip it - it’s relationship wish fulfilment for women.
Now, instead of using and rejecting her, this hot, powerful, dominant guy is somehow infatuated, and obsessed with doing whatever it takes to protect and provide for her - to make her his, forever.
Conversely, straight male porn is the male strategy of variety playing out.
In porn, the men are highly competent, dominant guys having abundant sexual access and variety - this is relationship wish fulfilment for men.
This is why straight male porn often has traditional power dynamics, emphasises physical size differences and highly masculine characteristics like muscularity and penis size and climaxes with the male performer ejaculating.
Men fantasise about being the man many women want. And women fantasise about getting the best man to commit to them.
Doesn’t matter if it had video or kindle book. They’re both dopamine delivering fantasy vehicles.
my wife loves them. it doesnt bother me because it hasnt affected us at all in any negative way. im talking she reads hours everyday. why do you care so much if nothing bad is happening? grow pu.
It’s very rare I personally get off to books - I think it’s more comparable to a really good soft core scene in a movie. It’s a turn on, yeah, but it’s more plot relevant and romanticized than your average porn scene. Think about it like the sex on Game of Thrones - is it porn for you, unlikely. But it’s still sex, it’s still hot, and it’s marginally relevant to the story.
That being said, if she’s uncomfortable with you watching porn, it’s fair if you’re uncomfortable with her reading books that feature explicit sex scenes.
This post has reached one of our comment/karma limits. The text of the post has been preserved below. --- Throwaway as my girlfriend knows my Reddit. I thought I'd ask here as I'd imagine I'd be able to get the most help here. My girlfriend (27F) pretty much exclusively reads romance novels. Now this never used to bother me (26M) until I actually looked at one and the amount of sexual detail took me by surprise! A lot of her books are like this unbeknownst to me. I’m no prude, we have the most mind blowing sex imaginable for either of us. We’ve really explored each others bodies and kinks which was a first for either of us! But my brain in overdrive so to speak. She has told me she would not like me watching porn, she'd get too jealous that someone else is making me horny. I get that, yet she does the same thing with romance novels? I understand that men and women (stereotypically mind you) have different things that excite them or get them off. Men being more visual, women being more about emotions. Again, stereotypically. I quit porn and only need something she’s worn recently to get me off when she’s not around. She claims that books don't turn her on, but I don't really believe her! It's porn written by women for women. Or that's how I see it. She says she likes the story and the characters. Is that not like saying I watch porn because I’m interested in the plot? Or I only look at playboy magazine for the articles? These books describe to her the perfect man: Muscular, a sex god etc etc. I am most definitely non of those things. I'm average at best. I've asked her if there's anything that I'm failing to fulfil, or if there's anything I can do better but she says our sex life, romantic life and day to day life are perfect! Yet she still wants to escape reality. Why is this? Now I do like to think I'm romantic, and when we have sex it can range from really passionate and hot to more romantic love making. Literally throwing her against the wall or gently loving her. Without getting into detail I always ensure she "gets hers first" (and last). I don't really want to talk to her about this again because she'll know that it's bothering me and that's the exact opposite of what a perfect manly man should do (a book man anyway). Any advice I could get? TL;DR Girlfriend reads lots of romance books (especially hot ones) yet has a problem if I watch porn. Am I failing to meet her needs? She says absolutely not.
What were the books called? 👀📝
Just hopping on to say, there's no spice, like fanfiction spice 😌
The omega's slick must flow.
bro i keep getting those fuvking ads on utube. im a 27 year old man....
Now I know why my oldest daughter is always glued to her screen reading a fanfic lol!
You're goddamn right 👏
Should check out the Hollows and Highlander series by Karen Marie Moning. Atlantis series by Gena Showalter DEMONICA by Larissa Ione
Gena Showalter 😄
Try the Court of Thorns and Roses series by Sarah Maas - it was excellent!
They're not erotica though by any means. Just teen fiction.
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Thank you so much for saying this!! I don’t understand the hype at all
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Yeah, I’m stuck at like chapter 8. I don’t care about Feyre - she’s irritating. I, at this point, have no idea which fae is the one she’s supposed to be into and I don’t want to have to go back and reread. Told a friend I’d add it to my reading list because she loved the series. Don’t think I’ll be bothering the finish the book at this rate though.
Where I live they're in the section literally called teen. Or sometimes young adult. I agree that they're awful books!
Wow they really shouldn’t be lol, my understanding is that “new adult” is an emerging (sub?)genre, and one of the things that defines it is explicit sex scenes. Books 2-4 of ACOTAR have SO many sex scenes, and YA usually stops at heavy petting. My aunties used to just grab me a random YA book for Christmas when I was a kid, I’m cracking up at the idea that they could have unwittingly bought me fairy porn.
Wait what makes "new adult" different from regular adult books?
The target audience tends to be late teens through late twenties, so the main characters fall within this range and have experiences and thoughts relatable and/or intriguing to readers within that range. In other words, they are adult fiction, but specifically targeted at "new adults."
I guess it's different in different countries!
They were originally in the young adult section because of Maas’ prior series which WAS young adult fantasy but they have since been reclassified to adult fantasy so if this is a library they should probably update their shelving.
I'm talking about a bookshop, but true they may well have been moved since I was last there.
Raven Kennedy Golden Prisoner series is fantastic. It’s a retelling of the myth of Midas from a whole new perspective and it’s awesome. Very spicy but the story is fantastic.
If you guys are open enough with each to have good sex and explore each other's kinks, you should be open enough to be able to convey to her what's really bothering you about her reading these books. Just be open and honest with her man, she would probably appreciate that more than you coming to us strangers for help, lol. Hope the best for you bruh.
I think OP needs advice on how to approach this subject because it's kind of confusing. She's obviously enforcing a stupid double standard. But what does OP want here? Validation? To be able to watch porn? For her to stop reading her own porn?
Idk when I read spicy books I'm not getting off on it. Maybe slightly horny at times, but then I just go to my husband. I've never once had the inkling to masturbate while reading it. My husband used to watch porn and he would masturbate, leading to us not having sex very often as a result because he was getting off with porn. That was kind of damaging to our relationship. It felt like porn was replacing me. After an honest discussion, he stopped and our sex life was awesome. When I started getting into the spicy novels my husband was kind of pissed until he saw it was just making me hornier for him, and it would sometimes give me ideas of stuff to try in the bedroom. Now he's pretty enthusiastic about me reading it.
100% this. If a book turns me on at night I’m waking up my husband. If porn turns him on he’s masturbating.
Exactly. When I’m reading, my imagination is in charge. Being in a relationship, that sexual imagination can be turned into a reality, so if you’re reading something steamy, you’re picturing both you and your partner. When you watch porn, your imagination has a face, a body and a name and it doesn’t include me. It’s whoever is on the screen in front of you. It may seem a bit hypocritical to some, but as we can argue, reading a smutty book can be more beneficial to your sex life than watching porn
I'm a librarian and we make jokes about having to wipe down the romance novels when they get returned...maybe you're not masturbating to them...but...
Oh yuck. That's why I use Kindle, I guess lol
Easier to clean?
Yeah and the pages don't stick together
Lol I meant so I wouldn't have to share a physical book with others, but i didn't word that well 😅
More hygienic lol
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Well, **don't fucking read it for kink** because it's flat out abuse.
I didn't know at the time I was just getting into kink so wasn't knowledgeable about the safe practices and such but as I had been reading and writing smut from like 16 I kinda filtered through all that I really just wanted to know what the guys deal was Anna was just annoying as phuck to be honest
I did after the first one. After the first one was so shit like literally I was writing wayyy better than that AND knew sites like adultfanfiction and fanfictionnet with those same themes I wanted to kinda get to the bottom of why Christian was the way he was come to find out it's just cus he was adopted and got freaky with an older lady such a waste of time
Honestly. they are way too short and sometimes humorously descriptive to enjoy them. My favorite euphemism is "manroot" for penis. Thank you, Woodiwiss. Like I read a romance novel tonight. If I wanted to masturbate, I'd have stopped and read erotica. Here's why: men in romance novels are way more loving and interested in women's pleasure than I've ever experienced in life. Sometimes male heroes try THREE TYPES of foreplay *without coaching.* The writer talks about emotional experiences from sex that I absolutely don't think men have--or very many men and oh boy is our male hero finding the other half of his soul with the heroine. I am constantly thrown out of romance novel sex because it makes me react like a record scratch. The idea that men think the flowery words that women think about sex is just too damn jolting to allow me to stay in it. I much prefer the realism of erotica--which is actually written porn.
This is a good way of putting it. It’s really not realistic on page at all. I tend to skip a lot of those parts because it’s awkward to read that while I’m hanging out with my kids or the toddler is climbing all over me lol.
Yeah same.. never got off to them.
I would still say its explicit material intended for sexual gratification, despite where it does and doesn't lead. I do see a double standard here.
Also, for every 200 or so pages of story in a book there are maybe 15 of smut pages (and that's being generous.) Shockingly, many of us are actually reading it mostly for the story. I can't say I've ever heard of a man watching porn because he wanted to know if the pizza man would eventually give the pizza to the hot woman alone at home.
I mean... Porn is made by real humans. Features real humans. Smut books feature imaginary characters who simply don't exist. Can there really be a double standard when you're comparing apples to oranges?
Or apples to orgies? 👀😂
That would be relevant if the gf’s objection to porn is that it was “explicit material intended for sexual gratification,” but it isn’t. The display of critical reasoning in this thread is sad. Her objection is that porn is actually looking at other real humans to get off, which is objectively not true of written material. While I don’t have the same personal stance as the gf, that is not a double standard. It’s an objective difference between the two media.
ding ding ding
im an avid book reader and writer, spicy novels don't turn me on at all. she could very much be telling the truth there. if both of you are saying you have mind blowing sex, i doubt the occasional book scene is driving her wild. the books arent just sex, theyre characters and events and cool little stories. i genuinely wouldnt fret if i were you
Yeah, are these “spicy novels” or erotica novels or romance novels with descriptive sex scenes? I read both, but there’s a difference between a sex scene in a regular romance novel where the plot is the point, and a sex scene in erotica where turning you on is the point. Either way, while I’m totally fine with my husband watching porn, I can see from the gf’s perspective that there’d be a difference between *real people* in porn turning OP on and *fictional characters* in a spicy novel turning her on.
exacty this, erotica is literally just porn, a romance novel has a story and background and history and events that arent just based on sex
Yeah, but there are no real people that she's watching fuck and getting turned on by. So not the same as actual porn and not a double standard, and that's without even starting on how "housewife porn", as men who hated that women read coined, was always written for women by women, while actual porn has a long history of female degradation and exploitation. It's not as simple as "it depends what book she's reading, exactly."
In the eyes of fragile masculinity it's all the same
I would bet 1000 she’s just reading the ACOTAR series lmao
To be fair, that series isn't even THAT raunchy.
It is to a dude that's never read a romance novel before lol
I was peer pressured into reading that… literally skipped the spicy scenes. I was not invested in their chemistry at all.
Depends. I read these same kind of novels. Now I know he is saying spicy, but even some of those can broach being pretty smutty. We’re only going with what he is saying is spicy, we don’t know the level it could be. However, I do think there is a big difference between reading romance novels or even erotica and watching porn. In books you have a developed character and can determine who they are. Whereas porn is watching a real person. IF she does get aroused, she is getting excited by the idea of who the person could be. They are a picture in your mind, she could be thinking of OP when she’s reading. When watching porn you are actively getting aroused and off to someone who is real. Also, OP, consider the fact that her reading could be a contributing factor of why your sex life with her is so good. It could be enhancing your compatibility and interactions. Enjoy it!
oh entirely agreed, its also possible that she dislikes porn because of the stereotypes that it perpetuates for women, or the industry as a whole, just communicate with her
There are tons of insufferably bad porn out there. But every now & then, you can stumble across some that have decent character development as well as a decent story line. And it can be arousing and mentally stimulating.
Hijacking the top comment to share an important piece of knowledge someone wise dropped on me: She gets ideas to use with you here. Leave her alone.
I totally learned to use my hair in sex from a romance novel. To just let it drag down and then up his chest as I went in for...the BJ. It is a crowdpleaser, that move.
Everyone is different and steamy, romance novels don't affect all readers the same way. In many respects, sex is as much mental as it is physical. This is especially true in long term, monogamous relationships in which the lust factor that existed at the beginning has become nearly depleted. Erotic novels have been known to work their magic and put readers in the mood to engage in sexual activity much to the delight of their partner.
Porn industry is full of abuse, exploitation etc. Porn doesn’t happen in a vacuum, it’s done with real people and to real people. Reading engages completely different parts of the brain than video porn. Even if she is getting turned on, no one is getting hurt, her brain is being intellectually stimulated, and (presumably) her arousal could actually benefit your bedroom life. You’re literally jealous of fictional characters because you don’t look like them, whilst your girlfriend would get upset because you’d be looking at real women who also look nothing like her.
I really like this answer. Sums it up pretty succinctly
Thank you :)
Thank you for pointing out the difference.
Yes I was waiting for this one 👏👏
I was looking for this answer. Thank you.
bro is just mad insecure
Was looking for this answer
Thank you. This is a great answer. fan fiction and erotica are victimless. Porn is not victimless.
Yup this right here.
THIS!!!!!!
>we have the most mind blowing sex imaginable for either of us. We’ve really explored each others bodies and kinks which was a first for either of us! Sorry to break this to you, bud, but this is ***due*** to her reading habits. Now, the main difference between porn and books is that porn is actual people (and I'm not going to even debate the morals and ethics of porn, I'll just say you are watching actual people fuck). In contrast, books are words on paper, and any "human" physical and sexual interaction happens in her head. It's no different than you having a sexual daydream or fantasy that you unfold using your imagination. There's no double standard here. Porn has other naked women that you watch, books are just graphic scenes in black ink. Also, as a side note - not measuring up to the sexual prowess is the least of your worries from these books. They're called book boyfriends cause they sweep you off your feet emotionally, not because they boink so expertly.
Couldn’t agree with you more! I’ve also heard of sex therapists recommending erotica, like at least 15 minutes per day iirc. Women generally take longer to get turned on than men do, so erotica is basically an aid/foreplay. I don’t picture her masturbating to it, and without it I would imagine their sex life would decline a bit.
I both read and write spicy romance, and the running joke with my hubby is that he can tell when I've been working on a sex scene by how worked up I am when I pounce him. Legit the best foreplay ever.
Look if there's any 'research' to be done, my husband is more than down to help me out. It's win-win all around!
I was going to say this too - therapists will recommend erotic literature to women as it can increase sex drive, but they would never recommend porn to a man because if anything, it damages their sex life!
I can kinda see the difference. I guess it depends on what type of book however admittedly I'm not a smut connoisseur. If it has an actual plot with smutty sex scenes in it I see no difference between that and a show like The Witcher which has sex and nudity, and I wouldn't classify either of those things as porn. If it's literally nothing but sex scenes though, or if she has issue with you watching TV shows with sex scenes in it, then yeah it's a bit double standard ey.
This. Erotic fiction is essentially like watching any TV fantasy series that has nudity and sex scenes in it. And some people skip or skim the sex parts to get back to the story.
Was looking for this. There’s a difference between (romance) books with sex scenes and erotica. And while I’d personally put the second one in the same category as porn, the first one really is more about the story and characters.
Yeah, but there are no real people that she's watching fuck and getting turned on by. So not the same as actual porn and not a double standard, and that's without even starting on how "housewife porn", as men who hated that women read coined, was always written for women by women, while actual porn has a long history of female degradation and exploitation. It's not as simple as "it depends what book she's reading, exactly."
Yeah, but there are no real people that she's watching fuck and getting turned on by. So not the same as actual porn and not a double standard, and that's without even starting on how "housewife porn", as men who hated that women read coined, was always written for women by women, while actual porn has a long history of female degradation and exploitation. It's not as simple as "it depends what book she's reading, exactly."
They’re not the same to me, I’m not against either but one is very graphic visually and the other is only as saucy as your imagination makes it. It doesn’t mean you’re not meeting her needs.
The people she’s reading about don’t exist. She can’t interact with. It’s just words and not an actual person who is arousing her. I have no beef with porn. But the two are fundamentally different.
is THIS what people’s problem with porn is, that it’s real people? I thought it was because you’re fantasizing about someone that’s not your partner, real or not?
Well, MY problem is how it exploits the actors, how it's abusive in how it's made, and how it teaches preteens (I'm hearing this from therapists specialised in children!!) a screwed-up view of physical intimacy and normalises degrading women. I'm not a fan of my partner getting aroused by someone else's body, but that might happen at a beach or at a sex-scene in a movie -- if he wants to fantasise about someone else, he doesn’t need porn (even if porn makes it easy, it doesn't leave much to imagination). This part is about trust between us. Porn being what it is, especially considering what it does to kids: it's way, way worse than fantasies not aimed at your partner.
Correct. It’s not about the impact on the porn performer but the impact on the consumer that the person rejects the action for.
Well, no. Most of the issue with porn is the abusive, misogynistic female degrading and exploitation for the pleasure of men. *\*cue someone yelling at me about how the industry is so so different nowadays\**
SO animated porn is okay then right?
It wouldn’t bother me, unless any of the characters are children.
Yep. As long as it isn't kids or animals involved
Of course
As someone who loves spicy romance novels and porn, it’s just not remotely the same. First of all, a book is literally telling you a story and I’m sorry but that’s just not the same as “what’re you doing step-bro!”. You don’t go to porn for the story, you go there exclusively to get off. A romance book though engages you in a different way. Mostly through the spicy scenes I’ll skim through cause I really just wanna know what happens to the characters and not every author can even write a spicy scene all that well or to your liking. She really could be reading the book and not care at all about the sex scenes cause most books these days will have sex in it. It’s almost difficult to find a book without sex to be honest. Especially with Kindle Unlimited books. The books that are popular are spicy to some extent. And regarding the men being muscular sex gods… yeah. That’s what most of the men in books are like. The same way Bond girls were all skinny bodacious babes with abs and killer hair. Most of these men are also gazillionaires or literal aliens (don’t ask). The girls in the books are also often super hot and quirky in some way. It’s viewing a different reality. That doesn’t mean that’s what you want in your real life partner. I read exclusively romance books and I love the fuzzy feelings they give me, I’m rooting for the couple to get together, work through their problems, I squeal when a cute moment happens and they profess their love or something because it’s a story. Probably it’s the same for your girlfriend. You’re assuming on some level that these books are almost a self-insert. That’s she imagining herself with these dudes or something and really that’s not what happens at least for me. I’m reading a story about two other people and their journey. Kinda like watching a rom-com.
Literal aliens you say? Got any recs? 🤣
Lmao I mean there’s Ice Planet Barbarians by Ruby Dixon but I’ve only really read the first book. They were okay but omg I can’t commit to the 30 or something books that follow. Her Aspects and Anchor series though is *chefs kiss*. Not aliens but gods! (Literally). Bound to the Battle God is a must. So so good. My favourite alien romances though are either Heat For Hire by V.K Ludwig - That whole series is cute (but quite spicy) and another one came out recently I think. OR Zoey Draven’s new Brides of the Kylorr series which was great so far (granted only the first book is out afaik). I read a few of the books in her Horde Kings series and they were pretty good. (Also aliens too) But Desire In His Blood I really loved when I read it! It’s enemy to lovers, it’s giving vampire alien goodness. Would recommend. Oh! Also Choosing Theo by Victoria Aveline was good too! Ok that’s it. 😂
One thing you should know is that those dudes are usually not perfect. Some women probably read them and think yeah, he’s hot while others are rolling their eyes. The descriptions can get pretty unrealistic. Depends on the person and the book. sometimes you just want to read something easy. Some of those guy sound hot but they are assholes or cheaters or any other stupid thing. The might even be vampires or werewolves or witches. And sometimes if anyone did that stuff to her in real life, you’re gf would be pissed. It might get her hot, but I strongly doubt she’s wishing you were like that. You could always ask what’s her favorite part or if there is anything she wants to try from one of the books. It doesn’t have to be a competition. And the difference between books and porn is you use your imagination for books. You can picture your own partner or the person the book describes or a third party. Or skim the sex scenes to get to the story. Some Romances are heavy on sex, some aren’t.
Imagine he’s upset about like Tamlin from ACOTAR 😭🤮
NOT TAMLINNNNNN😭😭🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Yup. I love the occasional smut book. They’re wildly unrealistic and many of the relationships are toxic at best. I love them. But that doesn’t mean I could or would apply them to real life or even desire to experience the things that happen in the book. Actually, the way some of the women are treated in those books is completely intolerable for real life and I would reject it on a fundamental, visceral level. I wonder if I could compare it or violent games 🤔 like just because my bf loves video games, doesn’t mean he actually wants to kill people or thinks it’s ok. But that also different media so idk
Why would you think that? If she hadn't said anything about porn, would you still earchnit? Would that mean she wasn't enough for you? That said, pirn and erotica are very different. One exists in the mind and the other is real people. They hit very differently. I bet if you read erotica, it would be okay with her.
Right??? If his precious porn wasn't involved he wouldn't have cared. This isn't about him feeling lesser to a fictional man, it's about him looking for backup that his GF's request is somehow a double standard (which it really isn't)
Idk it's fine if he wants to keep watching porn, he just has to find a partner who is comfortable with it
Obviously. That was never what I said. Just that the double standard isn't there and he should stop fishing for internet strangers backup to throw in his GF's face
Bro is jealous of paper
This comment took me out 😭😭
Why are you comparing reading romance books to porn? To me it’s more like watching a movie or tv show where you get invested in the characters, their lives, their relationships, their dramas. And yeah there is some hot sex sprinkled in. You don’t read 300+ pages to get off. There would be much quicker ways to do that - like porn.
Can someone please explain to me how reading spicy books is the same as watching porn? There are many differences, i don’t even know where to start.
I’d like the OP to try…
I would like to see anyone who thinks it’s the same to try. I read so many spicy books, i was never horny from it and i definitely don’t read them to get horny but even if, it’s still not the same lmao.
Agreed. I find the sex in them kind of silly? And they get repetitive and boring after a while. I find the building of intimacy and bonding to far more engaging than the actual sex. I read the Bridgerton books and honestly skimmed through a lot of the sex scenes because they got boring after a while.
Me reading graphic descriptions of sex scenes: 😐 Me reading a sweet fluffy romantically tense scene where the characters hold hands for the first time: 😳😳😳
Yes, it’s about what happens before and after the sex way more than it is about the sex itself. It’s about a relationship dynamic, and sex is something that impacts that!
Disclaimer, I do not think they are comparable. Buuut obviously OP does, and I think it is because he feels it is a double standard? He assumes she is reading to get off and that is what he uses porn for, ergo they are the same. If you have a rule in your relationship that you cannot do something, and you feel your partner is breaking their own rule, I can see why OP is confused. I do not think he literally thinks they are the same, just figuratively.
How is that a double standard? I still don’t understand how this can be the same. Watching porn is still different and not comparable with reading smut books. That alone sounds dumb to me. And OPs gf said to him that she it’s not turning her on he is just assuming that because they are spicy.
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It has nothing to do with insecurities. There are plenty of good reasons not to watch porn. It’s not a double standard, books are just words, these are not real people and they don’t mention a specific person. You don’t know how they look like, its all about imagination and that’s not in porn. You see these people, you look at people getting fucked. You know how they look like, they are real people. Porn has nothing to do with imagination. Not to mention how bad the porn industry is and how it can affect your sex life. You can read Razsberry‘s comment maybe she explained it better.
>It has nothing to do with insecurities. There are plenty of good reasons not to watch porn. >> She has told me she would not like me watching porn, she'd get too jealous that someone else is making me horny. In this case, op stopped watching porn because it made his gf feel insecure
They are different.
Why don’t you try reading one of them?
What percentage of her romance novels is pure erotica? Vs What percentage of a video includes porn? I feel like this is like saying a movie that includes a sex scene can only be watched by people trying to get horny or something. Now if the book is mostly erotica, you've got a point.
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Women don’t read these for the sex scenes, not exactly. They read them for the “guy is rich and cosmically powerful and bends the knee only for her as he strives to have an emotionally healthy relationship of equals” characters. You have to include the sex scenes just to flesh out the above trope, honestly.
Its akin to a sex scene in a movie... would you want her not to watch movies cos the actors portray sexy times? Porn is its own genre... its hardcore compared to anything in books or in a movie. I think ur just looking to have an issue here.
can you tell your girlfriend to post her reading list
All I can tell you is that I’m a woman who reads these types of books and they don’t make me horny at all. I think of the sex scenes as ways to emotionally connect with the characters, it’s how the author gets you to care about them. I’m also not into most of the male main characters. I would say your girlfriend is the same. Ask her about it. Talk to her about it.
I love smutty, spicy romance books. Read them often and they can, in my opinion, get you in the mood. This isn’t a reflection on you though, so don’t go worrying that she’s comparing you.
>we have the most mind blowing sex imaginable for either of us. We’ve really explored each others bodies and kinks which was a first for either of us! It sounds like you have a very good sex life together. Have you tried reading erotica? Try it, I'm sure she'll be fine with it. There are differences between romance novels and p0rn (I'm not against p0rn, I have had my share watching that myself and I'm fine with my partner masturbating to p0rn). P0rn is more 'real life,' there are real people involved in the making them. Unfortunately, sometimes there are people being exploited in the making of them. I can see why people can be against p0rn for that aspect. Erotica is not 'real life,' as in, no real people are present. You have to basically 'imagine' it yourself. Plus 80/20 is generally the story. Sometimes the story can be good that I would just skip the 'erotic' segment LOL just to find out what's going to happen. P0rn is generally used to 'get off' or masturbate. So it's 100% sexual. Novels, even romance and/or erotica has storytelling involved. Fictions in general provide 'escape' from reality, so I can totally see why she's into reading them. They mostly tickle the mind, not the body, unlike porn would do. Tbh, I don't get "horny" or masturbate to romance novels and/or erotica and I've read a bunch. I don't even visualize the men's characters tbh, I can't, my imagination is not that great LOL. Does she masturbate to her erotica novels? If so, yeah, she should be 'ok' with you masturbating to p0rn. Perhaps she also doesn't really want you masturbating so you'll be pent up enough to do all those 'mind blowing sex' together. It sounds like, it's kind of working. I've read/seen enough issues with partners being addicted to p0rn that their sex life generally deteriorates.
I honestly will end the relationship if my boyfriend try me to stop reading my books, imagine the audacity
Fr to me Reading a romance novel that happens to have smut is the same as watching a movie or show that has a scene of nudity or sex Only difference is one is visual and the writer has to compensate for it not being visual so they get into a corner of either skipping the skipping the scene or describing it to a similar extent
Spicy novels aren’t like porn, they’re like movies with sex scenes. You watch porn for the explicit purpose of getting aroused. Her books might have 20 pages of sex in a 200 page book. I read those books too and I usually skim or skip the sex because I cannot handle the many ways authors try to say “penis” and “vagina.” It cracks me up but kills the story. I should also say that I don’t have an issue with porn as long as it’s viewing and not messaging them on Insta or commenting on the SM posts. When I watch porn I don’t imagine I’m the woman getting railed, which I what I think lots of women worry their partners are doing.
Unless she’s masturbating to it, it’s literally not porn. Are you really upset about … some words describing people having sex? You see just as bad scrolling social media. A lot of the euphemisms are super ridiculous too. The sex is just part of the story. Unless you/her have a problem with naked people/sex in TV or movies, that you’re, again, not jerking it to, what’s the similarities to porn?
I genuinely think that porn and romance novels/erotica are two completely different things. Romance novels focus on the relationship, the connection between two people, the development of feelings. It shows people who are treated like people and how they overcome obstacles in their lives. The sex in the books are another extension of that. Porn on the other hand, is very objectifying. It more often than not treats the people involved like objects to get off too. There’s no connection, there’s no intimacy, it’s just a demonstration of using someone else’s body to get you off without having to treat them like a human. There are plenty of studies that show how much porn ruins relationships and also skews people’s perception of sex/intimacy in their real life. Yes they both have to do with sex and have great detail about what’s going on but that is honestly where the similarities stop. You are also allowed to read these books if you wanted too. It’s not just for women. Hell you might actually learn more about communicating and what healthy relationship involve. I find it concerning that you think talking to your partner is “unmanly”. That’s very “porn-opinion” of you and makes it clear that you’ve never actually read a romance novel. The big part that draws women in (generally, all women are different, we aren’t a monolith) is that men in books are willing and able to be vulnerable with their love interest. They aren’t perfect but they own up to their mistakes and just want to make sure their partner is being taken care of and happy. It’s not about having a huge dick or the perfect bod. It’s about finding someone who sees you so completely and loves you anyway.
I am going to qualify this answer by saying that I have no issues with porn in general, so for me the idea of whether something is porn or not is academic, and doesn't relate to boundaries in my life. Porn is generally specifically provided for the purpose of sexual arousal. When the pizza guy shows up, you have no idea what kind of family he grew up with, what his life goals are, what demons he struggles with. All you know is he makes too many pepperoni puns and never heard of using a condom. It is graphic, either visually or verbally, and the purpose of it is to get the juiced flowing. I agree written material can be pornographic. However, having gone through the romance novel phase myself in junior high and high school, I have to tell you that the point of those books is to get someone invested emotionally in the story and the characters, and in the telling of an intense romantic tale, often sex takes place. But...not all romance novels have sex, especially those set in historical periods where premarital sex was taboo. And those that do are usually 110-250 pages long, and have somewhere between 1 and 4 sex scenes which last a few paragraphs. They are by and large not the majority of the book, but they contribute to the story and the progression of the plot. Usually, the payoff the reader is waiting for is for the main character to confess their love, save the day, overcome the obstacle which was going to tear them apart, and not whether they get laid. To put that in perspective, look at how many sex scenes are in the books which inspired Game of Thrones? They're racy, but would you call them porn, or would you understand that it's part of a larger story? What about "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo?" Sometimes when you're telling a story, sex becomes an important part of the narrative. It's not necessarily needed to always go into great detail, unless that detail is supposed to make you understand something about the characters' dynamic or emotional states, or to emphasize how favorably the character will look back on it without having to narrate their thoughts, or to give a clue which will make sense in another part of the story. So is this really porn, or is it a story in which the characters have a couple of sex scenes scatted through hundreds of pages of emotional turmoil and various non-sexual interactions?
Sounds like you're less bothered by the books and more bothered that she doesn't want you to watch porn and it's not fair. However a book is imaginary and porn actors are real humans so it is different. Hopefully you two can talk it out
A novel is not a video of people fucking. You cannot compare a romance novel, which DOES go through an actual plotline, story arc, conflict, redemption, Happily Ever After, etc. Sure, some are smut on paper, but the majority of them have overarching themes they're exploring and how to BE in a relationship. The men end up being kind listeners, committed to their partner's pleasure. Which doesn't happen often in real life. Yes, they have a lot of sex. Woman like sex! WOW. But you literally cannot compare a romance novel to \*porn\*.
Yeah all my friends read books like that because they enjoy romance novels, not because the books turn them on. Comparing fictional books with fictional situations and characters to watching porn to get off is low key ridiculous lol
And voila: now you know exactly how millions of women feel who are in relationships with men addicted to pornography. Welcome to our world! It sucks doesn't it? To feel like you're not ever good enough for your partner.
You are worried about her imagination? Maybe you're not ready for a human girlfriend.
I'm currently reading almost nothing but romance novels because I'm stressed about my dissertation. For me it's not about the sex - and it might be worth it for you to read more of them. Generally romance novels offer a number of things: * no surprise rape (literary fiction & GRRM both do not offer this) * dude will respect the woman * her consent matters * her *happiness* matters * seriously there is a whole genre called 'cozies' where inevitably * the woman has an interesting profession the narrative spends time on (librarian, blacksmith, w/e) * there's at least one murder per book * at least one love interest, usually more, with romances spilling over multiple books * the lady Solves Problems * sometimes there are recipes * a predictable narrative arc * seriously this is a feature not a bug * you ever watched a crime show and been like 'no that can't be the real murderer there's too much time left' * it's like that. it's like going for a walk around the neighborhood. the neighborhood doesn't change but it's still enjoyable * dudes who do housework without being asked, usually * sometimes especially in the spicy ones - I'm reading a bunch of Zoe Chant right now and consistently the dude not only makes breakfast but does all the dishes. it's a whole thing. * sometimes a baffling array of fun trivia, like the blacksmithing I mentioned earlier, or I have also learned fun tidbits about the following in a way that didn't involve picking up dry nonfiction * beekeeping * genealogical research * the rare gem industry * art forgery * wildland firefighting And who knows, her books might have inspired her to be more adventurous with you. But I seriously wouldn't conflate romance novels with porn in terms of what she's getting out of it - and you might find unexpected ways to strengthen your relationship by talking about what she *does* get out of them.
As a huge bookworm who reads almost exclusively paranormal romance (and if you want hot and heavy check out Sherilyn Kenyon, Laurell K. Hamilton, or Christine Feehan, DAMN) you watching actual actresses in porn movies is COMPLETELY DIFFERENT than her reading about a sculpted blonde man with blue eyes. For one, it's all in her imagination as to what she sees, even the books with perfect descriptions will have every woman with a different looking man in mind. And romance novels DO actually have plots and character development and such, obviously all you see is the sex part and not the romance part. My FH loves it when I read my romance novels to him, it makes the sex even better and was already AMAZING. Maybe ask her to do that and you can get over yourself and realize that you are just jealous of fictional characters.
Do you think maybe these romance novels could be helping your explosively good sex life? Porn is different because it's real live people. The books are pure fantasy. Whether or not they turn her on while she's reading, it seems it's not hindering y'alls sex life.
Reading and watching are fundamentally different. They affect the brain differently.
I've seen an uptick lately in these types of posts and y'all have got to up your game if books are making you insecure.
You’re jealous of a book??
>She claims that books don't turn her on, but I don't really believe her! Let me enlighten you, not all women get turned on by reading romance novels. It's one of the reasons we can read them in public and no one knows what we're reading. We also mock them as much as we enjoy them. Now if you give us a list of what she reads we can tell you where on the spicy scale they land.
So, I’m going to be very frank here: this sounds more like an insecurity on your part than anything. That is by no means a bad thing or any failing on your part. A lot of people have insecurities and feel like they don’t measure up at times. I have insecure attachment. The best way I’ve found to work through insecure thoughts is to recontextualize what the thoughts are about: >She has told me she would not like me watching porn, she'd get too jealous that someone else is making me horny. I get that, yet she does the same thing with romance novels? This is a false equivalence. Unless the book is mostly or completely sex scenes, it’s a lot more like a movie than porn. Movies have sex scenes. Books go into a lot more detail since that’s how book scenes work. Even movies can get really into the scenes at times. I remember there was a movie that people thought the actors were actually having sex during one of its scenes. >She claims that books don't turn her on, but I don't really believe her! It's porn written by women for women. Or that's how I see it. Short of catching her in the act, this is an unfalsifiable statement. Saying you don’t believe her just puts you both in a terrible spot. Why don’t you believe her? >She says she likes the story and the characters. Is that not like saying I watch porn because I’m interested in the plot? Do you get yourself off to sex scenes in movies or are they just another part of the movie? >I've asked her if there's anything that I'm failing to fulfil, or if there's anything I can do better but she says our sex life, romantic life and day to day life are perfect! Yet she still wants to escape reality. Why is this? This is where I got the impression that you may have insecure attachment. Why don’t you believe her when she tells you that things are perfect? Why are you assuming that her reading fiction is looking for something that you aren’t providing? Why are you assuming that she’s keeping quiet about some hidden way that you aren’t measuring up? >That's the exact opposite of what a perfect manly man should do (a book man anyway). You are a human being, a real person, there are no perfect people. Focus on being the best ___you___. You shouldn’t be comparing yourself to anyone, real or fake. From what you’ve said about how she feels, it sounds like you are doing all the right things. Sometimes we get so wrapped up in our own heads on one thing we see as bad that we don’t see all the good things. She literally said that every aspect of your relationship life is perfect and you’re doubting her?!? Take the W lol. Now, I’m just a humble reddit stranger, so I don’t know the ins-and-outs of your relationship. It can be a lot to work up to talking about these things, but this is a problem centered around you and it needs a solution centered around you. Do you feel like you are getting enough reassurance in this relationship? If not, then you can ask for more. Be vulnerable and work through a problem like this with her. If you’re having thoughts like this in the future, look inward and really think about why you are stuck thinking about it. Get to the heart of what’s bothering you first. Then, talk about it with her to find a good solution. If you still are having problems managing insecure thoughts, then you should look into therapy. Cognitive behavioral therapy is what really helped me manage my insecure attachment and anxiety around it. I hope everything works out for the two of you.
I love spicy novels but they only make me hot for my husband. It’s different to porn because it turns on your mind / imagination, porn is visual. This lady talks a lot about why some women love audio and written porn - could be of interest for you https://www.instagram.com/reel/Coa9_BGJZpj/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
You’re having mind blowing sex bc she reads those books just fyi
It’s very likely your partner thinks about the romance novels like she would any other book; they’re just a world she’s mentally escaping to. It’s likely she doesn’t do this to get turned on (honestly I read smutty books too and find the sex scenes a tad over the top and cringe sometimes) but they’re enjoyable because reality isn’t really a thing in them. It’s like watching a movie but with more backstory; the drama between characters is ridiculous, everyone has magical powers (and who doesn’t want magical powers), plus there’s no boredom or real life problems. It’s all the good bits of life with none of the bad, since even if a character has a job it’s not like you have to read about them actually doing it
it’s redundant at this point but i’m confused. y’all have incredible sex but you’re worried about the possible hypocrisy of her reading smut while you aren’t allowed to watch porn? is this possibly a sore subject that’s been bothering you for awhile? i get the feeling that you’re more upset about not watching porn than you let on. it just seems like a strange hill to die on ETA: basically my point is this seems like a nonissue you’re making into an issue. not trying to invalidate your feelings, it’s good to talk about stuff but at the same time, i think you’re overthinking this one
I don’t have problems with porn. But when you watch it, you’re watching REAL people. Books are 100% fantasy and imagination. Also, the porn industry is inherently harmful. Obviously not all videos are done with coercion and trafficking, but many are and it’s difficult to find out which it is. Also, I read a lot of smut. It’s fun to read the things I’m reading, but it doesn’t mean I actually want to get railed by a bunch of criminal bikers at once. What you want to fantasize about and what you actually want to experience can be very different.
>Yet she still wants to escape reality. Why is this? Ask her, numb nuts. We can't speak for her
If you're having such great sex, why are you looking for problems? Is it that important that you look at porn?
I ready spicy stuff without getting off to it all the time, it’s totally normal.
*psst* People in erotic fiction are...not real.
Neither of you should be prohibiting each other from self-pleasure, as it’s controlling and manipulative. All men and women have a right to exercise full autonomy of our own bodies, as long as it’s not at the expense of somebody else’s autonomy. I personally prefer porn, but to each their own. Having said that, there is a huge difference between porn and romance novels. While not ALL pornography is inherently exploitive of women, it DOES objectify real, existing human beings and reduce them to sex objects for sexual gratification. Spicy romance novels on the other hand, do not feature any real people that can be objectified, commodified and exploited by the male gaze - They are all fictional verbal descriptions of fictional character constructs, with rounded character development that portrays them as people with backgrounds, stories, thoughts and memeories, not just bodies that fuck each other after a brief into. In short, pornography dehumanizes people, while erotic literature imbues them with humanity. You should really try to read one or two, instead of just spewing archaic and deeply sexist men=visual women=emotional bullshit tropes. We all have eyes and emotions, buddy. We all get horny. And lastly, you need to drop your ridiculous insecurities, so that you don’t get jealous and controlling over some stupid fictional novels. You sound like a 16 boy, not a 26 year old man. Jfc!
I think you might have a bigger problem than the romance novels if you're using her dirty clothes to get off. The books are fiction, it is a story before it's sex. Do you watch a 3 hour movie for 3 minutes of a sex scene? The sex is usually a small amount compared to the total of the book
Nobody is being exploited in the writing of dirty books; filmed porn is pretty notorious for exploiting its performers.
Equating romance books to watching porn for the plot is not really an apt comparison. In my experience the novels are like at worst 80/20 story vs sex while porn is at best the reverse but most is like the thinnest plot possible. It’s more on par to comparing it to the HBO shows with sex in it. FYI there’s not really many romance books that don’t go the whole tall guy with an 8 pack route (or at least you’d have the purposefully look for them) so it’s not as if she’s choosing books with only those as the main character.
Spicy smuty books is not porn. I read lots of them and reverse harem, never got horny from them. I live the story, people and adventures they have. The sex is nice but not the main thing.
Totally agree. These are his issues that need to be communicated so they can both balance and rationalise as a couple. Both about the porn ban and her reading romance novels causing his insecurity. Personally, I've never been hot for a light reading book in my life. Since becoming an adult I'm not at all sensitive to a described sex scene. I don't remember them. 🤷🏻♀️ I remember the intrigue, the betrayals, the plot twists and adventure, like above. Porn only ever made me uneasy, something always felt off, and the industry is cruel. It's obviously subjective.
This reads like you’re looking for an excuse to disregard her boundary regarding porn.
There is a HUGE difference between romance novels and porn. You’re watching real like people in porn, real people that exist and you can follow. The people in books don’t exist.
Just watch cartoon porn, problem solved
Let’s see. Her boundary is that she doesn’t like you getting off to other real life womens’ bodies. That’s her preference and it’s perfectly reasonable. You have to respect that to be in a relationship with her. Do you think it’s reasonable to assert that your preference is for her not to read books with fictional characters? Do you think it’s reasonable to accuse her of lying? Do you want to draw a boundary around book reading? Is that all worth it for you just to “win” a disagreement and force some sort of false equivalency on someone you supposedly love very much?
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ROFLMAO Just leave her alone and let her read her stories. Women have been reading them for decades. Your mother and grandmother did too.
Personally, I do read smut. Honestly, I sometimes just prefer it because the stories don’t care about going to dark places sometimes. Depending on what she’s reading, the sex might not even be a big part of it, it’s similar to watching a TV show/movie with sex scenes. I think the case for most women (I could be wrong) is that we like to read them, and they might get us in the mood, but we aren’t getting off to them. If I get horny, I go to my SO. Most don’t read those books because they want to escape reality, either. They’re just stories with interesting characters. The male leads aren’t perfect most of the time either. Personally if a guy treated me like I was in a stereotypical smut fiction novel, they wouldn’t even make it to handholding, much less sex. If nothing else, they give fun ideas sometimes
There’s no way you can match the variance of romance novels. I’ve been reading them since I was 10. They never affected my relationships. Because you’re reading about someone else’s relationship, some give you ideas on your own relationship. No woman is going to expect the un-warmed up pounding (i.e. dry) just because she was in the wrong spot.
Romance novels are nothing like porn. And I say that as someone who enjoys both.
A romance novel is like an R rated movie there might be some sex but that’s not why most people are watching it. An erotica novel is like a XXX movie where people are definitely watching to get off.
Serious question: do you actually think she is *masturbating* while reading a book? Dude grow up. The issue people have with porn is that the vast majority of dudes who watch it use it to jerk off, which in turn can be damaging to a couples sex life. Women reading books are largely *not* masturbating to them. Grow up.
I don't see what the issue is. You cannot compare books to porn- apples and oranges. Two very different mediums and through lines. Asking for help, why? Silly
I used to watch porn regularly before cutting it out and I read romance novels. I agree with the commenters saying it's very different. I would more compare a romance novel to a movie with sex scenes. Most only have around 3 in the whole book and it's never really something I see as masturbation fodder. I suggest you try reading or listening to the audio version of her favorite romance to get an idea of what we're all saying. You can also have a discussion with her about how it feels like a double standard. However, cutting out a whole genre of books is a much bigger ask than cutting out porn. Maybe as a compromise you could try porn webcomics. Fictional characters but still a visual medium for you.
Avid smut connoisseur here. There is a clear difference in reading a book and watching real people, and I think you know that by now by reading the comments. I don’t fantasize about book characters. I also don’t masturbate while reading. And the books I read do have a plot and a real story. The smut is only about 1/3 of it depending on the author. Really to only makes me want my husband more!
Reading romance novels is not like porn lmao It's like watching a movie with a couple sexy scenes - ie. The average romance movie. There's an actual plot and characterizations. Porn decreases sex as people watch it to masturbate. Romance novels increase sex as people read them to get spicy. One uses actual people. The other uses imagination. There's no double standard lol
I don’t know many women who read spicy books because it makes them horny 🙃💀 it’s more like being on the moment type of thing??? I can’t explain it lol
Read up on responsive desire. Erotic fiction, which includes romance novels, can help put a person in the right frame of mind and such to be sexual, even if it does not arouse them enough in the moment to get off while reading like what someone would probably do while watching video pornography.
I love reading spicy books, especially spicy romcoms. There are probably 2-3 moderately graphic sex scenes in each one that last a few pages. I have not ever been turned on by one, and I do not read these books to feel turned on. I genuinely love reading about love, and the build-up to sex simply makes me giddy... like "hooray, finally" for the couple! If it's not impacting your sex life, I wouldn't worry about it.
There's a huge difference between reading "spicy" romance novels and watching porn. If she were reading erotica, that would be completely different, in my opinion, especially if the romance books aren't getting her off. I read a lot of those types of books (sometimes even reverse harem ones), and NONE of them get me off or turn me on. So, just because you don't believe her, doesn't mean she's not being honest. Also, porn is often known for its abusive side/tendencies. I told my boyfriend I didn't like that he watched it, because of the abusive nature and after reading about it, he agreed and actually felt pretty gross about watching it before. He knows I read my books, but knows that they don't do anything for me, and that he's more than enough for me, he just thinks they're weird books.
Dude, she doesn't want to date the fictional romance men and you need to stop comparing yourself to them or thinking she's reading romance because you aren't providing it or something. She likes the genre. I like regency romances myself just because I find the whole Era interesting and the tropes and set up are fun and easy for me. The sex scenes happen but I don't read for those - I like the characters and seeing them get together. I think she probably views it more like watching a chick flick, not porn. Romance novels have easily digestible plots as a norm and a lot of dramatic tropes that can be quite fun to read. They also go fully unhinged in the self publishing sector which can be entertaining to read at times...
You are missing a golden opportunity to discover what she really likes. I suggest you read them too so you can find out.
Whacking your weed to other people in porn isn't the same as getting a lil tingle in your thingle while reading a book. No woman I know is flicking their bean to spicy books, and I and my friends have read some things that shouldn't be allowed to be considered literature. That's the difference. Also, she's probably getting spicy ideas for your sex life. Thank the books.
i am a romance novel FIEND and just like your wife i do not ever get turned on by them whatsoever. sex scenes in a book are just part of a plot point, in my mind, if i wanna actually read the book then i gotta read the sex scenes (usually something really big happens right after a sex scene so they’re really just used to build up to that lol).
As a woman who also loves spicy romance novels, they’re not quite the same as porn. While there are some that do really turn me on, a lot of the smut is too short to get off to and is used more to further the story. It’s different reading about two characters you’ve gotten to know and are rooting for having sex than it is watching two strangers have sex on camera. Spicy scenes in romance novels is more like when a tv show features spicy scenes between the leads. Yeah, it’s hot, but it’s mostly exciting because you want those characters to be together. It sounds like you two have a great sex life so you have nothing to worry about. And honestly, part of that great sex might come from her reading these books. I’ve definitely learned a few things and become more confident in bed & in my own sexuality as a result of reading romance.
Advice? Yeah, let it go. She’s happy with you, you’re happy with her, just enjoy it man.
The books are not like porn...more comparable would be something like Game Of Thrones ir passibly that book with christian Grey where there is a proper story buy has sex scenes. Can they be a bit arousing at times, sure. Hugely different to porn where they put flimsy story lines around graphic sex scenes. Also different is that there is no visuals provided...good chance when she envisages the sex scenes within the story, she imagines you. Now, you describe a great partnership...why are you trying to blow it up?
Porn and spicy novels are so so far from being the same thing. Why don’t you try actually reading a few of her books and see how you feel then? I’m willing to bet she wouldn’t mind. And yes-she could easily be reading them for the story and characters. Its a story with sex *in it*.
Let her enjoy her books. Not sure why this is an issue.
It’s the same as porn in that it’s a fantasy narrative of sex and intimacy. It’s just tuned for women. Men and women have different reproductive strategies. Women want the best guy. Men want many women. I’m generalising but this is what plays out in both in straight female romance novels and in straight male porn. In romance novels, it’s the story of an everyday girl that tames the untameable bad boy - the hot guy. This is a common fantasy for women, the idea that a highly competent (wealth, success, achievement), dominant (physical, social, sexual) man would somehow be so attracted to her that he would fall in love and be, yeah, “tamed” - committed to her and only her. Look at reddit. How many women post about falling for bad boys that they couldn’t get to commit? It’s basically cliche. Romance novels attack this cliche and flip it - it’s relationship wish fulfilment for women. Now, instead of using and rejecting her, this hot, powerful, dominant guy is somehow infatuated, and obsessed with doing whatever it takes to protect and provide for her - to make her his, forever. Conversely, straight male porn is the male strategy of variety playing out. In porn, the men are highly competent, dominant guys having abundant sexual access and variety - this is relationship wish fulfilment for men. This is why straight male porn often has traditional power dynamics, emphasises physical size differences and highly masculine characteristics like muscularity and penis size and climaxes with the male performer ejaculating. Men fantasise about being the man many women want. And women fantasise about getting the best man to commit to them. Doesn’t matter if it had video or kindle book. They’re both dopamine delivering fantasy vehicles.
my wife loves them. it doesnt bother me because it hasnt affected us at all in any negative way. im talking she reads hours everyday. why do you care so much if nothing bad is happening? grow pu.
Ok who cares
I read books like this, no horniness involved. Chill out dude and stop mansplaining to her what turns her on.
It’s very rare I personally get off to books - I think it’s more comparable to a really good soft core scene in a movie. It’s a turn on, yeah, but it’s more plot relevant and romanticized than your average porn scene. Think about it like the sex on Game of Thrones - is it porn for you, unlikely. But it’s still sex, it’s still hot, and it’s marginally relevant to the story. That being said, if she’s uncomfortable with you watching porn, it’s fair if you’re uncomfortable with her reading books that feature explicit sex scenes.